Hello everyone! I am new to the forum, but I was hoping I could get some feedback. I am not going to take full credit on this deck, as I built upon the budget deck that Saffron Olive featured on MTGGoldfish. However, I have come up with some other options that I think could be really fun to play, the main change is that I switched out Thalia, Guardian of Thraben for Odric, Lunarch Marshal, an idea I got from watching the professor. I switched some other cards to help synergize with Odric. I still havent come up with a sideboard. Anyways, let me know what you think! What should I keep or change.
What makes the deck good is the multitude of 2-power 1-drops, cutting them and adding 3,4-drops makes the deck worse imho.
As an aggro deck you want to be fast and hit hard and not curve out slowly with weak creatures.
The only 3-drop I'd play in the deck is Thalia, Heretic Cathar as it messes up blocking and mana-development for the opponent.
Thalia is the best card in the deck (besides Champion+Lieutenant) and really slow down decks trying to combo or stablize with multiple removal spells.
Cutting hee is a very bad idea imho.
#Odric is a win-more card (and a pretty bad one at that).
#Dragonslayer is a weak 2-drop, the megamorph ability is situational and slow.
#With a lower curve cards like Knight aren't necessary and with Brave as your evasion enabler Falconer isn't necessary.
#Arashin Foremost only works with warriors (most of your creatures aren't warriors) so I'd cut it as well.
Some good 1-drops for the deck are: Kytheon, Hero of Akros - can flip quickly and then hit hard and protect other creatures. Soldier of the Pantheon - another 2/1 with sometimes relevant abilities. Thraben Inspector - essentially draws you a card, very important for games that go longer and against discard. Student of Warfare - not great early but one of the best possible top-decks later in the game.
A good non-creature spell for the deck is Gather the Townsfolk which buffs Champion+Lieutenant twice and helps go wide against spot removal, also can help flip Kytheon quicker and very good in the late game when the life total is low.
Thanks for the reply Dennis! I know the deck is much better with Thalia, Guardian of Thraben. She is just a bit pricey for me at the moment. Do you have any suggestions on replacing her and keeping down costs? The reason I changed the other cards was due to their abilities and possible synergy with Odric, Lunarch Marshal.
Thanks for the input! Yes, switching out Thalia, Guardian of Thraben with bigger Thalia seems reasonable. I guess I should have prefaced the thread with the fact that this deck is not going to see competitive play. It is for my casual playgroup and that's all. That is why I am wanting to keep it as budget as possible.
Thanks For all the suggestions, I really do appreciate it! I ordered a bunch of cards and I'm just waiting for them to come in. I am going to keep tinkering with the deck after I see how it handles in my playgroup. I will post the final deck list in a couple days after I get a chance to test it out. I don't want to give up on Odric, Lunarch Marshal just yet. I see a lot of potential there, but maybe my mind will change after playtesting lol. The cards I ordered should allow me to make the deck more aggro if I decide I want to go with that route.
I know you like Odric, Lunarch Marshal but if you're going to put something in that's that high cost it needs to win you the game on its own. Thalia is def amazing but maybe 2of hero of blade hold to top your curve since you want a large creature. It can win you a game on its own if not delt with.
I know you like Odric, Lunarch Marshal but if you're going to put something in that's that high cost it needs to win you the game on its own. Thalia is def amazing but maybe 2of hero of blade hold to top your curve since you want a large creature. It can win you a game on its own if not delt with.
Thanks for the reply. I am from the "Show-Me State", so I guess I can be a bit stubborn. However, after playing Odric, Lunarch Marshal I realized that it wasn't nearly as consistent as I'd hoped. Maybe for another deck someday later.
About your discussion : Odric is lame. Sorry but you need to understand that. If you are losing, it won't do anything. If you are winning, you don't need it anyway. It dies to bolt. It dies to push. Don't play it.
Hero of bladehold is good, saddly not good enough for modern anymore (I played it for a while). You want things that your opponent won't destroy with regular removal. You need planeswalkers. I haven't figured out which one of the two in my list is the best, but this is what you want when the game reachs the midgame, because if you are there you're probably losing and you want something really threatening.
Honor of the pure is not good : It doesn't do anything by its own, you don't want to play it on turn 2 (you want to expand your board presence) and after that it's not that good. Gather the townsfolk is what you need instead.
19 lands is not enough. You're not affinity that doesn't need lands, you're not burn that can play with 2 lands. You want to play your creatures and still have mana up to protect them with Brave the elements or disrupt your opponent with path (or bluff one of these card with one mana left up).
Play at the very least 21 land (then cut 2 4CCM threats), and unless you meta is filled with blood moons, play the flagstone-ghost quarter combination. It does not cost you anything if your opponent has a good manabase (use quarter on flagstone : go get 2 plains), and can save your ass if he has a weak one (or against Tron).
Thank you for your response I do appreciate it! However, I tend to disagree with you in a few areas. Odric, Lunarch Marshal While I agree with you on your first point about the card, I don't think think the second bit of reasoning applies in that all the other cards that have been offered as replacements die to the same things. Sorry may be nitpicking here.
Honor of the Pure
Playing with this card, I would tend to argue that it is very good, especially after you have established a board presence. For me personally, it has often been the difference in swinging for lethal on turn 4/5 rather than later. I may be misguided, but Gather the Townsfolk seems much slower seeing as it only pumps Champion and Thalia's Lieutenant.
19 Versus 21 Lands
I do agree that 19 is a little low on land count, even with all of the 1-drops. With your deck list I can see why you justified adding the two extra lands. However, I chose to keep Knight of the White Orchid in my deck, for two reasons: 1)I have found that in my matchups a first striking 2/2 is relevant in that it can be hard to get around early on and adding counters and boosts from our "lord" effects keeps it relevant when the deck is gaining speed.
2)The ETB effect: Potentially gaining an untapped land and then making the land drop for the turn can really speed up the clock, but if I don't get a land out of it so be it. For the meta I play in, the first reason has proven to be enough to warrant its addition with the second reason being an added bonus. Although, I do have a play set of Imposing Sovereign in case the meta shifts.
So after playtesting the deck against my casual playgroup, I want to make that distinction because I realize this may not be the best setup for everyone depending on their local meta, I have decided to keep all of the warriors. I kept Mardu Woe-Reaper since it is a 1-drop that occasionally gains us some life and benefits from Arashin's ETB and combat triggers. I chose to keep Dragonslayer because of the warrior synergies and the lifelink which is an aspect I like, especially with pumps from cards like Honor, Lieutenant, andArashin.While it is unlikely to have all three in the order to make all of those synergies happen; even small advantages tend to add up.Even though his megamorph ability is very situational, there may be times that the situation arises and he gets the added bonus.I chose Arashin as my 3-drop because of those warrior synergies, and in my personal (yet limited) experience playing the deck, when it comes down it's ETB trigger usually has a target, and if there isn't a target it usually doesn't take long to find another warrior to drop down and have two double striking threats on the next turn.
I want to thank those of you who offered your suggestions and opinions. I really appreciate you taking time to give your thoughts. I don't want anyone to think that I ignored their suggestions out of pride, or that I think the cards I chose are better, for my playgroup they have proven themselves and that is how I made my decisions. That's not to say that this deck won't change if we happen to get a local shop where I can play and face a more diverse meta.
One final note and I'll stop rambling. As you can see the sideboard is not complete, I personally usually don't use a sideboard when I play casually, so I apologize for the lack of completeness.
It can make the difference of going wide with your smaller creatures through a big blocker instead of just being stonewalled and picked apart by removal or sweepers later.
Planeswalkers fit better in midrange decks whether I view mono-white humans as a go wide pure-aggro type of deck.
It can make the difference of going wide with your smaller creatures through a big blocker instead of just being stonewalled and picked apart by removal or sweepers later.
Planeswalkers fit better in midrange decks whether I view mono-white humans as a go wide pure-aggro type of deck.
Sweet Advice! I completely forgot about Dragon Hunter! Definitely going to replace Vanguard with that. I agree with your standpoint on this being more of an aggro deck than a midrange deck, the planeswalkers seem a bit clunky at 4CMC; the same was true for Odric, Lunarch Marshal although I do agree that the you get more for your mana with the planeswalkers vs.Odric,Lunarc Marshal Seeker of the Way would be a good replacement, but like you said it would be much better with more non-creature spells. I may have to playtest Glorybound to see how it fairs, it's nice that it's a 3/1 giving some additional hitting power, I just am not sure I like the situational side of having to exert it, but I do see the potential and it could make a big difference, especially exerting it and potentially giving it doublestrike from Arashin Foremost, this combination alone could probably close out games a turn earlier.
Bathum
I tend to agree with Dennis on Honor of the Pure. And you are correct, I don't have an LGS (I miss having one in my hometown), although one is suppose to be coming soon, so it's not that I don't realize or not care about your points, I just disagree with some of your choices for me personally. That doesn't mean your comments are wrong it just means that metas can vary a great deal and until I am able to play at my soon to be opening (Hopefully) LGS it is hard for me to analyze what changes,if any, need to be made.Arashin Foremost works really well in my playgroup although I did consider Mirran Crusader when I was building the deck. With the addition of Dragon Hunter as another one drop, I think the upside is still there.
Again, I appreciate all the feedback and discussions!
Some of the best humans are naturally soldiers. You could try a few Field Marshal.
Im personally running this list for Humans. Its under 75$ for the full deck.
Being allies it is quite different, but you might see some stuff you like. Fortify, in particular has been excellent, and Dawn Charm is a very nice surprise card.
If you do decide to start sideboarding, for your list I'd include some Rootborn Defenses. It will really surprise the hell out of wrath-heavy opponents.
It can make the difference of going wide with your smaller creatures through a big blocker instead of just being stonewalled and picked apart by removal or sweepers later.
Planeswalkers fit better in midrange decks whether I view mono-white humans as a go wide pure-aggro type of deck.
Sweet Advice! I completely forgot about Dragon Hunter! Definitely going to replace Vanguard with that. I agree with your standpoint on this being more of an aggro deck than a midrange deck, the planeswalkers seem a bit clunky at 4CMC; the same was true for Odric, Lunarch Marshal although I do agree that the you get more for your mana with the planeswalkers vs.Odric,Lunarc Marshal Seeker of the Way would be a good replacement, but like you said it would be much better with more non-creature spells. I may have to playtest Glorybound to see how it fairs, it's nice that it's a 3/1 giving some additional hitting power, I just am not sure I like the situational side of having to exert it, but I do see the potential and it could make a big difference, especially exerting it and potentially giving it doublestrike from Arashin Foremost, this combination alone could probably close out games a turn earlier.
Bathum
I tend to agree with Dennis on Honor of the Pure. And you are correct, I don't have an LGS (I miss having one in my hometown), although one is suppose to be coming soon, so it's not that I don't realize or not care about your points, I just disagree with some of your choices for me personally. That doesn't mean your comments are wrong it just means that metas can vary a great deal and until I am able to play at my soon to be opening (Hopefully) LGS it is hard for me to analyze what changes,if any, need to be made.Arashin Foremost works really well in my playgroup although I did consider Mirran Crusader when I was building the deck. With the addition of Dragon Hunter as another one drop, I think the upside is still there.
Again, I appreciate all the feedback and discussions!
If you going warrior I would recommend WB black has some pretty good cards. Below are options. Depends on which way you want to take it
[
Creatures
Chief of the edge
Blood-Chin Ranger
Bloodsoaked Champion
Mardu Strike Leader
Mardu Woe-Reaper
Sorin, Solemn Visitor
I haven't played in quite a while (14 years), just coming back to the game recently, last FNM I had my first competitive experience since returning about some month ago and the first time I played the deck (I didn't,t have a sideboard that Friday).
My main doubts are around the sideboard (I am tweaking the main deck for a while testing stuff around so not that much concern about the main).
Last week I played vs
1- 2 vs Spirits, this seems winnable, I was looking for some creature with protection from blue didn't come across any human so I went for Spirit mantle which could be useful in other matchups too, what do you think? is too slow?
1- 2 vs Dredge, I am sure an Auriok Champion and Mirran crusader to an extent would turn the tide completely as well as tormod's crypt
2 - 0 vs grixis, not much problem here
2 - 0 vs planeswalker control, this seemed more of a UW control shell plus some planeswalkers
What other cards should I consider for the Sideboard? AFAIK other decks in the FNm were Tron and a Mono-blue control.
Other cards I am considering for sideboard: Sword of body and Mind vs Humans, Spirits and blue control. Might be too slow, not enough impact? Frontline Medic vs creature based decks (instead of spirit mantle)
Any help is highly appreciated
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4 Mardu Woe-Reaper
2 Arashin Foremost
4 Hidden Dragonslayer
4 Champion of the Parish
3 Odric, Lunarch Marshal
4 Thalia's Lieutenant
4 Knight of the White Orchid
2 Abzan Falconer
4 Honor of the Pure
4 Path to Exile
4 Brave the Elements
As an aggro deck you want to be fast and hit hard and not curve out slowly with weak creatures.
The only 3-drop I'd play in the deck is Thalia, Heretic Cathar as it messes up blocking and mana-development for the opponent.
Thalia is the best card in the deck (besides Champion+Lieutenant) and really slow down decks trying to combo or stablize with multiple removal spells.
Cutting hee is a very bad idea imho.
#Odric is a win-more card (and a pretty bad one at that).
#Dragonslayer is a weak 2-drop, the megamorph ability is situational and slow.
#With a lower curve cards like Knight aren't necessary and with Brave as your evasion enabler Falconer isn't necessary.
#Arashin Foremost only works with warriors (most of your creatures aren't warriors) so I'd cut it as well.
Some good 1-drops for the deck are:
Kytheon, Hero of Akros - can flip quickly and then hit hard and protect other creatures.
Soldier of the Pantheon - another 2/1 with sometimes relevant abilities.
Thraben Inspector - essentially draws you a card, very important for games that go longer and against discard.
Student of Warfare - not great early but one of the best possible top-decks later in the game.
A good non-creature spell for the deck is Gather the Townsfolk which buffs Champion+Lieutenant twice and helps go wide against spot removal, also can help flip Kytheon quicker and very good in the late game when the life total is low.
Not having Thalia would really weaken the combo-matchups though.
I'm not even sure that replacements like Grand Abolisher in the SB would help.
Here is what I'd suggest playing:
4x Thraben Inspector
4x Champion of the Parish
4x Soldier of the Pantheon
4x Student of Warfare
3x Kytheon, Hero of Akros
4x Thalia's Lieutenant
2x Thalia, Heretic Cathar
4x Honor of the Pure
Instant (8)
4x Brave the Elements
4x Path to Exile
Sorcery (4)
4x Gather the Townsfolk
19x Plains
#Student of Warfare might be better off being Mardu Woe-Reaper.
#If you prefer going "tall" rather tan "wide" there is the option of playing Allies like: Expedition Envoy, Hada Freeblade and Kazandu Blademaster
instead of Gather the Townsfolk, Student of Warfare and Soldier of the Pantheon.
#Repel the Abominable and Selfless Spirit are good SB cards against removal and opposing aggro decks.
Thanks for the reply. I am from the "Show-Me State", so I guess I can be a bit stubborn. However, after playing Odric, Lunarch Marshal I realized that it wasn't nearly as consistent as I'd hoped. Maybe for another deck someday later.
Thank you for your response I do appreciate it! However, I tend to disagree with you in a few areas.
Odric, Lunarch Marshal While I agree with you on your first point about the card, I don't think think the second bit of reasoning applies in that all the other cards that have been offered as replacements die to the same things. Sorry may be nitpicking here.
Honor of the Pure
Playing with this card, I would tend to argue that it is very good, especially after you have established a board presence. For me personally, it has often been the difference in swinging for lethal on turn 4/5 rather than later. I may be misguided, but Gather the Townsfolk seems much slower seeing as it only pumps Champion and Thalia's Lieutenant.
19 Versus 21 Lands
I do agree that 19 is a little low on land count, even with all of the 1-drops. With your deck list I can see why you justified adding the two extra lands. However, I chose to keep Knight of the White Orchid in my deck, for two reasons: 1)I have found that in my matchups a first striking 2/2 is relevant in that it can be hard to get around early on and adding counters and boosts from our "lord" effects keeps it relevant when the deck is gaining speed.
2)The ETB effect: Potentially gaining an untapped land and then making the land drop for the turn can really speed up the clock, but if I don't get a land out of it so be it. For the meta I play in, the first reason has proven to be enough to warrant its addition with the second reason being an added bonus. Although, I do have a play set of Imposing Sovereign in case the meta shifts.
4 Mardu Woe-Reaper
4 Hidden Dragonslayer
4 Thalia's Lieutenant
3 Knight of the White Orchid
3 Arashin Foremost
4 Champion of the Parish
4 Elite Vanguard
4 Soldier of the Pantheon
3 Honor of the Pure
4 Path to Exile
4 Brave the Elements
So after playtesting the deck against my casual playgroup, I want to make that distinction because I realize this may not be the best setup for everyone depending on their local meta, I have decided to keep all of the warriors. I kept Mardu Woe-Reaper since it is a 1-drop that occasionally gains us some life and benefits from Arashin's ETB and combat triggers. I chose to keep Dragonslayer because of the warrior synergies and the lifelink which is an aspect I like, especially with pumps from cards like Honor, Lieutenant, andArashin.While it is unlikely to have all three in the order to make all of those synergies happen; even small advantages tend to add up.Even though his megamorph ability is very situational, there may be times that the situation arises and he gets the added bonus.I chose Arashin as my 3-drop because of those warrior synergies, and in my personal (yet limited) experience playing the deck, when it comes down it's ETB trigger usually has a target, and if there isn't a target it usually doesn't take long to find another warrior to drop down and have two double striking threats on the next turn.
I want to thank those of you who offered your suggestions and opinions. I really appreciate you taking time to give your thoughts. I don't want anyone to think that I ignored their suggestions out of pride, or that I think the cards I chose are better, for my playgroup they have proven themselves and that is how I made my decisions. That's not to say that this deck won't change if we happen to get a local shop where I can play and face a more diverse meta.
One final note and I'll stop rambling. As you can see the sideboard is not complete, I personally usually don't use a sideboard when I play casually, so I apologize for the lack of completeness.
It can make the difference of going wide with your smaller creatures through a big blocker instead of just being stonewalled and picked apart by removal or sweepers later.
Planeswalkers fit better in midrange decks whether I view mono-white humans as a go wide pure-aggro type of deck.
Miscreant Mage,
#If you insist on playing Warriors you might as well replace Elite Vanguard with Dragon Hunter.
#Seeker of the Way is probably also better than Hidden Dragonslayer, though I'd probably want to play him with 14-16x non-creature spells rather than just 11x.
Another option can be Glory-Bound Initiate.
Sweet Advice! I completely forgot about Dragon Hunter! Definitely going to replace Vanguard with that. I agree with your standpoint on this being more of an aggro deck than a midrange deck, the planeswalkers seem a bit clunky at 4CMC; the same was true for Odric, Lunarch Marshal although I do agree that the you get more for your mana with the planeswalkers vs.Odric,Lunarc Marshal
Seeker of the Way would be a good replacement, but like you said it would be much better with more non-creature spells. I may have to playtest Glorybound to see how it fairs, it's nice that it's a 3/1 giving some additional hitting power, I just am not sure I like the situational side of having to exert it, but I do see the potential and it could make a big difference, especially exerting it and potentially giving it doublestrike from Arashin Foremost, this combination alone could probably close out games a turn earlier.
Bathum
I tend to agree with Dennis on Honor of the Pure. And you are correct, I don't have an LGS (I miss having one in my hometown), although one is suppose to be coming soon, so it's not that I don't realize or not care about your points, I just disagree with some of your choices for me personally. That doesn't mean your comments are wrong it just means that metas can vary a great deal and until I am able to play at my soon to be opening (Hopefully) LGS it is hard for me to analyze what changes,if any, need to be made.Arashin Foremost works really well in my playgroup although I did consider Mirran Crusader when I was building the deck. With the addition of Dragon Hunter as another one drop, I think the upside is still there.
Again, I appreciate all the feedback and discussions!
Im personally running this list for Humans. Its under 75$ for the full deck.
4 Field Marshal
4 Kazandu Blademaster
4 Champion of the Parish
4 Hada Freeblade
4 Thalia's Lieutenant
3 Ranger of Eos
4 Boros Elite
4 Consul's Lieutenant
4 Honor of the Pure
// 4 Instant
4 Brave the Elements
// 21 Land
21 Plains
Being allies it is quite different, but you might see some stuff you like. Fortify, in particular has been excellent, and Dawn Charm is a very nice surprise card.
If you do decide to start sideboarding, for your list I'd include some Rootborn Defenses. It will really surprise the hell out of wrath-heavy opponents.
If you going warrior I would recommend WB black has some pretty good cards. Below are options. Depends on which way you want to take it
[
Creatures
Chief of the edge
Blood-Chin Ranger
Bloodsoaked Champion
Mardu Strike Leader
Mardu Woe-Reaper
Sorin, Solemn Visitor
Currently:
1 Student of warfare
1 Kytheon, Hero of Akros
3 Thraben Inspector
4 Champion of the Parish
4 Soldier of the Pantheon
3 Mardu Woe-Reaper
4 Thalia's Lieutenant
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1 Precinct Captain
2 Thalia, Heretic cathar
1 Field Marshal
3 Smuggler's Copter
4 Brave the Elements
3 Honor of the Pure
3 Path to Exile
1 Reciprocate
2 Ghot's Quarter
1 Shefet Dunes
16 Plains
2 Disenchant
3 Tormod's Crypt
3 Damping sphere
2 Auriok Champion
1 Mirran crusader
2 Spirit Mantle
2 Damping Matrix
I haven't played in quite a while (14 years), just coming back to the game recently, last FNM I had my first competitive experience since returning about some month ago and the first time I played the deck (I didn't,t have a sideboard that Friday).
My main doubts are around the sideboard (I am tweaking the main deck for a while testing stuff around so not that much concern about the main).
Sideboard
2 Disenchant - vs Oblivion stone, Chalice, Engineering explosives, is there a human creature that could play this role?
3 Tormod's Crypt - vs Dredge
3 Damping sphere - vs Tron, Storm
2 Auriok Champion - vs Grixis, Burn, dredge
1 Mirran crusader - vs Grixis
2 Spirit Mantle vs Humans, Eldrazi, Spirits
2 Damping Matrix vs Tron (substitute for stony silence)
Last week I played vs
1- 2 vs Spirits, this seems winnable, I was looking for some creature with protection from blue didn't come across any human so I went for Spirit mantle which could be useful in other matchups too, what do you think? is too slow?
1- 2 vs Dredge, I am sure an Auriok Champion and Mirran crusader to an extent would turn the tide completely as well as tormod's crypt
2 - 0 vs grixis, not much problem here
2 - 0 vs planeswalker control, this seemed more of a UW control shell plus some planeswalkers
What other cards should I consider for the Sideboard? AFAIK other decks in the FNm were Tron and a Mono-blue control.
The other problem I get into is don't know what to take out in order to bring in my sideboard, some are obvious but for example, I don't know what to cut for disenchant, damping matrix, tormod's crypt, damping sphere, spirit mantle.
Other cards I am considering for sideboard:
Sword of body and Mind vs Humans, Spirits and blue control. Might be too slow, not enough impact?
Frontline Medic vs creature based decks (instead of spirit mantle)
Any help is highly appreciated