MTG Salvation

***under construction***

This will be a reiteration of my Kaalia of the Vast deck here: https://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/commander-edh/multiplayer-commander-decklists/217009-kaalia-of-the-vast-certified-air-raid-material I never actually owned this deck, but I helped my friend build it and played with and against it often. But I am planning on actually building V2.0 for reasons I will explain. I figure if some of you found the same issues I did with Kaalia of the Vast you might also be interested in building or discussing this alternative list.

At first glace, Kaalia, Zenith Seeker seems to be strictly worse than her original printing because she can't cheat our fatties onto the battlefield turn after turn, and I wouldn't fault you for thinking that. The original is a true Timmy, Power Gamer kind of card. The ability is massively powerful. However, after playing the deck for a while and seeing how other Kaalia of the Vast list performed I decided there were some things that I didn't like and those things ultimately kept me from owning my own deck.

1. After Kaalia became well known, I noticed I was being targeted even if I had nothing on the battlefield. They just didn't want to get smacked in the face with whatever I was holding in my hand. She draws a lot of hate. I found myself losing games before I really had a chance to play. 3v1 are generally losing odds. Even if you do pull off a quick win you will be hated out even more next match.

2. It can be a glass cannon, because it is very dependent on Kaalia. Usually the deck either won magnificently or failed miserably. I spent a lot of my resources making sure she was protected and had haste.

2. I discovered that it was less than ideal to build a creature based deck outside of green. Green has some great creature support cards, namely some OP tutors (Natural Order for example or some insane card draw like Greater Good). I found myself running out of fatties to cheat, or just not being able to draw into the answers I needed.

3. I found that two of the sub-strategies that I liked in the deck, reanimation and blinking (think Cloudshift) had no real synergy with the commander herself, therefor sometimes those were dead cards.


Now, Zenith Seeker actually addresses each one of the problems I had with the original deck in pretty elegant ways. It's as if Wizards actually played with the card they made and made some revisions.


1. Because you aren't necessarily cheating anything crazy into play on turn 3 *cough cough* Master of Cruelties, I believe Zenith Seeker will draw much less hate just for being in your command zone, thereby the number of games lost before they are even played is reduced.

2. Because your commander can't be game winning on her own, the rest of the deck is forced to be independent of her. This ultimately creates a lot more resiliency - it encourages more of a combo/control approach which is my preferred playstyle anyway.

3. Her ability allows you to dig into your library for fuel fairly reliably. We can use blink effects to make the most value of it.

4. As stated above, Zenith Seeker benefits directly from blink effects so we can comfortably maindeck things like Conjurer's Closet and Ephemerate, synergizing with other ETB creatures in the deck. And I think the nature of the demands a reanimation subtheme, mostly because Kaalia of the Vast isn't in our command zone.

What changes about the deck?

1. Because Kaalia 2.0 can't cheat our fatties into play, that means our mana curve has to come down a bit. I'm thinking generally 6 cmc or less is the ideal cost for most of our ADDs (Angels, Demons, Dragons). We are still going to utilize Sneak Attack and Quicksilver Amulet or even Kaalia 1.0 herself in the 99. This also means we will need more ramp, especially colored ramp.

2. Preference will be given to ADDs with powerful ETB effects that we can abuse such as Rune-Scarred Demon and Thundermaw Hellkite


3. Worldgorger Dragon/Animate Dead will be a center piece combo. It will enable our ETB effects to go infinite, killing everyone with Bogardan Hellkite or something equally sinister.

4. Our glass cannon game-plan is out the window, that means no Master of Cruelties or Rakdos the Defiler. Personally I was never a fan of these strategies anyway.

5. Playing a more midrange Kaalia means slotting in more answers and potentially some heavy stax components. I will keep Armageddon and Winter Orb but think about others.

6. Our commander's ability means that we will be slotting in a much higher concentration of ADD and an equal mix of all three. It also means these need to be as low cost and as high value as possible. Think Doom Whisperer or Archangel of Tithes. The ADDs effects need to be synergistic with the deck, providing resiliency and value. In other words high CMC beaters aren't going to go as far here, and if an effect can be had on an ADD body we will choose that card over another.


Preliminary Decklist (in progress) Feedback requested:

I think there's more to this commander under the hood than the direct approach this deck list is trying to take. What I mean to say is, I don't believe you're looking in the right places to find what you're trying to make this deck do.

I'm hanging back to see what else this set does, but I'd like to encourage you to do the same. As Kaalia's personal liaison, you already know I'm going to be diving into this deck too. I just can't discern it's direction at present.

I have to agree with 3drinks on this one. Now you're absolutely right about Kaalia of the Vast drawing attention, she is always going to be the one that opponents save removal for 100%.
And you're right Kaalia, Zenith Seeker is going to draw absolutely no attention at all, and opponents will happily leave her alone.

But I think just playing large creatures without a way to get them into play other than simply doing it with a good old fashion mana base would make it no more than a very very casual kitchen table deck. Which is fine, but you've specifically labeled this competitive.
And I mean trying to play the mana denial strategy (land destruction) in this deck is like holding a shotgun to your head.
Sure there is the Sneak Attack, but that is literally one card in your deck. You just can't lean on it that amount. And then the Quicksilver Amulet does require 4 mana, and it is pretty slow.

I feel like a more low to the ground strategy is needed. Have you checked out the low cost Angel, Demon and Dragons?

For example Feather, the Redeemed is cheap and synergies with Cloudshift, Justiciar's Portal, Liberate, Long Road Home, Otherworldly Journey, Acrobatic Maneuver, Eerie Interlude.
Mirrorwing Dragon can help with this.

There are even Changelings to make use of the draw in a more low to the ground fashion.
Crib Swap, Graveshifter, Irregular Cohort, Mirror Entity, Taurean Mauler, for example.

I don't know exactly what is going to be a viable shell for her, but I think just replacing her with a similar Vast build is not going to work out very well, in my opinion.

Ilharg, the Raze-Boar might be a good choice if you seek to "sneak" creatures, and it lets you reuse those creatures. If you use cards like Erratic Portal you could technically bounce Kaalia every combat, if blink isn't at hand.

Quote from darrenhabib »

But I think just playing large creatures without a way to get them into play other than simply doing it with a good old fashion mana base would make it no more than a very very casual kitchen table deck. Which is fine, but you've specifically labeled this competitive.

I agree as well. It's pointless to fill your hand with cards if you can't utilize them quick enough. It's tempting to go big like Kaalia version 1, but version 2 is easier to go wide.

Though if you choose to go big, there are other options. I had a Tariel, Reckoner of Souls deck that focuses on global discard and reanimation, where big creatures would sooner fuel cards like Zombie Infestation and Necrogen Mists than staying in hand. In Kaalia #2's case, she would be used to keep your hand size high though blinking/bouncing.

Had anyone done math to determine how likely Kaalia-2 would hit at least one creature on first cast?

Quote from cyberium_neo »

Had anyone done math to determine how likely Kaalia-2 would hit at least one creature on first cast?

Not enough information to solve the query at-hand. This is specific to the individual deck construction via how many of the requisite creature types are in the specified deck list.

Thanks for chiming in guys! Great to see you 3drinks. Your list definitely was instrumental in tuning my own. I am excited to collaborate on a Kaalia, Zenith Seeker deck, as I intend on building it. I fully admit that I'm probably just scratching the surface on what this deck looks like, which is why I wanted to workshop it here on the forums first. That decklist was rushed because it was midnight and I wanted to sleep. But I'd rather not purchase cards I will end up putting in my binder, although trades are always welcome

I have to say I've been out of the loop for a while as far as new ADD that might be worth looking at including low cmc ones. Help appreciated there.

I do think that Kaalia 2.0 will utilize reanimation as a main strategy for cheating creatures into play or keeping them there. And I also think the Worldgorger Dragon combo is strong and is worth building around because it synergizes with our commander and other ETB effects that will be in the deck.

Why the rush to build and buy? We can take our time and do things right. No sense taking an incomplete project outta the wood shed just to say we played it on day one, because frankly what would that do for us? Nothing.

Besides, I think when you see the initial incarnation I'm currently spinning my wheels on, you'll kick yourself that you missed the approach.