Sorry if this has already been discussed, but I was curious what people have thought about the new Sorin, Grim Nemesis? Has anyone tried out the new one at all?
Sorin IV seems slooooow to me.
It's cool hearing people's ideas and experiences as we try to dial this in. It seems possible to me that maybe Wizards is intentionally pushing BW in Standard/Eternal formats, with Vent, Sorins, Unmaking, Strangler, Displacer, etc. making recent appearances. Looking forward to seeing Eldritch Moon and possibly a new Lili (or other Innistrad-flavored Orzhov goodies) to try out.
I think part of it is that they are trying to make White better overall. Aside from SFM, there hasn't been a card that makes you want to run white over other colors (Lingering Souls and Path are about as close as you get and those are often splashed). They are definitely trying to encourage WBx type decks because it opens up Junk, Esper and Mardu. The later two of which are severely underrepresented overall.
Have been on the D&T side of the fence for a couple of weeks already. The variance on that deck kind of blows. I wonder why this deck does not play Lilianna.
Liliana is great but would mean losing a beat stick. Souls is a good discard to her, but nothing else really is, since Relic is a consumable that you often want after cracking the first one. In many matches 2x Relic on the field is back breaking; and lands are always at a premium, at least in my build. She would be good with Kalitas, though.
I haven't tried her and don't know right now how I would build around such a change, but I think it would push the deck away from its current position pretty strongly.
I've been testing out D&T over the last week or so and really like it. It does fine without Vial but Vial hands are really really powerful which is why the deck seems vial dependant. The thing with that deck is that it sacrifices the extra points this deck gets from being able to grind into the late game and instead has a better matchup against aggro and combo. I think we will be seeing lots of both this list and the Eldrazi and Taxes list going forward as they are both very strong (at least strong enough IMO to be Tier 2 - 1.5).
Man why can't I get your opponents. I am testing out the BW Eldrazi & Taxes list for the next few weeks since I have the parts and I've run into 5/7 Jund matches. Whenever I play BW Processors I get a ton of Scapeshift and such. Congrats on the 4-0! This deck does still have a lot of firepower and while I do firmly believe it will never be tier 1 without even more value drazi cards, I do think it will be a strong deck for a midrange/control meta.
this deck is still really legit. we have game vs all aggro decks especially in games 2/3, jund/abzan seems like really easy matchups and we get to outgrind other midrange decks. having maindeck graveyard hate is extremely beneficial in the current meta.
the only deck ive somewhat struggled against has been scapeshift. i was thinking warping wail in the side for that possibly?
That matchup is horrendous for us no matter what we do. You have to pray you can destroy their hand fast enough before they just combo off and kill you. They pack counter magic so typically they just counter your wail and win.
Tks bros! I'm considering change to 4 Strangler 3 Herder, probably will do it on Friday. Also exchanged 1 SB Timely for 1 Worship. Still not convinced on change DB to Dismember... as said, it's meta dependent.
And yes, even being a "cheap" deck, Eldrazi still solid!
Well, today I played a small tourn with only 3 rounds and 7 players. The field was 2 Burn, 1 Naya Burn, 1 Affinity, 1 UWR Control and 2 BW Processors (a friend of mine, orphan from UW Eldrazi, took my advices and moved on with BW). I went first playing against R1 Burn, R2 Naya Burn and R3 Burn, all 2-0. Expedition Map and Vault were the MVP's.
The R2 Naya Burn played against my friend's Processors on R1 and smashed him on 2-0. He was playing Whip of Erebos instead of Sorin, GftT instead of DB and no Expedition Maps, while playing Vault. Also running 3 O-Sowers and 1 Ulamog, with no Smashers. I think he lost to Affinity too and BYE'd.
Probably will play a little bigger (and more versatile) tourn on Friday, so I can give better experience on the list.
Congrats on the tourney. With that much burn in the meta it seems like the spikish answer would be to bring Soul Sisters and just rofl. I'd definitely tell your buddy to bounce down the curve. We can't reliably cast Oblivion Sower and Ulamog anymore.
Yo guys... been following this thread for a long time, so I decided to finally make my first collaboration and share my experience.
Played Processors for a short time between Summer Bloom's ban and before aggro Eldrazi break with Modern... anyways, after Eye's ban I'm tryharding again with this list for some weeks on my LGS and on Cockatrice, and I'm very satisfied with results... I'm beating almost all decks in format (used to beat Tron before Eyes ban, but I didn't play against none since I made this list... still confident).
- I'm running 25 lands for I don't wanna get screwed and I have so many utility lands that is hard to cut something to go 24. Anyway, rarely flood.
- I'll never play without Marsh Flats... dodges Moon, filters deck.
- Urborg solves the later Marshs that can't find any land and helps to play Kalitas.
- Kalitas is amazing. I had one flex spot on deck, and was having a hard time playing against Melira Company, even with 4 relics. So I exchanged the 3rd Smasher for him, and the guy can win games by himself. Also, helps exiling oponent's grave while giving chumpblockers. Maybe better than BS?
- I don't know why everybody chooses GftT, Dismember or Anguished over Doom Blade. There's no real black threat against this deck. GftT fails on Affinity, Dismember costs 4 life and AU has a restrictive cost + lifeloss. Doom Blade never disppointed me.
- And overall, the lifelink package (Sorin + Vault + Kalitas) is working very well. Many times I could won lost games by playing 1 of them.
I'll probably play two tournaments this week, any news I post here.
Sorry for my bad english!
I like the overall list. My main issue with him in this deck is that our best removal spell Exiles already so we can't get full use of him. I still do really like him and might try him out (he sits in that Batterskull slot really). One thing I'd like to note because it's a common misconception. Fetch lands do filter your deck but at such a remote level you need to have like 20 draws to feel it's effect. Dodging Blood Moon is a fine option but "filtering" isn't mathematically beneficial. Remember with Dismember that you can pay full cost when you have it as well and not pay the 4 life. There is a TON that Doom Blade doesn't hit (most notably Bob and Vault Skirge). Dismember gives you versatility and kills just about everything.
Anyway, just some thoughts. Welcome back to the BW Processors. It's back to it's amazing roots as a very solid midrange grind deck that doesn't cost an arm and a leg like GBx.
I liked Batterskull. It is harder to cast because it doesn't benefit from Temple. It is also very mana-hungry if you want to equip it to a Spirit then which gets Bolted in response, while Herder is a mana producer... if you can get targets into exile for it, which is not always reliable for me.
Overall I would say that it is a solid replacement. In the games last night where it resolved it was extremely powerful, and additional lifegain is always welcome in this BW build. It works amazingly well with Smasher and Spirit tokens. However it is the highest card in my mana curve, which is already high, and it is vulnerable to the very common Kolaghan's Command.
For now I intend to keep it for further testing.
The main thing is that people don't expect it either. I haven't had too many issues getting Blight Herder's process triggers and it actually synergizes extremely well with Batterskull since you can sacrifice all the Scions to bounce it back to hand if you are tapped out. It is weak to certain things like artifact hate but it's easy enough to clear the way of those things and if you get to untap with it, it practically never dies without at least a 2 for 1. I actually rarely equip it to a spirit or anything that can be bolted (unless my opponent taps out). Force them to answer the 4/4 on the ground if they can. If they've bricked you there as well, wait for the optimum point to equip so you don't get blown out.
How's that Batterskull working for you ? Better then the 4th Herder ?
Personally I am loving it. There are some matchups where a 4/4 lifelinker is just what you want or need. When you equip it to pretty much any of your creatures, you now have an extremely hard to kill (without an actual kill or exile effect) lifelinker with Vigilance this has been enough to push the game out of reach against numerous matchups. Also with Reality Smasher it effectively becomes "build your own boggle"
Well I was incredibly sick this weekend and was unable to make the SCG States.. oh well. A bit more tuning and such and I'll try and make the next big tourney (granted there was only 90 people there and that is 10 more than I've seen at my LGS on their busiest night.... all in all my buddy told me the meta was absolutely random including several mill players, a Battle of Wits player and other such random nonsense.)
Round 1 UW Control (1-2)[0-1]: I have mentioned the disparity in decklists of the control decks greatly changes our chances of a win. Well the disturbing trend continues at my LGS and there were more folks running the Walker heavy UW list with Elspeth and Gideon as their top end. Game 1 my opponent curved perfectly Gideon into Elspeth and I couldn't find anything but spot removal. Game 2 I won the back off 3 copies of Lingering Souls. He couldn't find a board sweeper and was forced to spend all of his spot removal on my tokens. Game 3 I managed to sneak in a TKS (he had Mana Leak and forgot that he could counter TKS because I was forced to use Cavern for colorless mana instead of uncounterable mana (I always call out the color I tap it for so it wasn't like I hid it from him). I yanked his Elsepeth and seemed to be in a great position. I knocked him down to 4 and he found another Elspeth. I couldn't find Lingering Souls, Anguished Unmaking or Reality Smasher to try and come back into the game.
Round 2 Jeskai Control (2-0)[1-1]: This round was over in about 15 min (there as 35 min left in the round after the match slip had been signed). Curving discard into Cavern of Souls into TKS into Herder/Smasher was just too much for him both games. His game 2 opening hand was so awful I don't know why he kept (Spell Snare, Logic Knot x2, AV, Snapcaster, Land x2).. I when I dropped TKS turn 3 with a Cavern I knew I essentially had the game on lock. I haven't regretted moving up to 2x Cavern of Souls yet. They are more frequently being drawn and in matchups without counter spells they still act as a generic colorless land.
Round 3 Little Kid Abzan (2-1)[2-1]: I've played this opponent a lot on many different decks. He is quite good at the interactive matchups and boy was this one of those. Game 1 he managed to kill me as I couldn't draw past his 3x Lingering Souls, Gavony and Liege. Game 2 was nearly a blowout as he Path'd my Smasher and tricked in Smiter. Luckily I was stocked with removal spells and Lingering Souls to stall. I eventually stuck a Batterskull, equipped it to a Blight Herder and rode it to victory (going from like 3 life to over 30 before he scooped). Game 3 was very similar. He came out of the gates swinging. He almost had me at one point because of Leige making everything huge but I topdecked a relic, play and crack, draw the path. I then Path his leige and cast Flaying Tendrils which all but cleared his board (left him with just a smiter and exiled a Voice). I then stabilized and eventually got Reality Smasher carrying a Batterskull to win.
Round 4 Jeskai Thopter Sword (1-0-1)[3-1]: So game 1 I won on the back of destroying his hand, dropping uncounterable bombs and keeping his GY in exile... oh and Batterskull which allowed me to kill a Gideon. I did see the Sword but it was pretty late and I totally forgot he was running it so I forgot to board in Stoney Silences. He miracled into Crucible into Sword into Foundry and was able to go off making dudes but fortunately as he got it we entered turns. I had a Sorin, SV in play and just crashed in with everything to trade my board for a ton of life. He couldn't kill me before the end of the game and thus I won the match.
Hero of the Night: Batterskull. Holy hell did this thing do a whole lot of work tonight. It's not always needed but there are some matchups where it can just take over. It's a large enough body and god forbid you equip it to any of your creatures it just starts to get crazy. I'll say Westvale Abbey gets an honorable mention in here because there were a few games tonight where I got flooded and was able to abuse the Token gen on it to keep board state and start applying pressure.
I am still stuck if I want to play this or my Mardu Walker Control deck at states tomorrow but all in all, I do love this deck. It has a ton of versatility and grind.
Yeah I dropped it once against the Werewolves and equipped it to Reality Smasher under a Blood Moon. It's slot is where I'd stick Archangel Avacyn.. So far I haven't faced burn but feel like I'd like that extra 4/4 lifelink option that doesn't require colored mana to cast.
Round 1 Merfolk (1-2)[0-1]:
Game 1 I was able to spot remove and keep his board in check. Eventually used vault of the archangel to push myself way ahead in life to seal up the victory. Game 2 I had to mull to 4 (mulls were: no lands, 5 lands, 1 land all 5 drops, 2 lander) I drew no more lands and he spreading seas my only colored source to take out the Flaying Tendril out. Game 3 was really close but I couldn't find a GQ for the land he Spreading Seas and he ended up landing back to back Kira's. The first one forced me to eat double dismember to kill and then I only saw a single path for the second.
Round 2 Gruul Werewolves (2-1)[1-1]:
Oddly enough I am part of the brewing for this deck over in the Vial//CoCo Werewolves section so I knew the list and how to hit it. I nearly died game 1 as he found all 4 bolts and he got me pretty low game 3 by finding 3. Game 2 was lost due to me missing a land drop on turn 4 and then him resolving a Blood Moon. I had to GQ my own land and as I was searching for lands to top deck. He spammed out 3 lords. All in all though the list just isn't fast enough and suspect to disruption (admittedly he didn't own vials which I think are better than CoCo in the list. This may have been his undoing).
Round 3 Ad Nauseum (2-1 [2-1]:
Game 1 Turn 1 I Inquisitioned him and saw Ad Nauseum and Phyrexian Unlife x2. He had already suspended a Lotus Bloom as well. I couldn't find a processor to kill it in time (had a blight herder but couldn't get a second card into exile). Game 2 I kept a ridiculous hand you can only keep against Ad Nauseum. 6 lands (including Abbey and a Shambling Vent) and Leyline of Sanctity. I begin with Leyline in play, he suspends 2 lotus blooms. I top deck Stoney silence and then proceed to draw straight gas from there. He was able to stall with a Phyrexian Unlife but I made a nifty play of making a 2/2 Vampire with Sorin the turn I knocked him into -life and made an Abbey token at EOT. He hardcasted a spirit guide to block one of the 2 TKS's I had on board but with everything else, an uptick of Sorin was exactly 10 infect for lethal. Game 3 was a bit awkward as he started with Leyline killing my IoK and making my 2x TKS's just beaters. I had a turn 3 Reality smasher which he countered with Pact of Negation (but was forced to use Angel's Grace not to lose). I then started beating down with TKS's and he couldn't find the combo (he had like 2 draws to find it before I had lethal attacking him).
Round 4 Affinity (2-0)[3-1]:
Game 1 I got the nonsense hand and became the beat down. On the play Turn 2 TKS and Turn 3 Reality Smasher. He didn't have an explosive hand and couldn't recover. Game 2 He got a turn 2 Thoughtseize off taking my Flaying Tendrils (which would have lead to a blowout). I top deck Stoney Silence and jam it. He sacs his useless artifacts to ravager in response and then swings in to hit me down to 4. I then Path his Ravager and take one more shot down to 2. I then started jamming Lingering Souls and was able to win the top deck war as he managed to push 1 more damage through but couldn't find Galvanic Blast. He did find back to back Vault Skirges. Full cost Dismember from 1 life (thank god it wasn't Anguished Unmaking), let me kill the first but he was now essentially representing lethal with the second (I had Wasteland Strangler and TKS and he was at 5 and he could chump one of them with Ornithopter and survive). I play the Reality Smasher I had slow rolled the entire game in order to hold up full Dismember mana.
Summary: Man Dismember was just SO good tonight. It's versatility in cost requirements and being able to hit manlands felt really necessary on the night. Also being able to pay 0 life when needed mattered a lot at the end. I think Anguished is a good sideboard card (I replaced Disenchant with it) but I am less sold on it in the MB. Perhaps it's just my meta but there is a ton of man lands. Almost one type in every deck. There is lots of control running around my meta but somehow I seem to keep dodging them which is sad but oh well.
I'm still considering an Archangel Avacyn as a 1x in the list somewhere as Wrath protection and a wincon that others don't expect (not to mention we can flip her with Scion tokens and all our actual dudes (TKS, Smasher etc) all survive.
I did live the dream last week and processed 2x AV on turn 4 with a Blight Herder against Grixis Thing Control.
If I'm being really honest, this is one of the main reasons I'm on this deck. There are few things more satisfying than processing an AV.
The one I'm still waiting on is the process AV and kill Jace, VP. That's the day I know I win at magic. I'm actually playing this deck because I loved the way it felt before the Aggrodrazi ruined it's feel. I also think it's actually really well placed if we can work out the tweaks. It beats up other midrange and control decks while having a good matchup against Affinity and Infect. My meta has been chocked full of all of those so I have felt great lately. If Bring to Light Scapeshift really springs up in popularity... maybe I'll feel a lot worse. Still this deck is really strong and grindy and I love it.