It's really good to see Damia as a 1v1 dedicated deck. I'm always looking for new insight or ideas for my Damia deck which duels as well as plays multiplayer. How has your experience with her been so far? Have you gotten to play with her much? Oath of Druids looks very interesting in here. Are you using ruin-scarred demon to seek out answers usually? Thanks.
The deck runs fairly well. Creature based decks like edric and animar suffer a little inside when they play against this deck, which is sort of the point. It's nearly impossible to lose after resolving an Oath, which is fine by me.
Rune-Scarred definitely searches for answers. It can also tutor for a brainstorm to dump any drawn fatties, or just get Jace and go to town. I like it.
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Tantarus: It didn't make the gaka greifer level, so it should be fine
Would life from the loam be a good addition? It's synergistic with oath, fact or fiction, Liliana and forbidden alchemy and it gives you another powerful endgame card. It seems a lot stronger than chain of smog.
LftL is actually banned in the french banlist: otherwise it would be great.
Life isn't banned.
I don't know if I'd run LFTL anyways, it doesn't help me much.
Currently I'm testing Jin-Gitaxis in the Chain of Smog spot, which has been fairly good to me so far. Most people don't want to copy it, and if they do I just destroy their hand again and if I have damia out draw a new set. It's not terrible, but not fantastic either.
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Tantarus: It didn't make the gaka greifer level, so it should be fine
I'm not so good yet at looking at deck lists and 'seeing' how the deck plays out, so forgive my ignorance. I was just wondering what this deck typically does in the first few turns while it's trying to tutor up its wincon?
That's what all the removal and counterspells are for. Damia plays a very aggressive control plan until you either topdeck into a tutor or oath itself, where you then proceed to win unless your opponent has an answer to enchantments.
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Tantarus: It didn't make the gaka greifer level, so it should be fine
Dwhats?! Really? Adding Emrakul to EDH deck now... May I ask why they did this?
To be honest, Emrakul isn't that great in 1v1. The only decks that can really take advantage of it are Jhoira, Azusa, and oath lists, everywhere else it's just meh.
To be honest, Emrakul isn't that great in 1v1. The only decks that can really take advantage of it are Jhoira, Azusa, and oath lists, everywhere else it's just meh.
My biggest thing is I can't find out where they say Emrakul is legal in the French list. Just curious, how well does this deck transition to multiplayer? Or How often do you get Oath? And for that matter how do you get protected from removal + grave nuke? Or is a grave nuke not often in 1v1?
As for multiplayer, I've yet to try to bring this to a multiplayer game. I think I would either crush everyone or die horribly, without actually trying I couldn't tell you.
In 1v1, there is almost no grave hate except for Scavenging Ooze and the occasional Bojuka Bog. I think this deck runs the most virtual grave-hate of any, and only because they do something else (one tutors, one cantrips)
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Tantarus: It didn't make the gaka greifer level, so it should be fine
As for multiplayer, I've yet to try to bring this to a multiplayer game. I think I would either crush everyone or die horribly, without actually trying I couldn't tell you.
In 1v1, there is almost no grave hate except for Scavenging Ooze and the occasional Bojuka Bog. I think this deck runs the most virtual grave-hate of any, and only because they do something else (one tutors, one cantrips)
Well I play a lot of casual multiplayer EDH on paper. And I was looking at the Oath. Though I wouldn't be able to abuse it as well it seems decent and I would be willing to cut a few creatures to hit the larges ones more often.
But occasionally I take my exact list into 1v1 matchs and my deck works rather well. My only issue is GAAIV and other land denial effects. And I feel this might give me the leg up.
French EDH BRGW Saskia the Unyielding BRGW GUWB Thrasios, Triton Hero // Tymna the Weaver GUWB B Braids, Cabal Minion B G Titania, Protector of Argoth G R Zurgo Bellstriker R
Founding Father of [Team Stepfathers]: We beat you and you hate us My Street Art
Cryptic Command - This card is really good. But in three colors in a “wedge” combination, isn’t it hard to get your three blue mana ?
Echoing Truth - How often is this ability relevant (cards with same name) ? Wouldn’t it be better to play Repeal ? Most permanents don’t cost more than three mana.
Evasive Action - This is just a bad Mana Leak. Isn’t it better to play Remand or Condescend ?
Merchant Scroll - This tutor basically searches either for Force of Will, either for Fact or Fiction. Is it so good in this deck ?
Jace Beleren - Isn’t it better to play Phyrexian Arena ? Jace is easier to remove and forces you to give a card to your opponent once every three turns. Plus, having Jace in play prevents you from playing your own Jace. In a metagame where green decks dominate, I guess you rarely drop a Jace Beleren on turn three.
Acadely Ruins - The best you can do with it is retrieving Oblivion Stone. How many times did you do such a play ? Is it worth playing this colorless lands ? Did it make you win more games than it has made you lose some ?
Minamo, School at Water’s Edge - You have no legendary creatures in your deck, and your commander has no activated ability. Of course Damia can still attack, but if she attacks, that means she stayed in play a full turn. If she did, that means you refilled your hand like hell. And if you did, I just imagine your opponent will die in an horrible way, whether or not you have Minamo. Considering that, is it worth running that nonbasic land ?
Let's get straight to the choices.
Cryptic Command - This is easily the best counterspell in the deck. We're all well aware of its power, and I do understand your concern for actually being able to hit UUU. I find it to actually be pretty easy. When using a fetchland, I almost always get a U/x land, unless I really need Bayou or Overgrown Tomb. The green ramp further increases my blue count, as Tropical Island and Breeding Pool are pretty much the best choices. Overall, UUU is incredibly easy to get.
Echoing Truth - I use this over repeal simply because it costs so much less than repeal does, unless I'm bouncing a one-drop. This usually doesn't happen. This cost is huge - I need to constantly have mana open for counterspells or removal. I really can't waste my time tapping out for bounce, even bounce with a draw, unless I have no choice. Pretend this deck is Wydwen, only as soon as Oath drops you win, instead of having to wait 7 turns.
Evasive Action - I guess it's technically a bad mana leak, but with the amount of fixing I've got it's always a pay 3 effect. I'm a huge fan of it. Remand and Condescend both have problems I don't like for this deck. Remand doesn't actually solve the problem, and I don't care much for tempo counters. Condescend has the same failings as Repeal, in that it costs too much mana. This deck needs to be very careful about how it spends its mana, including what lands to keep untapped and what lands are worth using.
Merchant Scroll - This is both narrow, and at the same time incredibly versatile. My favorite target is neither Force nor FoF, but Muddle the Mixture. Why? Well, it tutors for Oath! With the amount of U/x instants I run, I think I can be fairly secure in merchant scroll, but I admit it's one of the weaker cards in the deck in some matchups.
Jace Beleren - You're right, Phyrexian Arena belongs in here. Why it's not... Anyways, Jace Beleren serves two vital purposes:
1. He kills opposing Jaces.
2. He draws cards.
In a nutshell, that's really it. It's very important that he kill other jaces, because Jace 2.0 can wreck your oath plan if you're not careful. He's usually a late-game drop, to be honest. I never drop him on turn three unless I'm holding a Force or really need to hit a land drop. Or if I'm feeling lucky. Don't ask.
As for holding your own jace - this isn't a problem. Since zen standard, when I played Jace/Elspeth control and then Sun Titan control to quite a few tournament wins, I have played Jace in exactly this manner, barring certain unforeseen circumstances:
And that's it. He's just a draw 3 for 3, and I don't bother protecting him unless I can get something out of it, or if I know my opponent has a jace of their own in hand.
Academy Ruins - I think this is necessary, or at least a huge leg up. Engineered Explosives lock can be.. Explosive. Recurring spellbomb, explosives, and ostone are plenty of reasons to run this as a one-shot land, which is easily tutorable through Tolaria West if I want it, though Forbidden Orchard is usually the first subject.
Minamo, School at Water's Edge - Since the banning of Back to Basics, this has gotten slightly more useful. You're correct in that just untapping with Damia is usually enough to win (actually, I havent yet lost once I untap with her) so I might as well forcefully untap her, yeah? ... I don't actually have a good reason for this over an Island. A basic land would probably be better, but having Minamo in the deck makes the list feel more important, with a long card name buried within. Posterity, baby.
Homeward Path - I guess you don't like when someone casts Treachery on your Damia. Ad what about Bribery on Blightsteel Colossus ? Speaking of which...
Bribery - This card is bad in Wydwen-like decks, but you are playing some ramp, and Bribery has the potential to win games all by itself. What about punishing those who abuse the Loyal Retainers / Iona, Shield of Emeria combo ?
Snuff Out - Considering most of the decks to beat don’t play black (except Doran), isn’t the risk of meeting Iname lesser than the rewards of beating high tempo decks like Edric ?
Vedalken Shackles - Most of the commanders don’t have more than 2 in power : Edric, Zur, Augustin, Jhoira, Nin, Doran, Rhys, Sisay, etc. Shackles can totally return some games to your advantage, in many situations.
Tooth and Nail - What about an additional win condition ? Resolving it should mostly lead to a win (Blightsteel Colossus + Rune-Scarred Demon which searches for Force of Will), sure it is expensive but maybe you might allow yourself such a powerful late game spell. Basically it just wins the game.
Lightning greaves - Having Damia stay alive the turn she comes into play is, I guess, the main problem with her. What about getting her Shroud ? Plus, having an instant kill with Blightsteel Colossus looks great.
Impulse - I could probably run this, but finding weak cards is difficult at times.
Filter - I do need a tad more filter, but not too much. Part of the reason I feel this deck is successful is due to the high variance of answers. Every card drawn has the potential to be game changing on its own, and I rarely run out of cards in hand. Smart play is the name of the game.
As for having a Rune-Scarred stuck in hand, I admit it's problematic. I do love the Frantic Search option, as basically free filter is exactly what this deck wants.
Homeward Path - I never really considered this possibility, because 99 times out of 100, I have answers to what they're doing. I suppose having a land that can save me a card in hand is a very good idea, but on cockatrice theft effects have a very low count. They just aren't that great most of the time except against certain decks. On that note...
Bribery - I don't like bribery. At all. In some matchups, it's a dead card. In others, it's win-more. I'm already playing Oath, what more could you ask for? At 5 mana and forcing a tap-out, this feels like a poor option.
Snuff Out - I do dig free removal. However, life-loss is actually important for this deck, as I'm basically racing for a sweeper or oath in the matchups where it matters. That's not to say I shouldn't be running this, as it's very, very good against edric.
Vedalken Shackles - I could probably run this. Can't say more on the subject.
Tooth and Nail - In this situation, I'd rather cast Damia to be honest. They MUST answer either of these cards in order to win, and one doesn't cost a card in my deck. However, cheating fat into play is something I like - I'm currently testing Show and Tell, as I know most creatures or enchantments are worthless in the face of Blightsteel or Emrakul, and those that are (theft) are either few in number or not worth casting SnT on, because they also like to run fat.
Lightning Greaves - This has been in and out, and eventually just left out. Similar to the problems Riley has faced, the opponent either has instant speed removal, or I untap with Damia anyways. Sorcery speed removal is rare it seems, except for wipes. I'm totally fine with my opponent wasting four mana to kill damia.
I searched Gatherer for better creatures, and I didn’t find any : congratulations for your Oath targets, I guess there is no better choice than these three. Board control, tutor and win condition, all of these are great. Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur cannot do better than Rune-Scarred Demon (costing three more is a lot), and Avenger of Zendikar is weak if it pops early game via Oath of Druids (plus, it allows opponents to oath in return).
Yup. I tried Jin-Git for a short time, but after even the first game I knew he wasn't what I wanted. A problem I've seen constantly with Jin-Git oath is that you have a general disposition to mill yourself. If my opponent is down to only a few cards off of an oath, I do my best to protect my opponent's Jin-Git. Why? Death by self-mill is hillarious.
On that note, a Laboratory Maniac oath build would be kind of fun, if a little ill placed right now with all the red running around.
Rather than suggesting a bunch of cards, I write this down as a slightly different approach for this deck. What about playing Grim Monolith, Basalt Monolith and Coalition Relic ? A turn two or three Monolith can give you the opportunity of playing your fatties without having to ramp many lands. I guess a turn four Damia can easily seal a game : if I understand well how this deck works, once you untap with Damia you basically have won, as Damia draws enough cards to protect herself.
I know where the problem comes from : with Engineered Explosives and pernicious Deed you are reluctant to play artifact ramp. But, is Engineered Explosives so strong ? How often do you make a two-for-one ? When you effectively do, I guess it did cost you five mana, which is quite expensive.
A single Grim Monolith or Basalt Monolith is just one card in your hand and should probably generate a lot of tempo advantage. You can even use it to cast Fact or Fiction while having mana in backup, or to land a turn four Karn Liberated (THAT is a good turn four, my dear !). I imagine that a turn three Massacre Wurm against Edric should make him want to cry. I find the reward of playing those cards really high in this particular deck.
Of course, these were just questions, you know this deck better than I do. I am just sharing some thoughts about it because I love the way it is done. By the way, I think I’ll try it on Cockatrice.
My reasoning for not including artifact ramp is simple - blindly charging a Damia out never results in anything good. When Mana Drain was legal, this was a much better plan, as I could just use my opponent's mana to cast damia, and Drain is rarely a bad topdeck. Artifact mana is. I also don't want to spend artifact ramp to just cast my fat - If i'm at this stage of the game I can basically take my time before casting anything, because it means I have stabilized and am not likely to die anytime soon. This means topdeck wars, and I am very good at those.
Explosives is one of the best cards in the format, and is highly under-appreciated. I think it's so powerful, it's the main sweeper in one of my brewed modern decks. Against pisse edric, Explosives is bar none the best sweeper in the deck. With so many one and two drops, explosives can't help but generate massive advantage. Explosives also does fun things against permanent based decks like Kwiznek's Jenara enchantress, because... well, it hit's permanents.
Explosives. <3. that is all.
Furthering the artifact mana bit - Damia Oath is not and cannot be played as a tempo deck. You're hardcore control until you resolve oath, then you switch into "I win" mode. It's very hard to lose after casting oath, enchantment hate is not exactly common, and of course it gives you your win-con without needing to spend mana. Oath and backup plan hardcast fat doesn't work well, unless it's a natural hardcast - because, like any finisher, you've won at that point.
Enjoy Damia Oath!
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Tantarus: It didn't make the gaka greifer level, so it should be fine
How many lands do you want in play when you start to go off? 40 lands is enough to have 4 lands turn 4 most of the time. Decks that want to get to 7 mana like Standard Cruel Control from a few years back were at least 45% lands. I bring this up mostly out of curiosity but also because I have had a suspicion that most control decks in this format would benefit from more lands. At 40 lands it is like playing 24 lands in a 60 card format. In standard that would never happen in a control deck. In legacy it could though. What are your thoughts on this? Do you have trouble casting Damia? Or do you not need to worry about that here because plan a is oath?
I need exactly two lands to win. I am usually fairly aggressive with the oath - if I have the mana to tutor for and then play it, I probably will. After all, you win the turn after it hits play.
To date, I've never had mana issues, and have occasionally been forced to (or have had the ability to) hardcast my bombs. *shudder*
Generally a control deck wants 40-42 lands in this format, with at least some form of filter and fetch. Once I hit 5 lands, I'm pretty much good, with any extras just ensuring I can cast my general if I feel like it.
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Tantarus: It didn't make the gaka greifer level, so it should be fine
A few more thoughts about the deck after having tested it a bit more.
Against Edric it remains a bit hard. When Edric is on the play, he can be really fast and start drawing like hell. A few removals might be considered :
- Innocent's Blood
- Night of Soul's Betrayal
- Wretched Banquet
And one card might be considered : Skeletal Scrying. It's a very efficient card drawer.
Oh, innocent blood. how could I forget about that? Definitely needs to find a spot. Wretched Banquet doesn't seem fantastic, and Night of Soul's Betrayal should be looked at. It interferes with your forbidden orchard, but only when you're winning anyways, when orchard is at its best. Killing 90% of edric's creatures in a huge plus with no downside. At four mana, I'd prefer it over the Curse of Death's hold.
I do like this, but I'm worried about how it will interfere with Oathing at the end, as the board tends to be empty except for my giant demon/Cthulhu/optimus prime.
On that note, I'm going to cut the targets from three to two in order to increase the chances of me hitting what I want, as well as opening a slot for other things.. Rune-scarred in staying in without question, and it's a matter of what I want to kill with.
Blightsteel I've been forced to cast a few times, but this is clearly not a good plan. Blightsteel loses to bounce, which is common. Blightsteel is, however, immune to wraths.
Emrakul is, well, Cthulhu. He's immune to spot removal, if you actually need to cast him, the extra turn is fine. He's not immune to creature-based bounce and steal, but can die to a wrath. Annihilator 6 means you're a boss and the opponent is screwed, but at 15 mana can be troublesome to cast from your hand.
...In any cast, I'm going to stick with Emrakul. One-shot robot is fine and all, but Emrakul fills another important roll as noted by Emether - another shuffle effect. This is big. Sorry robot, you've been replaced.
Massacre Wurm might find his way back at some point, but I want more oathing consistency.
I tested Show and Tell. It's as bad as everyone and I thought it would be, although it was rather funny to drop my damia back into play after it got remanded, and then the laughter died as they dropped a treachery from it. Moving on.
Tooth and Nail I rarely wanted to cast when I had the mana, and when I did, I could have just played Damia to get the same "I win" effect. That's not to say it's bad. I could definitely see someone using this well, but I don't like it. Not to mention the fact it automatically turns your hand into a 6 card mess.
Minamo - I changed it for a basic Island. I haven't missed it.
Primeval Titan/Maze/Scrying - I don't know if I want the titan. Maze I probably do, but not the titan. It's not something I want to Oath into unless for some reason I don't want to win ASAP. Ptitan is the kind of card I'd want to draw on turn 4 or 5 and cast it, but that doesn't work well in an Oath deck.
Impulse - Put it in, love it. No word yet on Lim-dul's Vault.
Frantic Search is likewise awesome. Instant speed basically free filter? Sign me up.
Stifle - I'm good with voidslime so far. (though this can probably be cut) I don't know if there is room for stifle, or even if I'd want it.
Did I miss anything?
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Tantarus: It didn't make the gaka greifer level, so it should be fine
Are you sure oath alone justifies cutting all the insanely good creatures that are poor to drill into? Notably Primeval titan, eternal witness, shadowmage infiltrator, gilded drake, snapcaster, phantasmal image etc etc?
Like the way I see it, if your main wincon is to slap a blightsteel on the board in a meta full of bounce spells (notably edric), isnt just better to play various threats to force the removals out and then play a smaller, but big enough threat once they dont have any answers?
additionally, i would cut jace 1.0, pact of negation and spellbomb since they are pretty poor draws in a fast/fish meta. the shred memory is very acceptable since it gets you demonic tutor at the very last but draw 1 card for a soercery is pretty bad in a meta where graveyard synergy is almost inexistant. but if you wanna beat evergreen go for it
i would also suggest cutting basic lands to 2 of each (1 snow, 1 non-snow) and run tainted pact. that card is way too powerful to not play. early game it drills for a "good" card and late game it gets you the one card you need to either win or not die in a fire. i would also run evacuation, miscalculation, mental mistep, spell snare and more removal (terror doom blade diabolic edict)
Are you sure oath alone justifies cutting all the insanely good creatures that are poor to drill into? Notably Primeval titan, eternal witness, shadowmage infiltrator, gilded drake, snapcaster, phantasmal image etc etc?
Like the way I see it, if your main wincon is to slap a blightsteel on the board in a meta full of bounce spells (notably edric), isnt just better to play various threats to force the removals out and then play a smaller, but big enough threat once they dont have any answers?
Absolutely. I originally ran all those tasty creatures, to very limited success. They were just irrelevant. Horribly, horribly irrelevant.
I switched to Oath, and suddenly the matchups I lost turned into great ones.
Edric isn't much of a problem. If you're at the stage of casting oath, you've already won. You should have plenty of removal and counters for their bounce via slots freed up with oath.
Does it justify cutting the creatures? Yes. Easily.
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Tantarus: It didn't make the gaka greifer level, so it should be fine
1 Damia, Sage of Stone
Instants - 29
1 Abrupt Decay
1 Beast Within
1 Brainstorm
1 Counterspell
1 Cryptic Command
1 Cyclonic Rift
1 Diabolic Edict
1 Dismember
1 Essence Scatter
1 Fact or Fiction
1 Forbid
1 Forbidden Alchemy
1 Force of Will
1 Go for the Throat
1 Impulse
1 Into the Roil
1 Intuition
1 Mana Leak
1 Miscalculation
1 Muddle the Mixture
1 Mystical Teachings
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Nature's Claim
1 Negate
1 Putrefy
1 Remand
1 Shred Memory
1 Victim of Night
1 Voidslime
Sorceries - 17
1 Ancestral Vision
1 Black Sun's Zenith
1 Damnation
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Duress
1 Explore
1 Innocent Blood
1 Inquisition of Kozilek
1 Life from the Loam
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Nature's Lore
1 Ponder
1 Preordain
1 Regrowth
1 Thoughtseize
1 Three Visits
1 Treasured Find
1 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
1 Liliana of the Veil
1 Tamiyo, the Moon Sage
Creatures - 3
1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
1 Griselbrand
1 Rune-Scarred Demon
Enchantments - 4
1 Oath of Druids
1 Pernicious Deed
1 Phyrexian Arena
1 Sylvan Library
Artifacts - 3
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Expedition Map
1 Oblivion Stone
Lands - 40
1 Academy Ruins
1 Bayou
1 Bloodstained Mire
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Breeding Pool
1 City of Brass
1 Command Tower
1 Creeping Tar Pit
1 Drowned Catacomb
1 Flooded Grove
1 Flooded Strand
1 Forbidden Orchard
1 Forest
1 Hinterland Harbor
4 Island
1 Marsh Flats
1 Maze of Ith
1 Misty Rainforest
1 Overgrown Tomb
1 Polluted Delta
1 River of Tears
1 Scalding Tarn
1 Sunken Ruins
2 Swamp
1 Tolaria West
1 Tropical Island
1 Underground River
1 Underground Sea
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Verdant Catacombs
1 Wasteland
1 Watery Grave
1 Windswept Heath
1 Wooded Foothills
1 Woodland Cemetery
Oath Plan. Stack your triggers with Rune-Scarred and Blessing to get the full range of tutoring.
Plan B is Damia beats or planeswalker fun.
EDH:
RNorin the WaryR <-Link! (Primer - Mono Red Control)
GUEdric, Spymaster of TrestUG <- Link! (Mini-Primer - Dredge)
Duel Commander:
WUGeist of Saint TraftUW <- Link! (Aggro-Control)
BGSkullbriar, the Walking GraveGB <- Link! (Aggro)
BUGDamia, Sage of StoneGUB <- Link! (Extinction Control)
Church of the Wary
Thank You Rivenor/Miraculous Recovery Studios!
GGGSKamahl's Band of Monstosities SGGG
RRRSFreaki-Kiki, The Goblin DoucheSRRR
BBGGNath, Raper of Hands and Spewer of Tokens!GGBB
BUGDamia, Sage of AnswersBUG
WIPs
BBBXiahou Dun, the Bitter Stax Enabling BastardBBB
On Break
BBBSKagemaro, First to RetireSBBB
BBBThe Walking DeadBBB
UUUSTeferi Combo PrimerSUUU
Rune-Scarred definitely searches for answers. It can also tutor for a brainstorm to dump any drawn fatties, or just get Jace and go to town. I like it.
EDH:
RNorin the WaryR <-Link! (Primer - Mono Red Control)
GUEdric, Spymaster of TrestUG <- Link! (Mini-Primer - Dredge)
Duel Commander:
WUGeist of Saint TraftUW <- Link! (Aggro-Control)
BGSkullbriar, the Walking GraveGB <- Link! (Aggro)
BUGDamia, Sage of StoneGUB <- Link! (Extinction Control)
Church of the Wary
BRWC Mardu Shops - Tymna and Akiri Artifacts BRWC
Life isn't banned.
I don't know if I'd run LFTL anyways, it doesn't help me much.
Currently I'm testing Jin-Gitaxis in the Chain of Smog spot, which has been fairly good to me so far. Most people don't want to copy it, and if they do I just destroy their hand again and if I have damia out draw a new set. It's not terrible, but not fantastic either.
EDH:
RNorin the WaryR <-Link! (Primer - Mono Red Control)
GUEdric, Spymaster of TrestUG <- Link! (Mini-Primer - Dredge)
Duel Commander:
WUGeist of Saint TraftUW <- Link! (Aggro-Control)
BGSkullbriar, the Walking GraveGB <- Link! (Aggro)
BUGDamia, Sage of StoneGUB <- Link! (Extinction Control)
Church of the Wary
That's what all the removal and counterspells are for. Damia plays a very aggressive control plan until you either topdeck into a tutor or oath itself, where you then proceed to win unless your opponent has an answer to enchantments.
EDH:
RNorin the WaryR <-Link! (Primer - Mono Red Control)
GUEdric, Spymaster of TrestUG <- Link! (Mini-Primer - Dredge)
Duel Commander:
WUGeist of Saint TraftUW <- Link! (Aggro-Control)
BGSkullbriar, the Walking GraveGB <- Link! (Aggro)
BUGDamia, Sage of StoneGUB <- Link! (Extinction Control)
Church of the Wary
Definitely around the right number. I might stand to add one or two more CA generating counters, but at the moment it functions perfectly.
EDH:
RNorin the WaryR <-Link! (Primer - Mono Red Control)
GUEdric, Spymaster of TrestUG <- Link! (Mini-Primer - Dredge)
Duel Commander:
WUGeist of Saint TraftUW <- Link! (Aggro-Control)
BGSkullbriar, the Walking GraveGB <- Link! (Aggro)
BUGDamia, Sage of StoneGUB <- Link! (Extinction Control)
Church of the Wary
Yes. Emrakul is finding a spot.
EDH:
RNorin the WaryR <-Link! (Primer - Mono Red Control)
GUEdric, Spymaster of TrestUG <- Link! (Mini-Primer - Dredge)
Duel Commander:
WUGeist of Saint TraftUW <- Link! (Aggro-Control)
BGSkullbriar, the Walking GraveGB <- Link! (Aggro)
BUGDamia, Sage of StoneGUB <- Link! (Extinction Control)
Church of the Wary
Dwhats?! Really? Adding Emrakul to EDH deck now... May I ask why they did this?
Thank you so much mchief111 for the amazing art!
BUG is the Jund of EDH!
Modern: Jund, Grixis Delver, Bant Eldrazi, TitanShift
Commander: Brago, Yidris, Mizzix, Marath, Atheros, Daretti
To be honest, Emrakul isn't that great in 1v1. The only decks that can really take advantage of it are Jhoira, Azusa, and oath lists, everywhere else it's just meh.
I'm testing the following changes:
- Massacre Wurm
- Karn Liberated
+ Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
+ Show and Tell
EDH:
RNorin the WaryR <-Link! (Primer - Mono Red Control)
GUEdric, Spymaster of TrestUG <- Link! (Mini-Primer - Dredge)
Duel Commander:
WUGeist of Saint TraftUW <- Link! (Aggro-Control)
BGSkullbriar, the Walking GraveGB <- Link! (Aggro)
BUGDamia, Sage of StoneGUB <- Link! (Extinction Control)
Church of the Wary
My biggest thing is I can't find out where they say Emrakul is legal in the French list. Just curious, how well does this deck transition to multiplayer? Or How often do you get Oath? And for that matter how do you get protected from removal + grave nuke? Or is a grave nuke not often in 1v1?
Thank you so much mchief111 for the amazing art!
BUG is the Jund of EDH!
Modern: Jund, Grixis Delver, Bant Eldrazi, TitanShift
Commander: Brago, Yidris, Mizzix, Marath, Atheros, Daretti
This is where you want to go.
As for multiplayer, I've yet to try to bring this to a multiplayer game. I think I would either crush everyone or die horribly, without actually trying I couldn't tell you.
In 1v1, there is almost no grave hate except for Scavenging Ooze and the occasional Bojuka Bog. I think this deck runs the most virtual grave-hate of any, and only because they do something else (one tutors, one cantrips)
EDH:
RNorin the WaryR <-Link! (Primer - Mono Red Control)
GUEdric, Spymaster of TrestUG <- Link! (Mini-Primer - Dredge)
Duel Commander:
WUGeist of Saint TraftUW <- Link! (Aggro-Control)
BGSkullbriar, the Walking GraveGB <- Link! (Aggro)
BUGDamia, Sage of StoneGUB <- Link! (Extinction Control)
Church of the Wary
Well I play a lot of casual multiplayer EDH on paper. And I was looking at the Oath. Though I wouldn't be able to abuse it as well it seems decent and I would be willing to cut a few creatures to hit the larges ones more often.
But occasionally I take my exact list into 1v1 matchs and my deck works rather well. My only issue is GAAIV and other land denial effects. And I feel this might give me the leg up.
Thank you so much mchief111 for the amazing art!
BUG is the Jund of EDH!
Modern: Jund, Grixis Delver, Bant Eldrazi, TitanShift
Commander: Brago, Yidris, Mizzix, Marath, Atheros, Daretti
BRGW Saskia the Unyielding BRGW
GUWB Thrasios, Triton Hero // Tymna the Weaver GUWB
B Braids, Cabal Minion B
G Titania, Protector of Argoth G
R Zurgo Bellstriker R
Founding Father of [Team Stepfathers]: We beat you and you hate us
My Street Art
Let's get straight to the choices.
Cryptic Command - This is easily the best counterspell in the deck. We're all well aware of its power, and I do understand your concern for actually being able to hit UUU. I find it to actually be pretty easy. When using a fetchland, I almost always get a U/x land, unless I really need Bayou or Overgrown Tomb. The green ramp further increases my blue count, as Tropical Island and Breeding Pool are pretty much the best choices. Overall, UUU is incredibly easy to get.
Echoing Truth - I use this over repeal simply because it costs so much less than repeal does, unless I'm bouncing a one-drop. This usually doesn't happen. This cost is huge - I need to constantly have mana open for counterspells or removal. I really can't waste my time tapping out for bounce, even bounce with a draw, unless I have no choice. Pretend this deck is Wydwen, only as soon as Oath drops you win, instead of having to wait 7 turns.
Evasive Action - I guess it's technically a bad mana leak, but with the amount of fixing I've got it's always a pay 3 effect. I'm a huge fan of it. Remand and Condescend both have problems I don't like for this deck. Remand doesn't actually solve the problem, and I don't care much for tempo counters. Condescend has the same failings as Repeal, in that it costs too much mana. This deck needs to be very careful about how it spends its mana, including what lands to keep untapped and what lands are worth using.
Merchant Scroll - This is both narrow, and at the same time incredibly versatile. My favorite target is neither Force nor FoF, but Muddle the Mixture. Why? Well, it tutors for Oath! With the amount of U/x instants I run, I think I can be fairly secure in merchant scroll, but I admit it's one of the weaker cards in the deck in some matchups.
Jace Beleren - You're right, Phyrexian Arena belongs in here. Why it's not... Anyways, Jace Beleren serves two vital purposes:
1. He kills opposing Jaces.
2. He draws cards.
In a nutshell, that's really it. It's very important that he kill other jaces, because Jace 2.0 can wreck your oath plan if you're not careful. He's usually a late-game drop, to be honest. I never drop him on turn three unless I'm holding a Force or really need to hit a land drop. Or if I'm feeling lucky. Don't ask.
As for holding your own jace - this isn't a problem. Since zen standard, when I played Jace/Elspeth control and then Sun Titan control to quite a few tournament wins, I have played Jace in exactly this manner, barring certain unforeseen circumstances:
1. Play Jace. -1. Loyalty 2.
2. -1. Loyalty 1.
3. -1. Loyalty 0. Jace dies.
And that's it. He's just a draw 3 for 3, and I don't bother protecting him unless I can get something out of it, or if I know my opponent has a jace of their own in hand.
Academy Ruins - I think this is necessary, or at least a huge leg up. Engineered Explosives lock can be.. Explosive. Recurring spellbomb, explosives, and ostone are plenty of reasons to run this as a one-shot land, which is easily tutorable through Tolaria West if I want it, though Forbidden Orchard is usually the first subject.
Minamo, School at Water's Edge - Since the banning of Back to Basics, this has gotten slightly more useful. You're correct in that just untapping with Damia is usually enough to win (actually, I havent yet lost once I untap with her) so I might as well forcefully untap her, yeah? ... I don't actually have a good reason for this over an Island. A basic land would probably be better, but having Minamo in the deck makes the list feel more important, with a long card name buried within. Posterity, baby.
Impulse - I could probably run this, but finding weak cards is difficult at times.
Forbidden Alchemy - I already run this! It's awesome.
Filter - I do need a tad more filter, but not too much. Part of the reason I feel this deck is successful is due to the high variance of answers. Every card drawn has the potential to be game changing on its own, and I rarely run out of cards in hand. Smart play is the name of the game.
As for having a Rune-Scarred stuck in hand, I admit it's problematic. I do love the Frantic Search option, as basically free filter is exactly what this deck wants.
Homeward Path - I never really considered this possibility, because 99 times out of 100, I have answers to what they're doing. I suppose having a land that can save me a card in hand is a very good idea, but on cockatrice theft effects have a very low count. They just aren't that great most of the time except against certain decks. On that note...
Bribery - I don't like bribery. At all. In some matchups, it's a dead card. In others, it's win-more. I'm already playing Oath, what more could you ask for? At 5 mana and forcing a tap-out, this feels like a poor option.
Snuff Out - I do dig free removal. However, life-loss is actually important for this deck, as I'm basically racing for a sweeper or oath in the matchups where it matters. That's not to say I shouldn't be running this, as it's very, very good against edric.
Vedalken Shackles - I could probably run this. Can't say more on the subject.
Tooth and Nail - In this situation, I'd rather cast Damia to be honest. They MUST answer either of these cards in order to win, and one doesn't cost a card in my deck. However, cheating fat into play is something I like - I'm currently testing Show and Tell, as I know most creatures or enchantments are worthless in the face of Blightsteel or Emrakul, and those that are (theft) are either few in number or not worth casting SnT on, because they also like to run fat.
Lightning Greaves - This has been in and out, and eventually just left out. Similar to the problems Riley has faced, the opponent either has instant speed removal, or I untap with Damia anyways. Sorcery speed removal is rare it seems, except for wipes. I'm totally fine with my opponent wasting four mana to kill damia.
Yup. I tried Jin-Git for a short time, but after even the first game I knew he wasn't what I wanted. A problem I've seen constantly with Jin-Git oath is that you have a general disposition to mill yourself. If my opponent is down to only a few cards off of an oath, I do my best to protect my opponent's Jin-Git. Why? Death by self-mill is hillarious.
On that note, a Laboratory Maniac oath build would be kind of fun, if a little ill placed right now with all the red running around.
My reasoning for not including artifact ramp is simple - blindly charging a Damia out never results in anything good. When Mana Drain was legal, this was a much better plan, as I could just use my opponent's mana to cast damia, and Drain is rarely a bad topdeck. Artifact mana is. I also don't want to spend artifact ramp to just cast my fat - If i'm at this stage of the game I can basically take my time before casting anything, because it means I have stabilized and am not likely to die anytime soon. This means topdeck wars, and I am very good at those.
Explosives is one of the best cards in the format, and is highly under-appreciated. I think it's so powerful, it's the main sweeper in one of my brewed modern decks. Against pisse edric, Explosives is bar none the best sweeper in the deck. With so many one and two drops, explosives can't help but generate massive advantage. Explosives also does fun things against permanent based decks like Kwiznek's Jenara enchantress, because... well, it hit's permanents.
Explosives. <3. that is all.
Furthering the artifact mana bit - Damia Oath is not and cannot be played as a tempo deck. You're hardcore control until you resolve oath, then you switch into "I win" mode. It's very hard to lose after casting oath, enchantment hate is not exactly common, and of course it gives you your win-con without needing to spend mana. Oath and backup plan hardcast fat doesn't work well, unless it's a natural hardcast - because, like any finisher, you've won at that point.
Enjoy Damia Oath!
EDH:
RNorin the WaryR <-Link! (Primer - Mono Red Control)
GUEdric, Spymaster of TrestUG <- Link! (Mini-Primer - Dredge)
Duel Commander:
WUGeist of Saint TraftUW <- Link! (Aggro-Control)
BGSkullbriar, the Walking GraveGB <- Link! (Aggro)
BUGDamia, Sage of StoneGUB <- Link! (Extinction Control)
Church of the Wary
Level 1 Judge
WUBRG
To date, I've never had mana issues, and have occasionally been forced to (or have had the ability to) hardcast my bombs. *shudder*
Generally a control deck wants 40-42 lands in this format, with at least some form of filter and fetch. Once I hit 5 lands, I'm pretty much good, with any extras just ensuring I can cast my general if I feel like it.
EDH:
RNorin the WaryR <-Link! (Primer - Mono Red Control)
GUEdric, Spymaster of TrestUG <- Link! (Mini-Primer - Dredge)
Duel Commander:
WUGeist of Saint TraftUW <- Link! (Aggro-Control)
BGSkullbriar, the Walking GraveGB <- Link! (Aggro)
BUGDamia, Sage of StoneGUB <- Link! (Extinction Control)
Church of the Wary
I'd have to agree that its worth consideration on the condition you add another game ender or two.
I also play Damia control (albeit in a different manner - more Master Transmuter/Tezzeret the Seeker/mana rocks etc.) and i can't remember ever losing after resolving this. Granted, I play three more fatties (Kozilek, Butcher of Truth/Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre/Emrakul, the Aeons Torn) than you do plus Primeval Titan.
If you can find the space for three more cards (for testing purposes) I don't think you'll be disappointed playing Tooth and Nail.
Edit: Minamo, School at Water's Edge might be better served as, say... Vesuva? Its a basic at worst but usually a Wasteland/Strip Mine in my experience.
Edit 2: Thoughts on Impulse? Served me well in Damia so far.
Yes, that's where the Phyrexian Arena should have gone. Fixed.
Oh, innocent blood. how could I forget about that? Definitely needs to find a spot. Wretched Banquet doesn't seem fantastic, and Night of Soul's Betrayal should be looked at. It interferes with your forbidden orchard, but only when you're winning anyways, when orchard is at its best. Killing 90% of edric's creatures in a huge plus with no downside. At four mana, I'd prefer it over the Curse of Death's hold.
I do like this, but I'm worried about how it will interfere with Oathing at the end, as the board tends to be empty except for my giant demon/Cthulhu/optimus prime.
On that note, I'm going to cut the targets from three to two in order to increase the chances of me hitting what I want, as well as opening a slot for other things.. Rune-scarred in staying in without question, and it's a matter of what I want to kill with.
Blightsteel I've been forced to cast a few times, but this is clearly not a good plan. Blightsteel loses to bounce, which is common. Blightsteel is, however, immune to wraths.
Emrakul is, well, Cthulhu. He's immune to spot removal, if you actually need to cast him, the extra turn is fine. He's not immune to creature-based bounce and steal, but can die to a wrath. Annihilator 6 means you're a boss and the opponent is screwed, but at 15 mana can be troublesome to cast from your hand.
...In any cast, I'm going to stick with Emrakul. One-shot robot is fine and all, but Emrakul fills another important roll as noted by Emether - another shuffle effect. This is big. Sorry robot, you've been replaced.
Massacre Wurm might find his way back at some point, but I want more oathing consistency.
I tested Show and Tell. It's as bad as everyone and I thought it would be, although it was rather funny to drop my damia back into play after it got remanded, and then the laughter died as they dropped a treachery from it. Moving on.
Tooth and Nail I rarely wanted to cast when I had the mana, and when I did, I could have just played Damia to get the same "I win" effect. That's not to say it's bad. I could definitely see someone using this well, but I don't like it. Not to mention the fact it automatically turns your hand into a 6 card mess.
Minamo - I changed it for a basic Island. I haven't missed it.
Primeval Titan/Maze/Scrying - I don't know if I want the titan. Maze I probably do, but not the titan. It's not something I want to Oath into unless for some reason I don't want to win ASAP. Ptitan is the kind of card I'd want to draw on turn 4 or 5 and cast it, but that doesn't work well in an Oath deck.
Impulse - Put it in, love it. No word yet on Lim-dul's Vault.
Frantic Search is likewise awesome. Instant speed basically free filter? Sign me up.
Stifle - I'm good with voidslime so far. (though this can probably be cut) I don't know if there is room for stifle, or even if I'd want it.
Did I miss anything?
EDH:
RNorin the WaryR <-Link! (Primer - Mono Red Control)
GUEdric, Spymaster of TrestUG <- Link! (Mini-Primer - Dredge)
Duel Commander:
WUGeist of Saint TraftUW <- Link! (Aggro-Control)
BGSkullbriar, the Walking GraveGB <- Link! (Aggro)
BUGDamia, Sage of StoneGUB <- Link! (Extinction Control)
Church of the Wary
Like the way I see it, if your main wincon is to slap a blightsteel on the board in a meta full of bounce spells (notably edric), isnt just better to play various threats to force the removals out and then play a smaller, but big enough threat once they dont have any answers?
additionally, i would cut jace 1.0, pact of negation and spellbomb since they are pretty poor draws in a fast/fish meta. the shred memory is very acceptable since it gets you demonic tutor at the very last but draw 1 card for a soercery is pretty bad in a meta where graveyard synergy is almost inexistant. but if you wanna beat evergreen go for it
i would also suggest cutting basic lands to 2 of each (1 snow, 1 non-snow) and run tainted pact. that card is way too powerful to not play. early game it drills for a "good" card and late game it gets you the one card you need to either win or not die in a fire. i would also run evacuation, miscalculation, mental mistep, spell snare and more removal (terror doom blade diabolic edict)
Absolutely. I originally ran all those tasty creatures, to very limited success. They were just irrelevant. Horribly, horribly irrelevant.
I switched to Oath, and suddenly the matchups I lost turned into great ones.
Edric isn't much of a problem. If you're at the stage of casting oath, you've already won. You should have plenty of removal and counters for their bounce via slots freed up with oath.
Does it justify cutting the creatures? Yes. Easily.
EDH:
RNorin the WaryR <-Link! (Primer - Mono Red Control)
GUEdric, Spymaster of TrestUG <- Link! (Mini-Primer - Dredge)
Duel Commander:
WUGeist of Saint TraftUW <- Link! (Aggro-Control)
BGSkullbriar, the Walking GraveGB <- Link! (Aggro)
BUGDamia, Sage of StoneGUB <- Link! (Extinction Control)
Church of the Wary