Taking out a few of the infinite mana combos... With this commander its an instant win and I usually feel *****ty winning that way. I'd rather generate a boat load of mana and exile chunks of libraries or play lots of fun spells.
Ill-Gotten Gains => Perilous Vault - Ill-Gotten Gains can be great but it helps your opponents too and my play group likes grabbing counters to counter whatever I'm bringing back. Perilous vault exiles all the things!
Also, are 9 Wrath effects necessary? I think unless you plan on shouldering all of the responsibility for sweeping, some of those could get pulled. Maybe 2-3? Maybe swap them for your previous Commanders? (Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief and Kiku, Night's Flower are reasonable spot removal)
Lastly, a question regarding choice of Commander. How come you're running only half of Oona? Flavorful choice? Access to blue helps shut down opponents win-cons, if nothing else. Maybe Jester's Cap, preemptively stopping insta-wins?
Phyrexia's Core is a good catch. I do have one laying around somewhere. Strangely I almost never see Spine of Ish Sah and don't usually have a way to recur it so I guess it didn't occur to me.
I was thinking about lowering the wrath counts slightly. However I don't think the old commanders would come in. I'd like to try out Chainer, Dementia Master and Geth, Lord of the Vault for some recursion.
Not running blue was a side effect of the deck always being mono-black. I like the big mana theme and putting islands in out reduces that theme dramatically. Yeah, Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth helps but I'm not really sure what the balance would be. It might be interesting to try and bring in more card draw and counter spells but the deck usually runs well as it is. It would be interesting to hear what you'd take out and put in if I were to include blue mana.
I also have a Mono-Black Oona list that I've been working on for some time. Big black mana is great and there are a lot of cool things that Mono-Black can do. Some cards I run in my list that I strongly recommend:
-Memory Plunder is a great card that allows you to occasionally counter spells, but more often than not it's a Tooth and Nail or even a Time Stretch. It has great utility and people forget that you can do it all the time. Mono Black with instant speed responses to stuff; who knew?
-Dire Undercurrents is one card that I am always happy to see. It turns Oona into a card advantage machine and has great synergy with the general idea of Mono Black. Paying 7 mana into Oona;s ability and then potentially draw, on average, 3-4 cards AND cause an opponent to discard 3-4 cards? That's pure card advantage for sure. It has great synergy with reanimation tooIt's also really fun with Army of the Damned, but that one is a pet card of mine. Think about the flavor there: a horde of Zombies is summoned and your opponents are so terrified that they literally lose their minds(discard cards)!
-Disciple of Bolas is really great in reanimation themed decks. Life and card advantage for the plus of putting one of your dudes in the graveyard to be reanimated again! Yes.
Keep on Oona'ing. She is the only general I would play in Mono-Black. And she was also one of the first cards that I ever ordered online. I still have my original copy sleeved up. Ah, memories.
Back in the day when I used to play a Cabal Coffers mono black deck Maga, Traitor to Mortals, Petrified Field was a huge boon at little to no cost(Coffers always gets blown up). Grim Discovery was another card that was actually always chocked with value every time it was cast.
@Patryn
Patryn, how often do you cast Kozilek, Butcher of Truth? Yes, Big Black Mana decks are a lot of fun to play but I have seen my spaghetti monster sit in my hand for a lot of turns before I was able to play it. In my playgroup, there are a lot of theft effects so I've been dissuaded from running Eldrazi if I can help it. It has a high mana cost and dies to every type of removal too. It would be sad to cast a 10 mana cost Concentrate and shuffle away your graveyard. Which also isn't a good thing since you're thinking about trending towards a slight reanimator theme.
Also, I agree with the high number of wrath effects. You could probably take out one or two and free up some spots for either spot removal or card draw. But that's just my opinion. I think I run about 6 wrath effects in my mono-Black and that's usually been enough.
I would like to agree with some people here that are saying cut some wraths and Kozilek. Another thing that I think might be cool, and I am currently trying to do is to add in smokestack. Dire Undercurrents is also really amazing. Discard is really under rated here and the card draw is really powerful as well.
I have been considering adding in the black god too. How has it been working out for you?
Thanks for the feedback everyone. I just added Erebos, God of the Dead yesterday and didn't get a chance to play him this weekend so I will have to see how he performs in the future.
Regarding Kozilek, Butcher of Truth I play him the first chance I get. Yes usually he dies to removal but drawing the 4 cards is still nice. Ideally I can flash him in with Vedalken Orrery. Thankfully my meta is short on Bribery / Control Magic effects.
Memory Plunder looks like it could be fun but obviously dependent on what others have in the yard. Casting it end of turn after a Time Stretch resolves would be hilarious but I'm really having trouble finding things to cut at this point.
Dire Undercurrents does looks pretty amazing. I'm thinking either Necropotence or Contamination. Contamination can create hard locks but removes the advantage of Cabal Coffers. Besides I still have Infernal Darkness if I need the effect. Necropotence is great but suicide black can get pretty dicey. I'm wondering if Dire Undercurrents could replace the card advantage.
I agree with cutting In Garruk's Wake. One of my friends plays a Progenitus super friends deck and I thought it would be nice to kill all walkers if they get out of hand but usually I can keep them in check just beating them to death with faeries.
Also regarding Petrified Field I agree it would be nice redundancy. I have Crucible of the Worlds and ways to recur it so unless it gets exiled I'm usually ok. I'm getting worried that my swamp count is getting low so I don't know if I want to add yet another non-basic.
No, don't cut Contamination or Necropotence! They're almost too good not to play. I'd rather cut Infernal Darkness instead of Contamination. You don't lose life and you don't have a cumulative mana tax, which in reality limits your playing instead of allowing you to get ahead when your opponent's are color screwed for the turns that Infernal Darkness is in play. I think Contamination is much better, but that's just personal opinion. I can understand cutting Necropotence. I cut if from my Dralnu list back in the day and I didn't regret it.
I still think that you have too many wrath effects. Cut one more and I think that you'll have the balance that you need. How many times has the board been cleared and yet you still have another wrath effect in hand? I would bet a lot of times. I argue that you don't want to draw cards that are irrelevant to the board state too frequently. That dilutes the power of your deck and your strategy because instead of advancing your board state to a condition where you can win, you are holding an answer. Answers don't win games; they prevent you from losing games. I think with your wrath count being as high as it is --it's still 9 after you remove In Garruk's Wake--you're limiting your chances of playing the big spell that will win you the game.
Sigh. Kozilek is a big, fat, dumb spaghetti monster. How much spaghetti do you need in your deck? Ha. No worries though. If you like Kozilek than carry on. If he sticks his Annihilator 4 does a good job of clearing board states.
Yeah you are probably right on Contamination. It can win games all on it's own. I took a look at your deck list and I like it a lot. You went way further into the reanimator theme. I also see how you have more ways to gain life to deal with Necropotence / Chainer / Etc. I may need to adopt a few of your strategies.
Down with the spaghetti monsters! They're nothing but giant, floating, tentacle-y blobs that eat people's dreams and board states! I still have nightmares when Emrakul, the Aeons Torn was legal in EDH. That card terrified our playgroup because everyone had it. Bribery, if resolved, basically won games all by itself. And our playgroup could make that happen as early as T2 or T3. It was awful.
I would recommend keeping Toxic Deluge because it can come down early in the game if you need it to. There's an Animar deck in my playgroup that I have a personal grudge against that seems to always have a T2 Animar. Having early wraths really puts him into playing fair and allows me to break him... I mean his deck. Sorry. Regardless, it's a wrath that gets around indestructible things and can scale as you need it to. Did I mention that it can come down early?
I agree with your cuts concerning In Garruk's Wake, Staff of Domination, Kozilek, Butcher of Truth, and the Hex Parasite. I'm gonna guess that the Parasite is to deal with the Super-Friends deck that you're talking about earlier. If that's the case than I say keep it because it comes down hella early underneath counters and if it eats removal, that's fine. That's one less removal on something that you need. And if you add a slight reanimator theme than you don't care because it will come back. If you want to keep the Parasite than you can eye up Necropotence. Although I feel terrible saying that...
How has Sorin Markov been for you? It seems that more often than not it's a 6 mana "Set target opponent at 10 life and incur his anger forever." That's been my experience with him, and I cut him in my list. I have him in my Lazav deck because there's a slight Vampire tribal thing going on and his setting an opponent at 10 life is very useful. I say this because I'm actually preferring to kill people with combat damage. Sorin sets my next targeted opponent at a reasonable life total while my voltron suited-up Lazav kills my current target. Sorin potentially allows me to one shot an opponent. I don't know if you have the same strategy going on here. If you like him, cool. If not, I think he could be replaced. Yes, I know it's hard to cut good cards that you've liked and have worked for you. Case in point being the spaghetti monster. You can do it. In the words of a well-known Disney song, "Let it go, let it go..."
Out: In Garruk's Wake - Slow, allows regen, lowering wrath count. Staff of Domination - Basically 6 to draw a card. Could tap down things but since you have to do it before combat not always helpful. Can no longer go infinite with it without Magus of the Coffers. Infernal Darkness - Feel it is worse than Contamination. The groans start when it hits the board and can be un-fun. Black Sun's Zenith - Probably more mana intensive than In Garruk's Wake.
Other options were Hex Parasite, Sorin Markov, and Kozilek, Butcher of Truth. Not sure if they would be better or worse than the above but trying this for now. Hex Parasite owns planeswalkers and can be a beast with enough mana. Sorin is kind of a jerk, but sometimes people just need to be set to 10 life. Kozilek draws cards and annihilates people. He's also in my banner... how could I ever cut him!
In: Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief - Can destroy anything that isn't hex-proof and is a win condition with enough mana. Geth, Lord of the Vault - Profit off opponents graveyards and can mill people out with enough mana. Chainer, Dementia Master - Profit off all graveyards, abuse ETB effects, should be fun. Dire Undercurrents - Card Draw and Discard. Makes Oona that much better.
I like the changes. I think you'll be happy with them as well. I can't wait for you to have the chance to use Dire Undercurrents for straight profit. With Big Mana mono-Black control, this card provides so much awesomeness. I love it.
Anyways, I think I would agree with your thoughts about the new Ob Nixilis. It costs people life to tutor or otherwise search through their decks, but they're probably going to pay that cost anyways and then win while I don't have many ways to interact. In the end, the new Ob Nixilis will probably be just a vanilla beater that grows really, really fast in the deck. And that's not quite enough for me.
Champion of Stray Souls seems to be a good card that can turn Oona tokens into free reanimation. I'm going to test it instead Kalitas for a while and see how I like it. It's cheaper and aids in making reanimation a stronger theme in my deck. I'll pop over to Defenestrate Windows' thread and list the change there as well. What are your thoughts? Have you tried it before?
The inclusion of Steel Hellkite would provide a way to deal with pesky artifacts and enchantments which black sorely lacks. It also doubles as a nice reanimation target.
Yeah Steel Hellkite is a nice option. I had it in here a long time ago when basically the only answers black had to enchantments were him and Nevinyrral's Disk. My problem with him is you have to play him, wait a turn, attack someone without a flyer, then you can kill something they have. I feel he is limited compared to the other newer options. He does wreck tokens and does shine in the right situations though.
Champion of Stray Souls I had in my Ghave, Guru of Spores deck for awhile. I didn't see him enough to evaluate him but can say that if you are going to be able to profit from it people will do everything they can to kill it before he loses summoning sickness.
Necropotence => Memory Plunder - I know Necropotence is a favorite for a lot of people but I never like seeing it unless its late game and I somehow have a lot of life to burn. This isn't really a combo deck and I don't like locking myself out of the draw step and having to pay life for every card. Memory Plunder should provide a lot of nice answers from Counterspell to Wrath of God to Time Warp to Tooth and Nail all at instant speed!
The other card I was eyeing was Unstable Obelisk. Has anyone tried it out? I can't find a cut for it but another Vindicate would be welcome.
Fate Reforged has some interesting options: Archfiend of Depravity - No downside 5/4 flyer for 5 that controls opponents creatures. Triggers on the end step too so they have to think about what they will play. Crux of Fate - Wrath for 5 that allows regen. Puts Karrthus, Tyrant of Jund in his place! Merciless Executioner - I don't play his other friends but they work well in a reanimator build (Fleshbag Marauder, Slum Reaper) Palace Siege - Probably better reanimator options but triggers every upkeep. Could also be used late game to ping people off. Ugin, the Spirit Dragon - This will definitely come in. Maybe for Sorin Markov or Dark Depths (I can't remember the last time I actually got a Marit Lage token in play.)
Anyone else have thoughts on the new mono-black options?
Also, I was looking through my binder and saw Hecatomb... probably not worth using swamps to ping but it could be worth trying out.
Alright so making a change that makes me sad as I always envisioned this as my kind of Cthulu themed deck but I'm taking out Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre, Kozilek, Butcher of Truth, and Dark Depths. The eldrazi will be joining my Animar deck which should be able to play them faster and also combo with them. Dark Depths I hardly ever got Marit Lage out and when I did she would get bounced / exiled. Can't remember the last time I actually hit someone with it.
Coming in will be Archfiend of Depravity, Ugin, the Spirit Dragon, and Leyline of the Void. I'm a little worried that Leyline will interfere with Geth and Chainer but I need some kind of graveyard hate because my meta has a few mean reanimator / stax decks that I need an answer for.
Trading Nevinyrral's Disk for Damnable Pact. The pact doubles as a deep card draw or a kill spell. Disk is slow and they've printed a lot more colorless answers so it can come out.
Comrade! It's been a long time, and I'm glad that you're still staying strong with mono-Black. I might rebuild it again soon, but I recently went through a hard time and my Magic decks suffered. I now only have three decks, as my sig shows, so I wish you the best in your mono-black adventures. I like your current list! I'm sure you've considered Disciple of Bolas, but is there a reason he's not in the list currently?
Sorry to hear about your commander decks. Yeah the disciple could definitely come in. I've been thinking about focusing more on the reanimator aspect of mono-black recently and he'd fit nicely. This used to be my most powerful deck but over time my other decks have eclipsed it. Could bring things in like Kokusho, the Evening Star, Ashnod's Altar, Disciple of Bolas, and other nice ETB/LTB/Die creatures. Need to think about it.
In all the times I've played this deck I've never gotten the Spine of Ish Sah "combo" going so I'm taking all the pieces out. Soul of New Phyrexia is too mana intensive and since I took Nevinyrral's Disk out I no longer have that interaction either. Archfiend of Depravity wasn't as great as I thought it would be the few times I played it.
Retired Lists: Ghave - Hanna - Thrun - Zur
Pauper: Crypt Rats
Yes, it's allowed. The white symbol is in the reminder text, not the card's ability.
Basalt Monolith => In Garruk's Wake - Infinite mana for superfriends hate.
Magus of the Coffers => Soul of New Phyrexia - Slow squishy mana for board protection / beats.
Ill-Gotten Gains => Perilous Vault - Ill-Gotten Gains can be great but it helps your opponents too and my play group likes grabbing counters to counter whatever I'm bringing back. Perilous vault exiles all the things!
Retired Lists: Ghave - Hanna - Thrun - Zur
Pauper: Crypt Rats
Also, are 9 Wrath effects necessary? I think unless you plan on shouldering all of the responsibility for sweeping, some of those could get pulled. Maybe 2-3? Maybe swap them for your previous Commanders? (Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief and Kiku, Night's Flower are reasonable spot removal)
Lastly, a question regarding choice of Commander. How come you're running only half of Oona? Flavorful choice? Access to blue helps shut down opponents win-cons, if nothing else. Maybe Jester's Cap, preemptively stopping insta-wins?
I was thinking about lowering the wrath counts slightly. However I don't think the old commanders would come in. I'd like to try out Chainer, Dementia Master and Geth, Lord of the Vault for some recursion.
Not running blue was a side effect of the deck always being mono-black. I like the big mana theme and putting islands in out reduces that theme dramatically. Yeah, Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth helps but I'm not really sure what the balance would be. It might be interesting to try and bring in more card draw and counter spells but the deck usually runs well as it is. It would be interesting to hear what you'd take out and put in if I were to include blue mana.
Retired Lists: Ghave - Hanna - Thrun - Zur
Pauper: Crypt Rats
Murder => Nevinyrral's Disk - Trying to live the dream with Soul of New Phyrexia.
Swamp => Phyrexia's Core - Taking advice to combo with Spine of Ish Sah for 8 mana Vindicate and 1 life. Don't want to get swamp count too low but I think this will still be fine.
Retired Lists: Ghave - Hanna - Thrun - Zur
Pauper: Crypt Rats
I also have a Mono-Black Oona list that I've been working on for some time. Big black mana is great and there are a lot of cool things that Mono-Black can do. Some cards I run in my list that I strongly recommend:
-Memory Plunder is a great card that allows you to occasionally counter spells, but more often than not it's a Tooth and Nail or even a Time Stretch. It has great utility and people forget that you can do it all the time. Mono Black with instant speed responses to stuff; who knew?
-Dire Undercurrents is one card that I am always happy to see. It turns Oona into a card advantage machine and has great synergy with the general idea of Mono Black. Paying 7 mana into Oona;s ability and then potentially draw, on average, 3-4 cards AND cause an opponent to discard 3-4 cards? That's pure card advantage for sure. It has great synergy with reanimation tooIt's also really fun with Army of the Damned, but that one is a pet card of mine. Think about the flavor there: a horde of Zombies is summoned and your opponents are so terrified that they literally lose their minds(discard cards)!
-Disciple of Bolas is really great in reanimation themed decks. Life and card advantage for the plus of putting one of your dudes in the graveyard to be reanimated again! Yes.
Keep on Oona'ing. She is the only general I would play in Mono-Black. And she was also one of the first cards that I ever ordered online. I still have my original copy sleeved up. Ah, memories.
UB Dralnu, Lich Lord
RBW [Primer]-Kaalia of the Vast
BUG [Primer]-Tasigur, the Golden Fang
GWU [Primer]-Arcades, the Strategist
WUB Primer-Aminatou, the Fateshifter
UBR Nicol Bolas, the Ravager
Patryn, how often do you cast Kozilek, Butcher of Truth? Yes, Big Black Mana decks are a lot of fun to play but I have seen my spaghetti monster sit in my hand for a lot of turns before I was able to play it. In my playgroup, there are a lot of theft effects so I've been dissuaded from running Eldrazi if I can help it. It has a high mana cost and dies to every type of removal too. It would be sad to cast a 10 mana cost Concentrate and shuffle away your graveyard. Which also isn't a good thing since you're thinking about trending towards a slight reanimator theme.
Also, I agree with the high number of wrath effects. You could probably take out one or two and free up some spots for either spot removal or card draw. But that's just my opinion. I think I run about 6 wrath effects in my mono-Black and that's usually been enough.
I would suggest cutting:
In Garruk's Wake -> Chainer, Dementia Master because reanimating dudes is really good in this format, as you know.
Kozilek, Butcher of Truth -> Dire Undercurrents because this card is really, really good with Oona. Seriously. Try it out once or twice. I promise you won't regret it.
UB Dralnu, Lich Lord
RBW [Primer]-Kaalia of the Vast
BUG [Primer]-Tasigur, the Golden Fang
GWU [Primer]-Arcades, the Strategist
WUB Primer-Aminatou, the Fateshifter
UBR Nicol Bolas, the Ravager
I have been considering adding in the black god too. How has it been working out for you?
Mono-Black Oona, Queen of the Fae
Athreos, God of Passage
Regarding Kozilek, Butcher of Truth I play him the first chance I get. Yes usually he dies to removal but drawing the 4 cards is still nice. Ideally I can flash him in with Vedalken Orrery. Thankfully my meta is short on Bribery / Control Magic effects.
Memory Plunder looks like it could be fun but obviously dependent on what others have in the yard. Casting it end of turn after a Time Stretch resolves would be hilarious but I'm really having trouble finding things to cut at this point.
Dire Undercurrents does looks pretty amazing. I'm thinking either Necropotence or Contamination. Contamination can create hard locks but removes the advantage of Cabal Coffers. Besides I still have Infernal Darkness if I need the effect. Necropotence is great but suicide black can get pretty dicey. I'm wondering if Dire Undercurrents could replace the card advantage.
I agree with cutting In Garruk's Wake. One of my friends plays a Progenitus super friends deck and I thought it would be nice to kill all walkers if they get out of hand but usually I can keep them in check just beating them to death with faeries.
Also regarding Petrified Field I agree it would be nice redundancy. I have Crucible of the Worlds and ways to recur it so unless it gets exiled I'm usually ok. I'm getting worried that my swamp count is getting low so I don't know if I want to add yet another non-basic.
Retired Lists: Ghave - Hanna - Thrun - Zur
Pauper: Crypt Rats
I still think that you have too many wrath effects. Cut one more and I think that you'll have the balance that you need. How many times has the board been cleared and yet you still have another wrath effect in hand? I would bet a lot of times. I argue that you don't want to draw cards that are irrelevant to the board state too frequently. That dilutes the power of your deck and your strategy because instead of advancing your board state to a condition where you can win, you are holding an answer. Answers don't win games; they prevent you from losing games. I think with your wrath count being as high as it is --it's still 9 after you remove In Garruk's Wake--you're limiting your chances of playing the big spell that will win you the game.
Sigh. Kozilek is a big, fat, dumb spaghetti monster. How much spaghetti do you need in your deck? Ha. No worries though. If you like Kozilek than carry on. If he sticks his Annihilator 4 does a good job of clearing board states.
UB Dralnu, Lich Lord
RBW [Primer]-Kaalia of the Vast
BUG [Primer]-Tasigur, the Golden Fang
GWU [Primer]-Arcades, the Strategist
WUB Primer-Aminatou, the Fateshifter
UBR Nicol Bolas, the Ravager
I'm planning to bring in Dire Undercurrents, Chainer, Dementia Master, Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief, and Geth, Lord of the Vault.
Cuts could be Toxic Deluge, In Garruk's Wake, Staff of Domination, and ... Necropotence? Kozilek, Butcher of Truth? Hex Parasite? Cutting an Eldrazi makes me sad. I'll think about it!
Retired Lists: Ghave - Hanna - Thrun - Zur
Pauper: Crypt Rats
I would recommend keeping Toxic Deluge because it can come down early in the game if you need it to. There's an Animar deck in my playgroup that I have a personal grudge against that seems to always have a T2 Animar. Having early wraths really puts him into playing fair and allows me to break him... I mean his deck. Sorry. Regardless, it's a wrath that gets around indestructible things and can scale as you need it to. Did I mention that it can come down early?
I agree with your cuts concerning In Garruk's Wake, Staff of Domination, Kozilek, Butcher of Truth, and the Hex Parasite. I'm gonna guess that the Parasite is to deal with the Super-Friends deck that you're talking about earlier. If that's the case than I say keep it because it comes down hella early underneath counters and if it eats removal, that's fine. That's one less removal on something that you need. And if you add a slight reanimator theme than you don't care because it will come back. If you want to keep the Parasite than you can eye up Necropotence. Although I feel terrible saying that...
How has Sorin Markov been for you? It seems that more often than not it's a 6 mana "Set target opponent at 10 life and incur his anger forever." That's been my experience with him, and I cut him in my list. I have him in my Lazav deck because there's a slight Vampire tribal thing going on and his setting an opponent at 10 life is very useful. I say this because I'm actually preferring to kill people with combat damage. Sorin sets my next targeted opponent at a reasonable life total while my voltron suited-up Lazav kills my current target. Sorin potentially allows me to one shot an opponent. I don't know if you have the same strategy going on here. If you like him, cool. If not, I think he could be replaced. Yes, I know it's hard to cut good cards that you've liked and have worked for you. Case in point being the spaghetti monster. You can do it. In the words of a well-known Disney song, "Let it go, let it go..."
UB Dralnu, Lich Lord
RBW [Primer]-Kaalia of the Vast
BUG [Primer]-Tasigur, the Golden Fang
GWU [Primer]-Arcades, the Strategist
WUB Primer-Aminatou, the Fateshifter
UBR Nicol Bolas, the Ravager
In Garruk's Wake - Slow, allows regen, lowering wrath count.
Staff of Domination - Basically 6 to draw a card. Could tap down things but since you have to do it before combat not always helpful. Can no longer go infinite with it without Magus of the Coffers.
Infernal Darkness - Feel it is worse than Contamination. The groans start when it hits the board and can be un-fun.
Black Sun's Zenith - Probably more mana intensive than In Garruk's Wake.
Other options were Hex Parasite, Sorin Markov, and Kozilek, Butcher of Truth. Not sure if they would be better or worse than the above but trying this for now. Hex Parasite owns planeswalkers and can be a beast with enough mana. Sorin is kind of a jerk, but sometimes people just need to be set to 10 life. Kozilek draws cards and annihilates people. He's also in my banner... how could I ever cut him!
In:
Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief - Can destroy anything that isn't hex-proof and is a win condition with enough mana.
Geth, Lord of the Vault - Profit off opponents graveyards and can mill people out with enough mana.
Chainer, Dementia Master - Profit off all graveyards, abuse ETB effects, should be fun.
Dire Undercurrents - Card Draw and Discard. Makes Oona that much better.
Retired Lists: Ghave - Hanna - Thrun - Zur
Pauper: Crypt Rats
Anyways, I think I would agree with your thoughts about the new Ob Nixilis. It costs people life to tutor or otherwise search through their decks, but they're probably going to pay that cost anyways and then win while I don't have many ways to interact. In the end, the new Ob Nixilis will probably be just a vanilla beater that grows really, really fast in the deck. And that's not quite enough for me.
Champion of Stray Souls seems to be a good card that can turn Oona tokens into free reanimation. I'm going to test it instead Kalitas for a while and see how I like it. It's cheaper and aids in making reanimation a stronger theme in my deck. I'll pop over to Defenestrate Windows' thread and list the change there as well. What are your thoughts? Have you tried it before?
UB Dralnu, Lich Lord
RBW [Primer]-Kaalia of the Vast
BUG [Primer]-Tasigur, the Golden Fang
GWU [Primer]-Arcades, the Strategist
WUB Primer-Aminatou, the Fateshifter
UBR Nicol Bolas, the Ravager
Both Geth, Lord of the Vault and Chainer, Dementia Master work well in the deck because they can nab your opponents creatures from their graveyards.
The inclusion of Steel Hellkite would provide a way to deal with pesky artifacts and enchantments which black sorely lacks. It also doubles as a nice reanimation target.
Champion of Stray Souls I had in my Ghave, Guru of Spores deck for awhile. I didn't see him enough to evaluate him but can say that if you are going to be able to profit from it people will do everything they can to kill it before he loses summoning sickness.
Retired Lists: Ghave - Hanna - Thrun - Zur
Pauper: Crypt Rats
The other card I was eyeing was Unstable Obelisk. Has anyone tried it out? I can't find a cut for it but another Vindicate would be welcome.
Retired Lists: Ghave - Hanna - Thrun - Zur
Pauper: Crypt Rats
Archfiend of Depravity - No downside 5/4 flyer for 5 that controls opponents creatures. Triggers on the end step too so they have to think about what they will play.
Crux of Fate - Wrath for 5 that allows regen. Puts Karrthus, Tyrant of Jund in his place!
Merciless Executioner - I don't play his other friends but they work well in a reanimator build (Fleshbag Marauder, Slum Reaper)
Palace Siege - Probably better reanimator options but triggers every upkeep. Could also be used late game to ping people off.
Ugin, the Spirit Dragon - This will definitely come in. Maybe for Sorin Markov or Dark Depths (I can't remember the last time I actually got a Marit Lage token in play.)
Anyone else have thoughts on the new mono-black options?
Also, I was looking through my binder and saw Hecatomb... probably not worth using swamps to ping but it could be worth trying out.
Retired Lists: Ghave - Hanna - Thrun - Zur
Pauper: Crypt Rats
Coming in will be Archfiend of Depravity, Ugin, the Spirit Dragon, and Leyline of the Void. I'm a little worried that Leyline will interfere with Geth and Chainer but I need some kind of graveyard hate because my meta has a few mean reanimator / stax decks that I need an answer for.
Retired Lists: Ghave - Hanna - Thrun - Zur
Pauper: Crypt Rats
Retired Lists: Ghave - Hanna - Thrun - Zur
Pauper: Crypt Rats
UB Dralnu, Lich Lord
RBW [Primer]-Kaalia of the Vast
BUG [Primer]-Tasigur, the Golden Fang
GWU [Primer]-Arcades, the Strategist
WUB Primer-Aminatou, the Fateshifter
UBR Nicol Bolas, the Ravager
Retired Lists: Ghave - Hanna - Thrun - Zur
Pauper: Crypt Rats
1 Trading Post
1 Spine of Ish Sah
1 Phyrexia's Core
1 Leyline of the Void
1 Archfiend of Depravity
1 Phyrexian Reclamation
1 Ashnod's Altar
1 Massacre Wurm
1 Kokusho, the Evening Star
1 Disciple of Bolas
In all the times I've played this deck I've never gotten the Spine of Ish Sah "combo" going so I'm taking all the pieces out. Soul of New Phyrexia is too mana intensive and since I took Nevinyrral's Disk out I no longer have that interaction either. Archfiend of Depravity wasn't as great as I thought it would be the few times I played it.
Bringing some reanimation options. Should be able to gain a lot of value off Massacre Wurm, Kokusho, the Evening Star, and Disciple of Bolas. Ashnod's Altar can produce extra mana using faeries to make more faeries or act as a sac outlet to be able to abuse ETB/Die triggers.
Any other reanimation options I should consider? A quick search revealed Hell's Caretaker, Champion of Stray Souls, Doomed Necromancer, and Corpse Dance.
Sidisi, Undead Vizier also looks tempting.
Retired Lists: Ghave - Hanna - Thrun - Zur
Pauper: Crypt Rats