"Kaalia of the Vast sits within her mountain chapel pondering both the heavenly host and the infernal horde, tormented by her past, scarred by devastation. Her once-simple life as a cleric was reduced to ashes when shadowy beings massacred her congregation. Somehow she survived, but her soul was fractured, and a growing hatred soon grew in the cracks. Now, driven by a righteous fury and an unholy thirst for revenge, Kaalia broods feverishly, amassing her vast power, waiting to unleash her apocalyptic might upon any who stand in her way." - Heavenly Inferno Precon Sheet
Mana Cost - 1WBR. Kaalia is cheap enough to cast quickly or repeatedly, even though this deck doesn't necessarily want to do that. If she was only three mana then she would be a lot more ridiculous (and recurable by Sun Titan :evillol:). It's not good to have to send her back to the Command Zone, because then she costs as much as the creatures she's trying to cheat in.
Creature Type - Human Cleric. No real synergies with Human, but there is some stuff going on with clerics. Problem is, you dilute the deck if you start running clerics.
Ability - "Whenever ~ attacks an opponent, you may put an Angel, Demon or Dragon creature from your hand onto the battlefield tapped and attacking that opponent." This is why we're playing her. This ability plays nice with mana rocks and land destruction, since we don't always cast the A, D, and D's. Couple of side notes, some dragons have abilities to do with attacking. Flameblast Dragon's ability won't trigger off Kaalia, but Ancient Hellkite's ability can be activated. And furthermore, some demons have "when ~ ETB, if you cast this from your hand" triggers, which don't trigger off Kaalia.
Body - 2/2 flyer. Kaalia's a small fry. Easily killed in combat or even by Pyroclasm (effects), keeping her on the table can be difficult. But this is why we play Darksteel Plate, Aegis Angel, Deathless Angel, etc.
Play Her if you:
- love angels, demons, and dragons.
- like using the commander for shenanigans.
- like being the person to beat in a given game.
- like being challenged to build with two bad colors and a great color.
- like watching your opponents squirm and curse, aka Schadenfreude.
Don't Play Her if you:
- want to combo out hardcore.
- have a super competitive playgroup. (Kaalia could possibly survive, don't get me wrong. But you're probably better off playing a different general)
- are iffy about land destruction (or your playgroup is).
- don't like counting on your commander much.
So I'm a 20-something year old college kid in Colorado, USA. So yes, I don't have any original duals or FoW or any of that. So my lists are slightly budget, cause, ya know, I'm in college. I only started playing EDH this summer (2011), but it's a blast. I've been playing Magic in general since about Tenth Edition, with a bit of a break from shortly after ZEN until about Besieged. My MtG psychological profile thing is predominantly Johnny and Vorthos, but I do have a bit of Timmy and Spike as well. I love flavorful decks, card choices, etc, and I want to show off my ideas. But I do like just playing huge dragons or fifteen million elves and smashing face. Almost by virtue of posting on a forum, I do have a bit of a competitive edge, but I try not to let that really shine through all the time. My two playgroups aren't the best or most competitive, and only one other guy seems to post on forums and stuff, so my decks tend to be the most consistent.
From Blackjack's Excellent EDH Guide - "A little like Stax, but instead of denying and taxing resources, it punishes everything players do like drawing cards, tapping lands, and playing spells with cards like Manabarbs, Ankh of Mishra, Spellshock, Underworld Dreams, Painful Quandary, and Spiteful Visions. The trick is making it hurt your opponents more than it hurts you, and using other effects to mitigate some of the damage like lifegain or cards like Urza's Armor...This is another style of deck that usually won't win you many friends."
Running out Kaalia ASAP usually leads to her getting killed or tucked, and you're promptly out of luck in that situation. Wait until the endgame to play her, so that you have had punishment going for a while and everyone else is softened up. You'll also have the mana and the means to easily keep her in the game at this point. That's why things like Ghostly Prison and Norn's Annex are in here, even though Kaalia herself isn't a defensive commander.
It makes much more sense to wear down everyone at the table, following through with balancing the board by wrathing, destroying lands, etc. Then you drop Kaalia for surgical strikes of death and watch others cry. Now, everyone else won't like being punished for everything they do, and they definitely don't want you dropping fatty bombs for free while you kill them. But late game, you should be able to save Kaalia from destruction with either reanimation, bounce, indestructibility, etc and your opponents should be running out of resources.
Early game, you want to drop mana rocks and punishing cards like Seizan, Perverter of Truth and Skullcage. Feel free to play an A, D, or D if you need a blocker, but only play them as you need them. That also applies to the removal and wraths, try to bargain with them. "If you want to still have your army/commander, attack someone else" and so on.
Liliana Vess - The deck is a little light on hand hate, and if nothing else, we can target ourselves with the +1 to reanimate something. Another source of tutoring is always welcome, and the necromantic ultimate is awesome :D. Plus, I had a GvL foil that wasn't being used so WTH right?
Linvala, Keeper of Silence - Creature hate. Since a ton of EDH decks rely on creatures with abilities, shutting them off is brutal. Their creatures will still trample, fly, etc, but I do believe that's it.
Baneslayer Angel - Cheap enough to play normally, gives us a solid blocker, plus some lifegain to offset punishment.
Basandra, Battle Seraph - I'm a little torn between keeping or tossing her, honestly. Combat tricks are fun, but the art is damn amazing. Debatable.
Admonition Angel - Oblivion Rings on landfall? Sweetness. If Arid Mesas and Marsh Flats, etc are available, even better. Because then you have instant speed O-Rings :D. And the fun continues when you start exiling your own stuff when you're holding a wrath in hand :evillol:.
Aegis Angel, Deathless Angel - Permanent/creature protection, mainly for Kaalia. Both also let you play politics, if you so desire.
Angelic Arbiter - No ridiculousness for you, opponents. Stops Insurrection (I think), mass token + haste annihilation, etc.
Angel of Despair - Huzzah for Vindicate on wings. Pop their only creature with reach, or a planeswalker. Pop an annoying artifact/enchantment, or to be really mean, pop a land.
Akroma, Angel of Fury and Akroma, Angel of Wrath - "O hai guyz!" *FACE SMASH* ...ahem. The only color you're not protected from is G, which is a touch worrying considering they have a lot of reach and flying killer spells. But on the other hand, we're talking about the Akromas here, powerful angels that cause opponents to tremble and curse.
Oros, the Avenger - All my creatures are either white or big enough to survive it, so no worries there. Kills a lot of small generals, and utility dorks.
Yosei, the Morning Star - Kind of a rattlesnake, or just one of the dudes who doesn't mind dying (aka swing constantly with him). Brutal with a sac+recur engine.
Bogardan Hellkite - I've heard votes against him, but he deserves a chance. Off Kaalia, that's a potential 12 damage from two creatures. Or utility dude removal plus 7 to the face. And so on.
Earthquake - All our creatures fly, so no worries there, and also serves as punishment/finisher/wrath effect.
Path to Exile - I don't have to explain this one, do I? Classic white removal. Plays nice with Armageddon.
Soul Snare - A pseudo Path with the only "drawback" being that it takes 2 mana instead of one.
Comet Storm - A faster, more versatile Earthquake, but takes more mana.
Demonic Tutor - Ah, "broken" tutoring at its finest :D. A signet pays for it easily enough, grabs anything you need out of your deck. You usually want to use it reactively, to find an answer.
Exsanguinate - Another finisher, punisher, etc and has the benefit of buffing me against my own punishment effects.
Aura of Silence - Artf/Enchant hate with a tax for my opponent's is tech.
Ghostly Prison - With War's Toll, Basandra, Soul Snare, Annex, etc I'm not an attractive target.
Mortify - More removal! Hits problematic enchantments as well.
Oblivion Ring - A now-classic white utility spell. Removes problematic stuff, or can set up some combos.
Sudden Spoiling - A pseudo Wrath, good for "countering" hard to answer creatures like Emrakul, shroud/hexproof, indestructible guys etc.
Armageddon - Admittedly, White and Red are possibly the two worst colors in this format for several effects, but White makes everyone play fair (or more accurately, by White's rules :D). This is one way we can win, since we have a few mana rocks and Kaalia plays our beaters for free.
Damnation - Colorshifted Wrath of God. The Time Spiral block is a gold mine for this format, seriously.
Day of Judgment - A de-powered ***, but that's fine since it gives us another creature wipe if things get out of hand.
Manabarbs - Punisher. We can get around the pain slightly with the three appropriate signets, Sol Ring, and Gilded Lotus.
Stranglehold - As Blackjack puts it, this isn't really punishment but more like oppression. Stops those enemy black and blue players from shenanigans, stops green from ramping, white from select tutoring, and red, from pretty much diddly squat but hey, what're you gonna do? Oh yeah, choke on your cleverness and die.
Syphon Mind - Classic black MP card. Hate on everyone's hand a bit and refill your own.
War's Toll - Your opponent's creatures are basically berserker-raged, and they basically have one phase/step on their turn to use mana from their lands. Basandra wrecks utility dude decks with this. Aren't those tears delicious?
Wrath of God - I say Wrath effect, you say ***! Classic.
In the Web of War - The selected creatures aren't all massive hitters, but they aren't all Kaalia size either. This gives them a little extra punch, but the main reason for this is as a me-only haste giver.
Painful Quandary - Ah, so much grief and punishment :D. Do you want to lose your options or do you want to meet Kaalia's Legion?
Martyr's Bond - I lose stuff, you lose stuff. And with several other cards like Balancing Act, Purification, etc this turns into I lose stuff, you lose double that stuff :evillol:.
Balancing Act, Razia's Purification - Because Balance is banned. Which makes me a sad panda, because I want to revel in the broken-ness :evillol:. Anyway, we're making them play our game and punishing them for going out of line.
Debtors' Knell - Reanimation redundancy, with the bonus of stealing the opponent's corpses.
Basics - They're almost all full art ZEN basics, which makes me happy. Let's see...Plains are split between 231 and 233 for now, Swamps are 240 and the Mountains are 244.
Rakdos the Defiler - Yes, his Kaalia attack is brutal, but without her, I don't want to sac half my things to kill someone, and even with her, he would just sit there as a blocker afterwards. No go for me.
Blood Speaker - A tutor for the two demons I'm running? Meh. Plus, I want to be playing punishment early and mid-game, and I'll draw/tutor into what I need anyway.
Polluted Bonds - The punishment for lands that I play is more along the lines of "I don't get ramp, so I'll bring you back down to my level." This is more for hating on G or G/X generals, those greedy ramping jerks.
Bloodchief Ascension - Once it's charged, bleeding opponents for every card of theirs that dies is amazing. Especially nice with Spellshock.
Fault Line - Instant speed Earthquake, for one more R. If you like playing things at EOT.
Mudslide - Another enchantment that's somewhat similar in role to War's Toll, but only for their creatures. Almost like a mix between Ghostly Prison/Norn's Annex and War's Toll.
Sort of. It doesn't seem to do as much as say Aegis Angel or Darksteel Plate. But it's only like a dime or so to pick up a copy, so if I remember I'll pick one up to try.
Do you know how you would put all that on the stack? Kaalia's trigger, Recon, etc?
Do you know how you would put all that on the stack? Kaalia's trigger, Recon, etc?
Just respond to Kaalia's trigger with the Recon ability.
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Winner of the SCG Invitational, Somerset, NJ, Jul 26-28, 2013
Top 8 of SCG Invitational, Las Vegas, NV, Dec 13-15, 2013
Top 8 of SCG Invitational, Somerset, NJ, Aug 28-30, 2015
Winner of SCG Worcester Team Sealed Open with Gerard Fabiano and Curtis Sheu, September 28, 2013
I'm debating whether or not the join forces dragon is worth it. Will people really be helping me take someone out? Would his spot be better as a different fatty?
L=> EDIT: I'm thinking Dragon Mage. Wrath the board, 'geddon the land, play Kaalia and destroy all hands XDXD:D.
Or would the Dragon Mage be a bad idea (at that point in the game), since my opponent's would draw into answers and lands faster? Although they would be on a slow comeback because of the board wipe :D.
List is finally @ 100 with Kaalia, had some troubles narrowing it down and solidifying the theme, but I think it's there and ready to test as is, once I get the cards.
Nicely done.... I laughed when I saw what you wrote about Basandra, I feel the exact same way. I want to keep her in the deck just for the freaking amazing art.
How is War's Toll working out? I had been thinking of giving it a test run.
I've had some pretty good luck so far with Heartless Hidetsugu and a little less with Kaervek the Merciless. I wish I could play the deck more often, I'm getting too many decks and they aren't getting the testing/attention they each need.
I actually don't have the deck that's posted, built in real life, but I'm working on it. I'll have to get back to you on War's Toll.
For flavor, the only creatures I'm running are ones that Kaalia can play, but that's just me. I kinda know what you mean with too many decks though. I start buying the cards for a deck, but then some other deck idea pops up and then I move onto that one, etc...haha.
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So in place of Mana-Charged Dragon, since I'm doubting anyone will actually pay for it, I've been thinking one of the following:
Alright, so some more of the planned cards came in today (I technically don't have the exact list build in real life). I'll be testing Spellshock, Warstorm Surge, and Quicksilver Amulet until I can pick up some more cards I'm missing in real life.
SpSk will almost certainly make the cut, Amulet has a decent chance, but I'm thinking Surge might not do enough for this deck. Any suggestions on creature swaps?
I was reading over your primer, and had a different direction that I took the deck.
Much like you, I'm using a lot of the same creatures. (Thanks for the idea for Aegis Angel, I hadn't really experimented with M12 yet outside of Swiftfoot Boots and Manalith!) But my approach is to run Kaalia out as fast as possible and put the beats down hard on whoever looks like they are the most threat!
I crammed in a bunch of Tutors, haste givers, and protection so that I don't have to worry about Kaalia going away, and it works out pretty good. Some of the cards I use are Emerge Unscathed, Brave the Elements, Bathe in Light, Emblem of the Warmind, Boros Guildmage, Anger, Beseech The Queen, Swiftfoot Boots, and Lightning Greaves. I've almost always got a way to keep her around long enough to really make a commanding (pun intended) presence. I can type up my entire list if you would like to compare and see the direction I went with it. Just let me know.
But my approach is to run Kaalia out as fast as possible and put the beats down hard on whoever looks like they are the most threat!
I crammed in a bunch of Tutors, haste givers, and protection so that I don't have to worry about Kaalia going away, and it works out pretty good. Some of the cards I use are Emerge Unscathed, Brave the Elements, Bathe in Light, Emblem of the Warmind, Boros Guildmage, Anger, Beseech The Queen, Swiftfoot Boots, and Lightning Greaves. I've almost always got a way to keep her around long enough to really make a commanding (pun intended) presence. I can type up my entire list if you would like to compare and see the direction I went with it. Just let me know.
I'm sure that'll work in certain playgroups, playing Kaalia asap. But for me, She would probably be invalidated quickly or just flat out killed. And in my opinion, you might be able to weaken a player or maybe two before you run out of steam.
Assuming a playgroup with a few sweepers, you'll probably be left creatureless a few times, and unless you're also running some heavy reanimation, I don't think that method will take you the distance. Go ahead and post your list, people can always help.
Alright, here is the version I've put together. One thing to keep in mind, in my community, there is a lot of 1v1 matchups, and not a lot of multiplayer. Generally a 3 for all is about as big as it gets.
How have the following been working out for you?
Archangel of Strife - Can't decide if I like her as a card or not.
Beseech the Queen - Rough at triple black, or really costly.
Victory's Herald - seems like win more to me.
Razia, Boros Archangel - Just not a great angel IMO.
Since you say you play a lot of 1v1 and occasionally 3 player, post your list in the 1v1 section for decklists. You'll get much more help over there.
How have the following been working out for you?
Archangel of Strife - Can't decide if I like her as a card or not.
Beseech the Queen - Rough at triple black, or really costly.
Victory's Herald - seems like win more to me.
Razia, Boros Archangel - Just not a great angel IMO.
Archangel of Strife has been amazing, probably my most favorite thing to slap down off of Kaalia. Tap, Attack, windmill slam, WAR! Take 14! (or more)!
Beseech the Queen is great to get that card you want to throw down with Kaalia, or to get that back up card I need to make her hasty or protected to set up bringing her out. Most Beseech'd card in my deck? Baneslayer so far! lol
Victory's Herald - Can bring you back at a key moment when it looks like all hope is lost. I don't know where sudden lifelink would be a bad thing!
Razia is in there as a personal favorite of mine. After initial attack, her redirect ability can be used to save Kaalia or something equally important.
Archangel of Strife has been amazing, probably my most favorite thing to slap down off of Kaalia. Tap, Attack, windmill slam, WAR! Take 14! (or more)!
Beseech the Queen is great to get that card you want to throw down with Kaalia, or to get that back up card I need to make her hasty or protected to set up bringing her out. Most Beseech'd card in my deck? Baneslayer so far! lol
Victory's Herald - Can bring you back at a key moment when it looks like all hope is lost. I don't know where sudden lifelink would be a bad thing!
Razia is in there as a personal favorite of mine. After initial attack, her redirect ability can be used to save Kaalia or something equally important.
So Archangel's "each opponent" part hasn't bitten you in the rear?
In such a multicolor build, I would run Diabolic over Beseech. Triple Black or any color in a three color deck is rough, that's where my concern is. Plus there are stronger tutors out there.
When you already have Baneslayer, I just question the herald's inclusion, haha.
Fair enough. I just don't see many opponent's lobbing Lightning Bolts around in this format
Totally agree with Sanity's Eclipse on the tutor.... get yourself a Demonic Tutor for beseech, it's tons better. Cheap, no limit on target cmc, and no reveal.
The Herald also seems a bit pointless to me. I think I'd much rather see a Karmic Guide.
I just found out about Karmic Guide by looking at blackjack's list. I want one! Also I completely agree about Demonic tutor and if I had one I'd use it instead. Alas, I haven't ordered it yet, but when I do, it will replace beseech.
Baneslayer was only recently added, so I may end up replacing the Herald when/if I get my hands on Karmic guide.
On the question of whether Strife's ability has bitten me yet? Only once against my wife's insane Ghave token deck. I added up damage wrong and didn't kill her. Next turn it was Overrun FTW. Just have to be smart and be choosy when the right time is to play her, but when it's right, it's SOOO right!!
Got to test a somewhat incomplete version of the deck tonight/this morning.
Quicksilver Amulet - Quite relevant, don't know why it doesn't have a planned spot in the ideal list. Gonna need to change that. Dropping Reya for 4 is awesome, Bogardan Hellkite with Surge (below) gives you 10 damage for 4, which is, once again, awesome.
Warstorm Surge - I was on the fence with this one, I'll admit. You can take your time in playing it, but once you do, it's amazing. It basically doubles the damage your creatures can do, and certainly makes 40 life reachable, especially when you're hacking away with only a few choice creatures.
Spellshock, another card I'm testing, didn't come up tonight sadly.
I'm very new to the Commander game so take anything I say w/ a grain of salt. I bought Devour for Power for a friend's birthday last weekend and a couple of other friends and me just made up some Commander decks on the spot from Standard cards and had an awesome time. Since then I've been reading the Salvation Commander Multiplayer forums for inspiration on my first Commander deck and fell in love with Blackjack's Kaalia Punisher-style build. Even though you might not surive from being the bad guy, it seems like one of the best decks for interaction w/ the opponent and wins out of nowhere - alot of fun. I bought the Heavenly Inferno pre-con a couple days ago and figuring out ways to make it Punisher-style like you guys.
Since Sanity's deck is a spin-off and considered the Kaalia Primer, I figured I would post my newbie ideas here.
- What about any sort of Threaten-style effects? I noticed Blackjack has more sac outlets so perhaps more for his build but it acts as possible damage and removal and if you have anything like Vicious Shadows or Grave Pact out then it's like "double-your-pleasure" sort of thing.
- Polluted Bonds; I was just going through my "junk" rares trying to find something useful and came upon this. Punishes opponents for playing lands and further using the "soften for the final blow approach".
- Suffer the Past; this might be more for me as my friends and I were playing against The Mimeoplasm the whole time and graveyard hate seems to be premium in Commander decks. This serves as graveyard hate and lifegain all in one. Also nice at instant speed so you let your opponent choose what he/she wants in the GY and lay it down.
- Din of the Fireherd; again, just looking through my junk rares and saw this. Land destruction also seems like a premium strategy in Commander so even though Kaalia decks don't run a ton of red AND black creatures in their mana cost, but a single Kaalia and the token this creates means one opponent is sacing two creatures and 2 lands and you get a decent size creature as a result. It is a bit expensive though.
Just some ideas I had while looking through some stuff is all.
Threaten effects - I'm not sure on this one. The cheap casting, single target ones (and spells in general) aren't always the best choice for this format. Of course the problem then is that Insurrection is 8 mana, and triple red I'm pretty sure.
Polluted Bonds - A definite Punisher card to consider. I didn't mention it because my copy is in my Drana deck. I'll update the primer post with a list of possible Punisher cards to run.
Suffer the Past - Like you said, definitely seems like a meta call. If you were to run a similar version to my deck, I would probably drop Earthquake for it.
Din of the Fireherd - I don't really like it in Kaalia. For my ideal plan, almost all the wraths are cheap on mana as can be. The equalizing spells (Balanc. Act, Purification) are a bit more expensive, but once again you want them to be cheaper rather than costlier.
Those are my thoughts on those cards. When you've got a good start to your list, post it here or in multiplayer for some more feedback.
Rakdos the Defiler - 1 attack is all you need from this bromancer and its prolly game anyways. And with rule 508.4b you dont even sac permanents from the initial summon into play from kaalia... so yeah..
I dont see how someone can slap primer on a tag then go and post a budget EDH list.. that has got to be some sort of spam or crime of something. Go look @ the Riku thread... its more revealing to Kaaila then this one.
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4th Texas State Champs - Red Deck Loses
5th TCG Qualifier - Soul Sisters
2nd GPT Qualifier - Sealed
3rd Star City Games Super IQ - UB Control
4th Star City Games Super IQ - Solar Flare
1st Star City Games IQ - Esper Heartless
3rd GPT Qualifier - Modern - Bant
2nd Star City Games IQ - Reanimator
2nd GPT Qualifier - Legacy - Goblins
Currently Playing: STANDARD UWBCONTROLUWB EDH UGEDRIC, SPYMASTER OF TRESTUG MODERN WBGRASSAULT LOAMWBGR
I'm still in the process of figuring out which cards I want to run and have some questions for either Sanity or Blackjack since both play Punisher-style Kaalia decks:
- White spot removal: Condemn, Swords to Plowshares or Path to Exhile? I don't know what the rule of thumb is for this in Commander but my thought was in this Punisher style deck, we want to be more ahead on life than the opponent and any point in time so giving them life via Swords or Condemn would be sub-optimal to Path where you're giving them a land. What's the opinion on this? I was considering running Condemn just for tucking an opponent's Commander, but didn't want to give him life, either.
- Mana-rocks: Mana Vault & Gilded Lotus? I have some extra Mana Vaults and thought about this, it's great since you can essentially get out a fattie Angel/Demon/Dragon early in the game w/o using Kaalia and put some pressure on the opponent and even force away their spot removal so it's safe to play a Kaalia late but again, it's somewhat punishes you since you won't always have the mana on upkeep. I thought Gilded Lotus was great since I am leaning towards creatures w/ triple-colored mana costs (Twilight Shepard, Akroma's, etc) but is 5 mana too much of an investment just for possibly hardcasting triple-mana colored fatties in case Kaalia is tucked?
Mana Vault is better in decks that will run a cheaper way of untapping it. Otherwise it is there for nothing more then an explosive t1 or t2 play but will just be a permanent in play @ that point as you will likely never find the time for the untap without a voltais key etc..
Gilded Lotus is a great card due to the fact that it helps you play some of the fatties in the event they keep kaaila from attacking. Also think about multiplayer games where there is 900 wraths a game + another 200 single target removal spells. Your general will start to cost a pretty penny by the end of the game and having an artifact tap for 3 is always good!
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4th Texas State Champs - Red Deck Loses
5th TCG Qualifier - Soul Sisters
2nd GPT Qualifier - Sealed
3rd Star City Games Super IQ - UB Control
4th Star City Games Super IQ - Solar Flare
1st Star City Games IQ - Esper Heartless
3rd GPT Qualifier - Modern - Bant
2nd Star City Games IQ - Reanimator
2nd GPT Qualifier - Legacy - Goblins
Currently Playing: STANDARD UWBCONTROLUWB EDH UGEDRIC, SPYMASTER OF TRESTUG MODERN WBGRASSAULT LOAMWBGR
All very good yes, I'm a fan of instant spot removal and I usually use them, but in this kind of build I'm not so sure. The only instant spot I'm running in my punisher build is swords, mortify, and terminate, and honestly I'm thinking of taking out one or two of those for more sweepers. I'd love to be able to keep/use all three, but I think the function of the deck and how it usually plays out requires the card slots to be filled with other things.
"Kaalia of the Vast sits within her mountain chapel pondering both the heavenly host and the infernal horde, tormented by her past, scarred by devastation. Her once-simple life as a cleric was reduced to ashes when shadowy beings massacred her congregation. Somehow she survived, but her soul was fractured, and a growing hatred soon grew in the cracks. Now, driven by a righteous fury and an unholy thirst for revenge, Kaalia broods feverishly, amassing her vast power, waiting to unleash her apocalyptic might upon any who stand in her way." - Heavenly Inferno Precon Sheet
Mana Cost - 1WBR. Kaalia is cheap enough to cast quickly or repeatedly, even though this deck doesn't necessarily want to do that. If she was only three mana then she would be a lot more ridiculous (and recurable by Sun Titan :evillol:). It's not good to have to send her back to the Command Zone, because then she costs as much as the creatures she's trying to cheat in.
Creature Type - Human Cleric. No real synergies with Human, but there is some
Ability - "Whenever ~ attacks an opponent, you may put an Angel, Demon or Dragon creature from your hand onto the battlefield tapped and attacking that opponent." This is why we're playing her. This ability plays nice with mana rocks and land destruction, since we don't always cast the A, D, and D's. Couple of side notes, some dragons have abilities to do with attacking. Flameblast Dragon's ability won't trigger off Kaalia, but Ancient Hellkite's ability can be activated. And furthermore, some demons have "when ~ ETB, if you cast this from your hand" triggers, which don't trigger off Kaalia.
Body - 2/2 flyer. Kaalia's a small fry. Easily killed in combat or even by Pyroclasm (effects), keeping her on the table can be difficult. But this is why we play Darksteel Plate, Aegis Angel, Deathless Angel, etc.
Play Her if you:
- love angels, demons, and dragons.
- like using the commander for shenanigans.
- like being the person to beat in a given game.
- like being challenged to build with two bad colors and a great color.
- like watching your opponents squirm and curse, aka Schadenfreude.
Don't Play Her if you:
- want to combo out hardcore.
- have a super competitive playgroup. (Kaalia could possibly survive, don't get me wrong. But you're probably better off playing a different general)
- are iffy about land destruction (or your playgroup is).
- don't like counting on your commander much.
So I'm a 20-something year old college kid in Colorado, USA. So yes, I don't have any original duals or FoW or any of that. So my lists are slightly budget, cause, ya know, I'm in college. I only started playing EDH this summer (2011), but it's a blast. I've been playing Magic in general since about Tenth Edition, with a bit of a break from shortly after ZEN until about Besieged. My MtG psychological profile thing is predominantly Johnny and Vorthos, but I do have a bit of Timmy and Spike as well. I love flavorful decks, card choices, etc, and I want to show off my ideas. But I do like just playing huge dragons or fifteen million elves and smashing face. Almost by virtue of posting on a forum, I do have a bit of a competitive edge, but I try not to let that really shine through all the time. My two playgroups aren't the best or most competitive, and only one other guy seems to post on forums and stuff, so my decks tend to be the most consistent.
It makes much more sense to wear down everyone at the table, following through with balancing the board by wrathing, destroying lands, etc. Then you drop Kaalia for surgical strikes of death and watch others cry. Now, everyone else won't like being punished for everything they do, and they definitely don't want you dropping fatty bombs for free while you kill them. But late game, you should be able to save Kaalia from destruction with either reanimation, bounce, indestructibility, etc and your opponents should be running out of resources.
Early game, you want to drop mana rocks and punishing cards like Seizan, Perverter of Truth and Skullcage. Feel free to play an A, D, or D if you need a blocker, but only play them as you need them. That also applies to the removal and wraths, try to bargain with them. "If you want to still have your army/commander, attack someone else" and so on.
1 Kaalia of the Vast
Advisor (1)
1 Liliana Vess [GvL]
Angels (12)
1 Linvala, Keeper of Silence
1 Baneslayer Angel
1 Basandra, Battle Seraph
1 Admonition Angel
1 Aegis Angel
1 Deathless Angel
1 Twilight Shepherd
1 Angelic Arbiter Foil
1 Angel of Despair
1 Akroma, Angel of Fury
1 Akroma, Angel of Wrath [DvD]
1 Reya Dawnbringer
Demons (2)
1 Seizan, Perverter of Truth
1 Rune-Scarred Demon
Dragons (5)
1 Mana-Charged Dragon
1 Oros, the Avenger
1 Steel Hellkite [promo]
1 Yosei, the Morning Star
1 Bogardan Hellkite Foil
Revenge (4)
1 Path To Exile
1 Comet Storm
1 Mortify
1 Sudden Spoiling
Wrath of the Vast (12)
1 Earthquake
1 Demonic Tutor [DvD]
1 Exsanguinate
1 Armageddon
1 Balancing Act
1 Damnation
1 Day of Judgment
1 Syphon Mind
1 Wrath of God
1 Hallowed Burial
1 Identity Crisis
1 Razia's Purification
1 Soul Snare
1 Aura of Silence Foil
1 Manabarbs
1 Spiteful Visions
1 Stranglehold
1 War's Toll
1 In the Web of War
1 Painful Quandary
1 Martyr's Bond
1 Debtors' Knell
Relics of the Vast (13)
1 Sol Ring
1 Lightning Greaves
1 Boros Signet
1 Orzhov Signet
1 Rakdos Signet
1 Angel's Trumpet
1 Champion's Helm
1 Darksteel Ingot
1 Darksteel Plate
1 Iron Maiden
1 Skullcage
1 Gilded Lotus
1 Norn's Annex
The Vast (40)
1 Command Tower
1 Plateau
1 Scrubland
1 Evolving Wilds
1 Terramorphic Expanse
1 Fetid Heath
1 Rugged Prairie
1 Godless Shrine
1 Sacred Foundry
1 Mistveil Plains
1 Emeria, the Sky Ruin
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Secluded Steppe
1 Barren Moor
1 Forgotten Cave
10 Plains
7 Swamp
7 Mountain
Liliana Vess - The deck is a little light on hand hate, and if nothing else, we can target ourselves with the +1 to reanimate something. Another source of tutoring is always welcome, and the necromantic ultimate is awesome :D. Plus, I had a GvL foil that wasn't being used so WTH right?
Linvala, Keeper of Silence - Creature hate. Since a ton of EDH decks rely on creatures with abilities, shutting them off is brutal. Their creatures will still trample, fly, etc, but I do believe that's it.
Baneslayer Angel - Cheap enough to play normally, gives us a solid blocker, plus some lifegain to offset punishment.
Basandra, Battle Seraph - I'm a little torn between keeping or tossing her, honestly. Combat tricks are fun, but the art is damn amazing. Debatable.
Admonition Angel - Oblivion Rings on landfall? Sweetness. If Arid Mesas and Marsh Flats, etc are available, even better. Because then you have instant speed O-Rings :D. And the fun continues when you start exiling your own stuff when you're holding a wrath in hand :evillol:.
Aegis Angel, Deathless Angel - Permanent/creature protection, mainly for Kaalia. Both also let you play politics, if you so desire.
Twilight Shepherd - Wrath/Board Wipe/etc recovery.
Angelic Arbiter - No ridiculousness for you, opponents. Stops Insurrection (I think), mass token + haste annihilation, etc.
Angel of Despair - Huzzah for Vindicate on wings. Pop their only creature with reach, or a planeswalker. Pop an annoying artifact/enchantment, or to be really mean, pop a land.
Akroma, Angel of Fury and Akroma, Angel of Wrath - "O hai guyz!" *FACE SMASH*
Reya Dawnbringer - Who doesn't like reanimation on your upkeep?
Mana-Charged Dragon - Lets any player help you ninja kill someone.
Oros, the Avenger - All my creatures are either white or big enough to survive it, so no worries there. Kills a lot of small generals, and utility dorks.
Steel Hellkite - A one-player pseudo-Ratchet Bomb on wings that's cheated into play is glorious.
Yosei, the Morning Star - Kind of a rattlesnake, or just one of the dudes who doesn't mind dying (aka swing constantly with him). Brutal with a sac+recur engine.
Bogardan Hellkite - I've heard votes against him, but he deserves a chance. Off Kaalia, that's a potential 12 damage from two creatures. Or utility dude removal plus 7 to the face. And so on.
Seizan, Perverter of Truth - He serves as both draw for us, and grief for our opponents.
Rune-Scarred Demon - Demonic Tutor on wings, hoo yeah.
Earthquake - All our creatures fly, so no worries there, and also serves as punishment/finisher/wrath effect.
Path to Exile - I don't have to explain this one, do I? Classic white removal. Plays nice with Armageddon.
Soul Snare - A pseudo Path with the only "drawback" being that it takes 2 mana instead of one.
Comet Storm - A faster, more versatile Earthquake, but takes more mana.
Demonic Tutor - Ah, "broken" tutoring at its finest :D. A signet pays for it easily enough, grabs anything you need out of your deck. You usually want to use it reactively, to find an answer.
Exsanguinate - Another finisher, punisher, etc and has the benefit of buffing me against my own punishment effects.
Aura of Silence - Artf/Enchant hate with a tax for my opponent's is tech.
Ghostly Prison - With War's Toll, Basandra, Soul Snare, Annex, etc I'm not an attractive target.
Mortify - More removal! Hits problematic enchantments as well.
Oblivion Ring - A now-classic white utility spell. Removes problematic stuff, or can set up some combos.
Sudden Spoiling - A pseudo Wrath, good for "countering" hard to answer creatures like Emrakul, shroud/hexproof, indestructible guys etc.
Armageddon - Admittedly, White and Red are possibly the two worst colors in this format for several effects, but White makes everyone play fair (or more accurately, by White's rules :D). This is one way we can win, since we have a few mana rocks and Kaalia plays our beaters for free.
Damnation - Colorshifted Wrath of God. The Time Spiral block is a gold mine for this format, seriously.
Day of Judgment - A de-powered ***, but that's fine since it gives us another creature wipe if things get out of hand.
Manabarbs - Punisher. We can get around the pain slightly with the three appropriate signets, Sol Ring, and Gilded Lotus.
Spiteful Visions - More drawing for us and grief for them.
Stranglehold - As Blackjack puts it, this isn't really punishment but more like oppression. Stops those enemy black and blue players from shenanigans, stops green from ramping, white from select tutoring, and red, from pretty much diddly squat but hey, what're you gonna do? Oh yeah, choke on your cleverness and die.
Syphon Mind - Classic black MP card. Hate on everyone's hand a bit and refill your own.
War's Toll - Your opponent's creatures are basically berserker-raged, and they basically have one phase/step on their turn to use mana from their lands. Basandra wrecks utility dude decks with this. Aren't those tears delicious?
Wrath of God - I say Wrath effect, you say ***! Classic.
In the Web of War - The selected creatures aren't all massive hitters, but they aren't all Kaalia size either. This gives them a little extra punch, but the main reason for this is as a me-only haste giver.
Painful Quandary - Ah, so much grief and punishment :D. Do you want to lose your options or do you want to meet Kaalia's Legion?
Martyr's Bond - I lose stuff, you lose stuff. And with several other cards like Balancing Act, Purification, etc this turns into I lose stuff, you lose double that stuff :evillol:.
Balancing Act, Razia's Purification - Because Balance is banned. Which makes me a sad panda, because I want to revel in the broken-ness :evillol:. Anyway, we're making them play our game and punishing them for going out of line.
Debtors' Knell - Reanimation redundancy, with the bonus of stealing the opponent's corpses.
Sol Ring - Ridiculous ramp for every color.
Lightning Greaves - General protection.
Boros/Orzhov/Rakdos Signets - Mana fixing and ramp.
Angel's Trumpet - Don't want to attack, opponents? Sucks for you.
Champion's Helm - General protection.
Darksteel Ingot - Mana fixing and ramp.
Darksteel Plate - General protection.
Iron Maiden, Skullcage - Damage for number of cards in hand. The combination of them means that opponents are always getting hit.
Gilded Lotus - There's a few cards with heavy color requirements, and besides that, this also gets us around Manabarbs, to an extent.
Norn's Annex - It's a bad idea to attack me. Go somewhere else with your tokens.
Command Tower, Evolving Wilds + Terramorphic Expanse - Common rarity mana fixing. Simple.
Fetid Heath, Rugged Prairie - The filterlands are great lands IMO, since you can easily control the colors.
Sacred Foundry, Godless Shrine - Ravnica shocklands are the poor man's Original Dual Lands.
Hall of the Bandit Lord - Another way to give Kaalia (or other creatures) haste so she can wreck someone's face ASAP.
Mistveil Plains - Spell, enchantment, artifact "recursion". Best with fetchlands, which I'll work on acquiring.
Emeria, the Sky Ruin - More reanimation possibilities, and I'm running the Ravnica shocklands to help enable it.
Bojuka Bog - Grave hate without really taking up a slot in the deck. Lovely little land, almost a staple land in decks with black.
Secluded Steppe, Barren Moor, Forgotten Cave - WBR Cycling Lands, to help with "draw".
Basics - They're almost all full art ZEN basics, which makes me happy. Let's see...Plains are split between 231 and 233 for now, Swamps are 240 and the Mountains are 244.
Rakdos the Defiler - Yes, his Kaalia attack is brutal, but without her, I don't want to sac half my things to kill someone, and even with her, he would just sit there as a blocker afterwards. No go for me.
Blood Speaker - A tutor for the two demons I'm running? Meh. Plus, I want to be playing punishment early and mid-game, and I'll draw/tutor into what I need anyway.
Polluted Bonds - The punishment for lands that I play is more along the lines of "I don't get ramp, so I'll bring you back down to my level." This is more for hating on G or G/X generals, those greedy ramping jerks.
Bloodchief Ascension - Once it's charged, bleeding opponents for every card of theirs that dies is amazing. Especially nice with Spellshock.
Fault Line - Instant speed Earthquake, for one more R. If you like playing things at EOT.
Mudslide - Another enchantment that's somewhat similar in role to War's Toll, but only for their creatures. Almost like a mix between Ghostly Prison/Norn's Annex and War's Toll.
--- Meren of Clan Nel Toth --- Jhoira of the Ghitu --- Prime Speaker Zegana ---
--- Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief --- Ghoulcaller Gisa --- Akroma, Angel of Fury --- Titania, Protector of Argoth ---
7/18 into 19/2011: deck list @ 100, solidified deck themes.
1 Dragon Mage
1 Destructive Force
1 Spellshock
1 Global Ruin
1 Warstorm Surge [+]
1 Eiganjo Castle
1 Shinka, the Bloodsoaked Keep
1 Shizo, Death's Storehouse
1 Worldgorger Dragon
1 Animate Dead
1 Necromancy
Gaka, Worldgorger Dragon Combo
Blackjack68, Punisher
King Shane, Competitive builds: 1v1 and MP
Ghost Love Score, by Nightwish
Wish I Had An Angel by Nightwish
Red Light in My Eyes part II (by Children of Sodom) by Nightwish
If you have any ideas or criticisms, anything at all, leave a post here and I'll get back to you.
Punisher Kaalia inspired by Blackjack68.
--- Meren of Clan Nel Toth --- Jhoira of the Ghitu --- Prime Speaker Zegana ---
--- Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief --- Ghoulcaller Gisa --- Akroma, Angel of Fury --- Titania, Protector of Argoth ---
Do you know how you would put all that on the stack? Kaalia's trigger, Recon, etc?
--- Meren of Clan Nel Toth --- Jhoira of the Ghitu --- Prime Speaker Zegana ---
--- Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief --- Ghoulcaller Gisa --- Akroma, Angel of Fury --- Titania, Protector of Argoth ---
Just respond to Kaalia's trigger with the Recon ability.
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L=> EDIT: I'm thinking Dragon Mage. Wrath the board, 'geddon the land, play Kaalia and destroy all hands XDXD:D.
--- Meren of Clan Nel Toth --- Jhoira of the Ghitu --- Prime Speaker Zegana ---
--- Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief --- Ghoulcaller Gisa --- Akroma, Angel of Fury --- Titania, Protector of Argoth ---
List is finally @ 100 with Kaalia, had some troubles narrowing it down and solidifying the theme, but I think it's there and ready to test as is, once I get the cards.
--- Meren of Clan Nel Toth --- Jhoira of the Ghitu --- Prime Speaker Zegana ---
--- Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief --- Ghoulcaller Gisa --- Akroma, Angel of Fury --- Titania, Protector of Argoth ---
How is War's Toll working out? I had been thinking of giving it a test run.
I've had some pretty good luck so far with Heartless Hidetsugu and a little less with Kaervek the Merciless. I wish I could play the deck more often, I'm getting too many decks and they aren't getting the testing/attention they each need.
Banner by Nakamura, Thanks!
EDH Math
EDH Decks:
BB Drana: Down with the Sickness
BWR Kaalia Punisher: Heaven's on Fire
I actually don't have the deck that's posted, built in real life, but I'm working on it. I'll have to get back to you on War's Toll.
For flavor, the only creatures I'm running are ones that Kaalia can play, but that's just me. I kinda know what you mean with too many decks though. I start buying the cards for a deck, but then some other deck idea pops up and then I move onto that one, etc...haha.
~~~~~~~~
So in place of Mana-Charged Dragon, since I'm doubting anyone will actually pay for it, I've been thinking one of the following:
1 Eternal Dragon [most likely inclusion, helps mana fix and beat]
1 Karmic Guide [more recursion is good]
1 Dragon Tyrant [Shaboomwhack I win]
1 Chancellor of the Annex [after 'Geddon, at the start, both seem helpful/cruel]
1 Demon of Death's Gate [BEEF]
1 Hellkite Igniter [Beef]
If anyone thinks another creature should go as well, let me know.
--- Meren of Clan Nel Toth --- Jhoira of the Ghitu --- Prime Speaker Zegana ---
--- Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief --- Ghoulcaller Gisa --- Akroma, Angel of Fury --- Titania, Protector of Argoth ---
SpSk will almost certainly make the cut, Amulet has a decent chance, but I'm thinking Surge might not do enough for this deck. Any suggestions on creature swaps?
--- Meren of Clan Nel Toth --- Jhoira of the Ghitu --- Prime Speaker Zegana ---
--- Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief --- Ghoulcaller Gisa --- Akroma, Angel of Fury --- Titania, Protector of Argoth ---
Much like you, I'm using a lot of the same creatures. (Thanks for the idea for Aegis Angel, I hadn't really experimented with M12 yet outside of Swiftfoot Boots and Manalith!) But my approach is to run Kaalia out as fast as possible and put the beats down hard on whoever looks like they are the most threat!
I crammed in a bunch of Tutors, haste givers, and protection so that I don't have to worry about Kaalia going away, and it works out pretty good. Some of the cards I use are Emerge Unscathed, Brave the Elements, Bathe in Light, Emblem of the Warmind, Boros Guildmage, Anger, Beseech The Queen, Swiftfoot Boots, and Lightning Greaves. I've almost always got a way to keep her around long enough to really make a commanding (pun intended) presence. I can type up my entire list if you would like to compare and see the direction I went with it. Just let me know.
Rune-Scarred Demon too. Beater + tutor is amazing. Quicksilver Amulet, Warstorm Surge are two other possibilities.
I'm sure that'll work in certain playgroups, playing Kaalia asap. But for me, She would probably be invalidated quickly or just flat out killed. And in my opinion, you might be able to weaken a player or maybe two before you run out of steam.
Assuming a playgroup with a few sweepers, you'll probably be left creatureless a few times, and unless you're also running some heavy reanimation, I don't think that method will take you the distance. Go ahead and post your list, people can always help.
--- Meren of Clan Nel Toth --- Jhoira of the Ghitu --- Prime Speaker Zegana ---
--- Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief --- Ghoulcaller Gisa --- Akroma, Angel of Fury --- Titania, Protector of Argoth ---
1 Liliana Vess
1 Archangel of Strife
1 Angel of Despair
1 Tariel, Reckoner of Souls
1 Akroma, Angel of Fury
1 Akroma, Angel of Wrath
1 Angelic Arbiter
1 Basandra, Battle Seraph
1 Victory's Herald
1 Iona, Shield of Emeria
1 Chancellor of the Annex
1 Baneslayer Angel
1 Razia, Boros Archangel
1 Reya Dawnbringer
1 Bladewing the Risen
1 Oros, the Avenger
1 Bogardan Hellkite
1 Ryusei, the Falling Star
1 Rune-Scarred Demon
1 Anger
1 Duergar Hedge-Mage
1 Mother of Runes
1 Boros Guildmage
1 Swiftfoot Boots
1 Lightning Greaves
1 Sol Ring
1 Rackdos Signet
1 Orzhov Signet
1 Boros Signet
1 Nihil Spellbomb
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Emblem of the Warmind
1 Oblivion Ring
1 Vow of Malice
1 Vow of Duty
1 Vow of Lightning
1 Sudden Death
1 Lightning Helix
1 Brave the Elements
1 Emerge Unscathed
1 Bathe in Light
1 Doom Blade
1 Swords to Plowshares
1 Path to Exile
1 Orim's Thunder
1 Master Warcraft
1 Cleansing Beam
1 Mortify
1 Sulfurous Blast
1 Congregate
1 Terminate
1 Return to Dust
1 Wrecking Ball
1 Red Sun's Zenith
1 Wrath of God
1 Beseech the Queen
1 Akroma's Vengeance (Great flavor, will probably be replaced with Day of Judgment eventually)
1 Syphon Mind
1 Earthquake
1 Diabolic Tutor
1 Syphon Flesh
6 Plains
6 Mountain
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Mutavault
1 Wasteland
1 Spawning Pool
1 Temple of the False God
1 Safe Haven
1 Windbrisk Heights
1 Gemstone Mine
1 Arid Mesa
1 Terramorphic Expanse
1 Tectonic Edge
1 Rackdos Carnarium
1 Command Tower
1 Vivid Meadow
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Rupture Spire
1 Boros Garrison
1 Orzhov Basilica
1 Akoum Refuge
1 Evolving Wilds
Archangel of Strife - Can't decide if I like her as a card or not.
Beseech the Queen - Rough at triple black, or really costly.
Victory's Herald - seems like win more to me.
Razia, Boros Archangel - Just not a great angel IMO.
Since you say you play a lot of 1v1 and occasionally 3 player, post your list in the 1v1 section for decklists. You'll get much more help over there.
--- Meren of Clan Nel Toth --- Jhoira of the Ghitu --- Prime Speaker Zegana ---
--- Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief --- Ghoulcaller Gisa --- Akroma, Angel of Fury --- Titania, Protector of Argoth ---
Archangel of Strife has been amazing, probably my most favorite thing to slap down off of Kaalia. Tap, Attack, windmill slam, WAR! Take 14! (or more)!
Beseech the Queen is great to get that card you want to throw down with Kaalia, or to get that back up card I need to make her hasty or protected to set up bringing her out. Most Beseech'd card in my deck? Baneslayer so far! lol
Victory's Herald - Can bring you back at a key moment when it looks like all hope is lost. I don't know where sudden lifelink would be a bad thing!
Razia is in there as a personal favorite of mine. After initial attack, her redirect ability can be used to save Kaalia or something equally important.
So Archangel's "each opponent" part hasn't bitten you in the rear?
In such a multicolor build, I would run Diabolic over Beseech. Triple Black or any color in a three color deck is rough, that's where my concern is. Plus there are stronger tutors out there.
When you already have Baneslayer, I just question the herald's inclusion, haha.
Fair enough. I just don't see many opponent's lobbing Lightning Bolts around in this format
--- Meren of Clan Nel Toth --- Jhoira of the Ghitu --- Prime Speaker Zegana ---
--- Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief --- Ghoulcaller Gisa --- Akroma, Angel of Fury --- Titania, Protector of Argoth ---
The Herald also seems a bit pointless to me. I think I'd much rather see a Karmic Guide.
Banner by Nakamura, Thanks!
EDH Math
EDH Decks:
BB Drana: Down with the Sickness
BWR Kaalia Punisher: Heaven's on Fire
Baneslayer was only recently added, so I may end up replacing the Herald when/if I get my hands on Karmic guide.
On the question of whether Strife's ability has bitten me yet? Only once against my wife's insane Ghave token deck. I added up damage wrong and didn't kill her. Next turn it was Overrun FTW. Just have to be smart and be choosy when the right time is to play her, but when it's right, it's SOOO right!!
Quicksilver Amulet - Quite relevant, don't know why it doesn't have a planned spot in the ideal list. Gonna need to change that. Dropping Reya for 4 is awesome, Bogardan Hellkite with Surge (below) gives you 10 damage for 4, which is, once again, awesome.
Warstorm Surge - I was on the fence with this one, I'll admit. You can take your time in playing it, but once you do, it's amazing. It basically doubles the damage your creatures can do, and certainly makes 40 life reachable, especially when you're hacking away with only a few choice creatures.
Spellshock, another card I'm testing, didn't come up tonight sadly.
--- Meren of Clan Nel Toth --- Jhoira of the Ghitu --- Prime Speaker Zegana ---
--- Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief --- Ghoulcaller Gisa --- Akroma, Angel of Fury --- Titania, Protector of Argoth ---
Since Sanity's deck is a spin-off and considered the Kaalia Primer, I figured I would post my newbie ideas here.
- What about any sort of Threaten-style effects? I noticed Blackjack has more sac outlets so perhaps more for his build but it acts as possible damage and removal and if you have anything like Vicious Shadows or Grave Pact out then it's like "double-your-pleasure" sort of thing.
- Polluted Bonds; I was just going through my "junk" rares trying to find something useful and came upon this. Punishes opponents for playing lands and further using the "soften for the final blow approach".
- Suffer the Past; this might be more for me as my friends and I were playing against The Mimeoplasm the whole time and graveyard hate seems to be premium in Commander decks. This serves as graveyard hate and lifegain all in one. Also nice at instant speed so you let your opponent choose what he/she wants in the GY and lay it down.
- Din of the Fireherd; again, just looking through my junk rares and saw this. Land destruction also seems like a premium strategy in Commander so even though Kaalia decks don't run a ton of red AND black creatures in their mana cost, but a single Kaalia and the token this creates means one opponent is sacing two creatures and 2 lands and you get a decent size creature as a result. It is a bit expensive though.
Just some ideas I had while looking through some stuff is all.
Threaten effects - I'm not sure on this one. The cheap casting, single target ones (and spells in general) aren't always the best choice for this format. Of course the problem then is that Insurrection is 8 mana, and triple red I'm pretty sure.
Polluted Bonds - A definite Punisher card to consider. I didn't mention it because my copy is in my Drana deck. I'll update the primer post with a list of possible Punisher cards to run.
Suffer the Past - Like you said, definitely seems like a meta call. If you were to run a similar version to my deck, I would probably drop Earthquake for it.
Din of the Fireherd - I don't really like it in Kaalia. For my ideal plan, almost all the wraths are cheap on mana as can be. The equalizing spells (Balanc. Act, Purification) are a bit more expensive, but once again you want them to be cheaper rather than costlier.
Those are my thoughts on those cards. When you've got a good start to your list, post it here or in multiplayer for some more feedback.
--- Meren of Clan Nel Toth --- Jhoira of the Ghitu --- Prime Speaker Zegana ---
--- Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief --- Ghoulcaller Gisa --- Akroma, Angel of Fury --- Titania, Protector of Argoth ---
I dont see how someone can slap primer on a tag then go and post a budget EDH list.. that has got to be some sort of spam or crime of something. Go look @ the Riku thread... its more revealing to Kaaila then this one.
5th TCG Qualifier - Soul Sisters
2nd GPT Qualifier - Sealed
3rd Star City Games Super IQ - UB Control
4th Star City Games Super IQ - Solar Flare
1st Star City Games IQ - Esper Heartless
3rd GPT Qualifier - Modern - Bant
2nd Star City Games IQ - Reanimator
2nd GPT Qualifier - Legacy - Goblins
Currently Playing:
STANDARD
UWBCONTROLUWB
EDH
UGEDRIC, SPYMASTER OF TRESTUG
MODERN
WBGRASSAULT LOAMWBGR
- White spot removal: Condemn, Swords to Plowshares or Path to Exhile? I don't know what the rule of thumb is for this in Commander but my thought was in this Punisher style deck, we want to be more ahead on life than the opponent and any point in time so giving them life via Swords or Condemn would be sub-optimal to Path where you're giving them a land. What's the opinion on this? I was considering running Condemn just for tucking an opponent's Commander, but didn't want to give him life, either.
- Mana-rocks: Mana Vault & Gilded Lotus? I have some extra Mana Vaults and thought about this, it's great since you can essentially get out a fattie Angel/Demon/Dragon early in the game w/o using Kaalia and put some pressure on the opponent and even force away their spot removal so it's safe to play a Kaalia late but again, it's somewhat punishes you since you won't always have the mana on upkeep. I thought Gilded Lotus was great since I am leaning towards creatures w/ triple-colored mana costs (Twilight Shepard, Akroma's, etc) but is 5 mana too much of an investment just for possibly hardcasting triple-mana colored fatties in case Kaalia is tucked?
Mana Vault is better in decks that will run a cheaper way of untapping it. Otherwise it is there for nothing more then an explosive t1 or t2 play but will just be a permanent in play @ that point as you will likely never find the time for the untap without a voltais key etc..
Gilded Lotus is a great card due to the fact that it helps you play some of the fatties in the event they keep kaaila from attacking. Also think about multiplayer games where there is 900 wraths a game + another 200 single target removal spells. Your general will start to cost a pretty penny by the end of the game and having an artifact tap for 3 is always good!
5th TCG Qualifier - Soul Sisters
2nd GPT Qualifier - Sealed
3rd Star City Games Super IQ - UB Control
4th Star City Games Super IQ - Solar Flare
1st Star City Games IQ - Esper Heartless
3rd GPT Qualifier - Modern - Bant
2nd Star City Games IQ - Reanimator
2nd GPT Qualifier - Legacy - Goblins
Currently Playing:
STANDARD
UWBCONTROLUWB
EDH
UGEDRIC, SPYMASTER OF TRESTUG
MODERN
WBGRASSAULT LOAMWBGR
All very good yes, I'm a fan of instant spot removal and I usually use them, but in this kind of build I'm not so sure. The only instant spot I'm running in my punisher build is swords, mortify, and terminate, and honestly I'm thinking of taking out one or two of those for more sweepers. I'd love to be able to keep/use all three, but I think the function of the deck and how it usually plays out requires the card slots to be filled with other things.
Banner by Nakamura, Thanks!
EDH Math
EDH Decks:
BB Drana: Down with the Sickness
BWR Kaalia Punisher: Heaven's on Fire