I definitely agree that both Wild Ricochet and Reverberate have their advantages in different metas.
In other news i've completed the deck and have had nothing but successful games since i've played it! My playgroup loves it since it usually involves unique endings and at the very least it punishes the person who is so very far ahead of everyone else. My favorite thing about the deck is how entertaining it is to pilot and play against. Even now that my playgroup knows I have some trick up my sleeve they still don't know what to fully expect. Even win or loss is always entertaining. (and I must say I do happen to be winning more often then i thought I would)
Reflecting 333,000,000 damage from an artifact creature back at its controller (the player had infinite mana and decided to make the creature that exact number of power/toughness).
Ultimately winning a long drawn out game with many shenanigans (A Zedruu deck was playing) after being at 1 health for 6+ turns by using Soul Conduit to exchange life totals with the last player left and hitting him with Tariel, Reckoner of Souls.
The deck has been extremely successful thus far and I play to add and remove cards accordingly. I love to try new things. I'll certainly be back with updates to share!
Thanks again!
Glad you guys are enjoying it! Yeah, the actual process of playing the deck is really fun for me too. There's a lot of suspense since it always seems like the moment when you can take everyone out at once is almost there. And it usually comes out of nowhere or when it seems like you're at a big disadvantage. While it can sometimes seem like you're not doing much for most of the game, the amount of assessment and reassessment of the game that goes on behind your hand keeps you more than busy.
Firstly, I stroke your ego; I love your deck and your very well put together explanation I like the idea of building a subtle political deck with punisher finishers.
You have said in your extensive breakdown of your deck that alternative generals would most likely need to keep white and red to maintain the essential elements of ‘turnaround’ and defence. The alternative directions you mention either drop black altogether or add blue (Zedruu and Ruhan). I would like to see if I can build a deck using your principles and general but dropping the black for green instead. Green has the advantage of dropping you even lower on the threat radar than either black or blue, especially if there is little in the way of creatures on your board. The general I have in mind is Gahiji, Honored One - his ability meshes so well with the idea of letting other people play their decks and encourages the opponents to smack each other around. My plan is to start with your deck, remove the black and work out what I need to add back in.
Black cards in your deck with their ‘roles’: Blood Reckoning - defence, dissuades swarm attacks Hissing Miasma - defence, dissuades swarm attacks Dread - defence, discourages creatures hurting you, can attack if needed No Mercy - defence, discourages creatures hurting you Sudden Spoiling - defence / disruption. Netherborn Phalanx - turnaround, will kill the player(s) with excessive creatures, can tutor Rakdos Charm - turnaround, will kill the player(s) with excessive creatures, can disrupt Stronghold Discipline - turnaround, will kill the player(s) with excessive creatures Backlash - turnaround, will kill the player with an excessively large creature Phthisis - turnaround, will kill the player with an excessively large creature Batwing Brume - turnaround, will kill the player with an attacking swarm Repay in Kind - turnaround, can put the table in reach of your burn, can combo with Phyrexian Unlife.
That is only 12 out of 99 cards, with 5 defence and 7 turnaround cards including a number of your win conditions, it is going to be a challenge to find replacement effects but I think it is possible to put something together.
Green turnaround options - these are a bit more of a challenge and may require more searching in red or white to fill in the options: Storm Seeker - obvious sudden impact number two. Fresh Meat - kind of a turnaround, but only if we run creatures - I might have to look a bit harder. Fertile Imagination - not a satisfying, kill right now type card like the black options but may be worth trying. Blunt the Assault - can play defence and gain me life there are other cards like this that are the opposite of Rakdos Charm, Netherborn Phalanx type cards, sadly life gain doesn’t win the game outside of silly cards (Felidar Sovereign, Test of Endurance) Tree of Redemption - not really turnaround again but may be able to work with Soul Conduit for some clunky shenanigans.
Sorry for that wall of text:
I’d be interested in people’s opinions on some of the defence / turnaround options available in green especially if there are directions that I haven’t thought of that I should consider.
Are there other Green/Red/White synergies that fit this decks plan and help finish opponents in ways that result in the 'wow that was great' response?
TLDR Gahiji could command a similar style deck IMO
Green has fog effects for defence but not the same tools for ‘turnaround’
Green has potentially better fixing / accel, and disruption.
Firstly, I stroke your ego; I love your deck and your very well put together explanation I like the idea of building a subtle political deck with punisher finishers.
You have said in your extensive breakdown of your deck that alternative generals would most likely need to keep white and red to maintain the essential elements of ‘turnaround’ and defence. The alternative directions you mention either drop black altogether or add blue (Zedruu and Ruhan). I would like to see if I can build a deck using your principles and general but dropping the black for green instead...
Thanks for the detailed feedback! So, I added a paragraph to the "Other Commanders" section which basically sums up my thoughts. Finding ways to abuse Chord of Calling with ETB effects or something similar seems like a way that Green could add in some turnaround cards...but I was able to only find one (besides for Dong Zhou, the Tyrant), and it's really expensive (but awesome). There are a lot of good ETB creatures, but they mostly make use of your own resources or don't care about what your opponent has. Dramatic Entrance (if not for the Green only restriction) and things that put cards from your hand into play might be okay too, but I think Chord is going to be better 95% of the time. I'm sure that there are many creative ways that it can also be used to save yourself like fetching an Elderscale Wurm. With the exception of Dread, I try to tend to avoid anything that can be reanimated or Rite of Replicationed with disastrous effects. If you end up building it, let me know how it works!
How would you recommend using this deck if a common opponent (my brother, for example, I play with a lot) runs Thraximundar.goodstuff? Also, how could I deal with opponents that are heavy on protection spells (Lightning Greaves, Asceticism, etc.)
I replied to this earlier but I did want to say a few things-
1. I have been looking for a deck good for me and have been searching for a while until I came across this beauty. This is exactly the direction I want to go in with EDH.
2. I don't want to copy this deck and am worried that it might get old pretty quickly, so am wondering what I could do to keep it fun to people that play it often.
3. I'm trying to design a version of this deck based with Gisela just because she seems like the perfect card to say "Attack him, not me" and will kill everyone quicker. However, I am a bit disturbed by the lack of rattlesnakes and Rakdos charm this might cause. Any suggestions?
4. Forcefield is 94$.
5. Love the deck! Your videos are great as well.
How would you recommend using this deck if a common opponent (my brother, for example, I play with a lot) runs Thraximundar.goodstuff? Also, how could I deal with opponents that are heavy on protection spells (Lightning Greaves, Asceticism, etc.)
I replied to this earlier but I did want to say a few things-
1. I have been looking for a deck good for me and have been searching for a while until I came across this beauty. This is exactly the direction I want to go in with EDH.
2. I don't want to copy this deck and am worried that it might get old pretty quickly, so am wondering what I could do to keep it fun to people that play it often.
3. I'm trying to design a version of this deck based with Gisela just because she seems like the perfect card to say "Attack him, not me" and will kill everyone quicker. However, I am a bit disturbed by the lack of rattlesnakes and Rakdos charm this might cause. Any suggestions?
4. Forcefield is 94$.
5. Love the deck! Your videos are great as well.
For the goodstuff deck, it depends how he wins (swarm, mill, big creatures, etc.). For creature based strategies, there are lots of cards that'll work. If he uses spells you might look at Wild Ricochet. If he uses a lot of stuff that makes his stuff untargetable, it's okay to add in something like Vandalblast in addition to Shattering Pulse. That new Dawn to Dusk from Born of the Gods looks interesting enough to add in beside Allay if you need more enchantment destruction. It's really not meant to be a 1 vs. 1 deck though. The best is when you have at least one person that's "the muscle", one person that will act as policeman with wraths and counters, and one other that has an aggro bend to it.
1. Thanks! I saw your post in the main section, so I think I get where you're coming from.
2. Using a "150 card deck" and changing which cards are actually in the deck is one way to keep it fresh. If you're going to use Gisela instead it might be different though.
3. Three things to keep in mind if you're trying to capture the feel of the deck without actually using it are 1. Follow the strategy section (don't attack, don't threaten, etc.) 2. Keep all of the power in your hand. Anything that could knock out another player should never be on the board. Also, it should be stuff that has SOMETHING to do with an opponent's board state as opposed to just something like Earthquake which has nothing to do with them like Acidic Soil does and 3. Use cards that allow other people to play their deck because that's usually what the most fun is for them. The Gisela section in the "Other Commanders" section has a bit more info if you haven't already read it. I'd probably try to add in more card draw and more stuff like Reiterate.
4. Yeah, on MTGO it's only 54 cents so that's a bit different. You could always proxy and sleeve it if your group allows that. Otherwise, you'd just have to sub in another card which is okay. Story Circle might be an okay replacement.
As the title currently says, BNG set update is in the second main post and there were a few additions (added Mirari and Survival Cache and removed Plains and Inheritance. I don't think I really have to explain Mirari, but Survival Cache was one I was playtesting for quite a bit. Usually you will have more life than someone else with this deck, and a two for one for three mana is always nice. If I ever see something I'd really want to put in the deck, it might be the first thing cut though.
There's also a new video replay which you can find here.
If you don't mind my doing so in your thread, once I complete the 150 card deck, I'd like to post it here.
No problem, and that would be great. I'd like to put it in the main post also if that's alright as an example of how to build the deck in paper while alternating cards.
Looking for ways to deal with Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir, Grand Abolisher, and yes, Dosan the Falling Leaf since they make a bunch of cards in the deck useless. Gisela, Blade of Goldnight can sometimes be a problem too. I don't really run into City of Solitude that much, so enchantment hate isn't too big of an issue. So, I guess I'm looking for some creature hate (or any card that would get around Teferi and friends) that still fits with the theme of the deck. My initial thought was something like Seal of Doom (I'm sure there are better options though) that sits on the field so it can be used before my turn to get rid of the thing preventing me from playing stuff. Any suggestions?.
Options for taking out creatures are limited when you're working within the confines of this style of deck.
You could use Æther Flash, but that destroys. Humility is another option, but that draws the tables' ire most of the time. Sudden spoiling is out because it's not something that will help most of the time on their turn.
There's also Soul Sculptor, but again, not effective against Abolisher on not your turn.
Seal of Doom is good vs. Dosan, and Teferi, but not Abolisher. Likewise Æther Flash is only good against Dosan and Abolisher, but not Teferei. Of course Humility is good against all creatures with abilities.
Grand Abolisher is beatable without something that draws ire like Aether Flash or Humility. You just need to find effects you can use reactively while he's in play. Lands such as Keldon Necropolis, Barbarian Ring, Cabal Pit, or Mouth of Ronom are all fair. I think cycling on a sorcery is OK too so Decree of Pain could work? Finally I think morph is a special action and can be used through the abolisher effect Bane of the Living is probably the most versatile morph but there are others.
I think that Mouth of Ronom might work best and it seems stupidly inoffensive. I'll try it out, and it gives me an excuse to run Scrying Sheets as well.
Yeah, the big issue with Dictate of the Twin Gods is the mana cost. It's probably most easily comparable to Wild Ricochet or Increasing Vengeance since they'll often serve the same function of doubling damage. However, it can be used in some different situations like when an opponent is attacking another. It also can backfire on you though unlike the copy spells unless you were copying something like Acidic Soil. Ricochet is four mana and can change a target while Vengeance is two or five mana to double or triple the damage. I guess Dictate does act as a "permanent" doubler, but I would really prefer to play it as a finisher so the permanent aspect of it is less important to me than the flash aspect. Also, since we're not playing green or big black, the cheaper the spells, the better.
This deck is a lifestyle.I love the deck so much because it's such a untypical deck to pilot. I don't know how you do it, but I don't have the degree in psychology that it takes to play this deck, especially online. How do you deal with players who see your general and think you're playing boardwipe.dec?
This deck is a lifestyle.I love the deck so much because it's such a untypical deck to pilot. I don't know how you do it, but I don't have the degree in psychology that it takes to play this deck, especially online. How do you deal with players who see your general and think you're playing boardwipe.dec?
Thanks! Playing the deck right isn't hard really as long as you remember two things. The first is don't make people mad at you or attract unwanted attention. Save every turnaround card, and I mean everything for the game ender if you can. Otherwise, never even show that you're capable of dealing damage. The second is sometimes things just won't go your way, but it's really just a game of odds so sometimes they will. Think of all the times you've seen people overextend in EDH with huge token armies, big creatures, or tables of land. That will happen again, and if you play the deck enough, odds are you'll have the right card to deal with it at some point. I don't know if people think I'm playing board wipes although that's not an unheard of strategy for Tariel since she's in the perfect colors for it and has a reanimation ability. Usually when the field is overrun with critters and I'm not playing Wrath of God, they get the hint.
Love your deck, I've used it as the skeleton of my build after seeing this thread and it's been nothing but fun times.
I'm a little more creature heavy since my meta are people that will attack you if they see no blockers... having just one or two of these guys really makes them see me as "not worth it"
I'm drawing these from memory...so probably not all my adds and cuts are here.
Love your deck, I've used it as the skeleton of my build after seeing this thread and it's been nothing but fun times.
I'm a little more creature heavy since my meta are people that will attack you if they see no blockers... having just one or two of these guys really makes them see me as "not worth it"
I'm drawing these from memory...so probably not all my adds and cuts are here.
Thank you very much! Always glad to see people having fun with it. My general aversion to creatures is because of a few reasons. The biggest is that I hate having my stuff Bribery'd, Rite of Replicationed, or Reanimated. I actually used to have Kazuul, Tyrant of the Cliffs and Archon of Justice in the deck, but (a potentially early) Rite of Replication became so ubiquitous on MTGO that Archon became a liability. Sometimes there are aggro decks, but it's possible that MTGO is a little more durdly than your meta since I don't usually get attacked in the first three/four turns (which is usually enough time to put up at least one deterrent) even if I don't have a creature. I used to have Sunforger in the deck (as well as a few other tutors), but I ended up taking them out because it didn't have the potential to be as jaw-dropping when winning with a tutor. If your primary goal is punishing abundance though, it still works really well for that.
The rest of the creatures you put in are all solid, and I'd use Teysa, Envoy of Ghosts as a general if she had Red. I especially like Michiko Konda, Truth Seeker and Glarecaster. The Red copy spells are something I'd like to maybe put more of in, and they're really fun to play too. It looks like you took out a lot of the cards that search for lands. I sometimes run into trouble if I don't hit a few of them. Have you had any issues with having enough mana? Although, you also took out Divine Deflection and Captain's Maneuver which are both very mana intensive cards. Sudden Spoiling has been useful against decks that give their creatures Lifelink (it can possibly interfere with a Rakdos Charm) or just random troublesome creatures you want gone for a turn. Blood Oath is definitely something meta-dependent. Forcefield is usually an all-star for me almost regardless of the other decks though.
Again, glad you like it, and I'm always interested in what ways other players modify it to fit their meta.
Hey! Was thinking of joining mtgsalvation but never got around to it…until I saw your list. I had to comment! Your list looks like exactly the thing I was hoping to find, something fresh. My meta (irl) has gotten a little stale, so I was looking for something to shake it up. And here we are! I am STRONGLY considering buying this list, but as I totaled it up on tcg player, it was 133$+ without the forcefield. Yikes! The top eleven most expensive cards were as follows: forcefield- a ludicrous amount of cash, Dong Zhou, the Tyrant-26$, No Mercy-9$, Tariel, Reckoner of Souls-8$ (but we can't cut her), Hallowed Burial-7$, Mind's Eye-6$, Thawing Glaciers-5.50$, Lightning Greaves-5$, Solemn Simulacrum-4.50$, Chromatic Lantern-4$, and Dread-3$. Those last couple aren,t so bad, but I would like to hear what you would replace those with (as far as cheaper options). Some of the more notorious decks in my meta are a volron/control auras Zur, the Enchanter, a sac/voltron Prossh, Skyraider of Kher, a graveyard/voltron The Mimeoplasmdeck, artifact shenanigans Sydri, Galvanic Genius, Balthor, the Defiled Black stuff, and a Roon of the Hidden Realms blink deck. There are some others, but I can bring those up later if they end up being a huge issue. Some things to think about: is this a deck a one trick pony irl, are there any cards you have on the list to try out that would be suitable replacements, any cards you were sad to let go?
After thinking about that, theres a bit of a hipsterish deck a brewed a few months back, but it is missing something and I can't figure it out. Things to keep in mind: as per rules of the deck, it has to be under 35$, so to give you some wiggle room, I'll probably cut the wayfarer and put it in this deck if I make it. The deck is over at tapped out.com under the deck name hipstermander (sorry about not leaving a link, mtgsalvation won't let me yet).
Thanks again for your time, and hope to see this deck shake up my meta! Cheers, Tiger
Hey! Was thinking of joining mtgsalvation but never got around to it…until I saw your list. I had to comment! Your list looks like exactly the thing I was hoping to find, something fresh. My meta (irl) has gotten a little stale, so I was looking for something to shake it up. And here we are! I am STRONGLY considering buying this list, but as I totaled it up on tcg player, it was 133$+ without the forcefield. Yikes! The top eleven most expensive cards were as follows: forcefield- a ludicrous amount of cash, Dong Zhou, the Tyrant-26$, No Mercy-9$, Tariel, Reckoner of Souls-8$ (but we can't cut her), Hallowed Burial-7$, Mind's Eye-6$, Thawing Glaciers-5.50$, Lightning Greaves-5$, Solemn Simulacrum-4.50$, Chromatic Lantern-4$, and Dread-3$. Those last couple aren,t so bad, but I would like to hear what you would replace those with (as far as cheaper options). Some of the more notorious decks in my meta are a volron/control auras Zur, the Enchanter, a sac/voltron Prossh, Skyraider of Kher, a graveyard/voltron The Mimeoplasmdeck, artifact shenanigans Sydri, Galvanic Genius, Balthor, the Defiled Black stuff, and a Roon of the Hidden Realms blink deck. There are some others, but I can bring those up later if they end up being a huge issue. Some things to think about: is this a deck a one trick pony irl, are there any cards you have on the list to try out that would be suitable replacements, any cards you were sad to let go?
After thinking about that, theres a bit of a hipsterish deck a brewed a few months back, but it is missing something and I can't figure it out. Things to keep in mind: as per rules of the deck, it has to be under 35$, so to give you some wiggle room, I'll probably cut the wayfarer and put it in this deck if I make it. The deck is over at tapped out.com under the deck name hipstermander (sorry about not leaving a link, mtgsalvation won't let me yet).
Thanks again for your time, and hope to see this deck shake up my meta! Cheers, Tiger
Thanks for the comment! Out of those cards, I'd be most likely to cut Forcefield (only because of the price), Dong Zhou, the Tyrant (again, price), and Lightning Greaves (doesn't do as much in this deck). Delirium is a cheap replacement for Dong. Michiko Konda, Truth Seeker or Teysa, Envoy of Ghosts aren't cards less than a dollar, but they're way cheaper than Forcefield. Fork, Reiterate, or any other red copy spell could replace the Greaves pretty easily. You might also consider some of the creatures Omen613 posted in his list just a few posts above this one. Hallowed Burial is a last resort card that sometimes needs to be played if things develop way to quickly. Mind's Eye is essential card draw. Thawing Glaciers is slow but solid ramp. Solemn Simulacrum and Chromatic Lantern both help us since we're not in Green or Blue. Dread is iffy, but I'm usually not upset to see it. I still haven't played the deck irl, but from what some of the people from here who play it live have said, it's not a bad idea to switch cards up in the deck from time to time to keep people guessing. Throw in a Parallectric Feedback or Price of Progress every so often if applicable to the meta. That way it keeps things fresh. Dictate of the Twin Gods is a new option that might be worth looking at. Gisela, Blade of Goldnight is interesting but on the more expensive side.
For the hipster deck, the only things that I can think of that seem funny are Earnest Fellowship and Tower of the Magistrate which both shut down a lot of voltron decks pretty hard. Tower can sometimes be more expensive though.
Thanks for your suggestions! I think Teysa will probably replace dread just because I have a foil of her already. Michiko Konda, Truth Seeker will probably replace No Mercy as well. I also just snagged a foil copy of Wild Ricochet that will also make it in. The idea of replacing Dong with delirium is also an attractive choice. Paralectric Feedback is something I would really consider because of one guy who has a couple of Enduring Ideal decks. Flashing back increasing vengeance would be good times with that. Lastly, I also have a pretty sexy fnm promo of Dictate of the Twin Gods that Id like to stick somewhere. What would you take out for them? Gunna have to keep my eyes open with Kiyomaro, but dawn charm or mana tithe might end up going in. Earnest Fellowship is something I never really thought of that would hit Zur really hard. That alone makes it good.
Glad you guys are enjoying it! Yeah, the actual process of playing the deck is really fun for me too. There's a lot of suspense since it always seems like the moment when you can take everyone out at once is almost there. And it usually comes out of nowhere or when it seems like you're at a big disadvantage. While it can sometimes seem like you're not doing much for most of the game, the amount of assessment and reassessment of the game that goes on behind your hand keeps you more than busy.
[Primer] WBR Tariel: You'll Thank Me For This WBR [Primer]
GGG Dosan of the Green Rainbow GGG
RWU Zedruu: I Ain't Even Mad RWU
You have said in your extensive breakdown of your deck that alternative generals would most likely need to keep white and red to maintain the essential elements of ‘turnaround’ and defence. The alternative directions you mention either drop black altogether or add blue (Zedruu and Ruhan). I would like to see if I can build a deck using your principles and general but dropping the black for green instead. Green has the advantage of dropping you even lower on the threat radar than either black or blue, especially if there is little in the way of creatures on your board. The general I have in mind is Gahiji, Honored One - his ability meshes so well with the idea of letting other people play their decks and encourages the opponents to smack each other around. My plan is to start with your deck, remove the black and work out what I need to add back in.
Black cards in your deck with their ‘roles’:
Blood Reckoning - defence, dissuades swarm attacks
Hissing Miasma - defence, dissuades swarm attacks
Dread - defence, discourages creatures hurting you, can attack if needed
No Mercy - defence, discourages creatures hurting you
Sudden Spoiling - defence / disruption.
Netherborn Phalanx - turnaround, will kill the player(s) with excessive creatures, can tutor
Rakdos Charm - turnaround, will kill the player(s) with excessive creatures, can disrupt
Stronghold Discipline - turnaround, will kill the player(s) with excessive creatures
Backlash - turnaround, will kill the player with an excessively large creature
Phthisis - turnaround, will kill the player with an excessively large creature
Batwing Brume - turnaround, will kill the player with an attacking swarm
Repay in Kind - turnaround, can put the table in reach of your burn, can combo with Phyrexian Unlife.
That is only 12 out of 99 cards, with 5 defence and 7 turnaround cards including a number of your win conditions, it is going to be a challenge to find replacement effects but I think it is possible to put something together.
Green defence options:
Fog effects:
To be a decent deterrent to attack the defence needs to sit on the table threatening to render their attack pointless, Spike Weaver, Spore Frog, Dawnstrider, Radiant Kavu. Maybe Constant Mists (once it’s done it’s job once people will perhaps be deterred), maybe Sekki, Seasons' Guide (can prevent or neutralise attacks).
Deathtouch or regeneration:
Deadly Recluse, Death-Hood Cobra, Thornweald archer, Kessig Recluse, Voracious Cobra, Hornet Queen, Engulfing Slagwurm - can all deter people attacking me.
Hunted Troll gives the guy with no creatures four faeries that are 3/1 attacking someone other than me if Gahiji is in play. He is also an 8 power defender with regeneration that should prevent people turning guys sideways in my direction.
Krosan Warchief accelerates and regenerates Gahiji.
Broken Fall, Asceticism - threaten to regenerate my general or my death touch guy if they get killed.
Rattlesnakes:
Giant Trap Door Spider
Green turnaround options - these are a bit more of a challenge and may require more searching in red or white to fill in the options:
Storm Seeker - obvious sudden impact number two.
Fresh Meat - kind of a turnaround, but only if we run creatures - I might have to look a bit harder.
Fertile Imagination - not a satisfying, kill right now type card like the black options but may be worth trying.
Blunt the Assault - can play defence and gain me life there are other cards like this that are the opposite of Rakdos Charm, Netherborn Phalanx type cards, sadly life gain doesn’t win the game outside of silly cards (Felidar Sovereign, Test of Endurance)
Tree of Redemption - not really turnaround again but may be able to work with Soul Conduit for some clunky shenanigans.
Green does potentially add some different strengths to the deck (even if winning easier isn’t one of them).
Mana fixing / deck acceleration:
Cultivate, Skyshroud Claim, Farseek, Sakura-tribe elder, Rampant Growth, Kodama's Reach, Wood Elves . . .
Harmonize, Compost, Sylvan library, Momentous Fall.
Disruption:
Krosan Grip, Acidic Slime, Terastodon, Artifact Mutation, Aura Mutation, Beast Within.
Sorry for that wall of text:
I’d be interested in people’s opinions on some of the defence / turnaround options available in green especially if there are directions that I haven’t thought of that I should consider.
Are there other Green/Red/White synergies that fit this decks plan and help finish opponents in ways that result in the 'wow that was great' response?
TLDR
Gahiji could command a similar style deck IMO
Green has fog effects for defence but not the same tools for ‘turnaround’
Green has potentially better fixing / accel, and disruption.
Thanks for the detailed feedback! So, I added a paragraph to the "Other Commanders" section which basically sums up my thoughts. Finding ways to abuse Chord of Calling with ETB effects or something similar seems like a way that Green could add in some turnaround cards...but I was able to only find one (besides for Dong Zhou, the Tyrant), and it's really expensive (but awesome). There are a lot of good ETB creatures, but they mostly make use of your own resources or don't care about what your opponent has. Dramatic Entrance (if not for the Green only restriction) and things that put cards from your hand into play might be okay too, but I think Chord is going to be better 95% of the time. I'm sure that there are many creative ways that it can also be used to save yourself like fetching an Elderscale Wurm. With the exception of Dread, I try to tend to avoid anything that can be reanimated or Rite of Replicationed with disastrous effects. If you end up building it, let me know how it works!
[Primer] WBR Tariel: You'll Thank Me For This WBR [Primer]
GGG Dosan of the Green Rainbow GGG
RWU Zedruu: I Ain't Even Mad RWU
1. I have been looking for a deck good for me and have been searching for a while until I came across this beauty. This is exactly the direction I want to go in with EDH.
2. I don't want to copy this deck and am worried that it might get old pretty quickly, so am wondering what I could do to keep it fun to people that play it often.
3. I'm trying to design a version of this deck based with Gisela just because she seems like the perfect card to say "Attack him, not me" and will kill everyone quicker. However, I am a bit disturbed by the lack of rattlesnakes and Rakdos charm this might cause. Any suggestions?
4. Forcefield is 94$.
5. Love the deck! Your videos are great as well.
For the goodstuff deck, it depends how he wins (swarm, mill, big creatures, etc.). For creature based strategies, there are lots of cards that'll work. If he uses spells you might look at Wild Ricochet. If he uses a lot of stuff that makes his stuff untargetable, it's okay to add in something like Vandalblast in addition to Shattering Pulse. That new Dawn to Dusk from Born of the Gods looks interesting enough to add in beside Allay if you need more enchantment destruction. It's really not meant to be a 1 vs. 1 deck though. The best is when you have at least one person that's "the muscle", one person that will act as policeman with wraths and counters, and one other that has an aggro bend to it.
1. Thanks! I saw your post in the main section, so I think I get where you're coming from.
2. Using a "150 card deck" and changing which cards are actually in the deck is one way to keep it fresh. If you're going to use Gisela instead it might be different though.
3. Three things to keep in mind if you're trying to capture the feel of the deck without actually using it are 1. Follow the strategy section (don't attack, don't threaten, etc.) 2. Keep all of the power in your hand. Anything that could knock out another player should never be on the board. Also, it should be stuff that has SOMETHING to do with an opponent's board state as opposed to just something like Earthquake which has nothing to do with them like Acidic Soil does and 3. Use cards that allow other people to play their deck because that's usually what the most fun is for them. The Gisela section in the "Other Commanders" section has a bit more info if you haven't already read it. I'd probably try to add in more card draw and more stuff like Reiterate.
4. Yeah, on MTGO it's only 54 cents so that's a bit different. You could always proxy and sleeve it if your group allows that. Otherwise, you'd just have to sub in another card which is okay. Story Circle might be an okay replacement.
5. Thank you very much!
[Primer] WBR Tariel: You'll Thank Me For This WBR [Primer]
GGG Dosan of the Green Rainbow GGG
RWU Zedruu: I Ain't Even Mad RWU
There's also a new video replay which you can find here.
[Primer] WBR Tariel: You'll Thank Me For This WBR [Primer]
GGG Dosan of the Green Rainbow GGG
RWU Zedruu: I Ain't Even Mad RWU
If you don't mind my doing so in your thread, once I complete the 150 card deck, I'd like to post it here.
No problem, and that would be great. I'd like to put it in the main post also if that's alright as an example of how to build the deck in paper while alternating cards.
[Primer] WBR Tariel: You'll Thank Me For This WBR [Primer]
GGG Dosan of the Green Rainbow GGG
RWU Zedruu: I Ain't Even Mad RWU
[Primer] WBR Tariel: You'll Thank Me For This WBR [Primer]
GGG Dosan of the Green Rainbow GGG
RWU Zedruu: I Ain't Even Mad RWU
You could use Æther Flash, but that destroys. Humility is another option, but that draws the tables' ire most of the time. Sudden spoiling is out because it's not something that will help most of the time on their turn.
There's also Soul Sculptor, but again, not effective against Abolisher on not your turn.
Seal of Doom is good vs. Dosan, and Teferi, but not Abolisher. Likewise Æther Flash is only good against Dosan and Abolisher, but not Teferei. Of course Humility is good against all creatures with abilities.
Great suggestions!
[Primer] WBR Tariel: You'll Thank Me For This WBR [Primer]
GGG Dosan of the Green Rainbow GGG
RWU Zedruu: I Ain't Even Mad RWU
Removed: Auntie's Hovel, Survival Cache, Plains, and Non-Snow-Covered Basics.
I've also added a new video which you can find here. I recorded it, but it was actually a game played by another player (Darty17).
[Primer] WBR Tariel: You'll Thank Me For This WBR [Primer]
GGG Dosan of the Green Rainbow GGG
RWU Zedruu: I Ain't Even Mad RWU
[Primer] WBR Tariel: You'll Thank Me For This WBR [Primer]
GGG Dosan of the Green Rainbow GGG
RWU Zedruu: I Ain't Even Mad RWU
[Primer] WBR Tariel: You'll Thank Me For This WBR [Primer]
GGG Dosan of the Green Rainbow GGG
RWU Zedruu: I Ain't Even Mad RWU
Thanks! Playing the deck right isn't hard really as long as you remember two things. The first is don't make people mad at you or attract unwanted attention. Save every turnaround card, and I mean everything for the game ender if you can. Otherwise, never even show that you're capable of dealing damage. The second is sometimes things just won't go your way, but it's really just a game of odds so sometimes they will. Think of all the times you've seen people overextend in EDH with huge token armies, big creatures, or tables of land. That will happen again, and if you play the deck enough, odds are you'll have the right card to deal with it at some point. I don't know if people think I'm playing board wipes although that's not an unheard of strategy for Tariel since she's in the perfect colors for it and has a reanimation ability. Usually when the field is overrun with critters and I'm not playing Wrath of God, they get the hint.
[Primer] WBR Tariel: You'll Thank Me For This WBR [Primer]
GGG Dosan of the Green Rainbow GGG
RWU Zedruu: I Ain't Even Mad RWU
I'm a little more creature heavy since my meta are people that will attack you if they see no blockers... having just one or two of these guys really makes them see me as "not worth it"
I'm drawing these from memory...so probably not all my adds and cuts are here.
I also run Sunforger, Fork, Wound Reflection and every Copy spell red has to offer which has always worked out very nicely
Some cards I cut
Dong Zhou, the Tyrant - cause I don't have one
and i cut land down to 38
Thank you very much! Always glad to see people having fun with it. My general aversion to creatures is because of a few reasons. The biggest is that I hate having my stuff Bribery'd, Rite of Replicationed, or Reanimated. I actually used to have Kazuul, Tyrant of the Cliffs and Archon of Justice in the deck, but (a potentially early) Rite of Replication became so ubiquitous on MTGO that Archon became a liability. Sometimes there are aggro decks, but it's possible that MTGO is a little more durdly than your meta since I don't usually get attacked in the first three/four turns (which is usually enough time to put up at least one deterrent) even if I don't have a creature. I used to have Sunforger in the deck (as well as a few other tutors), but I ended up taking them out because it didn't have the potential to be as jaw-dropping when winning with a tutor. If your primary goal is punishing abundance though, it still works really well for that.
The rest of the creatures you put in are all solid, and I'd use Teysa, Envoy of Ghosts as a general if she had Red. I especially like Michiko Konda, Truth Seeker and Glarecaster. The Red copy spells are something I'd like to maybe put more of in, and they're really fun to play too. It looks like you took out a lot of the cards that search for lands. I sometimes run into trouble if I don't hit a few of them. Have you had any issues with having enough mana? Although, you also took out Divine Deflection and Captain's Maneuver which are both very mana intensive cards. Sudden Spoiling has been useful against decks that give their creatures Lifelink (it can possibly interfere with a Rakdos Charm) or just random troublesome creatures you want gone for a turn. Blood Oath is definitely something meta-dependent. Forcefield is usually an all-star for me almost regardless of the other decks though.
Again, glad you like it, and I'm always interested in what ways other players modify it to fit their meta.
[Primer] WBR Tariel: You'll Thank Me For This WBR [Primer]
GGG Dosan of the Green Rainbow GGG
RWU Zedruu: I Ain't Even Mad RWU
After thinking about that, theres a bit of a hipsterish deck a brewed a few months back, but it is missing something and I can't figure it out. Things to keep in mind: as per rules of the deck, it has to be under 35$, so to give you some wiggle room, I'll probably cut the wayfarer and put it in this deck if I make it. The deck is over at tapped out.com under the deck name hipstermander (sorry about not leaving a link, mtgsalvation won't let me yet).
Thanks again for your time, and hope to see this deck shake up my meta! Cheers, Tiger
My Peasant-Cube-in-Progress http://www.cubetutor.com/viewcube/15395
Thanks for the comment! Out of those cards, I'd be most likely to cut Forcefield (only because of the price), Dong Zhou, the Tyrant (again, price), and Lightning Greaves (doesn't do as much in this deck). Delirium is a cheap replacement for Dong. Michiko Konda, Truth Seeker or Teysa, Envoy of Ghosts aren't cards less than a dollar, but they're way cheaper than Forcefield. Fork, Reiterate, or any other red copy spell could replace the Greaves pretty easily. You might also consider some of the creatures Omen613 posted in his list just a few posts above this one. Hallowed Burial is a last resort card that sometimes needs to be played if things develop way to quickly. Mind's Eye is essential card draw. Thawing Glaciers is slow but solid ramp. Solemn Simulacrum and Chromatic Lantern both help us since we're not in Green or Blue. Dread is iffy, but I'm usually not upset to see it. I still haven't played the deck irl, but from what some of the people from here who play it live have said, it's not a bad idea to switch cards up in the deck from time to time to keep people guessing. Throw in a Parallectric Feedback or Price of Progress every so often if applicable to the meta. That way it keeps things fresh. Dictate of the Twin Gods is a new option that might be worth looking at. Gisela, Blade of Goldnight is interesting but on the more expensive side.
For the hipster deck, the only things that I can think of that seem funny are Earnest Fellowship and Tower of the Magistrate which both shut down a lot of voltron decks pretty hard. Tower can sometimes be more expensive though.
[Primer] WBR Tariel: You'll Thank Me For This WBR [Primer]
GGG Dosan of the Green Rainbow GGG
RWU Zedruu: I Ain't Even Mad RWU
Thanks again, Tiger
My Peasant-Cube-in-Progress http://www.cubetutor.com/viewcube/15395