Hello,
I want to eventually build a reanimation or token commander deck for my first commander deck, but I don't know where to start. Let's say I've picked a commander. Where do I go from there? I can't just search: Good commander removal, pick out some good cards, than move on. How do I know how many cards I need of each type like removal and draw? How do I find the actual cards? Thanks in advance.
For card selection to match a specific commander, you can check out edhrec.com. Type in the commander name, and it'll show you the cards most commonly run with that commander. You can filter by high or low budget and by specific strategies. You can even have it generate an "average list" for that commander, though I would never try building that. I personally use the site to see if there are any cool interactions I haven't thought of, and I build my own list sprinkled with ideas from there.
Gatherer is also a great resource for finding cards. You can search for specific words or card types or colors and just see what's out there (this does require more time and work than other methods, but it can also find gems that haven't become popular yet.
And there's always Google to simply look at other posted decks with that same commander or theme.
For how many cards that act as removal or draw, there are varying theories.
The simplest is probably 8x8 Theory. Pick eight things you want your deck to do. this can include things like Draw, Removal, Ramp, Combo Pieces, Tribal Support, whatever; you can even dedicate two slots to the same function. Then, for each slot, fill it with eight cards. That'll give you 64 cards, and once you add 36 land, you've got a 100-card deck.
The Command Zone offered up a formula years ago that you can find on YouTube, but in recent videos, they've mentioned that they have been tweaking the numbers, adding in more spot removal than they used to.
One big thing I've seen a lot of people forget is to build with a good mana curve. Even in Commander, the format of big, swingy plays, you need to make sure you have a good curve to be able to play things both early game and late.
So, out of curiosity, what commander have you picked? That may help us to make more specific suggestions.
Omg, thank you so much for writing this proper essay of a reply I will definitely use edhrec.com and do some searching through gatherer. I will research 8x8 theory and see if I can find the command zone formula and other things. I am going to research manacurve, as neglecting it has costed me dearly in previous decks. I am currently looking at either Ulasht, the Hate Seed or Nath of the Gilt-Leaf for a token commander. Thanks for replying!
This very subforum has important posts pinned as well for good reason. Use the bottom and locked one titled:
Official Threads and Commander Resources.
Within it, you will find countless resources. The two most important ones are probably:
•Big guide to building your EDH / Commander Deck
•Playing Commander to Win
They bith give advice on the format as a whole.
Also, a deck is never finished. Build something and play with it. Note its flaws and how you want to improve it. Winning is not the end game. Having a fun experience with friends is.
Some generic advice?
Ramp is important. Magic is a game of resource development. Spells are not free and the tempo of the game is bottlenecked by the casting cost of spells and your limit of one land per turn. Ramp allows you to break this parity, and trust me when I say that your opponents are going to use ramp. If you do not, or are not using enough, you will fall behind.
Card draw is also very important. While duels can be and are won with little to no card draw, they also end with the winner at zero cards in hand or very few. In multiplayer, if you beat one opponent down and used all of your respurces to do so like in a duel, you will be left dead in the water with two or more other opponents who are ready to finish you off.
Just as with ramp, card draw helps break the parity of only drawing once on your turn. Ramp will exhaust your rescources in hand, and card draw will replinish them.
In competitive games, decks try to win on turn 4 or so. In casual games, turns 1-4 are often kmown as the development stage. Turns 5-8 are when threats and answers are exchanged. Turns 9-12 are when Most players hit their end game. Sure, some groups and games go longer, but at that stage, players tend to get knocked out and the end game is reached.
Finally, and has been touched on by FunkyDragon, it helps to have plenty of low and mid cost spells. Sure, this is a format with big splashy plays, but as you will hear on The Command Zone, some of the most powerful turns are NOT those which one big spell was cast, but rather when multiple small spells were chained together.
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"Whatever style you wish to play, be it fast and frenzied or slow and tactical, the surest way to defeat your opponent consistently is by dominating him or her in the war of card advantage." - Brian Wiseman, April 1996
older more experienced players will feast on you if you don't have an in-depth knowledge of mechanics, interactions and meta. I personally love hosing netdeckers with my homebrew decks designed to take advantage of them. I'm not alone!
older more experienced players will feast on you if you don't have an in-depth knowledge of mechanics, interactions and meta. I personally love hosing netdeckers with my homebrew decks designed to take advantage of them. I'm not alone!
How is this relevant to net-decking though? Someone that knows the mechanics and ins-and-outs of the game will do better than someone who doesn't, both because they know the game better to make good plays, and because they know how to make a really good deck. Someone that decides to pick their cards from gatherer based on what looks fun won't magically make a better deck then someone who decides to head over to edhrec to see what worked for other people. Someone that reads through a primer on this forum and copies or mostly copies a deck here will probably do signifcantly better than either of the previous examples(and will probably play on a fairly even footing with someone that totally homegrew their decks by only opening packs and never even looking at the internet and used their elite knowledge and thousand of hours of playtesting to tune their deck), because they'll most likely have a fairly good understanding of their deck, even though it'd still be 'net-decking'.
@OP, you should definitely ignore any comments of derision about 'net-decking' or whatever. There is no best way to build a deck for a casual variant like commander, and most people don't have an encyclopedic knowledge of every card ever printed, so using online sources for example decks and card recommendations to help you find cards that work for your deck that you never even knew existed without those sources is perfectly fine.
Ulasht, the Hate Seed and Nath of the Gilt-Leaf each have their own strengths and weaknesses, as well as their own play style. While they share a common core of green (great for ramp and tokens), the red or black sides offer very different strategies. Just a few things to consider when choosing between them:
- On an empty board (perhaps just after a board wipe), Ulasht is useless; it requires at least a moderate board to even be worth casting. Nath can at least survive entering the battlefield on an empty board and, if he survives, can start generating value with no further mana investment.
- With deathtouch, Ulasht offers cheap creature removal. Nath is in the color of creature removal.
- Ulasht offers a vague suggestion of a deck based around tokens and +1/+1 counters but doesn't really dictate a specific strategy. This can be good for some players (who don't want to be railroaded) but bad for others (who may want a little structure to build around).
- Nath works best with discard support - that doesn't mean you can't build any other way, but it is the best way to get the most out of your commander. Discard can annoy people into targeting you, but it also takes away their resources to do so. Making Elf tokens also suggests an elf-ball build, which is a traditionally strong archetype.
- You mentioned in the original post that you were considering a reanimation or token commander - Nath's black mana allows you to dip your toes in both.
- If I sound biased at all (and I'm trying not to), it's because black is my favorite color. If you prefer red, choose that. What draws you toward each commander? Toward each color pairing? Go with the one that you think would be more interesting.
- In either case, I'd suggest finding some decklists online and starting a conversation with the builders to see what they like about their chosen commander or specific card choices. The beauty of Magic in general and Commander in particular is that the color pie and individual card selections allow you to craft a very personal experience. Do what you like.
Also, a deck is never finished. Build something and play with it. Note its flaws and how you want to improve it. Winning is not the end game. Having a fun experience with friends is.
Great advice. Don't wait to craft the perfect deck.
older more experienced players will feast on you if you don't have an in-depth knowledge of mechanics, interactions and meta. I personally love hosing netdeckers with my homebrew decks designed to take advantage of them. I'm not alone!
@OP, you should definitely ignore any comments of derision about 'net-decking' or whatever. There is no best way to build a deck for a casual variant like commander, and most people don't have an encyclopedic knowledge of every card ever printed, so using online sources for example decks and card recommendations to help you find cards that work for your deck that you never even knew existed without those sources is perfectly fine.
@OP
Despite the obvious emotional backlash to the facts I present, it would be bad advice to not acknowledge the reality of the aspects I mentioned in the EDH format, namely meta.
Meta not only relates to card selection but the mentality around their use
So regardless of the emotional reaction my statement of fact has provoked, to disregard the notion that older players will pick up on netdecking new players, and to not try to gain a better understanding of your card selection to avoid this scenario (aka to have a better playing experience) - is bad advice.
Ultimately, we all do as we please and hopefully you have some fun
older more experienced players will feast on you if you don't have an in-depth knowledge of mechanics, interactions and meta. I personally love hosing netdeckers with my homebrew decks designed to take advantage of them. I'm not alone!
@OP, you should definitely ignore any comments of derision about 'net-decking' or whatever. There is no best way to build a deck for a casual variant like commander, and most people don't have an encyclopedic knowledge of every card ever printed, so using online sources for example decks and card recommendations to help you find cards that work for your deck that you never even knew existed without those sources is perfectly fine.
@OP
Despite the obvious emotional backlash to the facts I present, it would be bad advice to not acknowledge the reality of the aspects I mentioned in the EDH format, namely meta.
Meta not only relates to card selection but the mentality around their use
So regardless of the emotional reaction my statement of fact has provoked, to disregard the notion that older players will pick up on netdecking new players, and to not try to gain a better understanding of your card selection to avoid this scenario (aka to have a better playing experience) - is bad advice.
Ultimately, we all do as we please and hopefully you have some fun
The reason for my 'emotional reaction' is that I really, really dislike gate-keeping, and that's what you seem to be doing. But maybe I'm completely reading your post wrong. How would you recommend a new player builds a deck that can allow them to stand up to the older players that don't need online sources?
The first step is to know what you want to do. Sometimes this means picking a Commander, and thinking of what you want to with it, sometimes it involves picking a strategy, and seeing what Commander will best support that.
Next depends on your budget, and your available cards. Sometimes you want to start with the cards you have, and just go through what you have and pull out anything that looks fun, interesting, might fit the strategy, are necessary pieces for those colors (removal) etc. Sometimes you'll start online instead, and find the cards that fit the strategy from online searches, and then try and see if you own them, or how to acquire them. Sometimes you're not sure of the strategy you want to follow, so you look up other lists online and see what people are doing with the card. Learning from repetition is absolutely valid, and every professional has learned in that manner. Artists copy good art, athletes learn proper forms, etc.
From there - practice, learn, tweak, adapt. Every playgroup is different, and what works well in one area may have different results elsewhere. Talk to the people you play with, see what they think about the deck - they might have suggestions or feedback. Don't be afraid to experiment, especially in the early phases. Some of my decks I purposefully made drastic changes to in order to really try out different things.
Finally, one great way to learn more is to simply ask for help! Create threads in these forums just as you did here, and say "Hey guys, I'm trying to find cards to achieve <this>, I've done a search for <this>, but I haven't found what I'm looking for. Is there something else I should search for, or that you'd recommend?" So on and so forth. Most of all, have fun with it! Don't be afraid to make your deck not perfect if it will be more fun. My Jori En deck runs Form of the Dragon, and my Trostani deck runs Sandwurm Convergence simply because they're fun.
I've built decks using every combination of those methods above. I've built from Commander first, and built from a strategy trying to find a Commander. I've pulled hundreds of cards from my collection, to building purely online then practically ordering 80% of a deck to my hands. Most important though is to play, and adjust.
When I build from my collection, it's not unusual for me to pull out many hundreds of cards more than what I need before cutting down and focusing on what I want. I've pulled over 600 cards once when building a deck, which actually helped me define what strategy I wanted to follow and even gave me the framework for a future deck to build a different strategy that I liked.
Online searches can be very powerful. I would suggest learning how to use these sites/systems to really refine what you want/need:
https://scryfall.com/ or https://magidex.com/ - Slightly more robust search engines, learning their search parameters can make it faster and easier to filter your results.
Deck Searches:
Check out the Primers on this site. They tend to be written to a higher level, and go beyond simply having a list of cards to explaining what they do and why they were chosen. This eliminates some of the guesswork involved.
Check out our Decklist Database. If you're looking for a particular commander, this can be a good place to start, as it'll put those available resources together.
EDHrec.com and tappedout.com both have Commander decklists and stats.
Here's a few quick stories:
When I built my Chainer deck I routinely changed between 3 different main commanders, but also tried 4 other Commanders periodically in the Commandzone before I really settled down on Chainer. When I started to build the deck, it was even a completely different Commander, and even different set of colors before I decided to simply go Mono-Black.
When I built my Marath deck, I initially built it with a lands matter/landfall package, as well as a sunforger package. In testing, I quickly discovered that the two both took up too much space from each other, and I needed to split them appart. I ended up taking out the lands package, and started building that up without a Commander - once I realized what I wanted to do with it, I found Trostani, and it is now one of my longest lasting and favorite decks.
I once built a deck purely online, and tested, iterated, and refined it with online tools to the point that I discovered it was too powerful for my meta, and I never built it in paper.
When I built my Jenara deck, I had no idea what I wanted- I had a few key 'must include' cards, but no huge idea of how to relate them to each other - I pulled over 600 cards and started organizing them into synergies before deciding how to complete my vision.
My Tibor and Lumia deck has been rebuilt five times as completely different strategies, but built around the same playstyle. Since then, new commanders have encapsulated the theme and soul of each of those iterations into a single card that does the job better than T&L even could hope to do.
Hello,
I want to eventually build a reanimation or token commander deck for my first commander deck, but I don't know where to start. Let's say I've picked a commander. Where do I go from there? I can't just search: Good commander removal, pick out some good cards, than move on. How do I know how many cards I need of each type like removal and draw? How do I find the actual cards? Thanks in advance.
Some of this comes down to knowledge, or preference. Some to searches. I've played and built enough decks that I know that I want certain cards in certain colors to handle my removal. For example, if I'm playing BW I know that I'll probably include Merciless Eviction and Vindicate or Utter End.
Much like the previously mentioned 8x8 method, I tend to start similarly, but I like to have 40 lands as a base start, so I do 10's:
10 Ramp, 10 Draw, 10 Removal, 10 small threats, 10 medium threats, 10 large threats. Of course, certain things may cross categories, so you might end up with more representation of each in your deck, for example adding Bloodgift Demon to your medium threats means you'll have a better chance of getting card draw in your games, while if you count it in your card draw, you might up your threat density.
I used that system to build a deck for my (then 10yr old) nephew, and the deck works quite well.
When it comes to removal, I like to also keep in mind what type of removal. I typically run 2-4 single target creature removal, 2-3 artifact/enchantment removal, 1-2 catch-alls, and 2-3 mass removal. You'll also want a mix of destroy/exile/shuffle, etc, in order to deal with things that are indestructible, etc. These may overlap some too. For example, in BW my removal package may look like:
Adding a heavy discard element to your deck in order to utilize his ability more. Cards that make your opponent discard, or gain value when they do, like Larceny, Liliana's Caress, or Waste Not. However, this will make you a prime target, and makes you more reliant on your Commander to get value.
Utilizing some Elf synergies in order to make the tokens more powerful. Imperial Prefect and similar cards could be quite potent.
Using him as a starting point for tokens, but making the deck less reliant on the Commander, and going more large scale token swarm to utilize Overrun abilities.
Using the black identity to focus less on the swarm aspect of tokens, and utilize Nath as more of a constant source of sacrificial tokens for effect like Attrition, Blood Artist, and Gravepact.
Or it could be a mix of all of the above!
While Nath seems more slow and steady to me, Ulasht seems to want to go bigger, faster. Ulasht needs more creatures out first to get the counters, but opens up different avenues of play:
You can play with +1 counter synergies.
or make a multicolor dependent deck (creatures that are both red AND green will provide Ulasht a +1 counter TWICE, so give better value)
or go bigger mana to use his ability more (Wood Elves early to get lands out, but still count as a creature later for Ulasht trigger)
You can also go for a combo route: Ivy lane Denizen will combo with Ulasht, as you'll remove a counter from Ulasht to make a token, but then Ivy lane will see the token made, and put a +1 counter back on Ulasht, allowing you to keep making more tokens.
As you can see, there's lots of ways to build both of these, and this is just what I can think off the top of my head real fast. As you play them, you'll figure out even more ways to play/build them, and find what works best for you.
When I make a deck, I always ensure there's enough draws and removals first and foremost (I learn that from Jolt539), because without them your deck could not executes its topnotch style; style and uniqueness are to be revered.
I also make sure that all cards have at least two other cards which it could synergize. If your commander is one of those cards, props to deck cohesion. If not, I'd raise its number of associates to THREE cards, just so it'd never be dead. Cards with difficult maintenance cost such as Contamination (in a multi-color deck) would require even more associates to justify.
i aim for synergistic cards first, then i squeeze in staples again favoring synergy as much as possible while being sure to aim for ramp, removal, and draw power. it's also important to evaluate wincons. you can have a really fun deck to play, and play against, that never wins because its actually not doing anything. for me, its all about the commander, if i can put any commander in those colors at the helm and it plays the exact same then its not a deck worth playing/building.
seriously though, dont' forget removal. spot removal is important.
edhrec is a good baseline, but it can be very overwhelming and start to feel samey. like you feel obligated to run certain cards since so many decks run that card... but the reality is a lot of the time people are wrong and just go with it because everyone else did. hence, a good place for ideas. i also look at primers and posts on here, tapped out, and sometimes reddit. you can also find some good stuff just by searching a database for parameters you want, like every green card that mentions +1/+1 counters for instance.
most importantly though? build it. once you have some kind of idea. build it. play it. tweak it. don't be afraid to add or remove cards. play it some more. think about what worked and what didn't. then change it. i often see people run something, and its their pet card, they love it, its so great! ...and they don't even realize they never actually cast it, or the one time they did it actually didn't do anything, and they refuse to cut it for something that might because OMG ITS SO GOOD
did i mention spot removal?
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I want to eventually build a reanimation or token commander deck for my first commander deck, but I don't know where to start. Let's say I've picked a commander. Where do I go from there? I can't just search: Good commander removal, pick out some good cards, than move on. How do I know how many cards I need of each type like removal and draw? How do I find the actual cards? Thanks in advance.
For card selection to match a specific commander, you can check out edhrec.com. Type in the commander name, and it'll show you the cards most commonly run with that commander. You can filter by high or low budget and by specific strategies. You can even have it generate an "average list" for that commander, though I would never try building that. I personally use the site to see if there are any cool interactions I haven't thought of, and I build my own list sprinkled with ideas from there.
Gatherer is also a great resource for finding cards. You can search for specific words or card types or colors and just see what's out there (this does require more time and work than other methods, but it can also find gems that haven't become popular yet.
And there's always Google to simply look at other posted decks with that same commander or theme.
For how many cards that act as removal or draw, there are varying theories.
The simplest is probably 8x8 Theory. Pick eight things you want your deck to do. this can include things like Draw, Removal, Ramp, Combo Pieces, Tribal Support, whatever; you can even dedicate two slots to the same function. Then, for each slot, fill it with eight cards. That'll give you 64 cards, and once you add 36 land, you've got a 100-card deck.
The Command Zone offered up a formula years ago that you can find on YouTube, but in recent videos, they've mentioned that they have been tweaking the numbers, adding in more spot removal than they used to.
One big thing I've seen a lot of people forget is to build with a good mana curve. Even in Commander, the format of big, swingy plays, you need to make sure you have a good curve to be able to play things both early game and late.
So, out of curiosity, what commander have you picked? That may help us to make more specific suggestions.
2023 Average Peasant Cube|and Discussion
Because I have more decks than fit in a signature
Useful Resources:
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ManabaseCrafter
Official Threads and Commander Resources.
Within it, you will find countless resources. The two most important ones are probably:
•Big guide to building your EDH / Commander Deck
•Playing Commander to Win
They bith give advice on the format as a whole.
Also, a deck is never finished. Build something and play with it. Note its flaws and how you want to improve it. Winning is not the end game. Having a fun experience with friends is.
Some generic advice?
Ramp is important. Magic is a game of resource development. Spells are not free and the tempo of the game is bottlenecked by the casting cost of spells and your limit of one land per turn. Ramp allows you to break this parity, and trust me when I say that your opponents are going to use ramp. If you do not, or are not using enough, you will fall behind.
Card draw is also very important. While duels can be and are won with little to no card draw, they also end with the winner at zero cards in hand or very few. In multiplayer, if you beat one opponent down and used all of your respurces to do so like in a duel, you will be left dead in the water with two or more other opponents who are ready to finish you off.
Just as with ramp, card draw helps break the parity of only drawing once on your turn. Ramp will exhaust your rescources in hand, and card draw will replinish them.
In competitive games, decks try to win on turn 4 or so. In casual games, turns 1-4 are often kmown as the development stage. Turns 5-8 are when threats and answers are exchanged. Turns 9-12 are when Most players hit their end game. Sure, some groups and games go longer, but at that stage, players tend to get knocked out and the end game is reached.
Finally, and has been touched on by FunkyDragon, it helps to have plenty of low and mid cost spells. Sure, this is a format with big splashy plays, but as you will hear on The Command Zone, some of the most powerful turns are NOT those which one big spell was cast, but rather when multiple small spells were chained together.
older more experienced players will feast on you if you don't have an in-depth knowledge of mechanics, interactions and meta. I personally love hosing netdeckers with my homebrew decks designed to take advantage of them. I'm not alone!
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/magic-fundamentals/magic-general/334931-what-is-the-most-pimp-card-deck-youve-seen-or?comment=5361
Commander
RGOmnath, Locus of Rage Grenades! EDHGR
UWSygg's Defense, EDH - Voltron & ControlWU
BUGMimeoplasm EDH ft. Ifnir Cycling-discard comboBUG
WBTeysa, Connoisseur of CullingBW
BWSelenia & Recruiter of the Guard suicice combo EDHWB
UBRWGO-Kagachi - 5 Color Enchantments - EDHUBRWG
How is this relevant to net-decking though? Someone that knows the mechanics and ins-and-outs of the game will do better than someone who doesn't, both because they know the game better to make good plays, and because they know how to make a really good deck. Someone that decides to pick their cards from gatherer based on what looks fun won't magically make a better deck then someone who decides to head over to edhrec to see what worked for other people. Someone that reads through a primer on this forum and copies or mostly copies a deck here will probably do signifcantly better than either of the previous examples(and will probably play on a fairly even footing with someone that totally homegrew their decks by only opening packs and never even looking at the internet and used their elite knowledge and thousand of hours of playtesting to tune their deck), because they'll most likely have a fairly good understanding of their deck, even though it'd still be 'net-decking'.
@OP, you should definitely ignore any comments of derision about 'net-decking' or whatever. There is no best way to build a deck for a casual variant like commander, and most people don't have an encyclopedic knowledge of every card ever printed, so using online sources for example decks and card recommendations to help you find cards that work for your deck that you never even knew existed without those sources is perfectly fine.
- On an empty board (perhaps just after a board wipe), Ulasht is useless; it requires at least a moderate board to even be worth casting. Nath can at least survive entering the battlefield on an empty board and, if he survives, can start generating value with no further mana investment.
- With deathtouch, Ulasht offers cheap creature removal. Nath is in the color of creature removal.
- Ulasht offers a vague suggestion of a deck based around tokens and +1/+1 counters but doesn't really dictate a specific strategy. This can be good for some players (who don't want to be railroaded) but bad for others (who may want a little structure to build around).
- Nath works best with discard support - that doesn't mean you can't build any other way, but it is the best way to get the most out of your commander. Discard can annoy people into targeting you, but it also takes away their resources to do so. Making Elf tokens also suggests an elf-ball build, which is a traditionally strong archetype.
- You mentioned in the original post that you were considering a reanimation or token commander - Nath's black mana allows you to dip your toes in both.
- If I sound biased at all (and I'm trying not to), it's because black is my favorite color. If you prefer red, choose that. What draws you toward each commander? Toward each color pairing? Go with the one that you think would be more interesting.
- In either case, I'd suggest finding some decklists online and starting a conversation with the builders to see what they like about their chosen commander or specific card choices. The beauty of Magic in general and Commander in particular is that the color pie and individual card selections allow you to craft a very personal experience. Do what you like. Great advice. Don't wait to craft the perfect deck.
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Useful Resources:
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EDHREC
ManabaseCrafter
@OP
Despite the obvious emotional backlash to the facts I present, it would be bad advice to not acknowledge the reality of the aspects I mentioned in the EDH format, namely meta.
Meta not only relates to card selection but the mentality around their use
So regardless of the emotional reaction my statement of fact has provoked, to disregard the notion that older players will pick up on netdecking new players, and to not try to gain a better understanding of your card selection to avoid this scenario (aka to have a better playing experience) - is bad advice.
Ultimately, we all do as we please and hopefully you have some fun
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/magic-fundamentals/magic-general/334931-what-is-the-most-pimp-card-deck-youve-seen-or?comment=5361
Commander
RGOmnath, Locus of Rage Grenades! EDHGR
UWSygg's Defense, EDH - Voltron & ControlWU
BUGMimeoplasm EDH ft. Ifnir Cycling-discard comboBUG
WBTeysa, Connoisseur of CullingBW
BWSelenia & Recruiter of the Guard suicice combo EDHWB
UBRWGO-Kagachi - 5 Color Enchantments - EDHUBRWG
The reason for my 'emotional reaction' is that I really, really dislike gate-keeping, and that's what you seem to be doing. But maybe I'm completely reading your post wrong. How would you recommend a new player builds a deck that can allow them to stand up to the older players that don't need online sources?
Next depends on your budget, and your available cards. Sometimes you want to start with the cards you have, and just go through what you have and pull out anything that looks fun, interesting, might fit the strategy, are necessary pieces for those colors (removal) etc. Sometimes you'll start online instead, and find the cards that fit the strategy from online searches, and then try and see if you own them, or how to acquire them. Sometimes you're not sure of the strategy you want to follow, so you look up other lists online and see what people are doing with the card. Learning from repetition is absolutely valid, and every professional has learned in that manner. Artists copy good art, athletes learn proper forms, etc.
From there - practice, learn, tweak, adapt. Every playgroup is different, and what works well in one area may have different results elsewhere. Talk to the people you play with, see what they think about the deck - they might have suggestions or feedback. Don't be afraid to experiment, especially in the early phases. Some of my decks I purposefully made drastic changes to in order to really try out different things.
Finally, one great way to learn more is to simply ask for help! Create threads in these forums just as you did here, and say "Hey guys, I'm trying to find cards to achieve <this>, I've done a search for <this>, but I haven't found what I'm looking for. Is there something else I should search for, or that you'd recommend?" So on and so forth. Most of all, have fun with it! Don't be afraid to make your deck not perfect if it will be more fun. My Jori En deck runs Form of the Dragon, and my Trostani deck runs Sandwurm Convergence simply because they're fun.
I've built decks using every combination of those methods above. I've built from Commander first, and built from a strategy trying to find a Commander. I've pulled hundreds of cards from my collection, to building purely online then practically ordering 80% of a deck to my hands. Most important though is to play, and adjust.
When I build from my collection, it's not unusual for me to pull out many hundreds of cards more than what I need before cutting down and focusing on what I want. I've pulled over 600 cards once when building a deck, which actually helped me define what strategy I wanted to follow and even gave me the framework for a future deck to build a different strategy that I liked.
Online searches can be very powerful. I would suggest learning how to use these sites/systems to really refine what you want/need:
Here's a few quick stories:
Some of this comes down to knowledge, or preference. Some to searches. I've played and built enough decks that I know that I want certain cards in certain colors to handle my removal. For example, if I'm playing BW I know that I'll probably include Merciless Eviction and Vindicate or Utter End.
Much like the previously mentioned 8x8 method, I tend to start similarly, but I like to have 40 lands as a base start, so I do 10's:
10 Ramp, 10 Draw, 10 Removal, 10 small threats, 10 medium threats, 10 large threats. Of course, certain things may cross categories, so you might end up with more representation of each in your deck, for example adding Bloodgift Demon to your medium threats means you'll have a better chance of getting card draw in your games, while if you count it in your card draw, you might up your threat density.
I used that system to build a deck for my (then 10yr old) nephew, and the deck works quite well.
When it comes to removal, I like to also keep in mind what type of removal. I typically run 2-4 single target creature removal, 2-3 artifact/enchantment removal, 1-2 catch-alls, and 2-3 mass removal. You'll also want a mix of destroy/exile/shuffle, etc, in order to deal with things that are indestructible, etc. These may overlap some too. For example, in BW my removal package may look like:
1 Tragic Slip - Single Creature Removal
1 Murder - Single Creature Removal
1 Return to dust - Artifact/Ench Removal
1 Crush Contraband - Artifact/Ench Removal
1 Generous Gift - Catch All
1 Utter End - Catch All
1 Merciless Eviction - Mass Removal
1 Tragic Arrogance - Mass Removal
1 Hour of Revelation - Mass Removal
I might then also have cards like Cavalier of Dawn or Dark Impostor in my threats as well.
These are great choices for a token Commander! I do agree with previous posters that you may want to look at how you'd play them differently though.
For example, with Nath of the Gilt-Leaf you might look into:
While Nath seems more slow and steady to me, Ulasht seems to want to go bigger, faster. Ulasht needs more creatures out first to get the counters, but opens up different avenues of play:
As you can see, there's lots of ways to build both of these, and this is just what I can think off the top of my head real fast. As you play them, you'll figure out even more ways to play/build them, and find what works best for you.
Retired EDH - Tibor and Lumia | [PR]Nemata |Ramirez dePietro | [C]Edric | Riku | Jenara | Lazav | Heliod | Daxos | Roon | Kozilek
I also make sure that all cards have at least two other cards which it could synergize. If your commander is one of those cards, props to deck cohesion. If not, I'd raise its number of associates to THREE cards, just so it'd never be dead. Cards with difficult maintenance cost such as Contamination (in a multi-color deck) would require even more associates to justify.
Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest WUR Voltron Control
Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun WU Unblockable Mirror Trickery
Ra's al Ghul (Sidar Kondo) and Face-Down Ninjas
Brudiclad, Token Engineer
Vaevictis (VV2) the Dire Lantern
Rona, Disciple of Gix
Tiana the Auror
Hallar
Ulrich the Politician
Zur the Rebel
Scorpion, Locust, Scarab, Egyptian Gods
O-Kagachi, Mathas, Mairsil
"Non-Tribal" Tribal Generals, Eggs
seriously though, dont' forget removal. spot removal is important.
edhrec is a good baseline, but it can be very overwhelming and start to feel samey. like you feel obligated to run certain cards since so many decks run that card... but the reality is a lot of the time people are wrong and just go with it because everyone else did. hence, a good place for ideas. i also look at primers and posts on here, tapped out, and sometimes reddit. you can also find some good stuff just by searching a database for parameters you want, like every green card that mentions +1/+1 counters for instance.
most importantly though? build it. once you have some kind of idea. build it. play it. tweak it. don't be afraid to add or remove cards. play it some more. think about what worked and what didn't. then change it. i often see people run something, and its their pet card, they love it, its so great! ...and they don't even realize they never actually cast it, or the one time they did it actually didn't do anything, and they refuse to cut it for something that might because OMG ITS SO GOOD
did i mention spot removal?