If we pretend for a moment that we understand the difference between human conversation and a mathematical proof, this disingenuous-seeming argument falls apart pretty quickly.
For "any deck in their colors" take "the overwhelming majority of decks reasonable/viable to play in a large random selection of different metas in their colors," rather than arguing as though the other party is an arbitrarily strict debate club drone and not a human being using the typical subjective and ambiguous manner of a normal conversation. When you acknowledge this, it's clear that your counterarguments are the niche cases, not the other way around. Building this argument on the black-and-white technicality of "all" comes across as an abuse of the framing, as though you expect the argument to be presented as an equation and not an opinion or perspective from a living person.
As someone who ran one in every G/U deck I had, we are better off without Prophet. You drop her and then win the next turn in a combo deck, get way to much fuel in stax and prison decks, and I'm sure other situations are broken too. Run Vedalken Orrery and Seedborn Muse to recreate the card.
I love PoK, and I think I have 7 or 8 copies. I played it as a 4-of for all of it's life in Standard and put it in every deck I could play it in.
You don't have to build around PoK. You can just play creatures on each opponent's turn and you will get crazy advantage. It went into every deck.
It was also super broken in a lot of decks.
I would stop playing spells and leave up removal against every UGx deck I saw once they got to 4/5 mana. You had to kill it right away, or they would untap and be able to protect it. I also think UGx decks were at least 2/3 of the meta.
I would love for the card to be unbanned. But I know that it will make EDH worse.
If we pretend for a moment that we understand the difference between human conversation and a mathematical proof, this disingenuous-seeming argument falls apart pretty quickly.
For "any deck in their colors" take "the overwhelming majority of decks reasonable/viable to play in a large random selection of different metas in their colors," rather than arguing as though the other party is an arbitrarily strict debate club drone and not a human being using the typical subjective and ambiguous manner of a normal conversation. When you acknowledge this, it's clear that your counterarguments are the niche cases, not the other way around. Building this argument on the black-and-white technicality of "all" comes across as an abuse of the framing, as though you expect the argument to be presented as an equation and not an opinion or perspective from a living person.
He used a literal example of using tinker solely for the ability to upgrade a signet to a sol ring.
If you think "any deck in their colors" means "almost any deck in their colors" and that I should assume this, well, I have a sleeve playable black lotus to sell you. Sorry, almost sleeve playable.
If you think "any deck in their colors" means "almost any deck in their colors" and that I should assume this, well, I have a sleeve playable black lotus to sell you. Sorry, almost sleeve playable.
This is a false equivalency and you know it to be, there is a vast gulf of difference in the contexts. One involves a subjective examination of the viability and ubiquity of abstract strategies in a wildly variable format, the other a much more objective examination of the physical condition of a tangible object.
I disagree, it's a clear cut illustration of semantic differences that are meaningful.
"Almost All" is substantially different than "All" in every circumstance I have ever been in. Sometimes people are being hyperbolic and when given the opportunity to back down or double down, they'll back down and transition to a reasonable statement -- sometimes they double down.
The user I was talking to instead doubled down on a dubious statement, and I have no obligation to put words in his mouth to assume a favorable meaning.
I'm not even convinced Tinker is an "almost all," in EDH - I've seen tons of decks that couldn't take meaningful advantage of it. I think it's more like a "problematically lots" than "all."
I'm not sure what either of you are arguing at this point, but just because it apparently wasn't clear.
I would jam Sylvan Primordial, PoK, Tinker, and Recurring Nightmare into any deck in their colors, support or no.
I wouldn't (and don't) jam PE into every single deck.
Since I'm talking about myself, and exclusively about myself, the statement "any deck" is a shorthand for "any deck I would build". You can disagree by expanding the "any deck" to mean literally any deck, but that's not what I'm talking about. I'm also not talking about cEDH since that doesn't matter for the banlist... where I'd only expect Tinker to make a big splash and PE only sees tons of play in Thrasios/x decks, and barely anything else.
My second post did push more into a literal "any deck", but I was mostly referring to how I would build things. So I also stand by it.
However, if you're going to expand it to literally "any deck", then obviously that wouldn't be the case. No card sees 100% play: not basic lands, not sol ring, and not mana crypt. As Pokken pointed out the requirements (if any, because self imposed restrictions aren't requirements) are so low that it is absolutely fair to assume that the vast majority of decks would be capable of running them to at least medium effect, Nightmare being the sketchiest of those I suppose.
It's obvious that Tinker requires less synergy (play a few rocks and a few strong artifacts) than Prophet of Kruphix (play critical mass of creatures or instants and defense for the most fragile card type) and more synergy than Mox Ruby. So clearly there is a spectrum.
It's obvious that Tinker requires less synergy (play a few rocks and a few strong artifacts) than Prophet of Kruphix (play critical mass of creatures or instants and defense for the most fragile card type) and more synergy than Mox Ruby. So clearly there is a spectrum.
i think cards like karakas just happens to interact poorly with the format. It's not THAT amazing for what it does, but the fact that it bounces a legendary permanent without much of a cost just doesn't jibe well.
In that respect, the combination of being able to essentially play a turn during each other player's turns in a multiplayer format is also interacting poorly with the format. In a heads up 1v1, having 1 extra turn during an opponent's turn is good, but not game-breaking. Being able to do that 3 times for each 1 turn an opponent has is just backbreaking. Having 1 card that can do both of these abilities just warps any multiplayer format too significantly for it to stay unbanned for long.
When we're talking specifically about support from deckbuilding, I left Lotus off because it doesn't go in decks that don't want to explosively commit to the board on turn 0 necessarily - less autoinclude than moxen which are mostly strictly better lands.
Karakas while it does interact poorly with the format has basically zero deckbuilding constraints except "be playing white so you can include it." But I could see making some narrow cases there around how many utility lands you can include in a 5c deck but I think it's probably still correct to play over a basic plains
Library requires your deck to want to stay at 7 cards most of the time, otherwise it's worse than other utility lands. Not all decks want to do that. For example Library will conflict with very low curve artifact and dork decks that will not want to sit at 7 cards every turn drawing. Opportunity cost of a colorless land is fairly high compared to Karakas.
Sorry, I thought I was leading back there with the 'support' discussion which is that PoK requires less support than most cards and less than some others on the ban list already.
One could make a pretty strong argument that Balance and Tolarian Academy require more deckbuilding support than PoK, and these are among the more serious offenders on the banlist.
Sorry, I thought I was leading back there with the 'support' discussion which is that PoK requires less support than most cards and less than some others on the ban list already.
One could make a pretty strong argument that Balance and Tolarian Academy require more deckbuilding support than PoK, and these are among the more serious offenders on the banlist.
I don't mind talking about other cards as they compare to Card X, but was getting pretty focused on other cards.
The issue is just simply how much mana you actually have than appear to.
Say you only have five lands with PoK out in a four player game. You basically have equivalent of 20 lands worth of mana that is broken in increments of 5 across 4 turns. Have a Llanowar Elf out alongside PoK? Equivalent of 24 lands of mana in increments of 6 across 4 turns. Everyone else might be at 4-7 lands with 0-3 mana rocks, but they aren't multiplying their mana based on how many players exist within the game while also vomiting the creatures from their hand during every player's turn unless they are also running PoK.
The issue is just simply how much mana you actually have than appear to.
Say you only have five lands with PoK out in a four player game. You basically have equivalent of 20 lands worth of mana that is broken in increments of 5 across 4 turns. Have a Llanowar Elf out alongside PoK? Equivalent of 24 lands of mana in increments of 6 across 4 turns. Everyone else might be at 4-7 lands with 0-3 mana rocks, but they aren't multiplying their mana based on how many players exist within the game while also vomiting the creatures from their hand during every player's turn unless they are also running PoK.
Too much mana too quickly is definitely one of the ban criteria that pok is an offender for imho. Probably a 3-4/10 but definitely a part of its banning if I had to guess. It has a ton of issues.
On the topic of support - I run a Rashmi deck with something like 6 creatures, I would still run prophet because it is a second Seedborn more or less. The argument would be that seedborn is legal and unproblematic, but the contention it that this is literally prophet at its least powerful, and would still feel compelled to run it.
My momir vig deck was wild with prophet and undefeated whil the card was in the deck - save one game when a geth deck reanimated....my prophet.
I have a mudrotha stax build that would be ecstatic to run a way to untap my lands under winter/static orb.
I have an Estrid deck that is built around untapping thing, so obvious include, the deck would still be bad...but I digress.
But while I would be glad for being able to use one of my favorite cards, I can state without a doubt that it would simply ruin games with or without a dedicated deck because no game it lands in is unaffected -every removal spell goes to it, every theft or reanimation, it is worth a wrath all on its own, and it does all this with lands untapped ready to counter what you throw at it since it is also blue.
One of my local friends used to comment about every other week about his desires for us to allow an unban of PoK. Then spoilers started for RA and we saw Prime Speaker Vannifar. He hasn't asked or commented about PoK since.
I think prophet is only a mild to moderate offender on too much too quick. Its a 5 drop that starts netting you, essentially, quadruple your mana, but broken up into increments. Mana Reflection is a 6 drop that doubles your mana, and you can use it all at once. Prophet is better at this, because you get some mana right away and more mana in total, but not strictly better because doubling your mana all at once lets you cast more expensive spells. Mana Reflection is a card that is clearly not problematic on the too much too fast criteria. Turn 5 is pretty much the latest something can fall under this, and that late its just not going to hit the criteria very strongly. with any other acceleration, seeing Prophet come down turn 3 or 4 makes it worse and is what raises her up from negligible to mild to moderate. Not being able to use all the mana she generates at once is a pretty big factor, as it limits what she can do with the mana and keeps her in the "cast more spells" lane rather than the "cast game ending spells early" lane, which matters for this criteria.
Private Mod Note
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The Meaning of Life: "M-hmm. Well, it's nothing very special. Uh, try and be nice to people, avoid eating fat, read a good book every now and then, get some walking in, and try and live together in peace and harmony with people of all creeds and nations"
Onering's 4 simple steps that let you solve any problem with Magic's gameplay
Whether its blue players countering your spells, red players burning you out, or combo, if you have a problem with an aspect of Magic's gameplay, you can fix it!
Step 1: Identify the problem. What aspect of Magic don't you like? Step 2: Find out how others deal with the problem. How do players deal with this aspect of the game when they run into it? Step 3: Do what those players do. Step 4: No more problem. Bonus: You are now better at Magic. Enjoy those extra wins!
If prophet only had the land-untap ability then she wouldn't be an issue, more of an annoyance like seedborn muse.
The part that pushes her over the top is the flash to all creatures. This basically means if she isn't killed before passing turn the owner basically gets to time walk after ever opponent tries to end their turn. Her flash extends to the command zone, so untapping with any green/blue/x creature style general (prime speaker zegana/Momir/Thrasios/ -enormous list here- ) means that the player will get value even if prophet is killed a turn late. Those decks can also just cast clone style effects or whatever other common protection option they have to keep PoK around.
The common argument my friend used to make was that he could just play seedborn muse and teferi, mage of zhalfir, so why not unban PoK. Stuffing those two cards on one body that can be grabbed with chord/green sun's zenith is my tables typical reply.
Can't leave you guys alone for a few months or y'all start to talk about unbanning PoK again...
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My Commander decks:
Chandra, Torch of Defiance - Oops! All Chandras.
Prime Speaker Zegana - Draw for Power.
Pir & Toothy - Counterpalooza.
Arcades, the Strategist - Another Brick in the Wall.
Zacama, Primal Calamity - Calamity of Double Mana.
Edgar Markov - Vampires Don't Die.
Child of Alara - Dreamcrusher.
Can't leave you guys alone for a few months or y'all start to talk about unbanning PoK again...
Have no worries. PoK is staying where it is.
Sheldon, I will straight up say that I have a history of disagreeing with the RC. I liked tucking commanders, I want to play Sylvan Primordial and thought it was fine, banned as commander was good because Rofellos isn't that great in the 99 and the same would now apply to Leovold.
I give that preamble so you understand where I am coming from when I say that despite how much I love PoK, you guys made a good decision for the overall health of the format. Thank you.
Can't leave you guys alone for a few months or y'all start to talk about unbanning PoK again...
Have no worries. PoK is staying where it is.
You have no idea how loud my sigh of relief just was. Much appreciated.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
My Commander decks:
Chandra, Torch of Defiance - Oops! All Chandras.
Prime Speaker Zegana - Draw for Power.
Pir & Toothy - Counterpalooza.
Arcades, the Strategist - Another Brick in the Wall.
Zacama, Primal Calamity - Calamity of Double Mana.
Edgar Markov - Vampires Don't Die.
Child of Alara - Dreamcrusher.
One of my local friends used to comment about every other week about his desires for us to allow an unban of PoK. Then spoilers started for RA and we saw Prime Speaker Vannifar. He hasn't asked or commented about PoK since.
But Vannifar can only be activated at sorcery speed, so there's not really interaction there...
For "any deck in their colors" take "the overwhelming majority of decks reasonable/viable to play in a large random selection of different metas in their colors," rather than arguing as though the other party is an arbitrarily strict debate club drone and not a human being using the typical subjective and ambiguous manner of a normal conversation. When you acknowledge this, it's clear that your counterarguments are the niche cases, not the other way around. Building this argument on the black-and-white technicality of "all" comes across as an abuse of the framing, as though you expect the argument to be presented as an equation and not an opinion or perspective from a living person.
Most Used (of many dozens) EDH Decks:
Brago, King Eternal - Stax
Grenzo, Dungeon Warden - Aggro Combo
Wort, the Raidmother - Spellslinger Swarm Control
Animar, Soul of Elements - Tempo Combo
Yidris, Maelstrom Wielder - Spellslinger
Exodia the Forbidden One:
Oona, Queen of the Fae - Combowins.dec
Modern
URGTemur ScapeshiftGRU
EDH
WGKarametra EnchantressGW
UBGSidisi, Brood Tyrant ReanimatorGBU
UBRKess DoomsdayRBU
WBGGhave TokensGBW
WUBZur RebelsBUW
WUBErtai CursesBUW
WRFiresong and Sunspeaker Spell SlingerRW
You don't have to build around PoK. You can just play creatures on each opponent's turn and you will get crazy advantage. It went into every deck.
It was also super broken in a lot of decks.
I would stop playing spells and leave up removal against every UGx deck I saw once they got to 4/5 mana. You had to kill it right away, or they would untap and be able to protect it. I also think UGx decks were at least 2/3 of the meta.
I would love for the card to be unbanned. But I know that it will make EDH worse.
8.RG Green Devotion Ramp/Combo 9.UR Draw Triggers 10.WUR Group stalling 11.WUR Voltron Spellslinger 12.WB Sacrificial Shenanigans
13.BR Creatureless Panharmonicon 14.BR Pingers and Eldrazi 15.URG Untapped Cascading
16.Reyhan, last of the Abzan's WUBG +1/+1 Counter Craziness 17.WUBRG Dragons aka Why did I make this?
Building: The Gitrog Monster lands, Glissa the Traitor stax, Muldrotha, the Gravetide Planeswalker Combo, Kydele, Chosen of Kruphix + Sidar Kondo of Jamuraa Clues, and Tribal Scarecrow Planeswalkers
He used a literal example of using tinker solely for the ability to upgrade a signet to a sol ring.
If you think "any deck in their colors" means "almost any deck in their colors" and that I should assume this, well, I have a sleeve playable black lotus to sell you. Sorry, almost sleeve playable.
UW Ephara Hatebears [Primer], GB Gitrog Lands, BRU Inalla Combo-Control, URG Maelstrom Wanderer Landfall
This is a false equivalency and you know it to be, there is a vast gulf of difference in the contexts. One involves a subjective examination of the viability and ubiquity of abstract strategies in a wildly variable format, the other a much more objective examination of the physical condition of a tangible object.
Most Used (of many dozens) EDH Decks:
Brago, King Eternal - Stax
Grenzo, Dungeon Warden - Aggro Combo
Wort, the Raidmother - Spellslinger Swarm Control
Animar, Soul of Elements - Tempo Combo
Yidris, Maelstrom Wielder - Spellslinger
Exodia the Forbidden One:
Oona, Queen of the Fae - Combowins.dec
"Almost All" is substantially different than "All" in every circumstance I have ever been in. Sometimes people are being hyperbolic and when given the opportunity to back down or double down, they'll back down and transition to a reasonable statement -- sometimes they double down.
The user I was talking to instead doubled down on a dubious statement, and I have no obligation to put words in his mouth to assume a favorable meaning.
I'm not even convinced Tinker is an "almost all," in EDH - I've seen tons of decks that couldn't take meaningful advantage of it. I think it's more like a "problematically lots" than "all."
UW Ephara Hatebears [Primer], GB Gitrog Lands, BRU Inalla Combo-Control, URG Maelstrom Wanderer Landfall
Since I'm talking about myself, and exclusively about myself, the statement "any deck" is a shorthand for "any deck I would build". You can disagree by expanding the "any deck" to mean literally any deck, but that's not what I'm talking about. I'm also not talking about cEDH since that doesn't matter for the banlist... where I'd only expect Tinker to make a big splash and PE only sees tons of play in Thrasios/x decks, and barely anything else.
My second post did push more into a literal "any deck", but I was mostly referring to how I would build things. So I also stand by it.
However, if you're going to expand it to literally "any deck", then obviously that wouldn't be the case. No card sees 100% play: not basic lands, not sol ring, and not mana crypt. As Pokken pointed out the requirements (if any, because self imposed restrictions aren't requirements) are so low that it is absolutely fair to assume that the vast majority of decks would be capable of running them to at least medium effect, Nightmare being the sketchiest of those I suppose.
The argument was that most cards, even most bannable cards, require some degree of support from their deck in order to become an issue.
the only ones that have basically no deckbuilding requirements (other than straight up garbage like panoptic mirror which I am not going to discuss):
It's obvious that Tinker requires less synergy (play a few rocks and a few strong artifacts) than Prophet of Kruphix (play critical mass of creatures or instants and defense for the most fragile card type) and more synergy than Mox Ruby. So clearly there is a spectrum.
UW Ephara Hatebears [Primer], GB Gitrog Lands, BRU Inalla Combo-Control, URG Maelstrom Wanderer Landfall
(i'd say that black lotus, library of alexandria should also be in that list, but i digress)
i think cards like karakas just happens to interact poorly with the format. It's not THAT amazing for what it does, but the fact that it bounces a legendary permanent without much of a cost just doesn't jibe well.
In that respect, the combination of being able to essentially play a turn during each other player's turns in a multiplayer format is also interacting poorly with the format. In a heads up 1v1, having 1 extra turn during an opponent's turn is good, but not game-breaking. Being able to do that 3 times for each 1 turn an opponent has is just backbreaking. Having 1 card that can do both of these abilities just warps any multiplayer format too significantly for it to stay unbanned for long.
Legacy - Solidarity - mono U aggro - burn - Imperial Painter - Strawberry Shortcake - Bluuzards - bom
Karakas while it does interact poorly with the format has basically zero deckbuilding constraints except "be playing white so you can include it." But I could see making some narrow cases there around how many utility lands you can include in a 5c deck but I think it's probably still correct to play over a basic plains
Library requires your deck to want to stay at 7 cards most of the time, otherwise it's worse than other utility lands. Not all decks want to do that. For example Library will conflict with very low curve artifact and dork decks that will not want to sit at 7 cards every turn drawing. Opportunity cost of a colorless land is fairly high compared to Karakas.
UW Ephara Hatebears [Primer], GB Gitrog Lands, BRU Inalla Combo-Control, URG Maelstrom Wanderer Landfall
Misc. EDH Stuff: Commander Cube | Zombies (Horde)
Resources:Commander Rulings FAQ | Commander Deckbuilding Guide
Follow me on Twitter! @cryogen_mtg
One could make a pretty strong argument that Balance and Tolarian Academy require more deckbuilding support than PoK, and these are among the more serious offenders on the banlist.
UW Ephara Hatebears [Primer], GB Gitrog Lands, BRU Inalla Combo-Control, URG Maelstrom Wanderer Landfall
I don't mind talking about other cards as they compare to Card X, but was getting pretty focused on other cards.
Misc. EDH Stuff: Commander Cube | Zombies (Horde)
Resources:Commander Rulings FAQ | Commander Deckbuilding Guide
Follow me on Twitter! @cryogen_mtg
Say you only have five lands with PoK out in a four player game. You basically have equivalent of 20 lands worth of mana that is broken in increments of 5 across 4 turns. Have a Llanowar Elf out alongside PoK? Equivalent of 24 lands of mana in increments of 6 across 4 turns. Everyone else might be at 4-7 lands with 0-3 mana rocks, but they aren't multiplying their mana based on how many players exist within the game while also vomiting the creatures from their hand during every player's turn unless they are also running PoK.
Too much mana too quickly is definitely one of the ban criteria that pok is an offender for imho. Probably a 3-4/10 but definitely a part of its banning if I had to guess. It has a ton of issues.
UW Ephara Hatebears [Primer], GB Gitrog Lands, BRU Inalla Combo-Control, URG Maelstrom Wanderer Landfall
My momir vig deck was wild with prophet and undefeated whil the card was in the deck - save one game when a geth deck reanimated....my prophet.
I have a mudrotha stax build that would be ecstatic to run a way to untap my lands under winter/static orb.
I have an Estrid deck that is built around untapping thing, so obvious include, the deck would still be bad...but I digress.
But while I would be glad for being able to use one of my favorite cards, I can state without a doubt that it would simply ruin games with or without a dedicated deck because no game it lands in is unaffected -every removal spell goes to it, every theft or reanimation, it is worth a wrath all on its own, and it does all this with lands untapped ready to counter what you throw at it since it is also blue.
Links to my most current deck lists;
Primary EDH; Rakka Mar Token Perfection, Crosis Mnemonic Betrayal, Cromat Villainous, Judith Gravestorm, Rakdos Empty Storm, Exava Artifacts, Bant Trash, & Fumiko Voltron!
EDH kept at home; Ruzzian Isset & Rakdos LoR!
EDH (nostalgic/pimp/retired) in storage;
Latulla Burns, Akroma Smash, Jeska Voltron, Rakdos Storm, Bladewing Darghans, Lyzolda Worldgorger, Xantcha Steals your Heart, Jori Storm, Wydwen Permission, Gwendlyn Paradox, Jeleva Warps, & Sigarda Brick!
Legacy Showanimator and High Tide!
Onering's 4 simple steps that let you solve any problem with Magic's gameplay
Step 1: Identify the problem. What aspect of Magic don't you like? Step 2: Find out how others deal with the problem. How do players deal with this aspect of the game when they run into it? Step 3: Do what those players do. Step 4: No more problem. Bonus: You are now better at Magic. Enjoy those extra wins!
The part that pushes her over the top is the flash to all creatures. This basically means if she isn't killed before passing turn the owner basically gets to time walk after ever opponent tries to end their turn. Her flash extends to the command zone, so untapping with any green/blue/x creature style general (prime speaker zegana/Momir/Thrasios/ -enormous list here- ) means that the player will get value even if prophet is killed a turn late. Those decks can also just cast clone style effects or whatever other common protection option they have to keep PoK around.
The common argument my friend used to make was that he could just play seedborn muse and teferi, mage of zhalfir, so why not unban PoK. Stuffing those two cards on one body that can be grabbed with chord/green sun's zenith is my tables typical reply.
Links to my most current deck lists;
Primary EDH; Rakka Mar Token Perfection, Crosis Mnemonic Betrayal, Cromat Villainous, Judith Gravestorm, Rakdos Empty Storm, Exava Artifacts, Bant Trash, & Fumiko Voltron!
EDH kept at home; Ruzzian Isset & Rakdos LoR!
EDH (nostalgic/pimp/retired) in storage;
Latulla Burns, Akroma Smash, Jeska Voltron, Rakdos Storm, Bladewing Darghans, Lyzolda Worldgorger, Xantcha Steals your Heart, Jori Storm, Wydwen Permission, Gwendlyn Paradox, Jeleva Warps, & Sigarda Brick!
Legacy Showanimator and High Tide!
Chandra, Torch of Defiance - Oops! All Chandras.
Prime Speaker Zegana - Draw for Power.
Pir & Toothy - Counterpalooza.
Arcades, the Strategist - Another Brick in the Wall.
Zacama, Primal Calamity - Calamity of Double Mana.
Edgar Markov - Vampires Don't Die.
Child of Alara - Dreamcrusher.
Have no worries. PoK is staying where it is.
Sheldon, I will straight up say that I have a history of disagreeing with the RC. I liked tucking commanders, I want to play Sylvan Primordial and thought it was fine, banned as commander was good because Rofellos isn't that great in the 99 and the same would now apply to Leovold.
I give that preamble so you understand where I am coming from when I say that despite how much I love PoK, you guys made a good decision for the overall health of the format. Thank you.
You have no idea how loud my sigh of relief just was. Much appreciated.
Chandra, Torch of Defiance - Oops! All Chandras.
Prime Speaker Zegana - Draw for Power.
Pir & Toothy - Counterpalooza.
Arcades, the Strategist - Another Brick in the Wall.
Zacama, Primal Calamity - Calamity of Double Mana.
Edgar Markov - Vampires Don't Die.
Child of Alara - Dreamcrusher.
Two Score, Minus Two or: A Stargate Tail
(Image by totallynotabrony)
Not a lot of ways to do that in UG, just Momir Vig + UG creature + 4 mana vs. untapping with vannifar and a 4 drop in hand.
UW Ephara Hatebears [Primer], GB Gitrog Lands, BRU Inalla Combo-Control, URG Maelstrom Wanderer Landfall