What are people's thoughts on the optimal build going forward from MM17s release? Once Goblin Guide was spoiled it seems that the sales of Burn cards increased dramatically, which could mean more mirror matches going forward. Also, with Reid Duke's BUG list seeing more play, Leovold, Emissary of Trest seems to present a potential big problem for Burn going forward.
If you are worried about the mirror don't play Flame Rift and learn how to leverage your Eidolons. If you are really worried, put a couple Dragon's Claw in the side. Though, I imagine most of the demand for Guide is being driven by Modern where Burn is Tier 1.
Regarding Bug, I'd say Leovold is a must kill early, but can be ignored if you have lethal. A bit like Deathrite. Perhaps the matchup is just not good given that deck plays both.
What are people's thoughts on the optimal build going forward from MM17s release? Once Goblin Guide was spoiled it seems that the sales of Burn cards increased dramatically, which could mean more mirror matches going forward.
Odd, but I really, really believed that Goblin Guide value could mirror Jace/Goyf in card prices, especially when Goblin Guide was not reprinted last time around. But it seemed that Monastery Swiftspear pulled the weight of the missed Goblin Guide reprint. I've also noticed that Eidolon of the Great Revel has doubled in value.
I do think that Goblin Guide is a worthy investment as well as Eidolon.
I've always saw burn as a common deck. When I'm playing against burn I would pull 3 price of progress and add Vexing Shusher. I feel that the shusher is doing something.
As for the MM17 reprinting... If I can buy a pack at my local Walmart then I would think the reprinting is awesome and intended to bring more players into Modern and Legacy. If the packs are only available for card shops with a limited print run - the intent is to keep the collectors and card shops happy and the card prices are not going to drop. (This is my opinion on MM17)
Also, with Reid Duke's BUG list seeing more play, Leovold, Emissary of Trest seems to present a potential big problem for Burn going forward.
Guide was absolutely not destined for JTMS/Goyf levels. It's just not nearly played as heavily.
Magic cards aren't "investments", especially not ones that can be reprinted at any time. Just look at Tarmogoyf, which has plummeted since its peak. The best you can hope for is to sell a card right before it gets reprinted. Eidolon doubled in price because it's the new bottleneck card for Burn since Guide was reprinted. I've been saying for a while that Eidolon would become that when Guide gets printed and I was correct. It's probably wise to sell extras in a month or two as people open MM17 Guides and want to play Burn. It's not worth waiting until just before the reprint.
MM17 will not be in big box stores. It's sold at $10 per pack (or more, perhaps) at LGS just like every previous Masters set.
Card prices will definitely fall. It appears that MM17 has a big print run and prices will fall as the set is opened. They also have demonstrated from EMA that they are willing to reprint or re-release more of the set in the fall, so that might happen with MM17 too.
Guide was absolutely not destined for JTMS/Goyf levels. It's just not nearly played as heavily.
I see Goblin Guide equal or even more popular. I also factored in that Goblin Guide is a ‘staple’ for a major deck. And I’m also assuming it’s going to be the only such card for at least 10 to 15 years from now.
Magic cards aren't "investments", especially not ones that can be reprinted at any time.
It depends on how you look at investment.
12 years ago I needed to buy a used car; so I sold my Ancestral Recall (beta), Time Walk (Unlimited) and Timetwister (beta). My girlfriend (who later became my wife) she was amazed that I got 600 dollars from 3 magic cards! Today if I held on those 3 cards, I would be looking at least 6,000. I could get a really good used car or a nice down payment for a new car. 6,000 dollars is also a down payment for a house too.
I paid 35 dollars for a mint The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale (this was before wizards made Legacy) if I sell the card today I'm looking at least 1,000...
I bought 4 goblin guides at 5 dollars each and if I decided to sell them I'm getting 20 to 30 dollars each (at one time almost 50 dollars)... That's an investment.
I’m a realist and I always saw magic as an investment, even back when I started playing the game in 1996 (otherwise why are we playing with sleeves).
Eidolon doubled in price because it's the new bottleneck card for Burn since Guide was reprinted. I've been saying for a while that Eidolon would become that when Guide gets printed and I was correct.
I'm a strong supporter of Eidolon. I think the price of Eidolon is going to increase; so I won't be surprise to see it hitting 20 dollars.
It's probably wise to sell extras in a month or two as people open MM17 Guides and want to play Burn. It's not worth waiting until just before the reprint.
It’s hard to say, Goblin Guide is a very popular card in modern. I
MM17 will not be in big box stores. It's sold at $10 per pack (or more, perhaps) at LGS just like every previous Masters set.
I thought so and therefore wizards is never going to help drop the card prices down. They need to sell these things in the big stores.
Card prices will definitely fall. It appears that MM17 has a big print run and prices will fall as the set is opened. They also have demonstrated from EMA that they are willing to reprint or re-release more of the set in the fall, so that might happen with MM17 too.
Sure Wasteland dropped but reprint of Force of Will cost more than the original version. I do think making Force of Will a mystic was slap in the face to a legacy player (since the intent of the reprinting was to drop the card prices so more player could access the format)
Anyway, if the reprint of Goblin Guide drops to 5 dollars each… I would buy another playset. He’s worth it!
12 years ago I needed to buy a used car; so I sold my Ancestral Recall (beta), Time Walk (Unlimited) and Timetwister (beta)
I specifically said "especially not ones that can be reprinted at any time." and you bring up 3 Reserve List cards and then a 4th one later (Tabernacle), which are all cards that cannot be printed again (if you believe WotC will never abolish the RL).
I bought 4 goblin guides at 5 dollars each and if I decided to sell them I'm getting 20 to 30 dollars each (at one time almost 50 dollars)... That's an investment.
That's not an investment, it's a potential profit and it's solely based on hindsight and anyone who buys into such cards is speculating rather than investing. You haven't made an "investment" when you buy something that can have its value tanked at the will of WotC whenever they choose to print more of them. The best you can do is hope that you can cash in before that reprint happens and you generally don't have any warning of a reprint and could easily wait too long. An investment is something that one can reasonably expect to increase in value in a stable manner. With Magic cards, that leaves you with Power 9 since those are the only things that steadily increase in value annually. Even if you do choose to invest in P9, liquidity is low. There's not much of a reason to invest in a $5000 magic card when you could invest $5000 in blue chip stock.
Bringing up Guide is like saying "oh yeah, I invested in 100 Nightveil Specters the summer before Theros came out. HUGE return on investment!" No, that was speculation that led to a huge short term gain and it was something that really couldn't have been predicted.
Magic isn't an investment. It's just an expensive hobby that has speculation opportunities.
12 years ago I needed to buy a used car; so I sold my Ancestral Recall (beta), Time Walk (Unlimited) and Timetwister (beta)
I specifically said "especially not ones that can be reprinted at any time." and you bring up 3 Reserve List cards and then a 4th one later (Tabernacle), which are all cards that cannot be printed again (if you believe WotC will never abolish the RL).
I bought 4 goblin guides at 5 dollars each and if I decided to sell them I'm getting 20 to 30 dollars each (at one time almost 50 dollars)... That's an investment.
That's not an investment, it's a potential profit and it's solely based on hindsight and anyone who buys into such cards is speculating rather than investing. You haven't made an "investment" when you buy something that can have its value tanked at the will of WotC whenever they choose to print more of them. The best you can do is hope that you can cash in before that reprint happens and you generally don't have any warning of a reprint and could easily wait too long. An investment is something that one can reasonably expect to increase in value in a stable manner. With Magic cards, that leaves you with Power 9 since those are the only things that steadily increase in value annually. Even if you do choose to invest in P9, liquidity is low. There's not much of a reason to invest in a $5000 magic card when you could invest $5000 in blue chip stock.
Bringing up Guide is like saying "oh yeah, I invested in 100 Nightveil Specters the summer before Theros came out. HUGE return on investment!" No, that was speculation that led to a huge short term gain and it was something that really couldn't have been predicted.
Magic isn't an investment. It's just an expensive hobby that has speculation opportunities.
I'm not sure what bug is biting you, and I don't care. I've been playing the game over 20 years and I see every card that I buy with my own money is an investment.
12 years ago I needed to buy a used car; so I sold my Ancestral Recall (beta), Time Walk (Unlimited) and Timetwister (beta)
I specifically said "especially not ones that can be reprinted at any time." and you bring up 3 Reserve List cards and then a 4th one later (Tabernacle), which are all cards that cannot be printed again (if you believe WotC will never abolish the RL).
I bought 4 goblin guides at 5 dollars each and if I decided to sell them I'm getting 20 to 30 dollars each (at one time almost 50 dollars)... That's an investment.
That's not an investment, it's a potential profit and it's solely based on hindsight and anyone who buys into such cards is speculating rather than investing. You haven't made an "investment" when you buy something that can have its value tanked at the will of WotC whenever they choose to print more of them. The best you can do is hope that you can cash in before that reprint happens and you generally don't have any warning of a reprint and could easily wait too long. An investment is something that one can reasonably expect to increase in value in a stable manner. With Magic cards, that leaves you with Power 9 since those are the only things that steadily increase in value annually. Even if you do choose to invest in P9, liquidity is low. There's not much of a reason to invest in a $5000 magic card when you could invest $5000 in blue chip stock.
Bringing up Guide is like saying "oh yeah, I invested in 100 Nightveil Specters the summer before Theros came out. HUGE return on investment!" No, that was speculation that led to a huge short term gain and it was something that really couldn't have been predicted.
Magic isn't an investment. It's just an expensive hobby that has speculation opportunities.
I'm not sure what bug is biting you, and I don't care. I've been playing the game over 20 years and I see every card that I buy with my own money is an investment.
Then I am sorry to say, that you are a fool. Just like the people who used Beanie Babies as an investment.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
It's about time for the reserved list to die, for the sake of Vintage and Legacy (And Commander).
I'm not sure what bug is biting you, and I don't care. I've been playing the game over 20 years and I see every card that I buy with my own money is an investment.
If you mistakenly believe that every card you buy is an "investment", that's on you and I expect that I won't be changing your opinion on that. I suppose my comment is more targeted toward others who might come across this thread, because they are almost guaranteed to lose money if they take your attitude that cards are investments. The fact of the matter is that buying collectible game pieces, especially those that can be reprinted without warning, is not an investment, and I hope that people who stumble across these few comments are able to recognize that. The money making opportunities in MTG are all speculation with the exception of some RL cards that actually do behave as investments that appreciate in value steadily.
I'm not sure what bug is biting you, and I don't care. I've been playing the game over 20 years and I see every card that I buy with my own money is an investment.
If you mistakenly believe that every card you buy is an "investment", that's on you and I expect that I won't be changing your opinion on that.
You do know baseball cards has been around over a hundred years.
A 1933 Goudey #181 Babe Ruth psa 4 Vg-EX HOF on Ebay is currently going for $4,995.00
One card was printed in 1933 the other was printed in the early 1990's. Math suggest that MTG is a better investment than Baseball cards.
I'm not in the market of buying and selling cards. I'm always pleased when my cards grow in value. I'm also happy that wizards is keeping the reserve list.
We gotten off topic here (we could do this on another thread and I'll be happy to talk - as long as we don't go down the name calling path)... but I know the argument, you despise me because you think I'm driving up the card prices, you are wrong and off the mark.
Funny that you bring up baseball cards. In the 80s and early 90s there was a craze of people buying baseball cards because there were some very old ones that are worth a lot of money. Surely a 1991 Upper Deck MLB 800 card set is worth a lot now, right? People surely bought them in 1991 like they would be, and even called them "investments" because those old baseball cards are worth a lot of money. It turns out that you can buy a factory sealed 1991 Upper Deck MLB 800 card set on Amazon for $16 with free shipping.
Your example really highlights the point I'm trying to make: reserved list cards (scarce cards that won't appear again) are worth a lot and some of them are truly investments. A card printed in a recent set is analogous to that mass produced 1991 Upper Deck sealed set.
but I know the argument, you despise me because you think I'm driving up the card prices, you are wrong and off the mark.
No. My personal perception of you as a person has nothing to do with it, nor do I think that speculators are evil, horrible people keeping the little guys from playing the game. I'm simply stating a fact that MTG cards are not investments and correctly stating that it is an unsound financial decision to regard them as investments. Proctor & Gamble stock is an investment. US Treasury Bonds are investments. Graded Power is an investment, though it lacks liquidity. Goblin Guides are not investments.
People said the same thing that you're saying about Goblin Guide about BFZ Fatpacks: "They'll just go up because of full-art lands!!! Original ZEN full-arts are like $5!!!" And then full-arts were announced in OGW and they're in fatpacks too. Now Amonkhet will have some full-arts, too. People banked on full-arts being an "investment" and they're not. People hoarded EMA "Look at the value! A lot of these won't be printed again!!!", and they "invested" in sealed boxes, and then WotC released more EMA last fall and SCG recently put sealed boxes on sale for ~$170 down from $200 if I'm remembering right. People who bought them for more than $200 and still have the sealed box thought they were "investing", and now they've lost at least 15% on it. There simply are no investment opportunities on cards that aren't on the Reserved List.
I'm just not going to put up with being accused of personally attacking you, or being motivated by some dislike for you, when that is not remotely the case. That's the last I'm going to say about it, because this is the Burn thread.
I'm just not going to put up with being accused of personally attacking you, or being motivated by some dislike for you, when that is not remotely the case. That's the last I'm going to say about it, because this is the Burn thread.
I'm sorry I didn't mean to accuse you for attacking me but I took your reply a little over the top for the subject. The poster (if I understood was asking about the demand of Goblin Guide) and all I said was it's a worthy investment. Than you got out all defensive about what is a investment and what is not an investment.
Anyway, I'll be happy to talk about the subject on another post. I have theories why I believe the price of duals are f'n expensive meanwhile force of will has not jumped in value for almost 10 years (or maybe older). But we all have theories.
Anyway, I would like to keep this topic on burn. (I might PM you my response on the other stuff, if you want to hear my comments)
Really? I have always thought of Lavamancer as a control card, seldom did I target the opponent with it, it's damage usually went towards Mom, Stoneforge or Deadrite.
Right now I tend towards the classic 20 Land, 24 Burn Spells, 12 creatures plus 2 Lavamancer and 2 mainboard Sulfuric Vortex instead of Flame Rifts and was wondering if there really had been a change in meta that made Rift optimal again.
Really? I have always thought of Lavamancer as a control card, seldom did I target the opponent with it, it's damage usually went towards Mom, Stoneforge or Deadrite.
Right now I tend towards the classic 20 Land, 24 Burn Spells, 12 creatures plus 2 Lavamancer and 2 mainboard Sulfuric Vortex instead of Flame Rifts and was wondering if there really had been a change in meta that made Rift optimal again.
Very true, but a lot of players seemed to adopted (main decking) searing blaze/blood as a spot removal/keep damage rolling, and these cards also boost Swiftspear. I don't think anything is wrong with Lavamancer and against some decks he could be really, really good.
I think some players do like the idea of tapping 2 mana and sacking 2 mountains for 8 damage. The downside of Flame Rift is Eidolon, the reason why players started to stop playing Flame Rift. But Eidolon is such a big creature that opponents are killing it ASAP. So I'm guessing that most burn players don't see an issue of playing Flame Rift.
I think this is reckless burn, because there is going to be a time when Eidolon is in play and you're stuck holding a Flame Rift.
I think if you're going to play Flame Rift and Eidolon at the same time, you're forced into the fetchless build that Sullivan played recently. He played it that way because he felt that Grim and Blaze weren't that important and if they're not important then fetches simply shouldn't be played at all. Since fetches aren't in his deck, the only self damage is Eidolon and then Flame Rift can find a spot.
Really? I have always thought of Lavamancer as a control card, seldom did I target the opponent with it, it's damage usually went towards Mom, Stoneforge or Deadrite.
Grim is more on the control side, yes. Still competes for the same slot as Swiftspear. After you account for the core cards, there are not many flex slots. You play Swiftspear if you want the more consistent fast clock against a combo heavy meta. You play Grim if you expect a lot of creature matchups like Elves. Flame Rift is similar in that it fights for the same slots as stuff like Vortex and Searing Blaze. Again, clock vs control.
I don't think the 'redirection' rule of a planeswalker had changed... Therefore you can bolt, fireblast, searing blood/blaze the planeswalker. I guess we should be playing 3 Exquisite Firecraft in burn, just so we can get around Force of Will.
What's everyone's opinion of Andrea Mengucci's version of Legacy Burn? He has both Swiftspear and Grim Lavamancer mb. Andrea Mengucci Legacy Burn
Also, after pouring over lists and watching in-numerous videos, is seems like Chalice of the Void is being main boarded more often nowadays. I'm thinking of running some amount of Smash to Smithereens in the main, either 1 or 2, with the rest in the sb. Thoughts?
What's everyone's opinion of Andrea Mengucci's version of Legacy Burn? He has both Swiftspear and Grim Lavamancer mb. Andrea Mengucci Legacy Burn
It doesn't look bad. I've always thought 2 Grim Lavamancer is a good number (3 and 4 always seemed way, way too much). I never cared for Barbarian Ring, because it's a non-basic and the worst you cannot sac it to a Fireblast.
It's nice to see he's playing 1 Exquisite Firecraft. I do believe, especially with the new Gideon we are going to see a stronger Miracle Control in the following months. So it might be better to play 2 or 3 Firecrafts.
Also, after pouring over lists and watching in-numerous videos, is seems like Chalice of the Void is being main boarded more often nowadays. I'm thinking of running some amount of Smash to Smithereens in the main, either 1 or 2, with the rest in the sb. Thoughts?
Sure if you believe you can easily target an artifact without being forced to hold it for several turns. I'm running 3 in the side.
Any opinions on the following card that just got spoiled? Does it have a place in this deck?
The obvious comparison is Swiftspear. I think haste is better than the ability this card brings (most things you run into are small enough that they die to a single burn spell anyways), but maybe it acts as additional copies of Swiftspear if we want to play a build with more than 12 creatures and don't want to run Grim Lavamancer?
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici.
Regarding Bug, I'd say Leovold is a must kill early, but can be ignored if you have lethal. A bit like Deathrite. Perhaps the matchup is just not good given that deck plays both.
Modern: R Skred -- WBG Melira Co -- URW Nahiri Control
Legacy: R Mono Red Burn -- UWB Stoneblade
Commander: R Krenko, Mob Boss -- WUBRG Scion of the Ur-Dragon -- WUBRG Maze’s End
Other: R No Rares Red (Standard) -- URC Izzet Tron (Pauper)
Odd, but I really, really believed that Goblin Guide value could mirror Jace/Goyf in card prices, especially when Goblin Guide was not reprinted last time around. But it seemed that Monastery Swiftspear pulled the weight of the missed Goblin Guide reprint. I've also noticed that Eidolon of the Great Revel has doubled in value.
I do think that Goblin Guide is a worthy investment as well as Eidolon.
I've always saw burn as a common deck. When I'm playing against burn I would pull 3 price of progress and add Vexing Shusher. I feel that the shusher is doing something.
As for the MM17 reprinting... If I can buy a pack at my local Walmart then I would think the reprinting is awesome and intended to bring more players into Modern and Legacy. If the packs are only available for card shops with a limited print run - the intent is to keep the collectors and card shops happy and the card prices are not going to drop. (This is my opinion on MM17)
Bolt or searing blaze it...
In his Second 100 days - Yawgmoth's Bargain is unrestricted in Vintage.
What is going to happen in the Next 100 days!!!
Magic cards aren't "investments", especially not ones that can be reprinted at any time. Just look at Tarmogoyf, which has plummeted since its peak. The best you can hope for is to sell a card right before it gets reprinted. Eidolon doubled in price because it's the new bottleneck card for Burn since Guide was reprinted. I've been saying for a while that Eidolon would become that when Guide gets printed and I was correct. It's probably wise to sell extras in a month or two as people open MM17 Guides and want to play Burn. It's not worth waiting until just before the reprint.
MM17 will not be in big box stores. It's sold at $10 per pack (or more, perhaps) at LGS just like every previous Masters set.
Card prices will definitely fall. It appears that MM17 has a big print run and prices will fall as the set is opened. They also have demonstrated from EMA that they are willing to reprint or re-release more of the set in the fall, so that might happen with MM17 too.
I see Goblin Guide equal or even more popular. I also factored in that Goblin Guide is a ‘staple’ for a major deck. And I’m also assuming it’s going to be the only such card for at least 10 to 15 years from now.
It depends on how you look at investment.
12 years ago I needed to buy a used car; so I sold my Ancestral Recall (beta), Time Walk (Unlimited) and Timetwister (beta). My girlfriend (who later became my wife) she was amazed that I got 600 dollars from 3 magic cards! Today if I held on those 3 cards, I would be looking at least 6,000. I could get a really good used car or a nice down payment for a new car. 6,000 dollars is also a down payment for a house too.
I paid 35 dollars for a mint The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale (this was before wizards made Legacy) if I sell the card today I'm looking at least 1,000...
I bought 4 goblin guides at 5 dollars each and if I decided to sell them I'm getting 20 to 30 dollars each (at one time almost 50 dollars)... That's an investment.
I’m a realist and I always saw magic as an investment, even back when I started playing the game in 1996 (otherwise why are we playing with sleeves).
I'm a strong supporter of Eidolon. I think the price of Eidolon is going to increase; so I won't be surprise to see it hitting 20 dollars.
It’s hard to say, Goblin Guide is a very popular card in modern. I
I thought so and therefore wizards is never going to help drop the card prices down. They need to sell these things in the big stores.
Sure Wasteland dropped but reprint of Force of Will cost more than the original version. I do think making Force of Will a mystic was slap in the face to a legacy player (since the intent of the reprinting was to drop the card prices so more player could access the format)
Anyway, if the reprint of Goblin Guide drops to 5 dollars each… I would buy another playset. He’s worth it!
In his Second 100 days - Yawgmoth's Bargain is unrestricted in Vintage.
What is going to happen in the Next 100 days!!!
I specifically said "especially not ones that can be reprinted at any time." and you bring up 3 Reserve List cards and then a 4th one later (Tabernacle), which are all cards that cannot be printed again (if you believe WotC will never abolish the RL).
That's not an investment, it's a potential profit and it's solely based on hindsight and anyone who buys into such cards is speculating rather than investing. You haven't made an "investment" when you buy something that can have its value tanked at the will of WotC whenever they choose to print more of them. The best you can do is hope that you can cash in before that reprint happens and you generally don't have any warning of a reprint and could easily wait too long. An investment is something that one can reasonably expect to increase in value in a stable manner. With Magic cards, that leaves you with Power 9 since those are the only things that steadily increase in value annually. Even if you do choose to invest in P9, liquidity is low. There's not much of a reason to invest in a $5000 magic card when you could invest $5000 in blue chip stock.
Bringing up Guide is like saying "oh yeah, I invested in 100 Nightveil Specters the summer before Theros came out. HUGE return on investment!" No, that was speculation that led to a huge short term gain and it was something that really couldn't have been predicted.
Magic isn't an investment. It's just an expensive hobby that has speculation opportunities.
I'm not sure what bug is biting you, and I don't care. I've been playing the game over 20 years and I see every card that I buy with my own money is an investment.
In his Second 100 days - Yawgmoth's Bargain is unrestricted in Vintage.
What is going to happen in the Next 100 days!!!
Then I am sorry to say, that you are a fool. Just like the people who used Beanie Babies as an investment.
---
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.
Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.
When I post stuff like this - I get flagged for flaming.
END THIS NOW!
In his Second 100 days - Yawgmoth's Bargain is unrestricted in Vintage.
What is going to happen in the Next 100 days!!!
If you mistakenly believe that every card you buy is an "investment", that's on you and I expect that I won't be changing your opinion on that. I suppose my comment is more targeted toward others who might come across this thread, because they are almost guaranteed to lose money if they take your attitude that cards are investments. The fact of the matter is that buying collectible game pieces, especially those that can be reprinted without warning, is not an investment, and I hope that people who stumble across these few comments are able to recognize that. The money making opportunities in MTG are all speculation with the exception of some RL cards that actually do behave as investments that appreciate in value steadily.
You do know baseball cards has been around over a hundred years.
A 1933 Goudey #181 Babe Ruth psa 4 Vg-EX HOF on Ebay is currently going for $4,995.00
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1933-Goudey-181-Babe-Ruth-psa-4-Vg-EX-HOF-/112194292279?hash=item1a1f4d0a37:g:ycQAAOSwImRYHS6t
BLACK LOTUS BETA Magic the Gathering MTG BGS 9. on Ebay is currently going for 18,000.00
http://www.ebay.com/itm/BLACK-LOTUS-BETA-Magic-the-Gathering-MTG-BGS-9-0-/162427821126?hash=item25d173dc46:g:XDIAAOSwWxNYxKlT
One card was printed in 1933 the other was printed in the early 1990's. Math suggest that MTG is a better investment than Baseball cards.
I'm not in the market of buying and selling cards. I'm always pleased when my cards grow in value. I'm also happy that wizards is keeping the reserve list.
We gotten off topic here (we could do this on another thread and I'll be happy to talk - as long as we don't go down the name calling path)... but I know the argument, you despise me because you think I'm driving up the card prices, you are wrong and off the mark.
In his Second 100 days - Yawgmoth's Bargain is unrestricted in Vintage.
What is going to happen in the Next 100 days!!!
Your example really highlights the point I'm trying to make: reserved list cards (scarce cards that won't appear again) are worth a lot and some of them are truly investments. A card printed in a recent set is analogous to that mass produced 1991 Upper Deck sealed set.
No. My personal perception of you as a person has nothing to do with it, nor do I think that speculators are evil, horrible people keeping the little guys from playing the game. I'm simply stating a fact that MTG cards are not investments and correctly stating that it is an unsound financial decision to regard them as investments. Proctor & Gamble stock is an investment. US Treasury Bonds are investments. Graded Power is an investment, though it lacks liquidity. Goblin Guides are not investments.
People said the same thing that you're saying about Goblin Guide about BFZ Fatpacks: "They'll just go up because of full-art lands!!! Original ZEN full-arts are like $5!!!" And then full-arts were announced in OGW and they're in fatpacks too. Now Amonkhet will have some full-arts, too. People banked on full-arts being an "investment" and they're not. People hoarded EMA "Look at the value! A lot of these won't be printed again!!!", and they "invested" in sealed boxes, and then WotC released more EMA last fall and SCG recently put sealed boxes on sale for ~$170 down from $200 if I'm remembering right. People who bought them for more than $200 and still have the sealed box thought they were "investing", and now they've lost at least 15% on it. There simply are no investment opportunities on cards that aren't on the Reserved List.
I'm just not going to put up with being accused of personally attacking you, or being motivated by some dislike for you, when that is not remotely the case. That's the last I'm going to say about it, because this is the Burn thread.
I'm sorry I didn't mean to accuse you for attacking me but I took your reply a little over the top for the subject. The poster (if I understood was asking about the demand of Goblin Guide) and all I said was it's a worthy investment. Than you got out all defensive about what is a investment and what is not an investment.
Anyway, I'll be happy to talk about the subject on another post. I have theories why I believe the price of duals are f'n expensive meanwhile force of will has not jumped in value for almost 10 years (or maybe older). But we all have theories.
Anyway, I would like to keep this topic on burn. (I might PM you my response on the other stuff, if you want to hear my comments)
In his Second 100 days - Yawgmoth's Bargain is unrestricted in Vintage.
What is going to happen in the Next 100 days!!!
Modern: R Skred -- WBG Melira Co -- URW Nahiri Control
Legacy: R Mono Red Burn -- UWB Stoneblade
Commander: R Krenko, Mob Boss -- WUBRG Scion of the Ur-Dragon -- WUBRG Maze’s End
Other: R No Rares Red (Standard) -- URC Izzet Tron (Pauper)
Right now I tend towards the classic 20 Land, 24 Burn Spells, 12 creatures plus 2 Lavamancer and 2 mainboard Sulfuric Vortex instead of Flame Rifts and was wondering if there really had been a change in meta that made Rift optimal again.
Very true, but a lot of players seemed to adopted (main decking) searing blaze/blood as a spot removal/keep damage rolling, and these cards also boost Swiftspear. I don't think anything is wrong with Lavamancer and against some decks he could be really, really good.
I think some players do like the idea of tapping 2 mana and sacking 2 mountains for 8 damage. The downside of Flame Rift is Eidolon, the reason why players started to stop playing Flame Rift. But Eidolon is such a big creature that opponents are killing it ASAP. So I'm guessing that most burn players don't see an issue of playing Flame Rift.
I think this is reckless burn, because there is going to be a time when Eidolon is in play and you're stuck holding a Flame Rift.
In his Second 100 days - Yawgmoth's Bargain is unrestricted in Vintage.
What is going to happen in the Next 100 days!!!
Legacy: Merfolk U; Shadow UB; Eldrazi Stompy C
Pauper: Delver U
Vintage: Merfolk U
Primers:
Grim is more on the control side, yes. Still competes for the same slot as Swiftspear. After you account for the core cards, there are not many flex slots. You play Swiftspear if you want the more consistent fast clock against a combo heavy meta. You play Grim if you expect a lot of creature matchups like Elves. Flame Rift is similar in that it fights for the same slots as stuff like Vortex and Searing Blaze. Again, clock vs control.
Modern: R Skred -- WBG Melira Co -- URW Nahiri Control
Legacy: R Mono Red Burn -- UWB Stoneblade
Commander: R Krenko, Mob Boss -- WUBRG Scion of the Ur-Dragon -- WUBRG Maze’s End
Other: R No Rares Red (Standard) -- URC Izzet Tron (Pauper)
In his Second 100 days - Yawgmoth's Bargain is unrestricted in Vintage.
What is going to happen in the Next 100 days!!!
Andrea Mengucci Legacy Burn
Also, after pouring over lists and watching in-numerous videos, is seems like Chalice of the Void is being main boarded more often nowadays. I'm thinking of running some amount of Smash to Smithereens in the main, either 1 or 2, with the rest in the sb. Thoughts?
Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici.
It doesn't look bad. I've always thought 2 Grim Lavamancer is a good number (3 and 4 always seemed way, way too much). I never cared for Barbarian Ring, because it's a non-basic and the worst you cannot sac it to a Fireblast.
It's nice to see he's playing 1 Exquisite Firecraft. I do believe, especially with the new Gideon we are going to see a stronger Miracle Control in the following months. So it might be better to play 2 or 3 Firecrafts.
Sure if you believe you can easily target an artifact without being forced to hold it for several turns. I'm running 3 in the side.
In his Second 100 days - Yawgmoth's Bargain is unrestricted in Vintage.
What is going to happen in the Next 100 days!!!
The obvious comparison is Swiftspear. I think haste is better than the ability this card brings (most things you run into are small enough that they die to a single burn spell anyways), but maybe it acts as additional copies of Swiftspear if we want to play a build with more than 12 creatures and don't want to run Grim Lavamancer?