MTG Salvation

Back in the old Mimeoplasm days we just turned everything into Elephants and bounced them and it was enough. Hi, everyone
I moved off from BURG reanimator because I didn't like to constantly evaluate if what I was doing shouldn't be Hulk instead. My reanimation went to Kess Twin, rebuilt Tas comboing with EEvolution into Razaketh/Tidespout into infinite mana from Scepter. But my main deck now is Najeela aggro control.
I came here to ask if you tried the undergrowth Demonic Tutor? I don't have a deck for it right now but in yours with just a dork in the grave you can find Entomb and Reanimate, with two all the reanimation.

Quote from kvothe »

Back in the old Mimeoplasm days we just turned everything into Elephants and bounced them and it was enough. Hi, everyone
I moved off from BURG reanimator because I didn't like to constantly evaluate if what I was doing shouldn't be Hulk instead. My reanimation went to Kess Twin, rebuilt Tas comboing with EEvolution into Razaketh/Tidespout into infinite mana from Scepter. But my main deck now is Najeela aggro control.
I came here to ask if you tried the undergrowth Demonic Tutor? I don't have a deck for it right now but in yours with just a dork in the grave you can find Entomb and Reanimate, with two all the reanimation.

Back in the good old days where palinchron and deadeye were good enough.

I have debated the new tutor and I can see it being either terrible or awesome. Not sure yet, still would need to find a cut and I want to try Niv-Mizzet first. And of course I just re-added kederekt so I can't cut him again.

Could you punch a girl in the face and steal her cards??? Solonqo steals decks from other players and uses them in competition.

@Zach Butler
What is this comment about? It doesn't make any sense.

Having a lot of debate on if I cut razaketh here. He's very useful when it's later in the game when I have 6 mana to work with but it also requires a dork. I can find life/death to sac lands for combo but if it was usef already that's another 2 mana to find snapcaster or briefing. With life death I can find Entomb (which is also likely used by now) and an enchantment but that's another 3 mana at least.
So it's 1 for life, 1 for Entomb, and 2 for animate dead. This is assuming I haven't used any of them so I don't need to find snapcaster and/or briefing to play them again and if opponent has counters it means even more creatures and mana is needed. Don't think it's as feasible in this build and I often find myself reanimating someone else over razaketh since I typically don't run many creatures. I don't know entirely about cutting him but it's been a concern


I want to try the new niv mizzet in his spot. While it's not Nezahal or sphinx I think it's a decent test. Who knows

-Razaketh, the foul-blooded
-Memory's Journey
-Trickbind

+Mausleoum secrets
+Niv-Mizzet, parun
+Logic knot

Want to try knot again. Have ended up wishing I had it in some situations so I want to try it again. Haven't needed Journey or Trickbind much recently but can see either returning.

So I've been debating on if moving from reanimator combo to reanimator mid range would be better for the deck. Right now most wins are from Jin and often unless I can do it right away the combo pieces aren't as great. I'm thinking of switching from Thrasios to Kydele, Chosen of Kruphix and vial smasher
The addition of Logic knot again and how it let me win a few games that I otherwise couldn't made me think this and my group has been moving towards more control decks which makes the comboing much harder.

Essentially with Kydele I would be removing
Worldgroger, Lab man, Tainted pact, life-death, and some other cards that focus more on combo and adding wheels/theif along with Waste not, Teferi's puzzle box, Gilded lotus, Emrakul, the promised end, Bloodcheif ascension, treasonous ogre.

This is just something that I've been considering the last few days that I think could work out. Looking for more thoughts as well.

Would definitely be interested in seeing a midrange build from you!

Definitely check out DementedKirby's take on Vial/Kydele.

I've been following your Reanimator since it was Tasigur and it has been fantastic resource. Can't wait to see where you take it next.

'Tis blasphemy! What would the internet do without your Reanimator Combo list?!

No, I think that it's a good move. In the Teferi Discord, there's also been a shift towards more control elements and card advantage. So I think adjusting your deck to try and make windows of opportunity is probably a smart move.

I also think going full tilt into Waste Not could be a ton of fun. Adding Green to Nekusar would add even more Ramp elements to a Wheel strategy, but I think your main list is already good enough.

Quote from benjameenbear »

'Tis blasphemy! What would the internet do without your Reanimator Combo list?!

No, I think that it's a good move. In the Teferi Discord, there's also been a shift towards more control elements and card advantage. So I think adjusting your deck to try and make windows of opportunity is probably a smart move.

I also think going full tilt into Waste Not could be a ton of fun. Adding Green to Nekusar would add even more Ramp elements to a Wheel strategy, but I think your main list is already good enough.

I don't have intent to cut it apart or anything but it struggles against 2-3 stax/control decks on a table. With Kydele I can hard cast the win conditions and reanimate them if they fail. This also gives more plans with Waste Not or Theif.
Cut/Ribbons also would work well in here as a finisher since Kydele can add a ton of mana herself and it's very likely Vial Smasher at least kills someone. I'm bringing this up after re-testing logic knot and loving how it can just annihilate someone out of the game, I like that dice roll and Smasher and want to keep the deck similar but different. Worldgorger is great in a combo meta but not quite ideal when you cheat him in only to have Linvala, Containment priest, faerie macabre, krosan grip, and pretty much all those hate cards everywhere. At least with Kydele I can hard cast win conditions and reanimate them if they fail at first. Twice the chance of easy wins. This also adds another layer to careful study effects since they also now ramp with Kydele, this means I can careful study and then hard cast sphinx or whatever instead of pitching and reanimating it.

I think the only thing I would be concerned with is Kydele's casting cost. 4 CMC for a do nothing spell on T3/T4 (maybe T2 depending on your hand) is a little bit of a stretch in my opinion, but I could be wrong. I will admit that once you can resolve her and protect her for a turn cycle that you can then Wheel your hand and go crazy with the amount of mana she can generate from chaining Wheels together. And you've mentioned the Can-trip layer too, which is good.

I really like the Cut // Ribbonss idea. 4 damage kills pretty much every relevant creature in cEDH. And having the Ribbons be an additional finisher with Kydele is just too good to pass up.

Totally didn't get that Vial Smasher looks at the TOTAL CMC of a spell. Killing someone with Logic Knot finally makes sense, since you can exile most of your 'yard to fuel a huge X spell and kill someone with Vial's trigger. Reading the card is tech!

I've generally observed that the only true Combo deck that is all-in on the Combo are Nauseam Storm decks and Flash Hulk decks. Every other archetype seems to have shifted to bringing in more control and card advantage elements. Of the two, I think that Flash Hulk is the more resilient of the two based on my limited experience.

Quote from benjameenbear »

I think the only thing I would be concerned with is Kydele's casting cost. 4 CMC for a do nothing spell on T3/T4 (maybe T2 depending on your hand) is a little bit of a stretch in my opinion, but I could be wrong. I will admit that once you can resolve her and protect her for a turn cycle that you can then Wheel your hand and go crazy with the amount of mana she can generate from chaining Wheels together. And you've mentioned the Can-trip layer too, which is good.

I really like the Cut // Ribbonss idea. 4 damage kills pretty much every relevant creature in cEDH. And having the Ribbons be an additional finisher with Kydele is just too good to pass up.

Totally didn't get that Vial Smasher looks at the TOTAL CMC of a spell. Killing someone with Logic Knot finally makes sense, since you can exile most of your 'yard to fuel a huge X spell and kill someone with Vial's trigger. Reading the card is tech!

I've generally observed that the only true Combo deck that is all-in on the Combo are Nauseam Storm decks and Flash Hulk decks. Every other archetype seems to have shifted to bringing in more control and card advantage elements. Of the two, I think that Flash Hulk is the more resilient of the two based on my limited experience.

Nearly all the cards are 3 mana or less so casting Kydele early isn't a concern, games, where I cast Thrasios on turn 1 or 2, are actually pretty bad since that means I don't have anything better to do. I figure I use her more as value when I set up for a wheel and dump a fatty on board. With theif/wheel I can use her for a massive Cut/Ribbons to kill everyone.
I've found that Worldgorger is decent but yes, not quite the level of Food chain, hulk, or Ad Naseum, so more reason to change that. I could always switch to Hulk but...I don't wanna so maybe Kydele is the way to go. It also lets me try out cards I normally wouldn't like Puzzle box, Waste Not, Kruphix?, and treasonous ogre. Plus Blood chief ascension works as a kill condition, works with smasher, and can gain us life back from reanimation. I think switching to midrange makes reanimator more focused rather than combo and that's always been the plan to begin with. Plus theif/Wheel is pretty much an instant win anyway, if you have 28 cards in hand and opponents have none it's hard to lose

Here's all the cards I'm considering for Kydele/Smasher


Kydele (Duh)
Wheel of fortune (1st Priority)
Timetwister (1st Priority)
Windfall (1st Priority)
Notion Theif (1st Priority)
Waste not (Also really good)
Teferi's puzzle box (Probably not)
Gilded lotus (Midrange goodness)
Emrakul, the promised end (Amazing finisher)
Bloodcheif ascension (Good with everything added)
Cut/Ribbons (Finisher)
Treasonous ogre (Great midrange and combo)
Kruphix, god of horizons (Ramp storage?)
Bring to light (Finds thief, reanimation, or wheels
Mana vault (Eh)
Villanous Wealth (It's cute)
Staff of domination (Combo piece)
Umbral mantle ( Combo piece)
Lightning greaves (Probably not)
Bloom Tender (Ramp)
Ulamog, the ceaseless hunger (Good when cast)
Regrowth (Eldrazi synergy)
Eternal witness (Same)
Treasure cruise (Weeee)
Sword of the paruns (Probably not)
Thousand-year elixer (Seems ideal with Kydele combo)

I think this is a good starting list.

By the way, I've been playing Arena since its release and am currently on Jeskai Control. The new Niv is amazingly Strong in Standard. And if it's good in Standard, how much better do you think it will be in Commander? It kills mana dorks like a boss and can keep life totals under control when people are simply playing the game. And the amount of cards it draws is incredible. I think it's a great inclusion for your deck, especially if you go with Kydele.

If I were to build a Mid-Range list, I think including a Waste Not package would be ideal. It can generate some really strong plays and gives you a bunch of mana to play with. For that reason alone, I think you could run Gilded Lotus profitably so that you can translate colorless mana into colored mana.

Going through your list, I would say that the following are worth deck space:



I think this is a good list of cards to choose from, and being in 4 colors means that you have the hardest choice of all: what to cut. Good luck!

I think those are a good start. I really want to try Thousand year elixer, treasonous ogre, and bloodcheif as well on top of those.
I have really enjoyed Niv in the deck so far. It's actually castable and the biggest threat (Notion theif) dies right away when I draw for the turn so that's also a perk. I know that as far as cuts go the combo pieces would be first to go and possible 1 reanimation spell since I would be more able to hard cast now thanks to Kydele. I can Niv "Bad Nezahal" but that still makes it pretty damn solid, especially since we can abuse it more than Nezahal with our own spells.







Also some self promotion:
I started a twitch channel in which I will brew EVERY commander in edh and post that on my youtube channel as well. If you love brewing as much as I do then I would love to see you there.

What's your audience like for your YouTube and Twitch channels?

Yeah, Niv is even more busted than I thought. I underestimated how much raw card advantage he can accrue over the course of a game, much less a turn cycle. He's awesome.

Quote from benjameenbear »

What's your audience like for your YouTube and Twitch channels?

Yeah, Niv is even more busted than I thought. I underestimated how much raw card advantage he can accrue over the course of a game, much less a turn cycle. He's awesome.

The audience will be very relaxed. Just joking and messing around while building for the random general. Then I edit it down for a smaller youtube video

Yeah I've had a lot of good interaction with Niv, personal favorites include a brainstorm and bazaar to kill someone's daretti in response to an obliterate

I meant more lie audience size. How many viewers, streamers, etc. do your channels get?

Yeah, Niv-Mizzet has proven to be exceptionally strong. I built a deck dedicated to it from my Nicol Bolas deck, but I think I need to rebuild Nicol Bolas. He's my favorite character in MTG and I have a playmat of him and everything. It feels wrong to have an EDH deck without my favorite card as the Commander.

Since it sounds like you're fairly committed to switching over to the Mid-Range build, will you be increasing your land count or no? I think the interaction pieces are all well and good, so I have no issue there, but if you're going more mid range it might not be a bad idea to include some additional mana sources. Kydele will take care of your colorless mana requirements for hard casting your threats, which leaves you gated by the number of colored mana symbols you have available. More lands or more mana rocks/dorks might be in order so that you can consistently take advantage of the mana generation that Kydele can output for you, especially with the addition of Wheels and Waste Not.

Oh, if you do add Waste Not you should probably still keep Razaketh in the deck. I think it's good to have at least one big fattie in B so that you can take advantage of the mana output that Waste Not can generate. And Razaketh is clearly the best legal option in Commander for B.

Once I figure out the cuts I can work on adding lands or mana rocks as well. I don't think it needs too much of a change but likely at least some talismans as well. As far as twitch or youtube goes, I don't know, I started less than a week ago

How's the new commanders working? Did it work out well or no?

Quote from GoldenHau »

How's the new commanders working? Did it work out well or no?

Ended up not switching generals. Actually retired the deck last month

Quote from Dies_to_Doom_Blade »

Quote from GoldenHau »

How's the new commanders working? Did it work out well or no?

Ended up not switching generals. Actually retired the deck last month

Oh. That's sad to hear. Kinda makes me feel a little better tearing this deck apart for piece for my new Jodah super friends though.

Quote from Dies_to_Doom_Blade »

Quote from GoldenHau »

How's the new commanders working? Did it work out well or no?

Ended up not switching generals. Actually retired the deck last month

Had to start a new mtgsal account since i cant find my log on info for my original one,

What?!? sad to hear indeed, been following this deck since you put it up almost 6 years ago, I stayed with Tassy as my commander ( after all the money spent acquiring cards for it couldn't make the jump to add red dual lands etc.) but still.

What are you brewing up now? Hopefully your still playing commander!

Rip Night of the Living Dead. What are you playing these days?

Quote from Sol assassin8 »

Had to start a new mtgsal account since i cant find my log on info for my original one,

What?!? sad to hear indeed, been following this deck since you put it up almost 6 years ago, I stayed with Tassy as my commander ( after all the money spent acquiring cards for it couldn't make the jump to add red dual lands etc.) but still.

What are you brewing up now? Hopefully your still playing commander!

Quote from FearDReaper »

Rip Night of the Living Dead. What are you playing these days?

So after I decided to part ways with this I made Yuriko control with the cards in the deck and added some to my Muldrotha stax deck as well. I also made Zur Astral slide but I actually took apart all of them recently