Nice job on the content. It looks nice. You might also consider swapping out stax as a weakness for MLD. When I think of stax I think of things like Braids, Cabal Minion (yes I know she is banned) and Smokestack. Against traditional stax having ETB creatures that are cheap to cast tends to actually be a strong counter. If they blow up our lands with MLD, its sort of a different problem but against either keeping a low curve is the answer.
Creature Toolbox Hate (listed as a weakness) - feels slightly off I guess still. Its not incorrect but I think you could possibly go with just Creature Hate or ETB Hate? Humility also feels like it should be listed here as its probably the worst of the lot.
Heck yeah! I’m super pumped to get a new Jenara primer in the works. ISB’s was fantastic, and I loved seeing the different ideas flow. One problem I always had with ISB’s list (I say this affectionately <3 ) was the lack of combos. Hence I’m extremely excited to see Palinchron and Mirror Entity in this list.
Here’s my list for reference – I think you’ll see some pretty striking similarities. http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/13-08-15-wSI-jenara/. I’ll acknowledge I have a glaring lack of GY hate in my 99, but I rarely run into GY decks anyway.
But of course the differences are what matter the most. I’ll discuss some differences between our decks, and my rationale.
Lands – I have a semi-budget land base. Haven’t quite gotten Tundra or Tropical Island, but haven’t been having too much issue. Very glad to see Boseiju, Who Shelters All in your list, I think not enough people run that card.
However, I don’t see the usefulness of the artifact lands. In my opinion, they’re too much of a liability. Sure, Tezzeret can find them, but I’d almost always rather get Sol Ring. Already have sol ring? Grab a sword and go to town. I think the land use is too narrow, and they’re way to vulnerable to sweepers . How bad is an Austere Command going to hurt when you’re hitting your own lands? I’d run the off color fetches (Polluted Delta, Arid Mesa etc) instead, to give you more shuffle effects for Sylvan and Top.
I’ll also agree with ISB – I don’t think Reliquary Tower warrants a slot. If I have 8+ cards in hand, I’m probably winning with 7 of them regardless. I’ve never had a hand I had trouble discarding.
Also, I’m curious – What do you name with Cavern of Souls? One of the things I love about this list is that not many of our creatures are worth countering – it’s their combined synergy is what kills. I guess angel? Jenara doesn’t get countered much.
Creatures – Like I said, it’s great to see those combo creatures in there. Our differences are (primarily) with the top of your curve
Yavimaya Dryad – I think this card is worse than Farhaven Elf. Sure, she can get duals and give your opponent a land if you’re into that sort of thing, but GG makes me queasy in a hand where I’m using this creature for ramp. What if I need a green source?
Stonecloaker – haven’t tested him. Is he good? He seems kind of mana intensive to me, but I can definitely see the use in the bounce.
Solemn Simulacrum – He just seems so low impact to me. He can’t be skullclamped, rezed from Sun Titan. He makes a nice blocker but he just seems like filler to me.
Duplicant – Removal on a stick is nice, but I think you have enough spot removal already. It’s nice that you can get him from Farhaven Elf, but I’m not sure he’s efficient enough.
Angel of Serenity – I’ve never played with her, but I think there are better options. The double use of removal + GY hate is nice, but 7 mana is a lot to pay for this type of effect.
Sphinx of Uthuun – FoF on a stick is great, no doubt about it. But there’s no way to abuse him, outside of Karmic Guide shenanigans.
Suggestions:
Ixidron – I’d run this over Duplicant. The utility is just so nice, and often I find myself not wanting to kill the commander. Who wants to kill Omnath or Kaalia? Just flip it and leave them stranded. We can also recover from this type of effect much faster.
Consecrated Sphinx – I just don’t think we can avoid running him :/ I think he’s better than Sphinx of Uthuun, because when he’s good, he’s game winning. I’ve never seen a game won off a Sphinx of Uthuun/ Can’t say the same for ol’ Concs.
Stoneforge Mystic – I honestly think 4 targets is enough. I only run 3, and I’m never unhappy to draw him (her?) unless I’m out of targets. The utility is just so good.
Vorinclex – I’d run him over the Angel of Serenity. He’s just so powerful and adds another combo win for Palinchron. Alternatively, he can make Jenara huge and beat face.
Gilded Drake – This card is amazing. Giving them a flying blocker is problematic sometimes, but usually the creature I steal is faaaaarrrr better. I think this definitely needs to be in the list somewhere.
Oracle of Mul Daya – with so many shuffle effects, I’d run this card over Solemn Simulacrum. She gets crazy good with off color fetches, and can ramp a crazy amount. Sometimes she’s bad but I usually get at least 1 land, making her better than Simulacrum in my opinion.
Artifacts: Scrabbling Claws – I’m not an expert on GY removal, since I don’t run any (LOL), but if I were to, I think this is too low impact. I’d much rather run crypt, which can just wreck a GY player. Claws will just delay them a turn at worst.
Lightning Greaves – How has this been working out for you? I used to run it, but I found it unnecessary. Jenara flies low under the radar, and I’ve never found Lightning Greaves to be useful.
Planeswalkers: Jace, the Mind Sculptor – I haven’t tested him, but he just seems like a massive target and not impactful. Great in 1v1, but not in multiplayer.
Tezzeret, the Seeker – Honestly never been a fan. The tutoring is nice, but he’s 5 mana and rarely lasted a turn for me. I respect the inclusion but I just wasn’t impressed when I played him.
Instants:
Love the list. I run Muddle the Mixture over Counterspell. I love a good counterspell, but I love the utility Muddle gives. It fetches Survival, Stoneforge (in my list), Eladamri’s to get any creature, Phantasmal image, and Gilded Drake. Sooooo many good targets.
Sorceries: Tooth and Nail – I don’t see much reason for this to be in the list. What do you normally get with it? Deadeye and Palinchron? That requires that you have an outlet for that infinite mana (Jenara excluding, of course). Whenever I tested this card, I found it just clogged up too many hands for it to be worth it.
Bribery – This card needs to be in the list, in my opinion. It wins games, it’s that good. I can use it as early as T4 to get an early Prophet or use it late game to get a monster.
Time Warp – I run two of these effects (Warp and Aeons for budget reasons). I find that these are great for killing someone with an extra turn with Jenara. Generally, I use them to make sure I can kill the table when I get infinite mana and draw my deck (see below). I can just kill everyone with Jenara by looping the extra turn effects and Witness or Snappy.
With regard to your combos, how do you often use the infinite mana? For some reason whenever I get infinite mana, Jenara never seems to be on the field -_- so I can’t kill anybody. I always use a tutor to get Prime Speaker Zegana and then draw my deck off an arbitrarily big Jenara (be sure to leave yourself a few cards in your deck). I then use extra turn effects to kill everyone!
All in all, great list. I’m super excited to see another Jenara primer (hopefully) and I look forward to the discussions between us all!
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
My Cubes - The Busted Cube. A fully functional, almost 100% custom cube. The project started out by asking "What if other colors got cards on the power level of Mana Drain,Ancestral Recall, and Time Walk?" Draft and enjoy!
Nice job on the content. It looks nice. You might also consider swapping out stax as a weakness for MLD. When I think of stax I think of things like Braids, Cabal Minion (yes I know she is banned) and Smokestack. Against traditional stax having ETB creatures that are cheap to cast tends to actually be a strong counter. If they blow up our lands with MLD, its sort of a different problem but against either keeping a low curve is the answer.
Creature Toolbox Hate (listed as a weakness) - feels slightly off I guess still. Its not incorrect but I think you could possibly go with just Creature Hate or ETB Hate? Humility also feels like it should be listed here as its probably the worst of the lot.
I often tend to lump MLD and Stax together. I may just tack it on (in the form of Stax/MLD). Also, when I think of Stax, I definitely think of stuff like Smokestack for sure, but I also think of crap to slow you down, like Land Equilibrium, Tainted Æther, Kismet, etc.
With the creature toolbox hate, I was going things that specifically hose a value deck like this, like the cards I listed. Humility is definitely one I completely forgot about, and I'll add it in. I feel like just "Create Hate" doesn't really cut it, because stuff like wraths, Lethal Vapors, etc, don't do nearly as much when the creatures are already providing their value just by entering. Also, I think that saying "Creature Toolbox Hate", I'm kind of covering my bases with things hating on the various types value that these decks thrive on (ETB, onto the field tutors like Birthing Pod, recursion, etc).
As for Gilded Drake, I've never been nearly as fond of that card as you are. I played it in here for quite a while, but was never as happy with it as I wanted to be. Besides, can't get it in foil.
You never really realize how much of a difference having the duals makes until you have then.
Boseiju, Who Shelters All is sweet, but largely a meta call. I can understand why a lot of people don't run it.
The artifact lands, in my opinion, are a must-have when playing both Tezzeret the Seeker and Trinket Mage. Yes, they can a liability sometimes, but it's not generally as bad as you might think. Also, I will always, always go get a Birthing Pod with Tezzeret before I'll go get a sword. Don't even care if it kills him, but I'll usually plus him a time or two first so that it doesn't, 'cause being able to untap the Pod makes it even better.
I very thoroughly disagree about Reliquary Tower. I'm of the opinion that it should be in absolutely every single EDH deck. I draw many, many cards, and I'd much rather just always have them all. Also, it may depend a lot on meta, but in my own, having enough cards that you have to discard to seven doesn't even come close guaranteeing a win. Having more cards is always better.
Not running the off-colour fetch lands is a mostly a personal preference thing for me. It's kind of on principle. I don't think the off colour fetches should be allowed, but I don't make the rules. I feel like it goes against the whole point of your deck being restricted to your commander's colours.
Oh man, I WISH Jenara didn't get countered much. Everybody I play with knows better. Yes, I usually name Angel, for a few reasons. 1) I have a handful of them, and they're all good. 2) In some matches I just really, really want Jenara to resolve. 3) I abuse my own life total very, very heavily, and I really want that Resolute Archangel to stick if I hard cast it. Any time I don't have an immediate plan for it, it's Angel. Otherwise, I name whatever I'm about to do that I think is most likely to be countered.
I would have a very hard time convincing myself to cut combos entirely from this list. They just steal so many wins I have no business getting.
I have been way, way happier with Yavimaya Dryad than I ever was with Farhaven Elf. For one thing, I play a relatively low basics count. For another, the body is more aggressive, and generally much more useful. Every once in a while I will have a problem with double green cost, but it's pretty rare. I think a lot of this comes down as well to discussions I've had about things I've said about how I feel most people don't mulligan aggressively enough in EDH. Partial Paris is stupidly abusable, and people just don't do it.
I've been super happy with Stonecloaker. I think it also depends a lot on how frequently you are or want to be doing things on other people's turns, though. The only way I could imagine cutting it is if they one day decided to make like an Angel of Finality with Flash.
Solemn Simulacrum is one of my favourite parts of the Birthing Pod chain. He's also free to cast off of Mana Drain mana. And Pod and Mana Drain are two of the cards I tutor for the most. In general, I think that having a fully colourless ramp creature, that has both ETB AND dies effects, is just way worth his semi-slowness.
I've seen a number of people bash Duplicant, and I honestly don't understand it. Yes, he costs 6, and that can suck. But it's hard creature exile on a create ETB, and I have abused it so, so much. I could never imagine cutting it. It's especially nice to abuse with Reveillark.
Angel of Serenity is a card I've gone back and forth on. I first added it when it was new, played with it for a while, ended up cutting it, and now I've got it back. As it stands, for the last handful of months, I've been really happy with it. I particularly love going to get it at the end of a Pod chain, sticking a bunch of stuff that I just sacrificed under it. A 5/6 Flying body is just about always relevant, and when someone deals with it I get to have my sweet things back. I use it for that way more than I use it as removal. The removal aspect is just gravy.
I was playing Sphinx of Uthuun in here until a few months ago, and I have been so, so happy with it. Having each of my clones be a potential Fact or Fiction makes me a lot happy, and it's definitely abusable with more than just Karmic Guide. Also, just like with the angel, a 5/6 Flying body is very relevant.
I've looked at Ixidron a couple times, but really never wanted it. Having a sort-of wrath on a creature would be nice, and it's the main reason I've considered it, but I just don't like it. I think it also comes down a lot to factors of how you play the deck, and what kinds of decks you most frequently play against, though.
Not running Consecrated Sphinx is a pretty easy choice for me. My meta is way too full of both spot removal and clones. I really dislike that two people having one basically immediately ends the game, and I've had way too many times where I've played one and never gotten to draw a single card off of it. I've been much happier with Uthuun.
I ran Stoneforge Mystic in here for a long, long time, and thought I'd never even consider cutting it. And then one day I did. And I have not missed it once. It's not that it's not good, it's that I realized there are just other things I'd rather be doing than tutoring up one of my few equipments, most of the time. The only one I always want to have is Skullclamp, and I've got plenty of other ways to find that.
I used to run Vorinclex, Voice of Hunger, too. I had two problems with him: too expensive, and he always just ate removal or got cloned, my Consecrated Sphinx. I haven't missed him.
I'm going to cover both Gilded Drake and Bribery here: part of your argument is that stealing their best creature is just so good, but that depends very heavily on your opponents actually playing creatures worth stealing. I really dislike playing cards that rely on my opponents playing good cards. It's too conditional.
Oracle of Mul Daya is a card that I feel is very, very highly overrated. It's a good card, yes, but not nearly as good as people make it out to be. I played it here for years, and it just didn't make the cut one day. I've never missed it, even a little.
The incremental value of Scrabbling Claws is insane. Whether or not hitting one card is a graveyard is enough depends entirely on the type of graveyard deck. Will it stop a Living End? No. But 90% of the time it's going to be enough. I've played Relic of Progenitus, I've played Tormod's Crypt, and I've played these Claws. This is what I've been the happiest with.
Once again, you talk about Jenara "flying low under the radar." Boy, do I wish I played with a group that ignored. Like I said, everybody who knows my deck knows better, and she is never allowed to stick around. People fear her, and rightly so. But even completely regardless of that, the Lightning Greaves protect a Prophet of Kruphix or a Deadeye Navigator, and that's enough for me.
[card}Jace, the Mind Sculptor[/card] isn't treated as a massive target in a multiplayer game. At least, not with a group who understand threat assessment. People will toss extra creature damage at him, sure, but that's true of all planeswalkers, not just Jace. His free Brainstorm every turn is well worth it. Literally all I use him for.
Muddle the Mixture is fine. Can't really fault you on that choice. I'd just rather have the more versatile counter most of the time.
Every single time I successfully resolve a Tooth and Nail, I win the game. That's all. Sometimes it's to combo off, and sometimes it's just to lock up the board. Either way, if I resolve this, I win.
I've considered adding a Temporal Manipulation to have a second one of this effect. I don't think Walk the Aeons is good enough, and I've mostly been unwilling to spend the money on Manipulation. Or rather, unwilling to spend the money on it without really, really wanting it. I just don't generally feel like I need another one.
Infinite mana will usually be used to abuse Deadeye Navigator + something. But just about every time I have it, I can also kill with Jenara, whether or not she's on the field at the time, thanks to Lightning Greaves and a number of ways to get it. Even without all of that, though, if I've just purposely assembled infinite mana, I probably have enough other things to win anyway, just by virtue of being able to dump my entire hand.
EDIT: I decided to stick the above in a spoiler, because it was huge and scrolling sucks.
Oh boy, that was a lot of things. I think I need a nap now.
I'm glad you like the list, and the primer, and I'm also very excited to have it up. I've already applied for official primer status, so we'll see.
What are your thoughts on Magic Origins for Jenara and similar decks?
I know its not aimed at me but personally, Nissa, Vastwood Seer looks interesting as a whole because it fits into the cheap creatures with an ETB which more importantly gets some mileage later in the game. It more of interests me than being something I am sold on.
Sword of the Animist in my opinion is the big winner. You can curve into Jenara and drop / equip the sword the turn after. It rezes off Sun Titan / Academy Ruins and is an easy target for Stoneforge / Tezzeret if wanted. The deck can always use more mana as it makes it easier to keep up answers as well as giving you more mana to dump into casting and buffing Jenara or Sphinx's Revelation.
I don't think there is anything else I was really looking at. Woodland Bellower is interesting but I don't quite like how it functions.
I know its not aimed at me but personally, Nissa, Vastwood Seer looks interesting as a whole because it fits into the cheap creatures with an ETB which more importantly gets some mileage later in the game. It more of interests me than being something I am sold on.
Sword of the Animist in my opinion is the big winner. You can curve into Jenara and drop / equip the sword the turn after. It rezes off Sun Titan / Academy Ruins and is an easy target for Stoneforge / Tezzeret if wanted. The deck can always use more mana as it makes it easier to keep up answers as well as giving you more mana to dump into casting and buffing Jenara or Sphinx's Revilation.
I don't think there is anything else I was really looking at. Woodland Bellower is interesting but I don't quite like how it functions.
I really don't like that Nissa, Vastwood Seer puts the land into your hand and not onto the battlefield, and I don't really care for her planeswalker side, to be honest. +1 Coiling Oracle is nice, but the other two abilities don't wow me. Nothing there really convinces me that the bad front side of Nissa is worth playing to get this backside.
To be completely honest, I hadn't even considered Sword of the Animist here. That being said, I also run a much lower basic count than some others. I love the card, though, and I've recommended it to plenty of other people for their own decks, especially non-Green mono colour decks. Just about any deck with a decent basic count could get some pretty good use out of it, though.
There are three cards in particular that stuck out to me as interesting and/or potentially worth consideration:
Woodland Bellower - This card has been talked about a lot. The point has been made a few times that it feels like it goes in the wrong direction, but I'm not sure. I feel like it would be fantastic as part of a Birthing Pod chain. The real problem is something else that has been mentioned a lot for this card, and that's the requirements of the tutored creature being green and non-legendary. That's what really hurts it in my eyes. It seems powerful, though, and I think it's still worth testing at some point.
Mizzium Meddler - This sticks out to me purely by virtue of being neat. It's got flash, it's cheap, and it's a neat effect. Unfortunately, neat doesn't always mean powerful.
Evolutionary Leap - I haven't had the chance to play with this card yet, but I feel like it has a lot of potential. I'm pretty sure that in this deck, it would just be a much worse Survival of the Fittest. It gives the benefit of getting any ETB/dies triggers from the creature before it hits the graveyard, but it also doesn't give us the choice of creature. Maybe it would be better to think of it like a bad Birthing Pod here? I don't know, I just know it feels worse than what's already here. I think it'll be way better in a deck that sacrifices tokens to go get super relevant creatures, like a Ghave, Guru of Spores deck, for example.
I actually forgot about Evolutionary Leap but yea, it seems like it could be good.
EDIT: I have had some good results with Tragic Arrogance in a few decks too. Its interesting because you get to make the choices for other people. I sort of dismissed it at first but I have been liking it so far in actual play.
Oh, I just now saw your edit there. Tragic Arrogance is another card I hadn't even considered. I'd say it could be a possible replacement for Oblivion Stone, but I'm pretty sure O Stone is still just way better.
Also, I'd be really interested to hear from anybody who has had a chance to try out Evolutionary Leap, particularly in this style of deck, and find out what you thought of it.
Congrats on the primer status. A couple of our cards are different, but we run pretty similar lists (mine has also been tweaked over the past 4 years).
One thing I noticed is that you have 46% blue mana symbols, but only 29% in your mana distribution. Do you ever find yourself lacking the blue mana to do things? Especially with a lot of UU spells or 1UUU like Cryptic Command is.
The other thing that is probably a combination of meta choice and personal preference is your curve toppers. Most of our card type breakdowns are nearly identical until you get to the top of your list and I just feel like you can do better than the 7 drops that you are currently running, especially Serenity and Uthuun. It isn't that I don't think they are great, but I feel like they are outclassed by a couple other cards that your list is notably missing. I also personally dislike Palinchron, but if you're going for infinite mana, then that is fine.
The heavy blue is very rarely an issue. I just always make sure to prioritize things that make blue off of my fetches, Wood Elves, etc. And Islands are always the first basics I pull out.
At far as the 7 drops I'm using, I've played with a lot of different things at the top of my curve, and these are the ones I've been the happiest with. It's so easy to abuse them here, and they always do a ton. I'm personally not fond of a lot of the top-end creatures you're running. They're not bad, but things like Avacyn, Angel of Hope generally always just eat a Swords to Plowshares and that's the end of it. In my meta, at least. Tons of non-destroy removal. Also, Avenger of Zendikar is fine, but I much prefer him in a dedicated tokens deck. I also don't see myself ever running him without Craterhoof Behemoth alongside him.
is there any particular reason for City of Brass over something like Mana Confluence? I see a lot of tapping down lands in my meta so for me confluence is usually better
is there any particular reason for City of Brass over something like Mana Confluence? I see a lot of tapping down lands in my meta so for me confluence is usually better
They're both there. I'd play Grand Coliseum too, if it didn't enter tapped.
The heavy blue is very rarely an issue. I just always make sure to prioritize things that make blue off of my fetches, Wood Elves, etc. And Islands are always the first basics I pull out.
At far as the 7 drops I'm using, I've played with a lot of different things at the top of my curve, and these are the ones I've been the happiest with. It's so easy to abuse them here, and they always do a ton. I'm personally not fond of a lot of the top-end creatures you're running. They're not bad, but things like Avacyn, Angel of Hope generally always just eat a Swords to Plowshares and that's the end of it. In my meta, at least. Tons of non-destroy removal. Also, Avenger of Zendikar is fine, but I much prefer him in a dedicated tokens deck. I also don't see myself ever running him without Craterhoof Behemoth alongside him.
Fetching them is a fair point. My personal preference is to have the mana evenly distributed based on prevalence of symbols regardless so that I am more likely to hit what I need without needing to search.
Regarding Gilded Drake, I think it is one of the best 2 drops available. It is almost always going to do something good for you and I'd much rather have it over Phantasmal Image. Courser of Kruphix is seen as being pretty good card filtration and Oracle of Mul Daya is strictly better in most ways. You seem to like to ramp a lot and there is never any harm in being able to dig deeper and get your lands out of the way, be it early or late game. Any top-deck manipulation also works wonders.
Avacyn, Angel of Hope is a little bit of a pet card for me and I like running her. If I force someone to use a premium removal spell on her, I'm generally okay with that so it isn't so bad. Craterhoof Behemoth is a good card to run with Avenger of Zendikar, but I find that he does little to nothing without Avenger on the field with him whereas Avenger is its own engine to pump tokens (as you know, there are plenty of ways to get multiple land drops on a turn). Without a haste enabler as well, it does me little good to fetch them off of TaN. In most situations, demanding a more narrow answer to Avacyn via exile or a bounce + board wipe seems to be preferable to having Avenger and tokens out for a turn unprotected when Craterhoof is subject to an equally narrow answer in that it needs to be countered to stop its effect. Avacyn + Avenger is also a strictly stronger TaN combo unless you plan on killing the table with 3-4 creatures you already had on board so that they + Craterhoof get the pump when TaN resolves. Regardless, I know you run neither so this was merely a thought exercise as to why they are relatively equal in my mind. Forcing an opponent to have an answer though is seldom, if ever, a bad thing.
When I am talking about better 7 drops though, I am most notably hitting on Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite. She is one of the absolute best curve toppers in this style of list without a doubt. She serves as a functional asymmetrical board wipe/debuff and a creature buff for your utility guys at the same time. With her in play, everything you have becomes far more lethal. She also is applicable in far more situations as opposed to Craterhoof while serving the same sort of role. One thing I particularly like about her is that she deals with tokens quite well. Even if she doesn't wipe all of them, she lets every one of your creatures trade/block favorably, guaranteed. I really don't see any reason why she should not be in the list, especially over Angel of Serenity. My problem with Angel is that you stress that your playgroup has many cheap answers. Part of that umbrella is GY hate. I don't imagine your opponents are just going to let you cherry pick from your graveyard getting 3 creatures at a time. I'm also not fond of temporary removal via creatures since they, as a card type, are quite fragile.
I also don't understand your reasoning for not wanting Consecrated Sphinx. You seem to have an issue with it getting cloned, etc. and ending the game on the spot, implying that there are other players in your meta playing combo... but so are you. Drawing out your deck, or however much you need, potentially, isn't a bad thing at all. In fact, being able to dig for whatever you need to end the game yourself in this hypothetical situation is pretty darn good. It is one of the best cards at allowing you to dig for your game ending play in your colors while your opponents, if also playing combo, are probably running their own ways to reach such a point. Consequently, I understand the allure of getting immediate value from Sphinx of Uthuun as opposed to the time-dependent investment that you have to navigate with CS, but you show the same willingness to play an almost identical strategic/philosophically designed card in Prophet of Kruphix. If you are concerned with both of you digging for your combo, bear in mind that you are probably also drawing plenty of counters in order to deal with their threats. Maybe consider Pact of Negation if you are worried about them digging while you are tapped out? I just don't see how your mentality when choosing some cards matches up with the way that you are choosing others. Why not play cards that are better for you winning the game if this list is intended to be as competitive as you seemed to want to make it?
One last thing that I observed is in your game logs, you seem to be getting pretty nuts draws and almost playing out a Magic Christmas Land scenario in several situations where you were able to ramp out for 5-6 turns uninhibited. That can't be a reasonable expectation for those that play this list to encounter. I know that you want to validate the deck to your audience, which is why success stories are great, but I want to know how and with what you recover when things don't always go your way. You mention people running StP as if it and other cheap answers are flying around early on, but in your samples, I don't see anything that would affirm that. I consider myself to be a pretty decent player and, running a deck that is roughly 85-90% identical to yours, I can't say that I ever experience those sorts of things with any relative consistency. This also may be because that my playgroup and I don't play Partial Paris (because hand sculpting is stupid). I'd be interested to know how much things would change if you played using regular mulligan rules as you seem to benefit greatly from what PP has allowed you to get into your opening hand. Given that most people I am aware of tend to not use PP, I'd be curious to see how your 35 lands and other choices would fare in such an environment. Now that this thread is a primer, I think it is pertinent that it is representative of an environment that most players experience, or at least addresses how you would make adjustments for if/when you were not playing this list using PP.
P.S. I'm not trying to give you a hard time or anything. Just trying to keep discussion going on a deck I've enjoyed extensively over the years and help you develop your primer.
With Consecrated Sphinx, I usually draw all the cards I can until someone clones it. If I have gotten a good bit of cards from it already I will stop drawing entirely and move to answering theirs rather than continuing to draw. The other option is to just keep drawing like Riven said and combo off first because they dropped a clone after your sphinx so as long as your turn is before theirs draw your deck and win.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I have officially moved to MTGNexus. I just wanted to let people know as my response time to salvation decks being bumped is very hit or miss.
Alright, I'm going to try to cover everything, but there's a lot there, so sorry if I miss something.
I'm also going to stick it in a spoiler, because it's going to be big, and as I've previously mentioned, scrolling sucks.
There's a lot more to take into consideration than just the number of mana symbols on the cards. For example, I want lots of white to always be able to pump Jenara multiple times. I want lots of green to make sure I get some early, since the majority of the ramp is green. Also, with the fact that the majority of the ramp allows me to pick and choose the colours I want, as well as having 8 lands that make any colour (sort of, if you count the fetch lands), it's really not generally an issue to fetch/ramp intelligently to make sure I have the colours I need when I need them.
I would never, ever cut Phantasmal Image for Gilded Drake. Not in a million years. Having a two mana clone is just way, way too good. The Drake doesn't even come close in power level. Clones are inherently good, especially if you're running your own good creatures, offering a huge amount of versatility. Also, I ran Gilded Drake. For a couple years, even. And quite frankly, it just never rang my bell. I absolutely never want to cast it early, so being a cheap drop is somewhat irrelevant, and the majority of the time I did cast it, the flying body I was giving to my opponent just ended up giving me grief. Literally the only time I was happy casting a Gilded Drake was when I had a Venser, the Sojourner to back it up.
Oracle of Mul Daya is a fine card, but there are a few big reasons for why I cut it. First, I don't want a 4 drop that I never want to Birthing Pod away. Second, it doesn't hit nearly as often as I'd like it to, even with top-deck manipulation and shuffle effects. And lastly, it gives way too much information away. I really don't want my opponents knowing every single card I draw.
Avacyn, Angel of Hope is way, way too expensive to be bait. It's not something you should be okay playing out into removal. It's the kind of card that people specifically hang onto removal for. And unless you're playing it with counter magic the back it up, which is a huge amount of mana, then it's almost always going to just eat a removal spell in the near future, and then you're left with absolutely nothing to show for your 8 mana investment. It's the exact same reason I cut Vorinclex, Voice of Hunger. No thanks.
Avenger of Zendikar just doesn't do as much as it once did. Most of the time, Avenger himself will die before he ever has a chance to actually pump the tokens. If you're pumping them right away, you still can't attack with them, and a Wrath just blanks it. Nothing to show for it. Also, I'm not saying I want to be running Craterhoof Behemoth here. I'm saying I wouldn't ever run Avenger without it. And I would never run Avenger here.
I have no disagreements with you about the power level of Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite. I like that even if she does eat removal right away, she almost certainly already did something useful, since she has a pseudo-ETB ability, with her static ability immediately wiping out all opponents' tiny creatures. That's great, and I've looked at her for this list a handful of times. It's entirely possible she'll make it in at some point in time, she just hasn't yet.
I've said it before, and I'll say it again: I've been incredibly happy with Angel of Serenity. That being said, it IS the most likely cut if I ever decide I really want to put in Elesh Norn, but for now I don't see that happening.
If I were doing strictly competitive/tournament play, sure ending the game on the spot would be fine. Like ISB said, if they're cloning my Consecrated Sphinx then I most likely get a turn before them, and I can just untap and win the game. But, that's not the case. Not only is a large amount of my EDH play time with a group of friends, but also, my first and foremost concern is enjoying myself. This is a hobby, not a job, and if I'm not thoroughly enjoying playing a deck then I just won't play it. Every once in a while, drawing my entire deck and comboing off is neat, but it's not something I have fun doing all the time, and unless I am trying to spike an event or something, it's not how I want to win.
Prophet of Kruphix is cheaper, making it easier to cast and hold up protection. On top of that, it allows you to untap on each opponent's turn, making it even easier to protect it. Even if you manage to hold up the mana to protect a Consecrated Sphinx and then do so, let's say countering a removal spell from an opponent, then another opponent will likely be free to have his removal resolve. Just like I mentioned above with Avacyn, this is the type of card that people specifically hold onto removal for. Yes, the same is true of Prophet, but like I said, Prophet is much, much easier to protect. You can even Pod a Glen Elendra Archmage into it, guaranteeing at least a little protection right away.
"Why not play cards that are better for you winning the game [...] ?" That question is absolutely hilarious to me. In my opinion, the ONLY time when that sentiment is valid is when we're talking about one card being strictly better than an alternative. I mean, absolutely, unarguably, strictly better. Now, "strictly better" is a term that a lot of Magic players like to throw around, and 90% of the time they're strictly wrong. It is not, in any way, correct to say that Consecrated Sphinx is strictly better than Sphinx of Uthuun, and to even imply it is laughable. There are so many considerations that go into which card is a better fit for a situation or a deck, including meta, play style, the rest of the deck, etc, etc, etc. Now, I'm not saying that Consecrated Sphinx isn't a powerful card. I'm not even saying that it's not frequently a better card. What I AM saying is that it's not the card I would rather have in this deck, as I don't feel that it's the better card for me, here.
A few things about those games you're referring to: 1) those were games I'd played on Cockatrice that morning. The average Cockatrice player isn't exactly... good. 2) You're also sort of looking at them out of context. They were there as part of a discussion about land count/ramp/curve, not running the deck as a whole. I could just as easily have described a gold fishing session for my purposes there, but I'd already been playing games on Cockatrice so I went with those.
At some point, when I've got the time, I'm planning to record some Cockatrice games with players I know are good, running good decks (likely people I know IRL), and put them up. I think having full games to watch would be beneficial for people reading the primer, and it'll also show you what you're looking for, as far as the deck coming back from rough situations and whatnot.
Partial Paris mulligans are the "official" EDH rule, and as such I feel absolutely no inclination and see no need to add information to the primer for playing without it. I don't at all believe that any sort of "majority" of players play without them, and even if a large number do, I'm not going to cater to a variant rule set here.
Partial paris the official EDH mulligan for a reason. You say "hand sculpting is stupid", but you have to remember that you're running a 100 card singleton deck. The entire idea here is to eliminate the instances in which you lose to your own deck, or the sheer variance.
With all of the above said, since you asked, yes, a number of things would change without Partial Paris mulligans. Mostly notably, I would run 37-40 lands in every single one of my decks, and run twice as many tutors.
I vehemently disagree with you on Gilded Drake. It is one of the best blue creatures ever printed. Being able to neutralize an early Derevi, Zur, or otherwise troublesome general puts you in a great spot. For creature-based lists splashing blue it's an auto-include. As you play JTMS and Venser in your list I see no reason for its absence. I wouldn't cut Phantasmal Image (combo piece) but I'd certainly cut Scrabbling Claws. Bant combos are very mana intensive. The list needs more ramp to get to its win conditions quickly.
I vehemently disagree with you on Gilded Drake. It is one of the best blue creatures ever printed. Being able to neutralize an early Derevi, Zur, or otherwise troublesome general puts you in a great spot. For creature-based lists splashing blue it's an auto-include. As you play JTMS and Venser in your list I see no reason for its absence. I wouldn't cut Phantasmal Image (combo piece) but I'd certainly cut Scrabbling Claws. Bant combos are very mana intensive. The list needs more ramp to get to its win conditions quickly.
While the deck can combo, it's not a combo deck, as I've stated a few times. The fact that it combos with Palinchron is literally the last reason I have Phantasmal Image in here.
Also, there's not a single chance I'd cut Scrabbling Claws. If anything, I kind of want to add more graveyard hate.
Scavenging Ooze has done a ton of work for me. Being a creature means its easier to tutor and as long as he is in play with at least a single green up you neutralize most graveyard tactics out there. He is easy to tutor for and recur and he dominates the graveyard game as long as he is around. He is also easy to rez.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I have officially moved to MTGNexus. I just wanted to let people know as my response time to salvation decks being bumped is very hit or miss.
Yeah, I've had Scavenging Ooze in here before, he's definitely good. I forget what it was I cut him for before. There's nothing I really want him in here over, though, right now. I was just making a point about graveyard hate up above.
I understand your sentiments in your reply and appreciate the effort. I think we'll just have to agree to disagree on some Jenara philosophies.
What I do take a bit of an issue with is a LOT of people play without Partial Paris. In fact, I haven't come across anyone at LGSs or otherwise that actually uses PP near where I live. They use the standard mulligan rules for MtG. And the reason I say hand sculpting is stupid is because it is. I understand the reason that it is the "rule" for EDH and, as Sheldon has addressed before, the spirit of the rule is pretty much to make sure you get enough lands, or a somewhat playable hand. It isn't to fish for combo pieces or the nuts draws. Being able to run a more aggressively crafted list regarding land count simply because of the type of mulligan that SOME of the format uses is fine because that is how you play, but dismissing the assertion that there are many people that don't use PP is fallacious. Since the type of mulligan you use has clearly had an impact on your deck construction, just like your personal meta affects some of the cards that are in the actual list, I think that it should be addressed, especially so that people using your resource to learn about and play Jenara who don't use PP won't have negative results thinking that 35 lands is fine.
Scavenging Ooze is also some of the best GY hate you can get in the list. I'd second it in a heartbeat.
One thing that you didn't consider with Gilded Drake is that it being cheap lets you steal that turn 2 or 3 Blightsteel Colossus, or some equally obnoxious reanimate target. And if you do use it late game to steal a high-value creature, you still have plenty of mana to play out the rest of your turn. Since this isn't a Voltron deck, giving them a 1-turn blocker for Jenara is hardly something I'd be overly concerned about.
I find it very interesting that you say that nobody you know uses the Partial Paris mulligans, because in my experience it's the complete opposite. I don't know a single person who DOESN'T use the Partial Paris mulligans for EDH. Every person I've ever played with in person, as far as I can recall, has used Partial Paris mulls, and I can only ever remember a very small handful of people objecting to them in Cockatrice games, out of hundreds of people I've played against on there. Also, there are several stores in my city that run EDH events, and every single one of them enforces Partial Paris mulligans, because it's the rule.
Well, you are running a primer and I am literally telling you that there are people, especially in my area, that do not use Partial Paris mulligans. Given that it is the normal MtG mulligan that we're using, I'd say it isn't that outlandish. You can be combative with me if you want and insinuate I'm a liar, but if you are making deck choices based on the fact that you play with Partial Paris mulligans, I think it is reasonable to include how you would run the deck if you don't play with PP. It's kind of the literal job of a primer. It is supposed to teach and instruct and cover just about everything; that is why you get the tag.
I'm of the opinion mulligan rules aren't really that important. What's important is how a list goes about achieving its goals. Through hate and what not.
Nice job on the content. It looks nice. You might also consider swapping out stax as a weakness for MLD. When I think of stax I think of things like Braids, Cabal Minion (yes I know she is banned) and Smokestack. Against traditional stax having ETB creatures that are cheap to cast tends to actually be a strong counter. If they blow up our lands with MLD, its sort of a different problem but against either keeping a low curve is the answer.
Creature Toolbox Hate (listed as a weakness) - feels slightly off I guess still. Its not incorrect but I think you could possibly go with just Creature Hate or ETB Hate? Humility also feels like it should be listed here as its probably the worst of the lot.
Signature by Inkfox Aesthetics by Xen
[Modern] Allies
Here’s my list for reference – I think you’ll see some pretty striking similarities. http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/13-08-15-wSI-jenara/. I’ll acknowledge I have a glaring lack of GY hate in my 99, but I rarely run into GY decks anyway.
But of course the differences are what matter the most. I’ll discuss some differences between our decks, and my rationale.
Lands – I have a semi-budget land base. Haven’t quite gotten Tundra or Tropical Island, but haven’t been having too much issue. Very glad to see Boseiju, Who Shelters All in your list, I think not enough people run that card.
However, I don’t see the usefulness of the artifact lands. In my opinion, they’re too much of a liability. Sure, Tezzeret can find them, but I’d almost always rather get Sol Ring. Already have sol ring? Grab a sword and go to town. I think the land use is too narrow, and they’re way to vulnerable to sweepers . How bad is an Austere Command going to hurt when you’re hitting your own lands? I’d run the off color fetches (Polluted Delta, Arid Mesa etc) instead, to give you more shuffle effects for Sylvan and Top.
I’ll also agree with ISB – I don’t think Reliquary Tower warrants a slot. If I have 8+ cards in hand, I’m probably winning with 7 of them regardless. I’ve never had a hand I had trouble discarding.
Also, I’m curious – What do you name with Cavern of Souls? One of the things I love about this list is that not many of our creatures are worth countering – it’s their combined synergy is what kills. I guess angel? Jenara doesn’t get countered much.
Creatures – Like I said, it’s great to see those combo creatures in there. Our differences are (primarily) with the top of your curve
Yavimaya Dryad – I think this card is worse than Farhaven Elf. Sure, she can get duals and give your opponent a land if you’re into that sort of thing, but GG makes me queasy in a hand where I’m using this creature for ramp. What if I need a green source?
Stonecloaker – haven’t tested him. Is he good? He seems kind of mana intensive to me, but I can definitely see the use in the bounce.
Solemn Simulacrum – He just seems so low impact to me. He can’t be skullclamped, rezed from Sun Titan. He makes a nice blocker but he just seems like filler to me.
Duplicant – Removal on a stick is nice, but I think you have enough spot removal already. It’s nice that you can get him from Farhaven Elf, but I’m not sure he’s efficient enough.
Angel of Serenity – I’ve never played with her, but I think there are better options. The double use of removal + GY hate is nice, but 7 mana is a lot to pay for this type of effect.
Sphinx of Uthuun – FoF on a stick is great, no doubt about it. But there’s no way to abuse him, outside of Karmic Guide shenanigans.
Suggestions:
Ixidron – I’d run this over Duplicant. The utility is just so nice, and often I find myself not wanting to kill the commander. Who wants to kill Omnath or Kaalia? Just flip it and leave them stranded. We can also recover from this type of effect much faster.
Consecrated Sphinx – I just don’t think we can avoid running him :/ I think he’s better than Sphinx of Uthuun, because when he’s good, he’s game winning. I’ve never seen a game won off a Sphinx of Uthuun/ Can’t say the same for ol’ Concs.
Stoneforge Mystic – I honestly think 4 targets is enough. I only run 3, and I’m never unhappy to draw him (her?) unless I’m out of targets. The utility is just so good.
Vorinclex – I’d run him over the Angel of Serenity. He’s just so powerful and adds another combo win for Palinchron. Alternatively, he can make Jenara huge and beat face.
Gilded Drake – This card is amazing. Giving them a flying blocker is problematic sometimes, but usually the creature I steal is faaaaarrrr better. I think this definitely needs to be in the list somewhere.
Oracle of Mul Daya – with so many shuffle effects, I’d run this card over Solemn Simulacrum. She gets crazy good with off color fetches, and can ramp a crazy amount. Sometimes she’s bad but I usually get at least 1 land, making her better than Simulacrum in my opinion.
Artifacts:
Scrabbling Claws – I’m not an expert on GY removal, since I don’t run any (LOL), but if I were to, I think this is too low impact. I’d much rather run crypt, which can just wreck a GY player. Claws will just delay them a turn at worst.
Lightning Greaves – How has this been working out for you? I used to run it, but I found it unnecessary. Jenara flies low under the radar, and I’ve never found Lightning Greaves to be useful.
Planeswalkers:
Jace, the Mind Sculptor – I haven’t tested him, but he just seems like a massive target and not impactful. Great in 1v1, but not in multiplayer.
Tezzeret, the Seeker – Honestly never been a fan. The tutoring is nice, but he’s 5 mana and rarely lasted a turn for me. I respect the inclusion but I just wasn’t impressed when I played him.
Instants:
Love the list. I run Muddle the Mixture over Counterspell. I love a good counterspell, but I love the utility Muddle gives. It fetches Survival, Stoneforge (in my list), Eladamri’s to get any creature, Phantasmal image, and Gilded Drake. Sooooo many good targets.
Sorceries:
Tooth and Nail – I don’t see much reason for this to be in the list. What do you normally get with it? Deadeye and Palinchron? That requires that you have an outlet for that infinite mana (Jenara excluding, of course). Whenever I tested this card, I found it just clogged up too many hands for it to be worth it.
Bribery – This card needs to be in the list, in my opinion. It wins games, it’s that good. I can use it as early as T4 to get an early Prophet or use it late game to get a monster.
Time Warp – I run two of these effects (Warp and Aeons for budget reasons). I find that these are great for killing someone with an extra turn with Jenara. Generally, I use them to make sure I can kill the table when I get infinite mana and draw my deck (see below). I can just kill everyone with Jenara by looping the extra turn effects and Witness or Snappy.
With regard to your combos, how do you often use the infinite mana? For some reason whenever I get infinite mana, Jenara never seems to be on the field -_- so I can’t kill anybody. I always use a tutor to get Prime Speaker Zegana and then draw my deck off an arbitrarily big Jenara (be sure to leave yourself a few cards in your deck). I then use extra turn effects to kill everyone!
All in all, great list. I’m super excited to see another Jenara primer (hopefully) and I look forward to the discussions between us all!
Regular 450 unpowered cube (with some custom cards) - 450 Unpowered
With the creature toolbox hate, I was going things that specifically hose a value deck like this, like the cards I listed. Humility is definitely one I completely forgot about, and I'll add it in. I feel like just "Create Hate" doesn't really cut it, because stuff like wraths, Lethal Vapors, etc, don't do nearly as much when the creatures are already providing their value just by entering. Also, I think that saying "Creature Toolbox Hate", I'm kind of covering my bases with things hating on the various types value that these decks thrive on (ETB, onto the field tutors like Birthing Pod, recursion, etc).
As for Gilded Drake, I've never been nearly as fond of that card as you are. I played it in here for quite a while, but was never as happy with it as I wanted to be. Besides, can't get it in foil.
Alright, I'll try to hit everything here:
Oh boy, that was a lot of things. I think I need a nap now.
I'm glad you like the list, and the primer, and I'm also very excited to have it up. I've already applied for official primer status, so we'll see.
---
Current Commanders: Derevi, Empyrial Tactician (coming soon) | [Primer] Sedris, the Traitor King | Maelstrom Wanderer | Najeela, the Blade Blossom | Yuriko, the Tiger's Shadow
---
Retired Commanders: [Primer] Jenara, Asura of War | [Primer] Ghave, Guru of Spores | Freyalise, Llanowar's Fury | Saskia the Unyielding | Sydri, Galvanic Genius
I know its not aimed at me but personally, Nissa, Vastwood Seer looks interesting as a whole because it fits into the cheap creatures with an ETB which more importantly gets some mileage later in the game. It more of interests me than being something I am sold on.
Sword of the Animist in my opinion is the big winner. You can curve into Jenara and drop / equip the sword the turn after. It rezes off Sun Titan / Academy Ruins and is an easy target for Stoneforge / Tezzeret if wanted. The deck can always use more mana as it makes it easier to keep up answers as well as giving you more mana to dump into casting and buffing Jenara or Sphinx's Revelation.
I don't think there is anything else I was really looking at. Woodland Bellower is interesting but I don't quite like how it functions.
Signature by Inkfox Aesthetics by Xen
[Modern] Allies
To be completely honest, I hadn't even considered Sword of the Animist here. That being said, I also run a much lower basic count than some others. I love the card, though, and I've recommended it to plenty of other people for their own decks, especially non-Green mono colour decks. Just about any deck with a decent basic count could get some pretty good use out of it, though.
There are three cards in particular that stuck out to me as interesting and/or potentially worth consideration:
---
Current Commanders: Derevi, Empyrial Tactician (coming soon) | [Primer] Sedris, the Traitor King | Maelstrom Wanderer | Najeela, the Blade Blossom | Yuriko, the Tiger's Shadow
---
Retired Commanders: [Primer] Jenara, Asura of War | [Primer] Ghave, Guru of Spores | Freyalise, Llanowar's Fury | Saskia the Unyielding | Sydri, Galvanic Genius
EDIT: I have had some good results with Tragic Arrogance in a few decks too. Its interesting because you get to make the choices for other people. I sort of dismissed it at first but I have been liking it so far in actual play.
Signature by Inkfox Aesthetics by Xen
[Modern] Allies
Tragic Arrogance is another card I hadn't even considered. I'd say it could be a possible replacement for Oblivion Stone, but I'm pretty sure O Stone is still just way better.
Also, I'd be really interested to hear from anybody who has had a chance to try out Evolutionary Leap, particularly in this style of deck, and find out what you thought of it.
---
Current Commanders: Derevi, Empyrial Tactician (coming soon) | [Primer] Sedris, the Traitor King | Maelstrom Wanderer | Najeela, the Blade Blossom | Yuriko, the Tiger's Shadow
---
Retired Commanders: [Primer] Jenara, Asura of War | [Primer] Ghave, Guru of Spores | Freyalise, Llanowar's Fury | Saskia the Unyielding | Sydri, Galvanic Genius
---
Current Commanders: Derevi, Empyrial Tactician (coming soon) | [Primer] Sedris, the Traitor King | Maelstrom Wanderer | Najeela, the Blade Blossom | Yuriko, the Tiger's Shadow
---
Retired Commanders: [Primer] Jenara, Asura of War | [Primer] Ghave, Guru of Spores | Freyalise, Llanowar's Fury | Saskia the Unyielding | Sydri, Galvanic Genius
One thing I noticed is that you have 46% blue mana symbols, but only 29% in your mana distribution. Do you ever find yourself lacking the blue mana to do things? Especially with a lot of UU spells or 1UUU like Cryptic Command is.
The other thing that is probably a combination of meta choice and personal preference is your curve toppers. Most of our card type breakdowns are nearly identical until you get to the top of your list and I just feel like you can do better than the 7 drops that you are currently running, especially Serenity and Uthuun. It isn't that I don't think they are great, but I feel like they are outclassed by a couple other cards that your list is notably missing. I also personally dislike Palinchron, but if you're going for infinite mana, then that is fine.
EDH:
G[cEDH] Selvala, Heart of the StormG
URW[cEDH] Narset, the Last AirmericanURW
GWUSt. Jenara, the ArchangelGWU
UBGrimgrin, Chaos MarineUB
GOmnath, Mana BaronG
URWNarset, Justice League AmericaURW
GWUBAtraxa, Countess of CountersGWUB
GWUEstrid, Enbantress PrimeGWU
At far as the 7 drops I'm using, I've played with a lot of different things at the top of my curve, and these are the ones I've been the happiest with. It's so easy to abuse them here, and they always do a ton. I'm personally not fond of a lot of the top-end creatures you're running. They're not bad, but things like Avacyn, Angel of Hope generally always just eat a Swords to Plowshares and that's the end of it. In my meta, at least. Tons of non-destroy removal. Also, Avenger of Zendikar is fine, but I much prefer him in a dedicated tokens deck. I also don't see myself ever running him without Craterhoof Behemoth alongside him.
---
Current Commanders: Derevi, Empyrial Tactician (coming soon) | [Primer] Sedris, the Traitor King | Maelstrom Wanderer | Najeela, the Blade Blossom | Yuriko, the Tiger's Shadow
---
Retired Commanders: [Primer] Jenara, Asura of War | [Primer] Ghave, Guru of Spores | Freyalise, Llanowar's Fury | Saskia the Unyielding | Sydri, Galvanic Genius
[EDH In Development] Kynaios and Tiro of Meletis | Trostani, Selesnya's Voice | Queen Marchesa | Ruhan of the Fomori | Yahenni, Undying Partisan
[EDH Retired] Ertai, The Corrupted | Sigarda, Host of Herons | Tariel, Reckoner of Souls | Korlash, Heir to Blackblade
[Modern] Stuffy Doll Combo Burn | Demigod of Revenge
---
Current Commanders: Derevi, Empyrial Tactician (coming soon) | [Primer] Sedris, the Traitor King | Maelstrom Wanderer | Najeela, the Blade Blossom | Yuriko, the Tiger's Shadow
---
Retired Commanders: [Primer] Jenara, Asura of War | [Primer] Ghave, Guru of Spores | Freyalise, Llanowar's Fury | Saskia the Unyielding | Sydri, Galvanic Genius
[EDH In Development] Kynaios and Tiro of Meletis | Trostani, Selesnya's Voice | Queen Marchesa | Ruhan of the Fomori | Yahenni, Undying Partisan
[EDH Retired] Ertai, The Corrupted | Sigarda, Host of Herons | Tariel, Reckoner of Souls | Korlash, Heir to Blackblade
[Modern] Stuffy Doll Combo Burn | Demigod of Revenge
Fetching them is a fair point. My personal preference is to have the mana evenly distributed based on prevalence of symbols regardless so that I am more likely to hit what I need without needing to search.
Regarding Gilded Drake, I think it is one of the best 2 drops available. It is almost always going to do something good for you and I'd much rather have it over Phantasmal Image. Courser of Kruphix is seen as being pretty good card filtration and Oracle of Mul Daya is strictly better in most ways. You seem to like to ramp a lot and there is never any harm in being able to dig deeper and get your lands out of the way, be it early or late game. Any top-deck manipulation also works wonders.
Avacyn, Angel of Hope is a little bit of a pet card for me and I like running her. If I force someone to use a premium removal spell on her, I'm generally okay with that so it isn't so bad. Craterhoof Behemoth is a good card to run with Avenger of Zendikar, but I find that he does little to nothing without Avenger on the field with him whereas Avenger is its own engine to pump tokens (as you know, there are plenty of ways to get multiple land drops on a turn). Without a haste enabler as well, it does me little good to fetch them off of TaN. In most situations, demanding a more narrow answer to Avacyn via exile or a bounce + board wipe seems to be preferable to having Avenger and tokens out for a turn unprotected when Craterhoof is subject to an equally narrow answer in that it needs to be countered to stop its effect. Avacyn + Avenger is also a strictly stronger TaN combo unless you plan on killing the table with 3-4 creatures you already had on board so that they + Craterhoof get the pump when TaN resolves. Regardless, I know you run neither so this was merely a thought exercise as to why they are relatively equal in my mind. Forcing an opponent to have an answer though is seldom, if ever, a bad thing.
When I am talking about better 7 drops though, I am most notably hitting on Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite. She is one of the absolute best curve toppers in this style of list without a doubt. She serves as a functional asymmetrical board wipe/debuff and a creature buff for your utility guys at the same time. With her in play, everything you have becomes far more lethal. She also is applicable in far more situations as opposed to Craterhoof while serving the same sort of role. One thing I particularly like about her is that she deals with tokens quite well. Even if she doesn't wipe all of them, she lets every one of your creatures trade/block favorably, guaranteed. I really don't see any reason why she should not be in the list, especially over Angel of Serenity. My problem with Angel is that you stress that your playgroup has many cheap answers. Part of that umbrella is GY hate. I don't imagine your opponents are just going to let you cherry pick from your graveyard getting 3 creatures at a time. I'm also not fond of temporary removal via creatures since they, as a card type, are quite fragile.
I also don't understand your reasoning for not wanting Consecrated Sphinx. You seem to have an issue with it getting cloned, etc. and ending the game on the spot, implying that there are other players in your meta playing combo... but so are you. Drawing out your deck, or however much you need, potentially, isn't a bad thing at all. In fact, being able to dig for whatever you need to end the game yourself in this hypothetical situation is pretty darn good. It is one of the best cards at allowing you to dig for your game ending play in your colors while your opponents, if also playing combo, are probably running their own ways to reach such a point. Consequently, I understand the allure of getting immediate value from Sphinx of Uthuun as opposed to the time-dependent investment that you have to navigate with CS, but you show the same willingness to play an almost identical strategic/philosophically designed card in Prophet of Kruphix. If you are concerned with both of you digging for your combo, bear in mind that you are probably also drawing plenty of counters in order to deal with their threats. Maybe consider Pact of Negation if you are worried about them digging while you are tapped out? I just don't see how your mentality when choosing some cards matches up with the way that you are choosing others. Why not play cards that are better for you winning the game if this list is intended to be as competitive as you seemed to want to make it?
One last thing that I observed is in your game logs, you seem to be getting pretty nuts draws and almost playing out a Magic Christmas Land scenario in several situations where you were able to ramp out for 5-6 turns uninhibited. That can't be a reasonable expectation for those that play this list to encounter. I know that you want to validate the deck to your audience, which is why success stories are great, but I want to know how and with what you recover when things don't always go your way. You mention people running StP as if it and other cheap answers are flying around early on, but in your samples, I don't see anything that would affirm that. I consider myself to be a pretty decent player and, running a deck that is roughly 85-90% identical to yours, I can't say that I ever experience those sorts of things with any relative consistency. This also may be because that my playgroup and I don't play Partial Paris (because hand sculpting is stupid). I'd be interested to know how much things would change if you played using regular mulligan rules as you seem to benefit greatly from what PP has allowed you to get into your opening hand. Given that most people I am aware of tend to not use PP, I'd be curious to see how your 35 lands and other choices would fare in such an environment. Now that this thread is a primer, I think it is pertinent that it is representative of an environment that most players experience, or at least addresses how you would make adjustments for if/when you were not playing this list using PP.
P.S. I'm not trying to give you a hard time or anything. Just trying to keep discussion going on a deck I've enjoyed extensively over the years and help you develop your primer.
EDH:
G[cEDH] Selvala, Heart of the StormG
URW[cEDH] Narset, the Last AirmericanURW
GWUSt. Jenara, the ArchangelGWU
UBGrimgrin, Chaos MarineUB
GOmnath, Mana BaronG
URWNarset, Justice League AmericaURW
GWUBAtraxa, Countess of CountersGWUB
GWUEstrid, Enbantress PrimeGWU
Signature by Inkfox Aesthetics by Xen
[Modern] Allies
I'm also going to stick it in a spoiler, because it's going to be big, and as I've previously mentioned, scrolling sucks.
---
Current Commanders: Derevi, Empyrial Tactician (coming soon) | [Primer] Sedris, the Traitor King | Maelstrom Wanderer | Najeela, the Blade Blossom | Yuriko, the Tiger's Shadow
---
Retired Commanders: [Primer] Jenara, Asura of War | [Primer] Ghave, Guru of Spores | Freyalise, Llanowar's Fury | Saskia the Unyielding | Sydri, Galvanic Genius
BRGrenzo, Dungeon Warden EDH
GAzusa, Always in a Rush EDH
GWUDerevi, Empyrial Warlord EDH
Trade thread on MOTL
Also, there's not a single chance I'd cut Scrabbling Claws. If anything, I kind of want to add more graveyard hate.
---
Current Commanders: Derevi, Empyrial Tactician (coming soon) | [Primer] Sedris, the Traitor King | Maelstrom Wanderer | Najeela, the Blade Blossom | Yuriko, the Tiger's Shadow
---
Retired Commanders: [Primer] Jenara, Asura of War | [Primer] Ghave, Guru of Spores | Freyalise, Llanowar's Fury | Saskia the Unyielding | Sydri, Galvanic Genius
Signature by Inkfox Aesthetics by Xen
[Modern] Allies
---
Current Commanders: Derevi, Empyrial Tactician (coming soon) | [Primer] Sedris, the Traitor King | Maelstrom Wanderer | Najeela, the Blade Blossom | Yuriko, the Tiger's Shadow
---
Retired Commanders: [Primer] Jenara, Asura of War | [Primer] Ghave, Guru of Spores | Freyalise, Llanowar's Fury | Saskia the Unyielding | Sydri, Galvanic Genius
What I do take a bit of an issue with is a LOT of people play without Partial Paris. In fact, I haven't come across anyone at LGSs or otherwise that actually uses PP near where I live. They use the standard mulligan rules for MtG. And the reason I say hand sculpting is stupid is because it is. I understand the reason that it is the "rule" for EDH and, as Sheldon has addressed before, the spirit of the rule is pretty much to make sure you get enough lands, or a somewhat playable hand. It isn't to fish for combo pieces or the nuts draws. Being able to run a more aggressively crafted list regarding land count simply because of the type of mulligan that SOME of the format uses is fine because that is how you play, but dismissing the assertion that there are many people that don't use PP is fallacious. Since the type of mulligan you use has clearly had an impact on your deck construction, just like your personal meta affects some of the cards that are in the actual list, I think that it should be addressed, especially so that people using your resource to learn about and play Jenara who don't use PP won't have negative results thinking that 35 lands is fine.
Scavenging Ooze is also some of the best GY hate you can get in the list. I'd second it in a heartbeat.
One thing that you didn't consider with Gilded Drake is that it being cheap lets you steal that turn 2 or 3 Blightsteel Colossus, or some equally obnoxious reanimate target. And if you do use it late game to steal a high-value creature, you still have plenty of mana to play out the rest of your turn. Since this isn't a Voltron deck, giving them a 1-turn blocker for Jenara is hardly something I'd be overly concerned about.
EDH:
G[cEDH] Selvala, Heart of the StormG
URW[cEDH] Narset, the Last AirmericanURW
GWUSt. Jenara, the ArchangelGWU
UBGrimgrin, Chaos MarineUB
GOmnath, Mana BaronG
URWNarset, Justice League AmericaURW
GWUBAtraxa, Countess of CountersGWUB
GWUEstrid, Enbantress PrimeGWU
---
Current Commanders: Derevi, Empyrial Tactician (coming soon) | [Primer] Sedris, the Traitor King | Maelstrom Wanderer | Najeela, the Blade Blossom | Yuriko, the Tiger's Shadow
---
Retired Commanders: [Primer] Jenara, Asura of War | [Primer] Ghave, Guru of Spores | Freyalise, Llanowar's Fury | Saskia the Unyielding | Sydri, Galvanic Genius
EDH:
G[cEDH] Selvala, Heart of the StormG
URW[cEDH] Narset, the Last AirmericanURW
GWUSt. Jenara, the ArchangelGWU
UBGrimgrin, Chaos MarineUB
GOmnath, Mana BaronG
URWNarset, Justice League AmericaURW
GWUBAtraxa, Countess of CountersGWUB
GWUEstrid, Enbantress PrimeGWU
BRGrenzo, Dungeon Warden EDH
GAzusa, Always in a Rush EDH
GWUDerevi, Empyrial Warlord EDH
Trade thread on MOTL