In most of my EDH decks, I have a ring of three wishes, because of that card's immense utility, but in two decks, I instead have a tower of fortunes, because those decks contain cards that interact with the drawing of cards (specifically, horizon chimera and Niv-Mizzet, the Firemind). However, I am wondering if that is a wise decision, if I should instead use the ring over the tower. I shall compare the cards below:
Ring of Three Wishes
- Higher casting cost
+ Lower cost to use ability
- Ability can be used only a certain number of times
-/+ Ability can gain only one card at a time, but it can be any card from its controller's library
Tower of Fortunes
+ Lower casting cost
- Higher cost to use ability
+ Ability can be used any number of times
+/- Ability cannot obtain a specific card, but instead gains four cards simultaneously (at an average cost of 2 mana per card)
What does everyone else say about this? Should I keep the tower in my decks to interact with my creatures, or is the ring invariably superior?
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“Those who would trade their freedoms for security will have neither.”-Benjamin Franklin
“When the people fear the government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.”-Thomas Jefferson
“A vote is like a rifle; its usefulness depends upon the character of its user.”-Theodore Roosevelt
“Patriotism means to stand by one's country; it does not mean to stand by one's president.”-Theodore Roosevelt
Personally, I like to run liar's pendulum
It's cheap and let's you bluff what you have in your hand and activates for 2 mana
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pucatrade
big receipts
alpha mox emerald
beta time walk
4 goyfs received
3 liliana of the veil
4 karn liberated
3 force of will
4 grove of the burnwillows
snapcaster mage
3 horizon canopy
2 full art damnation
I'd vote ring. You're able to activate it earlier/with less investment and you can grab a high-power draw spell if that's what you need at the time. Usually, tutoring 3x puts you in enough of a lead to win, but if repeatability is a concern, I'd run Planar Portal before Tower of Fortunes.
Tower of Fortunes is a card in Azusa, I believe, but that is about it. Ring of Three Wishes is worse than Planar Portal unless there is a specific reason the 5/5 rather than 6/6 array of costs is necessary.
I would say Mind's Eye is better than either most of the time.
For those users who are suggesting that I use planar portal in my decks, I actually did have that card in all of my EDH decks, but I then decided that ring of three wishes was better, as it costs less mana to use, and three uses of the card is likely sufficient to turn the tide of a game in my favor (I even started a discussion of that subject on this forum, which is what led me to switch the portal for the ring).
For those users who are suggesting that I use planar portal in my decks, I actually did have that card in all of my EDH decks, but I then decided that ring of three wishes was better, as it costs less mana to use, and three uses of the card is likely sufficient to turn the tide of a game in my favor (I even started a discussion of that subject on this forum, which is what led me to switch the portal for the ring).
What you're saying makes sense, but I've never seen a Portal used to much effect outside of Unwinding Clock decks... Where the limitation on Ring is a real issue
For those users who are suggesting that I use planar portal in my decks, I actually did have that card in all of my EDH decks, but I then decided that ring of three wishes was better, as it costs less mana to use, and three uses of the card is likely sufficient to turn the tide of a game in my favor (I even started a discussion of that subject on this forum, which is what led me to switch the portal for the ring).
Yeah the Ring is better overall.
It's still not really good though, what is your reasoning behind "running it in each deck"?
It's still not really good though, what is your reasoning behind "running it in each deck"?
Because it is so very awesome: it is colorless, useable at instant speed, and (most importantly) repeatable. Plus, in a format such as EDH, where everything is on a larger scale, paying its high mana cost is not a major problem. What deck would not benefit from such a card?
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“Those who would trade their freedoms for security will have neither.”-Benjamin Franklin
“When the people fear the government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.”-Thomas Jefferson
“A vote is like a rifle; its usefulness depends upon the character of its user.”-Theodore Roosevelt
“Patriotism means to stand by one's country; it does not mean to stand by one's president.”-Theodore Roosevelt
Because it is so very awesome: it is colorless, useable at instant speed, and (most importantly) repeatable. Plus, in a format such as EDH, where everything is on a larger scale, paying its high mana cost is not a major problem. What deck would not benefit from such a card?
Because it is so very awesome: it is colorless, useable at instant speed, and (most importantly) repeatable. Plus, in a format such as EDH, where everything is on a larger scale, paying its high mana cost is not a major problem. What deck would not benefit from such a card?
Decks that run black, or decks with low CMC.
+ Decks that expect opponents to win if you waste 10 mana on a tutor.
+ Decks with a good curve
+ Decks with blue
+ Aggro decks
+ Beatdown decks
+ Control decks
+..
+ Decks that expect opponents to win if you waste 10 mana on a tutor.
+ Decks with a good curve
+ Decks with blue
+ Aggro decks
+ Beatdown decks
+ Control decks
+..
I use it in mono red, big mana... lol, but that's about it.
Ring of Three Wishes is completely baller in mono-red, where if you activate it three times without getting it wrecked, you probably won anyway.
Planar Portal was good, but shaving off that extra mana is extremely relevant, assuming you're actually trying to kill your opponents before they kill you.
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Oh, you think the losers' bracket is your ally, but you merely adopted the scrub tier. I was born in it, molded by it. I didn’t 4-0 an FNM until I was already a man; by then, it was nothing to me but an extra pack to sell for store credit!
I’d go with the ring for sure, but when I use it I have other cards to really make it worth it’s buck, for starters I run a black green and blue control edh deck, so one of the legendary creatures I run (could use as a commander in this case but don’t) is muldrotha the gravetide, it effectively allows me to play ring of three wishes from the graveyard again, that with a couple other tutor cards in case I don’t get the ring right away, I end up getting one of them, allowing me to pull the aforementioned and any game winning combo I want, it’s kind of a bore having to reshuffle quite a few times, but it gets an easy win just about every time
Why would you play Tower of Fortunes in a deck that has blue.. ?
This hardly makes any sense to me.
Each color has their restrictions, and those restrictions can be loopholed by using artifacts.
Blue doesn't need a card-draw loophole.
To clarify, a blue (or green or black, the colors more likely to have a similar card anyway) deck may still benefit from something like Skullclamp, which is basically broken by any relevant card (mana dorks, tokens, Fecundity, Momentous Fall, Greater Good, Kresh the Bloodbraided, any creature that sacrifices itself, exploit...) and pretty wtf on its own (and there's an interesting story about how it became +1/-1 because +1/+2 seemed "too good"). But Tower of Fortunes is no Clamp. Unless you like spending 8 every turn. Yes, mana cost matters in Commander. Curves still exist.
Tower of Fortunes is more like Book of Rass, which is a bad colorless Greed, but surprisingly popular in Commander because of the color identity rules: Greed has been replaced with Dictate of Erebos (or just Necropotence) but Book of Rass still sees a lot of play. It's popular because white has no way to draw cards, red has very few ways to draw cards, and green card draw generally depends on your board state. But blue and black should never use it.
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Card advantage is not the same thing as card draw. Something for 2B cannot be strictly worse than something for BBB or 3BB. If you're taking out Swords to Plowshares for Plummet, you're a fool. Stop doing these things!
Ring of Three Wishes
- Higher casting cost
+ Lower cost to use ability
- Ability can be used only a certain number of times
-/+ Ability can gain only one card at a time, but it can be any card from its controller's library
Tower of Fortunes
+ Lower casting cost
- Higher cost to use ability
+ Ability can be used any number of times
+/- Ability cannot obtain a specific card, but instead gains four cards simultaneously (at an average cost of 2 mana per card)
What does everyone else say about this? Should I keep the tower in my decks to interact with my creatures, or is the ring invariably superior?
“When the people fear the government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.”-Thomas Jefferson
“A vote is like a rifle; its usefulness depends upon the character of its user.”-Theodore Roosevelt
“Patriotism means to stand by one's country; it does not mean to stand by one's president.”-Theodore Roosevelt
Personally, I like to run liar's pendulum
It's cheap and let's you bluff what you have in your hand and activates for 2 mana
pucatrade
big receipts
alpha mox emerald
beta time walk
4 goyfs received
3 liliana of the veil
4 karn liberated
3 force of will
4 grove of the burnwillows
snapcaster mage
3 horizon canopy
2 full art damnation
This hardly makes any sense to me.
Each color has their restrictions, and those restrictions can be loopholed by using artifacts.
Blue doesn't need a card-draw loophole.
[Primer] Kozilek, Butcher with Juice.
I would say Mind's Eye is better than either most of the time.
“When the people fear the government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.”-Thomas Jefferson
“A vote is like a rifle; its usefulness depends upon the character of its user.”-Theodore Roosevelt
“Patriotism means to stand by one's country; it does not mean to stand by one's president.”-Theodore Roosevelt
What you're saying makes sense, but I've never seen a Portal used to much effect outside of Unwinding Clock decks... Where the limitation on Ring is a real issue
Yeah the Ring is better overall.
It's still not really good though, what is your reasoning behind "running it in each deck"?
[Primer] Kozilek, Butcher with Juice.
Because it is so very awesome: it is colorless, useable at instant speed, and (most importantly) repeatable. Plus, in a format such as EDH, where everything is on a larger scale, paying its high mana cost is not a major problem. What deck would not benefit from such a card?
“When the people fear the government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.”-Thomas Jefferson
“A vote is like a rifle; its usefulness depends upon the character of its user.”-Theodore Roosevelt
“Patriotism means to stand by one's country; it does not mean to stand by one's president.”-Theodore Roosevelt
Decks that run black, or decks with low CMC.
+ Decks that expect opponents to win if you waste 10 mana on a tutor.
+ Decks with a good curve
+ Decks with blue
+ Aggro decks
+ Beatdown decks
+ Control decks
+..
[Primer] Kozilek, Butcher with Juice.
I use it in mono red, big mana... lol, but that's about it.
Planar Portal was good, but shaving off that extra mana is extremely relevant, assuming you're actually trying to kill your opponents before they kill you.
8.RG Green Devotion Ramp/Combo 9.UR Draw Triggers 10.WUR Group stalling 11.WUR Voltron Spellslinger 12.WB Sacrificial Shenanigans
13.BR Creatureless Panharmonicon 14.BR Pingers and Eldrazi 15.URG Untapped Cascading
16.Reyhan, last of the Abzan's WUBG +1/+1 Counter Craziness 17.WUBRG Dragons aka Why did I make this?
Building: The Gitrog Monster lands, Glissa the Traitor stax, Muldrotha, the Gravetide Planeswalker Combo, Kydele, Chosen of Kruphix + Sidar Kondo of Jamuraa Clues, and Tribal Scarecrow Planeswalkers
To clarify, a blue (or green or black, the colors more likely to have a similar card anyway) deck may still benefit from something like Skullclamp, which is basically broken by any relevant card (mana dorks, tokens, Fecundity, Momentous Fall, Greater Good, Kresh the Bloodbraided, any creature that sacrifices itself, exploit...) and pretty wtf on its own (and there's an interesting story about how it became +1/-1 because +1/+2 seemed "too good"). But Tower of Fortunes is no Clamp. Unless you like spending 8 every turn. Yes, mana cost matters in Commander. Curves still exist.
Tower of Fortunes is more like Book of Rass, which is a bad colorless Greed, but surprisingly popular in Commander because of the color identity rules: Greed has been replaced with Dictate of Erebos (or just Necropotence) but Book of Rass still sees a lot of play. It's popular because white has no way to draw cards, red has very few ways to draw cards, and green card draw generally depends on your board state. But blue and black should never use it.
On phasing:
Retired EDH - Tibor and Lumia | [PR]Nemata |Ramirez dePietro | [C]Edric | Riku | Jenara | Lazav | Heliod | Daxos | Roon | Kozilek