Seeing how well this archetype placed in Phoenix, I bit the bullet and finished my deck. A good thing too because Noble Hierarch keeps rising in price. Based off Tate Donovan's GP deck this is what I've decided to pilot out week 1.
With the upcoming cards in Dominaria I want to try a Legendary based deck. Initial problems I think will show up before I start testing will be figuring out the exact number of which Legendary cards to run aside from the obvious 3-4 Mox Amber and finding the right mix of aggro and board control. This is what I've got for a first draft, will be able to test it out next time I'm at the local gamestore to see what performs and what lets me down. Aside from the Dominaria cards the ones I don't have available are Rhys, the Redeemed (for color options turn 1) and Brimaz, King of Oreskos and I would most definitely use them if I could, I might proxy them just for testing sake.
The above list needs more work than I care to do right now so it's shelved until the future. In the meantime I'm trying to streamline my deck to make it perform better by cutting the situational cards and focusing more on the cards that have tested well against the most variety of decks. This is what I've got so far, anybody have any thoughts on how to make it better?
I'm thinking of getting a Gideon, Ally of Zendikar to replace Thalia, Mindcensor, Thrun, or a Teeg since they're the lowest performing cards in the deck so far.
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I've played a few versions of this deck before with varying success here are some pointers I have, however these are personal you can disagree and I wont take it badly
1. Play 4 arbiters or none. The card is a powerhouse in the deck it is what makes the deck actually so my suggestion to you is play 4 or none.
2. Consider playing Collected Company/Aether Vial unfortunatly without a vial or company the deck deploys its threats too slowly and in a much too linear of a fashion.
3. Dont play fetches. I know its tempting but its just not what the deck does well.
4. Instead of field of Ruin put a tec edge or another land altogether.
5. Put the thrun into the sideboard and consider putting Shalai, Voice of Plenty my buddy played with this card once and it ended up being a total powerhouse im building a hatebear deck with 2 of those in there now.
6. Do not play Gideon of the Trials its too much of a control card.
7. Find space for some Thalia, Guardian of Thraben (I would move the Teegs to the board and remove and the Qasali Ambushers)
8. Maybe add a Brimaz, King of Oreskos Card is a house and works super well with wilt-leaf.
9. Try to add Tireless Tracker or Ramunap Excavator(im testing this one myself) just more card advantage.
10. Go up on tickets and shocks instead of scattered groves use more Horizon canopy as they can make mana but also be sac'd for card draw
11. Im not sure how i feel about Mindcensor and Thalia they can be good but can also be a total miss.
That's just my 5c like I said its just my personal opinion so feel free to go any way you prefer.
The above list needs more work than I care to do right now so it's shelved until the future. In the meantime I'm trying to streamline my deck to make it perform better by cutting the situational cards and focusing more on the cards that have tested well against the most variety of decks. This is what I've got so far, anybody have any thoughts on how to make it better?
I'm thinking of getting a Gideon, Ally of Zendikar to replace Thalia, Mindcensor, Thrun, or a Teeg since they're the lowest performing cards in the deck so far.
This deck has sparked by interest quite a bit. How much worse does the deck become if I use birds of paradise over the Hierarchs?
You really do use the exalted triggers a lot, at least a few times a match. The extra damage gets you wins for sure. But if you want to cut the price of the deck by 2/3s use Brushland instead of Horizon Canopy and Birds of Paradise instead of Noble Hierarch.
Posting this deck here because the Legendary thread is dead and the list I've been playing recently feels a lot like a Hatebear deck. I've gone 2-2 both times I've played it at FNM but they've been so close to 3-1 performances so I'm going to keep playing it and testing what works. Can't afford Nobles so I have to stick with the Birds, I would love if WOTC would ever make a legendary mana dork.
Shalai is still being tested but if I end up taking her out I will probably go up to 3 Smiter and either a Wilt-Leaf Liege or something like Gideon, Ally of Zendikar. I traded the search denial power of Leonin Arbiter for the combat strength and field presence of Thalia, Heretic Cathar and Gideon of the Trials. 6 one drop legendaries feels right with 4 Ambers, I would do a 2/2/2 split of Kytheon, Oviya, and Rhys the Redeemed if I had any copies of Rhys.
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I couldn't make Displacer work since I want to run 4 Horizon Canopy.
This is my current list, but I have not had a lot of time to test. I think with Krark-clan, Affinity, Hollow One, and Hardened Scales, plus hitting Vials in Humans and Spirits, I want all 4 Knight of Autumn main. They are also amazing vs. Burn and the new "Runaway Red" deck for the lifegain.
A 'Bear' means shorthand for grizzly bear 1G = 2/2 Vannila
Hate means that 2/2 has some Hatefilled ability
Leonin Arbiter is a hate bear.
Little Thalia is sorta similar, but isn't really.
Nothing else basedeck seems relevant to the term Hate Bear, since nothing costs 2.
I tried Leonin Arbiter, and moved on to other creatures when trying out all the 'bear' style creatures.
1W is just too much for a 2 power creature that may have an ability that matters, in Modern anyway.
Why not play just W for a 2 power creature with a Hate ability?
Like Kytheon, DryadM or SoldieroF ?
How has testing been going for people trying Knight of Autumn? I'm currently playing GW Death and Taxes, not many people are discussing that version on the Death and Taxes thread. Looking for any solid input.
With the spoilers so far for the new Ravnica set I'm thinking of adding in blue so I can run Lavinia, Azorius Renegade and Tithe Taker. The problem however is I'd have to potentially cut Leonin Arbiter as a strategy in order to fix my blue mana more efficiently. Has anyone tried running Bant or is the Arbiter package simply too good to pass up on?
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Friday I played a jank brew that started out as GW Hatebears. The relevant thing is that when it works, it's usually the remaining bits from the original that get the job done.
Against Hollow One, Scavenging Ooze is really, really good. Maybe you already knew this. There are, I'm sure, some other match-ups where Scooze is good. I would not want to have a shortage of Scooze these days.
The other card frequently played in GW Hatebears that is really good against Hollow One is Loxodon Smiter. But maybe you knew that too. My opponent played Burning Inquiry twice while I had a Smiter in hand and he hit it once. Exalted Smiter > Hollow One.
It feels really good to beat Hollow One. I've had trouble doing that with my other decks.
I think I should give up on the brew and go back to GW Hatebears.
Could someone help a fellow out and tell a bit about how Aether Vial is used in this deck? I see some situations where it just seems bad; turn-one Noble Hierarch into turn-two Loxodon Smiter just seems really good. Turn-two Leonin Arbiter seems to be the decks raison d'être.
After giving it a few minutes thought, I decided to go scrap my Combo-Bears crap and try GW Hatebears again. This is the maindeck I sleeved up and a slightly modified side-board - which probably still needs more modification.
My first match-up was a Goblin Charbelcher deck. I played first and went Noble Hierarch into Leonin Arbiter and Ghost Quarter-ed his first land. He played another and attached Utopia Sprawl to it. I Flickerwisp-ed the Enchantment and proceeded to run him over while he watched a couple of Search for Tomorrows resolve without being able to pay the Arbiter. The second game was worse. He mull'ed to TWO. I played Arbiter turn two and he scooped!
Round two was against Humans. I lost the roll and pretty much got over-run. The second game I mulled to five and wasn't able to hold out. The two Wrath of Gods are additions to the side-board I made after the game. I'd like to try at least one Settle the Wreckage but I don't currently have one. I may split it up and run one Day of Judgment since they are primarily for Humans - Meddling Mage, you know - anyway.
Round three was Bogles. The first game I tricked him into losing his Bogle by Flickerwisp-ing one of his enchantments after he blocked a double-exalted Voice. Game two was just ugly as I didn't get what I needed in time to deal with enough enchantments. Game three he kept a risky hand and I ROFL-stopped him with the help of a big token from Voice off of an untimely Path to Exile on his part.
All in all, a fun deck to play. I was unsure of Flickerwisp beforehand but I am a solid convert now. Who knew there were so many profitable interactions? Smiter doesn't seem popular but it's a pet card and a big reason I like this deck. The FoR's are probably wrong, but I just don't like Tectonic Edge. Perhaps someone can explain why I'm wrong. I just picked up the Knight tonight so it's the only one I have. I would probably still keep some of the Pridemages because I do like exalted, but I'd probably run another Knight in place of the Sage if I had it.
The side-board was an attempt to tune for what I expected: Bogles, UW Control, Burn, Dredge, Hollow One and possibly Goblins.
1x Blade Splicer
4x Flickerwisp
1x Kitchen Finks
4x Leonin Arbiter
2x Mirran Crusader
4x Noble Hierarch
4x Restoration Angel
2x Scavenging Ooze
4x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4x Voice of Resurgence
1x Forest
1x Gavony Township
4x Ghost Quarter
4x Horizon Canopy
1x Plains
4x Razorverge Thicket
1x Stirring Wildwood
2x Tectonic Edge
4x Temple Garden
Instant (4)
4x Path to Exile
4x Aether Vial
2x Auriok Champion
2x Dismember
1x Engineered Explosives
1x Kataki, War's Wage
1x Mark of Asylum
2x Qasali Pridemage
2x Rest in Peace
2x Stony Silence
2x Wrath of God
I may also replace a Wrath of God with a Settle the Wreckage. With Leonin Arbiter out that card can be a blowout against creature based decks.
Also like the idea of 1-2 Collected Company mainboard and was wondering how its performed for other people
4 Windswept Heath
2 Temple Garden
2 Forest
2 Plains
3 Untaidake, the Cloud Keeper
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Gavony Township
1 Razorverge Thicket
1 Field of Ruin
1 Scattered Groves
26 Creatures
4 Isamaru, Hound of Konda
4 Oviya Pashiri, Sage Lifecrafter
1 Kytheon, Hero of Akros
1 Gaddock Teeg
2 Scavenging Ooze
2 Qasali Pridemage
1 Saffi Eriksdotter
1 Kitchen Finks
1 Reki, the History of Kamigawa
1 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
1 Thrun, the Last Troll
1 Gisela, the Broken Blade
2 Wilt-Leaf Liege
1 Sigarda, Host of Herons
1 Darien, King of Kjeldor
1 Bruna, the Fading Light
1 Ghalta, Primal Hunger
2 Gideon of the Trials
1 Ajani Unyielding
2 History of Benalia
4 Mox Amber
4 Path to Exile
1 Day of Destiny
1 Dromoka's Command
1 Urza's Ruinous Blast
3 Forest
3 Plains
2 Temple Garden
1 Scattered Groves
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Razorverge Thicket
1 Stirring Wildwood
1 Gavony Township
4 Ghost Quarter
1 Field of Ruin
4 Voice of Resurgence
2 Qasali Pridemage
2 Scavenging Ooze
2 Gaddock Teeg
2 Leonin Arbiter
4 Loxodon Smiter
3 Qasali Ambusher
2 Kitchen Finks
1 Aven Mindcensor
1 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
3 Wilt-Leaf Liege
1 Thrun, the Last Troll
1 Dromoka's Command
2 Gideon of the Trials
I'm thinking of getting a Gideon, Ally of Zendikar to replace Thalia, Mindcensor, Thrun, or a Teeg since they're the lowest performing cards in the deck so far.
1. Play 4 arbiters or none. The card is a powerhouse in the deck it is what makes the deck actually so my suggestion to you is play 4 or none.
2. Consider playing Collected Company/Aether Vial unfortunatly without a vial or company the deck deploys its threats too slowly and in a much too linear of a fashion.
3. Dont play fetches. I know its tempting but its just not what the deck does well.
4. Instead of field of Ruin put a tec edge or another land altogether.
5. Put the thrun into the sideboard and consider putting Shalai, Voice of Plenty my buddy played with this card once and it ended up being a total powerhouse im building a hatebear deck with 2 of those in there now.
6. Do not play Gideon of the Trials its too much of a control card.
7. Find space for some Thalia, Guardian of Thraben (I would move the Teegs to the board and remove and the Qasali Ambushers)
8. Maybe add a Brimaz, King of Oreskos Card is a house and works super well with wilt-leaf.
9. Try to add Tireless Tracker or Ramunap Excavator(im testing this one myself) just more card advantage.
10. Go up on tickets and shocks instead of scattered groves use more Horizon canopy as they can make mana but also be sac'd for card draw
11. Im not sure how i feel about Mindcensor and Thalia they can be good but can also be a total miss.
That's just my 5c like I said its just my personal opinion so feel free to go any way you prefer.
You really do use the exalted triggers a lot, at least a few times a match. The extra damage gets you wins for sure. But if you want to cut the price of the deck by 2/3s use Brushland instead of Horizon Canopy and Birds of Paradise instead of Noble Hierarch.
3 Windswept Heath
2 Temple Garden
2 Forest
2 Plains
1 Gavony Township
4 Ghost Quarter
1 Field of Ruin
1 Stirring Wildwood
1 Eiganjo Castle
1 Okina, Temple to the Grandfathers
2 Kytheon, Hero of Akros
1 Isamaru, Hound of Konda
3 Oviya Pashiri, Sage Lifecrafter
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Qasali Pridemage
3 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
3 Brimaz, King of Oreskos
1 Gaddock Teeg
2 Loxodon Smiter
2 Shalai, Voice of Plenty
4 Path to Exile
1 Dromoka's Command
4 Mox Amber
1 Day of Destiny
Shalai is still being tested but if I end up taking her out I will probably go up to 3 Smiter and either a Wilt-Leaf Liege or something like Gideon, Ally of Zendikar. I traded the search denial power of Leonin Arbiter for the combat strength and field presence of Thalia, Heretic Cathar and Gideon of the Trials. 6 one drop legendaries feels right with 4 Ambers, I would do a 2/2/2 split of Kytheon, Oviya, and Rhys the Redeemed if I had any copies of Rhys.
I couldn't make Displacer work since I want to run 4 Horizon Canopy.
This is my current list, but I have not had a lot of time to test. I think with Krark-clan, Affinity, Hollow One, and Hardened Scales, plus hitting Vials in Humans and Spirits, I want all 4 Knight of Autumn main. They are also amazing vs. Burn and the new "Runaway Red" deck for the lifegain.
Sideboard is a work in progress.
2 Plains
1 Forest
4 Razorverge Thicket
4 Temple garden
4 Horizon Canopy
2 Stirring Wildwood
4 Ghost Quarter
1 Gavony Township
Spell 10
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to exile
2 Collected Company
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Thalia, guardian of Thraben
1 Scavenging Ooze
4 Leonin Arbiter
4 Flickerwisp
4 Blade splicer
4 Knight of Autumn
3 Restoration Angel
3 Stony Silence
2 Rest in Peace
2 Gaddock Teeg
2 Choke
2 Mirran Crusader
1 Shalai, Voice of Plenty
1 Settle the Wreckage
1 Thrun, the Last Troll
1 Grafdigger's Cage
Tempo
Modern
Eldrazi and Staxes
Whir Prison
Legacy
5c Humans
DnT
"I'm a lead farmer... !" Quote ruined due to policy.
Hate means that 2/2 has some Hatefilled ability
Leonin Arbiter is a hate bear.
Little Thalia is sorta similar, but isn't really.
Nothing else basedeck seems relevant to the term Hate Bear, since nothing costs 2.
I tried Leonin Arbiter, and moved on to other creatures when trying out all the 'bear' style creatures.
1W is just too much for a 2 power creature that may have an ability that matters, in Modern anyway.
Why not play just W for a 2 power creature with a Hate ability?
Like Kytheon, DryadM or SoldieroF ?
GW Death and Taxes WG
Against Hollow One, Scavenging Ooze is really, really good. Maybe you already knew this. There are, I'm sure, some other match-ups where Scooze is good. I would not want to have a shortage of Scooze these days.
The other card frequently played in GW Hatebears that is really good against Hollow One is Loxodon Smiter. But maybe you knew that too. My opponent played Burning Inquiry twice while I had a Smiter in hand and he hit it once. Exalted Smiter > Hollow One.
It feels really good to beat Hollow One. I've had trouble doing that with my other decks.
I think I should give up on the brew and go back to GW Hatebears.
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Leonin Arbiter
2 Scavenging Ooze
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Voice of Resurgence
4 Flickerwisp
1 Knight of Autumn
4 Loxodon Smiter
3 Restoration Angel
1 Forest
1 Gavony Township
4 Ghost Quarter
4 Horizon Canopy
1 Plains
4 Razorverge Thicket
1 Stirring Wildwood
4 Temple Garden
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
2 Qasali Pridemage
1 Kitchen Finks
1 Reclamation Sage
2 Thrun, the Last Troll
1 Back to Nature
2 Dromoka's Command
3 Rest in Peace
2 Wrath of God
My first match-up was a Goblin Charbelcher deck. I played first and went Noble Hierarch into Leonin Arbiter and Ghost Quarter-ed his first land. He played another and attached Utopia Sprawl to it. I Flickerwisp-ed the Enchantment and proceeded to run him over while he watched a couple of Search for Tomorrows resolve without being able to pay the Arbiter. The second game was worse. He mull'ed to TWO. I played Arbiter turn two and he scooped!
Round two was against Humans. I lost the roll and pretty much got over-run. The second game I mulled to five and wasn't able to hold out. The two Wrath of Gods are additions to the side-board I made after the game. I'd like to try at least one Settle the Wreckage but I don't currently have one. I may split it up and run one Day of Judgment since they are primarily for Humans - Meddling Mage, you know - anyway.
Round three was Bogles. The first game I tricked him into losing his Bogle by Flickerwisp-ing one of his enchantments after he blocked a double-exalted Voice. Game two was just ugly as I didn't get what I needed in time to deal with enough enchantments. Game three he kept a risky hand and I ROFL-stopped him with the help of a big token from Voice off of an untimely Path to Exile on his part.
All in all, a fun deck to play. I was unsure of Flickerwisp beforehand but I am a solid convert now. Who knew there were so many profitable interactions? Smiter doesn't seem popular but it's a pet card and a big reason I like this deck. The FoR's are probably wrong, but I just don't like Tectonic Edge. Perhaps someone can explain why I'm wrong. I just picked up the Knight tonight so it's the only one I have. I would probably still keep some of the Pridemages because I do like exalted, but I'd probably run another Knight in place of the Sage if I had it.
The side-board was an attempt to tune for what I expected: Bogles, UW Control, Burn, Dredge, Hollow One and possibly Goblins.
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn
Frenzy-Affinity-Ghost Quarter-Rock-Tokens- RGWPhyrexian Zoo- WVial KnightsStandard:
BW Knights(Rotated)Pioneer: RW Knights - BW Rally Zombies - UW Heroes
Commander:WUG
Jenara, Asura of War- WGSigarda, Host of HeronsCasualties of economicsLegacy: Good-night, sweet prince. Mono-R Burn