@Cecilia - yeah I'm working on getting four of each. With all the draw though I generally manage to get both out.
Propaganda is huge. Your meta sounds like mine, and it seriously throws aggro decks off their game, especially if you have ways of dealing with the creatures already on the board. Propaganda plus a few Fog Bank or Guard Gomazoa sets almost any aggro deck back a few crucial turns, denying then a turn three or four kill.
Nice, Fog Bank is pretty decent as a two drop as well. I think the only reason why I have played MUC in my meta was the fact that I played vedalken shackles, force spikes, powder kegs, and boomerangs. They tend to pack a pretty good bunch against creature decks but I solid my shackles 3-4 weeks ago so I can have enough money to play in a rise of eldrazi draft and also get some food. I regret it a bit but I thought it was worth it since I don't get an income right now.
Yup the shackles be nasty. Don't have any myself but I will pick them up one day. Always thought it'd be fun to do an MUC deck with tons of creature theft.
Seems like it could work. I've always loved pairing Treachery with control magic because you can cast treachery and then untap your lands to play control magic on the same turn.
Had an odd thought this week. What about Gravitational Shift?
I know it's a suck card but is it? I'm working on trying to get a deck togeather that uses 0-2 Cbirds and the like plus this card to try and see how you can turn this card into a late game turn around card. blues biggest problem usually tends to be the early game, this is a card that comes in late game but can help stop whatever early game problems that might still be sticking around.
It also helps out your birds, magpies, and owls to swing in for the win late game. You could spend your early game setting up your board and countering whatever super fatties and fliers they get online then come back from the rear.
I think you have generally a good idea on how to build MUC but I think your build is running a bit too many countermagic. I think it would be better with different control elements like vedalken shackles, propoganda and such. Even running some bounce would be better then running all countermagic in the same deck. I also think you need some draw spells because imo remand doesn't actually count as a real draw spell.
Otherwise, it looks like a cool decklist. Oh and you should play at least 24 islands and I love the addition of cognivore.
Back in the 90's, I ran a creature control'ish MUC, rather than a typical 18 counterspell deck...that's boring ;). Actually, I say that tongue in cheek, but I did kinda' neuter the deck cuz it was too strong and boring (I counter this, and that and this and that and this and that....*yawn*)...I prefer to play with my food ;). 4 Counterspell, 4 Mana Drain, 2 Force of Will (the last 6 of which were traded away a long time ago :(). So I ran more of a control magic'esque control, in a pretty creature-heavy group...and leveraged the MVP that was...Ophidean, the (old) king of card advantage. It was actually kinda' Agg-controlish, rather than waiting 20 turns to win, the bounce, control magic, Man-O'-War, ect would try to push in the damage with counters/bounce to back it up. I'm not sure if its even really "Draw-go"...but it is MUC IMHO.
Here's that deck...which has been untouched in 12 years...
Control (17) 4 Counterspell 4 Force Spike (sometimes I only ran 2 and 2 Vodalian Mage (aka the walking time walk), as the threat of a force spike is sometimes more valuable than the actual card in hand) 2 Undo (or sometimes Boomerang) 2 Desertion 1 Ray of Command 1 Control Magic 3 Unsummon
I find thieving magpie to be a really good card in MUC and so I am glad to see it being played.
Also, yeah, I'd suggest something else over braingeyser, probably jace's ingenuity or even Fact or fiction if you have any. Having more draw at instant speed does give you more of an advantage.
I've been reading through most MUC threads on these forums (Legacy, Extended, etc.) and I've decided to build a casual version of what is probably my favourite deck type of all time: Mono Blue Control.
While this is a casual deck (no Force of Will), it most certainly is still competitive and holds its own against some of the finest tuned decks I've played.
I guess I'll post the list before I get into details:
WARNING: After typing this, losing it all to ctrl + w (seriously, that's a stupid shortcut...) and typing it again, I see that this is a fairly long post. But I think it's a good read.
This is a very draw-go style of MUC, which to me is the true essence of the deck. I feel that the best way to explain how the deck works (which is important) is to explain the cards individually:
Force Spike: I absolutely love this card. In the absence of Force of Will, Spike is a monster. Having one in hand turn 1 on the play gives you a great deal of control. You decide right from the get-go what's going down. It's weaker late game, but you can still catch people offguard, and it makes people play around it even if you don't have one. Plus, one of this deck's main synergies is to combine the weaknesses of cards to turn them into strengths. More to come.
Spell Snare: Solid counter against a wide variety of threats. Invaluable in counter wars, which this deck rarely loses (barring FoW). It's uses diminish late game, but it is still relevant. I'd consider a fourth if I could find a place to squeeze it in.
Counterspell: The name says it all. Counter a spell. Period.
Disrupting Shoal: Shoal is absolutely nuts in this deck. I don't want to spend $200 on a playset of Force of Will when I can spend 100 times less (literally!) on a playset of Shoals. And you know what; they're amazing. This deck's curve is spread nicely to abuse Shoal. It's also fantastic at pitching uneeded Force Spikes, excess Shoals, or copies of Vendilion Clique when you already have one beating face. Combined with Force Spike and Spell Snare early game, it really helps get to that crucial stabilization point that usually is what gives MUC nightmares. Extremely underrated, give it a go.
Cryptic Command: Flexibility incarnate. Being able to counter a threat and bounce another is not something to be overlooked. That's a game-changing effect. I daresay its a game-winning effect. Most people dismiss this card because it's slow at 4 mana and doesn't "win you the game" like an EoT undisputed Fact or Fiction does. This is not completely true. Cryptic Command doesn't "win you the game" as often, but a well placed and chosen Cryptic Commandcan win you the game. I find 2 to be a good number. It's a complex card, and in a deck built off complexity; I welcome it.
Forbid: Forbid does something for the deck that I find irreplaceable: it gives the deck inevitability. If it shows up around turn 5-6, and I'm in some sort of decent position in the game, I'll usually win. Pitching extra Spikes/Shoals/Cliques/land to it is common, and it lets me play my counters more aggresively since I know I have Forbid to fall back on. I wouldn't mind running a second copy since an early 3mana counter is still pretty solid.
Ancestral Vision: This was a lot of cards before I settled on Ancestral Vision. It competed with Brainstorm, Impulse, and even Standstill, which surprisingly, was the next best. Ancestral Vision is way too good in this deck. Most times, it comes down turn 2 on the draw with a mana open and a Spell Snare and Disrupting Shoal in hand. Stop and think about it. That's a devastating play before your opponent drops his second land. Doing things like this is the type of play that jumps right into stabilization and ultimately into your lategame, where you just completely dominate. Speaking of lategame; AV is still pretty useful up until turn 5-6, where Fact or Fiction usually just ploughs through with its game-winning goodness. When you dont need it anymore, it can be chucked with the aforementioned card drawing bomb. It's also prime pitching for Forbid and can even be used by Shoal to nix 0cmc cards. (It happens!)
Fact or Fiction: Combined with Ancestral Vision, I have all the cards I could dream of. It digs 5 deep for what I need (which sometimes is a specific cmc card for Shoal). It forces my opponent to make difficult decisions (which they often get wrong). It dumps cards I dont need, or fuels other cards to dump them. It wins games. Run four. Always.
Vedalken Shackles: We all know what Shackles does for the deck and how good it is at it, so I'll skip that part. What I will say, is that if Shackles had a best friend, it would be Vendilion Clique. Running Clique allows me to run 3 Shackles, rather than 4, comfortably. Most of the time, it comes up when I need it, and when it doesn't, Clique is there to stem the flow until Shackles comes along to mop up. Plus, the happy friendship of Shackles and Clique rack up the 20 points I need to win in most games, being very reliable win conditions.
Oblivion Stone/Powder Keg: So far, I prefer Oblivion Stone, and here's why: This deck has a pretty strong early game. Between all the early game counters, and Cliques/Shackles coming down quickly, I don't need Powder Keg as much as traditional MUC does. To me, this slot is more valuable as a safety net for whatever bigger threat(s) sneak through, especially non-creatures as my only out would be to bounce it with Cryptic Command. Serving this function, 2 slots feel just about right, although I wouldn't mind testing 3. Playing casually, games are also a bit slower, which is an edge for Stone. Finally, Oblivion Stone is a recent card while Powder Keg is getting older and older, and while old cards are cool, I prefer keeping my casual decks as current as possible.
Vendilion Clique: I'm so happy that this card was printed. In my opinion, it is the perfect card for MUC. It's a decent body (3/1 flying for 3) with flash, so you can EoT it into play and put a very real clock on your opponent. It's also as close to a removal spell as blue is going to get. flash-blocking can even get rid of creatures with shroud that other removal spells would fan on. Score one for the mischievous faeries. It comes down right when we need it most, and on top of everything, it comes with a nifty ability that's ALWAYS relevant. The icing on the cake is that you can chuck uneeded copies to Disrupting Shoal/Forbid. Vendilion Clique is the best thing to happen to MUC in a long time.
Finishers: This slot is almost unneeded. Clique and Shackles do such a good job of winning the game on their own. However, it is still nice to have a solid finisher, and everyone likes to have a deck mascot. They're all viable in their own right, and excel in different situations. It is worth noting that Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir is slightly worse in this deck since Clique has flash and I'm already so strong in counterwars. Humourously, Guile is noticeably better in this deck mainly for his graveyard avoiding ability. Since you only play 1 solid finisher, you're normally forced to take him in a Fact or Fiction split. But since Guile will stick around after getting ditched, his value increases. This is doubly important with and early resolved FoF. Also, he can be pitched to Forbid and to Disrupting Shoal if you dont need him, and it's pretty funny to counter a $50 Primeval Titan by pitching Guile to Disrupting Shoal.
Land: Quicksand is good when I need it (heavy aggro, like WW), and pretty lame when I don't. Stalking Stones is left over from when Standstill was in Ancestral Vision's place, but it's still a solid win condition, and let's me play through opposing Standstills. Mishra's Factory is ancient and therefore, unappealing, and Mutavault costs WAY too much for what it does. I like the Stones best right now, but I could also go with an all Island base and maybe add in Minamo, School at Water's Edge and/or Riptide Laboratory for some fun with Vendilion Clique but it seems like a narrow and marginally useful accommodation.
I can't think of much to change in my deck, which is the main reason I posted here in the first place. My main critiques of my deck are as follows:
1) Not enough counterspells. Yep, even though I have 18(!), I feel like I'm short actual hard counters. I mean, all I have is Counterspell itself unless I draw into an early Forbid, or it's late enough that I can use Cryptic Command. This has nagged me for a while, but seeing as how the deck is so strong counterwise in the early game, I should have enough actual Counterspells left to carry me over to Forbid/Cryptic, with a little Spell Snare/Shoal thrown in. I feel like upping Forbid to 2, just so I can have some sort of extra hard counter, but I wouldn't know what to cut. Everything seems necessary AND I wouldn't mind and EXTRA Spell Snare. But like I said, my gut tells me that the counterbase *should* work fine.
2) Not having card selection/quality like Brainstorm/Impulse. Again, I think I should be alright seeing as how I almost always get an early Ancestral Vision and I run enough land to not need to dig for them. Plus I have enough ways to pitch otherwise dead cards in my hand already. I guess I'm just used to those luxuries. The way I see it; if you build your deck properly AND have enough redundancy, cards like these are not really needed; a goal I hope to have achieved.
Other than that, everything else looks good. Card Drawing is golden, threats and win conditions are solid, my early game is strong enough that I don't feel the need for Powder Keg/Engineered Explosives or cards like Propaganda. Back to Basics isn't as good in a casual environment. I've never liked Chalice of the Void or Chrome Mox, nor would either of them do my deck any good; Chalice of the Void even hinders it.
I know that I've babbled for quite a long time now, but after reading a lot (and I mean a LOT) of MUC posts I learned 2 things:
1) People who describe their deck and card interactions in detail are the most helpful to discussion.
2) These posts are much more likely to get feedback or start discussion.
I would really appreciate the feedback and insight of what I think is a very knowledgeable, experienced and friendly community, and I felt that my in-depth analysis is what would make it easier for you guys to see what I see and to catalyst the process of creativity.
Hey, just got another MUC idea. Since the new Leylines were printed in M11, I thought that Leyline of Anticipation is a good enchantment for MUC. I also made several changes from my last idea by adding more draw.
[...]
Land: [...] Riptide Laboratory for some fun with Vendilion Clique but it seems like a narrow and marginally useful accommodation.
[...]
I can't think of much to change in my deck, which is the main reason I posted here in the first place. My main critiques of my deck are as follows:
1) Not enough counterspells. Yep, even though I have 18(!), I feel like I'm short actual hard counters.
I like such posts. :):thumbsup: I agree with most you say in regards to your deck. Quoting the post I had to shorten it a bit to outline what I respond to. For the deck tag, I think that's what your deck looks like, right?
Your own point of critique not having enough hard counters, is indeed true. But with seven counters at 1cmc and Shoal as 0cmc option, that can't be different. For my taste, you're focusing too heavy on early counters, when you could play more solid counters and heavier board control, but that's just taste. I think you found a good balance. The second Forbid should be added in place of a Shoal imo.
I would consider Riptide Lab, it's nuts with Clique, not only can you avoid removal, but also re-use its etb effect. Minamo indeed isn't worth it. Tolaria West could be added as tutor that can also get Visions and if you feel fancy, Pact of Negation. As for manlands, I prefer those that need an activation each turn, as they dodge sorcery speed removal.
Hey, just got another MUC idea. Since the new Leylines were printed in M11, I thought that Leyline of Anticipation is a good enchantment for MUC. I also made several changes from my last idea by adding more draw.
So you can play your eight 6cmc fatties with flash? The Leyline is absolutely not worth it. I'd cut four of the finishers for some board control or speed bump, else if something gets past the counters you're pretty much screwed - and wish that 6cmc fat you hold would be something usefull.
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Each reality is but the dream of another, and each sleeper a god unknowing.
We define the boundaries of reality; they don't define us.
I considered Meditation, but I dismissed it. Here's why: First, for 1 extra mana, I can get the same amount of cards on occasion, 1 less most of the time, or 2 key cards using Fact or Fiction. Plus I'll get the extra card from my draw step I would've missed. More importantly, I get to untap. In a deck like this, you can't put a price on untapping, but its more than 2U
@Blutsau
This is exactly what I was looking for when I posted. I feel like I really succeeded in describing my deck, seeing as how you seem to get it, and you make suggestions that I would consider making myself. The deck you quoted is actually exactly what I'm using now. (That deck tag thing is cool btw)
I've thought of dropping a Disrupting Shoal for Forbid to up the hard counter count, and I feel like that would strike a good balance should the deck not function as intended.
Riptide Laboratory is pretty cool, and I like how it's almost like a 3 mana counterspell to removal pointed at Vendilion Clique. It actually works for just about any removal; be it mass removal, -X/-X effects, sacrifice effects, etc. Replaying the Clique is almost a non-issue, and in a lot of cases, beneficial.
Tolaria West I'm not that fond of, partially because I have to transmute it as a sorcery. Tutoring up Ancestral Vision is cool, but maybe unnecessary since It'll be turn 4 when I suspend it, and I hope to play FoF turn 4
I'm actually a huge fan of Pact of Negation, especially in combo decks that "go off" in one turn, but I feel like it's out of place in this deck. That also puts the nail in the coffin of Tolaria West for me. Stalking Stones is just what I have. They dont provide the early game punch that Mishra's Factory/Mutavault packs, but it's still a good finisher once I'm decently stable or cant find a Clique or something. There's always the option of just dropping them for Islands too.
I'm gonna be playing a ton of games with a bunch of friends some time next week. I'll try 4 Shoal 1 Forbid, and 3 Shoal 2 Forbid and see which I feel better with. I'm also picking up a copy of Riptide Laboratory to mess around with. Since I have it, I'll play a few games with Sphinx of Jwar Isle in Guile's place too, since in my opinion, the Sphinx is the best finisher MUC has now. Although, Guile has proven himself quite useful in this deck with his Graveyard trigger. Plus, it's too much fun beating someone with a Guile.
I appreciate your insight, it's exactly what I was looking for. It makes me see that I'm on the right track when others comprehend how my deck works and share similar views on what to improve.
I've been reading through most MUC threads on these forums (Legacy, Extended, etc.) and I've decided to build a casual version of what is probably my favourite deck type of all time: Mono Blue Control.
While this is a casual deck (no Force of Will), it most certainly is still competitive and holds its own against some of the finest tuned decks I've played.
I guess I'll post the list before I get into details:
WARNING: After typing this, losing it all to ctrl + w (seriously, that's a stupid shortcut...) and typing it again, I see that this is a fairly long post. But I think it's a good read.
This is a very draw-go style of MUC, which to me is the true essence of the deck. I feel that the best way to explain how the deck works (which is important) is to explain the cards individually:
Force Spike: I absolutely love this card. In the absence of Force of Will, Spike is a monster. Having one in hand turn 1 on the play gives you a great deal of control. You decide right from the get-go what's going down. It's weaker late game, but you can still catch people offguard, and it makes people play around it even if you don't have one. Plus, one of this deck's main synergies is to combine the weaknesses of cards to turn them into strengths. More to come.
Spell Snare: Solid counter against a wide variety of threats. Invaluable in counter wars, which this deck rarely loses (barring FoW). It's uses diminish late game, but it is still relevant. I'd consider a fourth if I could find a place to squeeze it in.
Counterspell: The name says it all. Counter a spell. Period.
Disrupting Shoal: Shoal is absolutely nuts in this deck. I don't want to spend $200 on a playset of Force of Will when I can spend 100 times less (literally!) on a playset of Shoals. And you know what; they're amazing. This deck's curve is spread nicely to abuse Shoal. It's also fantastic at pitching uneeded Force Spikes, excess Shoals, or copies of Vendilion Clique when you already have one beating face. Combined with Force Spike and Spell Snare early game, it really helps get to that crucial stabilization point that usually is what gives MUC nightmares. Extremely underrated, give it a go.
Cryptic Command: Flexibility incarnate. Being able to counter a threat and bounce another is not something to be overlooked. That's a game-changing effect. I daresay its a game-winning effect. Most people dismiss this card because it's slow at 4 mana and doesn't "win you the game" like an EoT undisputed Fact or Fiction does. This is not completely true. Cryptic Command doesn't "win you the game" as often, but a well placed and chosen Cryptic Commandcan win you the game. I find 2 to be a good number. It's a complex card, and in a deck built off complexity; I welcome it.
Forbid: Forbid does something for the deck that I find irreplaceable: it gives the deck inevitability. If it shows up around turn 5-6, and I'm in some sort of decent position in the game, I'll usually win. Pitching extra Spikes/Shoals/Cliques/land to it is common, and it lets me play my counters more aggresively since I know I have Forbid to fall back on. I wouldn't mind running a second copy since an early 3mana counter is still pretty solid.
Ancestral Vision: This was a lot of cards before I settled on Ancestral Vision. It competed with Brainstorm, Impulse, and even Standstill, which surprisingly, was the next best. Ancestral Vision is way too good in this deck. Most times, it comes down turn 2 on the draw with a mana open and a Spell Snare and Disrupting Shoal in hand. Stop and think about it. That's a devastating play before your opponent drops his second land. Doing things like this is the type of play that jumps right into stabilization and ultimately into your lategame, where you just completely dominate. Speaking of lategame; AV is still pretty useful up until turn 5-6, where Fact or Fiction usually just ploughs through with its game-winning goodness. When you dont need it anymore, it can be chucked with the aforementioned card drawing bomb. It's also prime pitching for Forbid and can even be used by Shoal to nix 0cmc cards. (It happens!)
Fact or Fiction: Combined with Ancestral Vision, I have all the cards I could dream of. It digs 5 deep for what I need (which sometimes is a specific cmc card for Shoal). It forces my opponent to make difficult decisions (which they often get wrong). It dumps cards I dont need, or fuels other cards to dump them. It wins games. Run four. Always.
Vedalken Shackles: We all know what Shackles does for the deck and how good it is at it, so I'll skip that part. What I will say, is that if Shackles had a best friend, it would be Vendilion Clique. Running Clique allows me to run 3 Shackles, rather than 4, comfortably. Most of the time, it comes up when I need it, and when it doesn't, Clique is there to stem the flow until Shackles comes along to mop up. Plus, the happy friendship of Shackles and Clique rack up the 20 points I need to win in most games, being very reliable win conditions.
Oblivion Stone/Powder Keg: So far, I prefer Oblivion Stone, and here's why: This deck has a pretty strong early game. Between all the early game counters, and Cliques/Shackles coming down quickly, I don't need Powder Keg as much as traditional MUC does. To me, this slot is more valuable as a safety net for whatever bigger threat(s) sneak through, especially non-creatures as my only out would be to bounce it with Cryptic Command. Serving this function, 2 slots feel just about right, although I wouldn't mind testing 3. Playing casually, games are also a bit slower, which is an edge for Stone. Finally, Oblivion Stone is a recent card while Powder Keg is getting older and older, and while old cards are cool, I prefer keeping my casual decks as current as possible.
Vendilion Clique: I'm so happy that this card was printed. In my opinion, it is the perfect card for MUC. It's a decent body (3/1 flying for 3) with flash, so you can EoT it into play and put a very real clock on your opponent. It's also as close to a removal spell as blue is going to get. flash-blocking can even get rid of creatures with shroud that other removal spells would fan on. Score one for the mischievous faeries. It comes down right when we need it most, and on top of everything, it comes with a nifty ability that's ALWAYS relevant. The icing on the cake is that you can chuck uneeded copies to Disrupting Shoal/Forbid. Vendilion Clique is the best thing to happen to MUC in a long time.
Finishers: This slot is almost unneeded. Clique and Shackles do such a good job of winning the game on their own. However, it is still nice to have a solid finisher, and everyone likes to have a deck mascot. They're all viable in their own right, and excel in different situations. It is worth noting that Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir is slightly worse in this deck since Clique has flash and I'm already so strong in counterwars. Humourously, Guile is noticeably better in this deck mainly for his graveyard avoiding ability. Since you only play 1 solid finisher, you're normally forced to take him in a Fact or Fiction split. But since Guile will stick around after getting ditched, his value increases. This is doubly important with and early resolved FoF. Also, he can be pitched to Forbid and to Disrupting Shoal if you dont need him, and it's pretty funny to counter a $50 Primeval Titan by pitching Guile to Disrupting Shoal.
Land: Quicksand is good when I need it (heavy aggro, like WW), and pretty lame when I don't. Stalking Stones is left over from when Standstill was in Ancestral Vision's place, but it's still a solid win condition, and let's me play through opposing Standstills. Mishra's Factory is ancient and therefore, unappealing, and Mutavault costs WAY too much for what it does. I like the Stones best right now, but I could also go with an all Island base and maybe add in Minamo, School at Water's Edge and/or Riptide Laboratory for some fun with Vendilion Clique but it seems like a narrow and marginally useful accommodation.
I can't think of much to change in my deck, which is the main reason I posted here in the first place. My main critiques of my deck are as follows:
1) Not enough counterspells. Yep, even though I have 18(!), I feel like I'm short actual hard counters. I mean, all I have is Counterspell itself unless I draw into an early Forbid, or it's late enough that I can use Cryptic Command. This has nagged me for a while, but seeing as how the deck is so strong counterwise in the early game, I should have enough actual Counterspells left to carry me over to Forbid/Cryptic, with a little Spell Snare/Shoal thrown in. I feel like upping Forbid to 2, just so I can have some sort of extra hard counter, but I wouldn't know what to cut. Everything seems necessary AND I wouldn't mind and EXTRA Spell Snare. But like I said, my gut tells me that the counterbase *should* work fine.
2) Not having card selection/quality like Brainstorm/Impulse. Again, I think I should be alright seeing as how I almost always get an early Ancestral Vision and I run enough land to not need to dig for them. Plus I have enough ways to pitch otherwise dead cards in my hand already. I guess I'm just used to those luxuries. The way I see it; if you build your deck properly AND have enough redundancy, cards like these are not really needed; a goal I hope to have achieved.
Other than that, everything else looks good. Card Drawing is golden, threats and win conditions are solid, my early game is strong enough that I don't feel the need for Powder Keg/Engineered Explosives or cards like Propaganda. Back to Basics isn't as good in a casual environment. I've never liked Chalice of the Void or Chrome Mox, nor would either of them do my deck any good; Chalice of the Void even hinders it.
I know that I've babbled for quite a long time now, but after reading a lot (and I mean a LOT) of MUC posts I learned 2 things:
1) People who describe their deck and card interactions in detail are the most helpful to discussion.
2) These posts are much more likely to get feedback or start discussion.
I would really appreciate the feedback and insight of what I think is a very knowledgeable, experienced and friendly community, and I felt that my in-depth analysis is what would make it easier for you guys to see what I see and to catalyst the process of creativity.
Regards, and thank you.
Wow, what I detailed post. With that said, I really like your list. I think Oblivion stone with shackles makes alot of decks cry.
Clique seems pretty insane in casual and also in Legacy so kudos to you for playing four. Overall, nice list.
Right now this is a 77 card deck and I am looking to shorten it down to a standard 60 card deck by removing cards that are not effective/important to a Spell Casting/Defending Play style.
So far, the deck plays pretty smooth. Aside from a few minor tweaks (haven't tested Riptide Laboratory or the second Forbid) I think this is pretty much what I'm gonna stick to. I can't really think of anything that fits the deck better.
Quick Note: Vendilion Clique is so good for this deck. If you haven't tried them yet, you're only doing yourself a disservice.
#1 adjustment moves this deck down to 74 cards thanks to Elfless
(Wouldn't evacuation still be a good card to keep on hand though? In an emergency situation?)
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Schools teach that the dinosaurs were wiped out by a single calamitous event, which is true, but it was not an asteroid..... It was Jace Beleren.
evacuation still be a good card to keep on hand though? In an emergency situation?)
Too much farting about...Building up the Hada spy, playing the Djinn, in other words, building up your army and levelups then returning them all to the hand..you'd have to play them all again and start from scratch...usually counter spells deal with potential "emergency situations"
Also I noted Phantom Beast..5cc for a plain 4/5 that is easily knocked off by a
Cunning Sparkmage (or any pinger)...or even something as simple as laying a Spider Umbra on it..is just, well...vulnerable. There's another for the ditch.
#1 adjustment moves this deck down to 74 cards thanks to Elfless
(Wouldn't evacuation still be a good card to keep on hand though? In an emergency situation?
#2 adjustment as per Elfless I removed 2 Phantom Beast and 1 Evacuation. As per myself, pending some insight I added 1 Jace Beleren. This brings the new total to 72 cards. Still looking to cut some/add more.
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Schools teach that the dinosaurs were wiped out by a single calamitous event, which is true, but it was not an asteroid..... It was Jace Beleren.
Kraken's eye is fairly worthless. If it gained 5 life a pop, sure. 1 life a spell? Ugh.
Tome scour is useless. It mills for 5, then what? Same goes true with archive trap. Mill for 13, and then what? Milling is only useful if you can manage to empty your opponent's library. 13 cards might as well be nothing, and milling an opponent is potentially quite harmful to you. Even Jace's ultimate is pretty weak.
Try to avoid playing walls. Wall of spears is pretty good for a wall, but its still just a wall.
I would like some explaination why Mana leak, Daze are better than Cancel. I think they are useless late game. It's not like i'm gona win games fast with this deck. I agree on the augury owl/ Plumeveil. But since i can afford to play with 23 lands, i have 2 free spots. I think i'l go for 2 Augury Owl and 4 Plumeveil.
I don't have Sensei or the other counterspells. I made this because i bought a box of M11.
even late game, the chances of them having 3 mana open to counter manaleak are pretty slim. Even then, late game isn't what you should be worried about, early game is significantly harder for MUC to handle, and mana leak handles that significantly better.
edit:
if you have any Jace's ingenuity, you should run them instead of foresee. For one mana more you get instant speed (really important) and one extra card. I would also recommend brainstorm or ponder in place of preordain.
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Whether it's a comedy or a tragedy, if there is cheering, the story will continue on.
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Propaganda is huge. Your meta sounds like mine, and it seriously throws aggro decks off their game, especially if you have ways of dealing with the creatures already on the board. Propaganda plus a few Fog Bank or Guard Gomazoa sets almost any aggro deck back a few crucial turns, denying then a turn three or four kill.
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Supreme thanks to Fio at Damnation Studios for the awesome artwork.
UMember of Clan Mono BlueU
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Supreme thanks to Fio at Damnation Studios for the awesome artwork.
UMember of Clan Mono BlueU
Treachery seems pretty broken in casual.
I know it's a suck card but is it? I'm working on trying to get a deck togeather that uses 0-2 Cbirds and the like plus this card to try and see how you can turn this card into a late game turn around card. blues biggest problem usually tends to be the early game, this is a card that comes in late game but can help stop whatever early game problems that might still be sticking around.
It also helps out your birds, magpies, and owls to swing in for the win late game. You could spend your early game setting up your board and countering whatever super fatties and fliers they get online then come back from the rear.
Any thoughts?
I think you have generally a good idea on how to build MUC but I think your build is running a bit too many countermagic. I think it would be better with different control elements like vedalken shackles, propoganda and such. Even running some bounce would be better then running all countermagic in the same deck. I also think you need some draw spells because imo remand doesn't actually count as a real draw spell.
Otherwise, it looks like a cool decklist. Oh and you should play at least 24 islands and I love the addition of cognivore.
Back in the 90's, I ran a creature control'ish MUC, rather than a typical 18 counterspell deck...that's boring ;). Actually, I say that tongue in cheek, but I did kinda' neuter the deck cuz it was too strong and boring (I counter this, and that and this and that and this and that....*yawn*)...I prefer to play with my food ;). 4 Counterspell, 4 Mana Drain, 2 Force of Will (the last 6 of which were traded away a long time ago :(). So I ran more of a control magic'esque control, in a pretty creature-heavy group...and leveraged the MVP that was...Ophidean, the (old) king of card advantage. It was actually kinda' Agg-controlish, rather than waiting 20 turns to win, the bounce, control magic, Man-O'-War, ect would try to push in the damage with counters/bounce to back it up. I'm not sure if its even really "Draw-go"...but it is MUC IMHO.
Here's that deck...which has been untouched in 12 years...
4 Counterspell
4 Force Spike (sometimes I only ran 2 and 2 Vodalian Mage (aka the walking time walk), as the threat of a force spike is sometimes more valuable than the actual card in hand)
2 Undo (or sometimes Boomerang)
2 Desertion
1 Ray of Command
1 Control Magic
3 Unsummon
20 Island
4 Svyelunite Temple
2 High Tide
Creatures (9)
4 Man-O'-War
3 Sage Owl
2 Mahamoti Djinn (how's that for oldschool ;))
4 Ophidean (now replaced by Thieving Magpie, *ding*)
3 Impulse (should be Ponder?)
3 Braingeyser (should be...something else, instant speed...Jace's Inginuity?)
So yeah, there it is. Hopefully this doesn't become the standard 4 Counterspell, 4 Fow, 4 Daze, 4 Mana Leak, 4 Rune Snag, 4 FoF...etc ;).
DRum
Old school group, sometimes more beer than cards. Revised thru Tempest block (and a little of Urza), sorry if I don't know all the new cards
Ye' Olde Schoole Casual Decks: BUReanimate -- GRAggro -- BWPestilence -- G10-land Stompy -- GRElfball -- GWEnchantress -- RAnkh Sligh -- BDiscard -- MUC "Draw-go" -- BRSuicide -- UWSkies -- UHigh Tide Mill -- WWeenie -- UMutated Bombers -- URThe great land-toss -- UB Molasass
Also, yeah, I'd suggest something else over braingeyser, probably jace's ingenuity or even Fact or fiction if you have any. Having more draw at instant speed does give you more of an advantage.
I've been reading through most MUC threads on these forums (Legacy, Extended, etc.) and I've decided to build a casual version of what is probably my favourite deck type of all time: Mono Blue Control.
While this is a casual deck (no Force of Will), it most certainly is still competitive and holds its own against some of the finest tuned decks I've played.
I guess I'll post the list before I get into details:
WARNING: After typing this, losing it all to ctrl + w (seriously, that's a stupid shortcut...) and typing it again, I see that this is a fairly long post. But I think it's a good read.
Control.dec
21 Island
3 Stalking Stones/Quicksand/Island
4 Force Spike
3 Spell Snare
4 Counterspell
4 Disrupting Shoal
2 Cryptic Command
1 Forbid
4 Ancestral Vision
4 Fact or Fiction
3 Vedalken Shackles
2 Oblivion Stone/Powder Keg
4 Vendilion Clique
1 Morphling/Guile/Meloku, the Clouded Mirror/Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir/Sphinx of Jwar Isle/Oona, Queen of the Fae
This is a very draw-go style of MUC, which to me is the true essence of the deck. I feel that the best way to explain how the deck works (which is important) is to explain the cards individually:
Force Spike: I absolutely love this card. In the absence of Force of Will, Spike is a monster. Having one in hand turn 1 on the play gives you a great deal of control. You decide right from the get-go what's going down. It's weaker late game, but you can still catch people offguard, and it makes people play around it even if you don't have one. Plus, one of this deck's main synergies is to combine the weaknesses of cards to turn them into strengths. More to come.
Spell Snare: Solid counter against a wide variety of threats. Invaluable in counter wars, which this deck rarely loses (barring FoW). It's uses diminish late game, but it is still relevant. I'd consider a fourth if I could find a place to squeeze it in.
Counterspell: The name says it all. Counter a spell. Period.
Disrupting Shoal: Shoal is absolutely nuts in this deck. I don't want to spend $200 on a playset of Force of Will when I can spend 100 times less (literally!) on a playset of Shoals. And you know what; they're amazing. This deck's curve is spread nicely to abuse Shoal. It's also fantastic at pitching uneeded Force Spikes, excess Shoals, or copies of Vendilion Clique when you already have one beating face. Combined with Force Spike and Spell Snare early game, it really helps get to that crucial stabilization point that usually is what gives MUC nightmares. Extremely underrated, give it a go.
Cryptic Command: Flexibility incarnate. Being able to counter a threat and bounce another is not something to be overlooked. That's a game-changing effect. I daresay its a game-winning effect. Most people dismiss this card because it's slow at 4 mana and doesn't "win you the game" like an EoT undisputed Fact or Fiction does. This is not completely true. Cryptic Command doesn't "win you the game" as often, but a well placed and chosen Cryptic Command can win you the game. I find 2 to be a good number. It's a complex card, and in a deck built off complexity; I welcome it.
Forbid: Forbid does something for the deck that I find irreplaceable: it gives the deck inevitability. If it shows up around turn 5-6, and I'm in some sort of decent position in the game, I'll usually win. Pitching extra Spikes/Shoals/Cliques/land to it is common, and it lets me play my counters more aggresively since I know I have Forbid to fall back on. I wouldn't mind running a second copy since an early 3mana counter is still pretty solid.
Ancestral Vision: This was a lot of cards before I settled on Ancestral Vision. It competed with Brainstorm, Impulse, and even Standstill, which surprisingly, was the next best. Ancestral Vision is way too good in this deck. Most times, it comes down turn 2 on the draw with a mana open and a Spell Snare and Disrupting Shoal in hand. Stop and think about it. That's a devastating play before your opponent drops his second land. Doing things like this is the type of play that jumps right into stabilization and ultimately into your lategame, where you just completely dominate. Speaking of lategame; AV is still pretty useful up until turn 5-6, where Fact or Fiction usually just ploughs through with its game-winning goodness. When you dont need it anymore, it can be chucked with the aforementioned card drawing bomb. It's also prime pitching for Forbid and can even be used by Shoal to nix 0cmc cards. (It happens!)
Fact or Fiction: Combined with Ancestral Vision, I have all the cards I could dream of. It digs 5 deep for what I need (which sometimes is a specific cmc card for Shoal). It forces my opponent to make difficult decisions (which they often get wrong). It dumps cards I dont need, or fuels other cards to dump them. It wins games. Run four. Always.
Vedalken Shackles: We all know what Shackles does for the deck and how good it is at it, so I'll skip that part. What I will say, is that if Shackles had a best friend, it would be Vendilion Clique. Running Clique allows me to run 3 Shackles, rather than 4, comfortably. Most of the time, it comes up when I need it, and when it doesn't, Clique is there to stem the flow until Shackles comes along to mop up. Plus, the happy friendship of Shackles and Clique rack up the 20 points I need to win in most games, being very reliable win conditions.
Oblivion Stone/Powder Keg: So far, I prefer Oblivion Stone, and here's why: This deck has a pretty strong early game. Between all the early game counters, and Cliques/Shackles coming down quickly, I don't need Powder Keg as much as traditional MUC does. To me, this slot is more valuable as a safety net for whatever bigger threat(s) sneak through, especially non-creatures as my only out would be to bounce it with Cryptic Command. Serving this function, 2 slots feel just about right, although I wouldn't mind testing 3. Playing casually, games are also a bit slower, which is an edge for Stone. Finally, Oblivion Stone is a recent card while Powder Keg is getting older and older, and while old cards are cool, I prefer keeping my casual decks as current as possible.
Vendilion Clique: I'm so happy that this card was printed. In my opinion, it is the perfect card for MUC. It's a decent body (3/1 flying for 3) with flash, so you can EoT it into play and put a very real clock on your opponent. It's also as close to a removal spell as blue is going to get. flash-blocking can even get rid of creatures with shroud that other removal spells would fan on. Score one for the mischievous faeries. It comes down right when we need it most, and on top of everything, it comes with a nifty ability that's ALWAYS relevant. The icing on the cake is that you can chuck uneeded copies to Disrupting Shoal/Forbid. Vendilion Clique is the best thing to happen to MUC in a long time.
Finishers: This slot is almost unneeded. Clique and Shackles do such a good job of winning the game on their own. However, it is still nice to have a solid finisher, and everyone likes to have a deck mascot. They're all viable in their own right, and excel in different situations. It is worth noting that Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir is slightly worse in this deck since Clique has flash and I'm already so strong in counterwars. Humourously, Guile is noticeably better in this deck mainly for his graveyard avoiding ability. Since you only play 1 solid finisher, you're normally forced to take him in a Fact or Fiction split. But since Guile will stick around after getting ditched, his value increases. This is doubly important with and early resolved FoF. Also, he can be pitched to Forbid and to Disrupting Shoal if you dont need him, and it's pretty funny to counter a $50 Primeval Titan by pitching Guile to Disrupting Shoal.
Land: Quicksand is good when I need it (heavy aggro, like WW), and pretty lame when I don't. Stalking Stones is left over from when Standstill was in Ancestral Vision's place, but it's still a solid win condition, and let's me play through opposing Standstills. Mishra's Factory is ancient and therefore, unappealing, and Mutavault costs WAY too much for what it does. I like the Stones best right now, but I could also go with an all Island base and maybe add in Minamo, School at Water's Edge and/or Riptide Laboratory for some fun with Vendilion Clique but it seems like a narrow and marginally useful accommodation.
I can't think of much to change in my deck, which is the main reason I posted here in the first place. My main critiques of my deck are as follows:
1) Not enough counterspells. Yep, even though I have 18(!), I feel like I'm short actual hard counters. I mean, all I have is Counterspell itself unless I draw into an early Forbid, or it's late enough that I can use Cryptic Command. This has nagged me for a while, but seeing as how the deck is so strong counterwise in the early game, I should have enough actual Counterspells left to carry me over to Forbid/Cryptic, with a little Spell Snare/Shoal thrown in. I feel like upping Forbid to 2, just so I can have some sort of extra hard counter, but I wouldn't know what to cut. Everything seems necessary AND I wouldn't mind and EXTRA Spell Snare. But like I said, my gut tells me that the counterbase *should* work fine.
2) Not having card selection/quality like Brainstorm/Impulse. Again, I think I should be alright seeing as how I almost always get an early Ancestral Vision and I run enough land to not need to dig for them. Plus I have enough ways to pitch otherwise dead cards in my hand already. I guess I'm just used to those luxuries. The way I see it; if you build your deck properly AND have enough redundancy, cards like these are not really needed; a goal I hope to have achieved.
Other than that, everything else looks good. Card Drawing is golden, threats and win conditions are solid, my early game is strong enough that I don't feel the need for Powder Keg/Engineered Explosives or cards like Propaganda. Back to Basics isn't as good in a casual environment. I've never liked Chalice of the Void or Chrome Mox, nor would either of them do my deck any good; Chalice of the Void even hinders it.
I know that I've babbled for quite a long time now, but after reading a lot (and I mean a LOT) of MUC posts I learned 2 things:
1) People who describe their deck and card interactions in detail are the most helpful to discussion.
2) These posts are much more likely to get feedback or start discussion.
I would really appreciate the feedback and insight of what I think is a very knowledgeable, experienced and friendly community, and I felt that my in-depth analysis is what would make it easier for you guys to see what I see and to catalyst the process of creativity.
Regards, and thank you.
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Supreme thanks to Fio at Damnation Studios for the awesome artwork.
UMember of Clan Mono BlueU
Plz. take a look:
20 Island
4 Halimar Depths
Creatures:
4 Guile
4 Sphinx of Jwar Isle
Enchantments:
2 Leyline of Anticipation
Counterspell:
4 Counterspell
4 Rune Snag
1 Redirect
3 Boomerang
3 Dissipate
4 Remand
4 Jace's Ingenuity
3 Dismiss
4 Echoing Truth
2 Evacuation
:cool2:Thanks to Heroes of the Planes Studios for avatar and signature.
“The enemy has been destroyed, sir. So have the forest, the city, your palace, your dog . . ."
I like such posts. :):thumbsup: I agree with most you say in regards to your deck. Quoting the post I had to shorten it a bit to outline what I respond to. For the deck tag, I think that's what your deck looks like, right?
Your own point of critique not having enough hard counters, is indeed true. But with seven counters at 1cmc and Shoal as 0cmc option, that can't be different. For my taste, you're focusing too heavy on early counters, when you could play more solid counters and heavier board control, but that's just taste. I think you found a good balance. The second Forbid should be added in place of a Shoal imo.
I would consider Riptide Lab, it's nuts with Clique, not only can you avoid removal, but also re-use its etb effect. Minamo indeed isn't worth it. Tolaria West could be added as tutor that can also get Visions and if you feel fancy, Pact of Negation. As for manlands, I prefer those that need an activation each turn, as they dodge sorcery speed removal.
So you can play your eight 6cmc fatties with flash? The Leyline is absolutely not worth it. I'd cut four of the finishers for some board control or speed bump, else if something gets past the counters you're pretty much screwed - and wish that 6cmc fat you hold would be something usefull.
I considered Meditation, but I dismissed it. Here's why: First, for 1 extra mana, I can get the same amount of cards on occasion, 1 less most of the time, or 2 key cards using Fact or Fiction. Plus I'll get the extra card from my draw step I would've missed. More importantly, I get to untap. In a deck like this, you can't put a price on untapping, but its more than 2U
@Blutsau
This is exactly what I was looking for when I posted. I feel like I really succeeded in describing my deck, seeing as how you seem to get it, and you make suggestions that I would consider making myself. The deck you quoted is actually exactly what I'm using now. (That deck tag thing is cool btw)
I've thought of dropping a Disrupting Shoal for Forbid to up the hard counter count, and I feel like that would strike a good balance should the deck not function as intended.
Riptide Laboratory is pretty cool, and I like how it's almost like a 3 mana counterspell to removal pointed at Vendilion Clique. It actually works for just about any removal; be it mass removal, -X/-X effects, sacrifice effects, etc. Replaying the Clique is almost a non-issue, and in a lot of cases, beneficial.
Tolaria West I'm not that fond of, partially because I have to transmute it as a sorcery. Tutoring up Ancestral Vision is cool, but maybe unnecessary since It'll be turn 4 when I suspend it, and I hope to play FoF turn 4
I'm actually a huge fan of Pact of Negation, especially in combo decks that "go off" in one turn, but I feel like it's out of place in this deck. That also puts the nail in the coffin of Tolaria West for me. Stalking Stones is just what I have. They dont provide the early game punch that Mishra's Factory/Mutavault packs, but it's still a good finisher once I'm decently stable or cant find a Clique or something. There's always the option of just dropping them for Islands too.
I'm gonna be playing a ton of games with a bunch of friends some time next week. I'll try 4 Shoal 1 Forbid, and 3 Shoal 2 Forbid and see which I feel better with. I'm also picking up a copy of Riptide Laboratory to mess around with. Since I have it, I'll play a few games with Sphinx of Jwar Isle in Guile's place too, since in my opinion, the Sphinx is the best finisher MUC has now. Although, Guile has proven himself quite useful in this deck with his Graveyard trigger. Plus, it's too much fun beating someone with a Guile.
I appreciate your insight, it's exactly what I was looking for. It makes me see that I'm on the right track when others comprehend how my deck works and share similar views on what to improve.
Wow, what I detailed post. With that said, I really like your list. I think Oblivion stone with shackles makes alot of decks cry.
Clique seems pretty insane in casual and also in Legacy so kudos to you for playing four. Overall, nice list.
4 Cloud Sprite
3 Snapping Drake
2 Thieving Magpie
2 Phantom Beast
2 Wall of Spears
1 Alluring Siren
1 Water Servant
2 Aether Adept
1 Harbor Serpent
1 Hada Spy Patrol
1 Denizen Of The Deep
2 Air Elemental
1 Phantom Warrior
1 Mahamoti Djinn
2 Unsummon
1 Evacuation
3 Essence Scatter
2 Cancel
1 Counterbore
2 Boomerang
2 Deluge
2 Negate
1 Archive Trap
Sorcery (7)
1 Tome Scour
1 Acquire
1 Mind Spring
2 Sleep
1 Ponder
1 Preordain
2 Ice Cage
1 Mind Control
Artifacts (2)
2 Kraken's Eye
Land (25)
25 Island
I am also looking to put in two Jace Beleren and sub out a few cards that are not needed.
IMO there is too much heavy cc creatures...
++Harbour Serpent is awful...6cc for a 6/6 that needs 5 islands..
++Denizen is cumbersome..after paying the cc and returning your beef only to have the Denizen Terminate d or even Unsummon d 0.o
++Ditch Acquire (no artifacts in opponent's deck would make this dead weight). Probably better off with Bribery
Just a few to go with.
So far, the deck plays pretty smooth. Aside from a few minor tweaks (haven't tested Riptide Laboratory or the second Forbid) I think this is pretty much what I'm gonna stick to. I can't really think of anything that fits the deck better.
Quick Note: Vendilion Clique is so good for this deck. If you haven't tried them yet, you're only doing yourself a disservice.
4 Cloud Sprite
3 Snapping Drake
2 Thieving Magpie
2 Phantom Beast
2 Wall of Spears
1 Alluring Siren
1 Water Servant
2 Aether Adept
1 Hada Spy Patrol
2 Air Elemental
1 Phantom Warrior
1 Mahamoti Djinn
2 Unsummon
1 Evacuation
3 Essence Scatter
2 Cancel
1 Counterbore
2 Boomerang
2 Deluge
2 Negate
1 Archive Trap
Sorcery (6)
1 Tome Scour
1 Mind Spring
2 Sleep
1 Ponder
1 Preordain
2 Ice Cage
1 Mind Control
Artifacts (2)
2 Kraken's Eye
Land (25)
25 Island
#1 adjustment moves this deck down to 74 cards thanks to Elfless
(Wouldn't evacuation still be a good card to keep on hand though? In an emergency situation?)
Too much farting about...Building up the Hada spy, playing the Djinn, in other words, building up your army and levelups then returning them all to the hand..you'd have to play them all again and start from scratch...usually counter spells deal with potential "emergency situations"
Also I noted Phantom Beast..5cc for a plain 4/5 that is easily knocked off by a
Cunning Sparkmage (or any pinger)...or even something as simple as laying a Spider Umbra on it..is just, well...vulnerable. There's another for the ditch.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=127892
4 Cloud Sprite
3 Snapping Drake
2 Thieving Magpie
1 Jace Beleren
2 Wall of Spears
1 Alluring Siren
1 Water Servant
2 Aether Adept
1 Hada Spy Patrol
2 Air Elemental
1 Phantom Warrior
1 Mahamoti Djinn
2 Unsummon
3 Essence Scatter
2 Cancel
1 Counterbore
2 Boomerang
2 Deluge
2 Negate
1 Archive Trap
Sorcery (6)
1 Tome Scour
1 Mind Spring
2 Sleep
1 Ponder
1 Preordain
2 Ice Cage
1 Mind Control
Artifacts (2)
2 Kraken's Eye
Land (25)
25 Island
#1 adjustment moves this deck down to 74 cards thanks to Elfless
(Wouldn't evacuation still be a good card to keep on hand though? In an emergency situation?
#2 adjustment as per Elfless I removed 2 Phantom Beast and 1 Evacuation. As per myself, pending some insight I added 1 Jace Beleren. This brings the new total to 72 cards. Still looking to cut some/add more.
Tome scour is useless. It mills for 5, then what? Same goes true with archive trap. Mill for 13, and then what? Milling is only useful if you can manage to empty your opponent's library. 13 cards might as well be nothing, and milling an opponent is potentially quite harmful to you. Even Jace's ultimate is pretty weak.
Try to avoid playing walls. Wall of spears is pretty good for a wall, but its still just a wall.
"Sometimes, the situation is outracing a threat, sometimes it's ignoring it, and sometimes it involves sideboarding in 4x Hope//Pray." --Doug Linn
2 Thieving Magpie
2 Aether Adept
2 Air Elemental
2 Phantom Warrior
2 Sphinx of Jwar Isle
3 Essence Scatter
2 Counterbore
4 Boomerang
3 Negate
Sorcery (11)
3 Mind Spring
2 Sleep
3 Ponder
3 Preordain
2 Mind Control
Land (22)
22 Island
Try that. It gives you some better beats and you just counter large threats.
Standard - None | Commander[EDH] - The Mimeoplasm | Legacy - Mono-W 60 Land Basic
even late game, the chances of them having 3 mana open to counter manaleak are pretty slim. Even then, late game isn't what you should be worried about, early game is significantly harder for MUC to handle, and mana leak handles that significantly better.
edit:
if you have any Jace's ingenuity, you should run them instead of foresee. For one mana more you get instant speed (really important) and one extra card. I would also recommend brainstorm or ponder in place of preordain.
Whether it's a comedy or a tragedy, if there is cheering, the story will continue on.
Just like the many lives.
For the us who are still in it and still in the journey, send warm blessings.
- We will continue to walk down this path until eternity.