I had a deck built over 2 years ago with Xira Arien at the helm. The decklist is still posted, but I took the deck apart a long time ago. It was a casualty of trying to make a 4 color deck work (which I never liked) and I have been thinking of putting together a Jund deck again with the same theme since it was fun and relatively chaotic. When Vaevictis was spoiled, I realized he is a perfect fit for this type of deck since he affects me as well as other players.
To start with, I kept the original deck more or less intact with a few changes with newer cards:
As of right now, the main focus is manipulating the top of my library to help control what I can cheat into play. I chose to eschew the "normal" cards of Oracle of Mul Daya and the like just because I use it in a bunch of other decks and I wanted to focus as much as I can on the creatures on top.
One of the suggestions in my previous thread was Mortuary and I decided to cut it for this deck. I like a little more control and I wasn't a fan of creatures automatically going back to the top of my library as it could cause less than stellar creatures going on top or even preventing me from drawing a much needed non-creature card when needed.
As of right now, this is a very rough draft for the deck. I haven't even played it yet but I am going to proxy up Vivien and Vaevictis for now and try it tomorrow night. I think it will be fun and I am trying my best to keep it distinct from my Karador deck which is heavily focused on the graveyard.
Bane of Progress was a bit of an issue since the deck cares a fair amount about enchantments. I decided to replace it with targeted removal.
Realm Seekers is not good enough for this deck as it just wants big creatures and, while it can get big, it is chumped all day. I found I wanted to spend that mana on better things.
Selvala was cut since she just didn't ramp as much as I would like for this deck. I have enough creatures, but the playstyle of the deck doesn't seem as well suited to her.
Insidious Dreams, Sylvan Tutor, and Cruel Tutor were cut for various reasons. The latter 2 mostly because they were sorcery speed (and I am thinking of Cutting Imperial Seal) and the discard aspect of Dreams was just too high when I only got to put cards on top.
Aid and Cream of the Crop just were not good enough. Aid wasn't always hitting and getting it at the end step was not as good as I wanted. Cream is good to stack the top, but I realized I would rather just have a different creature in that spot.
Evolutionary Leap and Perilous Forays were cut since they didn't do enough. I liked sacrificing creatures to them, but I didn't need both. And I decided to replace them with a creature based version. Flameshadow Conjuring was cut to make space for a creature as it was not a card I wanted to spend a turn on casting. The same goes for Vivien and Garruk as I would rather have a creature in this slot.
And, finally, probably the most contentious cut was Impromptu Raid. I really like the card but having to sacrifice the creature meant it was not able to really keep me alive when I needed it. It is purely an aggressive card and, while good, is not what I want for this deck.
To start with, I added a bit more mana ramp in Dryad and Elder. I decided both are good and they give more fodder for Vaevictus later on.
The rest are just big creatures or useful creatures. Some are questionable but I really wanted some like Avatar of Woe and Visara since I can never find a good deck for them. I doubt this is the deck either, but they seem like they would be fun if nothing else.
Inferno Titan should have been in the deck to start with and it really makes the deck better. Phyrexian Plaguelord is a sac outlet I enjoy playing mostly for nostalgic reasons but it is a decent card. It also helps loop certain things by getting them to the graveyard and then back on top of the library.
Archfiend, Sheoldred, AGent of Erebos, and Chupacabra are there for obvious reasons. The same for Rec Sage and Acidic Slime. These are ways to control the board and the latter two are there to help with the removal of Bane of Progress.
Reforge the Soul was added to provide additional card draw when needed. Since I have enough ways to deal with the graveyard, discarding my hand is not always that bad for me.
Bazaar was added because I like the card and it gives me a way to loot through my deck to get the cards I need and I can still use the discarded cards in a number of ways.
Also, with this many changes, I am sure I missed a couple to talk about here. The decklist in the first post is completely accurate even if I forgot to mention a couple cuts/additions here.
I think Sheoldred, Whispering One will be a good addition to the deck, as well as provide some interesting synergy in being able to get back a creature if you choose to sacrifice one to Vaevictis.
An interesting strategy to try could be including rec-curable creatures such as Bloodghast or even Reassembling Skeleton. Since they provide you the option to not sacrifice any impactful permanents. Although with the amount of land ramp in the deck, maybe sacrificing some lands will not be an issue.
I think Sheoldred, Whispering One will be a good addition to the deck, as well as provide some interesting synergy in being able to get back a creature if you choose to sacrifice one to Vaevictis.
I think that is the plan. An interesting scenario came up during testing: I had Sheoldred in the grave and just recurred it with Feldon at the end of my opponent's turn so I could recur something at the beginning of my turn. It didn't let me make my opponents sac anything, but it was interesting. And, at one point, I had the token of Sheoldred return the actual card.
An interesting strategy to try could be including rec-curable creatures such as Bloodghast or even Reassembling Skeleton. Since they provide you the option to not sacrifice any impactful permanents. Although with the amount of land ramp in the deck, maybe sacrificing some lands will not be an issue.
I think your last statement is actually fairly accurate: sacrificing lands (in a pinch) is not the worst thing in the world. I do like the suggestions or, at least, what they are leading towards. I am not sure I like either of the cards though. The main problem is that they do basically nothing else in the deck beyond be sac fodder. If there was a card that could be that but also be more utilitarian, I would slot it in somewhere. As it is, I feel I would be better off with something like Awakening Zone or From Beyond as they give me a token every turn and don't cost mana (like the Skeleton) or require a land drop (like Bloodghast). They also both ramp me and give me more and more chump blockers as time goes on (if I am not sacrificing them). I am still not a fan of those either, but there are a fair number of things that "guarantee" me a permanent to sac each turn but I don't feel I need to explore them yet, especially with the most recent changes made.
I may have to revisit this later to see how it functions now. As it is, I won't really know how well the changes above work until I play it again on Wednesday (and, being the 4th, I am not sure I will be playing this week).
Maybe. I have been on the fence with Gitrog in my Karador deck and I am not sure I want it in this deck. I don't think I often have enough lands to really make use of it and, with Vaevictis sacrificing a land, it means I am down 2 lands a turn just to keep it around. Granted, I get 2 cards out of the deal, but still. It is a fine card and a good suggestion, but for this deck I think the cons outweigh the pros. Or, to put more simply, when I get this card in hand in Karador, I am almost never happy to see it because it does so little on its own. I don't see its performance in this deck being that much different.
However, I have been wrong on cards before so I will keep it in mind as I move forward with the deck so I certainly appreciate the suggestion.
On a side note: as I am typing this up, I think I am going to cut Gitrog from Karador in favor of Phyrexian Plaguelord.
Fair enough I think it would be ok include if you also had Ramunap Excavator and Crucible of Worlds in the decklist. This would let you reuse fetches and always have maximum land drops. Very similar to the Bloodghast plan but with recurring lands.
But its hard to justify 1 card by saying also add 2 other.
I can definitely get behind Ramunap Excavator. I think that is actually a pretty good suggestion. Not only does it help guarantee that I hit my land drops (once they are in the grave) it does give me a better way to net 0 on Vaevictus's ability. I hadn't really thought of that card.
I like my stuff to be creatures (especially in this deck with things like Lurking Predators and Call of the Wild) so I would probably just stick with that over the Crucible. Now, I just need to find a spot for it.
To start with, I kept the original deck more or less intact with a few changes with newer cards:
1 Vaevictis Asmadi, the Dire
Lands
1 Badlands
1 Bayou
1 Bazaar of Baghdad
1 Blood Crypt
1 Bloodstained Mire
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Cinder Glade
1 Command Tower
1 Diamond Valley
6 Forest
1 Gaea's Cradle
1 Grim Backwoods
1 High Market
1 Maze of Ith
1 Miren, the Moaning Well
3 Mountain
1 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
1 Oran-Rief, the Vastwood
1 Overgrown Tomb
1 Phyrexian Tower
1 Reflecting Pool
1 Smoldering Marsh
1 Stomping Ground
5 Swamp
1 Taiga
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Verdant Catacombs
1 Vesuva
1 Volrath's Stronghold
1 Winding Canyons
1 Wooded Foothills
1 Call of the Wild
1 Goblin Bombardment
1 Haunted Crossroads
1 Lurking Predators
1 Phyrexian Reclamation
1 Sneak Attack
1 Sylvan Library
Creatures
1 Acidic Slime
1 Agent of Erebos
1 Archfiend of Depravity
1 Avatar of Woe
1 Burnished Hart
1 Chainer, Dementia Master
1 Diligent Farmhand
1 Disciple of Bolas
1 Eternal Witness
1 Farhaven Elf
1 Feldon of the Third Path
1 Inferno Titan
1 Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
1 Kokusho, the Evening Star
1 Magus of the Wheel
1 Massacre Wurm
1 Noxious Gearhulk
1 Phyrexian Plaguelord
1 Ravenous Chupacabra
1 Reclamation Sage
1 Regal Behemoth
1 Sakura-Tribe Elder
1 Sheoldred, Whispering One
1 Solemn Simulacrum
1 Spike Weaver
1 Temur Sabertooth
1 Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre
1 Urabrask the Hidden
1 Visara the Dreadful
1 Vizier of the Menagerie
1 Wood Elves
1 Yavimaya Dryad
1 Yavimaya Elder
1 Nihil Spellbomb
1 Scroll Rack
1 Sensei's Divining Top
Planeswalkers
1 Liliana Vess
Instants
1 Chaos Warp
1 Corpse Dance
1 Crop Rotation
1 Momentous Fall
1 Rakdos Charm
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Worldly Tutor
Sorceries
1 Damnation
1 Imperial Seal
1 Reforge the Soul
1 Selvala's Stampede
1 Toxic Deluge
1 Wheel of Fortune
As of right now, the main focus is manipulating the top of my library to help control what I can cheat into play. I chose to eschew the "normal" cards of Oracle of Mul Daya and the like just because I use it in a bunch of other decks and I wanted to focus as much as I can on the creatures on top.
One of the suggestions in my previous thread was Mortuary and I decided to cut it for this deck. I like a little more control and I wasn't a fan of creatures automatically going back to the top of my library as it could cause less than stellar creatures going on top or even preventing me from drawing a much needed non-creature card when needed.
As of right now, this is a very rough draft for the deck. I haven't even played it yet but I am going to proxy up Vivien and Vaevictis for now and try it tomorrow night. I think it will be fun and I am trying my best to keep it distinct from my Karador deck which is heavily focused on the graveyard.
1) The core concept is fun and somewhat chaotic (as expected)
2) The execution of that concept was lacking
As such, I decided to overhaul the deck in a not insignificant way. That is, I cut the following cards:
Bane of Progress was a bit of an issue since the deck cares a fair amount about enchantments. I decided to replace it with targeted removal.
Realm Seekers is not good enough for this deck as it just wants big creatures and, while it can get big, it is chumped all day. I found I wanted to spend that mana on better things.
Selvala was cut since she just didn't ramp as much as I would like for this deck. I have enough creatures, but the playstyle of the deck doesn't seem as well suited to her.
Insidious Dreams, Sylvan Tutor, and Cruel Tutor were cut for various reasons. The latter 2 mostly because they were sorcery speed (and I am thinking of Cutting Imperial Seal) and the discard aspect of Dreams was just too high when I only got to put cards on top.
Aid and Cream of the Crop just were not good enough. Aid wasn't always hitting and getting it at the end step was not as good as I wanted. Cream is good to stack the top, but I realized I would rather just have a different creature in that spot.
Evolutionary Leap and Perilous Forays were cut since they didn't do enough. I liked sacrificing creatures to them, but I didn't need both. And I decided to replace them with a creature based version. Flameshadow Conjuring was cut to make space for a creature as it was not a card I wanted to spend a turn on casting. The same goes for Vivien and Garruk as I would rather have a creature in this slot.
And, finally, probably the most contentious cut was Impromptu Raid. I really like the card but having to sacrifice the creature meant it was not able to really keep me alive when I needed it. It is purely an aggressive card and, while good, is not what I want for this deck.
Now, on to the additions:
To start with, I added a bit more mana ramp in Dryad and Elder. I decided both are good and they give more fodder for Vaevictus later on.
The rest are just big creatures or useful creatures. Some are questionable but I really wanted some like Avatar of Woe and Visara since I can never find a good deck for them. I doubt this is the deck either, but they seem like they would be fun if nothing else.
Inferno Titan should have been in the deck to start with and it really makes the deck better. Phyrexian Plaguelord is a sac outlet I enjoy playing mostly for nostalgic reasons but it is a decent card. It also helps loop certain things by getting them to the graveyard and then back on top of the library.
Archfiend, Sheoldred, AGent of Erebos, and Chupacabra are there for obvious reasons. The same for Rec Sage and Acidic Slime. These are ways to control the board and the latter two are there to help with the removal of Bane of Progress.
Reforge the Soul was added to provide additional card draw when needed. Since I have enough ways to deal with the graveyard, discarding my hand is not always that bad for me.
Bazaar was added because I like the card and it gives me a way to loot through my deck to get the cards I need and I can still use the discarded cards in a number of ways.
Also, with this many changes, I am sure I missed a couple to talk about here. The decklist in the first post is completely accurate even if I forgot to mention a couple cuts/additions here.
An interesting strategy to try could be including rec-curable creatures such as Bloodghast or even Reassembling Skeleton. Since they provide you the option to not sacrifice any impactful permanents. Although with the amount of land ramp in the deck, maybe sacrificing some lands will not be an issue.
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I think your last statement is actually fairly accurate: sacrificing lands (in a pinch) is not the worst thing in the world. I do like the suggestions or, at least, what they are leading towards. I am not sure I like either of the cards though. The main problem is that they do basically nothing else in the deck beyond be sac fodder. If there was a card that could be that but also be more utilitarian, I would slot it in somewhere. As it is, I feel I would be better off with something like Awakening Zone or From Beyond as they give me a token every turn and don't cost mana (like the Skeleton) or require a land drop (like Bloodghast). They also both ramp me and give me more and more chump blockers as time goes on (if I am not sacrificing them). I am still not a fan of those either, but there are a fair number of things that "guarantee" me a permanent to sac each turn but I don't feel I need to explore them yet, especially with the most recent changes made.
I may have to revisit this later to see how it functions now. As it is, I won't really know how well the changes above work until I play it again on Wednesday (and, being the 4th, I am not sure I will be playing this week).
However, I have been wrong on cards before so I will keep it in mind as I move forward with the deck so I certainly appreciate the suggestion.
On a side note: as I am typing this up, I think I am going to cut Gitrog from Karador in favor of Phyrexian Plaguelord.
But its hard to justify 1 card by saying also add 2 other.
I like my stuff to be creatures (especially in this deck with things like Lurking Predators and Call of the Wild) so I would probably just stick with that over the Crucible. Now, I just need to find a spot for it.