I was playing a similar version to your deck for a time, and I thought that maybe Altar of the Brood might be worth a slot. It's easy to mill the table out, and there's surely a way you can weave in a Tormod's Crypt to clear a graveyard in response to a shuffle trigger.
I was playing a similar version to your deck for a time, and I thought that maybe Altar of the Brood might be worth a slot. It's easy to mill the table out, and there's surely a way you can weave in a Tormod's Crypt to clear a graveyard in response to a shuffle trigger.
It is a win condition, so just have to balance it up with what I already have. The upside is that it works with any infinite and only costs 1. The downside is that it doesn't do anything on it's own.
It is weaker to the shuffle graveyard into library Eldrazi, but as you say there is the Tormod's Crypt out for those, and you are liekly to ge the other opponents, so not exactly a dead finisher in multiplayer.
Bit of a shame it only get opponents, because if it also milled you, then it would actually be a good card to set up your own graveyard.
I was playing a similar version to your deck for a time, and I thought that maybe Altar of the Brood might be worth a slot. It's easy to mill the table out, and there's surely a way you can weave in a Tormod's Crypt to clear a graveyard in response to a shuffle trigger.
It is a win condition, so just have to balance it up with what I already have. The upside is that it works with any infinite and only costs 1. The downside is that it doesn't do anything on it's own.
It is weaker to the shuffle graveyard into library Eldrazi, but as you say there is the Tormod's Crypt out for those, and you are liekly to ge the other opponents, so not exactly a dead finisher in multiplayer.
Bit of a shame it only get opponents, because if it also milled you, then it would actually be a good card to set up your own graveyard.
I know I run Codex Shredder, which could also be shoehorned into some combo somewhere to mill myself. It also has the added bonus of just being a Regrowth with infinite mana.
Hi. I'm interested in LEDless version of the deck. I have almost all of the cards so I would like to give this unusual deck a tshot but I'm unwilling to buy LED just for this one deck. I think without LED the whole bomberman package could come out, but Salvagers are still nice value engine even if they are not a wincon... so maybe not?
Also list in OP has 102 cards. It might be good to fix that.
Hi. I'm interested in LEDless version of the deck. I have almost all of the cards so I would like to give this unusual deck a tshot but I'm unwilling to buy LED just for this one deck. I think without LED the whole bomberman package could come out, but Salvagers are still nice value engine even if they are not a wincon... so maybe not?
Also list in OP has 102 cards. It might be good to fix that.
There been some discussion in the main forums about mono-whites in ability to compete in the world of Commander, struggling with consistent results.
So I wanted to build a good stuff deck that focused on mana acceleration and big draw cards as much as possible in mono-white, that's not completely centralistic around particular card combos, like just going for infinite's with Teshar, or maybe a deck that's built around Sram, Senior Edificer.
As mono-white doesn't have much in the way of card draw or mana acceleration, much of the good stuff is based around artifacts. With Teshar ability to recur creatures, and subsequently artifacts if you use artifact recursion creatures like, Salvage Scout, Restoration Specialist, Myr Retriever, Junk Diver, Workshop Assistant, the deck has a lot of resilience against artifact removal.
I have nicknamed it "The Great White Hope", in reflection of being a champion for competitiveness of mono-white in fun and stylish fashion for a more battle-cruiser meta.
As always please leave comments on cards that I should consider, I really want to make sure I don;t miss out on any big mana or draw that I can squeeze out of mono-white.
Looks pretty tuned to me.
My own sort of advise is that you really want to make sure that when you start spinning your wheels that you actually have a way to win.
Now also just be careful with Enduring Renewal as it's not a conditional return to hand. So it will nullify sacrificing your non-zero costing creatures, as they won't remain in the graveyard for them to return with Teshar, Ancestor's Apostle, instead going to hand which will be very annoying. So obviously you only want to play out if you specifically have the zero cost creatures, and then even be wary about being disrupted, and then subsequently Enduring Renewal cutting you off some of the other combos.
I have actually been cutting some of the ways that I can win with the mediocre sac outlets Gate to the AfterlifeBontu's Monument ect. Do you think those are worth it. Gate to the Afterlife seems to be the best outside of Aetherflux Reservoir and Altar of the Brood with the worst that it can do being gaining infinite life else getting one of the other win cons up. In my experience I have liked Enduring Renewal because of the zero drop creatures that I have. Do you think those are worth running?
At this point overall there isn't much that I can find to add, and I have just been tinkering with it for the past few months so I was just going to see what your insight was. Scarecrone seems like a good add.
I have actually been cutting some of the ways that I can win with the mediocre sac outlets Gate to the AfterlifeBontu's Monument ect. Do you think those are worth it. Gate to the Afterlife seems to be the best outside of Aetherflux Reservoir and Altar of the Brood with the worst that it can do being gaining infinite life else getting one of the other win cons up. In my experience I have liked Enduring Renewal because of the zero drop creatures that I have. Do you think those are worth running?
At this point overall there isn't much that I can find to add, and I have just been tinkering with it for the past few months so I was just going to see what your insight was. Scarecrone seems like a good add.
I think that Gate to the Afterlife is some great tech. I'm going to have to try it myself.
I'm less convinced about Bontu's Monument due to it being a less likely way to get a combo.
I mean honestly your feedback is worth more on whether you think the additional zero drop creatures have been giving more consistent ways to get enough pieces to win?
I personally find that a sacrifice outlet is usually the combo piece I'm waiting for on the most and then secondary an actual win condition if the sac outlet wasn't one itself.
So I tend to have enough zero casting cards, and also have enough graveyard retrieval creatures, that I'm not waiting on those parts.
I used to run Demonmail Hauberk, but because it doesn't have an inbuilt "do something" ability I ended up cutting it.
But if I can find a few more cards like Gate to the Afterlife, then I might be able to warrant putting it back in.
Do you have any suggestions of other "whenever a creature dies" win conditions?
I just find with Auriok Salvagers + Lion's Eye Diamond able to give infinite mana, that it's never lined up for me, like I've just had other combo going and infinite mana is often best served still with some sort of Teshar engine going.
Added
+ Trusty Packbeast
Removal
- Abeyance
Niv-Mizzet Reborn
Feather, the Redeemed
Estrid, the Masked
Teshar
Tymna/Ravos
Najeela, Blade-Blossom
Firesong & Sunspeaker
Zur the Enchanter
Lazav, the Multifarious
Ishai+Reyhan
Click images for decks->
-Prime Speaker Vannifar
---------------------Will & Rowan Kenrith
I think all-in-all it maybe better than Diviner's Wand as a combo finisher. Diviner's Wand actually does require infinite mana. I already have the Skullclamp, so Stoneforge Mystic already has a target for that.
It is weaker to the shuffle graveyard into library Eldrazi, but as you say there is the Tormod's Crypt out for those, and you are liekly to ge the other opponents, so not exactly a dead finisher in multiplayer.
Bit of a shame it only get opponents, because if it also milled you, then it would actually be a good card to set up your own graveyard.
Added
+ Altar of the Brood
Removed
- Diviner's Wand
Niv-Mizzet Reborn
Feather, the Redeemed
Estrid, the Masked
Teshar
Tymna/Ravos
Najeela, Blade-Blossom
Firesong & Sunspeaker
Zur the Enchanter
Lazav, the Multifarious
Ishai+Reyhan
Click images for decks->
-Prime Speaker Vannifar
---------------------Will & Rowan Kenrith
I know I run Codex Shredder, which could also be shoehorned into some combo somewhere to mill myself. It also has the added bonus of just being a Regrowth with infinite mana.
Also list in OP has 102 cards. It might be good to fix that.
Obviously LED is one of the better zero-cost artifacts, but just remove the Bomber-man package and you should be good to go.
Let me know how you get on with the deck once you get to play some game
Niv-Mizzet Reborn
Feather, the Redeemed
Estrid, the Masked
Teshar
Tymna/Ravos
Najeela, Blade-Blossom
Firesong & Sunspeaker
Zur the Enchanter
Lazav, the Multifarious
Ishai+Reyhan
Click images for decks->
-Prime Speaker Vannifar
---------------------Will & Rowan Kenrith
So I wanted to build a good stuff deck that focused on mana acceleration and big draw cards as much as possible in mono-white, that's not completely centralistic around particular card combos, like just going for infinite's with Teshar, or maybe a deck that's built around Sram, Senior Edificer.
As mono-white doesn't have much in the way of card draw or mana acceleration, much of the good stuff is based around artifacts. With Teshar ability to recur creatures, and subsequently artifacts if you use artifact recursion creatures like, Salvage Scout, Restoration Specialist, Myr Retriever, Junk Diver, Workshop Assistant, the deck has a lot of resilience against artifact removal.
Please check out the deck in the second post of the thread here => https://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/commander-edh/multiplayer-commander-decklists/790445-teshar-ancestors-apostle-mono-white-combo-new-deck#c2
I have nicknamed it "The Great White Hope", in reflection of being a champion for competitiveness of mono-white in fun and stylish fashion for a more battle-cruiser meta.
As always please leave comments on cards that I should consider, I really want to make sure I don;t miss out on any big mana or draw that I can squeeze out of mono-white.
Niv-Mizzet Reborn
Feather, the Redeemed
Estrid, the Masked
Teshar
Tymna/Ravos
Najeela, Blade-Blossom
Firesong & Sunspeaker
Zur the Enchanter
Lazav, the Multifarious
Ishai+Reyhan
Click images for decks->
-Prime Speaker Vannifar
---------------------Will & Rowan Kenrith
1 Teshar, Ancestor's Apostle
ETB Graveyard Recursion 3
1 Leonin Squire
1 Trusty Packbeast
1 Treasure Hunter
Death GY Recursion 4
1 Junk Diver
1 Scrap Trawler
1 Myr Retriever
1 Workshop Assistant
Ability GY Recursion 2
1 Salvage Scout
1 Restoration Specialist
Enduring Renewal 1
1 Enduring Renewal
Bounce 3
1 Kor Skyfisher
1 Aviary Mechanic
1 Glint Hawk
Sac Outlet 6
1 Altar of Dementia
1 Phyrexian Altar
1 Demonmail Hauberk
1 Blasting Station
1 Ashnod's Altar
1 Spawning Pit
Artifact Sac 2
1 Krark-Clan Ironworks
1 Grinding Station
Utility/Good Stuff 23
1 Conqueror's Flail
1 Lapse of Certainty
1 Citanul Flute
1 Ranger of Eos
1 Mesmeric Orb
1 Stoneforge Mystic
1 Grand Abolisher
1 Selfless Spirit
1 Path to Exile
1 Benevolent Bodyguard
1 Land Tax
1 Sacred Guide
1 Mangara of Corondor
1 Mother of Runes
1 Skyscanner
1 Swords to Plowshares
1 Lightning Greaves
1 Steelshaper's Gift
1 Bounty Agent
1 Recruiter of the Guard
1 Kami of False Hope
1 Memory Jar
1 Ornithopter
1 Lion's Eye Diamond
1 Mox Diamond
1 Mox Opal
1 Walking Ballista
1 Memnite
1 Shield Sphere
1 Mana Crypt
1 Urza's Bauble
1 Lotus Petal
1 Mishra's Bauble
1 Tormod's Crypt
1 Phyrexian Walker
1 Welding Jar
Fast Mana
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Vault
1 Grim Monolith
Win Cons 2
1 Altar of the Brood
1 Aetherflux Reservoir
Win Cons Kinda 2
1 Skullclamp
1 Mind Stone
Lands 34
1 Inventors' Fair
1 Flagstones of Trokair
25 Plains
1 Wasteland
1 Mishra's Workshop
1 Crystal Vein
1 Command Beacon
1 Strip Mine
1 Buried Ruin
1 Ancient Tomb
My own sort of advise is that you really want to make sure that when you start spinning your wheels that you actually have a way to win.
A lot of the sacrifice outlets have in built win conditions like; Altar of Dementia, Blasting Station, Grinding Station.
But these others are dependent on what else you have;
Ashnod's Altar, Phyrexian Altar, Demonmail Hauberk, Spawning Pit, Krark-Clan Ironworks.
What to do with infinite mana? Ashnod's Altar, Phyrexian Altar, Krark-Clan Ironworks can do this.
I like Scarecrone because with infinite mana (and Teshar engine going), you can draw your deck for a win condition.
Because you're playing Steelshaper's Gift in addition to Stoneforge Mystic, you can also look at Diviner's Wand as another win condition with infinite mana.
If that makes sense you have a lot of ways to spin the wheels with Ashnod's Altar, Phyrexian Altar, Krark-Clan Ironworks with Enduring Renewal and Memnite, Shield Sphere, Phyrexian Walker as additional ways to do this from my build.
Now also just be careful with Enduring Renewal as it's not a conditional return to hand. So it will nullify sacrificing your non-zero costing creatures, as they won't remain in the graveyard for them to return with Teshar, Ancestor's Apostle, instead going to hand which will be very annoying. So obviously you only want to play out if you specifically have the zero cost creatures, and then even be wary about being disrupted, and then subsequently Enduring Renewal cutting you off some of the other combos.
Niv-Mizzet Reborn
Feather, the Redeemed
Estrid, the Masked
Teshar
Tymna/Ravos
Najeela, Blade-Blossom
Firesong & Sunspeaker
Zur the Enchanter
Lazav, the Multifarious
Ishai+Reyhan
Click images for decks->
-Prime Speaker Vannifar
---------------------Will & Rowan Kenrith
The main reason for Steelshaper's Gift and Stoneforge Mystic is to get Skullclamp because it is fantastic whether you are comboing or not. So I don't really see the need for Diviner's Wand](Especially over Gate to the Afterlife. They can also get Demonmail Hauberk which is by far the worst sac outlet in the list.
At this point overall there isn't much that I can find to add, and I have just been tinkering with it for the past few months so I was just going to see what your insight was. Scarecrone seems like a good add.
I'm less convinced about Bontu's Monument due to it being a less likely way to get a combo.
I mean honestly your feedback is worth more on whether you think the additional zero drop creatures have been giving more consistent ways to get enough pieces to win?
I personally find that a sacrifice outlet is usually the combo piece I'm waiting for on the most and then secondary an actual win condition if the sac outlet wasn't one itself.
So I tend to have enough zero casting cards, and also have enough graveyard retrieval creatures, that I'm not waiting on those parts.
I used to run Demonmail Hauberk, but because it doesn't have an inbuilt "do something" ability I ended up cutting it.
But if I can find a few more cards like Gate to the Afterlife, then I might be able to warrant putting it back in.
Do you have any suggestions of other "whenever a creature dies" win conditions?
Mono-White Combo
Added
+ Gate to the Afterlife
Removed
- Auriok Salvagers
I just find with Auriok Salvagers + Lion's Eye Diamond able to give infinite mana, that it's never lined up for me, like I've just had other combo going and infinite mana is often best served still with some sort of Teshar engine going.
Niv-Mizzet Reborn
Feather, the Redeemed
Estrid, the Masked
Teshar
Tymna/Ravos
Najeela, Blade-Blossom
Firesong & Sunspeaker
Zur the Enchanter
Lazav, the Multifarious
Ishai+Reyhan
Click images for decks->
-Prime Speaker Vannifar
---------------------Will & Rowan Kenrith