MTG Salvation

Hey all, I was wondering what everyone's opinion of running the sword of the meek - thopter foundry is? I have been testing it in my U/W build and it has been nothing short of amazing so far.

How many foundries do you run/ how do you get them?

3 foundries I also run 4 brainstorm, 4 ancestral vision and 1 ponder for digging. The combo is not my primary win condition but it is another threat that if unanswered will win the game.

In UWR I have found Basilisk Collar great. Testing it md right now though I may demote it to sb. I feel Crusader mb is the right call, a great sword or collar carrier. It also is nice to tell Goyf to buzz off. I think Retribution of the Meek woul make a sick sb card, better than Firespout though my list runs more W). I also want to try Fire // Ice, as I just enjoyed that card so much playing Canadian.

My list is here. I would repost, but I'm on my itouch and don't feel like retupong everything. I'll edit it in later.

@anomie-p: I personally put ensnaring bridge in there because I found myself getting bashed on by KoTR far too often. Not only that, but my meta has a fair amount of Sneak & Show, and NO RUG as well. I usually don't have to many cards in my hand late game and even when visions goes off I'm probably dumping my hand down to 3.


In case anybody is looking for more ideas about how to tune their builds, TC Decks currently has 'Blade Control' as a Deck to Beat for July. Variations range from UW, UWR, and UWB.

http://www.thecouncil.es/tcdecks/tipo.php?archetype=Blade%20Control&format=Legacy

Also, that thopter combo variation looks such a blast to play I'm actually thinking of putting it together. I've always been a fan of the deck but never owned a moat. Seems like you could do without it though in a build like this.
http://www.thecouncil.es/tcdecks/deck.php?id=6418&iddeck=46492

Although I like Punishing Fire, I would not run it as a 3/3 I think... maybe like this:

Quote from Black Star Dec

Yeah it was much more to suppose to think in different ways, looks a lot like CAB Jace with SMF like that, and that deck beats creature based strategies pretty well. Alex's reasoning was more to dodge Misstep while still being able to repeatly burn stuff. Diggin' your deck though, especially with the Moon possibility.

Thanks. Moon is awesome, not going to lie. Running less than 3 moon effects is just wrong. It wins me matchups. My qualm with my current list is that its a bit weak to big green things if I don't get the sword or a PW down.

I'm wondering about Retribution of the Meek better, equal, or worse than Firespout? (my vote is better)

^^ Way worse.

Why? I have found I have more trouble with big dudes than small dudes, plus it doesn't kill my lavamancers

Here is the U/W build I have been running recently with great success. Right now I am having a lot of difficulty with my SB so suggestions would be most welcome, My meta is fairly balanced with control being the majority. So far the surprise star has been the thopter combo as it saved me from defeat plenty of times.

Also I realize I do not have duals/wastelands/fow, Its a matter of price so don't suggest them, I'm well aware that I could benefit from them.

I would run Inkmoth over Factory. Faster clock (when equipped) and it flies

Quote from Raggedjoe

Why? I have found I have more trouble with big dudes than small dudes, plus it doesn't kill my lavamancers

Big dudes don't swarm and kill you.

Quote from Raggedjoe

I would run Inkmoth over Factory. Faster clock (when equipped) and it flies

Also, please ignore the Inkmoth advice. Two reasons: Faster clock is incorrect. There are reasons not to run two different wincons in the same deck- I.E. they are the same wincon (damage) but you are diluting on both fronts. You are successfully reducing the number of win conditions in your deck, not increasing it.

The flying is nice, but Mishra's Factories pump each other.

My best advice for you, thedonmega, is get wastelands first, then run a crucible plan. Budget is not my strong suit, but in legacy there's no room for such things.

Quote from glurman

Big dudes don't swarm and kill you.




Also, please ignore the Inkmoth advice. Two reasons: Faster clock is incorrect. There are reasons not to run two different wincons in the same deck- I.E. they are the same wincon (damage) but you are diluting on both fronts. You are successfully reducing the number of win conditions in your deck, not increasing it.

The flying is nice, but Mishra's Factories pump each other.

My best advice for you, thedonmega, is get wastelands first, then run a crucible plan. Budget is not my strong suit, but in legacy there's no room for such things.

Yes ignore the inkmoth advice. I am not going into the reason(s) for why this is, but there are reasons you don't see inkmoths in ANY good landstill type decks, or stoneblade, or any other legacy optimal deck list.

The best advice for donmega is that while we know you are on a budget, you should make a conscious effort to obtain some FORCE OF WILL(s). Wastelands/Dual lands are helpful but do not help you in the way Force of Will can, in that if you intend to play ANY sort of blue control deck in legacy or Vintage, the Force of Will is there to allow you to combat combo. Your deck and every other blue control or aggro control deck you make just dies to combo straight up because it doesn't have FoW, not because it lacks duals or wasteland. Also if you need to feel better about it, Force of Will is almost like having money in your hands. You can always sell or trade it off to people. It's not dead weight like a lot of Standard cards once rotated out.

If you go the crucible of worlds route, note that dust bowl can be a house in itself followed by ghost quarter if you are playing against greedy legacy decks. Most greedy control lists only use 3-4 basic lands so your ghost quarter comboed with crucible effectively turns it into a strip mine especially if they have fetched only basics(it's here where showing a wasteland or dustbowl on the field will prevent your opponent from running the risk of grabbing duals and instead going after basics). Not to say that wasteland isn't good here but we are working off the fact that you are not able to obtain wastelands so dust bowl/ghost quarter are the only alternatives, and in actuality aren't that bad with crucible on the field. Even landstill uses 1 dust bowl as utility with a crucible. Hell sometimes they take a couple wastelands and/or mishras out when they play with crucible in their deck because they don't want to screw themselves over with too much nonbasics that only produce colorless mana.

I agree inkmoth would be quite subpar...If I were to drop the factories it would be for blinkmoths but as of right now the factories are excellent defensive creatures.

Yea I'm well aware that force would help as I have been in several tourney's were it would have been of great assistance and I know that it will keep its value, but unless 300.00 falls from the sky I don't see myself owning them until I'm done college.

Another question, I have 2 misdirection and 2 mirran crusader lying around would they be good in the MD or SB?

Quote from thedonmega

Another question, I have 2 misdirection and 2 mirran crusader lying around would they be good in the MD or SB?

Misdirection is pretty sweet as an SB card against the decks that tend to like Hymn to Touraching you out of the game. I don't think they have what it takes to be main-decked though.

As for Mirran Crusader, it really comes down to how aggressive you tend to be. If you like dropping stuff and getting in there like nobody's business, Mirran Crusader might be good for you, even main-deck. If not, he makes a decent place-holder SB card, and will pull his weight most of the time. Assuming your list is still the same as the one a few posts back, I don't think he'll fit in the MD, with you being slow-control and all.

I think that UWB, out of all the variants, is the least consistent. My friend has been trying to put it together and the deck seems to slow to really take advantage of cards like hymm/thoughtsieze. We've been testing the "mirror" constantly (that is, UWR vs UWB) and the deck just feels like its lacking something.

If I were to make some suggestions on your list, I would try and get more bitterblossoms in there and another equipment for lifegain. BB + Bob is a LOT of damage to be doing to yourself. The deck reminds me somewhat of The Gate where you just need lifegain to make up for the fact that you're doing more damage to yourself than your opponent. Bitterblossom helps the deck put the pressure on that the other creatures have trouble doing, while also giving you chump blockers for days.

Also you should note that most lists do not run Force of Will, and I probably wouldn't either without tops. Most lists traditionally don't run Daze, but I can see how you might like it after a turn 1 Hymm/Bob/BB/Mystic. I'd much rather go for a turn 3 Clique though. You're best bet, in my opinion, it work off Edgar Flores' build from Baltimore

Quote from Arirmind

UWR version sounds tempting and i have been pondering about that. Too bad i have 3 x Volcanic Island and 3 x Grim Lavamancers tied in my NO RUG 75. Mana base might be ok with 1 x Volcanic and some Plateus but those lavamancers are must.. maybe i draft additional ones from! M12

I hear when you go to a tournament, you generally only need enough cards for a single deck.

One of the major problems with UWB is that your mana base is going to very greedy; you need a lot of blue and black all the time. Compared to Patriot or TI, red is a splash and doesn't compete for colors while blue and black offer so much that they hog up a lot of space.

Red also has the best sideboard options (as you should know from NO RUG), which is one of the reasons it is so powerful in this deck.

Quote from bradstone

I think that UWB, out of all the variants, is the least consistent. My friend has been trying to put it together and the deck seems to slow to really take advantage of cards like hymm/thoughtsieze. We've been testing the "mirror" constantly (that is, UWR vs UWB) and the deck just feels like its lacking something.

If I were to make some suggestions on your list, I would try and get more bitterblossoms in there and another equipment for lifegain. BB + Bob is a LOT of damage to be doing to yourself. The deck reminds me somewhat of The Gate where you just need lifegain to make up for the fact that you're doing more damage to yourself than your opponent. Bitterblossom helps the deck put the pressure on that the other creatures have trouble doing, while also giving you chump blockers for days.

Also you should note that most lists do not run Force of Will, and I probably wouldn't either without tops. Most lists traditionally don't run Daze, but I can see how you might like it after a turn 1 Hymm/Bob/BB/Mystic. I'd much rather go for a turn 3 Clique though. You're best bet, in my opinion, it work off Edgar Flores' build from Baltimore

Pretty sure the reason why Edgar didn't use Force of Will in his B/W/U control deck is due to the general decline of traditional combo itself in the meta like Storm (tide,tendrils), Painter, Belcher etc. The past couple months post misstep has made all the 'boogeyman' combo decks fearful of having to fight through a whole lot of hate. These past couple months have been the prime environment in which if one was playing in a large event to make a metagame call NOT to use FoW in order to have more business spells for control/aggro. Play the odds in pairings so to speak that you will probably meet more control/aggro than combo if at all...but due to how the meta has shaped up, it's definitely prime time for certain combo decks to prey on the current metagame.

just one thing to say: AMAZING BANNER!!!!


I've been interested on this deck on the last month and also thinking on building it, but which are those decks' good and bad MU's?