I don't understand the complaints against infinite combos.
Would you seriously rather watch a player recur Time Stretch some arbitrary number of times and take a bunch of extra turns or just let them 'go infinite' and say 'nice job, lets shuffle up and play again'?
I find that if you're playgroup is mature and the 'easy' combos annoy people then people will tend to back off the combos that are easy to assemble.
It's when you don't play with a regular playroup that the consistency of the banlist becomes a necessity.
Yup I would. let them unfold, and laugh as they go to end the game with and cast Rout
From this post, some have generated the "Tip of the Iceburg Theory." If you ban the most degenerate card/combo of each scenario, I see some kind of consistency there. If you look at it without considering this "Tip of the Iceburg Theory" there is absolutely no consistency what so ever, since all these cards are not banned. If this "Tip of the Iceburg Theory" is true I believe with each new set of power creep there needs to be a "reevaluation" of what's at the top of each scenario.
This. If it's inconsistent to ban the moxen but not other undercosted cards, then half the cards in Magic would have to be banned. You have to draw a line between "undercosted" and "broken," otherwise every good constructed card is going to be banned. You can argue that Kokusho and Primeval Titan both centralise the game, but to different degrees; much like you can argue that Skullclamp is degenerate card advantage where Carnage Altar isn't. It's not inconsistent to say, "This is the point where this effect becomes unfun/broken/bad for the format."
But you do have to make those lines and the reason you're drawing them explicit.
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On average, Magic players are worse at new card evaluation than almost every other skill, except perhaps sideboarding.
Keeping in mind that the main reason that this format exists is to ensure that everybody is having a fun, socially-interacting game, I myself can only agree that the size of the ban list is where it should be. Here's why: as already stated many times over, when you start touching on what should be banned and what should not be and you are looking into the same categories of problematic cards, I think hitting the real doozies is the best, and most obvious place to start. If you digress into "if that's banned, this should be too", then this list that is set as a guide line becomes engorged and pisses people off. All points already covered, and quite honestly rather obvious. But weren't the cards set on the banned list only suggestions?? A list of cards to keep the douche level to a minimum?? I see this level at a fiery high right now. I look around and see a lot of broken stuff going on, and you know what, I just ignore it Sheldon. This amazing format has always been to me about the enjoyment of social interaction, not about breaking another format to prove some kind of dominance. If people are going to hate you because they think something is inconstant, they maybe they should look at what is being played around them and react to that instead of freaking out about the banned list. Are you having fun?? No, then ****ing fix it yourself. Be proactive.
I think you guys are doing a great job at keeping this format a great one in spite of the massive spike of new players (pun intended...) who have flooded into it. I feel it has always been up to the players to police themselves in a casual environment, and what is going on is that players are becoming overwhelmed with the power level that accompanies this format, instead of checking what is sensible and what is broken "fun".
My friends and I are now categorizing players, no styles of play into two category's. The first one being "EDH Players" those who can control themselves and provide a fun socially acceptable game. And two: "Commander" players: who have taken this format to a level of seriousness that, at least I believe, is unnecessary. To each their own, I've just been an EDH player all along.
End of Line
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The sportos, the motorheads, geeks, ****s, bloods, wasteoids, dweebies, dikheads — they all adore him. They think he's a righteous dude.
EDH DECKS:
BGWKarador: Rock out with your **** out RGBorBor Unragey: Lightning bolts for everyone BGUMimeoplasm: +1/+1 counters RWUZedruu- Free off the top forging
I think the RC has done a pretty good job for what they're working with. If anything banning more cards will just make things worse except maybe extreme cases like hermit druid. Maybe take Kokusho off? I don't know. Overall I'm pleased with the job you guys have done.
Part of the problem with discussions such as these is that building a deck in MtG represents a mixture of at least two distinct costs: CMC costs (color-related CMC costs), and monetary costs. Some may not be financially able to simply "improve [their] deck" with answers to "easily answerable cards" -- at least not with the most effective (low CMC) cards that do this.
@peterhooper
This is the second time in a row you have revived a thread over seven years old. Before posting to a thread you did not find on the first page, check the post dates.
Yup I would. let them unfold, and laugh as they go to end the game with and cast Rout
This. If it's inconsistent to ban the moxen but not other undercosted cards, then half the cards in Magic would have to be banned. You have to draw a line between "undercosted" and "broken," otherwise every good constructed card is going to be banned. You can argue that Kokusho and Primeval Titan both centralise the game, but to different degrees; much like you can argue that Skullclamp is degenerate card advantage where Carnage Altar isn't. It's not inconsistent to say, "This is the point where this effect becomes unfun/broken/bad for the format."
But you do have to make those lines and the reason you're drawing them explicit.
I think you guys are doing a great job at keeping this format a great one in spite of the massive spike of new players (pun intended...) who have flooded into it. I feel it has always been up to the players to police themselves in a casual environment, and what is going on is that players are becoming overwhelmed with the power level that accompanies this format, instead of checking what is sensible and what is broken "fun".
My friends and I are now categorizing players, no styles of play into two category's. The first one being "EDH Players" those who can control themselves and provide a fun socially acceptable game. And two: "Commander" players: who have taken this format to a level of seriousness that, at least I believe, is unnecessary. To each their own, I've just been an EDH player all along.
End of Line
EDH DECKS:
BGWKarador: Rock out with your **** out
RGBorBor Unragey: Lightning bolts for everyone
BGUMimeoplasm: +1/+1 counters
RWUZedruu- Free off the top forging
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