Objective: Flip the deck upside down and then right side-up repeatedly till all enemies are wiped out through use of cycling instead of standard Niv-Mizzet methods of Curiosity-like effects.
Life from the Loam lets you set up a land-cycling loop. If you're in white, Sun Titan also puts the cheaper cycling cards directly into play from the graveyard.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Card advantage is not the same thing as card draw. Something for 2B cannot be strictly worse than something for BBB or 3BB. If you're taking out Swords to Plowshares for Plummet, you're a fool. Stop doing these things!
Shefet Monitor is free to cycle, discard trigger, land into play untapped, draw Lotus Cobra land into play from cycle trigger one black mana floating Tortured Existence use floating black mana to discard any creature in hand for:
Shefet Monitor is free to cycle, discard trigger, land into play untapped, draw Lotus Cobra land into play from cycle trigger one black mana floating Tortured Existence use floating black mana to discard any creature in hand for:
this produces 2 discard triggers and an untapped basic land for each creature card drawn or discarded outright into Tortured Existence.
Rinse, wash and repeat
Nice. If there is an Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth in play, then you don't need the Lotus Cobra. If you did have Lotus Cobra then you could also use Phyrexian Reclamation at the cost of 2 life each time. This method also means that you don't need the creatures in hand. I'll think on some more cards around this type of combo
Amonkhet has been fully spoiled now, and we got a few more cycling engine cards to round out incremental gain: Faith of the Devoted, Ruthless Sniper
I personally going to make a deck that is going to be more value driven, but with the goal of comboing out with basically infinite.
Besides the cycling and engine cards, the rest of the deck needs to be able to tutor for key cards such as New Perspectives and Fluctuator, with the ability to protect and recur in the face of removal.
The deck archetype is certainly for casual gaming, but it can combo out, so is always going to be in the mix for winning.
Could be funny with draws that punish people when you draw..
I got to play my Sultai build last night and it feels like the colors BUG pair up very well for the self-discard theme. I'm noticing that trying to generate offense can be difficult considering the sheer volume of cards needed in the deck just to make the cycling/self discard triggers operate consistently. There's a lot of board presence needed for any kind of feedback loop to get steam. It's pretty durdley feeling, which is ok for me, but certainly wouldn't be for spike players. Both wins last night were in 4 player pods where all 3 opponents turned on me both times because of the sheer size of board presence I needed. Can't blame them for feeling like i was a threat though... I did beat them all both times though and they were all 3 very clearly against me the whole time the deck was used. I don't have many other decks that could go 3v1 from the start and win twice... so there's that..Morality Shift was a bomb
Right over the last week I've really tried to get a cycling deck that's at least ok. I've played multiple versions, played plenty of games and tweaked a lot. The result is that its its just not really up to anything but very casual play. But even then you're playing a very complicated deck. Its a lot of complicated sequences to just get a tiny bit of value.
In short cards that give cycling advantage are just not strong enough. You NEVER have enough mana to get value from the cards in ways that you want. Drake Haven, Lighting Rift, etc all require 1 mana each time and between trying to further your board and cycling for advantage, its just never ends up being favorable. It requires so many cards to get setup as well. In short, too hard to get setup for minimal value.
I tried to adjust by giving it more mana ramp to accommodate the big mana needs, but ultimately the pay off cards like Drake Haven, Lighting Rift, etc are just too weak even when you're setup.
I decided against a combo style deck because there are just too many pieces to get anything going. Its already a fragile style deck, and this just makes it more fragile.
The one card that is good is Astral Slide. I did end up making a Roon of the Hidden Realm, with Ancestral Slide and a lands cycling package. This deck is very good. Essentially it just has Fluctuator and Astral Slide, along with 9 cycle lands and a Life from the Loam. This package is really nice in a deck that gains advantage through blinking creatures in and out of play. You don't have to invest much into the cycling theme and you gain a great attrition card drawing engine and ETB gains.
Right over the last week I've really tried to get a cycling deck that's at least ok. I've played multiple versions, played plenty of games and tweaked a lot. The result is that its its just not really up to anything but very casual play. But even then you're playing a very complicated deck. Its a lot of complicated sequences to just get a tiny bit of value.
In short cards that give cycling advantage are just not strong enough. You NEVER have enough mana to get value from the cards in ways that you want. Drake Haven, Lighting Rift, etc all require 1 mana each time and between trying to further your board and cycling for advantage, its just never ends up being favorable. It requires so many cards to get setup as well. In short, too hard to get setup for minimal value.
I tried to adjust by giving it more mana ramp to accommodate the big mana needs, but ultimately the pay off cards like Drake Haven, Lighting Rift, etc are just too weak even when you're setup.
I decided against a combo style deck because there are just too many pieces to get anything going. Its already a fragile style deck, and this just makes it more fragile.
The one card that is good is Astral Slide. I did end up making a Roon of the Hidden Realm, with Ancestral Slide and a lands cycling package. This deck is very good. Essentially it just has Fluctuator and Astral Slide, along with 9 cycle lands and a Life from the Loam. This package is really nice in a deck that gains advantage through blinking creatures in and out of play. You don't have to invest much into the cycling theme and you gain a great attrition card drawing engine and ETB gains.
Try out Sultai. I've found that going wide with green (things like an Earthcraft or Cryptolith Rite out will help with those mana problems) feeds into black's sacrifice engines and then blue can make this amorphous goo of a deck recycle itself! The Mimeoplasm capitalizes on the discard/self mill themes well
There was a (60 cards) cycling deck emphasized Perplexing Chimera with Astral Slide, stealing opponent's spells then return Chimera under your control, think it would have a place here?
There was a (60 cards) cycling deck emphasized Perplexing Chimera with Astral Slide, stealing opponent's spells then return Chimera under your control, think it would have a place here?
Nice find!! That's an interesting idea and it fits into EDH well, use the cycling lands and Fluctuator and or Life from the Loam. I don't see a good way to do it multiple times a turn though...
There was a (60 cards) cycling deck emphasized Perplexing Chimera with Astral Slide, stealing opponent's spells then return Chimera under your control, think it would have a place here?
Nice find!! That's an interesting idea and it fits into EDH well, use the cycling lands and Fluctuator and or Life from the Loam. I don't see a good way to do it multiple times a turn though...
Yeah the issue in EDH being singleton compare to a 60 cards deck, so it might be less useful here.
There was a (60 cards) cycling deck emphasized Perplexing Chimera with Astral Slide, stealing opponent's spells then return Chimera under your control, think it would have a place here?
Gilded drake would be nice in this kind of deck too.
Card advantage is not the same thing as card draw. Something for 2B cannot be strictly worse than something for BBB or 3BB. If you're taking out Swords to Plowshares for Plummet, you're a fool. Stop doing these things!
Emphasis on 2 for cycling cost (EX: Miscalculation) instead of colored cycling cost (EX: Censor).
Manabase containing non-colored cost cycling lands (EX: Blasted Landscape), currently 4 cycling lands.
One of the three RotR Eldrazi Titans (EX: Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre) in order to move graveyard into library.
Curator of Mysteries in order to cycle faster.
Soul-Scar Mage, Blight Sickle and Grafted Exoskeleton for synergy with Firemind.
Reliquary Tower to keep non-cycling cards away from graveyard and instead in hand or on battlefield.
Fluctuator and New Perspectives to cycle for free.
Alhammarret's Archive to sift quicker.
Mind Over Matter to act as a discard outlet for Eldrazi and a few other cards.
Objective: Flip the deck upside down and then right side-up repeatedly till all enemies are wiped out through use of cycling instead of standard Niv-Mizzet methods of Curiosity-like effects.
Oh yeah living the dream
Niv-Mizzet Reborn
Feather, the Redeemed
Estrid, the Masked
Teshar
Tymna/Ravos
Najeela, Blade-Blossom
Firesong & Sunspeaker
Zur the Enchanter
Lazav, the Multifarious
Ishai+Reyhan
Click images for decks->
-Prime Speaker Vannifar
---------------------Will & Rowan Kenrith
On phasing:
Niv-Mizzet Reborn
Feather, the Redeemed
Estrid, the Masked
Teshar
Tymna/Ravos
Najeela, Blade-Blossom
Firesong & Sunspeaker
Zur the Enchanter
Lazav, the Multifarious
Ishai+Reyhan
Click images for decks->
-Prime Speaker Vannifar
---------------------Will & Rowan Kenrith
If you have a New Perspectives sitting out and active:
Shefet Monitor is free to cycle, discard trigger, land into play untapped, draw
Lotus Cobra land into play from cycle trigger one black mana floating
Tortured Existence use floating black mana to discard any creature in hand for:
Shefet Monitor
this produces 2 discard triggers and an untapped basic land for each creature card drawn or discarded outright into Tortured Existence.
EDIT: Shefet Monitor is a bomb card for cycling triggers, it unlocks a lot
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/magic-fundamentals/magic-general/334931-what-is-the-most-pimp-card-deck-youve-seen-or?comment=5361
Commander
RGOmnath, Locus of Rage Grenades! EDHGR
UWSygg's Defense, EDH - Voltron & ControlWU
BUGMimeoplasm EDH ft. Ifnir Cycling-discard comboBUG
WBTeysa, Connoisseur of CullingBW
BWSelenia & Recruiter of the Guard suicice combo EDHWB
UBRWGO-Kagachi - 5 Color Enchantments - EDHUBRWG
Instant (R)
Return to your hand all cards in your graveyard that you cycled or discarded this turn.
This got spoiled today.
Niv-Mizzet Reborn
Feather, the Redeemed
Estrid, the Masked
Teshar
Tymna/Ravos
Najeela, Blade-Blossom
Firesong & Sunspeaker
Zur the Enchanter
Lazav, the Multifarious
Ishai+Reyhan
Click images for decks->
-Prime Speaker Vannifar
---------------------Will & Rowan Kenrith
Niv-Mizzet Reborn
Feather, the Redeemed
Estrid, the Masked
Teshar
Tymna/Ravos
Najeela, Blade-Blossom
Firesong & Sunspeaker
Zur the Enchanter
Lazav, the Multifarious
Ishai+Reyhan
Click images for decks->
-Prime Speaker Vannifar
---------------------Will & Rowan Kenrith
Faith of the Devoted, Ruthless Sniper
I personally going to make a deck that is going to be more value driven, but with the goal of comboing out with basically infinite.
Besides the cycling and engine cards, the rest of the deck needs to be able to tutor for key cards such as New Perspectives and Fluctuator, with the ability to protect and recur in the face of removal.
The deck archetype is certainly for casual gaming, but it can combo out, so is always going to be in the mix for winning.
Niv-Mizzet Reborn
Feather, the Redeemed
Estrid, the Masked
Teshar
Tymna/Ravos
Najeela, Blade-Blossom
Firesong & Sunspeaker
Zur the Enchanter
Lazav, the Multifarious
Ishai+Reyhan
Click images for decks->
-Prime Speaker Vannifar
---------------------Will & Rowan Kenrith
This aint your girlfriends meta! This is a man's meta! TURBO META.
I got to play my Sultai build last night and it feels like the colors BUG pair up very well for the self-discard theme. I'm noticing that trying to generate offense can be difficult considering the sheer volume of cards needed in the deck just to make the cycling/self discard triggers operate consistently. There's a lot of board presence needed for any kind of feedback loop to get steam. It's pretty durdley feeling, which is ok for me, but certainly wouldn't be for spike players. Both wins last night were in 4 player pods where all 3 opponents turned on me both times because of the sheer size of board presence I needed. Can't blame them for feeling like i was a threat though... I did beat them all both times though and they were all 3 very clearly against me the whole time the deck was used. I don't have many other decks that could go 3v1 from the start and win twice... so there's that..Morality Shift was a bomb
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/magic-fundamentals/magic-general/334931-what-is-the-most-pimp-card-deck-youve-seen-or?comment=5361
Commander
RGOmnath, Locus of Rage Grenades! EDHGR
UWSygg's Defense, EDH - Voltron & ControlWU
BUGMimeoplasm EDH ft. Ifnir Cycling-discard comboBUG
WBTeysa, Connoisseur of CullingBW
BWSelenia & Recruiter of the Guard suicice combo EDHWB
UBRWGO-Kagachi - 5 Color Enchantments - EDHUBRWG
1 The Mimeoplasm
Creatures (30)
1 Ana Battlemage
1 Archfiend of Ifnir
1 Bloodsoaked Champion
1 Chasm Skulker
1 Curator of Mysteries
1 Duplicant
1 Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder
1 Entomber Exarch
1 Essence Warden
1 Eternal Witness
1 Genesis
1 Golgari Brownscale
1 Grim Haruspex
1 Haunted Dead
1 Hermit Druid
1 Jhessian Zombies
1 Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
1 Krosan Tusker
1 Lotus Cobra
1 Nether Traitor
1 Prowling Serpopard
1 Reassembling Skeleton
1 Reclamation Sage
1 Riftsweeper
1 Ruthless Sniper
1 Sadistic Hypnotist
1 Seedborn Muse
1 Sengir Autocrat
1 Shefet Monitor
1 Vorinclex, Voice of Hunger
1 Behold the Beyond
1 Black Sun's Zenith
1 Creeping Renaissance
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Genesis Wave
1 Green Sun's Zenith
1 Life from the Loam
1 Seasons Past
1 Yawgmoth's Will
Instant (1)
1 Cyclonic Rift
Land (31)
1 Alchemist's Refuge
1 Ash Barrens
1 Bayou
1 Command Tower
1 Exotic Orchard
3 Forest
4 Island
1 Llanowar Wastes
1 Misty Rainforest
1 Opal Palace
1 Polluted Delta
1 Polluted Mire
1 Remote Isle
1 Slippery Karst
6 Swamp
1 Tropical Island
1 Underground River
1 Underground Sea
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Verdant Catacombs
1 Winding Canyons
1 Blowfly Infestation
1 Compulsion
1 Cryptolith Rite
1 Dire Undercurrents
1 Drake Haven
1 Earthcraft
1 Faith of the Devoted
1 Nest of Scarabs
1 New Perspectives
1 Oath of Scholars
1 Phyrexian Arena
1 Phyrexian Reclamation
1 Rhystic Study
1 Survival of the Fittest
1 Tortured Existence
1 Unfulfilled Desires
Artifact (12)
1 Alhammarret's Archive
1 Anvil of Bogardan
1 Ashnod's Altar
1 Cloudstone Curio
1 Fellwar Stone
1 Fluctuator
1 Mind Stone
1 Panharmonicon
1 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Skullclamp
1 Sol Ring
1 Thran Dynamo
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/mimeoplasm-edh-ft-ifnir-cycling-discard-combo/
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/magic-fundamentals/magic-general/334931-what-is-the-most-pimp-card-deck-youve-seen-or?comment=5361
Commander
RGOmnath, Locus of Rage Grenades! EDHGR
UWSygg's Defense, EDH - Voltron & ControlWU
BUGMimeoplasm EDH ft. Ifnir Cycling-discard comboBUG
WBTeysa, Connoisseur of CullingBW
BWSelenia & Recruiter of the Guard suicice combo EDHWB
UBRWGO-Kagachi - 5 Color Enchantments - EDHUBRWG
In short cards that give cycling advantage are just not strong enough. You NEVER have enough mana to get value from the cards in ways that you want. Drake Haven, Lighting Rift, etc all require 1 mana each time and between trying to further your board and cycling for advantage, its just never ends up being favorable. It requires so many cards to get setup as well. In short, too hard to get setup for minimal value.
I tried to adjust by giving it more mana ramp to accommodate the big mana needs, but ultimately the pay off cards like Drake Haven, Lighting Rift, etc are just too weak even when you're setup.
I decided against a combo style deck because there are just too many pieces to get anything going. Its already a fragile style deck, and this just makes it more fragile.
The one card that is good is Astral Slide. I did end up making a Roon of the Hidden Realm, with Ancestral Slide and a lands cycling package. This deck is very good. Essentially it just has Fluctuator and Astral Slide, along with 9 cycle lands and a Life from the Loam. This package is really nice in a deck that gains advantage through blinking creatures in and out of play. You don't have to invest much into the cycling theme and you gain a great attrition card drawing engine and ETB gains.
Niv-Mizzet Reborn
Feather, the Redeemed
Estrid, the Masked
Teshar
Tymna/Ravos
Najeela, Blade-Blossom
Firesong & Sunspeaker
Zur the Enchanter
Lazav, the Multifarious
Ishai+Reyhan
Click images for decks->
-Prime Speaker Vannifar
---------------------Will & Rowan Kenrith
Try out Sultai. I've found that going wide with green (things like an Earthcraft or Cryptolith Rite out will help with those mana problems) feeds into black's sacrifice engines and then blue can make this amorphous goo of a deck recycle itself! The Mimeoplasm capitalizes on the discard/self mill themes well
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/magic-fundamentals/magic-general/334931-what-is-the-most-pimp-card-deck-youve-seen-or?comment=5361
Commander
RGOmnath, Locus of Rage Grenades! EDHGR
UWSygg's Defense, EDH - Voltron & ControlWU
BUGMimeoplasm EDH ft. Ifnir Cycling-discard comboBUG
WBTeysa, Connoisseur of CullingBW
BWSelenia & Recruiter of the Guard suicice combo EDHWB
UBRWGO-Kagachi - 5 Color Enchantments - EDHUBRWG
Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest WUR Voltron Control
Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun WU Unblockable Mirror Trickery
Ra's al Ghul (Sidar Kondo) and Face-Down Ninjas
Brudiclad, Token Engineer
Vaevictis (VV2) the Dire Lantern
Rona, Disciple of Gix
Tiana the Auror
Hallar
Ulrich the Politician
Zur the Rebel
Scorpion, Locust, Scarab, Egyptian Gods
O-Kagachi, Mathas, Mairsil
"Non-Tribal" Tribal Generals, Eggs
Nice find!! That's an interesting idea and it fits into EDH well, use the cycling lands and Fluctuator and or Life from the Loam. I don't see a good way to do it multiple times a turn though...
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/magic-fundamentals/magic-general/334931-what-is-the-most-pimp-card-deck-youve-seen-or?comment=5361
Commander
RGOmnath, Locus of Rage Grenades! EDHGR
UWSygg's Defense, EDH - Voltron & ControlWU
BUGMimeoplasm EDH ft. Ifnir Cycling-discard comboBUG
WBTeysa, Connoisseur of CullingBW
BWSelenia & Recruiter of the Guard suicice combo EDHWB
UBRWGO-Kagachi - 5 Color Enchantments - EDHUBRWG
Yeah the issue in EDH being singleton compare to a 60 cards deck, so it might be less useful here.
Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest WUR Voltron Control
Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun WU Unblockable Mirror Trickery
Ra's al Ghul (Sidar Kondo) and Face-Down Ninjas
Brudiclad, Token Engineer
Vaevictis (VV2) the Dire Lantern
Rona, Disciple of Gix
Tiana the Auror
Hallar
Ulrich the Politician
Zur the Rebel
Scorpion, Locust, Scarab, Egyptian Gods
O-Kagachi, Mathas, Mairsil
"Non-Tribal" Tribal Generals, Eggs
Gilded drake would be nice in this kind of deck too.
In Progress
GBIshkanah, Grafwidow ~ BWGRTymna the Weaver & Tana, the Bloodsower ~ UGRashmi, Eternities Crafter ~ RGAtarka, World Render
Also wondering why no Trade Routes if you're in blue to re-cycle those land cards already in play, or cycling lands that don't have cycling on them.
It'll work nicely with niv-mizzet or psychosis crawler.
On phasing:
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