MTG Salvation

Quote from Eldariel

I quit working on it in midst of large revisions, so it shows, but here's the last version I've got built:

// Lands
4 [ON] Bloodstained Mire
4 [ON] Wooded Foothills
4 [u] Volcanic Island
4 [MM] Rishadan Port
4 [TE] Wasteland
1 [MI] Mountain (1)

// Creatures
4 [P2] Goblin Matron
3 [ON] Goblin Piledriver
4 [US] Goblin Lackey
2 [LE] Gempalm Incinerator
4 [SC] Siege-Gang Commander
2 [MI] Goblin Tinkerer

// Spells
4 [NE] Daze
4 [AL] Force of Will
4 [5E] Brainstorm
4 [SC] Stifle
4 [DS] AEther Vial

What the ****? That's hilarious...Does it work?
Somehow it seems unlikely that it would, as you don't run too many goblins. Where are the Ringleaders?

Anyway: What are peoples opinion on MDing Pyrokinesis? No one expects it G1. It kills in the mirror, and does random good stuff to Thresh on occasion. People have been MDing it in my local tournaments, and I was like, WTF? But it's been working for the guy - He Top Foured.

Interesting decklist for Goblins. Have you Considered Standstill? Seems like it would make up for the loss of Ringleader.

Howabout cutting 4x Stifle for more Goblins? Or going 3x Stifle, 4x Piledriver?

Affinity runs fine with 15. Just saying, I think a 4th Piledriver is more important than a 4th Stifle.

The major thing that sticks out is the lack of Goblin Warchief and Goblin Ringleader. Without the former you are not as fast, and without the latter you are not as resilient.

Quote from Drow Slayer

The major thing that sticks out is the lack of Goblin Warchief and Goblin Ringleader. Without the former you are not as fast, and without the latter you are not as resilient.

LOL you took this seriously.

We're just looking for ways to improve gobbos because the list has, obviously, been having problems currently.

While the R/U may be taken as a joke by some, I'm actually quite intrigued. I've been following this tread because I happen to have most of the gobblins as well as 2 volc. islands.

Take/Analyze this as you will, but here's my attempt at some sort of a decklist

R/u Goblins
****
Goblins
4x Goblin Lackey
4x Goblin Matron
4x Goblin Piledriver
4x S.G.C
2x Goblin Gempalm
2x Goblin Recruiter
1x Goblin Sharpshooter

Spells, etc.
4x Vial
4x Brainstorm
4x Force of Will
4x Daze
3x Fire/Ice (or Stifle)

Lands
6x Saclands (mire/foothills)
3x Rishadan Port
3x Mountain
4x Wasteland
4x Volcanic Island

SB
2x Goblin King
3x Hurkyl's Recall
4x Pyrokenesis
3x Blood Moon
3x Stifle (or Fire/Ice)

****
Im testing this current list and I feel at least the Goblin crew has synergy. I actually like fire/ice (i know you're all going to blast me for that) but it can really be a solid addition.
[edit] Additionally, Fire/Ice is removal or a card to pitch to F.O.W
For big guys, it locks them away with Ice --- or permanents (such as stax), this can net a "turn advantage".
I happen to be a fan of H.Recall because for annoying decks that are artifact heavy, this blue-splash card seals the deal (especially catching the opponent occasionally off guard)
Blood Moon and Pyro are musts in any sideboard. Im not sold on Magus of the Moon because he's not thick enough to survive removal --- not saying this enchantment is any bit better --- but I'd opt for the need of enchant removal over critter removal for the opponent.

just putting ideas out there folks....

Quote from Puzzle

Why do you prefer Hurkyl's Recall to Shattering Spree ?

PS : pretty sure you meant Ringleader, not Recruiter.

Sorry for the typo --- it is Ringleader. my bad

As for H.R > 'Spree my mindset is this:

Recall has huge upside against many decks with artifacts (and decks with many artifacts for that matter) --- bouncing all of their artifacts in a single cast.
However, Spree can essentially break through counterspells (the only downside of Recall --- since you have more than 1 "spell")
Recall mass-bounces vs Spree's target destruction

I see both sides of the argument for going with either. It's just that I'd much rather bounce everything than break a few. Either case, both have pro's and con's.

Another example...
If Stax --- which is a pretty tough matchup --- has a decent start vs our decent start, I would rather bounce the field of artifacts than require paying alot of R to destroy everything. Recall would ruin or at least heavily disrupt their plans whereas Spree would hit maybe one or 2 solid cards -- yet leave the rest. Not to mention, if I topdeck either, assuming i got the mana to play either, i'd be happier seeing recall

Quote from Puzzle

Gobs thrives on tempo, to which Brainstorm is antithetic.
FoW forces you to play too much blue, hence not enough gobs. (Once you accept that, you'll stop playing Fire//Ice too.)
In conclusion, blue's two best cards are not fit for the task.

Puzzle, I'd love to hear your case and thoughts on what you said

What problems is Ru Goblins solving? I'd rather play RB goblins because of how powerful Wort and Warren Weirding are. Maybe even a very light green splash so you can take out Counterbalance g2 vs. Thresh, but does Thresh even leave Counterbalance in vs. Goblins? The combo MU is just as easily addressed in Black as in Blue since you have access to Thoughtseize/Duress/Therapy. And in the Black splash you can more confidently run 4x Ringleader, since Weirding counts as a Goblin.

Not giving up the decks aggressiveness, and addressing the problem MUs seems stronger than slowing the deck, losing your best source of CA, and what is arguably your best goblin (warchief).

Bladewing, you bring up good points too

Forgot most upcomming tourneys are allowing morningtide/morningtide comes out

Bladewing, could you post a list or even an idea as to what you'd run?

I would probably run something like



With sb options including (just in black):
Thoughtseize
Duress
Cabal Therapy
Smother
Leyline of the Void
and more.

Keep in mind thats just a rough list and the numbers need to be tweaked. But it shores up Goblins recent problems. Recursive Warren Weirdings wreck Thresh's creature base including Mongoose, and it only loses a little of its explosiveness.

Bladewing, you're def. proving a point in the black over blue argument.
While I like most of the things going on in your list, I have to ask (and this is probably due to your local meta) but why do you go with Warren Weirding instead of Thoughtseize in the MD?

Since 'seize can hit a creature, isn't that better than only a creature. Of course, both could be interchangeable as MD/SB cards --- but what makes you opt for creature hate in the MD over 'discard anything'?

Quote from Puzzle

The cases when you'd rather have Boggart Mob than Wort or SGC are rare enough not to bother with the former imo.

Do you have any testing to back that up? From the admittedly limited testing I have done with it Mob has been absolutely amazing, but SCG being able to win through Moat might make it more useful. I'm not saying that is anywhere close to a concrete list but more of a general outline of the deck.

@Warden- Basically Warren Weirding is a goblin. Which makes your Ringleader better g1, especially if you are in a MU where the discard is unnecessary. If you had a lot of combo in your meta I would probably switch Weirding with Thoughtseize/Cabal Therapy, but otherwise I would rather have a consistent way to kill opposing Goyfs and Mongooses.

I have to agree with Warren Weirding being the best choice, pre-board, over discard. I'm not completely sold on the discard suite from the sideboard either. I've found that most legacy combo (SI, Belcher, Breakfast, TES, Iggy-Pop, Solidarity) can win through one or two discard spells. I have also found that the slow-down effect that Thorn of Amethyst has on their game gives me just enough time to smack them with Goblin Lackeys and Goblin Piledrivers until they are dead.

One of the things I cannot decide on is how to balance Warren Weirding vs. Gempalm Incinerator and Mogg Fanatic. I have found that 4x Warren Weirding is definintely not the answer, but I'm not sure how many to use. Wort, Bogart Auntie has gone to two because her synergy with Weirding is incredible, and because having another in hand while one is active is not so bad. I find myself setting up Wort/Weirding and Wort/Gempalm recursion to win the mid-game against multiple Tarmogoyfs.

Has anyone besides me noticed that Battle Squadron got errata'd to be a goblin? im seriously considering Replacing a seige-gang with one as a strong finisher. here it is in case you dont know it:


Battle Squadron Set & Rarity: Mercadian Masques rare Printings: Cost: Card Type: Creature - Goblin P/T: */* Rules Text (Oracle): Flying
Battle Squadron's power and toughness are each equal to the number of creatures you control.



the Flying in combo with the */* and the effective swarm potential of gobbos makes this a lethal finisher/support.

Quote from Thresh-Ho

Has anyone besides me noticed that Battle Squadron got errata'd to be a goblin? im seriously considering Replacing a seige-gang with one as a strong finisher. here it is in case you dont know it:


Battle Squadron Set & Rarity: Mercadian Masques rare Printings: Cost: Card Type: Creature - Goblin P/T: */* Rules Text (Oracle): Flying
Battle Squadron's power and toughness are each equal to the number of creatures you control.



the Flying in combo with the */* and the effective swarm potential of gobbos makes this a lethal finisher/support.

I wouldn't ever replace SGC with this. This card is a dead draw after Tividar's Crusade in game 2, whereas you can still play SCG off the top of your deck. BS basically is only good when you're about to win anyway.

Quote from Dr.Awesome

This card is a dead draw after Tividar's Crusade in game 2

agreed. But what about game 1? Would it not rock some socks? I strongly blieve so... just side it out when it becomes useless if that happens.

Sorry, I'm used to playing in a meta where the other guy who usually Top8's with me is running GUw Thresh that sides Tivadar's Crusade against me.

But yeah, SCG can help you come back from a losing position, and help you maintain a winning position. The Battle Squadron is only useful when you're already winning.

I seem to recall that, in black splash, Dralnu's Crusade provided some major beatz. However, I may be behind the times on that one. I'd replace Tin-Street Hooligan with it, because in my testing, and yes, I have tested A LOT, Tin-Street often becomes just a crappy 2/1 goblin that doesn't 2-for-1. This is usually because of Warchief, but I wouldn't consider cutting him in favor of Hooligan. I'll just side in Krosan Grips g2.