My English is very poor, so I can only reply with Google Translate.
The delve creature and the shadow have always been like a couple who are hard together.And I really hate the instability brought by Thought Scour , and Thought Scour has no bonus for shadow.
Removing the delve creature and Thought Scour can at least keep us from being afraid of the grave hate.
I think bitterblossom is a card that is worth testing in your idea.And this card can also make up for the weakness of the shadow is not good at spending and can not block flying creatures.
I want to try this list
4 shadow
4 Bitterblossom
4 WRAITH
2 Architects of Will
2 tiago
4 serum visions
2 looting
2 secrets
4 THOUGHTSEIZE
4 inquisition
2 KC
2 BOLT
2 dismember
1 push
1 black pact
2 DENIAL
18 LANDS
Thanks for loving my ideas But Bitterblossom is great but it not really fitting the deck for uncontrollable life loss might be backfire at the end. The insane token generating value definitely is a cool idea, so I just decided to give a try on Young Pyromancer as 2 copies.
I saw the inclusion of the black pact. I actually have tried that as 1 copy previous but wasn't like it much. It is best card to tutor for some creature removal for 0 mana and kill opponent with direct 24 damage from Battle Raged Shadow. But when it might sit a very long time in the hand when you are unable to give one shot kill to opponent, and the card really really bad against control deck.
I have build the deck to move away cantrips (Bauble, Serum Vision, looting) as well actually, because these card serve one similar purpose which is SEARCHING FOR THREAT or FINDING ANSWER FOR A SITUATION and I believe it can be done with Mausoleum Secrets. So, I decided to go all 4 secrets and 4 tiago as well. SNapcaster mage really strong with Secrets to find additional thing in the deck.
This doesn't change much from previous Grixis Bauble Shadow. We played path like early discard and backed with Denial. It still goes the same, just Mausoleum Secrets tutor for shadow and it needed to be as big as 4/4 to turn on denial. Well, if you meant that Path that exile creature, and now creature is not in graveyard to enable Mausoleum Secrets but we are turning it on with Street Wraith and the cycling creature anyways.
If you don’t want to be heavy on Delve spells, you should at least play some Pyromancer maindeck. Shadow as your only real threat is definitely a non-sense.
I'm not sure removing the delve threats is a wise decision. However, if I were doing this, I would most likely try to build towards a Bedlam Reveler deck. More Lootings, more red sources and a couple more lands.
Yeah, a bit risky just to play 4 shadow without delve threats. Between young peezy and bedlam reveler, I chosen young peezy and give them a try for 2 copies in the main to see how it goes.
Not seeing delve fatties is weird haha, overall looks nice. Why not play two delve creatures?
The delve fatties everytime eat the whole graveyard especially street wraith, so I dare to try removed all 4 delve threats to go all 4 secrets haha. The deck was still play as "8" threat overall. Just sometime unable to play turn 2 angler/tasigur to pressure the board, but the deck still could perform turn 3 into 4/4 or 5/5 shadow, and secret is absolute beast in lategame that able to tutor for any 3cmc or less black cards.
I have tested variance new thing with Mausoleum Secrets, that card was insane to search for threat, so I give it a try for few test and watch closely for those cards that can be contradict and nonbo.
Those cards are : Mausoleum secrets, delve threat, snappy.
First phase: 4 Mausoleum Secrets, 4 delve threats, 4 snappy - too much rely on graveyard and really scoop vs grave hate. The biggest contradict was secrets and delve threat. For sure delve threat eat up street wraith in graveyard. 4 snap still able to support this play. Hence, -2 Mausoleum Secret and go to phase 2. Hard to fullfill secret's condition by dumping street wraith for turn 3 shadow.
Second phase : 2 Mausoleum Secrets, 4 delve threat, 4 snappy - the play has become a bit smoother than first phase since I have less possibility to draw on secrets. When draw secrets still have the same issue that delve threat eat up almost whole graveyard and left no creature. This time I have a conclusion that delve threat and secrets is really hard to play together, both card in hand at the same time, one can be dead most of the time. The test goes on to next phase, I cut all delve threat and cards that support to delve creature, it might not be correct but I still tried it.
Third phase : 4 Mausoleum Secrets, 4 snappy, 4 architect of wills, 0 delve threat, 0 thought scour, 0 bauble - To be truth, I liked this build a lot. It can be good since the release of assassin's trophy can be hit delve threat pretty bad. This build play 8 shadows and can be consistently hit turn 3 shadow with Secrets in hand. I have make the deck switch to more midrangy than before and surprisingly it can grind well against deck like jeskai control and jund. 3 denial still in the deck because 4 secrets able to tutor for shadow and still easily turn it on. I really like the deck that has become really flexible and able to switch gear against variance of deck.
Flexible cards:
Snapcaster mage, k command, mausoleum secrets
I guess you can give it a try. If really bad, we can still switch it back to old version of this deck Please let me know if you have any opinion or suggestion
You are right about the looting, without some value in the deck, this card is risky to play since it help lose gas and also bad topdeck later on. Not sure how it goes but I tried to come out with this list.
Agreed on how Endurrr think of Collective Brutality on tutor by Secrets as well as send creature to graveyard to enable tutoring effect. Play with a lot bad matchup at least it is a hate card that mainboard & extra discard. Gone back to 18 lands due to dropping baubles.
4 snappy is here to stay to add flexibility of the deck.
Result: secondary colour move to red than blue. Temur battle rage still is VIP. But I feel much better play against them by fast deploy & tutor threat. Lose but better.
I have using Ben Fredman's version for sometime now with 2 looting and 4 baubles. The deck indeed filled graveyard very fast with cards.
I was testing with +1 Tasigur -1 Snappy, along with 4 angler by focusing on aggro beat down and so far it has been great as one more additional threat that can be dig by cantrips while filling the graveyard, and it also add possibility to turn on denial and battle rage.
Hi GDS fellow, is the new card "Damping Sphere" from the new Dominaria set be a worth slot in our sideboard?
Good to stop tron and eldrazis given deploy it on turn 2. It definitely stop Tron from turn 3 wurmcoil or karn and delay those eldrazi buying us time to play some magic.
But the drawback sure would delay us also, but it is it not affecting us more than those big mana deck since GDS play cards that are mana efficient.
Appreciate if you could provide some opinion on the card.
I have to take back some of my criticism in regard to maindeck TBRs.
Today I played 15 practice matches in a row on MTGO and took notes on which cards were good in each matchup and what my opponents did to stop me. Unsurprisingly, Thoughtseize, Stubborn Denial and Gurmag Angler were the MVPs.
What surprised me was the lack of interaction in the vast majority of the games. The two most interactive matches were against Storm and Bant Eldrazi, and frankly, these decks were not that interactive. To be fair, I also rolled over a blue red control deck before my opponent had the opportunity to interact much. But even that opponent was busy trying to resolve one of their maindeck Blood Moons when they were not Opting or Serum Vision-ing. Of the 15 decks, 6 were Company/Chord decks in various color combinations that mostly played solitaire.
I went 12-3 in matches, losing only to Elves (very close), Esper Tokens (totally owned me with Lingering Souls) and Mono Red Hollow One (in both games I was stuck on 2 lands for the entire time). 10 of the 12 matches that I won ended 2-0 in games for me. I'm sure I won some of these games because I was more experienced with my deck than my opponents were with theirs, even though I also was playing an unfamiliar version with a new sideboard. On the other hand, I doubt that most of the solitaire decks are that hard to master. Anyway, I'm glad that TBR helped end some of these games prematurely. And I'm looking forward to some mirror matches in the future, which are currently by far the most enjoyable games for me.
I just feel that Opt probably worse than Serum Vision, filter 3 cards > instant speed. Doesn't matter its a sorcery, we are fine playing sorcery speed anyways. Vision confirmed will be filter 3 cards btw. Opt filter 2 card, sometime 1 card only.
I don't yet fully know what I think of this decklist, seems like a metagame call at first, but I am very interested
It seems like the base idea came from DSJ that replacing Traverse with cantrips. I think that build just hotcake for single moment and I still believe that we need our snappy and commands to do close the gap for our bad matchups. Smash some artifacts from affinity, crushes chalice and even get us ready to grind against controls deck. But one thing is that its hard for a grixis DS play alike DSJ. They have their explosiveness, but we have our late game stable.
Thanks for loving my ideas But Bitterblossom is great but it not really fitting the deck for uncontrollable life loss might be backfire at the end. The insane token generating value definitely is a cool idea, so I just decided to give a try on Young Pyromancer as 2 copies.
I saw the inclusion of the black pact. I actually have tried that as 1 copy previous but wasn't like it much. It is best card to tutor for some creature removal for 0 mana and kill opponent with direct 24 damage from Battle Raged Shadow. But when it might sit a very long time in the hand when you are unable to give one shot kill to opponent, and the card really really bad against control deck.
I have build the deck to move away cantrips (Bauble, Serum Vision, looting) as well actually, because these card serve one similar purpose which is SEARCHING FOR THREAT or FINDING ANSWER FOR A SITUATION and I believe it can be done with Mausoleum Secrets. So, I decided to go all 4 secrets and 4 tiago as well. SNapcaster mage really strong with Secrets to find additional thing in the deck.
This doesn't change much from previous Grixis Bauble Shadow. We played path like early discard and backed with Denial. It still goes the same, just Mausoleum Secrets tutor for shadow and it needed to be as big as 4/4 to turn on denial. Well, if you meant that Path that exile creature, and now creature is not in graveyard to enable Mausoleum Secrets but we are turning it on with Street Wraith and the cycling creature anyways.
Yeah, a bit risky just to play 4 shadow without delve threats. Between young peezy and bedlam reveler, I chosen young peezy and give them a try for 2 copies in the main to see how it goes.
The delve fatties everytime eat the whole graveyard especially street wraith, so I dare to try removed all 4 delve threats to go all 4 secrets haha. The deck was still play as "8" threat overall. Just sometime unable to play turn 2 angler/tasigur to pressure the board, but the deck still could perform turn 3 into 4/4 or 5/5 shadow, and secret is absolute beast in lategame that able to tutor for any 3cmc or less black cards.
Those cards are : Mausoleum secrets, delve threat, snappy.
First phase: 4 Mausoleum Secrets, 4 delve threats, 4 snappy - too much rely on graveyard and really scoop vs grave hate. The biggest contradict was secrets and delve threat. For sure delve threat eat up street wraith in graveyard. 4 snap still able to support this play. Hence, -2 Mausoleum Secret and go to phase 2. Hard to fullfill secret's condition by dumping street wraith for turn 3 shadow.
Second phase : 2 Mausoleum Secrets, 4 delve threat, 4 snappy - the play has become a bit smoother than first phase since I have less possibility to draw on secrets. When draw secrets still have the same issue that delve threat eat up almost whole graveyard and left no creature. This time I have a conclusion that delve threat and secrets is really hard to play together, both card in hand at the same time, one can be dead most of the time. The test goes on to next phase, I cut all delve threat and cards that support to delve creature, it might not be correct but I still tried it.
Third phase : 4 Mausoleum Secrets, 4 snappy, 4 architect of wills, 0 delve threat, 0 thought scour, 0 bauble - To be truth, I liked this build a lot. It can be good since the release of assassin's trophy can be hit delve threat pretty bad. This build play 8 shadows and can be consistently hit turn 3 shadow with Secrets in hand. I have make the deck switch to more midrangy than before and surprisingly it can grind well against deck like jeskai control and jund. 3 denial still in the deck because 4 secrets able to tutor for shadow and still easily turn it on. I really like the deck that has become really flexible and able to switch gear against variance of deck.
Flexible cards:
Snapcaster mage, k command, mausoleum secrets
The current brewing of mine :
2x Blood Crypt
4x Bloodstained Mire
1x Island
4x Polluted Delta
4x Scalding Tarn
1x Steam Vents
1x Swamp
2x Watery Grave
1x Collective Brutality
2x Inquisition of Kozilek
4x Thoughtseize
Instant (18)
2x Dismember
2x Fatal Push
2x Kolaghan's Command
3x Lightning Bolt
4x Mausoleum Secrets
3x Stubborn Denial
2x Temur Battle Rage
4x Architects of Will
4x Death's Shadow
4x Snapcaster Mage
4x Street Wraith
I guess you can give it a try. If really bad, we can still switch it back to old version of this deck Please let me know if you have any opinion or suggestion
The list is like how it was in previous post, and I did some minor changes. The current list looked like :
2x Blood Crypt
4x Bloodstained Mire
1x Island
4x Polluted Delta
3x Scalding Tarn
1x Steam Vents
1x Swamp
2x Watery Grave
2x Dismember
2x Fatal Push
3x Lightning Bolt
2x Mausoleum Secrets
3x Stubborn Denial
2x Temur Battle Rage
4x Thought Scour
4x Death's Shadow
4x Gurmag Angler
4x Snapcaster Mage
4x Street Wraith
2x Faithless Looting
2x Inquisition of Kozilek
4x Thoughtseize
The changes could also be -1 Push, +1 LOTV/LtLH
Even a maindeck relic deck can ruin the plan and new tutor left you to find nothing.
I think 4 was too many, 2 might be correct number here.
2x Blood Crypt
4x Bloodstained Mire
1x Island
4x Polluted Delta
3x Scalding Tarn
1x Steam Vents
1x Swamp
2x Watery Grave
2x Dismember
1x Fatal Push
3x Lightning Bolt
4x Mausoleum Secrets
3x Stubborn Denial
2x Temur Battle Rage
4x Thought Scour
4x Death's Shadow
4x Gurmag Angler
4x Snapcaster Mage
4x Street Wraith
Sorcery (7)
1x Collective Brutality
2x Inquisition of Kozilek
4x Thoughtseize
Agreed on how Endurrr think of Collective Brutality on tutor by Secrets as well as send creature to graveyard to enable tutoring effect. Play with a lot bad matchup at least it is a hate card that mainboard & extra discard. Gone back to 18 lands due to dropping baubles.
4 snappy is here to stay to add flexibility of the deck.
Creature that might help with the deck in filling Graveyard on turn 1 : Architects of Will, Stitcher's Supplier
Creature (16)
Death’s Shadow x4
Gurmag angler x4
Snapcaster mage x4
Street wraith x4
Spells (27)
Thoughtseize x4
Inquisition x2
Lightning bolt x3
Fatal push x2
Dismember x2
Secret of mausoleum x4
Faithless looting x4
Thought scour x1
Stubborn denial x3
Temur battle rage x2
Lands (17)
Bloodstained mire x4
Polluted delta x4
Scalding tarn x2
Watery grave x2
Blood crypt x2
Steam vent x1
Swamp x1
Mountain x1
Result: secondary colour move to red than blue. Temur battle rage still is VIP. But I feel much better play against them by fast deploy & tutor threat. Lose but better.
For sure, it worsen against grindy matchups.
I was testing with +1 Tasigur -1 Snappy, along with 4 angler by focusing on aggro beat down and so far it has been great as one more additional threat that can be dig by cantrips while filling the graveyard, and it also add possibility to turn on denial and battle rage.
Good to stop tron and eldrazis given deploy it on turn 2. It definitely stop Tron from turn 3 wurmcoil or karn and delay those eldrazi buying us time to play some magic.
But the drawback sure would delay us also, but it is it not affecting us more than those big mana deck since GDS play cards that are mana efficient.
Appreciate if you could provide some opinion on the card.
Mind if you could share the list here?
Some interesting article that can read through for analysing the meta deck. But, I am not convince to the GDS build in the article for playing 4 Opt.
However, strategy against Etron by attacking their mana indeed is a bad idea, i rather get answer for their threats instead of their lands.
It seems like the base idea came from DSJ that replacing Traverse with cantrips. I think that build just hotcake for single moment and I still believe that we need our snappy and commands to do close the gap for our bad matchups. Smash some artifacts from affinity, crushes chalice and even get us ready to grind against controls deck. But one thing is that its hard for a grixis DS play alike DSJ. They have their explosiveness, but we have our late game stable.
I sided in 2 Temur Battle Rage to fight with those unexpected deck such as Dredge.