Considering this past weekend's events, would Treasure Cruise be a viable sideboard card? It would be very easy to refill our hand if necessary. The downside of course is that it would somewhat dilute the strategy...
I don't think Cruise, or any delve spell, is a good pairing with Nivmagus Elemental, who wants to exile your spells. You could make it more storm combo-ish and pray that you get to make storm copies for him to eat, but that makes him less consistent and you lose one of the strengths of the deck, which is that your spells have some utility, however minor, outside of being elemental food. A cheap way to refuel would do wonders for the deck, but I don't think cruise is going to fit. Better for Delver decks.
I don't think Cruise, or any delve spell, is a good pairing with Nivmagus Elemental, who wants to exile your spells. You could make it more storm combo-ish and pray that you get to make storm copies for him to eat, but that makes him less consistent and you lose one of the strengths of the deck, which is that your spells have some utility, however minor, outside of being elemental food. A cheap way to refuel would do wonders for the deck, but I don't think cruise is going to fit. Better for Delver decks.
I mean I totally agree. And from what Ive seen, delver and control lists have been playing it like ancestral recall. its a 1 mana investment that pays off after turn 3ish, when they have cards already ready to be poured into it.
I tried a lot of ways to make Nivmagus work. I kept coming back to the phyrexian spell suite. The problem with Nivmagus is that it warps the entire deck around it in a much narrower way than it first seems because it exiles from the stack, which is weird. I want it to be good so badly though. I need to try a list with the new girl.
Lantern, you're more experienced than I am at this game. What are your opinions on Nivmagus one day being a biggish player? I hope that one day something has a completely stupid interaction with him.
Our spell suite is fine. only thing that could make it better is "free" spells better than what we already have (think force and friends) or better storm cards (think flusterstorm) or a 1-2 mana beater thats inbetween power of nivmagus and kiln. Swiftspear isnt that card. Its much better in tempo than combo aggro that we are, because it gets in for more over time than our one big shotgun.
Realisticly, if swift spear was a 2 mana 2/3 double strike with prowress rather than what we have, the deck would be tier 1.5 then and there.
Better storm cards aren't happening until they change the way cards enter modern... I was hoping for a UR costed fiend in Dragon's Maze. Instead it was the Cyclops. Swiftspear is better than I was expecting from prowess after I saw it was a fixed rate. Not a perfect fit though.
I haven't played the deck since the rise of Eidolon of the Great Revel. Do you just hope you have a slaughter pact? One of my most memorable games was outracing a burn player and attacking through with a thirty-something power elemental, and then he dropped from the FNM. The matchup seems scarier now though.
I used it in 4 dailies on MTGO and placed in 3 of them (4-0, 3-1, and 3-1). I haven't played enough to say for sure but the only difficult matchups seem to be Burn and Jund. I would say I've been about 50/50 against them though so they are still winnable.
Realisticly, if swift spear was a 2 mana 2/3 double strike with prowress rather than what we have, the deck would be tier 1.5 then and there.
There isnt a red two drop creature with anything near those kind of stats with zero drawback in all of magic let alone modern, with or without prowess. So I dont really think its fair to say realistically.
Realisticly, if swift spear was a 2 mana 2/3 double strike with prowress rather than what we have, the deck would be tier 1.5 then and there.
There isnt a red two drop creature with anything near those kind of stats with zero drawback in all of magic let alone modern, with or without prowess. So I dont really think its fair to say realistically.
I mean i agree... But there is a 1 drop that allows you to get permanent power increase whose base stats is already above curve (1/2) and even has a flexable casting cost... So you cant say something like that could never exist...
If you asked me 2 years ago if wed see a 1 drop kiln id have said no.
This deck got 5th at an SCG IQ (not a premier one) in St. Louis. The finish is a bit dated (9/7), but I just found info for this today. I have no idea how many people were at this tournament, but it is a nice paper finish for the deck to log. No Death's Shadow in the build.
I wonder if they ever went for the infect kill with Spellskite, since they maindeck him. Turn 2 Spellskite, turn 3 2x Mutagenic Growth, Assault Strobe, Tainted Strike, then just ROFL the rest of the tournament.
To that effect, Immolating Souleater and Assault Strobe used to be a deck by itself. Anyone ever consider playing him in here, maybe as a 2x? We also have Tainted Strike to make him lethal, and he can lower our life on demand to make Death's Shadow bigger.
Other than tanted strike and assult strobe, we got no good way to use him. Yes he works well with deaths shadow, but he doesnt help kiln and friends out. I mean, neither does death shadow, but our life is so low after a while anyways, deaths shadow is just good then lol
There's some chatter on become immense in a different thread. Is that too anti-synergistic with nivmagus, or too off-color to make it into this list (mehbe as a 1-of)? That's a heck of a bonus for a double-striker or infected creature...
I think the resurgence of Delve cards opens up two different paths for this type of deck. I don't think Nivmagus will work with Delve cards, but I wonder how a Nivmagus - less deck more focused on Kiln Fiend etc. would fare using these Delve cards. I don't know how I feel about that though, because Nivmagus is more resilient to bolt effects.
I don't think delve will work with Nivmagus in any number. Sure, it does work with kiln fiend, but you'll cut it as soon as you draw it with Niv out and you're one spell short of lethal. Also, if you can delve away five for Become Immense on a fiend, you probably don't need +6(9) to finish them off.
If you cut Niv and add other spell-pump creatures, you tick up the curve, which lowers the power of the deck. People tried cyclops blitz in modern and it died off pretty quickly. Delve works in delver-tempo style play, where swiftspear is more at home.
I don't think we'll see a double-striker with prowess for any cheaper than the 5cmc one. I don't think this is the block where we get our new best friend.
If you wanted to run a delved kilnfiend, itd have to be like pauper kilnfiend, where you run cyclops and wee dragonnauts. But then its not the same deck as shot gun, because your more or less bad delver.
I just know that the deck burns through its cards quickly, maybe quick enough to discount TC down to one, which at that point it would be better than Act on Impulse. Plus the reload might give us enough of a hand to try to go off.
Very valid point. Card draw has always been my issue with this deck, I always feel you get one shot, and if you fail your done unless you draw into a Death's Shadow. I was going to suggest Visions of Beyond, but that would be even worse with Niv.
I'm so glad I wasn't the only one considering building without the Elemental. I feel that TC is much more powerful than Nivmagus, and shores up a weakness that the deck has, which is would to go forward when you've emptied your hand. I'm still not sold on Death's Shadow, I would almost rather Blistercoil.
Not sure whether I just made a tier 5 Delver deck without Delver, or an Elemental Shotgun deck without the actual Elemental. I already made a DredgeVine deck without dredge, and Affinity plays without actual affinity, so I suppose an Elemental Shotgun deck without Nivmagus Elemental will be fine. Kiln Fiend is an Elemental too ehh... right?
I sold my Scalding Tarns, which explains the suboptimal mana base. I will need to fix that at some point. I am one of those that actually run TC. TC is sooooooooooo crazily good. I doubt whether I would like to trade that with the Elemental. I tried the deck in a testing session with several matches in the TP room on MTGO where I won all matches. So far it seems to be a faster deck than the real Delver deck, probably at the expense of it being less reliable.
There are several ways to throw cards in the graveyard via the Elder (Looting) or a simple Thought Scour. This fuels TC and also makes Artful Dodge available. With so many cantrips I also have not so many issues with the draw.
I still need to tune it a lot more, but I can see myself taking this to a Daily once for a real test. If this deck isn't good, it is at least hilarious.
I mean I totally agree. And from what Ive seen, delver and control lists have been playing it like ancestral recall. its a 1 mana investment that pays off after turn 3ish, when they have cards already ready to be poured into it.
"There are no two words in the English language more harmful than 'good job'." -Terrance Fletcher, Whiplash (2014)
Lantern, you're more experienced than I am at this game. What are your opinions on Nivmagus one day being a biggish player? I hope that one day something has a completely stupid interaction with him.
Realisticly, if swift spear was a 2 mana 2/3 double strike with prowress rather than what we have, the deck would be tier 1.5 then and there.
I haven't played the deck since the rise of Eidolon of the Great Revel. Do you just hope you have a slaughter pact? One of my most memorable games was outracing a burn player and attacking through with a thirty-something power elemental, and then he dropped from the FNM. The matchup seems scarier now though.
4 Blood Crypt
4 Sulfurous Springs
4 Death's Shadow
4 Kiln Fiend
4 Nivmagus Elemental
4 Apostle's Blessing
3 Assault Strobe
4 Gitaxian Probe
3 Ground Rift
4 Gut Shot
4 Mutagenic Growth
3 Tainted Strike
4 Thoughtseize
4 Marsh Flats
1 Swamp
1 Dismember
1 Duress
2 Shattering Spree
1 Slaughter Pact
3 Duress
3 Pyroclasm
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Spellskite
I used it in 4 dailies on MTGO and placed in 3 of them (4-0, 3-1, and 3-1). I haven't played enough to say for sure but the only difficult matchups seem to be Burn and Jund. I would say I've been about 50/50 against them though so they are still winnable.
There isnt a red two drop creature with anything near those kind of stats with zero drawback in all of magic let alone modern, with or without prowess. So I dont really think its fair to say realistically.
I mean i agree... But there is a 1 drop that allows you to get permanent power increase whose base stats is already above curve (1/2) and even has a flexable casting cost... So you cant say something like that could never exist...
If you asked me 2 years ago if wed see a 1 drop kiln id have said no.
2 Flamekin Harbinger
4 Kiln Fiend
4 Nivmagus Elemental
2 Spellskite
Spells: 30
4 Apostle's Blessing
4 Assault Strobe
4 Gitaxian Probe
3 Ground Rift
4 Gut Shot
4 Mutagenic Growth
4 Slaughter Pact
3 Tainted Strike
4 Arid Mesa
4 Blackcleave Cliffs
1 Blood Crypt
2 Mountain
1 Sacred Foundry
4 Scalding Tarn
1 Steam Vents
1 Stomping Ground
2 Ancient Grudge
3 Artful Dodge
2 Blood Moon
3 Lightning Bolt
2 Pithing Needle
2 Rakdos Charm
1 Tainted Strike
To that effect, Immolating Souleater and Assault Strobe used to be a deck by itself. Anyone ever consider playing him in here, maybe as a 2x? We also have Tainted Strike to make him lethal, and he can lower our life on demand to make Death's Shadow bigger.
"Personally I love high-riak, low-reqars gambles. Life's best with a decent amount of riak. And f*** reqars."
If you cut Niv and add other spell-pump creatures, you tick up the curve, which lowers the power of the deck. People tried cyclops blitz in modern and it died off pretty quickly. Delve works in delver-tempo style play, where swiftspear is more at home.
I don't think we'll see a double-striker with prowess for any cheaper than the 5cmc one. I don't think this is the block where we get our new best friend.
Cheeri0sXWU
Reid Duke's Level One
Who's the Beatdown
Alt+0198=Æ
Nah, but I'm testing Act on Impulse.
Only had a few games, but it's been kind of...... meeeeh.
Cheeri0sXWU
Reid Duke's Level One
Who's the Beatdown
Alt+0198=Æ
Cheeri0sXWU
Reid Duke's Level One
Who's the Beatdown
Alt+0198=Æ
Cheeri0sXWU
Reid Duke's Level One
Who's the Beatdown
Alt+0198=Æ
Shattering Spree over smelt