This is a pretty traditional big mana monoblack control list. It's creature light to help maximize the effectiveness of the many sweepers and runs a lot of disruption. There are also many ramp cards to help play big bombs and power out large X spells. Early game is usually tutoring up Thawing Glaciers to help hit land drops so that my mana doublers are more effective. Mid game is about controlling the board and disrupting opponents. Late game is taking over and dropping bombs. Against U/x control decks this deck needs to take a more aggressive role as those decks tend to have a better late game so I will aggressively try to kill them. Other decks tend to have a weaker late game so it is generally better to sit back and develop my board and wait for the right moment to strike and seal up the win.
Why play Kiku?
This deck isn't built around a commander and there are a number of viable options such as Maga, Traitor to Mortals, Sheoldred, Whispering One, Oona, Queen of the Fae & Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief that could be used in her place. I chose Kiku specifically because she is cheap to cast, helps me stabilize and deters attackers. She can also be used to kill off key creatures or prevent people from playing their commander. Previously I had Maga at the helm but once Exsanguinate was printed I found that I was rarely casting him so Kiku gives me a commander that will make an impact in almost every game I play and her cheap cost makes her relevant in the early game. Plus she has great flavor text.
Card Choices
Vedalken Orrery - This card dramatically changes the way the deck plays out because it turns this typically very proactive deck into a very reactive deck allowing you to see what your opponents do during their turns and react accordingly. It makes tutors extremely powerful since you can cast them at instant speed and your whole deck has flash. You can also double up on turns every other turn doing absurd things like dropping a couple mana doublers EOT then untapping and casting some bombs before your opponents can use sorcery speed answers. Discard spells are also stronger at instant speed because you can cast them during your opponent's draw step. Lastly it can give your creatures pseudo haste which can be important for guys like Steel Hellkite and Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre. This is a definite staple for this style of monoblack control.
Ill-Gotten Gains - The power of the card is all in the timing, similar in a way to how Balance is absurdly powerful (and much more powerful than Ill-Gotten Gains, this is just an example) but might appear fair to someone who hasn't played with it. Now Balance is unfair because it's much easier to break but it's also unfair because the Balance caster gets to choose when it happens. If they have a favorable board position they simply choose not to cast it. This is the same with Ill-Gotten Gains, in most situations you do not want to cast it. You have cards in hand, dangerous stuff in opponents graveyard, etc. This card becomes very powerful though when you do want to cast it. It will often be the last card in your hand (or you're holding stuff you don't care about) and it's a tripleRegrowth. Now while it may seem that this benefits your opponents equally since they all get 3 Regrowths too it often will not. Let's assume your opponents are good players with good decks. Good decks will usually have more than 3 cards in their hand and will have a deck full of good cards so the cards in their hand will be good. So if for example they are holding 6 good cards, this causes them to pitch those cards for 3 good cards. Now their card quality may have increased (and this is a maybe) but they are now down 3 good cards.
As far as breaking the synergy of the card the best way to do this is through discard. Ideally you get back Myojin of Night's Reach and make them dump their hand while still getting to keep 2 cards but often even a simple Mindtwist on the person who got the best cards back will suffice. Additionally you can use graveyard hate to limit people's options.
The last thing I'd like to add is that after casting Ill-Gotten Gains everyone will know what everyone else is holding. This should make everyone's threat assessment excellent so the most threatening player should be the one that gets targeted. You don't want this to be you so if you are casting it "fairly" (not breaking the symmetry or immediately winning) you want to get back cards that aren't immediately threatening to opponents. Cards like Phyrexian Arena are great because they aren't an immediate threat so people will generally let you have Arena because there are more serious things for them to worry about. Choosing the correct cards can be incredibly skill testing for everyone which is one of the reasons I like the card so much.
Bane of the Living - He may seem like an overcosted sweeper but the nice thing about him is the ability to function at instant speed which is a great way to deter attackers. Having no other morphs in my deck is kind of a bonus since my opponents know that if I have a morph in play it's this guy so there's no reason to take a gamble and swing at me.
Doubing Cube - This is arguably the worst mana doubler because without another mana doubler in play you need a lot of land to get value out of it. That said this deck is filled with mana doublers and tutors so getting another mana doubler out isn't very difficult.
Infernal Darkness - Contamination sucks in this deck. Infernal Darkness is much better because it's a stand alone card that doesn't need any other support. The cumulative upkeep should not be an issue as it is pretty easy to kill everyone in 2-4 turns if they can't cast spells and making land drops every turn will often mean 2-3 extra mana is available thanks to the mana doublers.
Sign in Blood/Night's Whisper - These are not very exciting cards but they fill an important role by giving me more things to do in the early game. Late game they are simply cheap card advantage. Usually I do not like cards with such a poor lifeloss to card advantage ratio (2 life to net 1 extra card) but these have played out better than more expensive options like Ancient Craving because of their cheap casting cost.
Syphon Mind - I typically play 4-5 person multiplayer with occasional 6 or even 7 player so this regularly draws me 3+ cards with no lifeloss while acting as minor disruption.
Mind Stone - Fixing is not needed in monocolor decks so this acts as a cheap ramp spell that can be cycled away later in the game or in response to a sweeper. It's also nice vs. mass discard because it helps you recover more quickly.
Mind Twist/Mind Sludge - Mass discard for all opponents is pretty rare but these can still empty the hand of the biggest threat so they don't lose much value in multiplayer. They also only piss off one person while leaving that person in a poor position to retaliate.
Sadistic Sacrament - I need to run a Jester's Cap effect as a tutor target and this is the best option. It grabs troublesome cards like Mindslaver , mass LD, combo pieces and key cards. Late game it can be kicked to cripple someone. Don't be afraid to cast this without kicker, that is the main mode of the card and the kicker is just an added bonus when you topdeck this late game.
Candelabra of Tawnos - Candelabra acts as a mana doubler when combined with most other mana doublers in the deck. It also works well with Cabal Coffers, Thawing Glaciers and with either of these in play Deserted Temple. What makes it so powerful is the very low casting cost as it will almost always act as a ramp spell the turn you play it unlike more expensive mana doublers.
Insidious Dreams - In a vacuum it appears to be card disadvantage but in actual play this is rarely the case. Often it will pitch 2-3 cards and you can put a card draw spell on top like Promise of Power or Necropotence turning the disadvantage into significant card advantage. I often fetch a tutor, a draw spell and/or a bonus spell or something like Exsanguinate, mana doubler, draw spell. One thing you have to be careful about is counterspells because the discard is an additional cost. In situations where I suspect my opponent may have a counter I will often cast it and only pitch 1 card to avoid getting blown out. While this may seem poor it's still a fine play and shows how flexible this card can be.
Bubbling Muck - While 1 shot ramp effects are viewed as poor in this format Bubbling Muck typically provides a large boost of mana which helps to create very explosive turns that opponents often don't see coming. It is also very powerful with Yawgmoth's Will.
Lethal Vapors - My experience with this card is that people rarely are willing to skip a turn to destroy it and it provides excellent board control, especially when preceded with or followed up by a sweeper.
Spreading Plague - It may seem out of place in a monocolored deck but I am not using it to kill other black creatures. It's used to prevent people from playing creatures and it does an excellent job at this since creatures rarely survive summoning sickness with Spreading Plague in play. It's also good against commanders because if their commander is in play any creature they cast will kill it and if their commander is not in play casting it will kill all their creatures. It also conveniently doesn't kill colorless creatures which many of my creatures are.
Thawing Glaciers - It looks like a slow card and it is. It's a glacier, what do you expect? The reason it's so good is that it ensures a steady stream of land drops and this deck really needs to be hitting land drops every turn to maximize the mana doublers. This is often one of the first cards I tutor up and it's great at letting you keep land light hands without having to mulligan. It also interacts nicely with Candelabra of Tawnos and Deserted Temple.
Extraplanar Lens - This is a great card because it is so cheap to cast. Once you hit 6 lands it's essentially free to play and any more than that and it ramps you the turn you play it. Compare this to Caged Sun which requires 12 lands to do the same. This makes it well worth the drawback of getting 2 for 1'd if it gets blown up. The symmetrical effect isn't so bad when you consider that a 2 color deck running black will probably be running a lot of non-basics to fix their mana so it is unlikely that they'll have a lot of basic swamps in play and 3+ color decks will only have a couple basic swamps in play.
Alternate card options
Helldozer - He's a slow card but he can do serious damage to non-basic lands if you're able to untap with him.
Mirari - I played this card for awhile and it's solid. Helps out vs. counters, doubles tutors and forks some nasty disruption.
Consume Spirit - This is a great option for an X spell if another one is needed.
Kozilek, Butcher of Truth - I feel that the current amount of card draw does fine. Kozilek is a good option if you need more mill protection or in lists that run Lightning Greeves.
Nevinyrral's Disk - Another sweeper option. It's pretty cheap but takes a turn to come online making it somewhat unreliable.
Imp's Mischief - I found there simply weren't enough targets for this card when I played it. It's a unique effect and probably very good in certain metagames, notably ones where extra turn cards are cast.
Liliana Vess - Another tutor option however expect her to have a short life expectancy.
Profane Command - A versatile X spell option but mostly used as removal and a drain spell.
Crystal Ball - It's a pretty good card with a cheap activation.
Withering Boon - Another unique effect for black, especially useful against commanders with ETB abilities.
Nightmare Incursion - This is very close to as good as Sadistic Sacrament. I chose Sacrament because it can be cast earlier but later on Nightmare Incursion is the better card because it's cheaper than kicked Sacrament.
Mass land destruction - Being a control deck having lots of land is very important and can take awhile to build up. Since the deck doesn't run any counters the only way to deal with this is to use discard, Sadistic Sacrament or the more difficult option of maintaining a strong enough board presence that mass ld can't be used.
Mindslaver - There is a pretty good chance this card will just kill you because of Necropotence or a tutor for Necropotence.
Counterspells - Since the deck runs a lot of very expensive spells counterspells can cause you to lose a lot of tempo and in some cases are similar to you skipping your turn if you only cast one spell.
Enchantments and artifacts - These types of permanents can be difficult to answer. Fortunately there have been a lot of new options printed recently and you can always tutor for answers if you need them.
4/8/10
-Swamp
-Puppeteer Clique
-Magus of the Coffers
+Crucible of Worlds
+Expedition Map
+Deserted Temple
4/15/10
-Sculpting Steel
-Stuffy Doll
-Mortivore
-Staff of Domination
-Darksteel Forge
+Nirkana Revenant
+All is Dust
+Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
+Suffer the Past
+Corrupt
5/3/10
-Kagemaro, First to Suffer
+Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre
5/12/10
-Gilded Lotus
+Sadistic Sacrament
5/22/10
-Dimir House Guard
+Pestilence Demon
6/3/10
-Nezumi Graverobber
+Memory Jar
6/24/10
-Mishra's Helix
-Boseiju, Who Shelters All
-Loxodon Warhammer
-Death Cloud
-Beacon of Unrest
-Crucible of Worlds
+Mind Stone
+Everflowing Chalice
+Grim Monolith
+Necrologia
+Swamp
+Solemn Simulacrum
7/21/10
-Necrologia
+Crystal Ball
8/25/10
-Everflowing Chalice
-Corrupt
-Drain Life
-Vesuva
+Sign in Blood
+Night's Whisper
+Armillary Sphere
+Swamp
10/11/10
-Mirari
+Exsanguinate
11/2/10
-Ancient Craving
+Syphon Mind
12/14/10
-Emrakul
+Kozilek
12/22/10
-Crystal Ball
+Mirari
2/5/11
-Profane Command
+Imp's Mischief
2/18/11
-Liliana Vess
+Go for the Throat
3/3/11
-Twisted Abomination
+Wayfarer's Bauble
3/28/11
-Imp's Mischief
+Steel Hellkite
5/12/11
-Grim Monolith
-Nevinyrral's Disk
-Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
+Praetor's Grasp
+Karn Liberated
+Caged Sun
Worldwake has Bojuka Bog as the only card that could make the deck. It's not a swamp which is a big strike against it but I am going to try it out as additional graveyard hate.
Your deck list looks pretty tight, but there are a couple of cards you may wish to consider:
Rite of Consumption: Allows you to sac Maga and recast him while hitting someone for big damage Profane Command: Another good mana sink, can help with recursion and removal as well. (ooops, you already have it in there) Miren, the Moaning Well/Diamond Valley: Sac outlets that'll help you gain life.
Just some ideas. Looks like fun.
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@C.A.B.A.L. - I felt that Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre needed to be included because of his ability to hit artifacts and enchantments so I needed a cut. Kagemaro, First to Suffer felt like my weakest sweeper and I think I had 1 too many. Ulamog also conveniently dodges Lethal Vapors.
Hey. I have maga as one of my generals as well, that's pretty close to your list. I'm running a few more creatures such as havoc demon,helldozer(playtesting),kozilek,darksteel colossus and pestilence demon(which you may want to consider for your build). In my playgroup we have zur,doran,slivers,nicol bolas,8 and a half tails and kresh. Since you run even less creatures than I do how successful are you in surviving the early rushes? How good is infernal darkness(in my playtesting ive had horrible luck with it)? Do you feel like you have enough targets for mirari and Boseiju. My last question is against decks like zur or doran where the general is the most likely path to victory not having some quick targeted removal hurts and turn 3-4 answers like damnation arent as frequent.
Im used to playing momir vig where I tend to have all the answers and I just wanna try to make maga less frail. Cabal coffers being removed of course hurts a ton.
Hey. I have maga as one of my generals as well, that's pretty close to your list. I'm running a few more creatures such as havoc demon,helldozer(playtesting),kozilek,darksteel colossus and pestilence demon(which you may want to consider for your build). In my playgroup we have zur,doran,slivers,nicol bolas,8 and a half tails and kresh. Since you run even less creatures than I do how successful are you in surviving the early rushes? How good is infernal darkness(in my playtesting ive had horrible luck with it)? Do you feel like you have enough targets for mirari and Boseiju. My last question is against decks like zur or doran where the general is the most likely path to victory not having some quick targeted removal hurts and turn 3-4 answers like damnation arent as frequent.
Im used to playing momir vig where I tend to have all the answers and I just wanna try to make maga less frail. Cabal coffers being removed of course hurts a ton.
My group currently has a lot of deck variety. If I can remember it is:
Then a few other people bring random decks as well sometimes. As far as the early rushes are concerned most of the decks are creature light and/or control decks so there aren't many early rushes. Since I've got so few creatures I like the wraths over spot removal and following up a wrath with Lethal Vapors doesn't affect me much at all. Infernal Darkness has been really effective for me, not against the monoblack decks obviously but most of the other decks are at least slowed down by it. If everyone is running a lot of artifact mana though I could see it not being as effective. The Mirari and the Boseiju are to help against the counter heavy blue generals like Teferi, Azami & Ertai mostly. Usually I am able to get a mass discard spell and the Mirari and Boseiju helps force it through counters. None of the decks above are aggro, even the monored one, but the guy that has the Kagemaro deck used to have a Korlash deck that was really aggressive. Sometimes it would just clobber me, other times I had enough removal but I can't justify running more than I have now against so many control decks. Pestilence Demon is a good suggestion though, he'd help a lot against Gaddock Teeg. I'll have to try and pick one up.
Then a few other people bring random decks as well sometimes. As far as the early rushes are concerned most of the decks are creature light and/or control decks so there aren't many early rushes. Since I've got so few creatures I like the wraths over spot removal and following up a wrath with Lethal Vapors doesn't affect me much at all. Infernal Darkness has been really effective for me, not against the monoblack decks obviously but most of the other decks are at least slowed down by it. If everyone is running a lot of artifact mana though I could see it not being as effective. The Mirari and the Boseiju are to help against the counter heavy blue generals like Teferi, Azami & Ertai mostly. Usually I am able to get a mass discard spell and the Mirari and Boseiju helps force it through counters. None of the decks above are aggro, even the monored one, but the guy that has the Kagemaro deck used to have a Korlash deck that was really aggressive. Sometimes it would just clobber me, other times I had enough removal but I can't justify running more than I have now against so many control decks. Pestilence Demon is a good suggestion though, he'd help a lot against Gaddock Teeg. I'll have to try and pick one up.
Im gonna keep boseiju in but im thinking about cutting mirari since i think it requires a specific type of deck that we just dont have. Its not that im saying creature heavy decks are the problem but say flickerform zur, doran with totem armor or just having power like that forces a wrath effect from you on one, maybe two creatures. I decided to add barter in blood to further help myself get an extra turn or two to set up. I just ordered most of the creatures I mentioned so im gonna wait and see how they turn out. 10-15 creatures wouldnt exactly make my deck creature heavy. I run a maze of ith as well but people can easily get around that with shroud.
I'd take out Bubbling Muck for Magus of the Coffers, which will give you more consistent ramp.
I'd also try to find room for Shizo, Death's Storehouse, since it works with (obviously) your general, plus the eldrazi titans and the myojin. And it'll let you work politics with other generals.
I can't tell how many creatures your running, but you might want to consider Oversold Cemetery.
How this helps some!
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I'd actually run both Magus and Bubbling Muck. This is a mana-hungry deck, and you generally want as much mana ramp as you can get your hands on. Bubbling Muck is black's High Tide. Play it, then cast Yawgmoth's Will, then cast it again to have a party. You should easily have enough mana to blow out the whole table.
Oversold Cemetery requires a great volume of creatures to make it work. Even in my Volrath deck, which runs at least 24 creatures, it seems like at times I don't have the 4 creatures needed to recur with Cemetery. I really like Volrath's Stronghold for creature recursion since it goes right into the mana base. It's fantastic for recycling Solemn Sim, Titan, Duplicant, and mana ramp creatures such as Suicide Girl and Magus. Also note that Ulamog and Emrakul will clear out your graveyard if they get sent there, which makes Cemetery that much harder to get going.
I'd actually run both Magus and Bubbling Muck. This is a mana-hungry deck, and you generally want as much mana ramp as you can get your hands on. Bubbling Muck is black's High Tide. Play it, then cast Yawgmoth's Will, then cast it again to have a party. You should easily have enough mana to blow out the whole table.
Oversold Cemetery requires a great volume of creatures to make it work. Even in my Volrath deck, which runs at least 24 creatures, it seems like at times I don't have the 4 creatures needed to recur with Cemetery. I really like Volrath's Stronghold for creature recursion since it goes right into the mana base. It's fantastic for recycling Solemn Sim, Titan, Duplicant, and mana ramp creatures such as Suicide Girl and Magus. Also note that Ulamog and Emrakul will clear out your graveyard if they get sent there, which makes Cemetery that much harder to get going.
That sums it up pretty nicely. I ran the Magus for awhile and found him to be too slow and fragile. If I counted right I've only got 11 creatures including my general, most of which are utility creatures so Oversold Cemetary definitely doesn't have enough targets. I'm trying out Deserted Temple for now so should I have a chance to tutor for a second land (after Coffers of course) it will be the Temple and not Urborg so I want to keep my swamp count as high as possible. Volrath's Stronghold only has about 6-7 targets I'd realistically want to even recur so I don't think it adds enough to the deck.
That sums it up pretty nicely. I ran the Magus for awhile and found him to be too slow and fragile. If I counted right I've only got 11 creatures including my general, most of which are utility creatures so Oversold Cemetary definitely doesn't have enough targets. I'm trying out Deserted Temple for now so should I have a chance to tutor for a second land (after Coffers of course) it will be the Temple and not Urborg so I want to keep my swamp count as high as possible. Volrath's Stronghold only has about 6-7 targets I'd realistically want to even recur so I don't think it adds enough to the deck.
I run Maga as well. I took Volrath's Stronghold out of my deck after a few weeks of testing. Since Maga decks ideally use very few creatures, the best one could do is let Maga hit the graveyard, and then use Volrath's ability. But that just slows you down and since you're producing a ton of mana anyhow, it's not a big deal to let Maga die and hit the command zone a few times. Having Maga reach 3 counters in the command zone is fine. The deck doesn't even need Maga to win, it's just one of many win conditions.
Even with just Maga, it rules. In my Maga EDH I use quite a few utility creatures like Big Game Hunter, Puppeteer Clique, Fleshbag Marauder, Solemn Simulacrum. The portal is a huge target but if it goes unanswered there is much that can be done with it. (I'm looking at you, Eldrazis.)
Even with just Maga, it rules. In my Maga EDH I use quite a few utility creatures like Big Game Hunter, Puppeteer Clique, Fleshbag Marauder, Solemn Simulacrum. The portal is a huge target but if it goes unanswered there is much that can be done with it. (I'm looking at you, Eldrazis.)
I like the card but I think it would be better in a more creature heavy deck. Of the ones you listed I only play the Eldrazis. It would certainly be awesome with Emrakul but that seems like it's a win more card. I'll think about it some more since it does work very nicely with Maga and that might just be enough.
how do you deal with opponents' sadistic sacrament, mindslaver and such? I don't know about you but everytime they resolve I get messed up. They often mill me by removing emrakul or destroy my whole plan by casting gauntlets and naming "white" for example. Do you think more discard/hand/turn disruption could be viable? Imp's mischief, word of command... are they no good or you just don't have the space for them?
I think it might be more of a group dependent thing, I'm pretty sure I'm the only one using Jester's Cap effects in my group so they aren't a problem. Mindslaver is a tremendous beating of course which is part of the reason I added Sadistic Sacrament but it is not such a frequent problem that I want to put in more cards to stop it. My current nemesis is blue based control decks with counterspells so I've probably got more answers for those than most MBC decks need. I guess my answer to your question is that if those are a frequent problem for you then putting in more answers for them certainly seems viable to me, I think the best approach might be just to rip them out of the deck with Sacrament, Nightmare Incursion or Jester's Cap backed up with mass discard. I've wanted to try out Imp's Mischief for a long time now, it seems really strong but I just never found the room for it. Word of Command seems a lot more narrow and they can just cast instants in response so sometimes you won't even get a spell sometimes.
-1 damnation
-1 all is dust (they are both much expensive for a single card and for now creatures are not that big of a problem for me)
-1 nezumi graverobber (if I exile opponent's cards then I don't need to remove them from the graveyard)
+1 nightmare incursion
+1 imp's mischief
+1 jester's cap
(wich is great with recursion from beacon of unrest)
I will even try to find a spot for a Mind shatter and perhaps the ordeal, as one of my opponent has mass land destruction.
I can see what you mean about All is Dust being expensive but it hits enchantments and I need it in my list to get around Karmic Justice which sees some play in my group. Bitter Ordeal doesn't work at instant speed unless you have Orrery in play and is pretty hard to set up. Really only useful with Orrery and Deathcloud and even then you usually can't cast a very big Deathcloud so I think you should stick with the other 2 for now. Instead of Mind Shatter you could also use Wit's End which can still dump someone's hand after they've drawn a bunch of cards and have a Reliquary Tower in play. I've been hit with it with 25+ cards in hand and it was pretty rough.
I'm giving all this feedback because I love the deck and I find your version of Maga to be my personal favorite around the forum and the web.
If you want I'll tell you how mischief performs once I've checked.
Thanks a lot for the support and I would definitely like to know how Imp's Mischief performs. Seems like it has a lot of potential.
When someone resolves a Mindslaver against me, they always do the douche move and cast Necropotence and pay all my life to kill me (before playing any cards in my hand that can mess up other player's gameplan).
Either that, OR, they tutor for Necropotence and kill me.
Such a douche move. On multiple levels. If someone is going to do that, you might as well as Sorin them and cast something like Profane for the win and LOL at them when they cry about Sorin being "cheap" (when in my experience, Mindslaver is "cheap" as all hell)
When someone resolves a Mindslaver against me, they always do the douche move and cast Necropotence and pay all my life to kill me (before playing any cards in my hand that can mess up other player's gameplan).
Either that, OR, they tutor for Necropotence and kill me.
Such a douche move. On multiple levels. If someone is going to do that, you might as well as Sorin them and cast something like Profane for the win and LOL at them when they cry about Sorin being "cheap" (when in my experience, Mindslaver is "cheap" as all hell)
That's one of the risks of playing such powerful and flexible cards though. It's sorta like a 5 color player complaining that Sundering Titan is douchebaggery when it was designed to wreck dual lands. If you don't want to get Slavered, then why not play cards like Sadistic Sacrament or Nightmare Incursion to get of Slaver preemptively?
When someone resolves a Mindslaver against me, they always do the douche move and cast Necropotence and pay all my life to kill me (before playing any cards in my hand that can mess up other player's gameplan).
Either that, OR, they tutor for Necropotence and kill me.
Such a douche move. On multiple levels. If someone is going to do that, you might as well as Sorin them and cast something like Profane for the win and LOL at them when they cry about Sorin being "cheap" (when in my experience, Mindslaver is "cheap" as all hell)
No Pithing Needle? That's my go-to shutoff for problem abilities.
@Donald: I would hesitate to cut Damnation. The anti-regeneration has been a savior for me on multiple occasions. Here is the deck I ran for a while:
General:
1x Maga, Traitor to Mortals
Lands:
31x Swamp
1x Terrain Generator
1x Miren, the Moaning Well
1x Maze of Ith
1x Reliquary Tower
1x Cabal Coffers
1x Everglades
1x Strip Mine
1x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
Creatures:
1x Dimir House Guard
1x Bane of the Living
1x Solemn Simulacrum
1x Sengir Nosferatu
1x Street Wraith
1x Netherborn Phalanx
1x Laquatus's Champion
1x Magus of the Mirror
1x Twisted Abomination
1x Stronghold Overseer
1x Visara the Dreadful
1x Reiver Demon
1x Avatar of Woe
1x Myojin of Night's Reach
1x Scion of Darkness
1x Sundering Titan
Instants:
1x Rend Flesh
1x Chill to the Bone
1x Tendrils of Corruption
1x Diabolic Edict
1x Skeletal Scrying
1x Tainted Pact
1x Shred Memory
Artifacts:
1x Ivory Tower
1x Sensei's Divining Top
1x Mirari
1x Memory Jar
1x Mind's Eye
1x Oblivion Stone
1x Nevinyrral's Disk
1x Gauntlet of Power
1x Charcoal Diamond
1x Mana Vault
1x Wayfarer's Bauble
1x Mind Stone
1x Darksteel Ingot
1x Journeyer's Kite
1x Extraplanar Lens
1x Sol Ring
1x Coldsteel Heart
1x Armillary Sphere
Planeswalkers:
1x Liliana Vess
[/deck]
Obviously, it's pre-ZEN, and I've deconstructed it in preparation for my Seizan, Perverter of Truth deck for Archenemy Planechase. But hopefully, you'll find a couple gems in there. I also just recently reacquired a Candles of Leng, which has always been a personal favorite of mine.
@abraxas: If someone Mindslaver's me it is probably in their best interests to kill me by any means they can. If I Mindslaver someone I try to do the same unless I need them alive for some reason. The ability to randomly kill people is what makes Mindslaver so awesome. Surging Chaos' analogy was a good one, actually it is the reason I play Sundering Titan.
@Shinigami: I'm finally getting around to testing out Pithing Needle in another deck and if it turns out to be awesome I will try and find room for it here. I looked over your list and it has a lot of cards I've been wanting to try out (Pthisis, Armillary Sphere, Terrain Generator). Memory Jar seems particularly exciting, I think my switch to try out Drana will be something like:
-Maga
-Loxodon Warhammer
-Sudden Death
-Nezumi Graverobber
+Drana
+Lightning Greeves
+Whispersilk Cloak
+Memory Jar
Even if Drana doesn't work out I think I'll keep the Jar in over the Graverobber. It seems really good since you should usually have the mana to play your entire Jar hand in one turn.
EDIT: I'm also going to leave the Drana changes off the list for now unless Drana proves herself to definitely be better than Maga. Also the guy that plays Visara might switch to Drana, I don't want to lock in Drana for a general since he might then switch to Maga if I do so I am just going to show up and hope he doesn't lock in Drana for his Visara deck and cut me off.
I'm also going to leave the Drana changes off the list for now unless Drana proves herself to definitely be better than Maga. Also the guy that plays Visara might switch to Drana, I don't want to lock in Drana for a general since he might then switch to Maga if I do so I am just going to show up and hope he doesn't lock in Drana for his Visara deck and cut me off.
I recommend that you keep Maga. He can kill players just by hitting the field, while Drana may serve better as a utility removal piece.
1 Kiku, Night's Flower
Creatures
1 Crypt Ghast
1 Solemn Simulacrum
1 Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed
1 Steel Hellkite
1 Myojin of Night's Reach
Artifacts
1 Candelabra of Tawnos
1 Expedition Map
1 Nihil Spellbomb
1 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Sol Ring
1 Wayfarer's Bauble
1 Armillary Sphere
1 Doubling Cube
1 Mind Stone
1 Extraplanar Lens
1 Oblivion Stone
1 Vedalken Orrery
1 Alhammarret's Archive
1 Gauntlet of Power
1 Memory Jar
1 Ring of Three Wishes
1 Caged Sun
Enchantments
1 Necropotence
1 Phyrexian Arena
1 Death Match
1 Infernal Darkness
1 Lethal Vapors
1 Spreading Plague
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Go for the Throat
1 Hero's Downfall
1 Sudden Death
1 Insidious Dreams
1 Tendrils of Corruption
1 Skeletal Scrying
Sorceries
1 Bubbling Muck
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Night's Whisper
1 Sign in Blood
1 Beseech the Queen
1 Grim Tutor
1 Praetor's Grasp
1 Read the Bones
1 Sadistic Sacrament
1 Toxic Deluge
1 Yawgmoth's Will
1 Damnation
1 Ill-Gotten Gains
1 Mutilate
1 Dark Petition
1 Diabolic Revelation
1 Mind Sludge
1 All is Dust
1 Worst Fears
1 Mind Twist
1 Exsanguinate
1 Sorin Markov
1 Karn Liberated
Lands
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Buried Ruin
1 Cabal Coffers
1 Deserted Temple
1 Maze of Ith
1 Myriad Landscape
1 Strip Mine
1 Thawing Glaciers
1 Thespian's Stage
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Vesuva
1 Wasteland
28 Swamp
About the deck
This is a pretty traditional big mana monoblack control list. It's creature light to help maximize the effectiveness of the many sweepers and runs a lot of disruption. There are also many ramp cards to help play big bombs and power out large X spells. Early game is usually tutoring up Thawing Glaciers to help hit land drops so that my mana doublers are more effective. Mid game is about controlling the board and disrupting opponents. Late game is taking over and dropping bombs. Against U/x control decks this deck needs to take a more aggressive role as those decks tend to have a better late game so I will aggressively try to kill them. Other decks tend to have a weaker late game so it is generally better to sit back and develop my board and wait for the right moment to strike and seal up the win.
Why play Kiku?
This deck isn't built around a commander and there are a number of viable options such as Maga, Traitor to Mortals, Sheoldred, Whispering One, Oona, Queen of the Fae & Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief that could be used in her place. I chose Kiku specifically because she is cheap to cast, helps me stabilize and deters attackers. She can also be used to kill off key creatures or prevent people from playing their commander. Previously I had Maga at the helm but once Exsanguinate was printed I found that I was rarely casting him so Kiku gives me a commander that will make an impact in almost every game I play and her cheap cost makes her relevant in the early game. Plus she has great flavor text.
Card Choices
Vedalken Orrery - This card dramatically changes the way the deck plays out because it turns this typically very proactive deck into a very reactive deck allowing you to see what your opponents do during their turns and react accordingly. It makes tutors extremely powerful since you can cast them at instant speed and your whole deck has flash. You can also double up on turns every other turn doing absurd things like dropping a couple mana doublers EOT then untapping and casting some bombs before your opponents can use sorcery speed answers. Discard spells are also stronger at instant speed because you can cast them during your opponent's draw step. Lastly it can give your creatures pseudo haste which can be important for guys like Steel Hellkite and Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre. This is a definite staple for this style of monoblack control.
Ill-Gotten Gains - The power of the card is all in the timing, similar in a way to how Balance is absurdly powerful (and much more powerful than Ill-Gotten Gains, this is just an example) but might appear fair to someone who hasn't played with it. Now Balance is unfair because it's much easier to break but it's also unfair because the Balance caster gets to choose when it happens. If they have a favorable board position they simply choose not to cast it. This is the same with Ill-Gotten Gains, in most situations you do not want to cast it. You have cards in hand, dangerous stuff in opponents graveyard, etc. This card becomes very powerful though when you do want to cast it. It will often be the last card in your hand (or you're holding stuff you don't care about) and it's a triple Regrowth. Now while it may seem that this benefits your opponents equally since they all get 3 Regrowths too it often will not. Let's assume your opponents are good players with good decks. Good decks will usually have more than 3 cards in their hand and will have a deck full of good cards so the cards in their hand will be good. So if for example they are holding 6 good cards, this causes them to pitch those cards for 3 good cards. Now their card quality may have increased (and this is a maybe) but they are now down 3 good cards.
As far as breaking the synergy of the card the best way to do this is through discard. Ideally you get back Myojin of Night's Reach and make them dump their hand while still getting to keep 2 cards but often even a simple Mindtwist on the person who got the best cards back will suffice. Additionally you can use graveyard hate to limit people's options.
The last thing I'd like to add is that after casting Ill-Gotten Gains everyone will know what everyone else is holding. This should make everyone's threat assessment excellent so the most threatening player should be the one that gets targeted. You don't want this to be you so if you are casting it "fairly" (not breaking the symmetry or immediately winning) you want to get back cards that aren't immediately threatening to opponents. Cards like Phyrexian Arena are great because they aren't an immediate threat so people will generally let you have Arena because there are more serious things for them to worry about. Choosing the correct cards can be incredibly skill testing for everyone which is one of the reasons I like the card so much.
Bane of the Living - He may seem like an overcosted sweeper but the nice thing about him is the ability to function at instant speed which is a great way to deter attackers. Having no other morphs in my deck is kind of a bonus since my opponents know that if I have a morph in play it's this guy so there's no reason to take a gamble and swing at me.
Doubing Cube - This is arguably the worst mana doubler because without another mana doubler in play you need a lot of land to get value out of it. That said this deck is filled with mana doublers and tutors so getting another mana doubler out isn't very difficult.
Infernal Darkness - Contamination sucks in this deck. Infernal Darkness is much better because it's a stand alone card that doesn't need any other support. The cumulative upkeep should not be an issue as it is pretty easy to kill everyone in 2-4 turns if they can't cast spells and making land drops every turn will often mean 2-3 extra mana is available thanks to the mana doublers.
Sign in Blood/Night's Whisper - These are not very exciting cards but they fill an important role by giving me more things to do in the early game. Late game they are simply cheap card advantage. Usually I do not like cards with such a poor lifeloss to card advantage ratio (2 life to net 1 extra card) but these have played out better than more expensive options like Ancient Craving because of their cheap casting cost.
Syphon Mind - I typically play 4-5 person multiplayer with occasional 6 or even 7 player so this regularly draws me 3+ cards with no lifeloss while acting as minor disruption.
Mind Stone - Fixing is not needed in monocolor decks so this acts as a cheap ramp spell that can be cycled away later in the game or in response to a sweeper. It's also nice vs. mass discard because it helps you recover more quickly.
Mind Twist/Mind Sludge - Mass discard for all opponents is pretty rare but these can still empty the hand of the biggest threat so they don't lose much value in multiplayer. They also only piss off one person while leaving that person in a poor position to retaliate.
Sadistic Sacrament - I need to run a Jester's Cap effect as a tutor target and this is the best option. It grabs troublesome cards like Mindslaver , mass LD, combo pieces and key cards. Late game it can be kicked to cripple someone. Don't be afraid to cast this without kicker, that is the main mode of the card and the kicker is just an added bonus when you topdeck this late game.
Candelabra of Tawnos - Candelabra acts as a mana doubler when combined with most other mana doublers in the deck. It also works well with Cabal Coffers, Thawing Glaciers and with either of these in play Deserted Temple. What makes it so powerful is the very low casting cost as it will almost always act as a ramp spell the turn you play it unlike more expensive mana doublers.
Insidious Dreams - In a vacuum it appears to be card disadvantage but in actual play this is rarely the case. Often it will pitch 2-3 cards and you can put a card draw spell on top like Promise of Power or Necropotence turning the disadvantage into significant card advantage. I often fetch a tutor, a draw spell and/or a bonus spell or something like Exsanguinate, mana doubler, draw spell. One thing you have to be careful about is counterspells because the discard is an additional cost. In situations where I suspect my opponent may have a counter I will often cast it and only pitch 1 card to avoid getting blown out. While this may seem poor it's still a fine play and shows how flexible this card can be.
Bubbling Muck - While 1 shot ramp effects are viewed as poor in this format Bubbling Muck typically provides a large boost of mana which helps to create very explosive turns that opponents often don't see coming. It is also very powerful with Yawgmoth's Will.
Lethal Vapors - My experience with this card is that people rarely are willing to skip a turn to destroy it and it provides excellent board control, especially when preceded with or followed up by a sweeper.
Spreading Plague - It may seem out of place in a monocolored deck but I am not using it to kill other black creatures. It's used to prevent people from playing creatures and it does an excellent job at this since creatures rarely survive summoning sickness with Spreading Plague in play. It's also good against commanders because if their commander is in play any creature they cast will kill it and if their commander is not in play casting it will kill all their creatures. It also conveniently doesn't kill colorless creatures which many of my creatures are.
Thawing Glaciers - It looks like a slow card and it is. It's a glacier, what do you expect? The reason it's so good is that it ensures a steady stream of land drops and this deck really needs to be hitting land drops every turn to maximize the mana doublers. This is often one of the first cards I tutor up and it's great at letting you keep land light hands without having to mulligan. It also interacts nicely with Candelabra of Tawnos and Deserted Temple.
Extraplanar Lens - This is a great card because it is so cheap to cast. Once you hit 6 lands it's essentially free to play and any more than that and it ramps you the turn you play it. Compare this to Caged Sun which requires 12 lands to do the same. This makes it well worth the drawback of getting 2 for 1'd if it gets blown up. The symmetrical effect isn't so bad when you consider that a 2 color deck running black will probably be running a lot of non-basics to fix their mana so it is unlikely that they'll have a lot of basic swamps in play and 3+ color decks will only have a couple basic swamps in play.
Alternate card options
Helldozer - He's a slow card but he can do serious damage to non-basic lands if you're able to untap with him.
Mirari - I played this card for awhile and it's solid. Helps out vs. counters, doubles tutors and forks some nasty disruption.
Consume Spirit - This is a great option for an X spell if another one is needed.
Kozilek, Butcher of Truth - I feel that the current amount of card draw does fine. Kozilek is a good option if you need more mill protection or in lists that run Lightning Greeves.
Nevinyrral's Disk - Another sweeper option. It's pretty cheap but takes a turn to come online making it somewhat unreliable.
Imp's Mischief - I found there simply weren't enough targets for this card when I played it. It's a unique effect and probably very good in certain metagames, notably ones where extra turn cards are cast.
Liliana Vess - Another tutor option however expect her to have a short life expectancy.
Profane Command - A versatile X spell option but mostly used as removal and a drain spell.
Crystal Ball - It's a pretty good card with a cheap activation.
Withering Boon - Another unique effect for black, especially useful against commanders with ETB abilities.
Nightmare Incursion - This is very close to as good as Sadistic Sacrament. I chose Sacrament because it can be cast earlier but later on Nightmare Incursion is the better card because it's cheaper than kicked Sacrament.
Ancient Craving - A solid draw option.
Corrupt - Corrupt is quite good albeit a little expensive for what you get out of it.
Everflowing Chalice - Early game ramp or late game big ramp.
Necrologia - Acts as a 1 shot Necropotence.
Boseiju, who Shelters All - This is one of the best ways to deal with blue control. Just cast a mass discard spell off it.
Death Cloud - The only viable mass land destruction card available for this deck. Good with Planeswalkers, enchantments and artifacts.
Sculpting Steel - Lots of artifacts you want to copy in your group? If so this card could be good.
Darksteel Forge - A great option for protecting your many artifacts against sweepers and spot removal.
Magus of the Coffers - He's slow and fragile but he is a mana doubler.
Weaknesses
Mass land destruction - Being a control deck having lots of land is very important and can take awhile to build up. Since the deck doesn't run any counters the only way to deal with this is to use discard, Sadistic Sacrament or the more difficult option of maintaining a strong enough board presence that mass ld can't be used.
Mindslaver - There is a pretty good chance this card will just kill you because of Necropotence or a tutor for Necropotence.
Counterspells - Since the deck runs a lot of very expensive spells counterspells can cause you to lose a lot of tempo and in some cases are similar to you skipping your turn if you only cast one spell.
Enchantments and artifacts - These types of permanents can be difficult to answer. Fortunately there have been a lot of new options printed recently and you can always tutor for answers if you need them.
Changelog
9/1/09
-1 Korlash, Heir to Blackblade
+1 Lethal Vapors
9/10/09
+Mindslaver
+Sorin Markov
+Mutilate
-Guiltfeeder
-Helldozer
-Nightmare Incursion
9/14/09
-Withered Wretch
+Puppeteer Clique
9/29/09
-Darksteel Ingot
+Candelabra of Tawnos
10/23/09
-Wasteland
+Stripmine
2/12/10
-Avatar of Woe
-Stronghold Overseer
+Sadistic Sacrament
+Mishra's Helix
3/17/10
-Swamp
+Bojuka Bog
3/18/10
-Sadistic Sacrament
-Chainer, Dimentia Master
+Mind Twist
+Mirari
4/8/10
-Swamp
-Puppeteer Clique
-Magus of the Coffers
+Crucible of Worlds
+Expedition Map
+Deserted Temple
4/15/10
-Sculpting Steel
-Stuffy Doll
-Mortivore
-Staff of Domination
-Darksteel Forge
+Nirkana Revenant
+All is Dust
+Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
+Suffer the Past
+Corrupt
5/3/10
-Kagemaro, First to Suffer
+Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre
5/12/10
-Gilded Lotus
+Sadistic Sacrament
5/22/10
-Dimir House Guard
+Pestilence Demon
6/3/10
-Nezumi Graverobber
+Memory Jar
6/24/10
-Mishra's Helix
-Boseiju, Who Shelters All
-Loxodon Warhammer
-Death Cloud
-Beacon of Unrest
-Crucible of Worlds
+Mind Stone
+Everflowing Chalice
+Grim Monolith
+Necrologia
+Swamp
+Solemn Simulacrum
7/21/10
-Necrologia
+Crystal Ball
8/25/10
-Everflowing Chalice
-Corrupt
-Drain Life
-Vesuva
+Sign in Blood
+Night's Whisper
+Armillary Sphere
+Swamp
10/11/10
-Mirari
+Exsanguinate
11/2/10
-Ancient Craving
+Syphon Mind
12/14/10
-Emrakul
+Kozilek
12/22/10
-Crystal Ball
+Mirari
2/5/11
-Profane Command
+Imp's Mischief
2/18/11
-Liliana Vess
+Go for the Throat
3/3/11
-Twisted Abomination
+Wayfarer's Bauble
3/28/11
-Imp's Mischief
+Steel Hellkite
5/12/11
-Grim Monolith
-Nevinyrral's Disk
-Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
+Praetor's Grasp
+Karn Liberated
+Caged Sun
8/9/11
-Mirari
-Consume Spirit
-Duplicant
+Rend Flesh
+Maze of Ith
+Spreading Plague
9/8/11
-Maga, Traitor to Mortals
+Kiku, Night's Flower
2/22/12
-Bane of the Living
+Increasing Ambition
4/4/13 (been awhile)
-Sundering Titan
-Rend Flesh
-Ulamog
-Swamp
-Syphon Mind
-Suffer the Past
+Murder
+Diabolic Revelation
+Crypt Ghast
+Thespian's Stage
+Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed
+Shred Memory
8/9/14
1 Promise of Power
1 Murder
1 Planar Portal
1 Swamp
1 Decree of Pain
1 Wound Reflection
1 Mindslaver
1 Pestilence Demon
1 Read the Bones
1 Hero's Downfall
1 Ring of Three Wishes
1 Buried Ruin
1 Toxic Deluge
1 Death Match
1 Worst Fears
8/30/15
1 Increasing Ambition
1 Shred Memory
1 Swamp
1 Dark Petition
1 Nihil Spellbomb
1 Myriad Landscape
Wishlist
No, only COMBAT damage from a General is General Damage.
Casual Commander player.
Check this Magic Shop to buy singles and cards online in Europe!
Already in.
Worldwake has Bojuka Bog as the only card that could make the deck. It's not a swamp which is a big strike against it but I am going to try it out as additional graveyard hate.
Yes, the Revenant seems very strong. Wish it were legendary and I might even consider switching generals.
@mod: This thread should be over in the Multiplayer EDH section.
Rite of Consumption: Allows you to sac Maga and recast him while hitting someone for big damage
Profane Command: Another good mana sink, can help with recursion and removal as well. (ooops, you already have it in there)
Miren, the Moaning Well/Diamond Valley: Sac outlets that'll help you gain life.
Just some ideas. Looks like fun.
Most recently looking at Morinfen!
@Tarasco - Rite of Consumption is interesting but requires my general or possibly Nirkana Revenant to be useful.
Miren, the Moaning Well/Diamond Valley - The Moaning well isn't a swamp and I don't run many creatures and rarely tutor up Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth. Diamond Valley seems solid but it is more than I want to spend on a card. I'll put it in if I pick one up in a trade.
Thanks for the suggestions though.
Im used to playing momir vig where I tend to have all the answers and I just wanna try to make maga less frail. Cabal coffers being removed of course hurts a ton.
My group currently has a lot of deck variety. If I can remember it is:
Player A:
Sliver Overlord, Gaddock Teeg, Wort, the Raidmother, Ertai, the Corrupted, Hanna, Ship's Navigator, Visara, the Dreadful, Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir
Player B:
Azami, Lady of Scrolls, Child of Alara, Sharuum the Hegemon, Oona, Queen of the Fae (mono black), Niv Mizzet, the Firemind
Player C:
Kazuul, Tyrant of the Cliffs, Doran, the Siege Tower, Kagemaro, First to Suffer
Then a few other people bring random decks as well sometimes. As far as the early rushes are concerned most of the decks are creature light and/or control decks so there aren't many early rushes. Since I've got so few creatures I like the wraths over spot removal and following up a wrath with Lethal Vapors doesn't affect me much at all. Infernal Darkness has been really effective for me, not against the monoblack decks obviously but most of the other decks are at least slowed down by it. If everyone is running a lot of artifact mana though I could see it not being as effective. The Mirari and the Boseiju are to help against the counter heavy blue generals like Teferi, Azami & Ertai mostly. Usually I am able to get a mass discard spell and the Mirari and Boseiju helps force it through counters. None of the decks above are aggro, even the monored one, but the guy that has the Kagemaro deck used to have a Korlash deck that was really aggressive. Sometimes it would just clobber me, other times I had enough removal but I can't justify running more than I have now against so many control decks. Pestilence Demon is a good suggestion though, he'd help a lot against Gaddock Teeg. I'll have to try and pick one up.
Im gonna keep boseiju in but im thinking about cutting mirari since i think it requires a specific type of deck that we just dont have. Its not that im saying creature heavy decks are the problem but say flickerform zur, doran with totem armor or just having power like that forces a wrath effect from you on one, maybe two creatures. I decided to add barter in blood to further help myself get an extra turn or two to set up. I just ordered most of the creatures I mentioned so im gonna wait and see how they turn out. 10-15 creatures wouldnt exactly make my deck creature heavy. I run a maze of ith as well but people can easily get around that with shroud.
I'd also try to find room for Shizo, Death's Storehouse, since it works with (obviously) your general, plus the eldrazi titans and the myojin. And it'll let you work politics with other generals.
I can't tell how many creatures your running, but you might want to consider Oversold Cemetery.
How this helps some!
MTG L1 Judge
Oversold Cemetery requires a great volume of creatures to make it work. Even in my Volrath deck, which runs at least 24 creatures, it seems like at times I don't have the 4 creatures needed to recur with Cemetery. I really like Volrath's Stronghold for creature recursion since it goes right into the mana base. It's fantastic for recycling Solemn Sim, Titan, Duplicant, and mana ramp creatures such as Suicide Girl and Magus. Also note that Ulamog and Emrakul will clear out your graveyard if they get sent there, which makes Cemetery that much harder to get going.
That sums it up pretty nicely. I ran the Magus for awhile and found him to be too slow and fragile. If I counted right I've only got 11 creatures including my general, most of which are utility creatures so Oversold Cemetary definitely doesn't have enough targets. I'm trying out Deserted Temple for now so should I have a chance to tutor for a second land (after Coffers of course) it will be the Temple and not Urborg so I want to keep my swamp count as high as possible. Volrath's Stronghold only has about 6-7 targets I'd realistically want to even recur so I don't think it adds enough to the deck.
I run Maga as well. I took Volrath's Stronghold out of my deck after a few weeks of testing. Since Maga decks ideally use very few creatures, the best one could do is let Maga hit the graveyard, and then use Volrath's ability. But that just slows you down and since you're producing a ton of mana anyhow, it's not a big deal to let Maga die and hit the command zone a few times. Having Maga reach 3 counters in the command zone is fine. The deck doesn't even need Maga to win, it's just one of many win conditions.
Deserted Temple > Volrath's Stronghold.
Even with just Maga, it rules. In my Maga EDH I use quite a few utility creatures like Big Game Hunter, Puppeteer Clique, Fleshbag Marauder, Solemn Simulacrum. The portal is a huge target but if it goes unanswered there is much that can be done with it. (I'm looking at you, Eldrazis.)
I like the card but I think it would be better in a more creature heavy deck. Of the ones you listed I only play the Eldrazis. It would certainly be awesome with Emrakul but that seems like it's a win more card. I'll think about it some more since it does work very nicely with Maga and that might just be enough.
I think it might be more of a group dependent thing, I'm pretty sure I'm the only one using Jester's Cap effects in my group so they aren't a problem. Mindslaver is a tremendous beating of course which is part of the reason I added Sadistic Sacrament but it is not such a frequent problem that I want to put in more cards to stop it. My current nemesis is blue based control decks with counterspells so I've probably got more answers for those than most MBC decks need. I guess my answer to your question is that if those are a frequent problem for you then putting in more answers for them certainly seems viable to me, I think the best approach might be just to rip them out of the deck with Sacrament, Nightmare Incursion or Jester's Cap backed up with mass discard. I've wanted to try out Imp's Mischief for a long time now, it seems really strong but I just never found the room for it. Word of Command seems a lot more narrow and they can just cast instants in response so sometimes you won't even get a spell sometimes.
I can see what you mean about All is Dust being expensive but it hits enchantments and I need it in my list to get around Karmic Justice which sees some play in my group. Bitter Ordeal doesn't work at instant speed unless you have Orrery in play and is pretty hard to set up. Really only useful with Orrery and Deathcloud and even then you usually can't cast a very big Deathcloud so I think you should stick with the other 2 for now. Instead of Mind Shatter you could also use Wit's End which can still dump someone's hand after they've drawn a bunch of cards and have a Reliquary Tower in play. I've been hit with it with 25+ cards in hand and it was pretty rough.
Thanks a lot for the support and I would definitely like to know how Imp's Mischief performs. Seems like it has a lot of potential.
Either that, OR, they tutor for Necropotence and kill me.
Such a douche move. On multiple levels. If someone is going to do that, you might as well as Sorin them and cast something like Profane for the win and LOL at them when they cry about Sorin being "cheap" (when in my experience, Mindslaver is "cheap" as all hell)
That's one of the risks of playing such powerful and flexible cards though. It's sorta like a 5 color player complaining that Sundering Titan is douchebaggery when it was designed to wreck dual lands. If you don't want to get Slavered, then why not play cards like Sadistic Sacrament or Nightmare Incursion to get of Slaver preemptively?
No Pithing Needle? That's my go-to shutoff for problem abilities.
@Donald: I would hesitate to cut Damnation. The anti-regeneration has been a savior for me on multiple occasions. Here is the deck I ran for a while:
1x Maga, Traitor to Mortals
Lands:
31x Swamp
1x Terrain Generator
1x Miren, the Moaning Well
1x Maze of Ith
1x Reliquary Tower
1x Cabal Coffers
1x Everglades
1x Strip Mine
1x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
Creatures:
1x Dimir House Guard
1x Bane of the Living
1x Solemn Simulacrum
1x Sengir Nosferatu
1x Street Wraith
1x Netherborn Phalanx
1x Laquatus's Champion
1x Magus of the Mirror
1x Twisted Abomination
1x Stronghold Overseer
1x Visara the Dreadful
1x Reiver Demon
1x Avatar of Woe
1x Myojin of Night's Reach
1x Scion of Darkness
1x Sundering Titan
Instants:
1x Rend Flesh
1x Chill to the Bone
1x Tendrils of Corruption
1x Diabolic Edict
1x Skeletal Scrying
1x Tainted Pact
1x Shred Memory
Sorceries:
1x Profane Command
1x Beseech the Queen
1x Diabolic Intent
1x Diabolic Tutor
1x Dimir Machinations
1x Brainspoil
1x Night's Whisper
1x Drain Life
1x Corrupt
1x Damnation
1x Consume Spirit
1x Innocent Blood
1x Phthisis
1x Barter in Blood
1x Chainer's Edict
1x Beacon of Unrest
Enchantments:
1x Necropotence
1x Phyrexian Arena
Artifacts:
1x Ivory Tower
1x Sensei's Divining Top
1x Mirari
1x Memory Jar
1x Mind's Eye
1x Oblivion Stone
1x Nevinyrral's Disk
1x Gauntlet of Power
1x Charcoal Diamond
1x Mana Vault
1x Wayfarer's Bauble
1x Mind Stone
1x Darksteel Ingot
1x Journeyer's Kite
1x Extraplanar Lens
1x Sol Ring
1x Coldsteel Heart
1x Armillary Sphere
Planeswalkers:
1x Liliana Vess
[/deck]
Obviously, it's pre-ZEN, and I've deconstructed it in preparation for my Seizan, Perverter of Truth deck for Archenemy Planechase. But hopefully, you'll find a couple gems in there. I also just recently reacquired a Candles of Leng, which has always been a personal favorite of mine.
@Shinigami: I'm finally getting around to testing out Pithing Needle in another deck and if it turns out to be awesome I will try and find room for it here. I looked over your list and it has a lot of cards I've been wanting to try out (Pthisis, Armillary Sphere, Terrain Generator). Memory Jar seems particularly exciting, I think my switch to try out Drana will be something like:
-Maga
-Loxodon Warhammer
-Sudden Death
-Nezumi Graverobber
+Drana
+Lightning Greeves
+Whispersilk Cloak
+Memory Jar
Even if Drana doesn't work out I think I'll keep the Jar in over the Graverobber. It seems really good since you should usually have the mana to play your entire Jar hand in one turn.
EDIT: I'm also going to leave the Drana changes off the list for now unless Drana proves herself to definitely be better than Maga. Also the guy that plays Visara might switch to Drana, I don't want to lock in Drana for a general since he might then switch to Maga if I do so I am just going to show up and hope he doesn't lock in Drana for his Visara deck and cut me off.
I recommend that you keep Maga. He can kill players just by hitting the field, while Drana may serve better as a utility removal piece.