4 gsz is for maxing the chances of not whiffing on your opening hand. No enchantress is pretty much a mulligan. I can see for dropping Words but remember that words of wind can bounce the fields back once you're going off. There is a bit of clash there I realize but usually if you're words of winding you're gonna go grab sigil and finish it that way...
It's my preference, but I don't think we'll need more than 2 Suppression Fields in the deck, and I don't want to stop one of my wincons from keeping me alive if it comes down to it. I think I've made my case before on some of my card selections, but I'll reiterate for sake of condensing and explaining in one post.
3/3/2 split of Growth, Sprawl, and Exploration (as opposed to 2/2 Utopia/Growth with Exploration) - While I like Wild Growth, many times I would prefer to have that Sprawl to make white or red available on demand. Running Moon in the MB makes it a little harder to keep a Utopia if I only have a Taiga or Savannah available at the time of casting Sprawl. I decided that splitting the difference and adding those 2 Exploration helps it run a little smoother in the ramp department. T1 Exploration can throw some people for a loop and they may think you're running Lands, allowing for head games and T1/2 misplays in your favor. Exploration also helps get that land you just drew off Enchantress to a little more use instead of just Solitary fuel.
Sigarda - 5/5 flying hexproof that eliminates part of Pox, Liliana, and Emrakul? SCORE! Oh, and GSZ makes it a surprise threat that some people won't expect. Double white hurts a little, but Sanctum can help cover 4 of the 5 mana, if necessary.
No Crop Rotation - While seemingly useful, it just screams to be countered and setting us back a turn. My personal preference, but I'm sure others advocate it's slot.
GSZ - Only a 1-of in my list mostly because I couldn't find the space too well. Acts as Presence #5 by searching out Argothian @ 3cc, but also can drag out Sigarda (Tutorable wincon to field, as opposed to hand/topdeck)
Suppression Field - Hates on too many decks to not be played at least 1-of MB, all we need is a 1-2 turn stall to set up, and this does that and more.
Ground Seal MB - This card should be in our 75, I simply like to see it G1 for dredge in my LGS and other reanimation hate. Built in cantrip makes it almost never a dead draw.
Blood Moon & Choke - Most people now have been running 2x Choke, but I prefer to hit almost all of the meta. With 10 basics MB, we come more prepared for Moon than most other decks, so why not take advantage of that? I've even had a game when my opponent played moon and gave me that red mana to land WoWar instead of a Sigarda my following turn. I definitely agree with the argument of running Choke MB, I simply left 1 in my SB since I'm running Moon so I can swap G2 if need be.
Mirri's Guile/Sylvan Library Split - Redundancy rarely helps here, and even though Library loses value after Solitary, pre-confinement, this duo helps you dig deeper than you normally would. Library & WoW interactions is great too for lack of Solitary.
Nevermore - This SB slot will probably be filled out by Aura of Silence later, but with Hypergenesis/Sneak Show in my meta, this stays in until something better comes along.
I've been wanting to break into legacy forever and since I don't want to get the 4 FOW i'm limited to not using the best color in the game so I have been looking at all the decks that don't use blue.
I have fallen in love with this deck. its fun and crazy and does so much.
I kind of want to just keep it too G/W so the red win condition is out.
If I invest in the deck I'm going to get the true landbase last (except some serrias sanctums) so I was wondering if there was a better win condition then Sigil of the Empty Throne right now I'm running 3
I've been wanting to break into legacy forever and since I don't want to get the 4 FOW i'm limited to not using the best color in the game so I have been looking at all the decks that don't use blue.
I have fallen in love with this deck. its fun and crazy and does so much.
I kind of want to just keep it too G/W so the red win condition is out.
If I invest in the deck I'm going to get the true landbase last (except some serrias sanctums) so I was wondering if there was a better win condition then Sigil of the Empty Throne right now I'm running 3
For what it's worth, the Words of War wincon adds a heckuva lot to the deck (i.e. a wincon that doesn't require attacking), and causes minimal damage to the manabase. You pretty much just need a single dual, and Utopia Sprawls can do the rest.
Round 1 vs. Red Moon/Sphere: I don't really know what the actual name was, but against any other deck, it could have stood a very good chance of bashing in. I got hit by Trinisphere g1, but managed to get my mana up in time to start building my board. They dropped Blood Moon t6, and turned my next turn sigarda into Words of War and Confinement. G2, Trinisphere and Chalice for 1 and 3 slowed me, but not before I could get some Enchantress's out and landing a healthy Replenish to lock them out. 2-0
Round 2 vs. Imperial Painter:
Game 1 I kept a shaky 5 card hand of 3 land, exploration and sigil. They dropped Painter T3, my next turn I topdecked Suppression field, and they let it pass for 2 1/2 turns holding a Red Elemental Blast, not realizing what I played yet until Sterling tried to come down. They landed a Welder and tried to combo out, but forgot about Suppression field affecting him too. They couldn't get to 5 mana before I had Sigil, Confinement and 2 Enchantress's out. Won via angels. G2 - opening hand had a Suppression field, kept played it t2 after ramp, they let it stay out for 2 turns when Sterling tried to protect it, I followed the next turn with cracking sterling to td a presence and replenished. Eventually got the damage through WoW with a suppresion in play and 4 enchantress's.
Round 3 vs. Elfcombo:
Got smoked and misplayed g1 by not dropping Solitary first turn I could. G2 went even worse as they went off before I could even establish my board.
Round 4 vs. RDW
Should have had this, but had Solitary and 1 Enchantress out, 2 cards in hand being sterling and replenish, guile had 3 lands shown, cracked fetch to reset, let solitary go to chance the enchantment draw, and died from Price of Progress for 8 followed by bolt to nuke my 10 remaining life. G2, died to 3 guide swings (1 swung twice, 2nd swung once) used Halo naming Guide after dropping presence to draw from it hoping to hit a 3rd land (4th mana), they dropped pillar, I dropped Story circle, dropping to 7 and got hit next turn by bolt and blast for gg. Just not my day for positive matchups.
Hey guys, so I'm just getting into Legacy and I'm looking at playing this deck. Given that the lists in the primer post are outdated, I was wondering if anyone could give me a typical GW Enchantress list. Also, are there any videos of people playing the deck so I can see how it works?
Edit: I'm not very observant. The list above me looks good as well as fun
I would actually advise running the list at the towards the top of this page as opposed to the one directly above your post, it has a little stronger build to it. But the past 3-4 pages have some pretty solid lists.
If you're gonna play GSZ in this deck, you might as well bring in Dryad Arbors and also use the GU list that's being piloted by Andrew Cuneo on MTGO. It'd be more fitting on to use GSZ in that version simply because it will have more targets compared to the GWr.
Anyway "Turn 1 Forest, GSZ for Dryad Arbor, followed by Turn 2 Argothian Enchantress, Seal of Removal, then drawing a card" looks like a great start IMO.
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Dryad Arbor opens itself to all the hate that would normally be avoided by Enchantress as well as (in that scenario) be not much better than hitting Wild Growth or Exploration. In all actuality, I'd rather have GSZ hit either Enchantress, Witness or Sigarda than thinning the deck out a land that can't tap the turn it's played.
Dryad Arbor opens itself to all the hate that would normally be avoided by Enchantress as well as (in that scenario) be not much better than hitting Wild Growth or Exploration. In all actuality, I'd rather have GSZ hit either Enchantress, Witness or Sigarda than thinning the deck out a land that can't tap the turn it's played.
Well, I see where you are going with that, but the thing is, you're using GSZ on the context of a deck with only 5 targets for GSZ. The GU version has 10 creatures even without my suggested addition.
Besides, 1 less mana on the 1st turn isn't the end of the world with the GU version of the deck. It operated with only 4 lands in play most of the time and relied on Carpets of Flowers for the extra mana.
All I was pointing out was that, if you really want to use GSZ on an Enchantress deck, you might as well put in more complementary creatures and use it on the better suited version of the deck.
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Any reason why people don't use abundant growth in their multi color enchantress decks?
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I've been playing the list at the top of the page a lot and I love it. But I was having some trouble against Burn with so many dead cards. And then post board was just not much better. I changed the sideboard Solitary Confinement to a Warmth and like the matchup much better now but Pyrostatic Pillar still wrecks me. Suggestions for dealing with it besides the singleton O Ring? Story Circle helps a lot but I don't always see either or even a Sterling Grove.
I should note that there are several Burn payers around here so it's important
I find that my three sideboard Leyline of Sanctity (mostly there to give me a chance vs Storm decks) are also a great boon against Burn, although they obviously don't do a whole lot versus Pillar and Price.
It does stop whatever Dredge has already dug itself into, though.
Also, how good is Mana Bloom as an Enchantress/Sigil/Words of X enabler? Play it for X = 0 and it returns itself to your hand every turn. It also ramps slightly if you get it too early, and it can help fix mana for Words of War.
Rest in peace is the best piece of grave hate we could have hoped to ask for. Think of this; if you are alive long enough to be able to use replenish against reanimator or dredge, youve probably won the game already. Ive been a huge fan of wheel, but if you dont have it in the opener against dredge its almost pointless. Ground seal is still nice versus reanimator because many lists have forgone playing exhume, so it is usually a hard counter versus them, and of course it replaces itself. The fact that rest in peace nerfs whats already in the grave is nutso versus dredge too.
IMO, zero reason to play wheel anymore. "Late game" (aka turn 3 or so versus those combo decks) relevance stuck on a hoser effect is everything wheel wanted to be.
I wish that the ghostly prison for enchantress was at least 1 mana less though.
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Rest in peace is the best piece of grave hate we could have hoped to ask for. Think of this; if you are alive long enough to be able to use replenish against reanimator or dredge, youve probably won the game already.
Yeah, I dig it. I'll probably just side my Replenishes out. I'll be happy to take those Leylines out of my side board. BB = yuch! On the other hand, Reanimator runs [CARD=force of will]FoW, so maybe Leyline still has an upside
What about Sphere of Safety? It coasts 1 more than Moat, but it shuts down flying as well. Considering we got around 5 to 10 enchantments, noone can pay that amount, plus it sums up with elephant grass. What do you think about it?
I'd like to run this in the side board, but space is pretty tight there. I'm not sure if it's worth taking out Moat MD. It's potentially slower, and not always an answer if we're struggling with our board. Also there aren't that many fliers in Legacy, and speed matters against grounded aggro decks. I'd very much like to hear other opinions on this. At the very least it's the best budget replacement yet, but it might turn out to be better.
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4x Argothian Enchantress
1x Sigarda, Host of Herons
Tax:
1x Suppresion Field
1x Ground Seal
1x Moat
1x Blood Moon
1x Choke
1x Oblivion Ring
3x Elephant Grass
Ramp:
3x Utopia Sprawl
3x Wild Growth
2x Exploration
1x Mirri's Guile
1x Sylvan Library
1x Sigil of the Empty Throne
1x Words of War
3x Solitary Confinement
4x Enchantress's Presence
4x Sterling Grove
1x Green Sun's Zenith
2x Replenish
Lands:
2x Serra's Sanctum
2x Savannah
1x Karakas
1x Taiga
3x Windswept Heath
1x Verdant Catacombs
6x Forest
4x Plains
2x Kataki, War's Wage
2x Carpet of Flowers
1x Choke
2x City of Solitude
2x Leyline of Sanctity
1x Nevermore
1x Solitary Confinement
2x Runed Halo
1x Story Circle
1x Suppression Field
It's my preference, but I don't think we'll need more than 2 Suppression Fields in the deck, and I don't want to stop one of my wincons from keeping me alive if it comes down to it. I think I've made my case before on some of my card selections, but I'll reiterate for sake of condensing and explaining in one post.
3/3/2 split of Growth, Sprawl, and Exploration (as opposed to 2/2 Utopia/Growth with Exploration) - While I like Wild Growth, many times I would prefer to have that Sprawl to make white or red available on demand. Running Moon in the MB makes it a little harder to keep a Utopia if I only have a Taiga or Savannah available at the time of casting Sprawl. I decided that splitting the difference and adding those 2 Exploration helps it run a little smoother in the ramp department. T1 Exploration can throw some people for a loop and they may think you're running Lands, allowing for head games and T1/2 misplays in your favor. Exploration also helps get that land you just drew off Enchantress to a little more use instead of just Solitary fuel.
Sigarda - 5/5 flying hexproof that eliminates part of Pox, Liliana, and Emrakul? SCORE! Oh, and GSZ makes it a surprise threat that some people won't expect. Double white hurts a little, but Sanctum can help cover 4 of the 5 mana, if necessary.
No Crop Rotation - While seemingly useful, it just screams to be countered and setting us back a turn. My personal preference, but I'm sure others advocate it's slot.
GSZ - Only a 1-of in my list mostly because I couldn't find the space too well. Acts as Presence #5 by searching out Argothian @ 3cc, but also can drag out Sigarda (Tutorable wincon to field, as opposed to hand/topdeck)
Suppression Field - Hates on too many decks to not be played at least 1-of MB, all we need is a 1-2 turn stall to set up, and this does that and more.
Ground Seal MB - This card should be in our 75, I simply like to see it G1 for dredge in my LGS and other reanimation hate. Built in cantrip makes it almost never a dead draw.
Blood Moon & Choke - Most people now have been running 2x Choke, but I prefer to hit almost all of the meta. With 10 basics MB, we come more prepared for Moon than most other decks, so why not take advantage of that? I've even had a game when my opponent played moon and gave me that red mana to land WoWar instead of a Sigarda my following turn. I definitely agree with the argument of running Choke MB, I simply left 1 in my SB since I'm running Moon so I can swap G2 if need be.
Mirri's Guile/Sylvan Library Split - Redundancy rarely helps here, and even though Library loses value after Solitary, pre-confinement, this duo helps you dig deeper than you normally would. Library & WoW interactions is great too for lack of Solitary.
Nevermore - This SB slot will probably be filled out by Aura of Silence later, but with Hypergenesis/Sneak Show in my meta, this stays in until something better comes along.
GW/R Enchantress (Legacy) R/WG
RW/G/ Norin The Champion/Norin the Artist (Modern) B//WR
GU Eternal Bouncing Command (Modern) UG
WUBRG Wish On A Stick (Modern) GRBUW
I have fallen in love with this deck. its fun and crazy and does so much.
I kind of want to just keep it too G/W so the red win condition is out.
If I invest in the deck I'm going to get the true landbase last (except some serrias sanctums) so I was wondering if there was a better win condition then Sigil of the Empty Throne right now I'm running 3
For what it's worth, the Words of War wincon adds a heckuva lot to the deck (i.e. a wincon that doesn't require attacking), and causes minimal damage to the manabase. You pretty much just need a single dual, and Utopia Sprawls can do the rest.
4x Argothian Enchantress
1x Sigarda, Host of Herons
Enchantments:
1x Sigil of the Empty Throne
1x Words of War
1x Nevermore
1x Suppression Field
1x Ground Seal
1x Moat
1x Oblivion Ring
1x Blood Moon
2x Exploration
2x Wild Growth
2x Mirri's Guile
3x Solitary Confinement
3x Elephant Grass
4x Sterling Grove
4x Enchantress's Presence
4x Utopia Sprawl
1x Green Sun's Zenith
2x Replenish
Lands:
2x Savannah
3x Windswept Heath
1x Verdant Catacombs
2x Serra's Sanctum
1x Taiga
1x Karakas
6x Forest
4x Plains
2x Kataki, War's Wage
1x Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
2x Choke
2x City of Solitude
2x Leyline of Sanctity
2x Runed Halo
1x Solitary Confienment
1x Story Circle
1x Suppression Field
1x Enlightened Tutor
Round 1 vs. Red Moon/Sphere: I don't really know what the actual name was, but against any other deck, it could have stood a very good chance of bashing in. I got hit by Trinisphere g1, but managed to get my mana up in time to start building my board. They dropped Blood Moon t6, and turned my next turn sigarda into Words of War and Confinement. G2, Trinisphere and Chalice for 1 and 3 slowed me, but not before I could get some Enchantress's out and landing a healthy Replenish to lock them out. 2-0
Round 2 vs. Imperial Painter:
Game 1 I kept a shaky 5 card hand of 3 land, exploration and sigil. They dropped Painter T3, my next turn I topdecked Suppression field, and they let it pass for 2 1/2 turns holding a Red Elemental Blast, not realizing what I played yet until Sterling tried to come down. They landed a Welder and tried to combo out, but forgot about Suppression field affecting him too. They couldn't get to 5 mana before I had Sigil, Confinement and 2 Enchantress's out. Won via angels. G2 - opening hand had a Suppression field, kept played it t2 after ramp, they let it stay out for 2 turns when Sterling tried to protect it, I followed the next turn with cracking sterling to td a presence and replenished. Eventually got the damage through WoW with a suppresion in play and 4 enchantress's.
Round 3 vs. Elfcombo:
Got smoked and misplayed g1 by not dropping Solitary first turn I could. G2 went even worse as they went off before I could even establish my board.
Round 4 vs. RDW
Should have had this, but had Solitary and 1 Enchantress out, 2 cards in hand being sterling and replenish, guile had 3 lands shown, cracked fetch to reset, let solitary go to chance the enchantment draw, and died from Price of Progress for 8 followed by bolt to nuke my 10 remaining life. G2, died to 3 guide swings (1 swung twice, 2nd swung once) used Halo naming Guide after dropping presence to draw from it hoping to hit a 3rd land (4th mana), they dropped pillar, I dropped Story circle, dropping to 7 and got hit next turn by bolt and blast for gg. Just not my day for positive matchups.
GW/R Enchantress (Legacy) R/WG
RW/G/ Norin The Champion/Norin the Artist (Modern) B//WR
GU Eternal Bouncing Command (Modern) UG
WUBRG Wish On A Stick (Modern) GRBUW
Edit: I'm not very observant. The list above me looks good as well as fun
GW/R Enchantress (Legacy) R/WG
RW/G/ Norin The Champion/Norin the Artist (Modern) B//WR
GU Eternal Bouncing Command (Modern) UG
WUBRG Wish On A Stick (Modern) GRBUW
Anyway "Turn 1 Forest, GSZ for Dryad Arbor, followed by Turn 2 Argothian Enchantress, Seal of Removal, then drawing a card" looks like a great start IMO.
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Decks built:
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:symbu:Hunted Singularity:symbu:
GW/R Enchantress (Legacy) R/WG
RW/G/ Norin The Champion/Norin the Artist (Modern) B//WR
GU Eternal Bouncing Command (Modern) UG
WUBRG Wish On A Stick (Modern) GRBUW
Well, I see where you are going with that, but the thing is, you're using GSZ on the context of a deck with only 5 targets for GSZ. The GU version has 10 creatures even without my suggested addition.
Besides, 1 less mana on the 1st turn isn't the end of the world with the GU version of the deck. It operated with only 4 lands in play most of the time and relied on Carpets of Flowers for the extra mana.
All I was pointing out was that, if you really want to use GSZ on an Enchantress deck, you might as well put in more complementary creatures and use it on the better suited version of the deck.
On the works:
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Decks built:
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:symru:16 land Ignite Memories Combo:symru:
:symbu:Hunted Singularity:symbu:
I should note that there are several Burn payers around here so it's important
GW/R Enchantress (Legacy) R/WG
RW/G/ Norin The Champion/Norin the Artist (Modern) B//WR
GU Eternal Bouncing Command (Modern) UG
WUBRG Wish On A Stick (Modern) GRBUW
an unnatural love towardsperfectly reasonable respect for Lightning Bolt.The Kiwi third of The Salt Mine Podcast: An Australian Legacy Podcast
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Also, how good is Mana Bloom as an Enchantress/Sigil/Words of X enabler? Play it for X = 0 and it returns itself to your hand every turn. It also ramps slightly if you get it too early, and it can help fix mana for Words of War.
IMO, zero reason to play wheel anymore. "Late game" (aka turn 3 or so versus those combo decks) relevance stuck on a hoser effect is everything wheel wanted to be.
I wish that the ghostly prison for enchantress was at least 1 mana less though.
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On the topic of Moat:
Yeah, I dig it. I'll probably just side my Replenishes out. I'll be happy to take those Leylines out of my side board. BB = yuch! On the other hand, Reanimator runs [CARD=force of will]FoW, so maybe Leyline still has an upside
I run Wheel main - it helps G1 vs graveyard combo, but I can target myself vs mill or simply to help not deck myself.
I don't like it 'cause I just bought a Moat!
I'd like to run this in the side board, but space is pretty tight there. I'm not sure if it's worth taking out Moat MD. It's potentially slower, and not always an answer if we're struggling with our board. Also there aren't that many fliers in Legacy, and speed matters against grounded aggro decks. I'd very much like to hear other opinions on this. At the very least it's the best budget replacement yet, but it might turn out to be better.
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RUGLegacy Lands.dec
RUGBLegacy Lands.dec
RGLegacy Lands.dec
WUBRG EDH Lands.dec
UBR EDH Artificer Prodigy
B EDH Relentless Rats