I am highly critical of this book, which was not good. I can't speak on Weisman's given time frame to complete this, but he accepted the job and as a professional, I expected better than this without having to hear excuses.
I wasn't aware about that with Jenna Helland and Godsend. Where did you learn that? I really wish they hadn't done that to Godsend and let her write it as she intended. Still, it was good.
¨
Sometimes after the book was released, maybe in some podcast, interview, or on Twitter discussion. I am not able to find the original source anymore, sorry :-(
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COme now, Avengeer os not master piece of writting, but atleast itas entertaining and cooherant. Actually gives each of the ehroes their spotlight and jsutice. can't say the same for WAR.
I do not want to badmouth Avengers But it is about the general mood, number of characters, depth of characters vs. the superhero flick where everyone shall shine for a while. Those are completely different premises each of the pieces comes from and has to build on. And yes, Avengers did that far better than War.
It is not a masterpiece, but it does not deserve Jenrik's -flinging either.
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The overall plot of WAR was fine. Greg Wiesman's novel however, was genuinely deprived. I couldn't believe how many cardinal sins of literature that book took the liberty of making. Telling, now showing. Juvenile vocabulary. Toilet humor. Run-on sentences that included name-dropping characters over properly writing them in. I was surprised Kiora was neglected, given her nature of opposing gods. Relying on capital letters over descriptive language to emphasize distress or gravitas. Internal monologues in capitals. Lack of focus, improper attention to senseless details while neglecting crucial story moments or relegating them to one-liner scene drops. Flat characters, limited momentum. The book spends its time getting a group of characters from point A to point B, Ravnica to the citadel across a plaza essentially. Just very poorly written by, I resent saying this, an author that I feel was most certainly beyond their own capabilities.
Whaa whaa whaa, they neglected my favorite blue planeswalker....
And about 25 others, pal. Kasmina was not featured in the book at all, added just to Rat's story on the webpage. Ashiok not even that. Tibalt mentioned once. Tamiyo and Narset maybe three times, with no speaking part...shall I continue?
And the last sentence about Weisman is laughable. Check his record (what he has written) and then consider that he was given not enough time to write this novel and too much hares to chase. It is so cute to see self-entitled random nobod- posters criticize established authors.
I frankly hope that the sequel (Forsaken) would be better, because there would not be so many characters and things to solve.
I honestly laughed when I read this. It's like an 8 year old's idea of writing a passage.
Taken out of context, it indeed seems laughable. When in the chapter, that intentionally used the capitals to emphasize Bolas's godhood and situation he was in, it fits.
Man, a far cry from Scott McGough's Kamigawa trilogy, and Godsend by Jenna Helland. Those are my favorite.
Well, Kamigawa (and Ravnica) were completely different kind of telling a story, a fact we have to accept. Godsend came close to the feeling of old novels, though there were also worse parts (also stemming from the fact that Jenna was forced to shorten the planned extent of the novel). But the thing is that these old books cannot be compared to War of the Spark, it is like you compared the Godfather trilogy to Avengers.
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Chapter 2 of the prequel was mailed out. Features our soon to be guild master assassin walkers.
"Part 1"
-We get to see Vraska take over the Golgari.
-Most of the high ranking Devkarin elves and Jarad had the Erstwhile as servants who where secretly working for Vraska which is how she took over the guild.
-We meet the Krul mindmage Xeddick, who later goes on to restore Vraskas memories. Xeddick is used to drain Jareds mind of all the guild info and secrets for Vraska.
-Overall I'm disappointed that Jared shift in character at the end of this from the original Ravnica. I could see him favoring the Devkarin and losing some of his old self as a lich but I wish that had been expanded on.
"Part 2"
-More details on what Kaya was meant to do. Bolas hired Kaya to recuse Teysa and then aid Teysa in killing the Obzedat.
-Teysa herself has been in contact with Bolas.
-Kaya makes contact with Teysa. Teysa decided to stay in her cell to pretend like she knew nothing of Kaya while sending Tomik to make a plan.
-Kaya mentions something called "The Broken Sky" that need to be fix and might be what Bolas might have done to her world.
The Jarad part is absolutely and totally f***ed up. He is absolutely NOTHING like his old character.
He sounds like a whiny despot, and one moment, he friggin' BLEEDS. A LICH.
Django really messed this part up. Not mention that at the end of Ixalan, Bolas told Vraska that Jarad is imprisoned for her in a particular place.
I wouldn't blame Django as much, I'm more upset at lining things up and Jared character which are things creative has better control on.
A friend of mine asked Django himself, and he said he got some outlines about the characters, but, for example, there was never mentioned that he is undead. Like the card Jarad, Golgari LICH Lord with the types ZOMBIE Elf never existed.
This is a big blunder of Creative or whoever gave him bad instructions and info...
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Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
Chapter 2 of the prequel was mailed out. Features our soon to be guild master assassin walkers.
"Part 1"
-We get to see Vraska take over the Golgari.
-Most of the high ranking Devkarin elves and Jarad had the Erstwhile as servants who where secretly working for Vraska which is how she took over the guild.
-We meet the Krul mindmage Xeddick, who later goes on to restore Vraskas memories. Xeddick is used to drain Jareds mind of all the guild info and secrets for Vraska.
-Overall I'm disappointed that Jared shift in character at the end of this from the original Ravnica. I could see him favoring the Devkarin and losing some of his old self as a lich but I wish that had been expanded on.
"Part 2"
-More details on what Kaya was meant to do. Bolas hired Kaya to recuse Teysa and then aid Teysa in killing the Obzedat.
-Teysa herself has been in contact with Bolas.
-Kaya makes contact with Teysa. Teysa decided to stay in her cell to pretend like she knew nothing of Kaya while sending Tomik to make a plan.
-Kaya mentions something called "The Broken Sky" that need to be fix and might be what Bolas might have done to her world.
The Jarad part is absolutely and totally f***ed up. He is absolutely NOTHING like his old character.
He sounds like a whiny despot, and one moment, he friggin' BLEEDS. A LICH.
Django really messed this part up. Not mention that at the end of Ixalan, Bolas told Vraska that Jarad is imprisoned for her in a particular place.
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Okay, I have finished the book this morning on my way to work.
Final thoughts: I am giving this 7,5/10.
First of all, it was a titanic effort to describe such a conflict believably. With the chosen method of different POVs and not an omniscient narrator, some things were just hinted and not explored deeper, like Sorin-Nahiri fight. But that is okay, because otherwise it would be a damned mess. Choosing a rookie walker like Teyo to be basically the main spectator was a good move. Yes, someone would complain that it means we got several pages of Teyo and the company underground, and just like two paragraphs of some emotional reunion..but that is how it is meant to be.
Second, I liked the writing. Simply liked. It is no worse than Martha Wells' Dominaria. What I find disruptive was the seemingly random capitalization of some words. Okay, I grudgingly accepted seeing Planeswalker again with capital (P), like in the ancient comics. But Hazoret's Spear?
Third - for everyone complaining about predictability - I actually liked how all the stratagems supposed to lead to Bolas's downfall played (at least to some extent) to his hand.
- the thing with the Beacon: devised to call planeswalkers to fight Bolas, in fact planted to the Firemind by Bolas and devised to call walkers for Bolas to harvest, really in fact known by Mizzet and Ugin to make things happen (with expected high casualties for having just a shot to stop Bolas). Leaves Zarek with guilt about being partially responsible for all walkers that died - possible character growth?
- to certain extension, this is also valid for Jace
- the whole Blackblade thing.
- the fact that the newly resurrected Mizzet managed only to take out Kefnet and then fainted. Of course, not exactly Apocalypse levels of hope lost, but it was there.
- And I must admit that I liked the twist with Vraska. Because everybody expected the climax to be different, Jace restoring her memory in crucial moment, her petrifying Bolas or something, everybody rejoices and dances, Ewoks bang on stormtrooper helmets... instead, a kraul telepath restores her mind in the prequels and she kills Isperia and plunges the whole world deeper into crisis just because she failed to control herself about the old injustices, and, like Ral, is partially responsible for what comes next.
- I liked the solution of elimination of the Living Guildpact power by disrupting the leyline nexus. Makes sense.
- And I liked the many hinted future stories to be explored - what happened between Karn and Sarkhan to just coldly acknowledge each other, what is the story of The Wanderer and Sarkhan, it would also be interesting to go back to Davriel after all this, because he went on full badass mode in one moment - but I loved the fact, that despite his card does not reflect that, the book makes use of his spellstealing exactly as in the Children.
- Dack's chapters were immensely satisfying here. Good way of saying farewell.
- I have already spoken about the walker cameos. I am disappointed that the Story Circle walkers in particular did not get a greater role (with the exception of Ajani, of course). Tamiyo, Narset, newly Kiora. Ashiok and Kasmina are not mentioned once at all. Tibalt is in one sentence about leading devils into battle, but not before and not after. I hoped to learn more about The Wanderer, besides three really cool action scenes. At least Yanggu & Yanling were funny.
- overall - the book is different than those in the past. But also of the piles of mess from Wintermute, and the enthusiastic, but amateurish attempts of Doug Beyer (Alara Unbroken, The Secretist). And after all those years, I am not disappointed.
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Nahiri-I also noticed Nahiri was at the war counsel when they had gathered all the walkers and guild members to figure out what to do
Ral-I love it and idk if intentional but I like the symbolism of him not wanting to be outed as a planeswalker as well as the couple being on the DL since they are high ranking members of different guilds. Its also cute of each of them has a ribbon of the others clothing around their wrists.
Cameo and missing walkers- we are getting web fiction from Rat POV (Love her she is now on the list of characters I wanna see on a card) so I hope at least we get to see the walkers who didn't get a lot of screen time. I do wonder why Kasmina was made if yangling was gonna be in the story. Maro mentioned they have plans for Yangling in the view of Garruk so maybe she's gonna get a storyline soon?
Walker team up- Honesty this was one of my favorite parts of the book, seeing all the walkers fighting together and seeing their differt magics on opponents they didn't need to hold back on. Davriel was pretty badass in his fight, loved that part where he stole the elder spell out of an eternal to stop it. I also just loved the Wanderer asking Gideon to punch her. Glad to see she seem to be popular, I love to know and see more of the Wanderer.
Dack- Yea he got a great last arc. The dramatic irony of his statements through the book got to me too. His death was also a bit of a shock, I know it was coming, but like Dack, I like how we thought it was him being saved like he had just before hand or to realize he was trapped and being harvested.
- now that you mention it, I checked the book, and Kasmina is not mentioned once. Yeah, it seems that Yanling was replaced by her in the cards.
- there's actually quite high number of planeswalker deaths, not just named ones...
Jace didn’t even know the names of the fallen. Hadn’t even realized there were this many Planeswalkers to fall.
Who was that vedalken? Who was that tall elven woman? Who was that four-armed ogre or that very short green-haired man or
that ancient crone or that frightened teenager or…?
a large viashino with lime-green skin materialized right in front of her, surrounded by the distinct gold aura of a Planeswalker.
He had just enough time to hiss, “What izzzz thissss?” before a female Eternal grabbed him from behind - pity to see a viashino walker and not even learned his name...
Rhonas reached out faster than Angrath’s chain, grabbing a human Planeswalker with a shaved head and metal-casting powers...
We’ve kept the Dreadhorde at bay, but it’s a losing battle. Khazi was harvested when an Eternal punched its hand right through the wall and grabbed her by the wrist.” - actually a named one, yet unknown to us.
An unnammed vedalken walker is also seen harvested. The number of walkers arriving is said to be over two hundred...
The cruel thing is that the walkers are super-vulnerable to the Eternals, more than mortals- a firm grip is enough...and the God-Eternals does not have the dignity to explode upon harvesting.
- the saddest thing is that all the harvested sparks in the end dissipate after Bolas is attacked by Bontu and Oketra and the Elderspell fizzles into nothing.
- Mazirek was Bolas's agent, busted by Vraska and killed by his fellow kraul.
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So, what exactly WAS the deal with Angrath? Was he actually on Bolas' side, or was he just commandeering eternals and running amok all on his own, like some here speculated? (Or did the implications of his card have literally no basis in story?)
Angrath was anti-Bolas and we don't see if Angrath takes control. Maro mentioned that most of the planeswalkers cards where made with their abilities first and then later matched wth a character, they wanted the black/red planeswalker to have amass for game play reasons and Angrath was the only red/black they had.
Angrath was pretty awesome, especially before he went hunting Eternals with Huatli. His speech like "well, I am trapped for the second time by this stupid thing, and I just want to go home to my daughters and kick this dragon's minions ass. Just show me what to hit."
Some musings:
-Sorin and Nahiri are mentioned like twice, once fighting together, once fighting against Eternals (their quarrel forgotten for time being). Because the book is written from several POVs and not an omniscient narrator, this makes sense.
- a certain thing revealed about Ral Zarek is...surprising.
- I quite liked the writing, it fits the chosen way of telling the story (the limited POV of characters)
- plenty of walkers are just cameoing without even speaking (Narset, Tamiyo), Tibalt is mentioned once, Ashiok not at all. But there is Mu Yanling, who does not have a card in the set.
- Mowu can "transform" from the cute puppy into a big, three-tailed dog.
- team-up of Karn, Samut, Dack, Nixilis and Sarkhan to destroy the Planar Bridge on Amonkhet is great.
- Dack actually has a great arc and lots of action before dying, and his POVs including his passing are well-written. His death is unfornutate, and indirectly caused by the intentional reactivation of the Sun by the allies, so that Bolas cannot escape. It comes in a critical moment for Dack, because he would be able to planeswalk from the Eternal's grip.
- Davriel actually fights a bit.
- we do not learn much about The Wanderer.
- what is a little annoying is having to wait for the prequel stories, because the book starts immediately after their conclusion.
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DO NOT DISCUSS THE STORY LEAK. Infractions will be handed out. The leak is due to possible illegal activity and due to such we are not allowing it on the forums.
Ulka and the Mod team
Whereas - as a former veteran moderator myself - I can see you are just trying to do your job, exactly what kind of illegal activity is when a store, by accident, sells a novel before it shall be available?
How different it is from people opening and leaking cards they opened a week and a half before they are allowed to?
It's not like the guy stole it from the printing facility.
And you missed post #615...
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According to the cards spoiled on mythicspoiler, Gideon dies and his soul goes to Theros, which shouldn't be possible because we were told that when you die your soul ends up on the plane where you've died. They are already setting him up for return lol
It is a kind of afterlife vision, not a return to Theros.
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1. Why "Hieromancy" became "Law Magic" in Magic:the Gathering is a mystery to me.
2. Bah, in the new teaser about Bolas' Plan they basically say "in the end (pun intended)it did not matter where the heck he would go"... But on Ravnica there is the Interplanar Beacon, that might be a better reason.
The Beacon was built there recently. It is the "new project" referred to on Steam Vents. It is not something that was there since days of yore.
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>>Banner by Spanglegluppet<<
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Whatever. I'm not gonna repeat myself again.
¨
Sometimes after the book was released, maybe in some podcast, interview, or on Twitter discussion. I am not able to find the original source anymore, sorry :-(
Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
I do not want to badmouth Avengers But it is about the general mood, number of characters, depth of characters vs. the superhero flick where everyone shall shine for a while. Those are completely different premises each of the pieces comes from and has to build on. And yes, Avengers did that far better than War.
It is not a masterpiece, but it does not deserve Jenrik's -flinging either.
Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
Whaa whaa whaa, they neglected my favorite blue planeswalker....
And about 25 others, pal. Kasmina was not featured in the book at all, added just to Rat's story on the webpage. Ashiok not even that. Tibalt mentioned once. Tamiyo and Narset maybe three times, with no speaking part...shall I continue?
And the last sentence about Weisman is laughable. Check his record (what he has written) and then consider that he was given not enough time to write this novel and too much hares to chase. It is so cute to see self-entitled random
nobod-posters criticize established authors.I frankly hope that the sequel (Forsaken) would be better, because there would not be so many characters and things to solve.
Taken out of context, it indeed seems laughable. When in the chapter, that intentionally used the capitals to emphasize Bolas's godhood and situation he was in, it fits.
Well, Kamigawa (and Ravnica) were completely different kind of telling a story, a fact we have to accept. Godsend came close to the feeling of old novels, though there were also worse parts (also stemming from the fact that Jenna was forced to shorten the planned extent of the novel). But the thing is that these old books cannot be compared to War of the Spark, it is like you compared the Godfather trilogy to Avengers.
Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
A friend of mine asked Django himself, and he said he got some outlines about the characters, but, for example, there was never mentioned that he is undead. Like the card Jarad, Golgari LICH Lord with the types ZOMBIE Elf never existed.
This is a big blunder of Creative or whoever gave him bad instructions and info...
Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
The Jarad part is absolutely and totally f***ed up. He is absolutely NOTHING like his old character.
He sounds like a whiny despot, and one moment, he friggin' BLEEDS. A LICH.
Django really messed this part up. Not mention that at the end of Ixalan, Bolas told Vraska that Jarad is imprisoned for her in a particular place.
Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
Final thoughts: I am giving this 7,5/10.
First of all, it was a titanic effort to describe such a conflict believably. With the chosen method of different POVs and not an omniscient narrator, some things were just hinted and not explored deeper, like Sorin-Nahiri fight. But that is okay, because otherwise it would be a damned mess. Choosing a rookie walker like Teyo to be basically the main spectator was a good move. Yes, someone would complain that it means we got several pages of Teyo and the company underground, and just like two paragraphs of some emotional reunion..but that is how it is meant to be.
Second, I liked the writing. Simply liked. It is no worse than Martha Wells' Dominaria. What I find disruptive was the seemingly random capitalization of some words. Okay, I grudgingly accepted seeing Planeswalker again with capital (P), like in the ancient comics. But Hazoret's Spear?
Third - for everyone complaining about predictability - I actually liked how all the stratagems supposed to lead to Bolas's downfall played (at least to some extent) to his hand.
- the thing with the Beacon: devised to call planeswalkers to fight Bolas, in fact planted to the Firemind by Bolas and devised to call walkers for Bolas to harvest, really in fact known by Mizzet and Ugin to make things happen (with expected high casualties for having just a shot to stop Bolas). Leaves Zarek with guilt about being partially responsible for all walkers that died - possible character growth?
- to certain extension, this is also valid for Jace
- the whole Blackblade thing.
- the fact that the newly resurrected Mizzet managed only to take out Kefnet and then fainted. Of course, not exactly Apocalypse levels of hope lost, but it was there.
- And I must admit that I liked the twist with Vraska. Because everybody expected the climax to be different, Jace restoring her memory in crucial moment, her petrifying Bolas or something, everybody rejoices and dances, Ewoks bang on stormtrooper helmets... instead, a kraul telepath restores her mind in the prequels and she kills Isperia and plunges the whole world deeper into crisis just because she failed to control herself about the old injustices, and, like Ral, is partially responsible for what comes next.
- I liked the solution of elimination of the Living Guildpact power by disrupting the leyline nexus. Makes sense.
- And I liked the many hinted future stories to be explored - what happened between Karn and Sarkhan to just coldly acknowledge each other, what is the story of The Wanderer and Sarkhan, it would also be interesting to go back to Davriel after all this, because he went on full badass mode in one moment - but I loved the fact, that despite his card does not reflect that, the book makes use of his spellstealing exactly as in the Children.
- Dack's chapters were immensely satisfying here. Good way of saying farewell.
- I have already spoken about the walker cameos. I am disappointed that the Story Circle walkers in particular did not get a greater role (with the exception of Ajani, of course). Tamiyo, Narset, newly Kiora. Ashiok and Kasmina are not mentioned once at all. Tibalt is in one sentence about leading devils into battle, but not before and not after. I hoped to learn more about The Wanderer, besides three really cool action scenes. At least Yanggu & Yanling were funny.
- overall - the book is different than those in the past. But also of the piles of mess from Wintermute, and the enthusiastic, but amateurish attempts of Doug Beyer (Alara Unbroken, The Secretist). And after all those years, I am not disappointed.
Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
- now that you mention it, I checked the book, and Kasmina is not mentioned once. Yeah, it seems that Yanling was replaced by her in the cards.
- there's actually quite high number of planeswalker deaths, not just named ones...
Jace didn’t even know the names of the fallen. Hadn’t even realized there were this many Planeswalkers to fall.
Who was that vedalken? Who was that tall elven woman? Who was that four-armed ogre or that very short green-haired man or
that ancient crone or that frightened teenager or…?
a large viashino with lime-green skin materialized right in front of her, surrounded by the distinct gold aura of a Planeswalker.
He had just enough time to hiss, “What izzzz thissss?” before a female Eternal grabbed him from behind - pity to see a viashino walker and not even learned his name...
Rhonas reached out faster than Angrath’s chain, grabbing a human Planeswalker with a shaved head and metal-casting powers...
We’ve kept the Dreadhorde at bay, but it’s a losing battle. Khazi was harvested when an Eternal punched its hand right through the wall and grabbed her by the wrist.” - actually a named one, yet unknown to us.
An unnammed vedalken walker is also seen harvested. The number of walkers arriving is said to be over two hundred...
The cruel thing is that the walkers are super-vulnerable to the Eternals, more than mortals- a firm grip is enough...and the God-Eternals does not have the dignity to explode upon harvesting.
- the saddest thing is that all the harvested sparks in the end dissipate after Bolas is attacked by Bontu and Oketra and the Elderspell fizzles into nothing.
- Mazirek was Bolas's agent, busted by Vraska and killed by his fellow kraul.
Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
Angrath was pretty awesome, especially before he went hunting Eternals with Huatli. His speech like "well, I am trapped for the second time by this stupid thing, and I just want to go home to my daughters and kick this dragon's minions ass. Just show me what to hit."
Some musings:
-Sorin and Nahiri are mentioned like twice, once fighting together, once fighting against Eternals (their quarrel forgotten for time being). Because the book is written from several POVs and not an omniscient narrator, this makes sense.
- a certain thing revealed about Ral Zarek is...surprising.
- I quite liked the writing, it fits the chosen way of telling the story (the limited POV of characters)
- plenty of walkers are just cameoing without even speaking (Narset, Tamiyo), Tibalt is mentioned once, Ashiok not at all. But there is Mu Yanling, who does not have a card in the set.
- Mowu can "transform" from the cute puppy into a big, three-tailed dog.
- team-up of Karn, Samut, Dack, Nixilis and Sarkhan to destroy the Planar Bridge on Amonkhet is great.
- Dack actually has a great arc and lots of action before dying, and his POVs including his passing are well-written. His death is unfornutate, and indirectly caused by the intentional reactivation of the Sun by the allies, so that Bolas cannot escape. It comes in a critical moment for Dack, because he would be able to planeswalk from the Eternal's grip.
- Davriel actually fights a bit.
- we do not learn much about The Wanderer.
- what is a little annoying is having to wait for the prequel stories, because the book starts immediately after their conclusion.
Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
It's a vision of afterlife, not something that is actually happening, I think.
Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
Is Liliana free of BOTH the pact and the veil now?
Will we ever learn who or what The Raven Man was?
Questions...
Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
Whereas - as a former veteran moderator myself - I can see you are just trying to do your job, exactly what kind of illegal activity is when a store, by accident, sells a novel before it shall be available?
How different it is from people opening and leaking cards they opened a week and a half before they are allowed to?
It's not like the guy stole it from the printing facility.
And you missed post #615...
Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
It is a kind of afterlife vision, not a return to Theros.
Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
The Beacon was built there recently. It is the "new project" referred to on Steam Vents. It is not something that was there since days of yore.
Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)