Two totally different decks. Humans doesn't run Bloodraid Elf, neither burn spells... Those decks share nothing in common, even if they both run some of the same cards. And by the way, this deck stomps 5C Humans all day. And it just won a 150 players event (8 round swiss + Top 8 ) near my hood, beating Jund, UX Control, Tron, Infect and various combo decks all day long.
Two totally different decks. Humans doesn't run Bloodraid Elf, neither burn spells... Those decks share nothing in common, even if they both run some of the same cards. And by the way, this deck stomps 5C Humans all day. And it just won a 150 players event (8 round swiss + Top 8 ) near my hood, beating Jund, UX Control, Tron, Infect and various combo decks all day long.
I didn't say Humans anywhere. I was also replying to the post right above mine, with the decklist from the GP that has 4 colors and Blood Moon.
everyone: "but lugger, you post the same 60 pretty much everytime!"
me: "they're different i swear"
Renegade Rallier would be better than Nissa but I'm so sick of not having revolt for that guy and just dying.
Nissa means that you're much more consistently going to be curving into BBE, which is kind of the point of playing BBE. A majority of the games I lose, I'm stuck on 3 and can't get BBEs out of my hand.
For a Big Zoo deck, Ghor Clan looks weird but it's soooo good right now. So little removal is being played at instant speed.
Civic Wayfinder is not good but I'm so sick of losing games with BBE in my hand -- so here we are.
@r497 I've been playing something similar. I do play a few more moon effects. The deck really isn't good if it doesn't disrupt mana.
Hey all! I'm still trying to recover from GP Phoenix weekend, but I wanted to post here that I'll be typing up a report hopefully this week of the strong tournament I had. I was the zoo deck that went 8-0 on day 1. I had a sluggish couple rounds of day 2 but managed to go 11-4 good for 42nd overall and some cash/pro points. Hopefully I'll be able to do even better at GP Vegas which it's looking like I'll be able to attend currently. I'll end with my list and post the report later in the week.
Small changes I'd make to the board would probably -1 molten rain +1 Gaddock Teeg. Again, I'll try and get the report later on this week when I'm better and finals are done.
Congrats on a great result with a really cool list.
I do have a couple of questions:
1) Why Dromoka's Command over Boros Charm? Dromoka can be a complete wiff with Bloobraid Elf. Is it because of the first mode "prevent instant/sorcery" or just the versatility.
2) How did Archangel Avacyn do? Which matchup's did you use her?
Congrats on a great result with a really cool list.
I do have a couple of questions:
1) Why Dromoka's Command over Boros Charm? Dromoka can be a complete wiff with Bloobraid Elf. Is it because of the first mode "prevent instant/sorcery" or just the versatility.
2) How did Archangel Avacyn do? Which matchup's did you use her?
Thanks!
Thanks!
Dromoka's can remove a creature, and I knew I wanted the 4th big creature removal spell but I didn't want it to be the 4th path to exile. I always run 3 in the board, but moving 1 to the main gave me an extra SB slot that I could use elsewhere.
Avacyn was used a lot. It comes in against all the grindy decks like UW control/Jund/Abzan, and also Humans because it's hard to always kill their flyers. It also comes in against Tron to protect from an OStone. It did amazing for me and will be there instead of Sigarda for the time being.
Shanna, Sisay's Legacy
GW
Legendary Creature - Human Warrior
Shanna, Sisay's Legacy can't be the target of abilities your opponents control.
Shanna gets +1/+1 for each creature you control.
0/0
It's Voice's token except it takes up a slot.
I'd rather run the full compliment of Voice of Resurgence to be honest. I'm currently running 3 copies in my URx and RBx heavy meta and they serve me very well.
I'm a firm believer of 2(3) for 1 cards in a similar environment. I run BBE, Rallier, Voice and Finks.
Round 1: Humans (2-1)
I lose the first game pretty lopsidedly. Against unknown I usually try and have removal spell + 1-2 drops, but here I kept a slower hand without removal, and by the time I got some it was too late.
In: +1 Avacyn, 2 Kozilek's Return, 2 Dromoka's Command
Out: - 3 Smiters, 2 Tarmogoyf
I won games 2 and 3 off the back of removal + creatures. Just like I drew it up!
Round 2: RG Eldrazi (2-0)
Game 1: I bolt his noble turn 1 and that messes his clock up way bad.
In: +1 Avacyn, 2 Dromoka's Command
Out: -2 Lightning Helix, -1 Bolt
Game 2: Read game 1. Pretty easy win, but he kept super greedy hands.
Round 3: Lantern Control: (2-0)
Game 1 I just kill him before he's able to dig and find whir or bridge.
In: +2 Teeg, +2 Thalia, +1 Stony, +1 Grudge
Out: -3 Path, -1 DC, -2 Smiters
Game 2 I have a hand with Grudge, Thalia, and a fast clock. He turn 1 inquisitions me and takes Thalia. I draw Teeg on turn 2 and play it which stops the Whir I see him draw later on. He gets a bridge out but I have the grudge for it, with flashback the next turn after he Academy Ruins it back. I have the GQ to stop that shenanigans and win.
Round 4: BR Hollow One (2-1)
I go first and it's not very close. I path and dromoka's command his big guys while his smaller guys can't even block. Travesty.
In: +2 Dromoka's Command, +1 Ancient Grudge
Out: -2 Lightning Helix, -1 Lightning Bolt
Game 2 I mull to 5 with no lands. I draw my first land after 2 discard steps and lose. I almost turned the corner though!
Game 3 is a close repeat of game 1. I play my things and he spends his first two turns trying to draw and discard stuff to play some beaters, but path is too much tempo for him. I draw a bolt with him at 8 and then have a smiter finish off his last blocker and attack for lethal.
Round 5 Humans(2-0)
Game 1 is back and forth, but I'm able to stop him when I'm at 6 life.
In: +1 Avacyn, 2 Kozilek's Return, 2 Dromoka's Command
Out: - 3 Smiters, 2 Tarmogoyf
Game 2 wasn't as close as game 1. I kept a noble hierarch + 4 removal spell hand that go there. Twas great.
Round 6: Jund (2-0)
Both games were the same. He tried to discard some of my cards while I boat raced him with a proper curve. I never dipped below 13 life in either game. He lands a Liliana which I ignore on a swing back and he ticks up after playing 2 Dark Confidants and sees me put a loxodon Smiter into play for free
In: +1 Avacyn, +2 Dromoka's Command
Out: -2 Lighning Helix, -1 Lightning Bolt
Round 7: Jund (2-0)
He plays Raging Ravine into Dark Confidant into inquisition of kozilek. I played Noble into Voice/Nacatl. When I reveal for his IoK I reveal 2 bloodbraid elfs and a loxodon smiter
In: +1 Avacyn, +2 Dromoka's Command
Out: -2 Lighning Helix, -1 Lightning Bolt
Game 2 I remove every threat he plays while landing goyf into knight. He pulses Knight but then I play knight + Voice into the third Knight I drew + Kessig Wolf Run. It wasn't even close. When your jund opponent plays turn 1 treetop village or raging ravine I feel so great.
Round 8: Humans (2-0)
Game 1: We go back and forth a bit but then I draw scooze who helps me recover in time to finish him off.
In: +1 Avacyn, 2 Kozilek's Return, 2 Dromoka's Command
Out: - 3 Smiters, 2 Tarmogoyf
Game 2: This game was much more drawn out and interesting. We go back and forth a while and he ends up with a board filled with champions, meddling mages, freebooter, and 2 Xathrid Necromancer. His Freebooter took a Helix and attacks for 2 in the air. I'm at 8 life and it's looking pretty grim. I draw Avacyn off the top and knew I just won the game. Next turn he attacks in with Freebooter and I kill it with the Avacyn. He plays another booter to take the helix back while making 2 2/2 zombies. He ends up having to make a desperation attack all out and gets me to 1 life, but then my Avacyn flips and kills all the zombies he just received.
Round 9: UW Control (1-2)
Game 1: I make a seemingly small mistake that cost me the game. He won the die roll and knew what the other 8 undefeated's were on. After he turn 1 serum visioned I looked around and knew he was the UW control player. I play a shock land tapped instead of a fetchland up to bolt him eot because I had a slower hand. I end up attacking him down to 1 before he stabilizes with Jace/Gideon and kills me.
In: +1 Avacyn, +2 Thalia, +2 Teeg, +2 Dromoka's
Out: -3 Path, - 2 Helix, -2 Scooze
Game 2: He gets an Elspeth the turn before I land a teeg making his hand of Jace/Cryptic useless. I get the Kessig up to kill his Elspeth after he chumps with a token. Then later he goes for the lethal attack with tokens + Collonade but I get the ghost quarter to stop lethal and make a lethal attack back.
Game 3: Repeat of game 1. I had some iffy draws this match, and both his wins came with him at 1 life. Bad beats.
Round 10: 4c Saheeli Good stuff. (0-2)
He was on the play and is placying Jace, Saheeli, Voice, and other good stuff cards. I don't draw the 4th land to play 2 spells a turn and he keeps jace bouncing my blockers to waste my turn. He fateseals fetches to the bottom lol and kills me.
In: +2 Teeg, + Avacyn, +2 Dromoka's
Out: -2 Helix, -3 Goyf,
Game 2: I have Nacatl + removal, but don't draw any gas while he has Jace take over the game. This match was not on the radar at all for me, and feel like had I played it before I could have made better decisions.
Round 11: Ponza (2-1)
Game 1: I get game 1 pretty easy as I bolt his arbor elf and tempo'd him out the game.
In: +2 Dromoka's, +2 Teeg,
Out: -2 Goyf, -2 Helix
Games 2 and 3 he wins with turn 2 blood moon into Chandra's into Pia and Kiran's. They were close at some points, but I couldn't close out the game before his oozes took over. He double anger of the gods in game 2 to seal the deal. This one stinks because in my testing Ponza is a great matchup. His Blood Moons were too timely though.
Round 12: Infect (2-0)
Games 1 and 2 I just have fast creatures and removal spells. He lands some infect creatures but never anything that could get past my blockers. I'm pretty sure infect is just a bad bogles deck in the current metagame.
In: +2 Dromoka's, +2 Teeg (do they even play become immense anymore?)
Out: -3 Smiters, -1 Scavenging Ooze
Round 13: Burn (2-0)
Game 1: We both get fast beats out, but I get 2 bloodbraid elves and ship the cascade triggers to the bottom to get around his eidolon's. A well timed Helix is good too.
In: +2 Dromoka's, +2 Thalia
Out: -3 Smiter, -1 Path
Game 2: He tries to searing blaze my Wild Nacatl but I dromoka's command preventing the damage and fighting his 2/2/ goblin guide. That was pretty much GG.
Round 14: Grixis Death Shadow: (2-1)
Game 1: I had the path every time. BBE is great in this matchup!
In: +2 Thalia, +2 Dromoka's
Out: -1 Scooze, -1 Bolt, -2 Helix
Game 2 I drew about 5 lands in a row after he's at 4 life
Game 3: We go back and forth and Thalia does some real work with him on 2 lands. He gets to a point where he has 2x Push and 2x Snapcasters though but I topdeck the BBE and path his blocker to swing in for lethal.
Round 15: Affinity (1-2)
Game 1 he has 5 permanents in play on a mull to 6, followed by turn 2 etched champion.
In: +2 Kozilek's Return, +2 Dromoka's, +Grudge, +Stony Silence
Out: -3 Smiters, -3 some other stuff I don't remember.
Game 2 I have 4 removal spells in hand. GG.
Game 3 I kept a hand with some 2 drops, helix, and Kozilek's return. I have a Nacatl in hand and he empties his hand again. I need to topdeck the third land on turn 4 to live after he has etched champion with 2x plating on it. I don't topdeck it and lose. Happens.
Was super stoked for the tournament. The deck drew like gas on day 1 which was pretty great. You definitely have to mulligan aggressively with the deck though, especially if you're not playing against a grindy deck.
Round 1: Humans (2-1)
I lose the first game pretty lopsidedly. Against unknown I usually try and have removal spell + 1-2 drops, but here I kept a slower hand without removal, and by the time I got some it was too late.
In: +1 Avacyn, 2 Kozilek's Return, 2 Dromoka's Command
Out: - 3 Smiters, 2 Tarmogoyf
I won games 2 and 3 off the back of removal + creatures. Just like I drew it up!
Round 2: RG Eldrazi (2-0)
Game 1: I bolt his noble turn 1 and that messes his clock up way bad.
In: +1 Avacyn, 2 Dromoka's Command
Out: -2 Lightning Helix, -1 Bolt
Game 2: Read game 1. Pretty easy win, but he kept super greedy hands.
Round 3: Lantern Control: (2-0)
Game 1 I just kill him before he's able to dig and find whir or bridge.
In: +2 Teeg, +2 Thalia, +1 Stony, +1 Grudge
Out: -3 Path, -1 DC, -2 Smiters
Game 2 I have a hand with Grudge, Thalia, and a fast clock. He turn 1 inquisitions me and takes Thalia. I draw Teeg on turn 2 and play it which stops the Whir I see him draw later on. He gets a bridge out but I have the grudge for it, with flashback the next turn after he Academy Ruins it back. I have the GQ to stop that shenanigans and win.
Round 4: BR Hollow One (2-1)
I go first and it's not very close. I path and dromoka's command his big guys while his smaller guys can't even block. Travesty.
In: +2 Dromoka's Command, +1 Ancient Grudge
Out: -2 Lightning Helix, -1 Lightning Bolt
Game 2 I mull to 5 with no lands. I draw my first land after 2 discard steps and lose. I almost turned the corner though!
Game 3 is a close repeat of game 1. I play my things and he spends his first two turns trying to draw and discard stuff to play some beaters, but path is too much tempo for him. I draw a bolt with him at 8 and then have a smiter finish off his last blocker and attack for lethal.
Round 5 Humans(2-0)
Game 1 is back and forth, but I'm able to stop him when I'm at 6 life.
In: +1 Avacyn, 2 Kozilek's Return, 2 Dromoka's Command
Out: - 3 Smiters, 2 Tarmogoyf
Game 2 wasn't as close as game 1. I kept a noble hierarch + 4 removal spell hand that go there. Twas great.
Round 6: Jund (2-0)
Both games were the same. He tried to discard some of my cards while I boat raced him with a proper curve. I never dipped below 13 life in either game. He lands a Liliana which I ignore on a swing back and he ticks up after playing 2 Dark Confidants and sees me put a loxodon Smiter into play for free
In: +1 Avacyn, +2 Dromoka's Command
Out: -2 Lighning Helix, -1 Lightning Bolt
Round 7: Jund (2-0)
He plays Raging Ravine into Dark Confidant into inquisition of kozilek. I played Noble into Voice/Nacatl. When I reveal for his IoK I reveal 2 bloodbraid elfs and a loxodon smiter
In: +1 Avacyn, +2 Dromoka's Command
Out: -2 Lighning Helix, -1 Lightning Bolt
Game 2 I remove every threat he plays while landing goyf into knight. He pulses Knight but then I play knight + Voice into the third Knight I drew + Kessig Wolf Run. It wasn't even close. When your jund opponent plays turn 1 treetop village or raging ravine I feel so great.
Round 8: Humans (2-0)
Game 1: We go back and forth a bit but then I draw scooze who helps me recover in time to finish him off.
In: +1 Avacyn, 2 Kozilek's Return, 2 Dromoka's Command
Out: - 3 Smiters, 2 Tarmogoyf
Game 2: This game was much more drawn out and interesting. We go back and forth a while and he ends up with a board filled with champions, meddling mages, freebooter, and 2 Xathrid Necromancer. His Freebooter took a Helix and attacks for 2 in the air. I'm at 8 life and it's looking pretty grim. I draw Avacyn off the top and knew I just won the game. Next turn he attacks in with Freebooter and I kill it with the Avacyn. He plays another booter to take the helix back while making 2 2/2 zombies. He ends up having to make a desperation attack all out and gets me to 1 life, but then my Avacyn flips and kills all the zombies he just received.
Round 9: UW Control (1-2)
Game 1: I make a seemingly small mistake that cost me the game. He won the die roll and knew what the other 8 undefeated's were on. After he turn 1 serum visioned I looked around and knew he was the UW control player. I play a shock land tapped instead of a fetchland up to bolt him eot because I had a slower hand. I end up attacking him down to 1 before he stabilizes with Jace/Gideon and kills me.
In: +1 Avacyn, +2 Thalia, +2 Teeg, +2 Dromoka's
Out: -3 Path, - 2 Helix, -2 Scooze
Game 2: He gets an Elspeth the turn before I land a teeg making his hand of Jace/Cryptic useless. I get the Kessig up to kill his Elspeth after he chumps with a token. Then later he goes for the lethal attack with tokens + Collonade but I get the ghost quarter to stop lethal and make a lethal attack back.
Game 3: Repeat of game 1. I had some iffy draws this match, and both his wins came with him at 1 life. Bad beats.
Round 10: 4c Saheeli Good stuff. (0-2)
He was on the play and is placying Jace, Saheeli, Voice, and other good stuff cards. I don't draw the 4th land to play 2 spells a turn and he keeps jace bouncing my blockers to waste my turn. He fateseals fetches to the bottom lol and kills me.
In: +2 Teeg, + Avacyn, +2 Dromoka's
Out: -2 Helix, -3 Goyf,
Game 2: I have Nacatl + removal, but don't draw any gas while he has Jace take over the game. This match was not on the radar at all for me, and feel like had I played it before I could have made better decisions.
Round 11: Ponza (2-1)
Game 1: I get game 1 pretty easy as I bolt his arbor elf and tempo'd him out the game.
In: +2 Dromoka's, +2 Teeg,
Out: -2 Goyf, -2 Helix
Games 2 and 3 he wins with turn 2 blood moon into Chandra's into Pia and Kiran's. They were close at some points, but I couldn't close out the game before his oozes took over. He double anger of the gods in game 2 to seal the deal. This one stinks because in my testing Ponza is a great matchup. His Blood Moons were too timely though.
Round 12: Infect (2-0)
Games 1 and 2 I just have fast creatures and removal spells. He lands some infect creatures but never anything that could get past my blockers. I'm pretty sure infect is just a bad bogles deck in the current metagame.
In: +2 Dromoka's, +2 Teeg (do they even play become immense anymore?)
Out: -3 Smiters, -1 Scavenging Ooze
Round 13: Burn (2-0)
Game 1: We both get fast beats out, but I get 2 bloodbraid elves and ship the cascade triggers to the bottom to get around his eidolon's. A well timed Helix is good too.
In: +2 Dromoka's, +2 Thalia
Out: -3 Smiter, -1 Path
Game 2: He tries to searing blaze my Wild Nacatl but I dromoka's command preventing the damage and fighting his 2/2/ goblin guide. That was pretty much GG.
Round 14: Grixis Death Shadow: (2-1)
Game 1: I had the path every time. BBE is great in this matchup!
In: +2 Thalia, +2 Dromoka's
Out: -1 Scooze, -1 Bolt, -2 Helix
Game 2 I drew about 5 lands in a row after he's at 4 life
Game 3: We go back and forth and Thalia does some real work with him on 2 lands. He gets to a point where he has 2x Push and 2x Snapcasters though but I topdeck the BBE and path his blocker to swing in for lethal.
Round 15: Affinity (1-2)
Game 1 he has 5 permanents in play on a mull to 6, followed by turn 2 etched champion.
In: +2 Kozilek's Return, +2 Dromoka's, +Grudge, +Stony Silence
Out: -3 Smiters, -3 some other stuff I don't remember.
Game 2 I have 4 removal spells in hand. GG.
Game 3 I kept a hand with some 2 drops, helix, and Kozilek's return. I have a Nacatl in hand and he empties his hand again. I need to topdeck the third land on turn 4 to live after he has etched champion with 2x plating on it. I don't topdeck it and lose. Happens.
Was super stoked for the tournament. The deck drew like gas on day 1 which was pretty great. You definitely have to mulligan aggressively with the deck though, especially if you're not playing against a grindy deck.
Do you like Voice over Goyf in the humans strategy? I've found Goyf to be invaluable as a threat there -- even if it starts out kinda' small.
Taking out Helix against Saheeli seems odd to me -- though I guess you're just swapping removal. Removing Goyf over removing smiter also seems odd. It's not very hard to make Goyf a 3/4 in that MU. Smiter is basically the same thing but cost one more mana.
Sometimes Ponza just has it and you have to take your licks.
Taking 3 losses in a row to start Day 2 is not ideal but you bounced back pretty well.
Anyway, congrats on your finish. It's great to see Big Zoo still being a viable deck.
I should be in at the Connecticut GP in a few weeks. I might snag some of your sideboard tech (3x Teegs, 1x Avacyn)!
I found Humans to be a fairly positive MU, like I assume you did. Sometimes they just draw a bunch of Mantis Riders or have t3 5/5s on the play and there's not much you can do but in most cases, if they have to fight fair, you can win pretty easily.
Do you like Voice over Goyf in the humans strategy? I've found Goyf to be invaluable as a threat there -- even if it starts out kinda' small.
Yes. Making an X/X is just too crucial against them. I actually prefer hitting my voices when I'm going to Kozilek's return because I know if I ever get one token into play with a Kessig then they are on a time crunch to find a Reflector mage or die.
Taking out Helix against Saheeli seems odd to me -- though I guess you're just swapping removal. Removing Goyf over removing smiter also seems odd. It's not very hard to make Goyf a 3/4 in that MU. Smiter is basically the same thing but cost one more mana.
I was torn between goyf and smiter, so the tiebreaker came to whether or not each one of them could kill his x/4 in combat more reliably without an additional removal spell.
I found Humans to be a fairly positive MU, like I assume you did. Sometimes they just draw a bunch of Mantis Riders or have t3 5/5s on the play and there's not much you can do but in most cases, if they have to fight fair, you can win pretty easily.
Yeah, it's either tons of flying or super fast clock or they just die to big fatties.
Anyone playing Pulse of Murasa on SB with BBE? Good against Burn and aggro decks for the lifegain and really useful on grindy matchups to return a dead/countered creature
Anyone see this list that 5-0'd. Pretty interesting take on Naya Zoo, playing 2x Simian Spirit Guide along with, 4x Nobles, 3x Birds, and 4 Nacatl. In addition, the sideboard seems really strange. Thoughts?
Might have our first playable Zoo card in a long while. Its a Wooly Thoctar that can't be chump blocked. GGG sucks, but its pretty close to RGW, so its more or less just an upgrade. I'm not sure it replaces Smiter as an option, but its beefy. Would have rather had trample, only dies to push really.
If you were in the market for a 3 drop that deals damage and doesnt want to be blocked, this fits the bill. like I said, upgrade and replaces thoctar. He wasnt seeing much play, but this makes him wholy irrelevant.
Match 1) 2-1 VS BR Hollow One, lost the die roll G1: He didn't really get going until turn 3 when my guys started to outsize his. He went for an all in with 2 phoenixes, an angler and a 7/2 flamewake adept after poking me in the air a few turns. I did some KoTR shenanigans: block angler, activate knight to fetch sacred foundry and bolt the adept. BBE next turn for exacts.
G2: He had the nuts, double Hollow One and Angler on 2nd turn. I was dead before I could take my 3rd turn.
G3: Finally got to go 1st and grinded him out fairly smoothly after we traded a couple of removal spells. Dromoka's Command and Fiery Justice were boss here.
I never saw a Smiter throughout the entirety of this match. Would have loved to see the look on my opponent's face if he'd inquiried some smiters onto the board.
Match 2) 2-1 vs GR Titanshift, won the die roll G1: We both stumbled and missed turn 2 plays, fortunately i had nacatl to keep the pressure on. Turn 3 Smiter followed by turn 4 BBE into Knight kept the pressure on but he was able to find 2 obstinate baloths into a prime time to stabilize at 6 life and decimate most of my board, leaving just a knight. I ripped a noble hierarch, cast it, used knight to fetch up another land to cast my homeboi Thundermaw Hellkite to get in for exactly 6.
G2: Mull to 5 nuff said.
G3: I get off to a quick start with back to back Nacatls, followed by a 4/4 knight on turn 3. He clears out the nacatls with sweltering sun. I rip the blood moon and slam it after using Knight to fix my mana. He was left with 6 mountains in play vs a 6/6 knight and scooped it up shortly.
Match 3) 0-0 vs Jund.
We decided to split the prizes and leave cos it was getting late.
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Friday Night Modern
Match 1) 2-1 vs Abzan Devoted Druid
G1: He got me with a postmortem lunge to combo out
G2: Got off to a fast start while opponent stumbled, he was forced to chump all his dudes away and I won in short order.
G3: Opponent kept a very good hand except for the fact that it was without green mana and never found it.
Match 2) 2-1 vs Eldrazi Tron (Inexperienced Pilot that sideboarded sub-optimally)
G1: I Stumbled on lands and died vs turn 3 natural tron.
G2: Opponent's inexperience showed as he pointed his removal at all the wrong stuff and I won even though he had turn 3 tron.
G3: Opp didn't have turn 3 tron for the 3rd game running thankfully and was forced to play the midrange game. You know it's going well when Eldrazi Tron players are chumping away endbringers, TKS and reality smashers. His All is Dust was 2 cards from the top when he finally succumbed.
Match 3) 2-1 vs Jund.
This was an insanely exciting match with sick rips all around in all 3 games. I forgot most of the details but I eventually took the match after ripping Avacyn to ambush his bob to take 2 from a persisted finks going down to 3. Ripped molten rain to take out Raging ravine. Blocked his finks with Avacyn. He then killed Avacyn with an escalated brutality dropping me down to 1 and putting himself up to 4. I pulled a Noble Hierarch next. He pulled nothing and Noble Hierarch got in with Kessig Wolf Run to deal the last 4 points of damage.
I've not played with Loxodon Smiter since 2016 because he was just a beefy body that didn't do anything in the combo-prevalent linear metagames of 2017. But he's actually really good now when there's lots of GBx and URx decks around. He's a downright nightmare for the straight UR decks to deal with.
Thundermaw Hellkite is kind of a pet card of mine and I've been itching to pull him out since the BBE unban was announced. This was where my main deck diverged from Zulander's. I included the 22nd land so I could get to Thundermaw mana more reliably, and I also hate being stuck on mana. He's actually been pretty good for me, being able to end games out of nowhere, especially in the grinder games.
With 4 BBEs in the deck, we actually perform much better against unfavourable matchups like titanshift and tron. The ability to close out games that bit more quickly has made a huge difference.
Overall, I think this is a really solid deck with a highly adaptable sideboard. We've got game vs almost any deck, previous bad matchups feel very winnable now. BBE is an amazing addition and is the glue that holds the aggro-midrange gameplan together in a way that CoCo can never do. The nature of the deck means that we rarely get 'free' wins but it's definitely a lot of fun to play.
Guys please opinions on japanese cards. Lost a 3/3 creature against Japan celestial colonade. This guy played all creatures and spells in english cards, but some cards in his manabase was japanese. I dont registrated this really ( my brain say its all fine and all english to me lets attack his empty board)...and i am sure it is a Kind of legal cheating. It is not ok, but i know legal. I Hate such people. I never forget colonade normally, but with this Tricks it can happen one time in 3 years and such people take advantage of this
If I am a customer spending premium amount of dollars, I expect a premium service. Jund falls into the category of a premium deck costing more dollars than a majority of the rest of the format. I'm not getting the desired performance ratio per dollars spent out of the Jund deck because WOTC decided to make the format more diverse.
Glad you took the list out for a spin! There's a ton of flexibility with the deck, and I'm glad your pet cards are helping out! As long as the core remains, you'll always be able to do well with the deck, and the core is cheap, fast, and efficient creatures with the best sideboard colors in the game.
I went 4-0 on Wednesday and 3-1 last night for 7-1 this week. The matchups were Jund, Bant Knightfall, Jund, GR Titanshift, Jund, Affinity, Jeskai Control (lost), and Grixis Control. Against Titanshift I won in the most epic of fashions, he turn 3'd a BBE into summoner's pact for another BBE, I untapped and molten rained his stomping ground to take him off of 4 mana so he died to his pact trigger
On a side note, I just finished foiling out the full 75!
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Zetsu's Poker Draft Method
I didn't say Humans anywhere. I was also replying to the post right above mine, with the decklist from the GP that has 4 colors and Blood Moon.
WGUBR 5c Humans
GWR Naya Zoo
Legacy:
GW GW Maverick
R Goblins
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Zetsu's Poker Draft Method
4x Wild Nacatl
4x Noble Hierarch
4x Tarmogoyf
2x Scavenging Ooze
2x Voice of Resurgence
4x Knight of the Reliquary
1x Nissa, Vastwood Seer
4x Bloodbraid Elf
3x Ghor-Clan Rampager
4x Lightning Bolt
3x Lightning Helix
3x Path to Exile
Lands: (22)
4x Wooded Foothills
4x Windswept Heath
3x Arid Mesa
2x Stomping Ground
1x Temple Garden
2x Sacred Foundry
1x Treetop Village
1x Kessig Wolf Run
1x Horizon Canopy
2x Forest
1x Plains
everyone: "but lugger, you post the same 60 pretty much everytime!"
me: "they're different i swear"
Renegade Rallier would be better than Nissa but I'm so sick of not having revolt for that guy and just dying.
Nissa means that you're much more consistently going to be curving into BBE, which is kind of the point of playing BBE. A majority of the games I lose, I'm stuck on 3 and can't get BBEs out of my hand.
For a Big Zoo deck, Ghor Clan looks weird but it's soooo good right now. So little removal is being played at instant speed.
Civic Wayfinder is not good but I'm so sick of losing games with BBE in my hand -- so here we are.
@r497 I've been playing something similar. I do play a few more moon effects. The deck really isn't good if it doesn't disrupt mana.
I think you'll be happy with Goblin Rabblemaster, especially if your local meta has a lot of people casting removal spells.
4 Windswept Heath
4 Wooded Foothills
2 Stomping Ground
2 Sacred Foundry
1 Temple Garden
2 Forest
1 Plains
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Kessig Wolf Run
1 Ghost Quarter
4 Wild Nacatl
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Knight of the Reliquary
4 Bloodbraid Elf
3 Scavenging Ooze
3 Voice of Resurgence
3 Loxodon Smiter
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Path to Exile
2 Lightning Helix
1 Dromoka's Command
1 Archangel Avacyn
2 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Gaddock Teeg
3 Molten Rain
2 Kozilek's Return
2 Dromoka's Command
1 Stony Silence
1 Ancient Grudge
1 Grafdigger's Cage
Small changes I'd make to the board would probably -1 molten rain +1 Gaddock Teeg. Again, I'll try and get the report later on this week when I'm better and finals are done.
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Congrats on a great result with a really cool list.
I do have a couple of questions:
1) Why Dromoka's Command over Boros Charm? Dromoka can be a complete wiff with Bloobraid Elf. Is it because of the first mode "prevent instant/sorcery" or just the versatility.
2) How did Archangel Avacyn do? Which matchup's did you use her?
Thanks!
Thanks!
Dromoka's can remove a creature, and I knew I wanted the 4th big creature removal spell but I didn't want it to be the 4th path to exile. I always run 3 in the board, but moving 1 to the main gave me an extra SB slot that I could use elsewhere.
Avacyn was used a lot. It comes in against all the grindy decks like UW control/Jund/Abzan, and also Humans because it's hard to always kill their flyers. It also comes in against Tron to protect from an OStone. It did amazing for me and will be there instead of Sigarda for the time being.
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Shanna, Sisay's Legacy
GW
Legendary Creature - Human Warrior
Shanna, Sisay's Legacy can't be the target of abilities your opponents control.
Shanna gets +1/+1 for each creature you control.
0/0
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I'd rather run the full compliment of Voice of Resurgence to be honest. I'm currently running 3 copies in my URx and RBx heavy meta and they serve me very well.
I'm a firm believer of 2(3) for 1 cards in a similar environment. I run BBE, Rallier, Voice and Finks.
Modern: WUBRG Humans - GBW Traverse - GWU Knightfall - GRW Bushwhacker Zoo -
WGUBR 5c Humans
GWR Naya Zoo
Legacy:
GW GW Maverick
R Goblins
4 Windswept Heath
4 Wooded Foothills
2 Stomping Ground
2 Sacred Foundry
1 Temple Garden
2 Forest
1 Plains
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Kessig Wolf Run
1 Ghost Quarter
4 Wild Nacatl
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Knight of the Reliquary
4 Bloodbraid Elf
3 Scavenging Ooze
3 Voice of Resurgence
3 Loxodon Smiter
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Path to Exile
2 Lightning Helix
1 Dromoka's Command
1 Archangel Avacyn
2 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Gaddock Teeg
3 Molten Rain
2 Kozilek's Return
2 Dromoka's Command
1 Stony Silence
1 Ancient Grudge
1 Grafdigger's Cage
Round 1: Humans (2-1)
I lose the first game pretty lopsidedly. Against unknown I usually try and have removal spell + 1-2 drops, but here I kept a slower hand without removal, and by the time I got some it was too late.
In: +1 Avacyn, 2 Kozilek's Return, 2 Dromoka's Command
Out: - 3 Smiters, 2 Tarmogoyf
I won games 2 and 3 off the back of removal + creatures. Just like I drew it up!
Round 2: RG Eldrazi (2-0)
Game 1: I bolt his noble turn 1 and that messes his clock up way bad.
In: +1 Avacyn, 2 Dromoka's Command
Out: -2 Lightning Helix, -1 Bolt
Game 2: Read game 1. Pretty easy win, but he kept super greedy hands.
Round 3: Lantern Control: (2-0)
Game 1 I just kill him before he's able to dig and find whir or bridge.
In: +2 Teeg, +2 Thalia, +1 Stony, +1 Grudge
Out: -3 Path, -1 DC, -2 Smiters
Game 2 I have a hand with Grudge, Thalia, and a fast clock. He turn 1 inquisitions me and takes Thalia. I draw Teeg on turn 2 and play it which stops the Whir I see him draw later on. He gets a bridge out but I have the grudge for it, with flashback the next turn after he Academy Ruins it back. I have the GQ to stop that shenanigans and win.
Round 4: BR Hollow One (2-1)
I go first and it's not very close. I path and dromoka's command his big guys while his smaller guys can't even block. Travesty.
In: +2 Dromoka's Command, +1 Ancient Grudge
Out: -2 Lightning Helix, -1 Lightning Bolt
Game 2 I mull to 5 with no lands. I draw my first land after 2 discard steps and lose. I almost turned the corner though!
Game 3 is a close repeat of game 1. I play my things and he spends his first two turns trying to draw and discard stuff to play some beaters, but path is too much tempo for him. I draw a bolt with him at 8 and then have a smiter finish off his last blocker and attack for lethal.
Round 5 Humans(2-0)
Game 1 is back and forth, but I'm able to stop him when I'm at 6 life.
In: +1 Avacyn, 2 Kozilek's Return, 2 Dromoka's Command
Out: - 3 Smiters, 2 Tarmogoyf
Game 2 wasn't as close as game 1. I kept a noble hierarch + 4 removal spell hand that go there. Twas great.
Round 6: Jund (2-0)
Both games were the same. He tried to discard some of my cards while I boat raced him with a proper curve. I never dipped below 13 life in either game. He lands a Liliana which I ignore on a swing back and he ticks up after playing 2 Dark Confidants and sees me put a loxodon Smiter into play for free
In: +1 Avacyn, +2 Dromoka's Command
Out: -2 Lighning Helix, -1 Lightning Bolt
Round 7: Jund (2-0)
He plays Raging Ravine into Dark Confidant into inquisition of kozilek. I played Noble into Voice/Nacatl. When I reveal for his IoK I reveal 2 bloodbraid elfs and a loxodon smiter
In: +1 Avacyn, +2 Dromoka's Command
Out: -2 Lighning Helix, -1 Lightning Bolt
Game 2 I remove every threat he plays while landing goyf into knight. He pulses Knight but then I play knight + Voice into the third Knight I drew + Kessig Wolf Run. It wasn't even close. When your jund opponent plays turn 1 treetop village or raging ravine I feel so great.
Round 8: Humans (2-0)
Game 1: We go back and forth a bit but then I draw scooze who helps me recover in time to finish him off.
In: +1 Avacyn, 2 Kozilek's Return, 2 Dromoka's Command
Out: - 3 Smiters, 2 Tarmogoyf
Game 2: This game was much more drawn out and interesting. We go back and forth a while and he ends up with a board filled with champions, meddling mages, freebooter, and 2 Xathrid Necromancer. His Freebooter took a Helix and attacks for 2 in the air. I'm at 8 life and it's looking pretty grim. I draw Avacyn off the top and knew I just won the game. Next turn he attacks in with Freebooter and I kill it with the Avacyn. He plays another booter to take the helix back while making 2 2/2 zombies. He ends up having to make a desperation attack all out and gets me to 1 life, but then my Avacyn flips and kills all the zombies he just received.
Round 9: UW Control (1-2)
Game 1: I make a seemingly small mistake that cost me the game. He won the die roll and knew what the other 8 undefeated's were on. After he turn 1 serum visioned I looked around and knew he was the UW control player. I play a shock land tapped instead of a fetchland up to bolt him eot because I had a slower hand. I end up attacking him down to 1 before he stabilizes with Jace/Gideon and kills me.
In: +1 Avacyn, +2 Thalia, +2 Teeg, +2 Dromoka's
Out: -3 Path, - 2 Helix, -2 Scooze
Game 2: He gets an Elspeth the turn before I land a teeg making his hand of Jace/Cryptic useless. I get the Kessig up to kill his Elspeth after he chumps with a token. Then later he goes for the lethal attack with tokens + Collonade but I get the ghost quarter to stop lethal and make a lethal attack back.
Game 3: Repeat of game 1. I had some iffy draws this match, and both his wins came with him at 1 life. Bad beats.
Round 10: 4c Saheeli Good stuff. (0-2)
He was on the play and is placying Jace, Saheeli, Voice, and other good stuff cards. I don't draw the 4th land to play 2 spells a turn and he keeps jace bouncing my blockers to waste my turn. He fateseals fetches to the bottom lol and kills me.
In: +2 Teeg, + Avacyn, +2 Dromoka's
Out: -2 Helix, -3 Goyf,
Game 2: I have Nacatl + removal, but don't draw any gas while he has Jace take over the game. This match was not on the radar at all for me, and feel like had I played it before I could have made better decisions.
Round 11: Ponza (2-1)
Game 1: I get game 1 pretty easy as I bolt his arbor elf and tempo'd him out the game.
In: +2 Dromoka's, +2 Teeg,
Out: -2 Goyf, -2 Helix
Games 2 and 3 he wins with turn 2 blood moon into Chandra's into Pia and Kiran's. They were close at some points, but I couldn't close out the game before his oozes took over. He double anger of the gods in game 2 to seal the deal. This one stinks because in my testing Ponza is a great matchup. His Blood Moons were too timely though.
Round 12: Infect (2-0)
Games 1 and 2 I just have fast creatures and removal spells. He lands some infect creatures but never anything that could get past my blockers. I'm pretty sure infect is just a bad bogles deck in the current metagame.
In: +2 Dromoka's, +2 Teeg (do they even play become immense anymore?)
Out: -3 Smiters, -1 Scavenging Ooze
Round 13: Burn (2-0)
Game 1: We both get fast beats out, but I get 2 bloodbraid elves and ship the cascade triggers to the bottom to get around his eidolon's. A well timed Helix is good too.
In: +2 Dromoka's, +2 Thalia
Out: -3 Smiter, -1 Path
Game 2: He tries to searing blaze my Wild Nacatl but I dromoka's command preventing the damage and fighting his 2/2/ goblin guide. That was pretty much GG.
Round 14: Grixis Death Shadow: (2-1)
Game 1: I had the path every time. BBE is great in this matchup!
In: +2 Thalia, +2 Dromoka's
Out: -1 Scooze, -1 Bolt, -2 Helix
Game 2 I drew about 5 lands in a row after he's at 4 life
Game 3: We go back and forth and Thalia does some real work with him on 2 lands. He gets to a point where he has 2x Push and 2x Snapcasters though but I topdeck the BBE and path his blocker to swing in for lethal.
Round 15: Affinity (1-2)
Game 1 he has 5 permanents in play on a mull to 6, followed by turn 2 etched champion.
In: +2 Kozilek's Return, +2 Dromoka's, +Grudge, +Stony Silence
Out: -3 Smiters, -3 some other stuff I don't remember.
Game 2 I have 4 removal spells in hand. GG.
Game 3 I kept a hand with some 2 drops, helix, and Kozilek's return. I have a Nacatl in hand and he empties his hand again. I need to topdeck the third land on turn 4 to live after he has etched champion with 2x plating on it. I don't topdeck it and lose. Happens.
Was super stoked for the tournament. The deck drew like gas on day 1 which was pretty great. You definitely have to mulligan aggressively with the deck though, especially if you're not playing against a grindy deck.
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Do you like Voice over Goyf in the humans strategy? I've found Goyf to be invaluable as a threat there -- even if it starts out kinda' small.
Taking out Helix against Saheeli seems odd to me -- though I guess you're just swapping removal. Removing Goyf over removing smiter also seems odd. It's not very hard to make Goyf a 3/4 in that MU. Smiter is basically the same thing but cost one more mana.
Sometimes Ponza just has it and you have to take your licks.
Taking 3 losses in a row to start Day 2 is not ideal but you bounced back pretty well.
Anyway, congrats on your finish. It's great to see Big Zoo still being a viable deck.
I should be in at the Connecticut GP in a few weeks. I might snag some of your sideboard tech (3x Teegs, 1x Avacyn)!
I found Humans to be a fairly positive MU, like I assume you did. Sometimes they just draw a bunch of Mantis Riders or have t3 5/5s on the play and there's not much you can do but in most cases, if they have to fight fair, you can win pretty easily.
Yes. Making an X/X is just too crucial against them. I actually prefer hitting my voices when I'm going to Kozilek's return because I know if I ever get one token into play with a Kessig then they are on a time crunch to find a Reflector mage or die.
I was torn between goyf and smiter, so the tiebreaker came to whether or not each one of them could kill his x/4 in combat more reliably without an additional removal spell.
Yeah, it's either tons of flying or super fast clock or they just die to big fatties.
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I saw a competitive list running 4 Woolly Thoctar, I'm gonna try them at my next local store tournament.
WGUBR 5c Humans
GWR Naya Zoo
Legacy:
GW GW Maverick
R Goblins
Anyone see this list that 5-0'd. Pretty interesting take on Naya Zoo, playing 2x Simian Spirit Guide along with, 4x Nobles, 3x Birds, and 4 Nacatl. In addition, the sideboard seems really strange. Thoughts?
Might have our first playable Zoo card in a long while. Its a Wooly Thoctar that can't be chump blocked. GGG sucks, but its pretty close to RGW, so its more or less just an upgrade. I'm not sure it replaces Smiter as an option, but its beefy. Would have rather had trample, only dies to push really.
If you were in the market for a 3 drop that deals damage and doesnt want to be blocked, this fits the bill. like I said, upgrade and replaces thoctar. He wasnt seeing much play, but this makes him wholy irrelevant.
4 wild nacatl
4 tarmogoyf
3 Voice of Resurgence
3 scavenging ooze
3 loxodon smiter
4 knight of the reliquary
4 bloodbraid elf
1 thundermaw hellkite
4 lightning bolt
3 path to exile
1 lightning helix
4 windswept heath
4 wooded foothills
3 arid mesa
2 stomping ground
2 sacred foundry
1 temple garden
1 horizon canopy
1 ghost quarter
1 kessig wolf run
2 forest
1 plains
1 mountain
1 blood moon
2 choke
1 kozilek's return
1 dromoka's command
1 gaddock teeg
1 ancient grudge
1 fiery justice
1 archangel avacyn
1 graffdigger's cage
1 stony silence
2 kor firewalker
Wednesday Night Modern
Match 1) 2-1 VS BR Hollow One, lost the die roll
G1: He didn't really get going until turn 3 when my guys started to outsize his. He went for an all in with 2 phoenixes, an angler and a 7/2 flamewake adept after poking me in the air a few turns. I did some KoTR shenanigans: block angler, activate knight to fetch sacred foundry and bolt the adept. BBE next turn for exacts.
G2: He had the nuts, double Hollow One and Angler on 2nd turn. I was dead before I could take my 3rd turn.
G3: Finally got to go 1st and grinded him out fairly smoothly after we traded a couple of removal spells. Dromoka's Command and Fiery Justice were boss here.
I never saw a Smiter throughout the entirety of this match. Would have loved to see the look on my opponent's face if he'd inquiried some smiters onto the board.
Match 2) 2-1 vs GR Titanshift, won the die roll
G1: We both stumbled and missed turn 2 plays, fortunately i had nacatl to keep the pressure on. Turn 3 Smiter followed by turn 4 BBE into Knight kept the pressure on but he was able to find 2 obstinate baloths into a prime time to stabilize at 6 life and decimate most of my board, leaving just a knight. I ripped a noble hierarch, cast it, used knight to fetch up another land to cast my homeboi Thundermaw Hellkite to get in for exactly 6.
G2: Mull to 5 nuff said.
G3: I get off to a quick start with back to back Nacatls, followed by a 4/4 knight on turn 3. He clears out the nacatls with sweltering sun. I rip the blood moon and slam it after using Knight to fix my mana. He was left with 6 mountains in play vs a 6/6 knight and scooped it up shortly.
Match 3) 0-0 vs Jund.
We decided to split the prizes and leave cos it was getting late.
-------------------------------------------------
Friday Night Modern
Match 1) 2-1 vs Abzan Devoted Druid
G1: He got me with a postmortem lunge to combo out
G2: Got off to a fast start while opponent stumbled, he was forced to chump all his dudes away and I won in short order.
G3: Opponent kept a very good hand except for the fact that it was without green mana and never found it.
Match 2) 2-1 vs Eldrazi Tron (Inexperienced Pilot that sideboarded sub-optimally)
G1: I Stumbled on lands and died vs turn 3 natural tron.
G2: Opponent's inexperience showed as he pointed his removal at all the wrong stuff and I won even though he had turn 3 tron.
G3: Opp didn't have turn 3 tron for the 3rd game running thankfully and was forced to play the midrange game. You know it's going well when Eldrazi Tron players are chumping away endbringers, TKS and reality smashers. His All is Dust was 2 cards from the top when he finally succumbed.
Match 3) 2-1 vs Jund.
This was an insanely exciting match with sick rips all around in all 3 games. I forgot most of the details but I eventually took the match after ripping Avacyn to ambush his bob to take 2 from a persisted finks going down to 3. Ripped molten rain to take out Raging ravine. Blocked his finks with Avacyn. He then killed Avacyn with an escalated brutality dropping me down to 1 and putting himself up to 4. I pulled a Noble Hierarch next. He pulled nothing and Noble Hierarch got in with Kessig Wolf Run to deal the last 4 points of damage.
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Thoughts on the deck:
I've not played with Loxodon Smiter since 2016 because he was just a beefy body that didn't do anything in the combo-prevalent linear metagames of 2017. But he's actually really good now when there's lots of GBx and URx decks around. He's a downright nightmare for the straight UR decks to deal with.
Thundermaw Hellkite is kind of a pet card of mine and I've been itching to pull him out since the BBE unban was announced. This was where my main deck diverged from Zulander's. I included the 22nd land so I could get to Thundermaw mana more reliably, and I also hate being stuck on mana. He's actually been pretty good for me, being able to end games out of nowhere, especially in the grinder games.
-1 lightning helix, -1 dromoka's command
+1 mountain, +1 thundermaw
With 4 BBEs in the deck, we actually perform much better against unfavourable matchups like titanshift and tron. The ability to close out games that bit more quickly has made a huge difference.
Overall, I think this is a really solid deck with a highly adaptable sideboard. We've got game vs almost any deck, previous bad matchups feel very winnable now. BBE is an amazing addition and is the glue that holds the aggro-midrange gameplan together in a way that CoCo can never do. The nature of the deck means that we rarely get 'free' wins but it's definitely a lot of fun to play.
I went 4-0 on Wednesday and 3-1 last night for 7-1 this week. The matchups were Jund, Bant Knightfall, Jund, GR Titanshift, Jund, Affinity, Jeskai Control (lost), and Grixis Control. Against Titanshift I won in the most epic of fashions, he turn 3'd a BBE into summoner's pact for another BBE, I untapped and molten rained his stomping ground to take him off of 4 mana so he died to his pact trigger
On a side note, I just finished foiling out the full 75!
I ran the same GP list.
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