Hey everyone, I'm compiling a bunch of "best of" staples lists, and thought I would turn to the experts. So post your favorite and best cards of the following:
Ramp & mana fixing
Removal
Tutors
Card draw
Graveyard hate
Recursion
Please include the category, even though it should be obvious it will just help me filter. No answer is wrong and this isn't a place for debate, I'll be subjectively making final lists. Thanks in advance!
How i feel about competitive players and casual players in EDH: The competitive are german tourists, the casual are italian tourists, both in a italian beach. The italians asking themselves "why are the germans here?" make a legitimate question, the answer is because the beach is beautiful, no matter the country you came from. The italians wanting to ban the germans are dumb, because if the germans pay for their stay and follow the rules like everyone else, they have the right to be in the beach. Hovewer, if the germans started to ask themselves "why are the italians here?"... they would be dumb as hell.
These all vary wildly with decks. I'm going for most generally useful, but this is still so broad that it's difficult to answer in places. For context, I'm usually on the high power end of the casual spectrum. I don't play a lot of cards that would be considered format staples (mostly fast mana, unrestricted tutors, and a handful of staples that get frequent complaints), but do still like having good support pieces for the jank that makes up most of my deck.
Ramp - Cheap ramp that also has the potential to fix colors trumps more expensive, larger options most times
Tutors - My preference runs to more restrictive tutors. Cards like Demonic Tutor and Vampiric Tutor are best in class by a large margin, which makes discussing them kind of boring.
Card draw - Again, my preferences run to efficiency more than anything. Some large burst draw and draw engines are good to have, but less important to a lot of decks
There is no hidden motive here, I'm working on a somewhat comprehensive guide to the ""best of" to help new players, so the more you throw at me the less likely I'll overlook something obvious.
Hey everyone, I'm compiling a bunch of "best of" staples lists, and thought I would turn to the experts. So post your favorite and best cards of the following:
Ramp & mana fixing
Removal
Tutors
Card draw
Graveyard hate
Recursion
So, we're just glossing over Sol Ring and Mana Crypt? If so, then put me down for Thawing Glaciers.
So many! I want to pick off-the-wall cards, but, I'm sure most of these have been well-explored. These are favourites, rather than best (necessarily).
Ramp & mana fixing: Wayfarer's Bauble. It's any colour, relatively budget.
Removal: Silence the Believers, exile, torches auras, surprisingly effective.
Tutors: Demonic Tutor. It's really hard to beat the mana cost on it.
Card draw: Greed. Among the Magic cards in my formative stage, this card (before Necropotence was printed) really solidified my love for Black.
Graveyard hate: Shred Memory, it's a personal favourite.
Recursion: Seasons Past, combos with tutors, feels like power-draw.
Ramp and Mana fixing: My "play additional land drops" ramp package in Gxx
This package is very strong, and includes a few not commonly used but extremely powerful (and underutilized cards). This package is exceptionally good for green based 5 color decks that do not want to load up on mana rocks due to a high sweeper quotient.
I notably did not include the support cards in there like loam, land tax, crucible, ramunap excavator, since not everybody wants fetch-based stuff.
(When discussing ramp it's a really good idea to talk about strategy as there're basically 4 different ramp packages I use - Land Drops, Artifacts, Dorks, and Spells - and I try usually to focus on one and then use the others only for curve filling).
Some high CMC batttlecruiser jank sneaks in from my favorites, but otherwise it's a lot of engines and efficiency. I clearly highly value bodies attached to my effects.
Let me preface this by saying there is a lot of nuance and circumstance that goes into what is the 'best' of something. To account for this, any such list needs to be excessively long, or provide caveats. The best option is likely to include 'sub-categories'.
On the note of categories, I feel these categories do not adequately account for the variety of variable effects.
Removal for example implies 'destroy' effects to remove a permanent, but does not clarify mass removal from targeted. Or what about counterspell effects, or proactive disruption, or discard?
What about cards that apply to multiple categories? List them multiple times for each category, or create a joint category? Create a list of cards, and tag them with appropriate categories and include a filter option?
Hey everyone, I'm compiling a bunch of "best of" staples lists, and thought I would turn to the experts. So post your favorite and best cards of the following:
Ramp & mana fixing
Removal
Please include the category, even though it should be obvious it will just help me filter. No answer is wrong and this isn't a place for debate, I'll be subjectively making final lists. Thanks in advance!
In general, I am defining best as "so good that it should be in every deck capable of using it". Some cards might be more powerful, but more niche. These are the staples that you just jam when you need, say, 3 more ramp spells or 2 more draw spells and don't care about any specific synergies.
RAMP AND FIXING: To me the key is to be as low in CMC yourself as possible. Paying 4 mana to ramp is hardly ramping. Paying 3 mana is a heavy cost and should come with heavy advantage to justify it. That's not to say cards like Gilded Lotus, Thran Dynamo, and Explosive Vegetation are bad but they aren't what I'd consider "best" and I do think they get run a little too often. At the same time, I don't love most creatures who tap for mana outside of specific decks - I think it's a mistake to play, say, Birds of Paradise or Llanowar Elves if your deck doesn't have some extra value from the body.
REMOVAL: To me, great removal hits as many of the following as possible. 1) Cheap - you are at a card deficit every time you use targeted removal in a multiplayer format, so you need to make that up in tempo; 2) Versatile - you come up against the weirdest threats in EDH and cards that hit a lot of things are valuable. 3) Instant - sorcery speed removal is awful in a multiplayer format. 4) Advantageous - again, you are at a card deficit so anything that soaks that by hitting several things OR drawing cards/leaving bodies gets a second glance. It's also a bit relative, as Black and White in general have more efficient removal than other colors and thus can be a bit more stingy in my picks.
This is my list exactly, if not for Sun Titan
Grave hate would have to be on theme for me to run it to be honest. RiP and Leyline would get my vote voor stricktly being the best though.
Ramp & mana fixing
Removal
Tutors
Card draw
Graveyard hate
Recursion
Please include the category, even though it should be obvious it will just help me filter. No answer is wrong and this isn't a place for debate, I'll be subjectively making final lists. Thanks in advance!
Misc. EDH Stuff: Commander Cube | Zombies (Horde)
Resources:Commander Rulings FAQ | Commander Deckbuilding Guide
Follow me on Twitter! @cryogen_mtg
Ramp: Smothering Tithe, Kynaios and Tiro of Meletis
Removal: Profane Procession
Tutors: Enlightened Tutor > the new group huggy one in the near future if I like it
Draw: K&T again
Graveyard Hate: Bojuka Bog
Recursion: Haakon, Stromgald Scourge
Untapped, color producing, two-drop mana rocks: the talisman cycle, the signet cycle
Fast mana: Kind of goes without saying, but it's not something I like to play in this format
Artifact/enchantment spot removal: Nature's Claim, Return to Nature
Artifact/enchantment sweepers: Austere Command, Bane of Progress
Creature spot removal: Swords to Plowshares, Path to Exile, Terminate
Creature sweepers: Toxic Deluge, Wrath of God/Damnation
Slightly larger draw: Night's Whisper, Painful Truths, Chart a Course
Largest draw: Recurring Insight, Sphinx's Revelation
Engines: Beast Whisperer, Guardian Project, Grim Haruspex, Necropotence (has to be mentioned, though it's higher power than I like to play)
Full GY: Scavenger Grounds, Nihil Spellbomb, Tormod's Crypt
Noncreature: Snapcaster Mage, Mission Briefing, Replenish
Removal: Despark, Decimate, Beast Within / Generous Gift
Tutors: None. Play them only if they're on theme for your deck.
Card draw: Mikokoro, Center of the Sea, Phyrexian Arena, Tatyova, Benthic Druid
Graveyard hate: Scavenger Grounds, Ashiok, Dream Render, Wheel of Sun and Moon
Recursion: Alesha, Who Smiles at Death, Gravewaker, Seasons Past
magicjudge.tumblr.com
GWU Angus Mackenzie's Fog of War GWU / B Sheoldred's Sleepless Cemetery B / R Ashling's Purifying Pilgrimage R
U Unesh's Sphinx Storm U / R Ib's Goblins: What It Says On The Tin R / UR Okaun & Zndrsplt Flip Out UR
Oathbreaker: UB Ashiok's Persistent Nightmare UB
Ramp & mana fixing:
Grim Monolith, Nature's lore, perilous forays
Removal
Wrath of God, Pernicious Deed, chaos warp
Tutors
Demonic Tutor, artificier's intuition, fauna shaman
Card draw
necropotence, skullclamp, Greater good
Graveyard hate
Bojuka Bog, Tormod's Crypt, Grafdigger's Cage
Recursion
Ill-gotten Gains, Regrowth, Sun Titan
Edit: spelling and skullclamp > beast whisperer
Misc. EDH Stuff: Commander Cube | Zombies (Horde)
Resources:Commander Rulings FAQ | Commander Deckbuilding Guide
Follow me on Twitter! @cryogen_mtg
Sakura-Tribe Elder, Sword of the Animist, Signets/Talismen
Removal
Beast Within/Generous Gift, Toxic Deluge, [c]Anguished Unmaking[c/]
Tutors
I only use them if they apply to the list I'm running. Sidisi, Undead Vizier is decent. Green Sun's Zenith is stalwart too.
Card Draw:
Necropotence, Phyrexian Arena, Greater Good, Consecrated Sphinx
Grave Hate
Bijuka Bog, Scavenging Ooze, Withered Wretch
Recursion
Living Death, Eternal Witness/Archaeomancer et al, Sun Titan , Emeria Shepherd
RIP me then I guess.
So, we're just glossing over Sol Ring and Mana Crypt? If so, then put me down for Thawing Glaciers.
Single or mass? Swords to Plowshares or Fire Covenant I guess.
Demonic Tutor...................
Scroll Rack w/ fetchlands.
Ravenous Trap and Leyline of the Void.
Disturbed Burial & Phyrexian Reclamation.
Steel Sabotage'ng Orbs of Mellowness since 2011.
Removal: Firestorm
Tutors: Grozoth
Card draw: Zedruu
Graveyard hate: Rest in Peace
Recursion: Mirror of Fate
Like half of my answers are helpful.
Best:
Ramp & mana fixing: Mana Crypt
Removal: Toxic Deluge
Tutors: Demonic Tutor
Card draw: Ad Nauseam
Graveyard hate: Ashiok, Dream Render
Recursion: Regrowth
Favorites:
Ramp & mana fixing: Chrome Mox
Removal: Chain of Vapor
Tutors: Intuition
Card draw: Mystic Remora
Graveyard hate: Leyline of the Void
Recursion: Noxious Revival
UGR Wanderer
UGB Tasigur Control
URB Jeleva Storm
RW Gisela Control
Ramp & mana fixing: Wayfarer's Bauble. It's any colour, relatively budget.
Removal: Silence the Believers, exile, torches auras, surprisingly effective.
Tutors: Demonic Tutor. It's really hard to beat the mana cost on it.
Card draw: Greed. Among the Magic cards in my formative stage, this card (before Necropotence was printed) really solidified my love for Black.
Graveyard hate: Shred Memory, it's a personal favourite.
Recursion: Seasons Past, combos with tutors, feels like power-draw.
http://www.commandercast.com/category/articles/generally-speaking
Follow me on Twitter: @generalspeak
This package is very strong, and includes a few not commonly used but extremely powerful (and underutilized cards). This package is exceptionally good for green based 5 color decks that do not want to load up on mana rocks due to a high sweeper quotient.
I notably did not include the support cards in there like loam, land tax, crucible, ramunap excavator, since not everybody wants fetch-based stuff.
(When discussing ramp it's a really good idea to talk about strategy as there're basically 4 different ramp packages I use - Land Drops, Artifacts, Dorks, and Spells - and I try usually to focus on one and then use the others only for curve filling).
Mana Fixing only
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Card Draw (raw spells)
Recursion
Removal non-counterspells
Removal- Counterspells
Tutors
Graveyard hate
UW Ephara Hatebears [Primer], GB Gitrog Lands, BRU Inalla Combo-Control, URG Maelstrom Wanderer Landfall
Land Ramp: burgeoning
Mana Dork: deathrite shaman
Mana Rock: mana crypt
Ritual: dark ritual
Mana fixing: I know this answer sucks... but a healthy dose of Fetches and ABUR lands
Creature Spot Removal: rending volley
Artifact/Enchantment Spot removal: natural state
Sweeper: toxic deluge
Complete Board Wipe: cyclonic rift
Best Counterspell: Mana drain
Tutor: demonic tutor
Ongoing Card draw: mystic remora
Mass Card Draw: ad nauseam
Best Card Filtering: Mirri's guile
Graveyard hate: extirpate (dont forget, is also a counter against Vampiric tutor et al.!)
Reanimation: reanimate
Utility card (multitool): Got a really strong feeling the new Tale's end is going to be an absolute house
Best Aggro Creature: serra ascendant
Best Defensive Creature: baleful strix
Best Hatebear: aven mindcensor
Best Mana Denial: stasis
Best Stax Card: null rod
Best Anti-Combo Card: flusterstorm
Most Oppressive Card: thrasios, triton hero. His threat hangs over a game like a looming shadow starting from turn two
Best Land Card: gaea's cradle
Best offensive Buff: tainted strike
Best Protection buff: aspect of mongoose
Most Degenerate Wincon: laboratory maniac
Most Degenerate Commander Card: Probably urza, lord high artificer. It breaks without even trying to break it.
Just my opinion of course, I'm sure many will agree with some and disagree on others I listed. Just my experience.
Ramp & Fixing: Sakura-Tribe Elder, Solemn Simulacrum, Signets
Removal: Toxic Deluge, Swords to Plowshares, Ashen Rider
Tutors: Demonic Tutor, Rune-Scarred Demon, Sidisi, Undead Vizier
Card Draw: Rhystic Study, Greater Good, Skullclamp
Graveyard Hate: Bojuka Bog, Scavenger Grounds, Relic of Progenitus
Recursion:Karador, Ghost Chieftain, Eternal Witness, Sun Titan
Some high CMC batttlecruiser jank sneaks in from my favorites, but otherwise it's a lot of engines and efficiency. I clearly highly value bodies attached to my effects.
On the note of categories, I feel these categories do not adequately account for the variety of variable effects.
Removal for example implies 'destroy' effects to remove a permanent, but does not clarify mass removal from targeted. Or what about counterspell effects, or proactive disruption, or discard?
What about cards that apply to multiple categories? List them multiple times for each category, or create a joint category? Create a list of cards, and tag them with appropriate categories and include a filter option?
Mana Crypt
Sol Ring
Mox Diamond
Nature's Lore
Three Visits
Sakura-Tribe Elder
Talisman Cycle
Fetch Land Cycle
Swords to Plowshares
Path to Exile
Abrupt Decay
Assassin's Trophy
Anguished Unmaking
Dismember
Lightning Bolt
Abrade
Generous Gift
Beast Within
Nature's Claim
Capsize
Cyclonic Rift
Toxic Deluge
Cataclysm
Pernicious Deed
The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
Demonic Tutor
Vampiric Tutor
Enlightened Tutor
Worldly Tutor
Mystical Tutor
Entomb
Grim Tutor
Trinket Mage
Tribute Mage
Trophy Mage
Stoneforge Mystic
Imperial Recruiter
Recruiter of the Guard
Protean Hulk
Intuition
Survival of the Fittest
Night's Whisper
Sign in Blood
Ad Nauseam
Necropotence
Sylvan Library
Mystic Remora
Rhystic Study
Painful Truths
Fact or Fiction
Dig Through Time
Pull from Tomorrow
Ashiok, Dream Render
Nihil Spellbomb
Remorseful Cleric
Withered Wretch
Scavenging Ooze
Kaya's Guile
Rest in Peace
Coffin Queen
Reanimate
Necromancy
Eternal Witness
Regrowth
Snapcaster Mage
Mission Briefing
Muldrotha, the Gravetide
Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed
Yawgmoth's Will
A Dying Wish
To Rise Again
Chainer, Dementia Master
Muldrotha, the Gravetide
Atraxa, Praetors' Voice
Removal: Path to Exile, Swords to Plowshares, Murderous Cut, Supreme Verdict
Tutors : Demonic Tutor, Sidisi, Undead Vizier, Protean Hulk, Chord of Calling
Card draw: Night's Whisper, Treasure Cruise, Mystic Remora, Rhystic Study
Graveyard hate: Leyline of the Void, Bojuka Bog, Relic of Progenitus, Remorseful Cleric
Recursion: Sun Titan, Reveillark, Muldrotha/Karador/Marchesa/Meren, Phyrexian Reclamation
8.RG Green Devotion Ramp/Combo 9.UR Draw Triggers 10.WUR Group stalling 11.WUR Voltron Spellslinger 12.WB Sacrificial Shenanigans
13.BR Creatureless Panharmonicon 14.BR Pingers and Eldrazi 15.URG Untapped Cascading
16.Reyhan, last of the Abzan's WUBG +1/+1 Counter Craziness 17.WUBRG Dragons aka Why did I make this?
Building: The Gitrog Monster lands, Glissa the Traitor stax, Muldrotha, the Gravetide Planeswalker Combo, Kydele, Chosen of Kruphix + Sidar Kondo of Jamuraa Clues, and Tribal Scarecrow Planeswalkers
In general, I am defining best as "so good that it should be in every deck capable of using it". Some cards might be more powerful, but more niche. These are the staples that you just jam when you need, say, 3 more ramp spells or 2 more draw spells and don't care about any specific synergies.
RAMP AND FIXING: To me the key is to be as low in CMC yourself as possible. Paying 4 mana to ramp is hardly ramping. Paying 3 mana is a heavy cost and should come with heavy advantage to justify it. That's not to say cards like Gilded Lotus, Thran Dynamo, and Explosive Vegetation are bad but they aren't what I'd consider "best" and I do think they get run a little too often. At the same time, I don't love most creatures who tap for mana outside of specific decks - I think it's a mistake to play, say, Birds of Paradise or Llanowar Elves if your deck doesn't have some extra value from the body.
2 Farseek
2 Nature's Lore
2 Rampant Growth
2 Sakura-Tribe Elder
2 Three Visits
3 Cultivate
3 Kodama's Reach
3 Wood Elves
0 Mana Crypt
0 Everflowing Chalice
1 Expedition Map
1 Mana Vault
1 Wayfarer's Bauble
1 Sol Ring
2 Coldsteel Heart
2 Azorius Signet (and the rest)
2 Talisman of Dominance (and the rest)
2 Mind Stone
3 Coalition Relic
3 Worn Powerstone
4 Solemn Simulacrum
REMOVAL: To me, great removal hits as many of the following as possible. 1) Cheap - you are at a card deficit every time you use targeted removal in a multiplayer format, so you need to make that up in tempo; 2) Versatile - you come up against the weirdest threats in EDH and cards that hit a lot of things are valuable. 3) Instant - sorcery speed removal is awful in a multiplayer format. 4) Advantageous - again, you are at a card deficit so anything that soaks that by hitting several things OR drawing cards/leaving bodies gets a second glance. It's also a bit relative, as Black and White in general have more efficient removal than other colors and thus can be a bit more stingy in my picks.
1 Condemn
1 Path to Exile
1 Swords to Plowshares
2 Winds of Abandon
3 Oblation
3 Generous Gift
4 Return to Dust
BLUE:
1 Rapid Hybridization
1 Pongify
1 Swan Song
2 Arcane Denial
2 Counterspell
2 Mana Drain
2 Reality Shift
2 Negate
2 Tale's End
3 Force of Negation
3 Imprisoned in the Moon
5 Force of Will
5 Treachery
1 Tragic Slip
2 Doom Blade
2 Go for the Throat
3 Ashes to Ashes
3 Reckless Spite
3 Bone Shredder
4 Ravenous Chupacabra
4 Snuff Out
5 Shriekmaw
6 Curtains' Call
RED:
1 Lightning Bolt
1 Vandalblast
2 Lava Coil
2 Mizzium Mortars
3 Chaos Warp
4 Aftershock
1 Caustic Caterpillar
3 Beast Within
3 Reclamation Sage
3 Song of the Dryads
4 Force of Vigor
5 Acidic Slime
MULTI:
2 Hull Breach
3 Anguished Unmaking
3 Mortify
3 Putrefy
3 Maelstrom Pulse
3 Vindicate
4 Decimate
6 Casualties of War
RCRDaretti: Superfriends Forever RCR
WGBDoran: Ent-mootWBG
GGGMultani: Group Bear HugGGG
GB(B/G)The Gitrog Monster: Dredgefall DurdleGB(B/G)
RGWGahiji, the Honored Group Hug MonsterRGW
UB(U/B)Yuriko, Ninja Trinket AggroUB(U/B)
WUBRGAtogatog: Assembling a OHKOWUBRG
Removal - Beast Within
Tutors - Demonic Tutor - Boring I know, but not a huge fan of tutors and it gets the job done.
Card draw - Rhystic Study
Graveyard hate - Scavenging Ooze
Recursion - Eternal Witness
Ramp & Mana Fixing: Chromatic Lantern, Land Tax, Hour of Promise
Removal: Beast Within, Anguished Unmaking, Generous Gift
Tutors: Sidisi, Undead Vizier, Mystical Tutor, Enlightened Tutor
Card Draw: Rhystic Study, Mulldrifter, Rishkar's Expertise
Graveyard Hate: Bojuka Bog, Scavenging Ooze, Rest In Peace
Recursion: Sun Titan, Eternal Witness, Seasons Past
Currently Playing:
Multiplayer EDH Lists (click italics for a link to the thread!)
[Primer] Lord of Tresserhorn - Don't Tell Me What I Can't Do[Primer] Roon of the Hidden Realm - Rhino Blink
5 Color Tribal Guide (Slivers, Atogs, Allies, Spirits)
Also Playing (most decklists can be found on my profile)
MarathGeistKamahlGrenzoBolasThassaGitrog
PiratesZurVial Smasher&ThrasiosYennettJhoira(cEDH)Strix(Pauper)
Legacy: Maverick
Modern:
Melira PodRIP 1/19/15GWHatebearsThis is my list exactly, if not for Sun Titan
Grave hate would have to be on theme for me to run it to be honest. RiP and Leyline would get my vote voor stricktly being the best though.
Modern: WUBRG Humans - GBW Traverse - GWU Knightfall - GRW Bushwhacker Zoo -
Misc. EDH Stuff: Commander Cube | Zombies (Horde)
Resources:Commander Rulings FAQ | Commander Deckbuilding Guide
Follow me on Twitter! @cryogen_mtg