If I'm running a tricolor deck, I almost never find myself needing more duals than 3 Duals, 3 Shocks, 9 Fetches.
If I'm running two-color, I'll generally include Man-Duals, Scrylands, Filterlands, and Checklands (in descending order of goodness, with Pains being just below and not used unless it's a deck with a ton of one-drops)
Bouncelands are unplayably bad unless you're running a ton of synergy like land untappers and Exploration effects.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
My Moderator Helpdesk
Currently Playing:
Legacy: Something U/W Controlish EDH Cube
Hypercube! A New EDH Deck Every Week(ish)!
Filters, for their ability to... well, filter. Mountain, Island and Fire-Lit Thicket can suddenly produce double green for Yavimaya Elder. That's insanely good.
How do people afford to play $500 manabases in each EDH deck? I run budget manabases in every EDH I have, and none of the lan ds is more than $5, apart mybe from Urborg or Minamo, which play very specific roles... I'd rather spend my money on great spells.
How do people afford to play $500 manabases in each EDH deck? I run budget manabases in every EDH I have, and none of the lan ds is more than $5, apart mybe from Urborg or Minamo, which play very specific roles... I'd rather spend my money on great spells.
i'd wanna know too...
though i think in answering the question, filter lands seems the most useful. the checklands could work, but aren't so good in a 5-c deck i suppose.
I love shocks. I run fetches actually only rarely because my meta is slow enough that only the greediest decks require them. I love filter lands even in even two color decks, and in three color decks I favor them over most others.
My darling runs ABUR duals in his favorite decks, but I just cannot bring myself to do it. They're so ... ugly.
How do people afford to play $500 manabases in each EDH deck? I run budget manabases in every EDH I have, and none of the lan ds is more than $5, apart mybe from Urborg or Minamo, which play very specific roles... I'd rather spend my money on great spells.
Well, for me, I own one of every Shock/Fetch/Dual/Check/Scry/Filter for my EDH Cube, and then just put those into whichever deck I'm building at the time when I want a constructed deck.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
My Moderator Helpdesk
Currently Playing:
Legacy: Something U/W Controlish EDH Cube
Hypercube! A New EDH Deck Every Week(ish)!
I don't even run duals. Too pricey, I rather use that money for actual good cards in my decks.
Shocks and Checks are mandatory for me though, with Painlands shortly after. It does kinda depend on the amount of colours in a deck. Dual, I like to run the Filters, but they get worse in decks with more colours as far as I'm concerned. Reflecting Pool and Command Tower are obviously great, Manlands in slower decks, Fastlands in, well, faster decks, Ravnica Bouncelands in slower decks/decks that can abuse the reentering of land/dual mana tap ability...
There's a lot of variables.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
My Commander decks:
Chandra, Torch of Defiance - Oops! All Chandras.
Prime Speaker Zegana - Draw for Power.
Pir & Toothy - Counterpalooza.
Arcades, the Strategist - Another Brick in the Wall.
Zacama, Primal Calamity - Calamity of Double Mana.
Edgar Markov - Vampires Don't Die.
Child of Alara - Dreamcrusher.
I typically add in the Filter Lands after my Fetches and Shocks (Duals too expensive) because it allows me to suddenly have two of a mana I don't have access to otherwise.
A Watery Grave into a Hollowed Fountain gives me some combination of 2 of WUUB, where as a Watery Grave into a Mystic Gate gives me something more akin to 2 of WWUUB1 in some form.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Oath of the Gatewatch; the set that caused the competitive community to freak out over Basic Lands.
Filter lands +1 by a long shot.
Check lands are a longs ways behind
Bounce (double) lands are good too. But they are a little lower on the spectrum.
One important note is that I NEVER use fetch lands outside my colors. So no Polluted Delta in my Karador deck. Huge flavor fail for me. So my 3 color decks usually start with 3 duals, 3 fetches, 3 shocks, 3 filters, then whatever else I need. Not every deck gets duals, only the top decks as I don't have enough to outfit every deck.
Filters > Checks. If you're running duals and shocks, checks are basically extra duals you can't fetch for. Filters serve the unique role of coming into play and giving you two of a color you didn't have previously.
How do people afford to play $500 manabases in each EDH deck? I run budget manabases in every EDH I have, and none of the lan ds is more than $5, apart mybe from Urborg or Minamo, which play very specific roles... I'd rather spend my money on great spells.
i'd wanna know too...
though i think in answering the question, filter lands seems the most useful. the checklands could work, but aren't so good in a 5-c deck i suppose.
Good lands mean you can cast your great spells when you want to. They're also the best investment in Magic, even if you put a lot of money into your manabase, chances are you'll be able to get that money back (or more) whenever you need to.
How do people afford to play $500 manabases in each EDH deck? I run budget manabases in every EDH I have, and none of the lan ds is more than $5, apart mybe from Urborg or Minamo, which play very specific roles... I'd rather spend my money on great spells.
FYI, we don't do it just because we like to flash our status at people. Those "great spells" you talk about really suck when they are stuck in your hand and you don't have the mana to cast them.
When building a mana base for most of my decks I go with:
6 Fetches
3 ABUR Duals
3 Shocks
3 Filters
From there it's usually 9 basics, 3-6 colorless lands, and then whatever else the deck needs.
I know a lot of people aren't as keen on Filters as I am, but they have more than earned their slots over the years.
Good lands mean you can cast your great spells when you want to. They're also the best investment in Magic, even if you put a lot of money into your manabase, chances are you'll be able to get that money back (or more) whenever you need to.
Exactly. They are the foundation for any deck and every deck you build will use the best duals you can get.
Yeah, I love having a good manabase... Poor manabases sometimes hold decks back more than budget non-land equivalents I find. I see people playing decks that have maybe $400-500 worth in value of non-land cards, but whose mana bases are filled with Karoos, Storage Lands, Guildgates, Scrylands ( it actually kinda hurts to dis the scrys as I love some of their art, but truly - they're not that good ).
In answer to the question, though, I would say Filters followed just narrowly by Painlands. I think people really overrate life in EDH. So many EDH loses come from infinite-something or more than lethal damage on a single turn. A land that generated 4 mana and bolted you every turn would probably still be worth running a lot of decks, and much of the time you can still use Painlands for colorless with no drawback.
A $500 manabase didn't necessarily cost $500 when originally purchased. Most of my duals were under $15 when I bought them, so it's not like I have to pay market price every time I build a deck.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
EDH playing competitive Magic cast away
Current Decks GTitania midrange RGThromok tokens/goodstuff | UB Grimgrin zombie tribal GW Sigarda enchantress | R Godo voltron U Braids aggro | WR Kalemne punisher RU Mizzix storm | BUG Mimeoplasm competitive reanimator | UG Ezuri infect
I know a lot of people here who also neglect to mention that they're playing online, so duals are either much cheaper than in paper or free. A few more neglect to mention that they're simply building optimal lists--no plans to have duals at all.
Well, for me, I own one of every Shock/Fetch/Dual/Check/Scry/Filter for my EDH Cube, and then just put those into whichever deck I'm building at the time when I want a constructed deck.
^ same for me as well. I generally have 4-8 of each fetch / shock as well. I often push proxies around and if anyone doesn't like it I will move them between decks.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I have officially moved to MTGNexus. I just wanted to let people know as my response time to salvation decks being bumped is very hit or miss.
How do people afford to play $500 manabases in each EDH deck? I run budget manabases in every EDH I have, and none of the lan ds is more than $5, apart mybe from Urborg or Minamo, which play very specific roles... I'd rather spend my money on great spells.
Few played since the beginning. Others have more. Some, like me, began at the beginning because they had had little. An expansion booster pack of eight cards was $1 while Alpha and Beta ran $1.50 compared to $2.50-3 per Marvel and DC booster. I am unsure what comic books ran at the time. Who would have known MTG was going to be a card game juggernaut? Lucky.
Most...just spend lots of money.
On topic:
The 4th depends on the deck. If the deck is color intensive or combo, I suggest filters. If the deck has land type tutors, Checklands.
Check lands first and then filters if there is room. Usually isn't. Don't care for pain lands and temples and bounce lands are garbage.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Hey guys so I've actually moved on from commander on to 60 card decks so I don't have any commander decks.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
I really don't get the popularity of the dual karoos... but they seem big locally. I guess in the broader scale of things, I don't mind. They make my Strip Mine the happiest little Strip Mine ever.
I really don't get the popularity of the dual karoos... but they seem big locally. I guess in the broader scale of things, I don't mind. They make my Strip Mine the happiest little Strip Mine ever.
If you burn your Strip Mine on a bounceland, I'll thank you, because it means that I can safely play things like Cabal Coffers, Volrath's Stronghold, Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx, Maze of Ith and so on. You know. The kind of lands that are actually worth the cost of destroying them. That's not to say bouncelands are particularly good or anything. On the contrary. But they're not really worth setting yourself back by using a Strip mine on given how good some of the other lands in the format are.
Well, for me, I own one of every Shock/Fetch/Dual/Check/Scry/Filter for my EDH Cube, and then just put those into whichever deck I'm building at the time when I want a constructed deck.
I run mine similar to this, only I do like to use Painlands as well, and probably before Scry.
Depending on the deck, the Auntie's Hovel cycle can be great, sometimes even better than shocks. Generally though, I'd say checklands are my 4th favorite. Filters can get awkward in 3+ color decks.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
From there I fill as needed the rest of the lands, but I was curious, what does the rest of the community consider the 4th best land cycle?
Obvious contenders are:
If I'm running two-color, I'll generally include Man-Duals, Scrylands, Filterlands, and Checklands (in descending order of goodness, with Pains being just below and not used unless it's a deck with a ton of one-drops)
Bouncelands are unplayably bad unless you're running a ton of synergy like land untappers and Exploration effects.
Currently Playing:
Legacy: Something U/W Controlish
EDH Cube
Hypercube! A New EDH Deck Every Week(ish)!
UR Mizzix of the Izmagnus ~~~ Build your own win-condition: Finite Spellslinging
UR Brudiclad, Telchor Engineer ~~~ We are the Borg. We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own.
WUB Oloro, Ageless Ascetic ~~~ A Guide to dying slowly
UBR Marchesa, the Black Rose ~~~ Marchesa's undying Marionettes
RGW Mayael the Anima ~~~ All Hail the Big Chungus
GWU Chulane, Teller of Tales ~~~ Permanents Only ETB Shenanigans
BGU Sidisi, Brood Tyrant ~~~ Sidisi's Restless Servants
WUBRG The Ur-Dragon ~~~ Dragons eat your face
i'd wanna know too...
though i think in answering the question, filter lands seems the most useful. the checklands could work, but aren't so good in a 5-c deck i suppose.
Legacy - Solidarity - mono U aggro - burn - Imperial Painter - Strawberry Shortcake - Bluuzards - bom
My darling runs ABUR duals in his favorite decks, but I just cannot bring myself to do it. They're so ... ugly.
Checklands are great.
Well, for me, I own one of every Shock/Fetch/Dual/Check/Scry/Filter for my EDH Cube, and then just put those into whichever deck I'm building at the time when I want a constructed deck.
Currently Playing:
Legacy: Something U/W Controlish
EDH Cube
Hypercube! A New EDH Deck Every Week(ish)!
Shocks and Checks are mandatory for me though, with Painlands shortly after. It does kinda depend on the amount of colours in a deck. Dual, I like to run the Filters, but they get worse in decks with more colours as far as I'm concerned. Reflecting Pool and Command Tower are obviously great, Manlands in slower decks, Fastlands in, well, faster decks, Ravnica Bouncelands in slower decks/decks that can abuse the reentering of land/dual mana tap ability...
There's a lot of variables.
Chandra, Torch of Defiance - Oops! All Chandras.
Prime Speaker Zegana - Draw for Power.
Pir & Toothy - Counterpalooza.
Arcades, the Strategist - Another Brick in the Wall.
Zacama, Primal Calamity - Calamity of Double Mana.
Edgar Markov - Vampires Don't Die.
Child of Alara - Dreamcrusher.
I typically add in the Filter Lands after my Fetches and Shocks (Duals too expensive) because it allows me to suddenly have two of a mana I don't have access to otherwise.
A Watery Grave into a Hollowed Fountain gives me some combination of 2 of WUUB, where as a Watery Grave into a Mystic Gate gives me something more akin to 2 of WWUUB1 in some form.
Check lands are a longs ways behind
Bounce (double) lands are good too. But they are a little lower on the spectrum.
One important note is that I NEVER use fetch lands outside my colors. So no Polluted Delta in my Karador deck. Huge flavor fail for me. So my 3 color decks usually start with 3 duals, 3 fetches, 3 shocks, 3 filters, then whatever else I need. Not every deck gets duals, only the top decks as I don't have enough to outfit every deck.
Untapped > Tapped for lands, always, IMO.
Good lands mean you can cast your great spells when you want to. They're also the best investment in Magic, even if you put a lot of money into your manabase, chances are you'll be able to get that money back (or more) whenever you need to.
Draft my Peasant Cube.
When building a mana base for most of my decks I go with:
6 Fetches
3 ABUR Duals
3 Shocks
3 Filters
From there it's usually 9 basics, 3-6 colorless lands, and then whatever else the deck needs.
I know a lot of people aren't as keen on Filters as I am, but they have more than earned their slots over the years.
Exactly. They are the foundation for any deck and every deck you build will use the best duals you can get.
WUBRGPauper Battle BoxWUBRG ... and why I am not a fan of Wayne Reynolds' Illustrations.
Yeah, I love having a good manabase... Poor manabases sometimes hold decks back more than budget non-land equivalents I find. I see people playing decks that have maybe $400-500 worth in value of non-land cards, but whose mana bases are filled with Karoos, Storage Lands, Guildgates, Scrylands ( it actually kinda hurts to dis the scrys as I love some of their art, but truly - they're not that good ).
In answer to the question, though, I would say Filters followed just narrowly by Painlands. I think people really overrate life in EDH. So many EDH loses come from infinite-something or more than lethal damage on a single turn. A land that generated 4 mana and bolted you every turn would probably still be worth running a lot of decks, and much of the time you can still use Painlands for colorless with no drawback.
UTeferi, Temporal ArchmageU's prison: blue is the new orange is the new black.
Mizzix Of The Izmagnus : wheels on fire... rolling down the road...
BSidisi, Undead VizierB: Bis zum Erbrechen
GTitiania, Protector Of ArgothG: Protecting Argoth, by blowing it up!
GYisan, The Wanderer BardG: Gradus Ad Elfball.
Duel EDH: Yisan & Titania.
In Progress: Grand Arbiter Augustin IV duel; Grenzo, Dungeon Warden Doomsday.
Current Decks
GTitania midrange
RGThromok tokens/goodstuff | UB Grimgrin zombie tribal
GW Sigarda enchantress | R Godo voltron
U Braids aggro | WR Kalemne punisher
RU Mizzix storm | BUG Mimeoplasm competitive reanimator | UG Ezuri infect
^ same for me as well. I generally have 4-8 of each fetch / shock as well. I often push proxies around and if anyone doesn't like it I will move them between decks.
Signature by Inkfox Aesthetics by Xen
[Modern] Allies
Few played since the beginning. Others have more. Some, like me, began at the beginning because they had had little. An expansion booster pack of eight cards was $1 while Alpha and Beta ran $1.50 compared to $2.50-3 per Marvel and DC booster. I am unsure what comic books ran at the time. Who would have known MTG was going to be a card game juggernaut? Lucky.
Most...just spend lots of money.
On topic:
The 4th depends on the deck. If the deck is color intensive or combo, I suggest filters. If the deck has land type tutors, Checklands.
Keep brewing.
Anyway I've started my own gameplay channel in which I play games (Magic also)
Twitch:
https://www.twitch.tv/dies_to_doom_blade
Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/user/UpsidedownHandshake
I really don't get the popularity of the dual karoos... but they seem big locally. I guess in the broader scale of things, I don't mind. They make my Strip Mine the happiest little Strip Mine ever.
UTeferi, Temporal ArchmageU's prison: blue is the new orange is the new black.
Mizzix Of The Izmagnus : wheels on fire... rolling down the road...
BSidisi, Undead VizierB: Bis zum Erbrechen
GTitiania, Protector Of ArgothG: Protecting Argoth, by blowing it up!
GYisan, The Wanderer BardG: Gradus Ad Elfball.
Duel EDH: Yisan & Titania.
In Progress: Grand Arbiter Augustin IV duel; Grenzo, Dungeon Warden Doomsday.
If you burn your Strip Mine on a bounceland, I'll thank you, because it means that I can safely play things like Cabal Coffers, Volrath's Stronghold, Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx, Maze of Ith and so on. You know. The kind of lands that are actually worth the cost of destroying them. That's not to say bouncelands are particularly good or anything. On the contrary. But they're not really worth setting yourself back by using a Strip mine on given how good some of the other lands in the format are.
I run mine similar to this, only I do like to use Painlands as well, and probably before Scry.