MTG Salvation

Going through the initial stages of drafting Amonkhet, it seems to me that the archetypes for each color pair are pretty set. From what I see, those archetypes (and their archetype defining commons and uncommons) break down as follows (in no particular order):

BW Zombies/Embalm - Wayward Servant, Lord of the Accursed, Binding Mummy, In Oketra's Name, Stir the Sands
BG -1/-1 Counters - Decimator Beetle, Nest of Scarabs, Soulstinger, Defiant Greatmaw, Quarry Hauler
BU Cycling - Shadowstorm Vizier, Faith of the Devoted, Horror of the Broken Lands, Zenith Seeker, Sacred Excavation
BR "Hellbent" - Merciless Javelineer, Thresher Lizard, Faith of the Devoted, Horror of the Broken Lands, Grim Strider
GW Exert - Ahn-Crop Champion, Tah-Crop Elite, Synchronized Strike, Sparring Mummy, Trial of Solidarity
UR Spellslinger - Enigma Drake, Warfire Javelineer, Cryptic Serpent, Nimble-Blade Khenra

To me, these 6 archetypes seem to be the most supported by a far margin, with the four Black/X archetypes being some of the strongest and most well-defined in the set.

RW Tokens/"Go Wide" Aggro - Honored Crop-Captain, Cartouche of Solidarity, Oketra's Monument, Trueheart Twins, Trial of Solidarity
RG Exert/"Go Big" - Khenra Charioteer, Emberhorn Minotaur, Scaled Behemoth, Synchronized Strike
UG Ramp?/3+ color? - Weaver of Currents, Scaled Behemoth, Naga Vitalist, Lay Claim, Greater Sandwurm, Shefet Monitor
UW Embalm/Tokens? - Aven Wind Guide, Cartouche of Solidarity, Oketra's Monument, Anointer Priest, Trial of Solidarity

From what I see, these archetypes are much less defined and are based less on synergy and more on just powering out creatures to go wide (RW and UW) or go bid (UG and RG). To me, these kinds of decks are more about basically following your removal and bombs.

The one thing that stick outs to me is just how much black synergizes with pretty much any other color in the set, and that cards like Horror of the Broken Lands can go into so many different kinds of decks. Coupled with really good removal (Final Reward, Splendid Agony, Trial of Ambition), black seems like the best color to try and get settled in.

So how does everyone else see the archetypes breaking down and what do you think of black in Amonkhet limited?

The thing about archetypes in limited is that they only have so much power. At the end of the draft, the average deck is a goodstuff deck with an archetypal subtheme, rather than a dedicated archetype deck.

In my experience so far, black hasn't been stronger than the other colors. There are some powerful cards in black, and you aren't wrong with your judgements on synergy, but I don't think that ultimately gives black the upper hand. Right now, I feel like the colors are pretty balanced. Slow decks and fast decks can be in any color.

I personally feel like the discard matters and -1/-1 counter themes are the ones with the best support, and both are well supported in black. Then again, there are loads of factors in play. For example, the blue/white tokens archetype has little support, but the support cards that exist (Aven Wind Guide and Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun) are so good on their own, and so easy to draft around that the archetype becomes a lot more powerful when you can get it.

I'm putting all of my chips on red right now.

Just straight aggro

Red and Black seem to be the most common colors in competitive draft on MTGO but I've lost the most games against white. GB counters is the archtype that's been the most disappointing to me in general. I've certainly built good builds but they don't seem as powerful as I had hoped. GW and RB have overperformed the most to me but honestly, I've seen a ton of competitive builds. There isn't a boogie man build in this format. I don't feel like folding when I see certain basics together. The winners of this format are the Bombs. Glorybringer, Archfiend of Ifnir, Prepare // Fight, Insult // Injury, Merciless Javelineer, Glyph Keeper,Sandwurm Convergence, even Approach of the Second Sun. This format has plenty of playable filler among the five colors and a good amount of removal too so the Bombs you pick up usually dictate your build. Synergy is important but a lot of decks can be mostly good stuff in your colors.

Right now I'd say Red and White are my picks for "best" colors (even though I lean towards Green because I'm a green Mage at heart). Green and Black are both great secondary colors and Blue is the color that I feel is picked the least. However, that's not detrimental for Blue. I think their biggest strength is their payables go around the longest since they're often the most open color. I rarely fight for Blue when I'm drafting it. Still have yet to do better than 2-1 with UR though. I swear it can happen!

I couldn't possibly imagine playing Sandwurm convergence or Approach of the second sun. I have a few games get to 7 lands, sure, but at least half of games I see are done around turn 7-8 (which is not usually land 7-8). I've done about 10 drafts now.
I might board in a sandwurm convergence though. Maybe

My only real complaints now are:
Glorybringer not mythic (why wizards why)
and blue being easily a step down.

I did manage one good blue deck since release day: a triple Cartouche of knowledge, one Blue trial deck that actually wanted sacred cat. And had Bomb rares.
So... count me out of blue for the most part.

I played my first sealed yesterday after a hiatus (completely skipped Kaladesh block and barely played Return to Innistrazi.

Did 2 pools with a friend, and my opinions are below, feel free to challenge/counter them:

- Blue is trash again because blue spells are weak and creatures aren't that good.
- So is the Cycling deck. Effects are too weak to be rally relevant.
- Green is OK, some creatures really shine, but the undercosted cratures at the cost of -1/-1 counters play weaker than you think they would. Still, Green/White or Green/Red monsters seem nice. Still, the green cartouche is probably the best?
- Aftermath is anecdotal
- Red and Black together win games and are probably the 2 best colors of the set
- Mana fixing is sorely missing (Evolving Wilds, rocks, etc)
- Exert is actually fine, Embalm is less good than intially thought

I know that only 2 pools aren't representative of a complete experience though.

If you're going to play 7- or 8-drops, you definitely need to draft a deck that can get there. You can't just put them in your deck for value and hope. You either need to play a fair amount of ramp (which definitely exists in the format) or else play control.

I think slow decks have a place in this format for sure, but they aren't as easy to draft as the aggro decks, by any means. Red and white both have such easy access to aggressive starts that it's kinda hard to see the slow decks you can draft unless you look really hard.

Puddle Jumper, can you elaborate on what you have found when you looked hard at "how can we draft a slow deck?"?

Blue is really awful so far. Why is the common looter, which blue desperately needs in this set, situational? I had a monoblue deck last night with a drake Haven, lots of cyclers and 2 seekers of insight and I still could only make about 2 drakes a game. The counter and bounce suite are actually very good, but the win cons are unnecessarily hosed.

Blue has all the tools to play control except a finisher. Of course, that's why you play another color. W/U embalm is strong, that bounce spell that mills is an all star because with embalm and aftermath it generates value. U/R needs you to go heavy onto spells, which is made easier by its bomb uncommon and it's solid counter magic and other control options. U/G let's you drop fat beef after playing control. U/B I've found works better as control than as all in cycling. Removal, counter magic, embalm for CA, and evasive threats.

Ive found W/B zombies to be a disappointment. It's payoffs are too small, you need to go all in and get enough payoff cards, but that means sacrificing power for synergy and the payoffs are too minor.

I would say red. It has the best common, the best trial, and is the aggressive color in one of the most aggressive formats ever. Starting out blue makes me nervous.

Quote from Hammer »

Blue is really awful so far. Why is the common looter, which blue desperately needs in this set, situational? I had a monoblue deck last night with a drake Haven, lots of cyclers and 2 seekers of insight and I still could only make about 2 drakes a game. The counter and bounce suite are actually very good, but the win cons are unnecessarily hosed.

Mono-anything seems awful. Why didn't you play another color?

Also, I think you're playing Drake Haven wrong. It's a bomb if used properly. I've happily 3-0'd with a Drake Haven deck, making a stupid number of drakes in the process.

I've gotten a few other 3-0s with blue. I agree with Puddle Jumper that it's just a matter of drafting a deck that properly supports a control strategy, instead of just cramming "good" blue cards together with "good" cards of some other color and expecting it to work.

I'll stick up for Sandwurm Convergence. The bar for 8 mana spells is always high and in format this fast it's astronomical, but barring enchantment removal or very specific evasion Convergence is 8 mana for "you win the game." The draft I got it I took it pack 1 so I could draft with it in mind and was blessed with a couple of other good rares; I had a decent curve with some of the big cyclers and some ramp spells, and ended up 2-1. My loss was a Boros deck with multiple glory-bounds, and for matches like that the Convergence just needs to be boarded out.

Best color is red. White and black are pretty close for second.