No, he does make you Wrath-immune although he himself is not. So, I would definitely run Wrath, Damnation, and Rout in here.
If you want to make him indestructable, you can equip him with Shield of Kaldra (or copy him somehow, but that's difficult outside of blue).
I like the deck a lot. I'm not a fan of the enchantments you are running, especially when you are missing the best enchantment in your colors: Pernicious Deed.
Cairn Wanderer would be another good treefolk, um, I mean shaman.
No, he does make you Wrath-immune although he himself is not. So, I would definitely run Wrath, Damnation, and Rout in here.
If you want to make him indestructable, you can equip him with Shield of Kaldra (or copy him somehow, but that's difficult outside of blue).
I like the deck a lot. I'm not a fan of the enchantments you are running, especially when you are missing the best enchantment in your colors: Pernicious Deed.
Cairn Wanderer would be another good treefolk, um, I mean shaman.
Cheers,
rant
Pernicious Deed, Wrath, and Damnation will definitly be put it then. Probably skip Rout, as I don't want to go overkill on board sweepers.
Though I suppose with the amount of recursion I can put in, along with adding Saffi Eriksdotter, getting my Timber Protector back into play won't be hard. Adding Living Wish, along with Riftsweeper could even get him out of the removed from game zone. Riftsweeper/Eternal Witness combined with Treefolk Harbinger is potentially reusable fetch as well.
okay, I realize that when Doran is in play, the card is essentially a 3/3 Treefolk.... However, the card is a Treefolk that will bounce back to your hand whenever it dies, plus it has built in Trample.... making it incredibly good when you don't have Doran in play. So I must ask, where is Weatherseed Treefolk???
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"As the size of an explosion increases, the number of social situations it is incapable of solving approaches zero." -- Varsuvius, Order of the Stick
Riftsweeper is banned in EDH, because it can shuffle Generals into libraries.
Damn, I should have thought of that. So other then Living Wish (and the rest of the cycle), are there any other cards in the format that bring back RFG cards?
I kept Weatherseed Treefolk out for the reasons you guys mentioned. However you are right, Doran won't be out all the time, and it that case, it is a very good card.
Dragon Fangs is an aura, thus it can be 2 for 1'ed against you. However it does have that recursability clause, making it far better than most auras.
Yah I wouldn't consider it if it wasn't reusable. However one thing I noticed is a lot of my Treefolk lack trample, and this seemed like a great way to slap it on.
As for Loxodon Warhammer.... +3/+0, Trample, and Lifelink.... meaning when Doran is out, you essentially get +0/+0, Trample, and Lifelink...
Right, duh again. I had Loxodon in my head as +3/+3.
I'm trying to limit the different types of creatures I put in, unless they serve a specific fault in the deck that Treefolk and Shaman suffer. I've added Spiders for instance, because they just work well with the nature/tree theme (IMO) and cover a weakness (flying creatures). Spirits and Elementals I "might" stretch for, as I associate them with Shamans.
I do like Wave of Reckoning though.
Will update deck list soon, making cuts and changes. At work, so can't do major changes without being obvious.
there are 25 slots left available for lands.... I realize this deck has 3x Land Fetches.... but do you really think that 25 lands is enough when the normal EDH deck runs between 34 and 40 lands??? Even with your land fetches you aren't running nearly as many lands as you should be.
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"As the size of an explosion increases, the number of social situations it is incapable of solving approaches zero." -- Varsuvius, Order of the Stick
there are 25 slots left available for lands.... I realize this deck has 3x Land Fetches.... but do you really think that 25 lands is enough when the normal EDH deck runs between 34 and 40 lands??? Even with your land fetches you aren't running nearly as many lands as you should be.
Well aware of that. This is still a preliminary list up for criticism and the count is actually at 65 cards (I separated out the shortlist section, which is where I was placing cards to consider) E.g. looking to cut cards, compare cards, replace cards etc. etc.
Working on the mana base today as well as notes on combinations and choices.
Some of my cards I don't mind saccing (Deadwood, Woodfall Primus etc.) especially when I make them indestructible. Combined with a lot of creatures with high toughness? Just seemed too obvious. It's great protection against RFG cards as well on vidal creatures I want back in my graveyard.
I'm not sure if thats what you mean, but saccing an industructible creature kills them. Industructible only prevents "Destroy" and lethal "damage". Sacrificing will kill them as normal.
I'm not sure if thats what you mean, but saccing an industructible creature kills them. Indestructible only prevents "Destroy" and lethal "damage". Sacrificing will kill them as normal.
That is exactly what I wanted. I know Deadwood dies on its own, but it gives me the option of saccing it early to get the second card back. I also like having the option of saccing Woodfall Primus whenever I want for its persist effect (which I know only happens once). The saccing works around my own indestructible creatures which if my opponent can't/won't kill them, at least I can.
E.g.Saffi Eriksdotter out, play Deadwood Treefolk (get 1 card), sac Saffi, targeting Deadwood, sac Deadwood (2nd card back), Deadwood returns to play, get Saffi back.
I think I need some graveyard protection of some sort now that I think about it.
except I don't think Saffi is able to protect something from being saced.... just a kink in your plan...
Why not?
Saffi reads: "Sacrifice Saffi Eriksdotter: When target creature is put into your graveyard from play this turn, return that card to play".
If I read that correctly, I sac Saffi, target my Deadwood Treefolk. Anytime it is put into the graveyard (which saccing does), return that card to play.
I don't mind people poking holes in some of the combo's, but how about some feedback on the rest of the deck? It's not like the whole thing revolves around saccing my creatures.
Saffi reads: "Sacrifice Saffi Eriksdotter: When target creature is put into your graveyard from play this turn, return that card to play".
If I read that correctly, I sac Saffi, target my Deadwood Treefolk. Anytime it is put into the graveyard (which saccing does), return that card to play.
I don't mind people poking holes in some of the combo's, but how about some feedback on the rest of the deck? It's not like the whole thing revolves around saccing my creatures.
oh jeeze, I totally misread Saffi, I thought she read "when target creature is destroyed" not "when target creature is put into your graveyard"
My bad....
I will get to the rest of your deck sometime tomorrow... right now me is sleepy....
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"As the size of an explosion increases, the number of social situations it is incapable of solving approaches zero." -- Varsuvius, Order of the Stick
I recommend Rootgrapple. Or at least Desert Twister. Or both.
Considering Rootgrapple again for Planeswalkers. Like Desert Twister, except its cost, and for what? Hardest thing getting people's suggestions is getting an idea of what to take out. E.g. why are the cards you are recommending more important then other cards?
you might wanna consider wrath of god as well as damnation, and i'd also suggest path to exile
Over what? All the sweep spells serve a purpose, so that means taking a card out elsewhere, and I'm already finding it hard to pull from anywhere, unless it is a direct replacement of a similar card.
depends on what you are trying to do with it. Sure, the Key would allow you to play more spells than just the General (or other legendaries in the deck) at a reduced cost. However, the Land would allow you to reduce the extra casting cost of playing the General again after it has been removed from the game at least once by 2 points. If I had to choose, I would probably run both cards personally, as that would raise the likely hood of seeing one or the other in a given game.
Granted though, I am not actually running either in my own EDH deck.
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"As the size of an explosion increases, the number of social situations it is incapable of solving approaches zero." -- Varsuvius, Order of the Stick
Corrupt and Consume Spirit type cards seem good for those two cards... the problem with them is that they are dependant on you getting Urborg, and Cabal Coffers.
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"As the size of an explosion increases, the number of social situations it is incapable of solving approaches zero." -- Varsuvius, Order of the Stick
I've had these in and out of the list before, but the whole point of cards like Wordly Tutor and Congregation at Dawn, are to work with cards like Sapling of Colfenor and Leaf-Crowned Elder. Making them IMO, superior for this particular deck.
Cutting any of the other Tutors seems counter productive since they can find anything.
Entomb, the last one that "could" be cut for either of those, also has synergy in the deck. Namely it can work as mana fixing by dropping Riftstone Portal into my graveyard, or a major combat trick by dropping Brawn into my graveyard after someone tries to chump block my trees (especially fun with Unstoppable Ash out).
So while I agree they are good cards, and maybe I could add them in addition, what would you cut? That's always the biggest question I have when people suggest things: What would you cut, and why do you consider the card better then the card it replaces.
RW Kalemne, Disciple of Iroas
If you want to make him indestructable, you can equip him with Shield of Kaldra (or copy him somehow, but that's difficult outside of blue).
I like the deck a lot. I'm not a fan of the enchantments you are running, especially when you are missing the best enchantment in your colors: Pernicious Deed.
Cairn Wanderer would be another good treefolk, um, I mean shaman.
Cheers,
rant
My Cube
CubeCobra: https://cubecobra.com/cube/overview/5f5d0310ed602310515d4c32
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Pernicious Deed, Wrath, and Damnation will definitly be put it then. Probably skip Rout, as I don't want to go overkill on board sweepers.
Though I suppose with the amount of recursion I can put in, along with adding Saffi Eriksdotter, getting my Timber Protector back into play won't be hard. Adding Living Wish, along with Riftsweeper could even get him out of the removed from game zone. Riftsweeper/Eternal Witness combined with Treefolk Harbinger is potentially reusable fetch as well.
Hmmm...I'm liking this more and more.
RW Kalemne, Disciple of Iroas
Angelic Protector combos pretty well with Lightning Greaves and Doran.
Loxodon Warhammer is awful with Doran, and you want to play Doran, so you don't want to play Loxodon Warhammer.
Some other guys to play might be Blessed Orator, Oathsworn Giant, and Veteran Armorer.
Wave of Reckoning seems really good with your guys. Solidarity is also fun.
Damn, I should have thought of that. So other then Living Wish (and the rest of the cycle), are there any other cards in the format that bring back RFG cards?
I kept Weatherseed Treefolk out for the reasons you guys mentioned. However you are right, Doran won't be out all the time, and it that case, it is a very good card.
What do you guys think of Dragon Fangs?
Why is Loxodon Warhammer bad?
RW Kalemne, Disciple of Iroas
Dragon Fangs is an aura, thus it can be 2 for 1'ed against you. However it does have that recursability clause, making it far better than most auras.
As for Loxodon Warhammer.... +3/+0, Trample, and Lifelink.... meaning when Doran is out, you essentially get +0/+0, Trample, and Lifelink...
Yah I wouldn't consider it if it wasn't reusable. However one thing I noticed is a lot of my Treefolk lack trample, and this seemed like a great way to slap it on.
Right, duh again. I had Loxodon in my head as +3/+3.
I'm trying to limit the different types of creatures I put in, unless they serve a specific fault in the deck that Treefolk and Shaman suffer. I've added Spiders for instance, because they just work well with the nature/tree theme (IMO) and cover a weakness (flying creatures). Spirits and Elementals I "might" stretch for, as I associate them with Shamans.
I do like Wave of Reckoning though.
Will update deck list soon, making cuts and changes. At work, so can't do major changes without being obvious.
RW Kalemne, Disciple of Iroas
Well aware of that. This is still a preliminary list up for criticism and the count is actually at 65 cards (I separated out the shortlist section, which is where I was placing cards to consider) E.g. looking to cut cards, compare cards, replace cards etc. etc.
Working on the mana base today as well as notes on combinations and choices.
EDIT: Land added
RW Kalemne, Disciple of Iroas
I'm not sure if thats what you mean, but saccing an industructible creature kills them. Industructible only prevents "Destroy" and lethal "damage". Sacrificing will kill them as normal.
Thanks to Spiderboy4 of High~Light Studios!
That is exactly what I wanted. I know Deadwood dies on its own, but it gives me the option of saccing it early to get the second card back. I also like having the option of saccing Woodfall Primus whenever I want for its persist effect (which I know only happens once). The saccing works around my own indestructible creatures which if my opponent can't/won't kill them, at least I can.
E.g.Saffi Eriksdotter out, play Deadwood Treefolk (get 1 card), sac Saffi, targeting Deadwood, sac Deadwood (2nd card back), Deadwood returns to play, get Saffi back.
I think I need some graveyard protection of some sort now that I think about it.
RW Kalemne, Disciple of Iroas
except I don't think Saffi is able to protect something from being saced.... just a kink in your plan...
Why not?
Saffi reads: "Sacrifice Saffi Eriksdotter: When target creature is put into your graveyard from play this turn, return that card to play".
If I read that correctly, I sac Saffi, target my Deadwood Treefolk. Anytime it is put into the graveyard (which saccing does), return that card to play.
I don't mind people poking holes in some of the combo's, but how about some feedback on the rest of the deck? It's not like the whole thing revolves around saccing my creatures.
RW Kalemne, Disciple of Iroas
oh jeeze, I totally misread Saffi, I thought she read "when target creature is destroyed" not "when target creature is put into your graveyard"
My bad....
I will get to the rest of your deck sometime tomorrow... right now me is sleepy....
Also have you considered the following lands:
Eiganjo Castle
Okina, Temple to the Grandfathers
Shizo, Death's Storehouse
I don't think you have too many Legendaries, however those cards would make your Doran, the Siege Tower a force to be reckoned with....
Another card to consider is Untaidake, the Cloud Keeper as that card essentially makes it easier to recast a defeated General.
Considering Rootgrapple again for Planeswalkers. Like Desert Twister, except its cost, and for what? Hardest thing getting people's suggestions is getting an idea of what to take out. E.g. why are the cards you are recommending more important then other cards?
Hymn of Rebirth. My bad, fixed in the list.
Of those, Shizo is my favourite. The others are just too niche for me. Considering Shizo.
Wouldn't Cloud key be universally better?
Over what? All the sweep spells serve a purpose, so that means taking a card out elsewhere, and I'm already finding it hard to pull from anywhere, unless it is a direct replacement of a similar card.
RW Kalemne, Disciple of Iroas
depends on what you are trying to do with it. Sure, the Key would allow you to play more spells than just the General (or other legendaries in the deck) at a reduced cost. However, the Land would allow you to reduce the extra casting cost of playing the General again after it has been removed from the game at least once by 2 points. If I had to choose, I would probably run both cards personally, as that would raise the likely hood of seeing one or the other in a given game.
Granted though, I am not actually running either in my own EDH deck.
The themes I'm focusing on are:
Treefolk
One sided sweeps
Toughness over Power
Aggro-Control
1 Doran, the Siege Tower
1 Indomitable Ancients
1 Leaf-Crowned Elder
1 Sapling of Colfenor
1 Timber Protector
1 Unstoppable Ash
1 Woodfall Primus
1 Chameleon Colossus
1 Weatherseed Treefolk
1 Nemata, Grove Guardian
1 Verdeloth the Ancient
1 Wickerbough Elder
1 Deadwood Treefolk
1 Seedguide Ash
1 Bosk Banneret
Artifacts:
1 Darksteel Ingot
1 Sol Ring
1 Weatherseed Totem
1 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Door of Destinies
Accel:
1 Mirari's Wake
1 Kodama's Reach
1 Skyshroud Claim
Equipment:
1 Lightning Greaves
1 Sigil of Distinction
1 Horned Helm
Other Creatures:
1 Arashi, Sky Asunder
1 Silklash Spider
1 Brawn
Other Spells:
1 Profane Command
1 Reach of Branches
1 Spidersilk Armor
1 Haunted Crossroads
1 Privileged Position
1 Sacred Ground
1 Rootgrapple
1 Vindicate
1 Mortify
1 Putrify
1 Krosan Grip
Recursion:
1 Hymn of Rebirth
1 Eternal Witness
1 Genesis
1 Saffi Eriksdotter
1 Regrowth
1 Patriarch's Bidding
1 Tilling Treefolk
Draw:
1 Mind's Eye
1 Harmonize
1 Ambition's Cost
1 Skeleton Scrying
Sweeper Spells:
1 Catastrophe
1 Pernicious Deed
1 Wave of Reckoning
1 Crime/Punishment
1 Harsh Mercy
Tutors:
1 Diabolic Tutor
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Congregation at Dawn
1 Wordly Tutor
1 Entomb
1 Treefolk Harbinger
Basic Land:
12 Forest
2 Plains
2 Swamp
1 Treetop Village
1 Tranquil Thicket
1 Wooded Bastion
1 Selesnya Sanctuary
1 Temple Garden
1 Windswept Heath
1 Krosan Verge
1 Murmuring Bosk
1 Golgori Rot Farm
1 Twilight Mire
1 Overgrown Tomb
1 Dakmor Salvage
1 Barren Moor
1 Shizo, Death's Storehouse
1 Fetid Heath
1 Godless Shrine
1 Forbidding Watchtower
1 Boseiju, Who Shelters All
1 Volrath's Stronghold
1 Miren, the Moaning Well
1 Riftstone Portal
1 Terramorphic Expanse
Total: 101
1 cut to make.
Would like to fit in Hurricane.
Considering Cabal Coffers and Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth. Just have to figure out what to do with them...
RW Kalemne, Disciple of Iroas
Corrupt and Consume Spirit type cards seem good for those two cards... the problem with them is that they are dependant on you getting Urborg, and Cabal Coffers.
I've had these in and out of the list before, but the whole point of cards like Wordly Tutor and Congregation at Dawn, are to work with cards like Sapling of Colfenor and Leaf-Crowned Elder. Making them IMO, superior for this particular deck.
Cutting any of the other Tutors seems counter productive since they can find anything.
Entomb, the last one that "could" be cut for either of those, also has synergy in the deck. Namely it can work as mana fixing by dropping Riftstone Portal into my graveyard, or a major combat trick by dropping Brawn into my graveyard after someone tries to chump block my trees (especially fun with Unstoppable Ash out).
So while I agree they are good cards, and maybe I could add them in addition, what would you cut? That's always the biggest question I have when people suggest things: What would you cut, and why do you consider the card better then the card it replaces.
RW Kalemne, Disciple of Iroas