What do you guys think of main boarding collective brutality in the flexi slot? I been testing fine so far. At least it helps in some bad matchups. Clearing some creature early game in aggro matches. Taking away some removal by discarding from company, and control matches. Utilising all three mode vs burn in game 1 lol. Escalate helps throwing cards to graveyard for our delve fatties as well.
Yeah, i've been talking to some other GDS players in my community and they agree that cutting Stubborn Denial(even from the MB) is kind of crazy. This is obviosuly based on pure results. Denial has been a staple in every winning list and his Jundy list is more of a testing build(or at least he hasn't put any tangible result with it). Again, i like his premise but that doesn't make it right. I feel that Denial fills a role that might not be so crystal clear, but having the ability of playing protect the queen+defending against random nonsense is huge in this format. I always feels busted to me.
Ultimately, like most Modern decisions, it should be a pure metacall, i don't think cutting Denial entirely from the deck or even the MB is correct. If you expect a lot of Control, Mirrors and attrition based matchups then being more proactive could be better. Only testing can know.
Agreed with your fellow community, not sure about the MB's Liliana of the Veil, however I felt Denial still important to be play. Although there are some matchups they are held in hand for long time (for instance against aggro creature based), but not necessary die in hand as affinity has galvanic blast, merfolk has vapour snag, eldrazi has their path etc. Probably Game 2 would be siding those denial out anyway against those creature based deck.
What's the best strategy for burn?
Try not to street wraith and let them get your life total down before going for the kill?
The ideal play is play a delve guy in turn 2 and go for the beat down, and turn on denial. Less reduce your life with street wraith.
However, ppl tend to bring down number of thoughtseize to 1 or 0 in Game 2, but always remember that Burns player's biggest threat still is an early Eidolon and only way to deal with it is rip their hand before they could play them.
Counterspell is all star, Inquisition and Collective Brutality is all star against them.
Game 2 cut 4 street wraith, 1-2 thoughtseize, bring in 2 collective brutality, 1-2 stubborn denial, 1-2 Temur battle rage if you have them
Saw this in channelfireball by Paulo Vitor. However, I am having disagreement on the final part on Kolaghan's Command and Snap. I would still remain 2 kcommand in main since it only the way to deal with resolved chalice. It also add favor for us against affinity etc. Snap could be slow but I think he is important especially in late game, and there is no way for me to cut his number in my deck. The LotV MD seems interesting for me and might try swap 2 denial to 2 LotV and walk a proactive way.
I think what you board in and board out is good. I would bring in 1 EE as some of them playing chalice and our discard are very good against it unless they have topdeck it. I would play surgical extraction when discard a titan and extract them are enough to win the game.
I agree,I actually just before this tournament switched off of surgical in favor of temur battle-rage. Thus far (from a very small sample size) I've liked battle-rage much much more. It lets you steal games from otherwise difficult match-ups, especially against decks playing lingering souls. I additionally have found surgical as kind of underwhelming, it is of course very good here.
I actually take off temur battle rage from my 75 long time ago. Its excellent when your threat stick in battlefield. Been stuck in my hand before without having chance to cast it. Against tokens, I been using last hope instead and so far she is doing extremely good job. But I guess it personal choices after all.
After having lots of failure with this deck I ended up winning FNM last night (after barely squeaking into top 8) in which I beat titan shift in both the semi's and the finals. I'm mainly curious as to how other people approach this match-up. My maindeck is 19 land, completely stock.
I sideboarded by cutting 4 fatal pushes, 2 kolaghan's command and 1 street wraith. I brought in 2 Liliana, 2 Temur Battle-Rage, 2 collective brutality, 1 stubborn denial.
I think what you board in and board out is good. I would bring in 1 EE as some of them playing chalice and our discard are very good against it unless they have topdeck it. I would play surgical extraction when discard a titan and extract them are enough to win the game.
Hi guys, just wanted to hear your opinion about Hollow One in grixis shell. If this make a success, he would be another early threat with replace Thought Scour to Faithless Looting. Hmmm, maybe Izzet charm has its place as well? Just a curiosity from mine
Emma Handy has share some of break down of some cards and reason behind for the cards to be used MB and SB. She also pointed out some ratio that nowadays SB look like. Seems like a good source to be reference and put our mind together
This deck is just hard. Thoughtseize is a difficult card to play, so is serum visions, so is fetching. Are we on the plan of attack with delve creatures or death's shadow?
Most matchups are unique and take deliberate practice to understand; I suggest understanding Affinity, the Mirror, Eldrazi Tron, Burn, and any other decks you are running into over online first. Then learn more matchups.
Start with burn as you know both sides of the matchup.
Who's the beatdown: Death Shadow is my vote!
What are some of our opponent's best cards against us: Eidolon of the Great Revel, Rift Bolt (it allows them to delay damage a turn so they can play many spells in one turn)
What's the opponent thinking: Since DS isn't a fast deck I have time to build up a critical mass of burn spells that I can play at the end of their turn, untap and do a bunch more. Let the DS player damage themselves and don't help them play get to under thirteen to play a shadow.
What's the sideboard plan: Worse cards in the matchup: Street Wraith, Kolaghan's Command, Terminate, Thoughtseize (that's 12 cards depending on the list)
What's the best cards in the sideboard: Stubborn Denial, Collective Brutality, Temur Battle Rage (3 - 6 cards depending on the list)
My sideboard plan right now (-4 Wraiths, -1 Kommand, +2 Stubborn Denial, +2 Collective Brutality, +1 Temur Battle Rage). I leave in Thoughtseize because Eidolon is very scary and I need to remove it from their hand)
What's the best cards in their sideboard: Path, RIP/other GY Hate, Deflecting Palm, Grim Lavamancer
What's their worse cards in the matchup: Searing Blaze, Skullcrack,
So if that's how this one matchup sort of works (my opinion of course). We need a hand that is both proactive (delve creatures are great here) and disruptive. We can't keep a hand of just cantrips and hope to figure it out. Now we have a good question when we look at our opening hand - do we have a threat and either discard or countermagic. From there you are giving yourself the best chance of winning the game. If you don't, that's okay. Why did we lose? Could we have won with the information we had? Could we have won if we had hidden information? Could we have inferred the hidden information?
Finally, and sorry to go on such a long thread, learn general rules. This deck does have a lot of "it depends" answers but crossing off some decision points automatically is quite helpful to learn when you shouldn't do them. Let me explain. When you have a choice in fetchlands turn one, it's better to leave Polluted Delta as the last card to fetch with. Why, because it's the only fetch that can get both basic island and swamp. Obvious I know, but now when we look at turn one we know we should play Bloodstained Mire or Scalding Tarn before a Polluted Delta.
Other basic rules to live by: Fetch before Serum Visions if you are going to need to fetch. It hurts when you shouldn't have but more often than not you should. Should you fetch + shock before serum visions. I mostly do unless I have a good reason not to.
The last section might not have been too clear but try to find out what decision points are coming up over and over and try to figure out what the most common decision is and when you should not make that decision.
Any more comments on the Burn matchup from anyone else would be helpful for me if there's more insight.
I can probably do another one of these tomorrow if it was helpful let me know.
Hi guys, just have a question. Against eldrazi such as bant eldrazi and eldrazi tron. Will siding out street wraith be a smart decision? I know its been great playing a 56 deck would be good of fast digging an answer for their big guy. But we are put our life in risk as their can be very fast in their mana ramp. Whats the thought about this?
How do you guys usually play against burn? It's one of this decks's really hard matchups.
Previous 3 post has mention the best way we could do. SB game I would goes for -4 Wraith, -2 Thoughtseize, +2 Collective Brutality, +2 Denial, +1 Kozilek's Return, +1 Kolaghan's Command.
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Agreed with your fellow community, not sure about the MB's Liliana of the Veil, however I felt Denial still important to be play. Although there are some matchups they are held in hand for long time (for instance against aggro creature based), but not necessary die in hand as affinity has galvanic blast, merfolk has vapour snag, eldrazi has their path etc. Probably Game 2 would be siding those denial out anyway against those creature based deck.
The ideal play is play a delve guy in turn 2 and go for the beat down, and turn on denial. Less reduce your life with street wraith.
However, ppl tend to bring down number of thoughtseize to 1 or 0 in Game 2, but always remember that Burns player's biggest threat still is an early Eidolon and only way to deal with it is rip their hand before they could play them.
Counterspell is all star, Inquisition and Collective Brutality is all star against them.
Game 2 cut 4 street wraith, 1-2 thoughtseize, bring in 2 collective brutality, 1-2 stubborn denial, 1-2 Temur battle rage if you have them
Saw this in channelfireball by Paulo Vitor. However, I am having disagreement on the final part on Kolaghan's Command and Snap. I would still remain 2 kcommand in main since it only the way to deal with resolved chalice. It also add favor for us against affinity etc. Snap could be slow but I think he is important especially in late game, and there is no way for me to cut his number in my deck. The LotV MD seems interesting for me and might try swap 2 denial to 2 LotV and walk a proactive way.
I actually take off temur battle rage from my 75 long time ago. Its excellent when your threat stick in battlefield. Been stuck in my hand before without having chance to cast it. Against tokens, I been using last hope instead and so far she is doing extremely good job. But I guess it personal choices after all.
I think what you board in and board out is good. I would bring in 1 EE as some of them playing chalice and our discard are very good against it unless they have topdeck it. I would play surgical extraction when discard a titan and extract them are enough to win the game.
Link: http://www.starcitygames.com/article/35572_Know-Your-Enemy-Beating-Deaths-Shadow.html
Appreciated that with a good write up
4 Death's Shadow
4 Snapcaster Mage
4 Street Wraith
2 Tasigur, the Golden Fang
2 Gurmag Angler
Spells (25)
4 Fatal Push
2 Inquisition of Kozilek
4 Serum Visions
2 Stubborn Denial
4 Thought Scour
4 Thoughtseize
1 Temur Battle Rage
2 Terminate
2 Kolaghan's Command
2 Blood Crypt
4 Bloodstained Mire
4 Scalding Tarn
1 Island
4 Polluted Delta
1 Steam Vents
1 Swamp
2 Watery Grave
2 Ceremonious Rejection
2 Nihil Spellbomb
2 Stubborn Denial
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Collective Brutality
1 Izzet Statiscaster
1 Anger of the Gods
1 Rakdos Charm
2 Liliana, the Last Hope
Previous 3 post has mention the best way we could do. SB game I would goes for -4 Wraith, -2 Thoughtseize, +2 Collective Brutality, +2 Denial, +1 Kozilek's Return, +1 Kolaghan's Command.