MTG Salvation

Hmmmm...

After playing a bit more, I've noticed a few cards I'm not liking too much and some I'm liking a lot.

Ones I'm not crazy about:
Felidar Sovereign - It just never feels good. I know I said I wanted to do lifegain as a highlighted theme in the deck but this dude just never feels good to play or have dealt with. Either it leads to an instant removal or an unsatisfying win. I originally wanted it in as a "okay can we just end the game now" card, but even I feel gross playing it. I'm glad I never got around to getting Test of Endurance because I'm really considering taking this out.

Nezumi Graverobber - Maybe I'm just not using it right, but it only actually seems worth playing at the very start of a game, when I could just be throwing down Ayli turn two as a deterrent instead. Otherwise it doesn't seem very relevant unless I happen to have Bojuka Bog as well. And even if it flips, it feels like it never gets to do anything relevant before getting killed off.

And ones I'm really liking:

Sidisi, Undead Vizier - a Diabolic Tutor that I can use as protection, kill off something that has an LTB effect, AND recur? She's fantastic.

Erebos, God of the Dead - you haven't lived until you have an opponent make a 1000/1000 Ulasht, the Hate Seed and swing it at you, only to be hit with Swords to Plowshares. He grins, and says "well, thanks for the thousand life". I smiled and said "no." Also, having an indestructible blocker is great for chumping commanders who are trying to get in for commander damage.

Yosei, the Morning Star - Every time this card comes down, it's an extreme threat. Last two games I played, I didn't win either, but it did end up being horrible punishment for the person who killed me. I tap them out in revenge and essentially give opponents a Time Walk against them.

Still loving playing this. Keep looking forward to every Commander night at my LGS. Even if I don't win (let's face it, I'm still learning this deck and EDH politics in general against people who are seasoned veterans at it), I have a lot of fun with being a huge threat if left unchecked. Which seems to happen a lot because no one at my LGS ever sees Ayli played as a commander.

I've found Nezumi Graverobber to be ineffective in multiplayer since graveyards are either totally full or totally empty if there's a Rest in Peace. If you want a likelihood you can try Chainer, Dementia Master. You even have enough lifegain in your deck to mitigate his lifeloss.
If your opponents have swarm strategies, you can also try Demon of Dark Schemes. My friend plays a Liliana, Heretical Healer deck and trust me, the card can stack well over enough energy on its own.

Nezumi means mouse... And it's a rat. Lol.

Demon of Dark Schemes seems pretty cool. I'll have to snag one of those sometime. Chainer kinda worries me because if I invest resources into getting stuff onto the battlefield, the last thing I want is someone killing him off and wiping all of those units I brought back away too.

Quote from Jenna Tolaria »

Nezumi means mouse... And it's a rat. Lol.

True! From what I recall, even if names and subtypes clash, R&D will favor subtypes over flavor for the sake of keeping synergy in the game. So rather than it being a mouse like its name claims, it's a rat instead so it will work with all the other rats in the game (there's even a rat lord so the synergy is not unwelcome if rat tribal is your thing.)

Quote from MatsuriFramboise »

Yosei, the Morning Star - Every time this card comes down, it's an extreme threat. Last two games I played, I didn't win either, but it did end up being horrible punishment for the person who killed me. I tap them out in revenge and essentially give opponents a Time Walk against them.

This. The Morning Star is the most important wincon in my deck. Or, Yosei is able to temporarily set back someone enough so you catch your breath and find a solution. AND it's tool for vengeance. And, like most threats in our deck, no less threatening from the 'yard. I just love Falcor Yosei.

Quote from MatsuriFramboise »

Demon of Dark Schemes seems pretty cool. I'll have to snag one of those sometime. Chainer kinda worries me because if I invest resources into getting stuff onto the battlefield, the last thing I want is someone killing him off and wiping all of those units I brought back away too.

Quote from Jenna Tolaria »

Nezumi means mouse... And it's a rat. Lol.

True! From what I recall, even if names and subtypes clash, R&D will favor subtypes over flavor for the sake of keeping synergy in the game. So rather than it being a mouse like its name claims, it's a rat instead so it will work with all the other rats in the game (there's even a rat lord so the synergy is not unwelcome if rat tribal is your thing.)

That's pretty cool!

Hey everyone! I'm catching up on the posts these last couple weeks. I've been super busy with setting up a new game room, hopefully in which some friends and I will begin recording a Commander series to put on YouTube in the future! My partner and a close friend of ours and a rotating player chair are brainstorming on the setup and everything. Just got the paint for the room this weekend. I also wrote the script for a video primer for Ayli, though that's still a bit off as I have some articles to finish writing for QueueTimes.com, EDH at FNM this Friday, D&D on Saturday and my mother-in-law's birthday on Sunday Phew.

Anyway, on to some of the cards being discussed here:

Nezumi Graverobber is a card I haven't ever had much problem with flipping, myself. In the early game it's not too hard to remove enough cards to flip him because I always find there's a player with only 3 or 4 cards at most in their graveyard. In the mid game it's relatively easy to find Bojuka Bog, though generating a lot of mana to exile some cards isn't hard either. He's also graveyard hate when he's not flipped, which is nice to have when one Bojuka Bog just won't do the job. I admit there are games where it's harder than others to flip him, but the key here is that he's a repeatable reanimation effect that doesn't require much colored mana. I saw Chainer mentioned, and I'll get to him in a minute.

Felidar Sovereign and Test of Endurance are best in a deck that is not only built going all in for life gain, but also a pillow fort so you can ensure you stay at a relevant life total to even win with them. They're pretty fragile win conditions because if they're not removed, the moment you play them your opponents will try their hardest to make sure you don't get there. It's also a struggle because we want to use life as another resource as Orzhov players. Necropotence is absolutely amazing, and so is Phyrexian Arena, but if you're trying to win off of your life total then you have two concepts really clashing against each other. For the same reason I never really tout Ayli, Eternal Pilgrim's second ability as a reason to play her. 50 life is a lot, even though we start at 40 in EDH. It's a nice bonus if you happen to get there somehow, but I never count on it.

Erebos, God of the Dead is a pretty great way to draw cards, but I've never found something I want to replace for the effect. 2 mana per card is a lot in a deck that wants to keep mana open to respond and be the Control most of the time. There are niche examples though like mentioned above where the "no life gain" static ability can be nice, though.

Chainer, Dementia Master is actually one of my favorite cards in the game, for nostalgia reasons. He'd be absolutely amazing for the deck if it weren't so risky. It's easy enough for us to sacrifice our Nightmares in response to whatever effect would kill Chainer. The biggest issue is his activated ability costing BBB for each activation. It's a very steep cost, and one more effective in a mono-black deck that can take full advantage of Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth + Cabal Coffers and Liliana of the Dark Realms In Ayli, I don't run Urborg + Coffers because Coffers has proven to be unreliable in decks with two or more colors. It's a dead draw without Urborg, which isn't a high priority over many other utility lands to find for protecting our creatures, ourselves or our graveyard. I love him, but he just doesn't pan out very well outside mono black.

Demon of Dark Schemes is actually something I had in the main deck and was removed pretty fast afterwards. There are a lot of conditions that need to be met for him to be useful: You need board full of creatures to gain energy from him for his activated ability; he only gives creatures -2/-2, so in the mid to late game when you play him not much does; you need a board wipe to really take advantage of him, killing him in the process so you have to bring him back later, or you have to specifically have Black Sun's Zenith or Toxic Deluge for him to be useful. He requires 2B in addition to tapping and the Energy cost to use his ability, if there's anything particularly important you want from a graveyard, so he's very slow and very resource intensive. There's just so many other better ways to do what he does. If you want an effect that is happy for creatures to die, there's Massacre Wurm or even Havoc Demon. If you want to mass reanimate opponent's creatures, Puppeteer Clique + Ashnod's Altar + Nim Deathmantle can let you get every creature from every opponent's graveyard; or you can play Sepulchral Primordial and keep reanimating him.

I don't have much to update right now, I'm afraid! The last few weeks have been very busy and I haven't gotten to play much to test Approach of the Second Sun, though I'm happy with the changes. I was much more happy to draw it than Kaya, Ghost Assassin when I have played, because it immediately puts the game on a clock and is very easy to cast the second time. Sidisi, Undead Vizier in place of Tree of Perdition has proven a good change because being able to tutor is always a good ability, especially on a body! Whereas Tree usually sat in hand, waiting for a time when it wouldn't just be immediately removed. I have yet to get any copies of Razaketh, the Foulblooded but it's price has dropped considerably so I hope to pick about 3 copies up for my various EDH decks I'm still considering what I would take out for him, and it still looks like Sorin, Grim Nemesis or Ugin, the Spirit Dragon are the primary considerations.

Hmm... What about Gonti, Lord of Luxury? He works as a general value card that can steal cards from opponents' decks and allows us to play them (regardless of color), which can throw off combos and take away responses to our cards (or at the very least, steal some land drops to keep them from casting stuff) and give us extra resources to work with. And since Ayli's a reanimation deck, we can sac Gonti (or use him as a rattlesnake removal piece) and reanimate him for extra value and disruption. Not only that, but if you use the Reveillark + Karmic Guide combo, he not only can give us as many cards as we want to work with-- he can just win, because he straight up just mills everyone. In other words, he's potentially a wincon if he can be put in an ETB loop.

Quote from MatsuriFramboise »

Hmm... What about Gonti, Lord of Luxury? He works as a general value card that can steal cards from opponents' decks and allows us to play them (regardless of color), which can throw off combos and take away responses to our cards (or at the very least, steal some land drops to keep them from casting stuff) and give us extra resources to work with. And since Ayli's a reanimation deck, we can sac Gonti (or use him as a rattlesnake removal piece) and reanimate him for extra value and disruption. Not only that, but if you use the Reveillark + Karmic Guide combo, he not only can give us as many cards as we want to work with-- he can just win, because he straight up just mills everyone. In other words, he's potentially a wincon if he can be put in an ETB loop.

I like Gonti and think he's a fun card, but my biggest issue with using him is how often you can hit dead cards with him unless you're really dedicated to making his trigger happen a lot. If you have the availability to keep reanimating him, there's so many other targets that are more effective or do more. You can use him as part of Reveillark + Karmic Guide but in that case you're probably already winning and he can be a "win more" card. It is true that he can get some extra cards if you aren't hitting lands, etc with him and give you more options, though. He's another win condition with Lark/Guide if you don't have Exsanguinate or Blasting Station out.

Thinking through it, I'm definitely wouldn't say not to use him. But I will warn that as far as politics go, doing much with him outside of using him as a win con with Lark/Guide may be suicide. I've talked to a lot of friends that play him and there is something psychological about having your cards taken away or other people playing them. You'll probably be targeted the entire rest of the game In summary I think he could be worth a shot, but at least in the main build I don't believe there's anything I would take out for him. Earlier there was discussion that some of you were having problems flipping Nezumi Graverobber, so you could possibly try Gonti in his place. Granted, with Ashnod's Altar and a flipped Nezumi Graverobber, you could keep reanimating Gonti using it for effectively 2B, so it's another way to abuse Gonti.

I ended up just putting Knight-Captain of Eos in, honestly.

Also, how does Vindictive Lich from the C17 spoilers look as a reanimator target? Every time it dies, you choose one or more: target opponent sacrifices a creature, target opponent discards 2 cards, or target opponent loses 5 life. This means you can hit multiple people at once, or throw it all at one person. I'm intrigued.

It looks like we have all of the new cards from the Commander 2017 set, so with the question about Vindictive Lich, I'd say now is a good time to do a review of the set!

Commander 2017 Set Review

Alms Collector
If you play heavy in a combo meta or you're facing down the likes of The Locust God, this could be a meta call with some instant reanimation effects. Because he doesn't do anything when he enters or leaves the battlefield or dies, I would never include him in the main deck except for a meta call.

Balan, Wandering Knight
This guy just isn't what Ayli is looking for, and even in a deck with an Equipment package or Stoneforge Mystic you don't want so much equipment that it would make this guy good. Equipment packages will be things like Sword of Feast and Famine or Sword of Fire and Ice to get some triggers from swinging through with flying creatures, or providing protection. Even then, I find it really hard to justify equipment packages. That said, Balan should probably keep on wandering.

Curse of Vitality
If you're looking to play a life gain build, then this could be for you. The big down side is that to encourage opponents to attack the cursed player, you're also letting them gain life as well. As long as your win conditions are alternate ones such as Test of Strength or Felidar Guardian, giving opponents life isn't too awful.

Fortunate Few
It's widely known that giving your opponents choices is not where you want to be when playing Magic. What's worse is that you choose first, meaning that you don't get the benefit of tailoring your choice to what your opponents do. If you play this and actually make it good, you'll definitely be of a very fortunate few. Hard pass.

Kindred Boon
In most cases, if something gets destroyed you'll be able to get it back one way or another. We also like to sacrifice things that are targeted with removal, or in response to board wipes. Making things Indestructible is really not something Ayli is looking for, which is why we don't run Avacyn, Angel of Hope. For this deck's strategy, this isn't much of a boon.

Scalelord Reckoner
Excluding itself, the only Dragons currently worth playing in Ayli are Yosei, the Morning Star and Kokusho, the Evening Star. If it were in the deck, that would only be three targets, and if Yosei or Kokusho were targeted, you'd probably just sacrifice them to look that opponent out of the game. Very few targets that are relevant and an ability we don't need, so I reckon this is a pass.

Stalking Leonin
His ability is very narrow given how much removal we're running. Ideally the board state should be under control where he isn't necessary. Also, his ETB ability has no effect on the board state. If he's in your deck, he's the bad kind of stalker - forever stalking your hand or graveyard, waiting to be useful.

Teferi's Protection
Yes, yes. Phasing. Surprise! Chances are that if you're in a spot where you need to play this, you're not going to turn things around with one extra turn to live. It can be a response to Combo/Storm decks, but Protection is limited to targeted effects. I don't like the idea of Phasing everything out, especially because most of Ayli's ability to respond to threats comes with the permanents currently on your board. Despite the Protection from Everything, you can still be harmed by global effects in the 3+ consecutive turns after you play this. I also dislike that it Exiles itself. Ayli likes bringing back horses to beat until they're dust; not one-trick horses we can't use again. The only protection I want involving this is giving the deck Protection from Teferi's Protection so it doesn't enter the deck.

Bloodline Necromancer
We play very few Vampires or Wizards, making this a very narrow target. One of the unfortunate things about Commander 2017 is that with it being Tribal, most of the new cards will have a hard time finding a place in any decks that aren't very focused on these four tribes. Conspiracy is the only thing that could make this guy viable, and there's very little reason to play Conspiracy in the Ayli. This is where his bloodline ends.

Boneyard Scourge
Again, very little ways in Ayli to trigger this guy and make him relevant. There's very few Dragons worth playing because so many of them aren't in our colors, or don't have any valuable ETB/LTB effects to trigger. Even in a Dragon deck, this thing isn't necessarily better than Reassembling Skeleton, Nether Traitor or Bloodghast because those are similar creatures that are much easier to bring back. You'll forgive me if I refuse to toss this Dragon a bone.

Curse of Disturbance
Giving opponents creatures to encourage them to attack one player isn't all that great, in my opinion. I really don't like the idea of benefiting opponents when we could just wipe the board or take anyone out with our normal tactics. You'd have to be disturbed to want to include this in Ayli.

Kheru Mind-Eater
Despite having Menace, the fact is again that Ayli is is not an aggressor that wants to go into the combat zone. It's has a lot of conditions for being useful. It has to be able to deal combat damage to an opponent. You have to exile something that is of use to you. You have to have the mana available to cast it. One would be out of mind to want to play this Vampire.

Kindred Dominance
7-mana one-off board wipes just aren't my thing. Especially since we only play one or two Vampires. The only thing this will be dominating is the dollar bins.

New Blood
Well, you can play this if you happen to have Viscera Seer or Vish Kal, Blood Abriter on the battlefield. Otherwise it's a pretty dead card, when you could just kill the target in question and reanimate it with Puppeteer Clique as part of a massive alpha strike. You'd be going through some heavy blood, sweat and tears to make this thing worth it.

Patron of the Vein
There are already a lot of ETB destruction effects in the deck, and many that are better and flat out Exile permanents. There's no reason to burst a vein trying to figure out how to play this guy. He's just not worth it.

Vindictive Lich
This Lich is exactly the kind of card that Ayli wants! Very rare do we get creatures with powerful enough abilities to warrant considering. The utility of it's death trigger is absolutely amazing, and with our reanimation abilities we can hit those triggers multiple times per turn, easily! Rotating targets, Vindictive Lich can be a combo finisher with is 5-life, a board clear of opponents with Indestructible or Hexproof creatures, and also stop opponents in their tracks who are attempting to gather combo pieces or who have been drawing a lot of cards. it has additional bonus points for synergy with Skullclamp and Recruiter of the Guard. Vindictive Lich will definitely be a must-have and I'll be figuring out how to slot it in. Being vindictive is fun!

Bloodforged Battle-axe
It's an Equipment. It requires you to get into Combat and get combat damage on a player. It makes more Equipment. Ayli is not a deck that gets into Combat, and it's for sure not one that keeps so many creatures around that getting more of these is worth it.

Hammer of Nazahn
Equipment that wants more Equipment. Ugh. FOOL! Ugh.

Heirloom Blade
I'm already not being a fan of running Equipment, and this won't be changing that. There is an eclectic mix of creature types in the deck, meaning that it would be extremely inconsistent. One thing that I have tried to strive for with Ayli is to make the deck consistent as possible. If the creature were put onto the battlefield, it still would probably not be a consideration because of the random nature of the card.

Herald's Horn
Ayli isn't a Tribal deck. At least, not this Ayli. Some people try to do Clerics. I'm sorry I wasn't laughing just now, that was the wind. Not to toot my own horn.

Mirror of the Forebearers
Again, Tribal Matters cards are not what Ayli is looking for, and rather than making copies of creatures, we want to just sacrifice them and bring them back as new permanents triggering more abilities that way. If I played this here I would have to take a long hard look in the mirror and question my life choices.

Path of Ancestry
There are zero other Kor in the deck unless you run Kor Cartographer, and very few Clerics. You're also reanimating more than casting creatures.

Conclusion

Vindictive Lich is sadly the only card out of the entire set to be excited about for Ayli, but damn it's exciting. Having this sort of utility is living the dream. I'll be trying to get one ASAP to test and figure out how to make room for it.

Been trying out Vindictive Lich. It's not bad, but also not super necessary in our deck. Also: it looks like we're getting new versions of Kokusho and Yosei !

Quote from tarotplz »

Hello everyone,

I´m kinda new to EDH and I`m trying to build a Ayli, Eternal Pilgrim deck. Seeing as this is the first Commander deck I´m building, it´s not as easy as I would have thought. That´s why I´m here to ask all of you more experienced Ayli players for help

Hi there! Welcome to the wacky world of EDH! Glad you chose Ayli as your first Commander, she can be built a lot of different ways!

My first question is about life gain. How much of it do we actually need in the deck? Originally I was set on running both of the Soul Sisters and even a bunch of cards like Blood Artist and Rhox Faithmender.
Looking at the lists in this thread I don´t really see many life gain cards. Why not? Wouldn´t we kinda want to get Ayli´s 2nd ability online reliably?

Most of your questions are answered in the main post and through the discussion here, but I'll answer these given it's a long read:

Ayli's second ability is good, but not necessary or really the reason I run her in the deck. The two biggest reasons to run her are that 1.) She's only 2-mana with a 2/3 Deathtouch body that makes opponents not want to attack you in the early game. Orzhov decks are not fast and regardless of how you build them, they tend to play the long game. 2.) She is a very accessible sac outlet available from the Command Zone when you need it. If she dies, she's still only 4 mana. Orzhov has so many great removal spells and abilities that even though Ayli comes with one, it's seldom worth going out of your way to make available to use, especially because it really requires a lot of life gain in EDH to get to 50 life. In a format with 3 players, life totals swing often and it makes it really difficult to stay above 50 and inconsistent. For that reason I find it's best not to focus on it and it be a happy coincidence if it becomes available to use.

In general I don't really go out of my way for life gain because Orzhov can handle aggressors very well and prevent them from attacking, so even when using Phyrexian Arena, Necropotence or other cards that add up over time on the life loss, it's fairly negligible.

Which cards would you all say are the core of the deck? The cards that should not be replaced under any circumstances? The best sac-outlets, the best reanimation spells, the best reanimation targets?

The most important cards for the build I posted in the main build are those that are part of the "triangle choke":

The Sac Engine:

• Ayli, Eternal Pilgrim
  
• Vish Kal, Blood Arbiter
  
• Phyrexian Tower
  
• High Market
  
• Blasting Station
  
• Ashnod's Altar
  
• Viscera Seer
  
• Spawning Pit

The Recursion Engine:

• Sheoldred, Whispering One
  
• Nezumi Graverobber
  
• Nim Deathmantle
  
• Karmic Guide (on Nim Deathmantle)
  
• Corpse Dance (with buyback)

The ETB/LTB Creature:

• Yosei, the Morning Star
  
• Kokusho, the Evening Star
  
• Angel of Serenity
  
• Archon of Justice
  
• Mangara of Corondor (if you're using Corpse Dance to give her haste for her ability)
  
• Fiend Hunter
  
• Ashen Rider

Creatures with ETB effects or death triggers are the key to closing games with the the deck. It's mostly a reanimator combo deck, so while you don't see the mana-cheap reanimation spells like Reaninmate or Animate Dead here, there's a lot of effects for incremental value from reanimating things until such a point that you can combo out somehow. There are tons of possible interactions but most of them are posted in the main post after the primary deck list The above I would say is the core, with how much or what types of removal you want to play being up to you. I like to run a lot of removal to be able to always have an answer to everyone's plays or problematic board states. Some people run less and one or two different sweepers or a single target removal spells. The deck I talk about here is about winning a game of attrition and being able to bounce back.

If you're new to EDH you'll learn over time that politics are paramount in multiplayer, which is also why I don't run early, aggressive reanimation cards. It's in large part a combo deck and takes a bit to assemble the pieces for a triangle choke; but, you also don't want to risk combo pieces being exiled because casting Reanimate on Kokusho, the Evening Star on Turn 3 sounded fun and someone had a Swords to Plowshares or other removal waiting. He's better when you have a sac outlet and Vizkopa Guildmage to abuse his life loss/gain death trigger than by himself as an attacker, and that goes for many of the card choices. I go over a lot of this in the main post, though

OH and lastly, what do you all think about Dawn of the Dead? Seems like an easy way to get a creature back each turn. If we sac the creature again it won´t be exiled and can return next turn aswell.

For the most part, I like to leave my creatures in the graveyard until I can use them as a combo piece or get a good effect out of them. They're more likely to get exiled or stolen while on the battlefield than in the graveyard. For that reason I haven't ever paid much attention to Dawn of the Dead and there's a lot better effects for getting creatures back permanently, too. At one point I ran Debtors' Knell which is similar but quite a bit better! It's a great card but I ended up removing it for another card at one point because sometimes it was just a dead card without any really interesting targets and I like to make big plays But overall it was a very slow card. I think I replaced it with Sepulchral Primordial which with some of the Triangle Choke cards can grab multiple creatures from opponents graveyard and act as a pseudo-finisher.

Youtube -> Command zone Ayli
If you like the lifegain approah. Links are not working....

Ayli is a fun and powerful Orzhov commander. Imho the best, but Im not into inf. combos so Teysa v.1 is a no go.

Just to Post A Slight Update:

Before I dive into replying: Ixalan sure looks... interesting. I'm excited for some wider accessibility from Iconic Masters, but not too impressed by any offerings in Ixalan so far. Apologies to everyone for not being around as of late! I've been doing other projects such as Inalla, Archmage Ritualist and updating a lot of my decks since Ayli is about at the pinnacle of where I want her to be right now. I'd still like to do some videos in the future of Ayli in action. For now I'll be coming back and doing a review of Ixalan later today!

On to the Replies!:

Quote from tarotplz »

Thank you so much for the detailed answer!

I really look forward to playing EDH and Ayli looks to be a promising general

Glad I could help! Please drop by with any concerns or questions as you play the deck! The 2nd post has suggestions for different ways to take the deck outside of the core cards, a budget build (needs some slight updating but mostly still relevant!) and other options to consider Depending on how you build, remember that politics are super important! Try not to play stuff like Ashnod's Altar until you have something really cool (and dangerous) to do with it!

Quote from SlaveToPhage »

Youtube -> Command zone Ayli
If you like the lifegain approah. Links are not working....

Ayli is a fun and powerful Orzhov commander. Imho the best, but Im not into inf. combos so Teysa v.1 is a no go.

I really like the Command Zone and Game Knights but their decks can be pretty hit or miss. Josh Lee Kwai's Hapatra, Vizier of Poisons build was where I started with mine but it certainly needed a lot of tweaking to run smoothly. But in general I really dislike lifegain decks because they seldom go anywhere and they're very, very obvious. You have the usual very slow, high cost Sanguine Bond + Exquisite Blood, Felidar Sovereign and Test of Endurance wincons but overall lifegain decks are extremely fragile and tend to meander without doing much to progress the game. That's my experience, anyway.

Ixalan Set Review

words

White

Ashes of the Abhorrent - If you're in a heavy storm combo meta, this could be an answer and piece of graveyard hate that doesn't necessarily hose you or your ability to steal cards from their graveyard. It effects Reassembling Skeleton and if you run Unburial Rites then it effects that. Bloodghast is a triggered ability, if you run that, and thus isn't effected by it. Meta call, only!

Axis of Mortality - A cute card I won't be slotting in, but which has some fun interactions with Vizkopa Guildmage, because when your life total changes, you gain whatever amount of life is required for you to reach your new life total. In a build where you're paying a lot of life for various effects, this can be a way to reclaim your life, or an interesting political tool! I don't think it's for Ayli, but it's still a fun effect.

Bishop of Rebirth - Sadly only a worse Sun Titan! It only triggers when it attacks and only targets creatures and costs only 1 less.

Kinjalli's Sunwing - If you're looking to play a Death & Taxes, stax or pillowfort package, it might be tempting to play this guy. Blind Obedience is certainly better, and Thalia, Heretic Cathar is probably better in EDH/Commander because so many lands are non-basics. If you play in an aggro meta it could be something to add for pillowfort builds for consistency, but probably not. Definitely not for the main build!

Paladin of the Bloodstained - Only useful semi-useful for a Tokens build, but a great option for budget lists if you can afford Nim Deathmantle and Ashnod's Altar. You can generate infinite mana that way or infinite triggers with Blood Artist and Zulaport Cutthroat.

Sanguine Sacrament - Not of interest to the main build, and still questionable for a life gain package. You can gain 10 life for 4WW, or double your life total instead for 5W with Beacon of Immortality. I'm always weary of life gain builds. If you're looking for ways to consistently keep gaining life, this could be for you. Your mileage may vary.

Settle the Wreckage - I really dislike the idea of ramping an opponent's land count by 3-4 or more to play this. It could be a cute trick in a Token build when attacking with your own tokens to ramp youself, but as a Token build your tokens are generally kept for combos or combo synergy rather than combat, and that also means it's a dead card most of the time. Way too situational and advantageous for opponents.

Wakening Sun's Avatar - The "if you cast from hand" requirement really kills this card for us, but even if that weren't a thing, there are far better options than this for board wipes attached to creatures.

Black

Bloodcrazed Paladin - Most builds do not want to go into combat, so this guy is pretty irrelevant to what the deck wants to do. With the loops and mass removal he can certainly be pretty big when he enters the battlefield. At best he might be worthy of an Equipment Package build to stick some Swords on to attack, but generally not worth it as a combat-oriented creature.

Boneyard Parley - #1) Giving your opponents choices is always bad; #2.) For two more mana you could just play Rise of the Dark Realms. It could be an OK finisher in a Budget build as it costs one more than Sepulchral Primordial but lets you choose multiple cards from the same graveyard. However, you can keep sacrificing and reanimating Sepulchral Primordial. Definitely not worth playing in the main build, which can take every creature from opponent's graveyards with Puppeteer Clique combos.

Dire Fleet Ravager - One of the cards with the most potential for the main build from Ixalan. Having a partial Pox effect on a creature that doesn't require you to cast it from your hand to get the effect is pretty scary. This could be the key to finishing the game when you have Kokusho, the Evening Star on the battlefield and reanimator effects but no Vizkopa Guildmage. It gets opponents that much closer into range of killing them with Exsanguinate, and you could Corpse Dance or Necromancy him onto the battlefield in response to opponents playing mass damage spells. He's pretty nasty and has some potential.

Revel in Riches - With all the board wipes and removal available, this can trigger several times in the turn on or after it enters the battlefield. It may be too situational because it requires opponents to be playing creatures for you to remove, and it has to survive three rounds of turns for you to win with it on your upkeep. It's a cute and fun alternate win condition that can let you ramp out incredibly crazy after a board wipe, but probably not consistent enough for the main build.

Vraska's Contempt - For four mana you can exile any non-land permanent with Utter End, instead. Or Anguished Unmaking for 3 mana. This is pretty weak for Orzhov because of all the better options, and I would not play it except in Mono-B decks.

Multicolor

Vona, Butcher of Magan - Nope. He makes an OK blocker, but in most cases you can just remove the attacking creature. 7 life for a Vindicate is not great, at all. He isn't a sac outlet, and for 5 mana just doesn't do enough for Ayli. I wouldn't even consider him as a Commander for his own deck, to be honest.

Artifact

No cards of interest

Final Thoughts

Truthfully, Ixalan offers very little to Ayli. It was exciting being that Orzhov is the main focus of one of the tribes so I was pretty hopeful for some great new cards to check out. Sadly, there's very few ETB or death trigger effects worth considering. There is Dire Fleet Ravager to consider, but I don't see anything I'd take out to play him. His effect isn't exactly one we're in need of. The other cards mentioned may be worth it in alternate builds or packages, but most are subpar. I wish I had more positive to say about the set! It looks like lots of fun for other Commanders and Standard, but not so much for Ayli.

Quote from Dedalus »

Hi there

Thank you for your wonderful Primer!

After I played a few rounds I tweaked it a bit to my needs.
Scrubland, Caves of Koilos for fixing and Orzhov Basilica for fixing and advantage.
I hope that we soon see Orzhov Cycling, Battle and Reveal lands. If so, more fetchlands are going in as well.
Mimic Vat is of course on my list


Boseiju, Who Shelters All My meta isn't very blue (in case of countermagic). Therefore is a land that comes tapped into play, produces colorless and costs 2 life not worth it (for me!)
You play a Strip mine but no Wasteland or Tectonic Edge?


Will somehow put Westvale Abbey in it, although there maybe arent enough creatures to sac into it.
Will test out Thaumatic Compass as well, because a) takes care of our coulored mana (altough its expensive) and b) another Maze of Ith

Yawgmoth's Will --> never played it outside of storm in commander before. I dont like the exile
Also don't like an Ugin, the Spirit Dragon in this deck. How frequently do you use the second ability ?


What do you think about Tragic Slip and Phyrexian Reclamation?
and
How does your newest decklist looks like (after testing Custodi Lich and Vindictive Lich and Razaketh, the Foulblooded?

Greetings

Hi there, thanks for stopping by!

Scrubland is definitely an auto-include if you have it I have yet to pick one up myself. I've tried to avoid lands that come into play tapped unless necessary or there's lacking a better option. The deck is very color mana hungry when combo engines come online and with Vindicate and being able to get it back to cast again a few different ways, I've never felt the need for Wasteland or Tectonic Edge. It may be a meta call, as well, but there's generally never been more targeted LD needed than the Strip Mine that can hit any land or a Vindicate, or even triggers from Ashen Rider and Archon of Justice.

Boseiju, Who Shelters All is definitely also a meta call. The primary build is made for walking in blind and not knowing what to expect. I actually don't run Cavern of Souls anymore either, as I had other decks that could make much better use of it and most creatures enter the battlefield from reanimation effects, anyway. It's still nice to have for naming Humans or Spirits in a blue-heavy meta, though, as those are probably the two most importan types to cast if it comes to that.

Westvale Abbey is one that I tried after it came out and ended up taking out. Usually by the time I have enough creatures to sacrifice to flip it, I'm already about to win the game in some other way. With how the deck revolves around abusing reanimation effects on creatures in the graveyard, there's never too many creatures around at any one time between sacrificing them to bring back for ETB/Death Triggers or to protect them from Exile effects. I like it but feel like it's kind of a "win more" card outside of a deck that makes a lot of tokens to take advantage of it easily.

I haven't tested Thaumatic Compass because the deck doesn't run that many basic lands and it feels like Weathered Wayfarer, Wayfarer's Bauble and Expedition Map are more than enough, in addition to the deck's mana rocks.

Yawgmoth's Will is amazing and a game changer, in my experience. It has turned around late games many times for me, being able to re-cast board wipes and removal spells, Artifact combo pieces, etc. There's very few ways to get Artifacts back on the battlefield, and only Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed to get Instants and Sorceries back from the graveyard. Yawgmoth's Will allows both of those very easily and is a late game card where if you're playing it, you shouldn't be worried about a board wipe or Instant or Sorcery being exiled because you're probably about to win. The exile clause isn't as bad as it sounds at all.

I've never been much of a fan of Tragic Slip because without Morbid is pretty terrible and there's so many better options. I'd even go as far as to play Path to Exile before it because in the late game most EDH players have so much mana that giving them another basic land isn't going to hurt.

Phyrexian Reclamation is a great card, and if I were in a meta with a ton of graveyard hate I would consider playing it, but otherwise the deck isn't looking to cast a ton of creatures from the hand to really warrant a slot for it, at least in my experience.

I currently don't play Ugin, the Spirit Dragon because I believe I took him out for Razaketh, the Foulblooded; but when I did have him in, he was absolutely amazing. I almost always played him for his 2nd ability to get rid of problematic permanents, sacrificing anything important on my side of the board so it didn't get exiled while other people's stuff did. Using Ugin's 1st ability after that was always icing on the cake because it reaches so much stuff to help keep the board clear as opponents tried to recover, and that late in the game using his ultimate tended to be really valuable. I may yet put him back in the deck because I rarely found a situation where I didn't want to play him.

I've been very impressed with Razaketh, the Foulblooded in the deck. Being able to drop him and basically tutor up any combo pieces I need to finish the game has been pretty amazing. Even if he gets targetd for removal, activating him a couple times in response so that it doesn't particularly matter if he dies or not is fantastic. I've never been all that interested in Custodi Lich because it just doesn't do enough to try to test it out. The Monarch isn't that valuable to the deck with all the card advantage and draw already in the list and I don't particularly want people gunning for me to get the Monarch. Vindictive Lich on the other hand is a card I haven't gotten around to trying to make room for yet but would like to.

There haven't been much in the way of cards this year that I've felt obligated to add to Ayli beyond Razaketh and Approach of the Second Sun, which I've also taken out because it's a cute card but wants to be backed up by counterspells or some control spells to ensure it goes off. Revel in Riches is somewhat tempting because it's really easy to get Treasure off of it's trigger and eventually win if it sticks around. I'm currently testing Dire Fleet Ravager and leaning towards axing it because I'm finding myself seldom in a situation where cutting the table's life by thirds is helpful, which is what I suspected the case would be.

Anyway, thanks for stopping by! Hopefully Rivals of Ixalan and Dominaria have some interesting cards I'll be updating the main post here soon to reflect what I'm currently running. There are very little changes to the current list here, other than making room for Razaketh, (took out Ugin) and bringing back Austere Command (took out Approach of the Second Sun).

I recently cut both Vindictive Lich and Custodi Lich. They were not absolutely required.
I tried running a list without Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed, but that proved a mistake. There's just no other reliable way of recurring black instants and sorceries. So he's back.

Also: if you have Entomb and some reanimation available T2: what do you usually bin? Razaketh, Ashen Rider, or (what I usually fo for) Sheolly?

Hi, great primer! I just started playing her and she is amazing. I tested out the idea of corpse dance but often find the need to hold up Mana and care about my graveyard order very taxing...just wanna hear your argument for and against it and maybe convince me to give it another chance? Just wondering if I'm playing corpse dance wrong in general. What are your thoughts on Chainer and eldrazi displacer? I'm testing them out ATM. I wrote a mini primer to remind me of the synergies and inclusions I made. Feel free to check out my list and feedback/critique would be appreciated
: http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/your-pain-is-my-gain-2/

Apologies for getting around to replying rather late! Holidays and all that jazz, y'know? Anyway, let me get down to business!

Quote from Frozocrone »

Thank you very much for this guide - I originally started my EDH experiences with Ayli and on suggestion of friends, tried to build a life gain deck but it wasn't going as planned with long, drawn out games with a mentality to 'not lose' rather than win.

Building around a sacrifice theme has completely changed how my play group sees Orzhov, no longer is it the annoying Karlov kife gain deck!

Have you considered other utility creatures? I find my meta has a lot of Enchantments, so War Priest of Thune usually makes its way into my hand early on, just to get rid of problem cards (and being a 2/2 for 2 mana means it's easy to cast or animate from various cards.

I'm also tempted to get a hold of Bontu the Glorified. 3 mana for an indestructible sac outlet seems really good, not to mention scrying to fix draws or get to combo pieces faster. Two mana for each sacrifice does seem quite steep though. Speaking of indestructible sac outlets, Yahenni, Undying Partisan could be interesting, particularly after a board wipe.

Also, what number of Equipments would make Stoneforge Mystic an optimal inclusion. I'm somewhat interested in Viridian Longbow or Thornbite Staff, just to equip onto Ayli and play politics with people by removing big threats and build (temporary) alliances. Thornbite, I think could be used in a Ashnod's Altar. Priest of Gix and Nim Deathmantle to win games too (not to attach onto the infinite Priest but another creature already in play, since Thornbite would untap each time Priest hits the graveyard.

You're quite welcome! Thanks for stopping by!

What you pack in your utility toolkit can entirely be a meta call. My main list here packs so much targeted Permanent removal that I seldom find myself in need of switching it up much. Usually I can pick off troublesome Enchantments with Vindicate, Anguished Unmaking or Utter End; or just target them when sacrificing Archon of Justice a number of other creatures with utility. Most Enchantments aren't too bothersome because a lot are based on trying to deter you from attacking their controller, so I find myself just holding removal to my chest in case of combo pieces or massive enablers and disruption like Doubling Season, Mind Over Matter or Possibility Storm.

If you play with a meta regularly you can usually learn to spot which cards you can just let slide and opponents deal with, and which ones you need to take out ASAP For example, Ghostly Prison, Cathar's Crusade or No Mercy doesn't really bother me as we're not a Combat damage oriented deck. Cathar's Crusade can get out of control fast, but with Knight-Captain of Eos and plentiful board wipes, it can be rendered ineffective, at least towards us. Lurking Predators, Survival of the Fittest, or Aggravated Assault however are dangerous enablers for combos, etc. Most early game Enchantments aren't that big of a deal unless you're in a really cutthroat meta.

I did talk a bit about Bontu the Glorified when Amonkhet came out. I've passed on her because even though she's an Indestructible sac outlet, she's still a creature and exile effects like Swords to Plowshares are very common. In this list itself, I've picked Exile effects over flat out destruction effects where possible because it saves me the trouble of things coming back to haunt me later if I put them in an opponent's graveyard instead. EDH is in a very removal/denial sort of overarching state right now, too. But ultimately as you said, 2 mana is very steep for a sac outlet. Most of our sac outlets are to enable combos and need to have free activation costs to make a net gain of mana and sometimes require a little mana to get going to begin with.

If I didn't have a mana creation loop and wanted to sacrifice a creature and reanimate it a bunch of times with Corpse Dance, for example, having to pay 2 mana on top of the 5 mana to cast + buyback Corpse Dance is definitely not where I want to be! I really wanted to like Bontu, but she's sadly just too mana intensive. Yahenni, Undying Partisan on is a great sac outlet, however! I haven't tested them because it isn't a very combat oriented deck and the only thing I could see replacing for them is Spawning Pit being one of the permanent, free activation sac outlets. However, spot Creature exile effects are far more common than Artifacts, and I like that Spawning Pit can come out of nowhere with 2/2 Sac Fodders and suddenly create a lot of fuel that no one is usually paying attention to

As for an Equipment package, ideally you'll have a lot of support for it in addition to really good Equipment worth running. This in itself makes you want to focus on combat because your best Equipment such as Batterskull, Sword of Feast and Famine or Sword of Fire and Ice, Loxodon Warhammer, Quietus Spike and others want you to deal combat damage. You'd be looking at Stonehewer Giant, Open the Vaults, Open the Armory, Stoneforge Mystic, Steelshaper's Gift, Sigarda's Aid and among other things. This is where Yahenni could really shine and you may want to bring in effects like Grave Pact or Dictate of Erebos and Dauthi Embrace to help clear the way.

Quote from Jonas Ukulore »

I recently cut both Vindictive Lich and Custodi Lich. They were not absolutely required.
I tried running a list without Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed, but that proved a mistake. There's just no other reliable way of recurring black instants and sorceries. So he's back.

Also: if you have Entomb and some reanimation available T2: what do you usually bin? Razaketh, Ashen Rider, or (what I usually fo for) Sheolly?

Personally, Custodi Lich has never up for much consideration because with all the draw power and tutor effects in the deck, using a slot on such a lackluster ETB trigger seems wasteful to me. I can see myself with it in my hand or graveyard and there being any number of things I'd rather reanimate or bring back than Custodi Lich, making it a pretty dead card. As for Vindictive Lich, I've come to see it as a "Win More" card in the deck. There's plenty of ways to disrupt board states and finish the game, so the discard effect and sac effect is pretty unnecessary.

I haven't ended up adding Vindictive Lich to the main for the same reasons that I haven't added Torment of Hailfire - it tries to do a lot of things, when we can just Exsanguinate and end the game since by the time we can abuse it, we should be in a position to kill the table in a multitude of other ways. Going back to the comparison to Torment of Hailfire, it is particularly bad since it gives opponents choices and they can easily negate taking life loss that late in the game with so many permanents on the board. Somewhat similarly with Vindictive Lich, there's a lot of times we don't want a creature's death trigger to go off by an opponent's choice or help an opponent or help them put things in their graveyard they may want there, and he has to make players do those things.

Reanimating On Turn 2: Honestly, this is something I basically never do because I don't like the attention and it's bad EDH politics. It's a very aggressive move for a deck that plays rather defensively. If I were going to bin something, it would probably be Rune-scarred Demon, Knight-Captain of Eos, Wurmcoil Engine or Weathered Wayfarer. On Turn 2 most people don't have much to target on the board with Ashen Rider other than lands or maybe a mana rock. If they seriously ramped out into a Sol Ring into a Grim Monolith or Mana Crypt or something then I might consider it because they need to be slowed. But, other than that, if having a huge Flying beater on the board on Turn 2 isn't negative attention, blowing up lands will get you ejected from the game first.

Razaketh, the Foulblooded would have basically no sac fodder that early in the game to make him too useful, which is why Rune-scarred Demon would be the better T2 reanimator target for tutoring, although I'd prefer to wait until later in the game to use him, as well. Sheoldred, Whispering One wouldn't be doing too much as she wouldn't have much to reanimate - if anything at all - and while she might be putting a choke on opponents playing creatures, it's just asking to be Public Enemy #1 and opponents to focus you the rest of the game. The deck can handle being focused, but only after time to set up for it. I like following up a board wipe in the mid to late game with her when I'm getting more value out of her triggered abilities. The ones I listed above though may have utility depending on the situation, though.

Against heavy token or aggro decks such as Krenko or Ezuri Elfball it'd be great to have out Knight-Captain of Eos or possibly Wurmcoil Engine to deter attackers. I love saving opponents with Knight-Captain's ability to gain political points and get some heat off of me while they turn their attention to whoever tried to kill them. You could possibly get False Prophet as a bargaining chip but only being a 2/2, it's easy to remove him and no one is going to play much while he's on the board so they'll just try to remove him first then play out their hands. Weathered Wayfarer is an all-star Turn 1 or 2 play, however, because our utility lands are so important in helping us shore up our defenses until the mid to late game when we start to shine He's small and unthreatening, but finding Volrath's Stronghold, Maze of Ith, Phyrexian Tower, Mistveil Plains and the others early on makes it so hard for opponents to keep you down.

Quote from Enral »

Hi, great primer! I just started playing her and she is amazing. I tested out the idea of corpse dance but often find the need to hold up Mana and care about my graveyard order very taxing...just wanna hear your argument for and against it and maybe convince me to give it another chance? Just wondering if I'm playing corpse dance wrong in general. What are your thoughts on Chainer and eldrazi displacer? I'm testing them out ATM. I wrote a mini primer to remind me of the synergies and inclusions I made. Feel free to check out my list and feedback/critique would be appreciated
: http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/your-pain-is-my-gain-2/

Hi there! Thanks for the kind words - I'm glad you're enjoying Ayli!

Corpse Dance is a mid to late game card that can quite literally help finish a game or kill opponents, because with effects like Ashnod's Altar it's really easy to effectively make Corpse Dance cost 2B to cast + buyback rather than 4B. When you do this with cards like Ashen Rider, Kokusho, the Evening Star, Yosei, the Morning Star you're able to take out many threats, drain the table for a ton of life and possibly kill people, or lock them out of the game There's many ETB or death triggers with Ashnod's Altar that let you make a huge play with Corpse Dance.

You don't have to worry too much about the order of your graveyard when you're sacrificing something and putting it into your graveyard so it's right on top. It takes some set up, but usually I find it naturally happens with the lines of play I'm looking to employ in the late game where it really shines. Also, it's one of very few Instant-speed reanimation spells! It can also sometimes be the difference between an opponent getting a combo off and winning the game or stopping them dead cold. I can't tell you how many times I've Corpse Danced Mangara of Corondor, Ashen Rider, Archon of Justice, Fiend Hunter or Angel of Serenity from the graveyard at Instant speed in response to something hitting the board that HAD to go, RIGHT then, then sacrificing them to permanently exile that target. And possibly a few more.

As for Chainer, Dementia Master and Eldrazi Displacer:

Where Corpse Dance is expensive, Chainer is a bit fragile and lacking protection, and may exile your toys when he goes bye-bye. The triple black mana is a bit steep, because our best mana production is Ashnod's Altar, which produces colorless. He really plays best in a mono-black deck that can abuse him with Cabal Coffers + Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth, which I personally don't feel is very good outside of Mono-Black decks due to the high chance of Cabal Coffers being a dead land or draw until you find Urborg or have a lot of Swamps, which this deck doesn't particularly have because it packs a lot of utility lands. There's enough sac outlets available to sacrifice creatures to in response to Chainer being targeted with removal so they don't die, but generally he's sadly just too costly requiring BBB for each activation.

Eldrazi Displacer is a creature I tested for a bit, but also found too mana intensive. It specifically needs colorless mana to activate, which can be a big downside to playing it. Several utility lands produce colorless mana, but therein lies a conundrum: tapping those utility lands for colorless mana means making their actual utility and purpose in the deck inaccessible. There's enough ways to reanimate creatures to get those ETB effects that I felt it was better replaced with another ETB effect or death trigger. Speaking of Death Triggers, that's also somewhat of a downside, in that it doesn't help you get those death triggers, which are also important to the deck. It's not an awful card, and I'd play it before Chainer, but the Colorless mana requirement really dampens being able to make great use of it.

I hope this was helpful!

Wanted to make a separate post so it didn't get lost in my responses above to let y'all know that I made significant progress on a big update to the main post and I'm hoping to have it up tomorrow! I know I had kept talking about it for a while, but life and other distractions had a habit of popping up. I'm going to be considering the best outlet for making videos of the deck since that is still something I'd love to do for everyone interested in playing a similar build of Ayli! Hope everyone is having happy holidays! I'll be checking in regularly, once again!

Hey everyone!

The long awaited massive update to the original post is now up! I've completely reformatted it and given some more love to several sections, added several graphics with explanations of various combos and synergies, and at last! No more random broken quote boxes!

The Addendum section regarding various packages and budgets will be back later and I have gone back to simply having the thread's second post reserved. Several of those sections need major overhauls or need fleshed out. Until then, enjoy the focus on the primary list!

Quote from Kelzam »

Quote from Jonas Ukulore »

I recently cut both Vindictive Lich and Custodi Lich. They were not absolutely required.
I tried running a list without Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed, but that proved a mistake. There's just no other reliable way of recurring black instants and sorceries. So he's back.

Also: if you have Entomb and some reanimation available T2: what do you usually bin? Razaketh, Ashen Rider, or (what I usually fo for) Sheolly?

Reanimating On Turn 2: Honestly, this is something I basically never do because I don't like the attention and it's bad EDH politics. It's a very aggressive move for a deck that plays rather defensively. If I were going to bin something, it would probably be Rune-scarred Demon, Knight-Captain of Eos, Wurmcoil Engine or Weathered Wayfarer. On Turn 2 most people don't have much to target on the board with Ashen Rider other than lands or maybe a mana rock. If they seriously ramped out into a Sol Ring into a Grim Monolith or Mana Crypt or something then I might consider it because they need to be slowed. But, other than that, if having a huge Flying beater on the board on Turn 2 isn't negative attention, blowing up lands will get you ejected from the game first.

Razaketh, the Foulblooded would have basically no sac fodder that early in the game to make him too useful, which is why Rune-scarred Demon would be the better T2 reanimator target for tutoring, although I'd prefer to wait until later in the game to use him, as well. Sheoldred, Whispering One wouldn't be doing too much as she wouldn't have much to reanimate - if anything at all - and while she might be putting a choke on opponents playing creatures, it's just asking to be Public Enemy #1 and opponents to focus you the rest of the game. The deck can handle being focused, but only after time to set up for it. I like following up a board wipe in the mid to late game with her when I'm getting more value out of her triggered abilities. The ones I listed above though may have utility depending on the situation, though.

Against heavy token or aggro decks such as Krenko or Ezuri Elfball it'd be great to have out Knight-Captain of Eos or possibly Wurmcoil Engine to deter attackers. I love saving opponents with Knight-Captain's ability to gain political points and get some heat off of me while they turn their attention to whoever tried to kill them. You could possibly get False Prophet as a bargaining chip but only being a 2/2, it's easy to remove him and no one is going to play much while he's on the board so they'll just try to remove him first then play out their hands. Weathered Wayfarer is an all-star Turn 1 or 2 play, however, because our utility lands are so important in helping us shore up our defenses until the mid to late game when we start to shine He's small and unthreatening, but finding Volrath's Stronghold, Maze of Ith, Phyrexian Tower, Mistveil Plains and the others early on makes it so hard for opponents to keep you down.

And this is why I visit this thread. Not: this card good, this card bad. But: consider your playstyle, how to make correct threat assessments, and not to paint yourself a target.
Thank You.

Quote from Frozocrone »

Sheoldred wasn't cutting it for me, I've got a pretty competitive meta and she was always a turn too slow so she's gone from my deck. Same with Yosei and Kukushko, love the cards but they just paint a massive target on my head when I played them.

Leonin Relic-Warder however, I've found is amazing. It creates an infinite ETB/LTB with Necromancy, Animate Dead or just about any Enchantment that brings stuff back and utilising the stack can exhile opponent artifacts and enchantments permanently. Nothing too bad to warrant attention, but just enough to remove threats and set up combos.

A few of my tech cards are Silence, Grand Abolisher, Aven Mindcensor and Angel's Grace. Not necessarily to help my strategies, but rather to protect them(or buy me time in the case of the latter two).

Sheoldred, Whispering One hasn't ever been a card that doesn't have a big effect when she's on the table or that forces opponents to use a removal spell on, and that's part of why I love her. If she sticks for a full cycle on a board without a board wipe, she takes out four creatures before she turns around and reanimates something on your own turn. In the mid and late game she is amazing value, so it's unfortunate you weren't able to see her power play out. I do have to entirely disagree with Yosei, the Morning Star and Kokusho, the Evening Star being too slow. They are win conditions in themselves and shouldn't be played willy-nilly. It's something I go over at length in the first post: Don't play out obvious combo pieces until you're in position to win with them or shut down players who are problematic for your plans. Some of the cards you mention later in the post are cards that exist outside of the web that makes this build so resilient. They aren't necessarily bad cards, but personally as I play Ayli I don't have much problem or need for those effects and don't really know of anything I'd take out for them. Compared to Yosei or Kokusho, they're either very situational or don't progress towards winning the game.

Leonin Relic-Warder could be a worthy addition, as it works much like Fiend Hunter and the combo you mentioned with Necromancy is a thing. I may look to see if I feel he could replace to test him out, though with all the targeted exile and destruction effects in the deck, I'm not sure if he's really necessary.

Added the Leonin. Also added (for a short while): Naughty // Nice :-D Happy 2018 fellow Orzhovians!

Update: I now understand how to make a table kill with Leonin Relic-Warder, Animate Dead and Blasting Station (or Blood Artist) Another combo that makes Ayli so lethal