So this is a thread I wanted to start to discuss commanders that players may want to try and use, but can't because people assume you are being a dick. Things like Teferi, Animar, Stax Bird, ect.
So have you ever been guilty of griefing someone for the percieved threat of their general or ever been on the recieving end of it? Personally i can say I have. I have wanted to make a Derevi birds deck but... anytime someone so much as glances at him, they freak out -.-
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This aint your girlfriends meta! This is a man's meta! TURBO META.
Esper deck? Hate those guys.
Mono-blue-anything but merfolk/sea monster tribal? Hate those guys.
Goblins? Too fast, must kill.
Any general that people assume will combo out? Kill.
GAAIV? Yeah, he ain't sticking around.
Chaos guy? Ick, get him out of here.
If you're not playing battle cruiser, you're a target.
My Tasigur deck, based on a land-heavy variant of DirkGently's, has a reputation at the shop and I often get hit hard, especially with the obvious graveyard hate.
I've just instead adjusted the deck to deal with the hate, with tutors for things like Glacial Chasm so I can sit behind my land-wall, and just rolling with the graveyard-hate to regain power later (assuming I don't die in the meanwhile, of course).
I never actually thought of building any of these, but i'm pretty sure these would result in the cringiest agony possible - for good reason.
As far as my playgroup and taste go these are just too unresponsive, boring and solitaire-ish.
Ghave, Guru of the Spores falls into another category. I'd love to build him, but he goes infinite with basically anything. And i'm not really into that, so poor me will have to wait for more Abzan options to pop up.
In my meta, it mostly depends on the people playing the commander rather than the commander itself. Animar in our local chumps hands? Doesn't really matter, even with all the competitive bs he has in there (a fair few eldrazi and infinite combos). He is, himself, a really bad player. Animar in my hands (or any of the other more experienced players) is completely banned. "Insert obnoxious general of choice here" and it doesn't matter. I do keep at least two competitive style decks around to deal with those who might be more shenanigans inclined. Other than that, it's a pretty fair meta where battlecruiser decks get to keep up with the combo and control decks. We pretty much keep each other in check. I would, however, caution against showing up with a straight counter deck or a MLD unless that's how you win. You'll probably get dropped to a negative life total quickly from those of us who frown on such things...
It was partially my fault although. I know my deck inside-and-out, and was able to play it at a very quick pace. Since the deck had a pile of ramp, Jeleva tends to come out on turn-3 almost every game, sometimes turn-2.
The issue was that my opponent(s) were not keeping up with me. More frequently is that they just didn't want to keep up with her trigger and exile their cards. After Jeleva would resolve, they would either not hand me the top x cards of their deck, or just do so very slowly. I would even say "top-4 please" or something to remind them that she has an ability that includes their decks. I would frequently have to reach for their decks just to help speed up the turn. Reaching for your opponent(s) decks can really bug someone.
Even worse? My Jeleva build was designed to allow her to die/sacrifice her so she can be re-cast at a high rate, essentially mill-exiling opponent(s) decks if my big spells didn't pan out. So I would have to pester the opponent(s) quite frequently to continue handing me their cards.
I understand that it may be considered rude to reach for your opponents deck if they are not wanting to (or showing hesitance of) going through with her triggered exile ability. Adding in the elements of people seeing their cards being exiled and then possibly being used against them, a tuned Jeleva can make for some very aggravated opponents.
Also my deck has a theme of theft spells. The most memorable game (in terms of opponents hatred for her), was when I resolved Jeleva on turn-2, attacked with her on turn-3 casting a blatant thievery taking lands from each opponent, and again on turn-4 casting the blatant thievery from my graveyard off a spelltwine off jeleva, again taking lands. One of my buddies was about to throw my deck..like not jokingly "haha angry throw," but legitimate destroy your deck throw. The blatant thievery and spelltwine were all visible off her exile pile on turn-2.
I love the deck, and I love Jeleva. But due to this I don't bring her out very often.
Mu arcum deck got grief and evntually the grief was for good reason. Originally i was just doing goofy stuff with arcum. It was for fun. I gkt hated out so i tweaked arcum until i was able to go 3v1 and laugh. Turn 5 wins were also veru fast (well more so tirn 5 all opponents scoop.
I just want to play a control-ish deck with one of my favorite mechanics (Suspend) while being in two of my favorite colors. I don't want to play eldrazi, I don't want to play jJokulhaups variants. I just want to keep up interaction and then suspend my non-instants EoT. But her reputation gets me hated out of every game I tried it, even when I explain what the deck is doing and even when there's an obviously competitive Teferi deck at the table.
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UG Arixmethes Combo UGR Wanderer UGB Tasigur Control URB Jeleva Storm RW Gisela Control
I have a play group that kinda does both. We all have multiple "semi-broken" decks (Meren, Teferi, Animar, Daretti, Omnath LoR, Breya) that when played by their owners are lethal and efficient, but otherwise clunky and much slower.
We also each have 4-5 "other" decks that're all in the the $30-$50 range for some battle cruiser magic.
I personally own 12 EDH decks (most made when the format first started in 2009ish), and would only classify 2 (Breya, Animar) as broken. I like making decks to play magic much more than making decks to crush people really quickly.
Lots of groans when my Maelstrom Wanderer actually Cascades into 2 decent spells. Enough so that I only use it once in a blue moon, even after taking out all Time Magic/Extra Turns and never having included any MLD.
Most of the experience counter commanders from 2015 but especially Mizzix of the Izmagnus are big targets for me. Mizzix is inherently strong and often the rest of the deck is meant to combo out quickly. Decks that are heavily blue and/or combo centric get targeted by me more than they perhaps deserve.
My only case of this is playing Rafiq of the Many. I play aura voltron rather than swords and have to point this out from the outset. Its still strong but generally not as bad as the other decks at the table.
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EDH BRGKresh the BloodbraidedBRG, A box of lands and ideas.
Modern: RG Titanshift. A deck made of cards too stupid for EDH.
Retired: Lots. More than I feel you should suffer through or I should type out.
Didn't even bother building Narset, Enlightened Master after an online playtest of the list I built for her, she was crazy. Oh, and had to dismantle Ulasht, the Hate Seed of all things due to its combos.
I tried building Zur the Enchanter once. It stayed intact for one game. It turns out that even when you're not tutoring up broken combo/stax/protection pieces (my deck was themed around reanimation and Animate Dead-style enchantments, with no super-broken reanimation targets) it's still annoying to wait for a search and shuffle every single time Zur attacks. The group made it quite clear that they didn't like playing against it.
As for commanders other people play that are on my personal hit list: Animar, Soul of Elements--Only played against it once but, guess what, Animar on turn 2 and Ancestral Statue on Turn 3. Of course. Yisan, the Wanderer Bard--I wouldn't mind it if it was just "search up a value creature once per turn cycle" but nooooo, every single Yisan deck has to be ramp ramp ramp, Elves Elves Elves, untap untap untap so that he gets to basically take a turn in between all of our turns. And, of course, since he's tutoring you can expect most games to go the same unless you disrupt his game plan (and with all the ramp, and the general costing only 3, it only sets him back so far). Bruna, Light of Alabaster--This general is simply too risky to ever let attack, since a whole bunch of Auras will probably attach to her for free and make her into a one-hit kill, make her impossible to remove, or both. Sometimes it doesn't happen--the controller only drew one or two Auras--but you can't know that until it's too late to prevent the worst case from happening! And the worst part is, being a Voltron, she can kill one player quickly and just fail to kill the others for whatever reason, leaving that player stuck out of the game for quite a while.
I just want to play a control-ish deck with one of my favorite mechanics (Suspend) while being in two of my favorite colors. I don't want to play eldrazi, I don't want to play jJokulhaups variants. I just want to keep up interaction and then suspend my non-instants EoT. But her reputation gets me hated out of every game I tried it, even when I explain what the deck is doing and even when there's an obviously competitive Teferi deck at the table.
This, made Jhoira Fun stuff, played only a few games before taking it apart because it was garbage and I was getting archenemied every game.
On the alternate I bought the Mind Sieze deck for Nekusar, love the art, flavours and colours. Tossed in every broken mana rock and counterspell I owned to make it opressive for competitive games. Destroyed two tables and never played it again.
Nekusar, the Mindrazer. I really just wanted a Grixis control deck, and having a glorified Howling Mine in the Commandzone to keep the cards flowing seemed like a good idea but I had to take the deck apart because I was constantly targeted by people assuming I was just mono-Wheels.
I played it because to me it read "draw a card" in colours not known for card advantage. It immediately got hated out because it's a "tutor general".
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EDH RRGrenzo plays your deck, GGYeva's mono green control, WW9-tails trys desperately for monowhite not to suck RWBUTymna and Kraum's saboteur tribal, UWG Kestia's Enchantress Aggro, RUB Jeleva casts big dumb spells, RGB Vaevictis' big critters can kill your critters hard
I have not encountered this, likely because I don't push my decks past the power level of the local meta. There aren't many explosive/infinite combo decks around here, so the pacing of play is usually predictable based on what is in play.
I also greatly enjoy playing political cards, so my power level is already capped by not being in the lead for them to work to their full strength. As an example, I will run Skullwinder all day and I'd run duplicates of it instead of Eternal Witnesswere it possible.
One of my buddies hates my Uril "hexproof tribal" deck, but he painted himself into that corner by deciding he cares more about beating me than winning and packs his decks with targeted removal (not for me specifically he just is all about "interaction").
My two designated *****ty decks, Ruric Thar and Thada Adel, have been sidelined indefinitely because threat assessment in my new meta is non-existent. I'm about to start on Kataki, War's Wage and see if it works as a counter to all the fast mana power decks that keep getting ignored.
Esper deck? Hate those guys.
Mono-blue-anything but merfolk/sea monster tribal? Hate those guys.
Goblins? Too fast, must kill.
Any general that people assume will combo out? Kill.
GAAIV? Yeah, he ain't sticking around.
Chaos guy? Ick, get him out of here.
If you're not playing battle cruiser, you're a target.
What is a battle cruiser?
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GMR21=OYS, I know you.
Salt is part of the game. Deal with it.
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So have you ever been guilty of griefing someone for the percieved threat of their general or ever been on the recieving end of it? Personally i can say I have. I have wanted to make a Derevi birds deck but... anytime someone so much as glances at him, they freak out -.-
This aint your girlfriends meta! This is a man's meta! TURBO META.
Mono-blue-anything but merfolk/sea monster tribal? Hate those guys.
Goblins? Too fast, must kill.
Any general that people assume will combo out? Kill.
GAAIV? Yeah, he ain't sticking around.
Chaos guy? Ick, get him out of here.
If you're not playing battle cruiser, you're a target.
(U/B)(U/B)(U/B) JUMP IN THE LINE, ROCK YOUR BODY IN TIME
(R/W)(R/W)(R/W) RISING FROM THE NEON GLOOM, SHINING LIKE A CRAZY MOON
(U/R)(R/G)(G/U) STEALIN' WHEN I SHOULD HAVE BEEN BUYIN'
I've just instead adjusted the deck to deal with the hate, with tutors for things like Glacial Chasm so I can sit behind my land-wall, and just rolling with the graveyard-hate to regain power later (assuming I don't die in the meanwhile, of course).
Beating Face with Bane
Beatrice, the Golden Witch
- Arcum Dagsson
- Captain Sisay
- Narset, Enlightened Master
- Zur the Enchanter
I never actually thought of building any of these, but i'm pretty sure these would result in the cringiest agony possible - for good reason.As far as my playgroup and taste go these are just too unresponsive, boring and solitaire-ish.
Ghave, Guru of the Spores falls into another category. I'd love to build him, but he goes infinite with basically anything. And i'm not really into that, so poor me will have to wait for more Abzan options to pop up.
Credit to DolZero for this awesome sig!
It was partially my fault although. I know my deck inside-and-out, and was able to play it at a very quick pace. Since the deck had a pile of ramp, Jeleva tends to come out on turn-3 almost every game, sometimes turn-2.
The issue was that my opponent(s) were not keeping up with me. More frequently is that they just didn't want to keep up with her trigger and exile their cards. After Jeleva would resolve, they would either not hand me the top x cards of their deck, or just do so very slowly. I would even say "top-4 please" or something to remind them that she has an ability that includes their decks. I would frequently have to reach for their decks just to help speed up the turn. Reaching for your opponent(s) decks can really bug someone.
Even worse? My Jeleva build was designed to allow her to die/sacrifice her so she can be re-cast at a high rate, essentially mill-exiling opponent(s) decks if my big spells didn't pan out. So I would have to pester the opponent(s) quite frequently to continue handing me their cards.
I understand that it may be considered rude to reach for your opponents deck if they are not wanting to (or showing hesitance of) going through with her triggered exile ability. Adding in the elements of people seeing their cards being exiled and then possibly being used against them, a tuned Jeleva can make for some very aggravated opponents.
Also my deck has a theme of theft spells. The most memorable game (in terms of opponents hatred for her), was when I resolved Jeleva on turn-2, attacked with her on turn-3 casting a blatant thievery taking lands from each opponent, and again on turn-4 casting the blatant thievery from my graveyard off a spelltwine off jeleva, again taking lands. One of my buddies was about to throw my deck..like not jokingly "haha angry throw," but legitimate destroy your deck throw. The blatant thievery and spelltwine were all visible off her exile pile on turn-2.
I love the deck, and I love Jeleva. But due to this I don't bring her out very often.
Links to my most current deck lists;
Primary EDH; Rakka Mar Token Perfection, Crosis Mnemonic Betrayal, Cromat Villainous, Judith Gravestorm, Rakdos Empty Storm, Exava Artifacts, Bant Trash, & Fumiko Voltron!
EDH kept at home; Ruzzian Isset & Rakdos LoR!
EDH (nostalgic/pimp/retired) in storage;
Latulla Burns, Akroma Smash, Jeska Voltron, Rakdos Storm, Bladewing Darghans, Lyzolda Worldgorger, Xantcha Steals your Heart, Jori Storm, Wydwen Permission, Gwendlyn Paradox, Jeleva Warps, & Sigarda Brick!
Legacy Showanimator and High Tide!
UB Vela the Night-Clad BUDecklist
WBG Ghave, Guru of Spores GBW
WUBRGThe Ur-DragonWUBRGDecklist
I just want to play a control-ish deck with one of my favorite mechanics (Suspend) while being in two of my favorite colors. I don't want to play eldrazi, I don't want to play jJokulhaups variants. I just want to keep up interaction and then suspend my non-instants EoT. But her reputation gets me hated out of every game I tried it, even when I explain what the deck is doing and even when there's an obviously competitive Teferi deck at the table.
UGR Wanderer
UGB Tasigur Control
URB Jeleva Storm
RW Gisela Control
Aftee the 1st game with Teferi's Puzzle Box in hand, Leovold, Emissary of Trest was the first commander i was asked to not play anymore.
Needless to say the group agrees with the ban.
https://archidekt.com/user/71716
I agree too, but i also was the only person playing Leovold at my LGS
UB Vela the Night-Clad BUDecklist
WBG Ghave, Guru of Spores GBW
WUBRGThe Ur-DragonWUBRGDecklist
We also each have 4-5 "other" decks that're all in the the $30-$50 range for some battle cruiser magic.
I personally own 12 EDH decks (most made when the format first started in 2009ish), and would only classify 2 (Breya, Animar) as broken. I like making decks to play magic much more than making decks to crush people really quickly.
Username: Cabz
My only case of this is playing Rafiq of the Many. I play aura voltron rather than swords and have to point this out from the outset. Its still strong but generally not as bad as the other decks at the table.
BRGKresh the BloodbraidedBRG, A box of lands and ideas.
Modern:
RG Titanshift. A deck made of cards too stupid for EDH.
Retired: Lots. More than I feel you should suffer through or I should type out.
Had to dismantle Grand Arbiter Augustin IV, and replaced Leovold, Emmissary of Trest with The Mimeoplasm.
Didn't even bother building Narset, Enlightened Master after an online playtest of the list I built for her, she was crazy. Oh, and had to dismantle Ulasht, the Hate Seed of all things due to its combos.
As for commanders other people play that are on my personal hit list:
Animar, Soul of Elements--Only played against it once but, guess what, Animar on turn 2 and Ancestral Statue on Turn 3. Of course.
Yisan, the Wanderer Bard--I wouldn't mind it if it was just "search up a value creature once per turn cycle" but nooooo, every single Yisan deck has to be ramp ramp ramp, Elves Elves Elves, untap untap untap so that he gets to basically take a turn in between all of our turns. And, of course, since he's tutoring you can expect most games to go the same unless you disrupt his game plan (and with all the ramp, and the general costing only 3, it only sets him back so far).
Bruna, Light of Alabaster--This general is simply too risky to ever let attack, since a whole bunch of Auras will probably attach to her for free and make her into a one-hit kill, make her impossible to remove, or both. Sometimes it doesn't happen--the controller only drew one or two Auras--but you can't know that until it's too late to prevent the worst case from happening! And the worst part is, being a Voltron, she can kill one player quickly and just fail to kill the others for whatever reason, leaving that player stuck out of the game for quite a while.
This, made Jhoira Fun stuff, played only a few games before taking it apart because it was garbage and I was getting archenemied every game.
On the alternate I bought the Mind Sieze deck for Nekusar, love the art, flavours and colours. Tossed in every broken mana rock and counterspell I owned to make it opressive for competitive games. Destroyed two tables and never played it again.
Sliver Queen. What If I just want to build a 5-color token deck with a sliver sub-theme?
Prossh. He's the only Jund legend to ever interest me, but everyone thinks combo.
Arcuum Dagson. I just want to play with Mirrorworks, but everyone kills/counters all my things.
Jhoira. I want to build a deck around playing with time counters, but Eldrazi/MLD is way too common to play Jhoira casually.
WBG Karador, Ghost Chieftain
B Toshiro Umezawa
BG Pharika, God of Affliction - Necromancy and Politics
WWW The Church of Heliod
WBR Zurgo, Helmsmasher
RG Wort, the Raidmother
UBR Jeleva, Nephalia's Scourge
UG Vorel of the Hull Clade
I played it because to me it read "draw a card" in colours not known for card advantage. It immediately got hated out because it's a "tutor general".
RRGrenzo plays your deck, GGYeva's mono green control, WW9-tails trys desperately for monowhite not to suck
RWBUTymna and Kraum's saboteur tribal, UWG Kestia's Enchantress Aggro, RUB Jeleva casts big dumb spells, RGB Vaevictis' big critters can kill your critters hard
Arena Standard
UUUU Tempo, since before it was cool
Various Wx decks running Fountain of Renewal and Day of Glory
Anything I can cram Chaos Wand in to
(U/B)(U/B)(U/B) JUMP IN THE LINE, ROCK YOUR BODY IN TIME
(R/W)(R/W)(R/W) RISING FROM THE NEON GLOOM, SHINING LIKE A CRAZY MOON
(U/R)(R/G)(G/U) STEALIN' WHEN I SHOULD HAVE BEEN BUYIN'
I also greatly enjoy playing political cards, so my power level is already capped by not being in the lead for them to work to their full strength. As an example, I will run Skullwinder all day and I'd run duplicates of it instead of Eternal Witness were it possible.
Older Magic as a Board Game: Panglacial Wurm , Mill
Pauper: Burn
Modern: Burn
Legacy: Burn
EDH: Marath, Will of the Wild - Ramp/Combo | Anafenza the Foremost - French | Uril, the Miststalker - Voltron | Freyalise, Llanowar's Fury - Goodstuff
Ghost Council of Orzhov - Tokens | Lazav, Dimir Mastermind - Control | Isamaru, Hound of Konda - Tiny Leaders
What is a battle cruiser?
Salt is part of the game. Deal with it.