MTG Salvation

Sol Ring really isn't needed I feel if you are going for less competitive. Is there a reason why you have sanctity? Beyond the obvious that is.

Quote from deadheaven

Sol Ring really isn't needed I feel if you are going for less competitive. Is there a reason why you have sanctity? Beyond the obvious that is.

sol ring just for acceleration. it was a thought but probably is just a wasted slot and horrid topdeck.

sanctity to prevent them from attacking my GY. because this is a slower format, this deck has to commit to the graveyard hard and early, and GY hate hurts.

This is true, what else are you using to really combat that? I too have found that to be an issue in some games.

Solitary Confinement and Leyline are about it?

Yea, not much else. Wizards doesn't exactly print anti-graveyard hate

Solitary serves as antiantigy, and as a Moat for myself in case someone drops a fattie that cant be dealt with.

There is also Witchbane Orb, which has the plus of being recurable with Academy Ruins.

Quote from iron

There is also Witchbane Orb, which has the plus of being recurable with Academy Ruins.

I must find one now. That is definitely a brilliant addition.

Quote from deadheaven

I must find one now. That is definitely a brilliant addition.

+1 for brilliance, on my list!

How useful has ad nauseam been for you?

Dark Confidant seems like it could have some use in here. While hitting a Liege would hurt, it will generate you card advantage for sure.

Just an idea.

Quote from deadheaven

How useful has ad nauseam been for you?

as in many decks; hit or miss. More hit than anything. Especially if you can Scroll Rack first It usually draws me 1.5 cards for 1 life or so, which is pretty decent. Another reason my curve is low; it benefits Ad Nauseum too! If i just need business, ill tutor up Ad Nauseum and go to town.

Like most of the deck, it exists for the fun it brings to the table and myself. It has the downside of revealing more of your gameplan however. And it also hurts having Leige/Avenger in the deck.

Dark Confidant should be an obvious addition. Waiting to hopefully pull one from modern masters Wish I would have kept the one I pulled in 2005 when they were only $12. But much like Ad Naus, high cmc hurts. Plus, i have a few good draw engines. As much as one more wouldnt hurt, I'm on the fence about Bob.


Current list of additions

• Command Tower
  
• Avenger of Zendikar
  
• Academy Ruins
  
• Wargate
  
• dune-brood nephilim
  
• Rings of Brighthearth
  
• Witchbane orb
  
• dark confidant
  
• Leyline of Sanctity

More or less responding to myself

We have some, as as they call it in Warmachine/Hordes, Skornergy with Child of Alara and all of my protection artifacts and enchantments.

The Skorne are also renowned for a trait that is not exclusive to them, but so agonizingly prevalent in their forces that it has been named after them. It is Skornergy. Skornergy is the opposite of synergy, it is a thing in which two good abilities or features are mutually exclusive or contradictory.

source: http://battlecollege.wikispaces.com/mkiiSkorne


As much as I want to include more and more of these protection artifacts, I need to be wary of my own general nuking the board. I lose GY protection at the cost of nuking their fatties.

Basically, it just means cute things like Rings of Brighthearth would be just awesome, but only if I can grab them back with Academy Ruins, and if i dont have untap effects out, I need to take care how many I keep around.

But the big advantage to losing my fun artifacts and enchantments (by the way, no way to return them outside of one time effects like Regrowth), I kill theirs. And knowing other players, theirs are a mix of mana rocks and plain evil #@!%.

That's why I try to keep most of my CA and protection at or under 3cmc for Sun Titan. Or make them artifacts for Ruins.

Got to play a for real 1v1 game (despite being for multiplayer, needed to test)

Liege of the Tangle could have won me the game if his Omnath wasnt so built up. Was having trouble drawing appropriate removal while searching for a wincon under Maze of Ith and Ensnaring Bridge.

No real out for an enchantment with Shroud other than Oblivion stone... and it would have set me back further than him, since he could recast his general for nothing and started swinging.

Harmonize. Sometimes its hit, mostly miss. I really get it when I need actual business... And then, I have to pay 2GG to draw actual business, which can be nice, as its +2CA, but at that cost.

Still need to massage out the manabase. Just not feeling the above two cards so far. Need to find more multiplayer groups to test with, as Liege shines against un-built up opponents.

+ Command Tower / - Rupture Spire
+ Witchbane orb / - Solitary Confinement

Obvious replacements. If I still have issues with being targeted by creature damage too much, Solitary can come back in, but it was basically for recursive hexproof with suntitan and the like when im stabilized. This rock however is recurable with Academy Ruins, which is on its way.

In addition, still looking to smooth and massage out the manabase to better account for the fact the deck is primarily BUG.


Current list of additions

• Wargate
  
• reflecting pool
  
• summer bloom
  
• ob nixilis
  
• gemstone mine
  
• exotic orchard
  
• Lotus Vale
  
• Admonition Angel
  
• vampire hexmage
  
• dark depths
  

and if i could, R&D's Secret Lair
i got dune-brood nephilim, academy ruins, and avenger cheap and are testing them currently.

Adding pictures and more in depth information to the opening post.

Also, per the topic in the General Commander forums, would Polymorph effects be cool? or more cute than useful? i can see transforming tokens into a huge beater or ramper. However, I feel I'd have to put back in manlands like treetop village kher keep and fairae conclave

thoughts?

It could be done, but you would have to retool the entire deck around them.

Quote from iron

It could be done, but you would have to retool the entire deck around them.

Probably true, even with just adding something small like Dryad Arbor for Survival and Polymorph would seem to be worth it to me. Maybe not tool the deck around it, but make it a cute combo.

I found Survival to be really useless. Don't have enough creatures to make it truly worth while. I'm not saying its bad in this deck... when it works it will help but at those points I had possibilities to simply tutor for the creature instead.

really? I read the old lands primer and got the idea of recurring Arbor and using survival to tutor out the fun creatures.

If it doesnt work i wont bother. And yea, usually intuition, once i have an engine going, grabs those creatures anyway.

Exactly as you state... it makes some sense but you just will run out of creatures in your deck to make it truly useful.

- Steam Vents / + Dune Brood Nephalim
testing this guy out. hoping he can make me a bunch of sand creatures. he probably will just get chumped all day as there's no room for creature support. at least leige has trample and is 8/8.

- Orzhov Basilica / + Academy Ruins
dont need more cipt lands, especially ones that hurt when i need them most. academy ruins is bonkers in this deck.

- stomping grounds / + Crosis Catacombs
bounce lands > shock lands. plus BUR, especially BU are needed.

and KotR is testing way better than expected. I expected for him to be a little bit cool, but mannn. Just tutoring with him to filter lands out of the deck is incredibly potent.

Anyone else use summer bloom in their variants? I may test it. It looks bad, it does, but to me, it looks good, even later on. The tempo gain I get from it is obvious earlier on, but even late game the ability to drop half my hand on the table. Meh. Think it's just up to some testing. Busy this week but i hope to next.

decided to test my mostly unused wincons seismic assault and liege of the tangle.

Seismic assault couldnt do much once i started dropping my hand. Also, it's tough to get RRR when i need it midgame as my deck is primarily BUG, with the fetches only grabbing W. It really needs loam and/or creeping reinassance to do good things. Hell, even ad nauseam. It burned a few hatebears off the board, then next turn i dropped liege. it got countered, recurred, then cast, then connected, then bounced. but it was too late. I had 11 lands and turned 5 into 8/8's. No one had any wrath's [left]. But it does burn off excess lands. Skornergy with scroll rack.

Fringe case. But Terra Eternal would have been awesome in that scenario if i didnt shuffle it away. oops. scroll rack is insane as well with our bouncelands and draw. bounce a basic, shuffle it away.

or petrified field into flooded strand into a plateau is some awesome filtering. and slyvan scrying into vesuva into a maze of ith is not nice. That's what i really like about this deck.

bazaar of baghdad is questionable. it helps me dump excess cards and dig deeper, but i'm losing CA. Only got two games in with it so far so it's too early to say, but if it performs well i'll drop the money for one.

treetop village and or nantuko monastery will both probably be dropped soon. they were/are mostly used as chump blockers, however, i rarely get to animate them and usually pitch them or get disgusted when i draw them. They're not redundant and dont work toward an end goal of the deck. if i was playing manland prison/control, which ive seen some cool lists of on these forums, then yeah, they're efficient and powerful.

they may get dropped for any of the following new ideas

• Wargate
  
• reflecting pool
  
• summer bloom
  
• ob nixilis
  
• avenger of zendikar
  
• gemstone mine
  
• exotic orchard
  
• Lotus Vale
  
• The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
  
• demonic tutor
  
• vampire hexmage
  
• dark depths
  
• oblivion ring
  
• Naturalize
  
• Island
  
• Plains

working toward more efficient tutors, gold lands to replace bouncelands and manlands, etc. lotus vale to nuke unneeded lands, especially with loam.

readding the hexmage DD combo. Didn't ever get it to go off before, hopefully a more tuned deck can pull it off. 30 mana isnt difficult either. And hexmage can nuke walkers, and isnt hard to cast now that im getting more black sources.

ob nixilis and avenger of zendikar were old suggestions from page 2. They're both vying for liege's creaturespot. I really hate big fatties for this deck in general as they're bribery targets and this deck only has so many ways to deal with them.

finally, summer bloom was an interesting one. 3 lands is insane tempo at any part of the game for this deck, but i have a feeling it's just worthless.

aaannnd o ring for emurakul and other pesky cards.

Basic lands are in case i need to fetch out something to kill a Blood Moon.

Naturalize is vying for slice in twain's spot. I dont know if i wanna pay 1G for it to cantrip. It has mattered but it has hurt as well.

Working on foiling what I can of the deck. Most of the land fetches and nonbasics are fairly cheap at foil. Some I'll be better off just getting signed. Momir Vig was like 50% foil because half of it was jank rares. sigh.

-1 treetop village / +1 city of brass
-1 nantuko monastery / +1 demonic tutor
-1 dune brood nephalim / +1 Plains
-1 Crumbling Necropolis / +1 exotic orchard

Did a 1v1 vs my momir vig u/g control combo deck and some other casual edh. Found myself wishing I had scapeshift to tutor out the lands i needed, and pitch my unneeded lands. Need to look into an artifact or enchantment based land sac outlet. I know there's one that sacs lands to blow up enchantments. that's may be what i need. Artifacts seem to be 60/40 on hurting this deck more however.

kinda hilarious. He briberied, then cloned my liege twice. Sorry, cant break through two maze of iths **vesuva**, and by the time the third one hit, meekstone. He sadly didnt have any non-creature bounce or kill at that point.

dune brood nephalim seems too much of a winmore card. though i got a foil for $2 to test with, he is a 3/3 vanilla essentially. only useful against a clear board, which is turn 2-5 or post wrath. every time i draw him, i wish it was something else. I've casted him once and he was chumped to oblivion. Nearly every other wincon or board presence card is better. He is getting dropped for a basic Plains. How embarrassing.

genju of the realm is much like the above card; dead early on, as it's too difficult to cast early on. If I was playing a deck using more nonbasics that produce colored mana and manlands, sure. I hope to someday cast it, but it usually gets Scroll Rack'd and shuffled away, or discarded, or is just a dead card.

rude awakening testing out pretty well for easy kills. Much better than expected, but an absolute dead card until you can Retwine it.

Thoughts?

cards came in the mail

-1 Golgari Rot Farm / +1 Scapeshift
-1 Genju of the Realm / +1 Dark Depths
-1 Rootbound Crag / +1 Gemstone Mine
-1 Maelstrom Nexus / +1 Wargate

Tired of drawing into these dead or slow cards. planning to add hexmage once i grab it off my buddy to add that combo back in. If it ends up being dilluting again it will get removed. Genju was too damn awkward and usually came out too late for it to matter.

At this point; Leige is meh. It's rarely a killcon I want to see or go after. But, unlike many of the others, it can kill on its own. A Naturalize or Path to Exile may even take it's place.

It was really fun to finally kill with Seismic Assault. Windfall, kill his hatebears and lands to the dome for 6. creeping Renaissance for 20 to the dome. Next turn, flashback and win. Knight of the Reliquary was MVP again. He just is too good. He enables most of the killcons in the deck by filling the GY, and makes me want to get every Plains and Forest based AUBR duals.

List of ideas

• Wargate
  
• reflecting pool
  
• summer bloom
  
• avenger of zendikar
  
• Lotus Vale
  
• The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
  
• vampire hexmage
  
• oblivion ring
  
• Naturalize
  
• Island
  

current proxies

• Bazaar of Baghdad
  
• Tropical Island

Bazaar is meh, tropical is a Must Have, and will be purchased when possible.

-1 Sun Titan / +1 Wargate
-1 Harmonize / +1 Lim-Dul's Vault
-1 Slice in Twain / +1 Nature's Claim

Sun Titan is winmore. Hard to cast and even more difficult to use. Giant target, and never want to tutor him outside of fringe situations.

swapped bazaar of baghdad for tabernacle at pendrell vale. results have been devestating; where bazaar was winmore when I was trying to fill the yard with lands for Knight or Worm Harvest, Tabernacle hurts decks hard early mid and late. Just gotta be careful of the hate i get.


list of ideas
Phyrexian Tower to replace Grim Backwoods

• reflecting pool
  
• summer bloom
  
• avenger of zendikar
  
• vampire hexmage