WW tribal aggro is going to be pretty weak in modern.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
In life all we can do is try to make things better. Sitting lost in old ways and fearing change only makes us outdated and ignorant.
Peace cannot be kept by force. It can only be achieved by understanding.
Albert Einstein
Millions of innocent men, women and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined and imprisoned; yet we have not advanced one inch towards uniformity.
With Aether vial avoiding the banhammer I think tribal aggro decks really stand a chance here, knights look more than a decent tribe here with exemplar and knight reliquary.
If the store owner says that I can't trade in the premises, I'll just go outside. If he says that I can't trade within 10m of his premises, I'll go to 11 meters. If he says that he doesn't want to see me trading, I will put a basket over his head and continue trading.
Yes, he's a local legend. He's only known to take his clothes off before he goes into the Ladies' Lockerroom. Nobody knows what he does in there because he's invisible, but it's almost certainly tons of masturbating.
Phyrexian Metamorph can be played in a monowhite build, so with Adaptive Automaton you have a potential of 12 Knight Exemplars. Would want to include some life gain though. Maybe Martyr of Sands
With Zoo so popular, I think either SoBaM or SoFaF would be better as you can swing through the defenses easier or block. Besides the obvious Hugeness he can get to, what's the reason for splashing green for Reliquary? I would think splashing black for Stillmoon Cavalier and hate cards like Deathmark, Thoughseize, Extirpate, and Smother would be better than splashing green. Krosan Grip in an environment where countermagic is going to be obsolete is worst than Disenchant. Plus making the Cav fly w/ a sword on him is so awesome!
With Zoo so popular, I think either SoBaM or SoFaF would be better as you can swing through the defenses easier or block. Besides the obvious Hugeness he can get to, what's the reason for splashing green for Reliquary? I would think splashing black for Stillmoon Cavalier and hate cards like Deathmark, Thoughseize, Extirpate, and Smother would be better than splashing green. Krosan Grip in an environment where countermagic is going to be obsolete is worst than Disenchant. Plus making the Cav fly w/ a sword on him is so awesome!
Reliquary also allows you to thin your deck and take advantage of Flagstones of Troikar. The Knight's a consistency card and color-fixer in one.
Phyrexian Metamorph can be played in a monowhite build, so with Adaptive Automaton you have a potential of 12 Knight Exemplars. Would want to include some life gain though. Maybe Martyr of Sands
Phrexian Metamorph is certainly playable, the question is how many should we put? I can imagine Metamorph copying the eldrazi in 12 posts matchups.
I thought hard about Martyr of Sands, but wouldnt Knight of Meadowgrain be good enough? And Martyr of Sands is only good if you include a playset, or does it has to be in the opening hand to be really useful?
With Zoo so popular, I think either SoBaM or SoFaF would be better as you can swing through the defenses easier or block. Besides the obvious Hugeness he can get to, what's the reason for splashing green for Reliquary? I would think splashing black for Stillmoon Cavalier and hate cards like Deathmark, Thoughseize, Extirpate, and Smother would be better than splashing green. Krosan Grip in an environment where countermagic is going to be obsolete is worst than Disenchant. Plus making the Cav fly w/ a sword on him is so awesome!
Zoo's spells are so efficient that they can always remove our creatures prior to equipping, thus gaining tempo in the process and making it even harder for us to response.
I think the equipments are too slow if we are to race them. The only chances of equipments going through is during the mid-game when they run out of gas.
I can understand Krosan Grip is not so effective anymore in Modern. With the cards you mention, Black/white knights certainly looks viable here. I'll try to brew a Black/white list shortly.
Why not Bojuka Bog as a one-of in the sideboard? Also a single Sejiri Steppe in the mainboard can be a nice combat trick/removal counter with Knight of the Reliquary in play.
Why not Bojuka Bog as a one-of in the sideboard? Also a single Sejiri Steppe in the mainboard can be a nice combat trick/removal counter with Knight of the Reliquary in play.
Nice! Didn't thought of Sejiri Steppe's interaction with KoTR. KoTR as a land toolbox certainty has very relevant applications here.
If the store owner says that I can't trade in the premises, I'll just go outside. If he says that I can't trade within 10m of his premises, I'll go to 11 meters. If he says that he doesn't want to see me trading, I will put a basket over his head and continue trading.
Yes, he's a local legend. He's only known to take his clothes off before he goes into the Ladies' Lockerroom. Nobody knows what he does in there because he's invisible, but it's almost certainly tons of masturbating.
For the time being, i'll most probably replace the 4 Krosan Grip with 1 Borjuka Bog, 1 Qasali Pridgemage, 2 Oust. Oust is included to improve Zoo matchups.
Nurgal, why a 63-card deck? It seems like you'd be better off cutting something, and adding a fourth Aether Vial, than running such a large deck. Also: Is Gaddock Teeg going to be as important here? I would see him more as a sideboard card, perhaps as part of a GSZ toolbox in the sideboard (or MD) to counter storm combo (Dragonstorm rather than Tendrils) and control (Cryptic rather than Force), but not important enough to use three valuable MD slots. Ironic how he shuts down similar archetypes in both Modern and Legacy...
I'm glad you like my list, and is more than happy to brainstorm together on how to make it even better although our individual meta will eventually dictates the final card choices.
Naldor is right here, there is no need to run 3 extra cards. Playing 4 Aether Vial here is a must as you'll want to draw it in the early game. Gaddock Teeg should be moved to the sideboard, taking Krosan Grip position if you are concerned about Combo matchup.
We can also look at GSZ toolbox like what Naldor suggested. Maybe it is even possible to have 2xGSZ, Gaddock tegg mainboard. GSZ can also tutor for Pridgemage & KotR also.
Nurgal, why a 63-card deck? It seems like you'd be better off cutting something, and adding a fourth Aether Vial, than running such a large deck. Also: Is Gaddock Teeg going to be as important here? I would see him more as a sideboard card, perhaps as part of a GSZ toolbox in the sideboard (or MD) to counter storm combo (Dragonstorm rather than Tendrils) and control (Cryptic rather than Force), but not important enough to use three valuable MD slots. Ironic how he shuts down similar archetypes in both Modern and Legacy...
My bad I must have forgotten to take something out. I was dead tired when I was writing those and couldn't sleep. I'll go back an edit.
So what I want to know is why is the playset of brave the elements not in the maindeck? Seems pretty good in this meta.
Yeah, it's good, but i didnt want to remove more creatures from the list which will reduce Vial's effectiveness.
By the way i just realised if we play GSZ it'll start to look similar to GWMaverick. In any case playing the GSZ toolbox will enable me to reduce the KoTR & Qasali Pridgemage count. If the Meta is combo heavy and i'll maindeck Gaddock Teeg.
Any chance of sticking Kataki, War's Wage into the side board for artifact decks?
I think it really depends on the meta. Personally having 4 Qasali Pridgemage is sufficient. Besides is there a way to tutor for kataki? Playing one or two from the sideboard seems like a long shot if you desperately need to draw them. How about Aura of Silence or is there another card similar to Serenity effect?
How is the decklist working for you so far? Is it worth including a GSZ toolbox?
If the store owner says that I can't trade in the premises, I'll just go outside. If he says that I can't trade within 10m of his premises, I'll go to 11 meters. If he says that he doesn't want to see me trading, I will put a basket over his head and continue trading.
Yes, he's a local legend. He's only known to take his clothes off before he goes into the Ladies' Lockerroom. Nobody knows what he does in there because he's invisible, but it's almost certainly tons of masturbating.
I'm actually starting to consider Body and Mind, or Fire and Ice due to the loads of Blue out there. Body and Mind also has the advantage of getting you through Green targets.
I'll probably keep Sword of Body and Mind for the sideboard since i'm already running Mirran Crusader. That said, SoBM is really good in holding up against Goyf & for building a mass of creature tokens.
WW tribal aggro is going to be pretty weak in modern.
Albert Einstein
Thomas Jefferson
I'm not sure which format you are comparing to, in any case are you saying the Mono-white knights list is weak?
In tribal matchups against Goblins/Zombies/merfolk etc, i think WW knights has a good shot in besting them.
Signature by Syndarion from Aeternal Studios!
[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W
That hits your curve at 3.
Bad thing about tribals is your lords. looks
Merfolk - 4 lords
Elves - 3 lords
Goblins - 3 lords
Knights - 1 lords
Granted Knight creatures alone are usually better alone than most other tribal critters.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=519290
However with SFM banned, Knights do take a bigger hit compared to other tribals especially since they share the same color.
Anyway below is my new Green/White list updated with the ban list:
3 Adaptive Automaton
4 Knight Exemplar
4 Knight of the Reliquary
4 Knight of the White Orchid
3 Mirran Crusader
3 Qasali Pridemage
4 Student of Warfare
Spells [15]
4 AEther Vial
4 Dismember
4 Path to Exile
2 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Sword of Light and Shadow
4 Arid Mesa
1 Forest
2 Horizon Canopy
4 Marsh Flats
7 Plains
1 Tectonic Edge
1 Temple Garden
4 Krosan Grip
4 Brave the Elements
3 Phyrexian Metamorph
4 Relic of Progenitus
Signature by Syndarion from Aeternal Studios!
[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W
WUBRG Some of these decks can actually win games...WUBRG
How I know I should build a deck:
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=519290
Reliquary also allows you to thin your deck and take advantage of Flagstones of Troikar. The Knight's a consistency card and color-fixer in one.
Phrexian Metamorph is certainly playable, the question is how many should we put? I can imagine Metamorph copying the eldrazi in 12 posts matchups.
I thought hard about Martyr of Sands, but wouldnt Knight of Meadowgrain be good enough? And Martyr of Sands is only good if you include a playset, or does it has to be in the opening hand to be really useful?
Zoo's spells are so efficient that they can always remove our creatures prior to equipping, thus gaining tempo in the process and making it even harder for us to response.
I think the equipments are too slow if we are to race them. The only chances of equipments going through is during the mid-game when they run out of gas.
I can understand Krosan Grip is not so effective anymore in Modern. With the cards you mention, Black/white knights certainly looks viable here. I'll try to brew a Black/white list shortly.
Correct, KoTR is a land toolbox, and is also the only knight creature which is has the potential to be a threat on its own.
Signature by Syndarion from Aeternal Studios!
[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W
Why not Bojuka Bog as a one-of in the sideboard? Also a single Sejiri Steppe in the mainboard can be a nice combat trick/removal counter with Knight of the Reliquary in play.
Nice! Didn't thought of Sejiri Steppe's interaction with KoTR. KoTR as a land toolbox certainty has very relevant applications here.
Thanks for the suggestions. I'll go for Sejiri Steppe to replace one of the plains, and Borjuka Bog to take over Krosan Grip.
For the time being, i'll most probably replace the 4 Krosan Grip with 1 Borjuka Bog, 1 Qasali Pridgemage, 2 Oust. Oust is included to improve Zoo matchups.
@Nurgal,
I prefer Elspeth, The Knight Errant at the 4cc slot, thus poor Hero is left out.
Signature by Syndarion from Aeternal Studios!
[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W
4 Arid Mesa
2 Marsh Flat
2 Tectonic Edge
4 Temple Garden
2 Horizon Canopy
5 Plain
1 Forest
Creatures: 25
3 Adaptive Automaton
4 Knight Exemplar
4 Knight of the Reliquary
4 Knight of the White Orchid
3 Mirran Crusader
3 Qasali Pridemage
4 Student of Warfare
3 Dismember
4 Path to Exile
Artifacts: 6
3 Aether Vial
2 Sword of War and Peace
1 Sword of Light and Shadow
Planeswalker: 2
2 Elspeth, Knight Errant
4 Krosan Grip
4 Brave the Elements
3 Phyrexian Metamorph
4 Relic of Progenitus
Version 2
4 Arid Mesa
2 Tectonic Edge
2 Temple Garden
4 Horizon Canopy
5 Plain
1 Forest
2 Flagstones of Trokair
Creatures: 25
3 Adaptive Automaton
4 Knight Exemplar
4 Knight of the Reliquary
4 Knight of the White Orchid
3 Mirran Crusader
3 Qasali Pridemage
4 Student of Warfare
3 Gaddock Teeg
3 Dismember
4 Path to Exile
Artifacts: 6
2 Sword of War and Peace
1 Sword of Light and Shadow
Planeswalker: 2
2 Elspeth, Knight Errant
4 Krosan Grip
4 Brave the Elements
3 Phyrexian Metamorph
4 Relic of Progenitus
I'm glad you like my list, and is more than happy to brainstorm together on how to make it even better although our individual meta will eventually dictates the final card choices.
Naldor is right here, there is no need to run 3 extra cards. Playing 4 Aether Vial here is a must as you'll want to draw it in the early game. Gaddock Teeg should be moved to the sideboard, taking Krosan Grip position if you are concerned about Combo matchup.
We can also look at GSZ toolbox like what Naldor suggested. Maybe it is even possible to have 2xGSZ, Gaddock tegg mainboard. GSZ can also tutor for Pridgemage & KotR also.
Signature by Syndarion from Aeternal Studios!
[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W
My bad I must have forgotten to take something out. I was dead tired when I was writing those and couldn't sleep. I'll go back an edit.
Yeah, it's good, but i didnt want to remove more creatures from the list which will reduce Vial's effectiveness.
By the way i just realised if we play GSZ it'll start to look similar to GWMaverick. In any case playing the GSZ toolbox will enable me to reduce the KoTR & Qasali Pridgemage count. If the Meta is combo heavy and i'll maindeck Gaddock Teeg.
No wonder your list looks a little weird...;)
Just post your new lists and we can discuss from there
Signature by Syndarion from Aeternal Studios!
[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W
4 Arid Mesa
2 Tectonic Edge
2 Temple Garden
4 Horizon Canopy
5 Plain
1 Forest
2 Flagstones of Trokair
Creatures: 24
3 Adaptive Automaton
4 Knight Exemplar
3 Knight of the Reliquary
4 Knight of the White Orchid
2 Qasali Pridemage
4 Student of Warfare
1 Gaddock Teeg
3 Phyrexian Metamorph
3 Dismember
4 Path to Exile
Sorcery: 2
2 Green Sun's Zenith
Artifacts: 6
3 Aether Vial
2 Sword of War and Peace
1 Sword of Light and Shadow
Planeswalker: 1
1 Elspeth, Knight Errant
4 Krosan Grip
4 Brave the Elements
2 Qasali Pridemage
1 Elspeth, Knight Errant
4 Relic of Progenitus
I'm still not sold on the side board quite yet, but this is the version I'm playing on cockatrice right now.
I think it really depends on the meta. Personally having 4 Qasali Pridgemage is sufficient. Besides is there a way to tutor for kataki? Playing one or two from the sideboard seems like a long shot if you desperately need to draw them. How about Aura of Silence or is there another card similar to Serenity effect?
How is the decklist working for you so far? Is it worth including a GSZ toolbox?
Signature by Syndarion from Aeternal Studios!
[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W
Signature by Syndarion from Aeternal Studios!
[Deck/Primer] Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Darth Knights in Legacy
[Deck] Casual Knights in Legacy
[Deck/Primer] Modern Knights
[Deck/Primer] Modern Ninjas
LEGACY
Legacy Knights Variants WG,WU,WR,WB,W,B
Soldiers Stompy W
NinjaStill UB
FOWless Merfolk UW
Aggro Elves G
MODERN
Modern Knights Variants WG,BR
Modern Ninjas Variants UB,UG,UW,UWR
Modern Kithkins WR,W