Ever since I saw the spoiler for Urabrask the Hidden, I decided I needed a deck with him in it. For some reason though, I wasn't really all that excited about putting him in a Standard deck, so I decided to make him a general for a new EDH deck However, there's one thing about this deck that I want to be different from my other ones...
I want this deck to be a cutthroat as possible Everyone else in my playgroup has a competitive EDH deck, and I'm kinda tired of not being able to join in our competitive games (you know, without getting slaughtered). So instead of being casual like my other EDH decks are, I want this one to be absolutely vicious
Unfortunately, I have no experience in making a competitive EDH deck, so that is why I ask for some assistance. Here's what I got so far:
You should cut one Mountain for a Valakut, the Molten Pinnacle. It comes online surprisingly more often than you would think. And to go hand in hand with that Valakut, Thawing Glaciers insures you make your land drop. To go along with the land talk, unless you're playing via the French list, i see no reason to not include Crucible of Worlds. You already play the strip effects, you could even add a fetchland or two to also insure you make your land drops.
One last thing before I go, Obsidian Fireheart likes the proliferate mechanic. He may not be able to put multiple blaze counters on the lands, but that doesn't stop Contagion Engine from making their own lands lethal.
edit: And of course, since you're mono-coloured and you already play extraplanar lens anyway, you might as well go with scrying sheets and snow-covered mountains. Much appreciated draw for red, clearing lands off the top so you can draw gas.
One last thing before I go, Obsidian Fireheart likes the proliferate mechanic. He may not be able to put multiple blaze counters on the lands, but that doesn't stop Contagion Engine from making their own lands lethal.
I hadn't thought of that That certainly does seem brutal, but would it really be worth it to cut a card for Contagion Engine? The only other card it synergizes with would be Hateflayer. It's a cool combo, and great card, but is it really worth a spot?
Um, this may be a dumb question, but why would playing Imperial Recruiter make me want a fourth mana doubler?
Granted, now that you mentioned it, I am going to put Gauntlet of Might in here, but I feel I'm missing something with your comment...
Just the financial implications. Most red deck builders eschew the sickeningly good gauntlet because it's narrow and expensive- between $50 and $75 bucks for a card that's only good in the (generally) weakest mono-color build. But if you're playing Imperial Recruiter, clearly price is no object at $200 for a utility tutor
Just the financial implications. Most red deck builders eschew the sickeningly good gauntlet because it's narrow and expensive- between $50 and $75 bucks for a card that's only good in the (generally) weakest mono-color build. But if you're playing Imperial Recruiter, clearly price is no object at $200 for a utility tutor
OhmyGodIthinkI'mgonnabesick...
*catches breath* ...Well...I am going for optimal performance, and price is not an issue...but $200 That's gonna hurt...
Hey man I'm this close (><) to just proxying him just to tutor up Goblin Welder, a real gem in red who just goes SILLY with Solemn Simulacrum and other players' artifacts.
Tower of Fortunes or Urza's Blueprints: With four Mana Doublers, these guys can work for you. HOWEVER if you're going to be blowing up lands all the time, maybe the tower is not such a good choice
Worn Powerstone, Thran Dynamo, Everflowing Chalice, Mind Stone, etc.: If you're going to be blowing up lands, I would be interested in a lot more artifact mana if I were you. Not to mention your average CMC looks pretty high here.
Wild Ricochet, Fork, Reverberate: Piggyback off other spells so you can cover for red's weaknesses. In some cases, outright steal them.
I think with all the control elements you have in this deck (wipes, dragons, etc) that you should just go all out with it and drop most of the aggro elements like Rakka Mar and Gratuitous Violence. If you really want to be competitive with this, I imagine you'll probably have to pick aggro or control, but not both. My gut says control, but I'm not the mono-red expert here so definitely ask around.
Not enough targets for Hoarding Dragon or Godo to be worth it, imo.
Rakka Mar seems.. really bad.
You sure about Hoarding Dragon and Godo, Bandit Warlord? They're R tutors, which is awesome and rare. Plus, having them is like getting another chance to get whatever artifact I want. It seems like I have enough targets for Hoarding Dragon at least...
If those two really aren't worth their slots, then what should I put in to replace them?
Rakka Mar > Smoke
Extraplanar Lens > Gauntlet of Might
You sure about Hoarding Dragon and Godo, Bandit Warlord though? They're R fetches, which is awesome and rare. Plus, having them is like getting another chance to get whatever artifact I want. It seems like I have enough targets for Hoarding Dragon at least...
If those two really aren't worth their slots, then what should I put in to replace them?
I didn't say to cut them? They are great tutors. Hoarding Dragon gets you a mana doubler and Godo is dirty with haste and a SoFI out of your library. Read my ninja edits
I didn't say to cut them? They are great tutors. Hoarding Dragon gets you a mana doubler and Godo is dirty with haste and a SoFI out of your library. Read my ninja edits
I know they're awesome, and I am reading your ninja edits Gaka was the one who said to cut them and I was questioning whether I should or not.
First, I would be running Wake of Destruction if you have either ramp players, mono-colored decks, or large amounts of any one or two colors in your meta. Even without those conditions being met, it's a very good hate card (against everything but mono-R).
Second, proliferating extra blaze counters onto lands doesn't make them do more damage as was suggested earlier. It's still just one damage per blazing land, even with 40 counters on each one.
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First, I would be running Wake of Destruction if you have either ramp players, mono-colored decks, or large amounts of any one or two colors in your meta. Even without those conditions being met, it's a very good hate card (against everything but mono-R).
Second, proliferating extra blaze counters onto lands doesn't make them do more damage as was suggested earlier. It's still just one damage per blazing land, even with 40 counters on each one.
O_o. You're right. Well now, that combo looks a lot less appealing for my red needs.
And Wake can be good against mono-red. Just catch the guy who is playign it without snow lands(since it targets the specific land name).
The first card that came to mind for me when I saw Urabrask was Static Orb. It seems to me that you could really do some damage with messing with peoples' untap steps. Tangle Wire is probably worth the slot as well.
all put a damper on your opponents. you can easily counter your own static orb/ orb of dreams with amulet of vigor. all of theese are great dragon tutor targets. also, with red your creatures are going to do the majority of the damage, so lifelink and deathtouch are a red decks best friend. oh, thats right. basilisk collar does both. seems like a good fit. also, collar and its friend, loxodon warhammer are fantastic on creatures like
as well as any red creature that does the old-fashoned firebreathing trick. all that chaos burn can ammount to a massive life total in the hundreds as well as wipe the field.
card draw is important for a red deck, as well as not missing land drops. journeyer's kitefills the bill here.
additionally creatures like thundermare are fantastic in a smoke filled environment. kher keep is one of the best red legendary lands ever. produces chump blockers, as well as fodder for things like shivan harvest. sac outlets are important in edh, and this is one of reds best. if you want to hate on land, ruination is one of the best spells to kill problem lands, all at once.
buyback is one of reds best friends.
there have been many games that i have won just because i run 37 mountains, and they were all worth 4 mana each.
so i have spouted off a lot of stuff here. i hope some of it helps. a lot of people i play with are really surprized at the compeditiveness of a mono red deck that doesnt armageddon. its possible, and a lot of fun to prove them wrong about red being the weakest color.
"10/1/2009: If a land ends up with more than one blaze counter on it (thanks to Doubling Season or Gilder Bairn, for example), the ability still only causes it to deal 1 damage to its controller each turn."
Yeah, i already commented on how that didn't work after all. Thanks anyway though.
I want this deck to be a cutthroat as possible
Unfortunately, I have no experience in making a competitive EDH deck, so that is why I ask for some assistance. Here's what I got so far:
1 Urabrask the Hidden
These hit things:
1 Akroma, Angel of Fury
1 Hateflayer
1 Kazuul, Tyrant of the Cliffs
These don't die:
1 Blightsteel Colossus
1 Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre
Card Draw:
1 Dragon Mage
1 Mind's Eye
1 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Urza's Blueprints
1 Wheel of Fortune
Land Hate:
1 Dwarven Blastminer
1 Dwarven Miner
1 Magus of the Moon
1 Blood Moon
1 Boom / Bust
1 Price of Glory
1 Ruination
Artifact Removal:
1 Goblin Welder
1 Hoard-Smelter Dragon
1 Viashino Heretic
Fetches:
1 Hoarding Dragon
1 Imperial Recruiter
1 Journeyer's Kite
1 Expedition Map
1 Planar Portal
1 Caged Sun
1 Darksteel Ingot
1 Everflowing Chalice
1 Extraplanar Lens
1 Gauntlet of Might
1 Gauntlet of Power
1 Mind Stone
1 Sol Ring
1 Thran Dynamo
Mass Removal (More LD inside):
1 Decree of Annihilation
1 Devastation
1 Jokulhaups
1 Obliterate
Targeted Destruction:
1 Fanning the Flames
1 Red Sun's Zenith
"Play no favorites. Everybody dies.":
1 Comet Storm
1 Fault Line
1 Molten Disaster
1 Starstorm
Anti-Untap:
1 Smoke
1 Static Orb
1 War's Toll
Spell Replication:
1 Fork
1 Reiterate
1 Reverberate
1 Wild Ricochet
1 Anarchist
1 Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
1 Crucible of Worlds
1 Crystal Ball
1 Sculpting Steel
1 Solemn Simulacrum
1 Stranglehold
1 Vicious Shadows
Lands:
1 Darksteel Citadel
1 Dust Bowl
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Maze of Ith
1 Mystifying Maze
1 Scrying Sheets
1 Strip Mine
1 Tectonic Edge
1 Thawing Glaciers
1 Valakut, the Molten Pinnacle
1 Vesuva
1 Wasteland
28 Snow-Covered Mountain
1 Blasphemous Act
1 Bloodfire Colossus
1 Chain Reaction
1 Destructive Force
1 Inferno
1 Boil
1 Boiling Seas
1 Jaya Ballard, Task Mage
1 Anarchy
1 Flashfires
Any help/comments/advice will be greatly appreciated ^ ^
WReya DawnbringerWGBounteous KirinGRUrabrask the HiddenR
One last thing before I go, Obsidian Fireheart likes the proliferate mechanic. He may not be able to put multiple blaze counters on the lands, but that doesn't stop Contagion Engine from making their own lands lethal.
edit: And of course, since you're mono-coloured and you already play extraplanar lens anyway, you might as well go with scrying sheets and snow-covered mountains. Much appreciated draw for red, clearing lands off the top so you can draw gas.
Steel Sabotage'ng Orbs of Mellowness since 2011.
Mountains > Snow-Covered Mountains
3 Snow-Covered Mountains > Valakut, Scrying Sheets, Thawing Glaciers
Apocalypse > Crucible of Worlds
I hadn't thought of that
WReya DawnbringerWGBounteous KirinGRUrabrask the HiddenR
:symu::symr: Melek WheelStorm
:symw::symg: Trostani Enchantress (updated 6/5)
:symg::symr::symu: Unexpected Results.dec
Um, this may be a dumb question, but why would playing Imperial Recruiter make me want a fourth mana doubler?
Granted, now that you mentioned it, I am going to put Gauntlet of Might in here, but I feel I'm missing something with your comment...
WReya DawnbringerWGBounteous KirinGRUrabrask the HiddenR
Just the financial implications. Most red deck builders eschew the sickeningly good gauntlet because it's narrow and expensive- between $50 and $75 bucks for a card that's only good in the (generally) weakest mono-color build. But if you're playing Imperial Recruiter, clearly price is no object at $200 for a utility tutor
:symu::symr: Melek WheelStorm
:symw::symg: Trostani Enchantress (updated 6/5)
:symg::symr::symu: Unexpected Results.dec
OhmyGodIthinkI'mgonnabesick...
*catches breath* ...Well...I am going for optimal performance, and price is not an issue...but $200
What should I take out for Gauntlet of Might though?
WReya DawnbringerWGBounteous KirinGRUrabrask the HiddenR
Swap out Extraplanar Lens for Gauntlet of Might. The lens is almost always 2-1 yourself.
Not enough targets for Hoarding Dragon or Godo to be worth it, imo.
Rakka Mar seems.. really bad.
EDH:
RNorin the WaryR <-Link! (Primer - Mono Red Control)
GUEdric, Spymaster of TrestUG <- Link! (Mini-Primer - Dredge)
Duel Commander:
WUGeist of Saint TraftUW <- Link! (Aggro-Control)
BGSkullbriar, the Walking GraveGB <- Link! (Aggro)
BUGDamia, Sage of StoneGUB <- Link! (Extinction Control)
Church of the Wary
Hey man I'm this close (><) to just proxying him just to tutor up Goblin Welder, a real gem in red who just goes SILLY with Solemn Simulacrum and other players' artifacts.
Here's some stuff you can live without:
Anger: He's doing double duty with Urubrask.
Magma Phoenix: I just find it underwhelming unless you know you're going to have token problems.
Imperial Recruiter: Come to think of it, who is this guy actually tutoring for?
Gratuitous Violence: You aren't playing enough aggro for this to be that good, I think.
And stuff to add:
Solemn Simulacrum: More mana ramp and card draw? STUPID BUSTED with Goblin Welder? YES PLZ
Gauntlet of Might: Needs no explanation
Tower of Fortunes or Urza's Blueprints: With four Mana Doublers, these guys can work for you. HOWEVER if you're going to be blowing up lands all the time, maybe the tower is not such a good choice
Worn Powerstone, Thran Dynamo, Everflowing Chalice, Mind Stone, etc.: If you're going to be blowing up lands, I would be interested in a lot more artifact mana if I were you. Not to mention your average CMC looks pretty high here.
Wild Ricochet, Fork, Reverberate: Piggyback off other spells so you can cover for red's weaknesses. In some cases, outright steal them.
I think with all the control elements you have in this deck (wipes, dragons, etc) that you should just go all out with it and drop most of the aggro elements like Rakka Mar and Gratuitous Violence. If you really want to be competitive with this, I imagine you'll probably have to pick aggro or control, but not both. My gut says control, but I'm not the mono-red expert here so definitely ask around.
:symu::symr: Melek WheelStorm
:symw::symg: Trostani Enchantress (updated 6/5)
:symg::symr::symu: Unexpected Results.dec
You sure about Hoarding Dragon and Godo, Bandit Warlord? They're R tutors, which is awesome and rare. Plus, having them is like getting another chance to get whatever artifact I want. It seems like I have enough targets for Hoarding Dragon at least...
If those two really aren't worth their slots, then what should I put in to replace them?
WReya DawnbringerWGBounteous KirinGRUrabrask the HiddenR
I didn't say to cut them? They are great tutors. Hoarding Dragon gets you a mana doubler and Godo is dirty with haste and a SoFI out of your library. Read my ninja edits
:symu::symr: Melek WheelStorm
:symw::symg: Trostani Enchantress (updated 6/5)
:symg::symr::symu: Unexpected Results.dec
I know they're awesome, and I am reading your ninja edits
Imperial Recruiter tutors Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker, Dwarven Blastminer, Dwarven Miner, Magus of the Moon, Goblin Welder, Viashino Heretic, Anarchist, and Solemn Simulacrum. Eight targets.
I think you're right about making it into a pure control build. What do you think about cutting:
Bogardan Hellkite?
Flameblast Dragon?
Greater Gargadon?
Wurmcoil Engine?
Insurrection?
EDIT:
Changes:
Rakka Mar > Worn Powerstone > Darksteel Ingot
Anger > Thran Dynamo
Magma Phoenix > Everflowing Chalice
Gratuitous Violence > Mind Stone
Another EDIT: I was wrong about the Recruiter count again
WReya DawnbringerWGBounteous KirinGRUrabrask the HiddenR
Second, proliferating extra blaze counters onto lands doesn't make them do more damage as was suggested earlier. It's still just one damage per blazing land, even with 40 counters on each one.
O_o. You're right. Well now, that combo looks a lot less appealing for my red needs.
And Wake can be good against mono-red. Just catch the guy who is playign it without snow lands(since it targets the specific land name).
Steel Sabotage'ng Orbs of Mellowness since 2011.
Current EDH Decks:
G Multani, Maro-Sorcerer
B Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed
GU Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
- smoke
- orb of dreams
- static orb
- war's toll
all put a damper on your opponents. you can easily counter your own static orb/ orb of dreams with amulet of vigor. all of theese are great dragon tutor targets. also, with red your creatures are going to do the majority of the damage, so lifelink and deathtouch are a red decks best friend. oh, thats right. basilisk collar does both. seems like a good fit. also, collar and its friend, loxodon warhammer are fantastic on creatures like- magma phoenix
- bloodfire colossus
- scourge of kher-ridges
- ashen firebeast
as well as any red creature that does the old-fashoned firebreathing trick. all that chaos burn can ammount to a massive life total in the hundreds as well as wipe the field.card draw is important for a red deck, as well as not missing land drops. journeyer's kitefills the bill here.
additionally creatures like thundermare are fantastic in a smoke filled environment. kher keep is one of the best red legendary lands ever. produces chump blockers, as well as fodder for things like shivan harvest. sac outlets are important in edh, and this is one of reds best. if you want to hate on land, ruination is one of the best spells to kill problem lands, all at once.
buyback is one of reds best friends.
- shattering pulse
- reiterate
- fanning the flames
are worth their weight in diamonds.as for the power artifacts, like gauntlet of might, run them all. in my Kazuul deck i run,
there have been many games that i have won just because i run 37 mountains, and they were all worth 4 mana each.
so i have spouted off a lot of stuff here. i hope some of it helps. a lot of people i play with are really surprized at the compeditiveness of a mono red deck that doesnt armageddon. its possible, and a lot of fun to prove them wrong about red being the weakest color.
Yeah, i already commented on how that didn't work after all. Thanks anyway though.
Steel Sabotage'ng Orbs of Mellowness since 2011.
Bogardan Hellkite > Solemn Simulacrum
Flameblast Dragon > Gauntlet of Might
Great Gargadon > Urza's Blueprints
Wurmcoil Engine > Fork
Insurrection > Reiterate
Obsidian Fireheart > Reverberate
Relic of Progenitus > Wild Ricochet
Knollspine Dragon > Smoke
Banefire > Static Orb
Destructive Force > War's Toll
Skullclamp > Fanning the Flames
Sword of Fire and Ice > Journeyer's Kite
Lightning Greaves > Stranglehold
Godo, Bandit Warlord > Sculpting Steel
I also quickly threw together a sideboard, so if you want to help me on that, or just want to make suggestions to the main deck, please, feel free ^ ^
WReya DawnbringerWGBounteous KirinGRUrabrask the HiddenR