Academy Ruins seems like it would be a good addition for sure, I will have to look into that. It could be especially useful with the main deck artifact hate that is running around right now (Kolaghan's Command). With that, you could also look into the Academy Ruins/Mindslaver combo potentially.
I'm curious about how you are using Altar of the Brood. What do you use as the engine to fuel that, and is it reliable enough to close out the game on it's own? In my experience Sphinx's Tutelage combined with all the card draw can really close out games when you are milling 6-10 cards for each of your draw steps, but it does require that extra mana investment up front. I can see how a turn 1 mill threat could be pretty nice.
I guess Altar of the Brood could also have some synergy with Rites of Flourishing and fetches. Are there any cards that you use to use to help produce more permanents? Something like a Secure the Wastes for a big X could get things going, especially if you have more than 1 Altar of the Brood out. If could also serve as a type of fog by providing a lot of chump blockers.
If you have a list with Altar, I'd love to see it!
That is a great point, I had not considered that Swan Song can counter Eidolon of the Great Revel. So my burn matchup may not be too terrible considering that.
Also, not running into tron won't be a viable strategy for me. All the places I play have at least one weekly tron player. I think I might need to run Slaughter Games and Jester's Cap as a way to strip the threats from their deck. These can also provide some resilience against any other troublesome decks I run into.
I do like Gideon Jura, and I am considering War's Toll instead/as well. This forces them to swing with everyone if they want to attack, which gets Batwing Brume online. It also has an added effect of shutting out the control decks from being able to out counter me effectively (if I can resolve it). I can cast a fog on their upkeep, and if they want to counter it, they have to tap out.
Any thoughts on these?
Also, I think I will play this version this FNM probably (since my twin deck is done for), so I should hopefully have some results to post soon.
Hey guys, I have a new take on the turbo fog idea that I want to get some advice on. I have been playing Bant Fog for a bit. I think I posted a list a while ago. It's win con was Sphinx's Tutelage. I enjoyed it, but I have decided to try a new direction. I started of just substituting some lands with Forbidden Orchard since I figured the creatures wouldn't be getting any damage in anyways, and this allowed me to use Batwing Brume to get some damage in. It was fun, but people quickly figured out to quit attacking with the spirits once they saw the Brume. I did throw a singleton Rakdos Charm in the SB and it turned out to be way better than Brume in most cases. So it inspired me to try something new. I pulled green completely out of the deck (the Rites of Flourishing were great, but I found them often helping my control/tron opponents a bit more than I wanted).
Here's the idea. Get some Forbidden Orchard out and tap them every time possible to give your opponents some spirits. Use Mercy Killing to turn their Goyf/Tasigur/Swiftspear/Ulamog etc into a bunch of chumps. Counter some spells with Swan Song, then once they have enough dudes, cast Rakdos Charm to turn their army against them. Additionally Batwing Brume can be combined with the Gideon Jura +2 to force them to attack into you with everyone. Riot Control can do some good work gaining life with all the creatures they will have (with the added bonus of stopping storm and the occasional lethal burn spell). Congregate can help out with the burn matchup, which is pretty tough if they land an Eidolon of the Great Revel.
This is just a first draft of what I am thinking. I put the 2 Tutelage in the sideboard to give me a second win condition in case I need to kill them without damage. Definitely still a work in progress. I especially need to keep thinking of how my Burn and Tron matches go (since that I what I was having the most trouble with before).
Advice is greatly appreciated. I have not even played this version of the deck yet. Hopefully I can test this out and report back with some results soon.
So, I took the Bant fog deck I posted to my local FNM. (nearly the same as what I posted -1 Celestial Colonnade and +1 Canopy Vista). It was a blast. I went 2-0-2.
Both of my draws were after a game 1 win then my opponent winning game 2. One the players won on turn 5 after going to time, the other I got hit with a Thalia, then a surprise Spellstutter Sprite that got me.
Here are my matchups:
Round 1: Mono-Red Burn 2-0 Win
This can be a troublesome matchup for me, but luckily, my opponent never landed an Eidolon of the Great Revel either game. Being Mono-red really helped me to get the win game 1 with Sphinx's Tutelage.
Game 2, I boarded in 4 Timely Reinforcements and 4 Leyline of Sanctity and was able to win pretty easily.
Round 2: Abzan 1-1 Draw
Game 1 was incredibly long. I got caught by a Maelstrom Pulse with 2 Sphinx's Tutelage out, but I got my Elixir of Immortality to shuffle them back in. I was finally able to land another Tutelage and cast a very big Sphinx's Revelation for the win. Game 1 took almost 40 minutes.
Game 2, I obliged my opponent by playing as quickly as possible, and I got killed by a Manland on turn 5 of time in round, after casting 3 Supreme Verdict to clear the board.
I had boarded in 2 Supreme Verdict, 4 Leyline of Sanctity, and (I think) 2 Rest in Peace .
Round 3: Bant Collected Chord 1-1-1 Draw
Game 1 I won pretty straight up, my opponent tried to combo off with Knight of the Reliquary and Retreat to Coralhelm and thinned his deck way out so my Tutelage hit for a lot.
Game 2 I was doing pretty well, and I tapped more than I needed to (I left up 2 mana for 2 fog effects), my Opponent had a huge board presense and used Chord of Calling to get Thalia, Guardian, Thraben on my turn, then attacked and countered my fog with a Spellstutter Sprite. Kudos to him, it was a great play that I was not expecting. Those collected decks full of 1-ofs are hard to predict.
Game 3 Basically started, then went to turns so we drew.
I had boarded in 2 Rest in Peace, 2 Detention Sphere, and 4 Leyline of Sanctity (to avoid the mill from a Hedron Crab with the Kight/Retreat combo, and to avoid Melira combos).
Round 4: ??? 2-0 Win
I got paired up against a BW mostly Standard Allies deck. Not sure exactly what it was, but it wasn't really tuned to be competitive. Though, I almost lost game 1 to his Retreat to Hagra which was draining me for 2-3 every turn with my Rites of Flourishings out. I boarded in my 2 Detention Sphere and 4 Timely Reinforcements for the extra life gain. I won this one pretty easily.
Overall, it was a great night. Had some really close fun games, with a lot to keep track of. Everyone loved seeing Turbo Fog, and I'm looking forward to playing it more (and hoping I keep avoiding the burn decks!).
I have recently put together a Bant Fog deck, and I have been playtesting it a lot, and it feels pretty good. I'm taking it out to my next FNM to see how it goes.
Burn is a problem for this deck, especially Eidolon of the Great Revel. I think I want to include 4 Runed Halo somewhere in the 75 to help deal with it. The life gain from Timely Reinforcements and Riot Control can really help out in those matches. Riot Control has the added advantage of preventing damage from Storm, Scapeshift, and Melira.
Sphinx's Revelation is there to power out wins with Tutelage, and the lifegain can play an important role in some matchups.
The single Elixir of Immortality is there to prevent me from milling myself, and the incidental lifegain can be good. It also puts my fogs back in the deck when I have an especially long and grindy match.
I really like going green for Rites of Flourishing, since it lets me drop it on turn 3, then play another land to keep up for a Fog effect. I have also considered running the new Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger as a one-of for an alternate win condition, since hitting 10 mana is not uncommon with Rites out.
I know there is probably some room for improvement here and suggestions are appreciated.
I'm curious about how you are using Altar of the Brood. What do you use as the engine to fuel that, and is it reliable enough to close out the game on it's own? In my experience Sphinx's Tutelage combined with all the card draw can really close out games when you are milling 6-10 cards for each of your draw steps, but it does require that extra mana investment up front. I can see how a turn 1 mill threat could be pretty nice.
I guess Altar of the Brood could also have some synergy with Rites of Flourishing and fetches. Are there any cards that you use to use to help produce more permanents? Something like a Secure the Wastes for a big X could get things going, especially if you have more than 1 Altar of the Brood out. If could also serve as a type of fog by providing a lot of chump blockers.
If you have a list with Altar, I'd love to see it!
Also, not running into tron won't be a viable strategy for me. All the places I play have at least one weekly tron player. I think I might need to run Slaughter Games and Jester's Cap as a way to strip the threats from their deck. These can also provide some resilience against any other troublesome decks I run into.
I do like Gideon Jura, and I am considering War's Toll instead/as well. This forces them to swing with everyone if they want to attack, which gets Batwing Brume online. It also has an added effect of shutting out the control decks from being able to out counter me effectively (if I can resolve it). I can cast a fog on their upkeep, and if they want to counter it, they have to tap out.
Any thoughts on these?
Also, I think I will play this version this FNM probably (since my twin deck is done for), so I should hopefully have some results to post soon.
Here's the idea. Get some Forbidden Orchard out and tap them every time possible to give your opponents some spirits. Use Mercy Killing to turn their Goyf/Tasigur/Swiftspear/Ulamog etc into a bunch of chumps. Counter some spells with Swan Song, then once they have enough dudes, cast Rakdos Charm to turn their army against them. Additionally Batwing Brume can be combined with the Gideon Jura +2 to force them to attack into you with everyone. Riot Control can do some good work gaining life with all the creatures they will have (with the added bonus of stopping storm and the occasional lethal burn spell). Congregate can help out with the burn matchup, which is pretty tough if they land an Eidolon of the Great Revel.
2x Darkness
3x Ethereal Haze
3x Holy Day
2x Pollen Lullaby
4x Riot Control
2x Congregate
3x Mercy Killing
3x Swan Song
3x Rakdos Charm
1x Blood Crypt
4x Flooded Strand
4x Forbidden Orchard
2x Hallowed Fountain
2x Island
2x Mikokoro, Center of the Sea
2x Plains
4x Polluted Delta
1x Swamp
1x Watery Grave
4x Howling Mine
1x Gideon Jura
1x Jester's Cap
4x Leyline of Sanctity
2x Nevermore
2x Pithing Needle
2x Rest in Peace
2x Runed Halo
2x Sphinx's Tutelage
This is just a first draft of what I am thinking. I put the 2 Tutelage in the sideboard to give me a second win condition in case I need to kill them without damage. Definitely still a work in progress. I especially need to keep thinking of how my Burn and Tron matches go (since that I what I was having the most trouble with before).
Advice is greatly appreciated. I have not even played this version of the deck yet. Hopefully I can test this out and report back with some results soon.
Both of my draws were after a game 1 win then my opponent winning game 2. One the players won on turn 5 after going to time, the other I got hit with a Thalia, then a surprise Spellstutter Sprite that got me.
Here are my matchups:
Round 1: Mono-Red Burn 2-0 Win
This can be a troublesome matchup for me, but luckily, my opponent never landed an Eidolon of the Great Revel either game. Being Mono-red really helped me to get the win game 1 with Sphinx's Tutelage.
Game 2, I boarded in 4 Timely Reinforcements and 4 Leyline of Sanctity and was able to win pretty easily.
Round 2: Abzan 1-1 Draw
Game 1 was incredibly long. I got caught by a Maelstrom Pulse with 2 Sphinx's Tutelage out, but I got my Elixir of Immortality to shuffle them back in. I was finally able to land another Tutelage and cast a very big Sphinx's Revelation for the win. Game 1 took almost 40 minutes.
Game 2, I obliged my opponent by playing as quickly as possible, and I got killed by a Manland on turn 5 of time in round, after casting 3 Supreme Verdict to clear the board.
I had boarded in 2 Supreme Verdict, 4 Leyline of Sanctity, and (I think) 2 Rest in Peace .
Round 3: Bant Collected Chord 1-1-1 Draw
Game 1 I won pretty straight up, my opponent tried to combo off with Knight of the Reliquary and Retreat to Coralhelm and thinned his deck way out so my Tutelage hit for a lot.
Game 2 I was doing pretty well, and I tapped more than I needed to (I left up 2 mana for 2 fog effects), my Opponent had a huge board presense and used Chord of Calling to get Thalia, Guardian, Thraben on my turn, then attacked and countered my fog with a Spellstutter Sprite. Kudos to him, it was a great play that I was not expecting. Those collected decks full of 1-ofs are hard to predict.
Game 3 Basically started, then went to turns so we drew.
I had boarded in 2 Rest in Peace, 2 Detention Sphere, and 4 Leyline of Sanctity (to avoid the mill from a Hedron Crab with the Kight/Retreat combo, and to avoid Melira combos).
Round 4: ??? 2-0 Win
I got paired up against a BW mostly Standard Allies deck. Not sure exactly what it was, but it wasn't really tuned to be competitive. Though, I almost lost game 1 to his Retreat to Hagra which was draining me for 2-3 every turn with my Rites of Flourishings out. I boarded in my 2 Detention Sphere and 4 Timely Reinforcements for the extra life gain. I won this one pretty easily.
Overall, it was a great night. Had some really close fun games, with a lot to keep track of. Everyone loved seeing Turbo Fog, and I'm looking forward to playing it more (and hoping I keep avoiding the burn decks!).
Sphinx's Tutelage is my main win condition, and I have the backup of Celestial Colonnade beatdown.
Main:
4x Flooded Strand
1x Forest
2x Celestial Colonnade
4x Hallowed Fountain
3x Island
2x Misty Rainforest
2x Plains
1x Sunpetal Grove
1x Temple Garden
2x Mikokoro, Center of the Sea
1x Cryptic Command
4x Ethereal Haze
4x Fog
4x Holy Day
2x Pollen Lullaby
2x Sphinx's Revelation
2x Supreme Verdict
3x Riot Control
1x Elixir of Immortality
4x Rites of Flourishing
4x Sphinx's Tutelage
Side:
4x Leyline of Sanctity
2x Rest in Peace
2x Supreme Verdict
1x Surgical Extraction
4x Timely Reinforcements
Burn is a problem for this deck, especially Eidolon of the Great Revel. I think I want to include 4 Runed Halo somewhere in the 75 to help deal with it. The life gain from Timely Reinforcements and Riot Control can really help out in those matches. Riot Control has the added advantage of preventing damage from Storm, Scapeshift, and Melira.
Sphinx's Revelation is there to power out wins with Tutelage, and the lifegain can play an important role in some matchups.
The single Elixir of Immortality is there to prevent me from milling myself, and the incidental lifegain can be good. It also puts my fogs back in the deck when I have an especially long and grindy match.
I really like going green for Rites of Flourishing, since it lets me drop it on turn 3, then play another land to keep up for a Fog effect. I have also considered running the new Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger as a one-of for an alternate win condition, since hitting 10 mana is not uncommon with Rites out.
I know there is probably some room for improvement here and suggestions are appreciated.