Very cool decks guys. I have been playing my Meren Commander deck for a few months now and always find myself testing and switching things out. Here is the current version I have for it now let me know what you think.
I haven't tried it, but it's hard for me to imagine Melira being that great. Obviously the interaction with persist is valuable, but there are two problems: 1) The only persist creatures that are any good in this color combination (Puppeteer Clique and Woodfall Primus) are very likely to already be in the deck, so there's nothing really to add, and 2) Melira is not a good card by herself. She's just a Grizzly Bear unless you have persist creatures on the battlefield with her.
Mikaeus, the Unhallowed is an excellent inclusion because it does so much stuff: it beats (with evasion), it pumps basically everything in our deck and has the chance to kill our opponents' creatures when they attack, or at least make attacking difficult. I don't want to say that the interaction with persist PLUS the fact that it gives basically your whole team undying is icing on the cake or anything, but it at least does something even if its your only creature on the battlefield. The cards are just incomparable.
That being said, if anyone has had success with Melira in this deck I'd be eager to hear how they made it work!
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Playing with proxied cards at sanctioned events is good, actually.
I haven't tried it, but it's hard for me to imagine Melira being that great. Obviously the interaction with persist is valuable, but there are two problems: 1) The only persist creatures that are any good in this color combination (Puppeteer Clique and Woodfall Primus) are very likely to already be in the deck, so there's nothing really to add, and 2) Melira is not a good card by herself. She's just a Grizzly Bear unless you have persist creatures on the battlefield with her.
Mikaeus, the Unhallowed is an excellent inclusion because it does so much stuff: it beats (with evasion), it pumps basically everything in our deck and has the chance to kill our opponents' creatures when they attack, or at least make attacking difficult. I don't want to say that the interaction with persist PLUS the fact that it gives basically your whole team undying is icing on the cake or anything, but it at least does something even if its your only creature on the battlefield. The cards are just incomparable.
That being said, if anyone has had success with Melira in this deck I'd be eager to hear how they made it work!
This. There is really no alternative to what Mike does in the deck, and his interactions with cards shouldnt be limited to just the fun you can have with Persist creatures. That's double the ETB/LTB triggers. Swinging with wild abandon becomes a valid strategy. He helps you recover from board wipes very easily. With Grave Pact, it's extremely unsymmetrical suddenly for you, as you sac a creature, it comes back, triggers its ability, then grave pact triggers!
Heya, I've been toying with a Meren deck myself, and I'm wondering why you've included Bitterblossom here? It seems like it'd be more at home in a Mazirek deck where something like Seed Guardian would make some more sense here.
One general think I've been noticing is that while Meren makes for a nice reanimator commander I find that since I'm playing without a theme I'd rather move in on a commander that is more specific and put her into the main deck. I just can't help but want to argue with myself that Jarad is a better sac-to-kill commander (with a potential voltron finish) or Mazirek is a better tokens swarm commander (with another potential to voltron people out). Running these two in the main deck here splits this deck in two directions, but looking at your list it just feels like she's already branching out that way.
Don't get me wrong, she's the better reanimator commander, but if that's all we're going for then I'd be inclined to cut cards like Bitterblossom for more reanimator cards.
Heya, I've been toying with a Meren deck myself, and I'm wondering why you've included Bitterblossom here? It seems like it'd be more at home in a Mazirek deck where something like Seed Guardian would make some more sense here.
One general think I've been noticing is that while Meren makes for a nice reanimator commander I find that since I'm playing without a theme I'd rather move in on a commander that is more specific and put her into the main deck. I just can't help but want to argue with myself that Jarad is a better sac-to-kill commander (with a potential voltron finish) or Mazirek is a better tokens swarm commander (with another potential to voltron people out). Running these two in the main deck here splits this deck in two directions, but looking at your list it just feels like she's already branching out that way.
Don't get me wrong, she's the better reanimator commander, but if that's all we're going for then I'd be inclined to cut cards like Bitterblossom for more reanimator cards.
Thanks for the input!
Seed guardian is terrible. He's basically a vanilla 3/4 that dies and makes another vanilla beater. It doesn't really do much for the deck overall. Have you looked at the lists? Most of us use effects like Grave Pact to clear the field and provide oodles of triggers. Those faerie tokens can block opposing fliers, pick away at planeswalkers, Ashnod's Altar fodder so the commander tax never bothers you, Contamination fodder, and best of all, can be used for GP effects. I love the card, and all of the efficient token generators in the deck.
No one is arguing if Mazzy is better at tokens. But really consider what it brings to the table. Could it be cut someday? Perhaps. I can totally see cutting it in favor or better stax effects, enablers, etc. I just like that Meren runs all of these strategies well, stax, reanimator, ramp, etc. I dont think Mazzy or Jarad being objectively "better" at a theme makes this style of Meren all over the place or necessarily weaker. My question to you is, why do you think Meren would want generic beaters that promote overextending into the graveyard? Why not run the best of everything in a synergistic mess that provides oodles of value, like we are doing? It works amazingly for me and my meta is 75%+, and it can hold a 4-6 person table by itself! It's fun as heck too! Meren can have many themes depending on the build, and I think that is what makes her a well designed commander. She isnt niche like Nekusar or Mazzy who do one thing, and it's highly telegraphed.
Not to say that Meren doesnt telegraph; she telegraphs that you wanna reanimate things, but typically people are finding out that just dumping garbage into the yard isnt too amazing. The fact that she triggers end of turn means you can control what comes back usually before grave hate can hit you, or you can more easily play around it. She's incredibly powerful. I recommend giving her a whirl if Jarad gets a bit boring (I love how Jarad plays as well, and it's definitely similar but Meren is different and fun enough to make her worth consideration!)
Heya, I've been toying with a Meren deck myself, and I'm wondering why you've included Bitterblossom here? It seems like it'd be more at home in a Mazirek deck where something like Seed Guardian would make some more sense here.
Seed Guardian is two mana more, and because I have to loop it with, say Meren, for example to get a similar effect to Bitterblossom, I am loosing out on using a different card. Bitterblossom provides a lot of value beyond just spitting out dudes. Admittedly, it's also a bit of a pet card of mine, but I went the rounds with ISBPathfinder and Wildfire393 when I included it in my Balthor the Defiled deck as well, and am keeping it for similar reasons.
One general think I've been noticing is that while Meren makes for a nice reanimator commander I find that since I'm playing without a theme I'd rather move in on a commander that is more specific and put her into the main deck. I just can't help but want to argue with myself that Jarad is a better sac-to-kill commander (with a potential voltron finish) or Mazirek is a better tokens swarm commander (with another potential to voltron people out). Running these two in the main deck here splits this deck in two directions, but looking at your list it just feels like she's already branching out that way.
Don't get me wrong, she's the better reanimator commander, but if that's all we're going for then I'd be inclined to cut cards like Bitterblossom for more reanimator cards.
This deck isn't strictly a reanimator deck though. Reanimation is certainly a part of what I do, but it fits more in to a value or attrition style of build. Jarad is certainly more swingy, and is a lot better at doing mass drain shenanigans, and Mazirek is better at swarming the board, but my list isn't looking to do either of those things. It's looking to loop smaller creatures for value and go in for the long haul. I'm not necessarily going for an early bomb, and the deck doesn't really support that idea, but rather to use ETB/death triggers on repeat. There are multiple ways to run a reanimation based deck, this one just looks to be more gradual, as I'm limited by experience counters early on as it is.
I love Meren because she fits the style that I was looking for when I worked my way through several graveyard based decks (including Jarad, Karador, and Balthor). She's not as splashy as some of the other options, but she works quite well for my purposes.
Don't think of Bitterblossom as something to generate an army, it's not really quick enough for that anyways. It's a source of bodies to sacrifice to get the effects of cards like Phyrexian Tower, Skullclamp or Smothering Abomination, for example. Sacrificing tokens lets me control what I loop with Meren while still getting effects from those kinds of cards. If I were to replace it, it wouldn't be throwing a bomb in the deck or even another reanimation effect, it would likely be either Sifter of Skulls or From Beyond, both of which cost two more to cast, making them slower despite their tokens sacrificing themselves.
I had him in the side for a while, but most people look unkindly at SB in EDH. Elder was very hit or miss. I prefer creatures to do something immediately, and he required so much setup that by the time he came down, I was already good on lands for the most part, since no one wants to block him, and to cantrip, you need 2 colorless. This deck is mana hungry early on, and I dont wanna durdle too much.
Bane of Progress is an "Oh !#@%" card i can cast or return to play to eat a stax/superfriend/daretti/etc player's board if necessary. This deck deals with creatures well, but it's threats outside of that that we need to deal with. This has the added disadvantage of eating our own artifacts and enchantments, but there are situations where that is beneficial! Worst case just keep looping E Witness with Meren/Clique to grab stuff back afterwards.
Very cool decks guys. I have been playing my Meren Commander deck for a few months now and always find myself testing and switching things out. Here is the current version I have for it now let me know what you think.
I like the list, little different to most I've seen in that you're quite reliant (in terms of Craterhoof Behemoth/Lord of Extinction) of having a lot of creatures in the graveyard and/or on the battlefield? How's that worked for you? I ask as most decks I see (including mine) are focusing more on a value sac lock and control based, rarely having more than a few creatures out and valuing the recursive effects of what's in the graveyard.
Seeing them also in your list has made me realise i really, really need to source a Massacre Wurm and Mindslicer. They're on the list, just can't get them easily.
It just allows me to finish with different board states. With the amount of tutors this deck uses being Green/Black it is easy to grab the right answer. Mikaeus, the Unhallowed + Woodfall Primus and a infinite sac outlet is the classic finisher. Usually this is obtained with using Tooth and Nail or with Victimize. You can up the instant kill power of Tooth and Nail with Triskelion to machine gun the board instantly, but it isn't my style and having a Triskelion in your hand isn't the best where the other two are still great.
The Craterhoof Behemoth would be the card you probably replace with Triskelion but he is one of my favorite cards and is a great reanimation target. If at any point you have a lot of little guys you can just instantly turn them into value and usually kill someone or you played a Avenger of Zendikar or Ghoulcaller Gisa you can Birthing Pod the Avenger to instantly kill the board usually or play Craterhoof sac him then reanimate him again which I have done get the double trample. He has been surprisingly efficient. This deck just needed an extra card to take advantage and giving value to the random garbage minions you have left over sometimes from using Grave Pact or w/e.
If the board was wiped then comes the Lord of Extinction. It isn't hard to get this guy gigantic by even turn 5. If you have a Hermit Druid out or an Alter of Dementia you can make him a 80/80+ in no time especially sacing himself to mill out your most dangerous opponent or just milling random people to protect yourself from grave hate targeted at you. His instant kill combo is with Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord which like all my combo's can be Tooth and nailed out of the deck depending on how the game goes. The biggest upside to Lord of Extinction is he is so versatile with Rogue's Passage, Greater Good, Disciple of Bolas, and Ghoulcaller Gisa he is a kill condition with endless value.
I really like this thread it was very informative and I will be able to create my own Meren deck using the advice that you all gave. I am curious about 1 thing though. How well would Titania work in a deck like this? I saw someone mention it earlier but nobody elaborated on it.
I really like this thread it was very informative and I will be able to create my own Meren deck using the advice that you all gave. I am curious about 1 thing though. How well would Titania work in a deck like this? I saw someone mention it earlier but nobody elaborated on it.
Glad it was helpful!
On Titania, I don't think she's worth it in a deck that isn't focused on lands. You'd have to jump through a lot of hoops to make sure you had consistent access to her second effect, and her first ability is going to be limited in most cases.
Another card I'm considering trying is Null Brooch.Is it too all in?
I think there are better ways to empty you hand into the grave yard, and it's also a bit expensive for the first go (six mana investment). How badly are you looking for a counterspell effect?
Airthne I have been following this thread since you posted it and the info here and provided by the others has been a huge help is making my own Meren deck (my fav of the new commanders by far). I wanted to drop my list here and see what every one thinks and see if any one has any hidden tech for me that I have not thought of yet.
Craterhoof is about to get the axe as is just dead any time I bring it back with Meren. I will say however Spore Frog is an all star in the deck and the mana base is all wacky I need to go back thru it since the mulligan change.
One thing I will say is seeing some of these decks posted the land is way too light. With everyone at least hitting Avenger of Zendikar, and the new mulligan rule that probably will be a good upgrade for you guys. Kind of the common rule is start at 40 lands and subtract one for every 3 ramp/land fixing cards in your deck.
@Azurhawk Harvester is very expensive for his effect. A better way around it might be to grab Grim Haruspex if you still need a draw engine.
@muffins1001 I also wouldn't judge a card as bad if it is killed as soon as it hits the board. That means the card is good actually and you want them to use removal on it. This means other cards will be able to resolve. With Craterhoof Behemoth if it wasn't countered which you can't counter Meren's ability his ability still goes off so it isn't a waste. You still get Overwhelming Stampedeish worth of value and get rid of their target removal.
One thing I will say is seeing some of these decks posted the land is way too light. With everyone at least hitting Avenger of Zendikar, and the new mulligan rule that probably will be a good upgrade for you guys. Kind of the common rule is start at 40 lands and subtract one for every 3 ramp/land fixing cards in your deck.
@Azurhawk Harvester is very expensive for his effect. A better way around it might be to grab Grim Haruspex if you still need a draw engine.
@muffins1001 I also wouldn't judge a card as bad if it is killed as soon as it hits the board. That means the card is good actually and you want them to use removal on it. This means other cards will be able to resolve. With Craterhoof Behemoth if it wasn't countered which you can't counter Meren's ability his ability still goes off so it isn't a waste. You still get Overwhelming Stampedeish worth of value and get rid of their target removal.
Oh yes my lands are all a mess right now it's not up to date with the rule change I think I currently have it at 37-38 ish range. That's the problem I have with Mr. Hoof is that Meren's ability is at the end of turn. So if bring him back with her he does not do anything.
Airthne I have been following this thread since you posted it and the info here and provided by the others has been a huge help is making my own Meren deck (my fav of the new commanders by far). I wanted to drop my list here and see what every one thinks and see if any one has any hidden tech for me that I have not thought of yet.
Craterhoof is about to get the axe as is just dead any time I bring it back with Meren. I will say however Spore Frog is an all star in the deck and the mana base is all wacky I need to go back thru it since the mulligan change.
Generally, things that net you Eldrazi spawn/scions are increadibly valuable in Meren, because they give you mana while ticking up your experience counters. A few more ETB effects would probably be helpful as well, so you're getting maximum value from repeating Meren.
Has anyone strong opinions on Harvester of Souls? I was thinking about cutting him, but didn't draw him often enough yet.
While he's certainly a potent engine, I never found myself in a position where I wanted to tutor for him so far.
I used to like him a lot, but less so now, as they've printed more and more of this effect. 5/5 deathtouch doesn't stack up against the other options so well.
Grim Haruspex, though it only triggers on your own things, (and not tokens) is probably stop #1. Dark Prophecy is obviously more for mono-black due to the cost, but some 2 colors can swing it. It hurts, but also triggers on tokens, giving you more draw options. Fecundity - Green's side of things, it's "symmetrical," but you'll probably be doing more of it. Just pay attention. Triggers on tokens. Deathreap Ritual - only 1 card per turn, but triggers for you on any creature's deaths. Smothering Abomination - If you don't have this guy in, I'd replace harvester with him. He still gives you the draws, is much cheaper, triggers on tokens, and flies.
Of course, this should be on top of Skullclamp, and possibly Evolutionary Leap and Vampiric Rites. Infernal Tribute is interesting as well, very similar to rites, but I've always had issues being unable to sac tokens with it, although saccing enchants or artifacts (or lands) as needed makes up as a perk, sometimes.
@Airithne I will look into getting more ETB effects in there to up the to get more value out of Meren. I am wary of putting back in awakening zone and the new one back into the deck. I had them in there at first but I felt like they did to little most of the time (they are great early plays and help power Meren up but where dead draws is gotten later in the game). I will test out pawn of ula and skull sifter and see how they work out for me.
@nedb37 Thank you the big game hunter was a way to kill big things even if they where black (quite a few grixis decks in my meta). Also I promise spore frog is worth more than fully earned his spot in my deck for the life of it.
Has anyone strong opinions on Harvester of Souls? I was thinking about cutting him, but didn't draw him often enough yet.
While he's certainly a potent engine, I never found myself in a position where I wanted to tutor for him so far.
I used to like him a lot, but less so now, as they've printed more and more of this effect.
Grim Haruspex, though it only triggers on your own things, (and not tokens) is probably stop #1. Grim Haruspex is obviously more for mono-black due to the cost, but some 2 colors can swing it. It hurts, but also triggers on tokens, giving you more draw options. Fecundity - Green's side of things, it's "symmetrical," but you'll probably be doing more of it. Just pay attention. Triggers on tokens. Deathreap Ritual - only 1 card per turn, but triggers for you on any creature's deaths. Smothering Abomination - If you don't have this guy in, I'd replace harvester with him. He still gives you the draws, is much cheaper, triggers on tokens, and flies.
Of course, this should be on top of Skullclamp, and possibly Evolutionary Leap and Vampiric Rites. Infernal Tribute is interesting as well, very similar to rites, but I've always had issues being unable to sac tokens with it, although saccing enchants or artifacts (or lands) as needed makes up as a perk, sometimes.
Grim doesnt work on tokens. unless you meant a different card?
Grim doesnt work on tokens. unless you meant a different card?
I did. Dark Prophecy is supposed to be the second; hence the mention of difficult manacost in even 2 color decks. =/ Hence also why I mentioned it didn't work on tokens on line one, but then on line two... sigh. tired. fixed.
I've seen Dryad Arbor profitably used in a Meren decks as well. Player sacced the dryad arbor to a crop rotation, dropped Meren with no counters, and brought the dryad back to play at end of turn (cmc 0 = 0 exp counters). Was cute. He also ran Harrow, for similar tricks.
In that game, the player had gone for Grim Backwoods as their hand was already low (bad mulligan situation).
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Other pet cards of mine - Meren has limited value - ie once per turn, thus, she gets better value the longer she is out. Protect her. Avoid Fate is entirely unexpected, as is Imp's Mischief. For less specific answers, look to running undying evil - it works as bonus value for your current sac targets, and can be used to save a piece of board presence in front of a wrath, or save something from spot removal. Has been a champion in my Karador deck, and really, any deck I've run it in. (except pirates, because that deck is bad. But it's still hilarious there).
@Airithne I will look into getting more ETB effects in there to up the to get more value out of Meren. I am wary of putting back in awakening zone and the new one back into the deck. I had them in there at first but I felt like they did to little most of the time (they are great early plays and help power Meren up but where dead draws is gotten later in the game). I will test out pawn of ula and skull sifter and see how they work out for me.
Fair enough. I've really enjoyed Pawn, though. And I'm trying to see where I can fit Sifter in to my own deck.
Agreed. This card has been insane for me as well, it's pretty much been an allstar every time I've played it.
I've seen Dryad Arbor profitably used in a Meren decks as well. Player sacced the dryad arbor to a crop rotation, dropped Meren with no counters, and brought the dryad back to play at end of turn (cmc 0 = 0 exp counters). Was cute. He also ran Harrow, for similar tricks.
In that game, the player had gone for Grim Backwoods as their hand was already low (bad mulligan situation).
I tend to exclude Arbor because I've had some really bad experiences with it in the last month (I think it got bounced three times in a row, and the destroyed as one of my only lands one game). That is kind of cute though.
I have heard some good things about Blade of Selves wondering if you guys have tried playing with it. You get all the ETB effects and more sac outlets.
I have heard some good things about Blade of Selves wondering if you guys have tried playing with it. You get all the ETB effects and more sac outlets.
My biggest issue with it is the equip cost. Four mana to equip, especially on a creature that you probably also want to be recurring with Meren is pretty steep each turn.
I have heard some good things about Blade of Selves wondering if you guys have tried playing with it. You get all the ETB effects and more sac outlets.
My biggest issue with it is the equip cost. Four mana to equip, especially on a creature that you probably also want to be recurring with Meren is pretty steep each turn.
Exactly. While in magical fairy land, getting this out with Gary and just winning is possible, how many other creatures is it worth 6 mana for that effect? Because you pay 2 to play, 4 to equip, then swing. For all that setup, I think it's just cute in this deck. Corpse Dance, as a poster mentioned in my own topic, is a better mana dump that has a similar effect.
True and I mostly agree I had just saw it in a Kaalia of the Vast deck and with that equipped to her or w/e it was pretty crazy. I usually like things that people have to kill and it seemed like it might be one. However in Meren of Clan Nel Toth I can see the cost being too much since she usually uses more mana every turn than Kaalia.
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http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/meren-multiplayer-edh/
I haven't tried it, but it's hard for me to imagine Melira being that great. Obviously the interaction with persist is valuable, but there are two problems: 1) The only persist creatures that are any good in this color combination (Puppeteer Clique and Woodfall Primus) are very likely to already be in the deck, so there's nothing really to add, and 2) Melira is not a good card by herself. She's just a Grizzly Bear unless you have persist creatures on the battlefield with her.
Mikaeus, the Unhallowed is an excellent inclusion because it does so much stuff: it beats (with evasion), it pumps basically everything in our deck and has the chance to kill our opponents' creatures when they attack, or at least make attacking difficult. I don't want to say that the interaction with persist PLUS the fact that it gives basically your whole team undying is icing on the cake or anything, but it at least does something even if its your only creature on the battlefield. The cards are just incomparable.
That being said, if anyone has had success with Melira in this deck I'd be eager to hear how they made it work!
Blue lives don't matter in the slightest.
This. There is really no alternative to what Mike does in the deck, and his interactions with cards shouldnt be limited to just the fun you can have with Persist creatures. That's double the ETB/LTB triggers. Swinging with wild abandon becomes a valid strategy. He helps you recover from board wipes very easily. With Grave Pact, it's extremely unsymmetrical suddenly for you, as you sac a creature, it comes back, triggers its ability, then grave pact triggers!
GB [Primer][Competitive][Stax][Combo] Meren of Clan Nel Toth 95% RETIRED
UW [Primer][Competitive][Combo][Stax] Brago, King Eternal RETIRED
BR Rakdos, Lord of Riots (75%)
G Titania - 75%
W SRAM - Welcome to the cheeri0s jam 95%
U Teferi - stax 100%
R Neheb - janky mono red eggs combo 90%
B Gonti - 50% valuetown
One general think I've been noticing is that while Meren makes for a nice reanimator commander I find that since I'm playing without a theme I'd rather move in on a commander that is more specific and put her into the main deck. I just can't help but want to argue with myself that Jarad is a better sac-to-kill commander (with a potential voltron finish) or Mazirek is a better tokens swarm commander (with another potential to voltron people out). Running these two in the main deck here splits this deck in two directions, but looking at your list it just feels like she's already branching out that way.
Don't get me wrong, she's the better reanimator commander, but if that's all we're going for then I'd be inclined to cut cards like Bitterblossom for more reanimator cards.
Thanks for the input!
Level 1 Judge
Seed guardian is terrible. He's basically a vanilla 3/4 that dies and makes another vanilla beater. It doesn't really do much for the deck overall. Have you looked at the lists? Most of us use effects like Grave Pact to clear the field and provide oodles of triggers. Those faerie tokens can block opposing fliers, pick away at planeswalkers, Ashnod's Altar fodder so the commander tax never bothers you, Contamination fodder, and best of all, can be used for GP effects. I love the card, and all of the efficient token generators in the deck.
No one is arguing if Mazzy is better at tokens. But really consider what it brings to the table. Could it be cut someday? Perhaps. I can totally see cutting it in favor or better stax effects, enablers, etc. I just like that Meren runs all of these strategies well, stax, reanimator, ramp, etc. I dont think Mazzy or Jarad being objectively "better" at a theme makes this style of Meren all over the place or necessarily weaker. My question to you is, why do you think Meren would want generic beaters that promote overextending into the graveyard? Why not run the best of everything in a synergistic mess that provides oodles of value, like we are doing? It works amazingly for me and my meta is 75%+, and it can hold a 4-6 person table by itself! It's fun as heck too! Meren can have many themes depending on the build, and I think that is what makes her a well designed commander. She isnt niche like Nekusar or Mazzy who do one thing, and it's highly telegraphed.
Not to say that Meren doesnt telegraph; she telegraphs that you wanna reanimate things, but typically people are finding out that just dumping garbage into the yard isnt too amazing. The fact that she triggers end of turn means you can control what comes back usually before grave hate can hit you, or you can more easily play around it. She's incredibly powerful. I recommend giving her a whirl if Jarad gets a bit boring (I love how Jarad plays as well, and it's definitely similar but Meren is different and fun enough to make her worth consideration!)
GB [Primer][Competitive][Stax][Combo] Meren of Clan Nel Toth 95% RETIRED
UW [Primer][Competitive][Combo][Stax] Brago, King Eternal RETIRED
BR Rakdos, Lord of Riots (75%)
G Titania - 75%
W SRAM - Welcome to the cheeri0s jam 95%
U Teferi - stax 100%
R Neheb - janky mono red eggs combo 90%
B Gonti - 50% valuetown
This deck isn't strictly a reanimator deck though. Reanimation is certainly a part of what I do, but it fits more in to a value or attrition style of build. Jarad is certainly more swingy, and is a lot better at doing mass drain shenanigans, and Mazirek is better at swarming the board, but my list isn't looking to do either of those things. It's looking to loop smaller creatures for value and go in for the long haul. I'm not necessarily going for an early bomb, and the deck doesn't really support that idea, but rather to use ETB/death triggers on repeat. There are multiple ways to run a reanimation based deck, this one just looks to be more gradual, as I'm limited by experience counters early on as it is.
I love Meren because she fits the style that I was looking for when I worked my way through several graveyard based decks (including Jarad, Karador, and Balthor). She's not as splashy as some of the other options, but she works quite well for my purposes.
Don't think of Bitterblossom as something to generate an army, it's not really quick enough for that anyways. It's a source of bodies to sacrifice to get the effects of cards like Phyrexian Tower, Skullclamp or Smothering Abomination, for example. Sacrificing tokens lets me control what I loop with Meren while still getting effects from those kinds of cards. If I were to replace it, it wouldn't be throwing a bomb in the deck or even another reanimation effect, it would likely be either Sifter of Skulls or From Beyond, both of which cost two more to cast, making them slower despite their tokens sacrificing themselves.
I also agree with gromgrom's points.
My Helpdesk
[Pr] Marath | [Pr] Lovisa | Jodah | Saskia | Najeela | Yisan | Lord Windgrace | Atraxa | Meren | Gisa and Geralf
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/10-11-15-aAW-meren/
My topic, with descriptions and changes.
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/commander-edh/multiplayer-commander-decklists/648382-meren-of-clan-nel-toth-75-stax-valuetown
-1 Yavimaya Elder
+1 Bane of Progress
I had him in the side for a while, but most people look unkindly at SB in EDH. Elder was very hit or miss. I prefer creatures to do something immediately, and he required so much setup that by the time he came down, I was already good on lands for the most part, since no one wants to block him, and to cantrip, you need 2 colorless. This deck is mana hungry early on, and I dont wanna durdle too much.
Bane of Progress is an "Oh !#@%" card i can cast or return to play to eat a stax/superfriend/daretti/etc player's board if necessary. This deck deals with creatures well, but it's threats outside of that that we need to deal with. This has the added disadvantage of eating our own artifacts and enchantments, but there are situations where that is beneficial! Worst case just keep looping E Witness with Meren/Clique to grab stuff back afterwards.
GB [Primer][Competitive][Stax][Combo] Meren of Clan Nel Toth 95% RETIRED
UW [Primer][Competitive][Combo][Stax] Brago, King Eternal RETIRED
BR Rakdos, Lord of Riots (75%)
G Titania - 75%
W SRAM - Welcome to the cheeri0s jam 95%
U Teferi - stax 100%
R Neheb - janky mono red eggs combo 90%
B Gonti - 50% valuetown
It just allows me to finish with different board states. With the amount of tutors this deck uses being Green/Black it is easy to grab the right answer. Mikaeus, the Unhallowed + Woodfall Primus and a infinite sac outlet is the classic finisher. Usually this is obtained with using Tooth and Nail or with Victimize. You can up the instant kill power of Tooth and Nail with Triskelion to machine gun the board instantly, but it isn't my style and having a Triskelion in your hand isn't the best where the other two are still great.
The Craterhoof Behemoth would be the card you probably replace with Triskelion but he is one of my favorite cards and is a great reanimation target. If at any point you have a lot of little guys you can just instantly turn them into value and usually kill someone or you played a Avenger of Zendikar or Ghoulcaller Gisa you can Birthing Pod the Avenger to instantly kill the board usually or play Craterhoof sac him then reanimate him again which I have done get the double trample. He has been surprisingly efficient. This deck just needed an extra card to take advantage and giving value to the random garbage minions you have left over sometimes from using Grave Pact or w/e.
If the board was wiped then comes the Lord of Extinction. It isn't hard to get this guy gigantic by even turn 5. If you have a Hermit Druid out or an Alter of Dementia you can make him a 80/80+ in no time especially sacing himself to mill out your most dangerous opponent or just milling random people to protect yourself from grave hate targeted at you. His instant kill combo is with Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord which like all my combo's can be Tooth and nailed out of the deck depending on how the game goes. The biggest upside to Lord of Extinction is he is so versatile with Rogue's Passage, Greater Good, Disciple of Bolas, and Ghoulcaller Gisa he is a kill condition with endless value.
Marath, Will of the Wild
Friendly Kess Twin Combo
Tatyova - Sir Bounce A Lot
Gonti's Luxury Pie
Prime (Eldrazi) Speaker Zegana (Retired)
On Titania, I don't think she's worth it in a deck that isn't focused on lands. You'd have to jump through a lot of hoops to make sure you had consistent access to her second effect, and her first ability is going to be limited in most cases.
I think there are better ways to empty you hand into the grave yard, and it's also a bit expensive for the first go (six mana investment). How badly are you looking for a counterspell effect?
My Helpdesk
[Pr] Marath | [Pr] Lovisa | Jodah | Saskia | Najeela | Yisan | Lord Windgrace | Atraxa | Meren | Gisa and Geralf
Marath, Will of the Wild
Friendly Kess Twin Combo
Tatyova - Sir Bounce A Lot
Gonti's Luxury Pie
Prime (Eldrazi) Speaker Zegana (Retired)
http://www.mtgvault.com/muffins1001/decks/meren-2/
Craterhoof is about to get the axe as is just dead any time I bring it back with Meren. I will say however Spore Frog is an all star in the deck and the mana base is all wacky I need to go back thru it since the mulligan change.
@Azurhawk Harvester is very expensive for his effect. A better way around it might be to grab Grim Haruspex if you still need a draw engine.
@muffins1001 I also wouldn't judge a card as bad if it is killed as soon as it hits the board. That means the card is good actually and you want them to use removal on it. This means other cards will be able to resolve. With Craterhoof Behemoth if it wasn't countered which you can't counter Meren's ability his ability still goes off so it isn't a waste. You still get Overwhelming Stampedeish worth of value and get rid of their target removal.
Oh yes my lands are all a mess right now it's not up to date with the rule change I think I currently have it at 37-38 ish range. That's the problem I have with Mr. Hoof is that Meren's ability is at the end of turn. So if bring him back with her he does not do anything.
Generally, things that net you Eldrazi spawn/scions are increadibly valuable in Meren, because they give you mana while ticking up your experience counters. A few more ETB effects would probably be helpful as well, so you're getting maximum value from repeating Meren.
I agree. Good effect, but he's expensive, and I'd rather have Haruspex come down earlier to help me get through the early/mid game.
My Helpdesk
[Pr] Marath | [Pr] Lovisa | Jodah | Saskia | Najeela | Yisan | Lord Windgrace | Atraxa | Meren | Gisa and Geralf
I used to like him a lot, but less so now, as they've printed more and more of this effect. 5/5 deathtouch doesn't stack up against the other options so well.
Grim Haruspex, though it only triggers on your own things, (and not tokens) is probably stop #1.
Dark Prophecy is obviously more for mono-black due to the cost, but some 2 colors can swing it. It hurts, but also triggers on tokens, giving you more draw options.
Fecundity - Green's side of things, it's "symmetrical," but you'll probably be doing more of it. Just pay attention. Triggers on tokens.
Deathreap Ritual - only 1 card per turn, but triggers for you on any creature's deaths.
Smothering Abomination - If you don't have this guy in, I'd replace harvester with him. He still gives you the draws, is much cheaper, triggers on tokens, and flies.
Of course, this should be on top of Skullclamp, and possibly Evolutionary Leap and Vampiric Rites. Infernal Tribute is interesting as well, very similar to rites, but I've always had issues being unable to sac tokens with it, although saccing enchants or artifacts (or lands) as needed makes up as a perk, sometimes.
Retired EDH - Tibor and Lumia | [PR]Nemata |Ramirez dePietro | [C]Edric | Riku | Jenara | Lazav | Heliod | Daxos | Roon | Kozilek
@nedb37 Thank you the big game hunter was a way to kill big things even if they where black (quite a few grixis decks in my meta). Also I promise spore frog is worth more than fully earned his spot in my deck for the life of it.
Grim doesnt work on tokens. unless you meant a different card?
GB [Primer][Competitive][Stax][Combo] Meren of Clan Nel Toth 95% RETIRED
UW [Primer][Competitive][Combo][Stax] Brago, King Eternal RETIRED
BR Rakdos, Lord of Riots (75%)
G Titania - 75%
W SRAM - Welcome to the cheeri0s jam 95%
U Teferi - stax 100%
R Neheb - janky mono red eggs combo 90%
B Gonti - 50% valuetown
I did. Dark Prophecy is supposed to be the second; hence the mention of difficult manacost in even 2 color decks. =/ Hence also why I mentioned it didn't work on tokens on line one, but then on line two... sigh. tired. fixed.
I stand by Smothering Abomination though. If it's not in, easy replacement.
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I've seen Dryad Arbor profitably used in a Meren decks as well. Player sacced the dryad arbor to a crop rotation, dropped Meren with no counters, and brought the dryad back to play at end of turn (cmc 0 = 0 exp counters). Was cute. He also ran Harrow, for similar tricks.
In that game, the player had gone for Grim Backwoods as their hand was already low (bad mulligan situation).
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Other pet cards of mine - Meren has limited value - ie once per turn, thus, she gets better value the longer she is out. Protect her. Avoid Fate is entirely unexpected, as is Imp's Mischief. For less specific answers, look to running undying evil - it works as bonus value for your current sac targets, and can be used to save a piece of board presence in front of a wrath, or save something from spot removal. Has been a champion in my Karador deck, and really, any deck I've run it in. (except pirates, because that deck is bad. But it's still hilarious there).
Retired EDH - Tibor and Lumia | [PR]Nemata |Ramirez dePietro | [C]Edric | Riku | Jenara | Lazav | Heliod | Daxos | Roon | Kozilek
Agreed. This card has been insane for me as well, it's pretty much been an allstar every time I've played it.
I tend to exclude Arbor because I've had some really bad experiences with it in the last month (I think it got bounced three times in a row, and the destroyed as one of my only lands one game). That is kind of cute though.
My Helpdesk
[Pr] Marath | [Pr] Lovisa | Jodah | Saskia | Najeela | Yisan | Lord Windgrace | Atraxa | Meren | Gisa and Geralf
My Helpdesk
[Pr] Marath | [Pr] Lovisa | Jodah | Saskia | Najeela | Yisan | Lord Windgrace | Atraxa | Meren | Gisa and Geralf
Exactly. While in magical fairy land, getting this out with Gary and just winning is possible, how many other creatures is it worth 6 mana for that effect? Because you pay 2 to play, 4 to equip, then swing. For all that setup, I think it's just cute in this deck. Corpse Dance, as a poster mentioned in my own topic, is a better mana dump that has a similar effect.
GB [Primer][Competitive][Stax][Combo] Meren of Clan Nel Toth 95% RETIRED
UW [Primer][Competitive][Combo][Stax] Brago, King Eternal RETIRED
BR Rakdos, Lord of Riots (75%)
G Titania - 75%
W SRAM - Welcome to the cheeri0s jam 95%
U Teferi - stax 100%
R Neheb - janky mono red eggs combo 90%
B Gonti - 50% valuetown