59% to hit 4 lands on t4
76% to hit 3 lands on t3
Lead the Stampede hits 2.7 creatures
Coco 1.92 creatures
Coco is instant
Coco puts 2 creatures into play the same moment
I dont know whats better, I like Coco more because of more flexibility due to instant speed and more momentum due to 2 creatures to the battlefield (Lead puts 0!)
If you are in a grindy game vs Jund, Lead is better, otherwise I think Coco is better. Maybe shouldnt play 4 because double Coco without lands is tough.
That list was mine!
Honestly, tried playing CoCo and it was rarely, if ever, actually castable. The decks playing lands like it doesn't need to hit its 3 drops on curve, but it really does.
so I have fallen hard into testing with Domri, Anarch of Bolas, and I really think the payoff is nice. Hes an extra mana per turn and an anthem effect. I feel like he fits really well here but I could see him being too slow or low impact.
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Decks I have in my bag of tricks- Needless to say, someone who wants to play will probably have a deck UB/x Faeries UR Storm XURWB Affinity G Elves UW control
Actually Im not playing Atarka's command anymore, so maybe. The anthem does a lot of work and its a sustainable pump that doubles as a removal engine. I think the comparison leads to the wrong conclusion though so domri is just more effective in the long term. Domri and Judith make me want to add birds back to the deck in the 1drop spot too
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Decks I have in my bag of tricks- Needless to say, someone who wants to play will probably have a deck UB/x Faeries UR Storm XURWB Affinity G Elves UW control
well the 2 lord effects outside Rageforger that can pump the flyer sounds pretty good to me! If I didn't just sell most of my cards, i would love to buy back into Shamans to give it a try!
Command is a very good card here imo, we want to be fast.
Domri is kinda meh
+1/0 is good but 3 mana..
other abilities are very narrow to the point of only being sideboard material
giving mana on third turn is not an acceleration, its deceleration,
uncounterability is meh, very narrow and we have Caverns
fighting is not for shamans, most of the times our creatures are weaker than opponents'. Sideboard vs Infect and Affinity? Doesnt sound great
First time posting while lurking here, but I do want to comment.
My opinion is that Domri as a better Judith, because a) it's pseudo-removal and b) a boltable anthem is not very impressive in modern. (Also, it shouldn't theoretically matter, but since this is kind of a budget archetype for the time being, getting a Cavern effect without the $$$ is nice.)
Command is interesting, but it's a win-more finisher that boosts speed a little vs combo; not committing to the board with a creature deck seems very unappealing in modern, since there are a ton of ways opponents can just grind games out. Playing some value engine that can get more creatures in the last noncreature slots (e.g. Light up the Stage?) creates more staying power, which in my opinion is more important.
P.S. Has anyone of the more experienced players in this thread tried maindecking Goblin Ruinblaster? I've found 2 copies to be pretty amazing (enough that I'm up to 3, but this could be a mistake without a means to accelerate it other than Banneret) since it's often timewalk with more mana but upside in the more difficult matchups.
First time posting while lurking here, but I do want to comment.
My opinion is that Domri as a better Judith, because a) it's pseudo-removal and b) a boltable anthem is not very impressive in modern. (Also, it shouldn't theoretically matter, but since this is kind of a budget archetype for the time being, getting a Cavern effect without the $$$ is nice.)
Command is interesting, but it's a win-more finisher that boosts speed a little vs combo; not committing to the board with a creature deck seems very unappealing in modern, since there are a ton of ways opponents can just grind games out. Playing some value engine that can get more creatures in the last noncreature slots (e.g. Light up the Stage?) creates more staying power, which in my opinion is more important.
P.S. Has anyone of the more experienced players in this thread tried maindecking Goblin Ruinblaster? I've found 2 copies to be pretty amazing (enough that I'm up to 3, but this could be a mistake without a means to accelerate it other than Banneret) since it's often timewalk with more mana but upside in the more difficult matchups.
Command is a pure tempo card so it has it advantages and disadvantages. In my opinion tempo is more important in shamans because with speed we maintain ability to win games, if we put in card advantage over tempo card we generally lose because now our speed is not enough to win and our card advantage is also not enough to grind games out.
I played Goblin Ruinblaster main, it was ok, but in the end I removed him because:
he isnt great at our main plan - aggro
he is a 4 drop, which can be problematic, we dont have much slots for cards this expensive
sometimes he is great killing a tron land at t3 or destroying a land in greedy manabase, sometimes he is blank because he is slow and land destruction is irrelevant. So he is more a sideboard material, in main we want cards that are always good
Came to Shamanism via MTGGoldfish's BR list as my first Modern deck.
My changes have been including 2 copies of Fulminator Mage in the sideboard, 4 of Fireblade Artist just as a hasty 2/2 with fringe upside (-2 Glarewielder, -2 Rix-Maadi Reveler), and small budget mana upgrades (Unclaimed Territory, Blood Crypt, Dragonskull Summit). Glarewielder was boarded out every game so he got cut, and Reveler just wasn't as valuable in my Tron-filled meta where I need to be as fast as possible.
I feel like Immolation Shaman should be good in the sideboard, but haven't seen a good enough matchup to include it.
The biggest decisions I have to make are whether to play Metallic Mimic before Burning-Tree Emissary or chain them, and whether my first elemental tutor is for Fulminator or Rage Forger.
The next step is jumping into Jund or shifting to RG. Judith hasn't been all that great for my meta, so I'm not very committed to black.
IMO Immolation Shaman is a good card against Lantern Control or Jeskai Ascendancy (When they go off with Fatestitcher) but slightly niche. I personally run Burning-Tree Shaman in that slot as it also has the side benefit of pinging when they use planeswalkers.
What do you guys think of Seasoned Pyromancer? Sounds like a decent card to me but not sure if it fits enough. Helps refill our hand in more all-in builds, gives tokens when stuck with weird hands and can give one last push from the graveyard in matchups like Jund or Death's Shadow where blocking a Goyf or Death's Shadow can mean life or death.
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Current Decks:
MODERN: RG Shamanism RG WUG Blades of the Avatars WUG
I'm not sure if it's a better or a worse Rix Maadi Reveler. I usually have one card worth pitching, but not sure if I have two, and the 5-mana exile effect is nearly useless for me. If I haven't secured the board (and the win) by turn 5, then I doubt I'll be winning.
I'll be thinking about Seasoned Pyro in Reveler's place for my BR build as I play for the next few weeks, but I'm afraid it just crowds out the important 3-Drop Rage Forger spot.
LEGACY: Soldier Stompy WW // Blue Stompy UU // Fit Variants BGRW // Sol Land Brews BGRUWC MODERN: Pure Pili-ness GU // Red Devotion RR // Green Devotion Variants GRWUG // U/G Emerge CGU // Lots and Lots of Brews BGRUWC
Once it has a counter it can pull back a Rage Forger for a bigger attack (no pings though), Fulminator Mage to mess with their manabase, or even a Flamekin Harbinger if this guy doesn't have counters yet. Glarewielder could be a solid way to reliably push through damage.
And you can do it every turn. Blow up a land every turn. Grow your crew every turn. Get through unblocked every turn.
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Definitely better for elemental decks than shaman decks (Lightning Skelemental??), but will definitely be fun to play with.
So yeah. I think I didn't give Thunderkin enough though before. I'm playing it in Modern Elementals and it's really good. It's insane with Fulminator if you can increase the toughnes by 1. We can potentially play a more disruptive version of Shamans.
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Always wear protection kids, sleeve up your deck.
LEGACY: Soldier Stompy WW // Blue Stompy UU // Fit Variants BGRW // Sol Land Brews BGRUWC MODERN: Pure Pili-ness GU // Red Devotion RR // Green Devotion Variants GRWUG // U/G Emerge CGU // Lots and Lots of Brews BGRUWC
While I'm always excited for new shamans, I believe Grumbelly, the Generous to have some real potential. If some of you remember the old Wolf Token/Shared Animosity version of the deck, I think you will see why Grumbelly could have some massive effect making 3/3 wolf tokens and making them ping with Rage Forger.
Only problem is the risk of getting killed before doing anything. (Which would likely mean playing him in the Vial version.)
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Current Decks:
MODERN: RG Shamanism RG WUG Blades of the Avatars WUG
I like it, but it doesn't trigger on either Burning-Tree Emissary or Rix Maadi Reveler. Wondering how the deck should change to include him, but I think he'll have the same issues Metallic Mimic had, you want to pull him out first then play things, which generally results in him dying on the cast.
The card I'm pretty high on right now is Once Upon a Time but will need some testing to see if a free spell is actually helpful or not.
Once Upon a Time sounds like a very good card in a lot of decks too. For us, it's Forger 9-12, as well as more digging for sideboard pieces. My only problem is that if I were to draw a OUaT later in the game, I wouldn't feel too good.
I think Grum really needs to be in the less explosive versions (Vial) of the deck since those tend to take advantage of Wolf and Elemetal tokens a lot more.
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Current Decks:
MODERN: RG Shamanism RG WUG Blades of the Avatars WUG
76% to hit 3 lands on t3
Lead the Stampede hits 2.7 creatures
Coco 1.92 creatures
Coco is instant
Coco puts 2 creatures into play the same moment
I dont know whats better, I like Coco more because of more flexibility due to instant speed and more momentum due to 2 creatures to the battlefield (Lead puts 0!)
If you are in a grindy game vs Jund, Lead is better, otherwise I think Coco is better. Maybe shouldnt play 4 because double Coco without lands is tough.
G Green Stompy
RG Shamans
UB Mill
UG Infect
WUBRG Slivers!
Honestly, tried playing CoCo and it was rarely, if ever, actually castable. The decks playing lands like it doesn't need to hit its 3 drops on curve, but it really does.
UB/x Faeries
UR Storm
XURWB Affinity
G Elves
UW control
UB/x Faeries
UR Storm
XURWB Affinity
G Elves
UW control
Domri is kinda meh
+1/0 is good but 3 mana..
other abilities are very narrow to the point of only being sideboard material
giving mana on third turn is not an acceleration, its deceleration,
uncounterability is meh, very narrow and we have Caverns
fighting is not for shamans, most of the times our creatures are weaker than opponents'. Sideboard vs Infect and Affinity? Doesnt sound great
G Green Stompy
RG Shamans
UB Mill
UG Infect
WUBRG Slivers!
My opinion is that Domri as a better Judith, because a) it's pseudo-removal and b) a boltable anthem is not very impressive in modern. (Also, it shouldn't theoretically matter, but since this is kind of a budget archetype for the time being, getting a Cavern effect without the $$$ is nice.)
Command is interesting, but it's a win-more finisher that boosts speed a little vs combo; not committing to the board with a creature deck seems very unappealing in modern, since there are a ton of ways opponents can just grind games out. Playing some value engine that can get more creatures in the last noncreature slots (e.g. Light up the Stage?) creates more staying power, which in my opinion is more important.
P.S. Has anyone of the more experienced players in this thread tried maindecking Goblin Ruinblaster? I've found 2 copies to be pretty amazing (enough that I'm up to 3, but this could be a mistake without a means to accelerate it other than Banneret) since it's often timewalk with more mana but upside in the more difficult matchups.
GW Copycat
Jund Loam
I played Goblin Ruinblaster main, it was ok, but in the end I removed him because:
he isnt great at our main plan - aggro
he is a 4 drop, which can be problematic, we dont have much slots for cards this expensive
sometimes he is great killing a tron land at t3 or destroying a land in greedy manabase, sometimes he is blank because he is slow and land destruction is irrelevant. So he is more a sideboard material, in main we want cards that are always good
G Green Stompy
RG Shamans
UB Mill
UG Infect
WUBRG Slivers!
My changes have been including 2 copies of Fulminator Mage in the sideboard, 4 of Fireblade Artist just as a hasty 2/2 with fringe upside (-2 Glarewielder, -2 Rix-Maadi Reveler), and small budget mana upgrades (Unclaimed Territory, Blood Crypt, Dragonskull Summit). Glarewielder was boarded out every game so he got cut, and Reveler just wasn't as valuable in my Tron-filled meta where I need to be as fast as possible.
I feel like Immolation Shaman should be good in the sideboard, but haven't seen a good enough matchup to include it.
The biggest decisions I have to make are whether to play Metallic Mimic before Burning-Tree Emissary or chain them, and whether my first elemental tutor is for Fulminator or Rage Forger.
The next step is jumping into Jund or shifting to RG. Judith hasn't been all that great for my meta, so I'm not very committed to black.
What do you guys think of Seasoned Pyromancer? Sounds like a decent card to me but not sure if it fits enough. Helps refill our hand in more all-in builds, gives tokens when stuck with weird hands and can give one last push from the graveyard in matchups like Jund or Death's Shadow where blocking a Goyf or Death's Shadow can mean life or death.
MODERN:
RG Shamanism RG
WUG Blades of the Avatars WUG
LEGACY:
WUBRG Cascabalance WUBRG
Made by the amazing Traproot
"Some say the clockwork doesn't speak... I say they are deaf to it's voice." -Daeren, Artificer Druid.
Archester Revival (Custom Steampunk set)
I'm not sure if it's a better or a worse Rix Maadi Reveler. I usually have one card worth pitching, but not sure if I have two, and the 5-mana exile effect is nearly useless for me. If I haven't secured the board (and the win) by turn 5, then I doubt I'll be winning.
I'll be thinking about Seasoned Pyro in Reveler's place for my BR build as I play for the next few weeks, but I'm afraid it just crowds out the important 3-Drop Rage Forger spot.
MODERN: Pure Pili-ness GU // Red Devotion RR // Green Devotion Variants GRWUG // U/G Emerge CGU // Lots and Lots of Brews BGRUWC
BRG Shamans
WUBRGElementals
Once it has a counter it can pull back a Rage Forger for a bigger attack (no pings though), Fulminator Mage to mess with their manabase, or even a Flamekin Harbinger if this guy doesn't have counters yet. Glarewielder could be a solid way to reliably push through damage.
And you can do it every turn. Blow up a land every turn. Grow your crew every turn. Get through unblocked every turn.
--------
Definitely better for elemental decks than shaman decks (Lightning Skelemental??), but will definitely be fun to play with.
Simian Spirit Guide ->
Looting discards Thunderkin Awakener and Lightning Skelemental ->
Blood Crypt ->
Unearth for Thunderkin Awakener ->
Thunderkin Awakener attacks and reanimates Lightning Skelemental.
BRG Shamans
WUBRGElementals
MODERN: Pure Pili-ness GU // Red Devotion RR // Green Devotion Variants GRWUG // U/G Emerge CGU // Lots and Lots of Brews BGRUWC
Only problem is the risk of getting killed before doing anything. (Which would likely mean playing him in the Vial version.)
MODERN:
RG Shamanism RG
WUG Blades of the Avatars WUG
LEGACY:
WUBRG Cascabalance WUBRG
Made by the amazing Traproot
"Some say the clockwork doesn't speak... I say they are deaf to it's voice." -Daeren, Artificer Druid.
Archester Revival (Custom Steampunk set)
The card I'm pretty high on right now is Once Upon a Time but will need some testing to see if a free spell is actually helpful or not.
I think Grum really needs to be in the less explosive versions (Vial) of the deck since those tend to take advantage of Wolf and Elemetal tokens a lot more.
MODERN:
RG Shamanism RG
WUG Blades of the Avatars WUG
LEGACY:
WUBRG Cascabalance WUBRG
Made by the amazing Traproot
"Some say the clockwork doesn't speak... I say they are deaf to it's voice." -Daeren, Artificer Druid.
Archester Revival (Custom Steampunk set)