Commander MVP from each Magic Set - Poll 5 (Odyssey and Onslaught Blocks)
Poll: What is the 'MVP' from Odyssey?
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What is the 'MVP' from Odyssey? - Single Choice
- Threshold Lands (Barbarian Ring, Cephalid Coliseum, etc.) 0%
- Filter Lands (Darkwater Catacombs, Mossfire Valley, etc.) 3.2%
- Balancing Act 0%
- Concentrate 0%
- Crystal Quarry 0%
- Decimate 7.9%
- Deserted Temple 0%
- Diabolic Tutor 12.7%
- Entomb 44.4%
- Karmic Justice 3.2%
- Millikin 0%
- Mindslicer 6.3%
- Mirari 4.8%
- Moment's Peace 1.6%
- Patron Wizard 0%
- Psychatog 0%
- Recoup 0%
- Sadistic Hypnotist 3.2%
- Time Stretch 11.1%
- Traumatize 0%
- Other 1.6%
Poll: What is the 'MVP' from Torment?
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What is the 'MVP' from Torment? - Single Choice
- Tainted Lands (Tainted Field, Tainted Isle, etc.) 5%
- Ambassador Laquatus 0%
- Cabal Coffers 78.3%
- Cabal Ritual 0%
- Chainer, Dementia Master 8.3%
- Cleansing Meditation 0%
- Compulsion 1.7%
- Dawn of the Dead 0%
- Deep Analysis 1.7%
- Devastating Dreams 0%
- Far Wanderings 0%
- Grim Lavamancer 0%
- Insidious Dreams 1.7%
- Krosan Restorer 0%
- Laquatus's Champion 0%
- Last Laugh 0%
- Mortal Combat 0%
- Mutilate 1.7%
- Nostalgic Dreams 0%
- Parallel Evolution 0%
- Plagiarize 0%
- Radiate 1.7%
- Transcendence 0%
- Turbulent Dreams 0%
- Other 0%
Poll: What is the 'MVP' from Judgment?
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What is the 'MVP' from Judgment? - Single Choice
- Anger 22%
- Balthor the Defiled 3.4%
- Brawn 0%
- Cabal Therapy 0%
- Cephalid Constable 0%
- Epic Struggle 0%
- Filth 0%
- Genesis 0%
- Glory 0%
- Hunting Grounds 0%
- Krosan Verge 1.7%
- Mirari's Wake 64.4%
- Planar Chaos 1.7%
- Riftstone Portal 1.7%
- Solitary Confinement 3.4%
- Spelljack 0%
- Test of Endurance 0%
- Wonder 1.7%
- Other 0%
Poll: What is the 'MVP' from Onslaught?
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What is the 'MVP' from Onslaught? - Single Choice
- Fetchlands (Flooded Strand, Polluted Delta, etc.) 79.7%
- Cycling Lands (Barren Moor, Forgotten Cave, etc.) 0%
- Words Cycle (Words of War, Words of Wind, etc.) 0%
- Aggravated Assault 0%
- Akroma's Vengeance 0%
- Arcanis the Omnipotent 1.7%
- Blatant Thievery 0%
- Death Match 0%
- Encahntress's Presence 0%
- Explosive Vegetation 1.7%
- Future Sight 1.7%
- Goblin Sharpshooter 0%
- Gratuitous Violence 0%
- Insurrection 5.1%
- Ixidor, Reality Sculptor 0%
- Kamahl, Fist of Krosa 3.4%
- Krosan Tusker 0%
- Mana Echoes 1.7%
- Mobilization 0%
- Oblation 1.7%
- Oversold Cemetery 0%
- Patriarch's Bidding 0%
- Riptide Laboratory 0%
- Slate of Ancestry 0%
- Starstorm 0%
- Visara the Dreadful 0%
- Voidmage Prophecy 0%
- Weathered Wayfarer 3.4%
- Other 0%
Poll: What is the 'MVP' from Legions?
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What is the 'MVP' from Legions? - Single Choice
- Akroma, Angel of Wrath 3.4%
- Bane of the Living 1.7%
- Caller of the Claw 0%
- Corpse Harvester 0%
- Dreamborn Muse 0%
- Gempalm Incinerator 0%
- Gempalm Polluter 0%
- Gempalm Strider 0%
- Glowrider 0%
- Graveborn Muse 5.2%
- Mistform Ultimus 0%
- Noxious Ghoul 0%
- Seedborn Muse 81%
- Willbender 5.2%
- Windborn Muse 0%
- Wirewood Channeler 0%
- Withered Wretch 3.4%
- Other 0%
Poll: What is the 'MVP' from Scourge?
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What is the 'MVP' from Scourge? - Single Choice
- Bladewing the Risen 0%
- Call to the Grave 0%
- Decree of Annihilation 3.4%
- Decree of Justice 0%
- Decree of Pain 30.5%
- Decree of Silence 0%
- Dragon Mage 0%
- Eternal Dragon 0%
- Fierce Empath 6.8%
- Forgotten Ancient 5.1%
- Form of the Dragon 3.4%
- Goblin Warchief 0%
- Grip of Chaos 0%
- Karona, False God 0%
- Mind's Desire 20.3%
- Primitive Etchings 0%
- Siege-Gang Commander 3.4%
- Sliver Overlord 6.8%
- Stifle 3.4%
- Temple of the False God 13.6%
- Tendrils of Agony 0%
- Undead Warchief 0%
- Wirewood Symbiote 3.4%
- Other 0%
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Link to Poll 2
Link to Poll 3
Link to Poll 4
Alpha/Beta/Unlimited - Sol Ring
Arabian Nights - City of Brass
Antiquities - Ashnod's Altar
Legends - Sylvan Library
The Dark - Maze of Ith
Fallen Empires - High Tide
Ice Age - Necropotence
Homelands - Merchant Scroll
Alliances - Force of Will
Mirage - Tutors Enlightened Tutor, Mystical Tutor, Worldly Tutor
Visions - Vampiric Tutor
Weatherlight - Buried Alive
Tempest - Tied Ancient Tomb and Living Death
Stonghold - Gravepact
Exodus - Survival of the Fittest
Urza's Saga - Gaea's Cradle
Urza's Legacy - Karmic Guide
Urza's Destiny - Academy Rector
Mercadian Masques - Bribery
Nemesis - Skyshroud Claim
Prophecy - Rhystic Study
Invasion - Aura Shards
Planeshift - Tied Diabolic Intent and Eladamri's Call
Apocalypse - Phyrexian Arena
The definition of MVP for the purposes of this thread is really up to each person voting, but in general it should be the card you feel is either the best card power-wise, or a card you feel has the most influence on the format, or the card you feel leads to the best games, or your favorite card from the set, or the one you see the most in your playgroup. Just like voting for sports MVP's, the definition of "MVP" is deliberately left open to interpretation to allow for each voter to bring their personal experiences and/or thoughts to the table. My hope is that each person voting will establish their own criteria taking Power, Influence, Ubiquity, Personal Experience, etc. all into consideration and weighing their vote based on several criteria.
This time it's Odyssey and Onslaught block, with all six sets with some powerhouse card to choose from. I also expanded my criteria for nominating cards a little bit to include some fringe cards that are still considered powerful even though they might not see tons of play in Commander.
I'm also going to start going back and closing the previous polls and making the results official, so when Poll 6 goes up early next week Poll 1 will be closed and so on. Some of the races are tight, so if you haven't voted please go back and vote (links to previous polls are at the top).
Torment - Cabal Coffers : The most absolute staple in any mono black and even duel deck with black. Incredibly powerfull mana generating land. Feels obscene at times for the amount of mana it easilly generates, specially with Tomb of Yawgmoth. Theres no competition in this set, even if alot of cards aren't bad compared to Prophecy and Homelands. Cabal Coffers is that amazing.
Judgment - Mirari's Wake : A very powerfull mana doubler. I like the Incaranations and use a couple of them, but Mirari's Wake feels like a staple in any W/G deck like Aura Shards. Zendikar Resurgent is good competition to it bu 5 converted mana cost > 7 converted mana cost XD.
Onslaught - Fetchlands : So many good cards here like: Insurrection for been an amaqzing finisher, Aggravated Assault for been a powerfull combo card or just making your attacks do more damage in certain deck, Patriarch's Bidding great reanimator for tribal, etc. But...theres no competition here, the fetchlands is the most powerfull cycle of lands in the intire game. theres nothing i can say here because they are the fetchlands.
Legion - Seedborn Muse : Prophet of Kruphix was a thing btw and Seedborn is almsot as good as that card. It can actually be betetr in certain scenarios. Shes ridiculous in a multiplayer format.
Scourge - Fierced Empath : hmmmmmmmm this was a tough hoice. I really like Decree of Pain but is abit expensive to go a couple of decks. Temple of the False God was almsot my choice for been able to go in any deck and i probably should have picked it....but i think Fierced Empath is more powerfull.... Honestly i might even change my vote later if someone here convice me. I would pick both if i could.
I think many of these cards are worthy of being the best of the best, to be honest. It's probably 'cuz I'm a red-leaning player, so i probably voted more red cards than others. that being said, mirari's wake over the GY-ability cycle (anger et al)? i'm struggling to see how that's a thing.
Legacy - Solidarity - mono U aggro - burn - Imperial Painter - Strawberry Shortcake - Bluuzards - bom
Odyssey
MVP: Time Stretch - This set kind of strikes me as not really having an MVP. I mean, Diabolic Tutor is by far the most played, but that's a bad card that people pretend is good. And it's not that the set is bad, just a lot of roleplayers. So I picked the card that stands out to me as the flashiest, most emblematic card of the set in this format.
Needs more love: Millikin - Mana and graveyard filling, this little (adorable) enabler doesn't see the play it deserves.
Needs less love: Traumatize - It's not unplayable, but it's definitely played too much.
Really? Decimate - it's a fine card, but 9000+ decks?
Torment
MVP: Cabal Coffers - It's no contest, obviously. But I allow me to state how much I dislike this card in this format. It's not TOO powerful, but it is, if you know what I mean. It doesn't throw off competitive balance, but it just commands to much weight/attention. Like, every black deck needs to run it, and it is almost always the card you should tutor for first, regardless of whats happening. And with Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth, it's not just a mono-B card, but a any black deck card. It eliminates choices and interesting decisions because it is always the correct one. That's my complaint with this card.
Not interested: Insidious Dreams - If this card is good in your deck, I'm pretty sure your games are not fun.
Feel bad for : Tainted Peak - All the other tainted lands got reprints, why is this one so unloved?
Judgement
MVP: Mirari's Wake - I guess. I dunno. This set also feels like a ton of roleplayers.
It's bad, you do know that right?: Browbeat - Although kudos to WotC on the naming of this card. Every time it's played, someone just has to Browbeat the caster about how it's a terrible card and they should know that.
Black Sheep of the family: Valor - Congratulations! You are the crappy Incarnation.
Onslaught
MVP: It's the Fetchlands. They are the spine of eternal format manabases. But that's boring to discuss.
Biggest Stock Drop: Oblation - This card was fantastic when you could tuck opposing Generals. Now you can't.
Format All-Star: Insurrection or Blatant Thievery - I can't decide. Both of these cards make me think of the shenanigans of this format, but can't win MVP that the fetches have on lockdown.
And what's with combining the words into 1 vote? They are very different. Words of Wind is meaningful combo engine weirdness. Words of Wilding is not.
Also, cheers to WotC for finally thinking of multiplayer with the appearance of cards like Syphon Mind
Legions
MVP: Seedborn Muse - Just on another level. Effectively taking multiple turns for every one of yours.
Most Overplayed Sliver: Root Sliver - This is just the least needed highly played sliver
Best Zombie: Noxious Ghoul - I know it's the 3rd most played zombie from the set, but it's better than the other two
This sets boring. It seems removing all card types except 1 from a set resulted in something uninteresting. Imagine that.
Scourge
MVP: Forgotten Ancient - Oh Mr. Babycakes, we watched you grow. You came up just short for other formats, but here you are free to roam.
WotC, please stop: Temple of the False God - There are 4 cards that have been reprinted in EVERY commander set. This is one of them. It should not be. It has its place. Its place is definitely not EVERYWHERE.
I Decree that you shall have no friends: Not just Decree of Annihilation, but I see you people trying to flicker/recycle Decree of Silence. Please don't.
Rob from the poor, give to the rich: Lethal Vapors - It's bad when you need it to be good, and good when it doesn't matter.
(U/B)(U/B)(U/B) JUMP IN THE LINE, ROCK YOUR BODY IN TIME
(R/W)(R/W)(R/W) RISING FROM THE NEON GLOOM, SHINING LIKE A CRAZY MOON
(U/R)(R/G)(G/U) STEALIN' WHEN I SHOULD HAVE BEEN BUYIN'
Deserted Temple is a close second for similar reasons.
Why? I guess having it in your opening hand feels bad but not by that mutch. i think is a solid card
A land that does nothing as one of your first 4! lands is a land with a serious drawback. The payoff for dealing with that drawback is pretty underwhelming.
Basically, in the situations where it's bad, it's SOOOO BAD. In the situations where it's good, it's good but not overwhelmingly so. That combined with the fact that WotC won't stop reprinting it and putting it in commander mana bases is going to evoke strong emotions.
Personally, I suspect the mana bases of at least half of the decks that run it would be improved by replacing it with something else.
Entomb - This card allows for so many things and, in the right deck, is basically a 1 mana Instant Tutor. I have used it to get Eldrazi to save my graveyard or used it to get Life from the Loam to hit my lands drops. It is a solid card all around
Torment
Chainer, Dementia Master - The obvious choice here is Cabal Coffers but I prefer Chainer. Both get better with Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth but I prefer Chainer as he is versatile, can go in multicolor decks easier than Coffers, and isn't as reliant on Urborg in those Multi Color decks (though Coffers really shouldn't often be used outside of 1 and 2 color decks probably). Chainer has won me a lot of games or turned things around for me in a number of situations that he is easily one of the better cards in my Black decks.
Judgment
Anger - Judgment doesn't offer a lot of cards but Anger (and Wonder) are probably the best ones of the list. Anger allows for a Haste enabler that is a bit harder to turn off than other options.
Onslaught
Flooded Strand (and other Fetches) - Fetches are not required for EDH by any means, but in any deck with 3 or more colors they make the deck much more consistent.
Legions
Graveborn Muse - Seedborn Muse is probably the "best" of the choices but I don't play the card for a number of reasons. Instead, I went with Graveborn as it works well in Zombie decks and there are a number of incidental zombie cards that it is fairly easy to make it a "Draw 2, lose 2" every Upkeep. This means it can likely be a better Phyrexian Arena in a lot of cases (though it is easier to deal with)
Scourge
Temple of the False God - Scourge is another set that I noticed I don't use a lot of cards from. Temple is the one card I really use in a number of decks and I often use it in non-green decks to give myself a little bit of a mana boost early enough. It is tough due to its restriction on use, but it is good enough in decks that can't land ramp easily.
entomb is a very strong tutor, no real competition.
coffers is nearly ubiquitous in mono-black, and even 2-color black with urborg.
mirrari's wake is easily the most powerful card imo, though I can see the argument made for anger given that it can cost 0 and fits into more decks.
fetches go into every non-monocolor deck, and lots of monocolor ones too. Tough to argue with that, even if they're a little boring.
seedborn muse is an easy pick in a weak set.
scourge is the only one that's tough. Decree of pain is powerful, but expensive. mind's desire is pretty niche to storm decks. temple is in a lot of decks but it's only just ok imo, early turns are important. Personally I went out on a limb and voted sliver overlord - slivers aren't a major archetype or anything, but overlord absolutely makes that deck which would be garbage without him. Mind's desire is a great card for storm but it's only one of the 99.
EDH Primers
Phelddagrif - Zirilan
EDH
Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif 4 - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif 3 - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
Torment: Cabal Coffers Plenty of good cards, but how many effectively double your mana and are lands themselves?
Judgment: Mirari's Wake Another mana doubler, and GW generally likes +1/+1. It's also cute with the phantoms.
Onslaught: Fetchlands They can justify including Titania, Protector of Argoth, Crucible of Worlds, Sun Titan, and Ramunap Excavator in decks that aren't even lands.dec, and Rings of Brighthearth in decks that don't even have that many activated abilities. Spoiler alert for Zendikar's MVP.
Legions: Seedborn Muse This one was interesting. I like the muses (and may I say that I like how in Un games, using Legions for Summon the Pack has two cards that can kiiillll yooooouuuuuuuu, as HCBailly would say), and I like morph. But of all the creatures in Legions (and all the cards were creatures), the one that struck me as most obvious was Seedborn Muse. Why, you ask? Well, I play Stax. Seedborn Muse is therefore a card I love seeing on my side of the table and she's KOS on the other side of the table. Every Winter Orb or Meekstone, broken. (Sadly, not Stasis...) If I'm playing Ghave Stax, she gives him more mana, and lets me tap my artifacts and creatures again too. She also is a sorta blanket almost vigilance? And yeah, she breaks Mana Vault, Basalt Monolith, and Grim Monolith in two, but a lot of things do. And she only gets worse if you also play Vedalken Orrery (coincidentally letting me get around my Rule of Law or Arcane Laboratory).
Scourge: Decree of Annihilation Instant-speed MLD. It's seven mana, but it's an instant-speed MLD cantrip. Or you can get a near-Apocalypse for ten, which is a bit pricey, but it's nice to know it exists.
On phasing:
Niv-Mizzet Reborn
Feather, the Redeemed
Estrid, the Masked
Teshar
Tymna/Ravos
Najeela, Blade-Blossom
Firesong & Sunspeaker
Zur the Enchanter
Lazav, the Multifarious
Ishai+Reyhan
Click images for decks->
-Prime Speaker Vannifar
---------------------Will & Rowan Kenrith
It's up there with Meteor Crater, but I can at least see myself using Meteor Crater before turn 5 (turn 3~4 with a ramp spell). Even storage lands can be tapped for mana at least once before that, and they have proliferate to make them better (but never even remotely good).
It's not the worst land ever printed. I'd say it's worse than Sorrow's Path and Wintermoon Mesa but better than Adventurers' Guildhouse and friends. So, yes, it's better than a giant rules cluster**** which does absolutely nothing in practical terms and depends on you having at least two of that category of card (legends of colors corresponding to the waste of trees you have in play) to do that nothing, but worse than every other land ever printed. I challenge anyone here to prove me wrong.
On phasing: