White Plume Adventurer
Blade Splicer
Skyclave Apparition
Elite Spellbinder
Flickerwisp
Loran of the Third Path
Thalia, Heretic Cathar
Adeline, Resplendent Cathar
The two definitives for me is White Plume Adventurer #1 with Thalia, Heretic Cathar being at the bottom. After that you can really go either way with everything in between.
Here's how I'd rank everything else in the middle. Not definitive, any different day I'd probably rank them slightly different.
- Adeline, Resplendent Cathar
- Skyclave Apparition
- Elite Spellbinder
- Blade Splicer
- Flickerwisp
- Loran of the Third Path
Increased fetchland density and the way power is distributed in multi-colored good stuff cards (top heavy) is what makes triomes even more valuable in a small cube than in larger cubes. ETBT is a bigger deal at small sizes, but the fetchland synergy more than offsets that.
I'd argue that the increased pressure of a top heavy 360 cube makes the triomes ETBing tapped much more of a liability. 10 ETB tapped lands is A LOT for a 360, IMO, even with increased fetch density. I've personally found the mana fixing of triomes to be excessive at 540, nevermind a 360 cube where all 10 are guaranteed to be in a draft pool with 8 players.
I used to be very high on canopy lands, but I underestimated the downside cost of the pain they cause... Especially in multiples (which matters a tiny bit more at smaller cube sizes). The've dropped to my #5 slot from #4.
It's definitely true that the cost of pain lands has increased since inflation of damage has devalued life points. But again, the increase of pressure also increases the cost of ETBing tapped also.
I wouldn't run crucible effects outside of wrenn and six @ 360 I think?
Assuming all other things being equal, the presence of Wrenn and Six and / or Primeval Titan would probably be the biggest tie breaker(s) more than any domain card / land types matter card / other Crucible effects / etc.
I've always said that your choice of land cycles won't make too much of a difference in the grand scheme of things since a lot of them are very interchangeable with other cycles. That being said, here's some personal anecdotes I've observed over time:
- WOTC finishing the Horizon Canopy cycle has been on the top of my overall MTG wishlist (not just cube) since when Future Sight came out in 2007 (nearly 17 years ago at the time of writing this). I really can't say that I was waiting anxiously for WOTC to complete the triome cycle.
- The only Horizon Canopy to have been standard legal is Horizon Canopy itself, everything else so far has only been printed in a direct to Modern set. Meanwhile, WOTC has been okay with all 10 triomes having been legal in Standard (shocklands too as long as fetches aren't legal). I feel like WOTC would've completed the Horizon Canopy cycle by now if they were more comfortable with them in Standard. I assume the real reason the cycle hasn't been finished yet is because they have to compete with fetchland reprints, and there isn't a single non-reserved list land cycle that can compete with those since fetchlands will sell the most packs by far.
Triomes would be my 4th and final cycle of land for a 360 vintage cube and > canopy lands.
I also don't think I'd support the cards that leveraged canopy lands? I wouldn't run crucible effects outside of wrenn and six @ 360 I think?
Canopy lands are great on their own, the presence of Crucible effects don't move the needle at all on their viability. And unlike triomes, they ETB untapped and you're not restricted to choosing between playing it as a land or cashing it in for a card.
If I were forced into a situation where I can only run 1 uniform land cycle outside of fetch / dual / shock, I would snap pick a completed Horizon Canopy cycle.
I prefer canopy lands + mix of various other things over triomes unless you're going in on domain. I like the Horizon Canopy cycle of lands more than any other cycle besides actual fetch / dual / shock.
They all do really different things, so it's a matter of what you want to prioritize.
- Trinket Mage if you want to string together some specific combos like Time Vault or just ramp extra hard to find your Sol Ring / Black Lotus / etc.
- Chrome Host Seedshark if you want a defensive spells matters creature.
- Aether Channeler if you want a catch all blue midrange creature. It's good for blink / recursion and is one of the better blue creatures at fighting both initiative and reanimator.
- Tishana's Tidebender if you really want to shut down planeswalkers and such I guess. I personally don't see the appeal of Tishana's Tidebender in cube and think it's overrated based on its impact on constructed. Tishana's Tidebinder is the card I like the least of this bunch, and by a wide margin.
Can't go wrong with either of them. Personally I like Soul Partition more since it has a cleaner mana cost and can be used on your own stuff if in response to removal or you just really want another ETB trigger. It's important to note that the 2 mana tax doesn't apply if you use it on your own stuff.
Fwiw when I say “blue deck” I mean a deck where blue is a primary or significant secondary color.
There are plenty of blue shells that are pretty creature heavy where Seedshark isn't idea: UR Kiki-Twin / UW blink / UB Recurring Nightmare / UG Survival / many UX tempo shells / a good amount of artifacts matters decks are getting creature heavy / etc.
I see oath of druids as a near pointless comparison. Oath decks in cubes I draft come together like 1/100 decks… and even if they came together more (as is clearly the case in some cubes here). Shark typhoon is not a good card in them, it’s a low priority playable.
YMMV, but Oath of Druids comes together in my cube all the time since I heavily support cheaty face (and Oath of Druids is probably the deck I force the most). Shark Typhoon is often a card that will make the deck since it's a cantrip that can buy time or steal initiative / monarch in a pinch.
I think chrome host is better than all the other spells matters cards.
The highest average case performance and only less upside than mentor.
This I generally agree with, the only spells matters card I think that is better than Seedshark is Third Path Iconoclast. Mentor has a high ceiling, but its average case scenario in a singleton environment is so bad that I ended up cutting it from my cube. Shark is pretty much everything I wanted mentor to be in terms of defensive prowess and generating value through a sweeper.
Just to be clear with everyone, I think Chrome Host Seedshark is a great card. But gun to head, I'd cube Shark Typhoon first. I value Shark Typhoon's versatility, guaranteed value, role of being a scaleable big mana payoff that's strong at any point in the game, and ability to be reactionary more than Seedshark being an engine for spells matters. I'd give the nod to Seedshark over Mulldrifter even though Mulldrifter is also more versatile and shares a lot of Shark Typhoon's qualities, but IMO Shark Typhoon is on another level compared to both of them.
FWIW , I’m near 100% confident that chrome host seedshark is a higher pick than shark typhoon in the significant majority of blue decks.
I disagree with Chrome Host Seedshark being a higher pick than Shark Typhoon in most decks for several reasons:
- Shark Typhoon can go into any deck that Chrome Host Seedshark can go into / any blue deck in general. Chrome Host Seedshark doesn't necessarily fit into every blue deck, and is incompatible with Oath of Druids.
- Shark Typhoon's cycling can be used at any time, giving blue decks more options in terms of leaving counters up against key threats, having a combat trick that can lead to a 3 for 1, or surprising your opponent at EOT to steal monarch / initaitive.
- If I can afford a blue splash in my deck, Shark Typhoon is a card I'll shoehorn in. I probably wouldn't splash for Chrome Host Seeshark, because if blue is a tertiary color that I"m splashing for, that probably means it's not a very spell centric deck.
Wow, I like chrome host seedshark the most of the 3 by a lot.
Seedshark is good, but the other two are more consistent and will always be a 2 for 1 for 2U. Shark Typhoon being a combat trick and strong mana sink / solo finisher that's also uncounterable easily puts it over the top of the other two for me. Shark Typhoon is still one of the better goodstuff blue win conditions, although Occult Epiphany has been eating a lot of its lunch. I consider Occult Epiphany to the best goodstuff blue spell not named Ancestral Recall / Time Walk.
Valki God of Lies v Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast v Kolaghan's Command, pick one.
Daretti >= Kolaghan's Command >>> Valki
You can argue that Daretti and Kolaghan's Command are pretty much equal as generic good stuff cards, but Daretti has the edge in also being an extremely valuable roleplayer for artifacts matters.
Other cards in section are Fire Covenant and Chaos Defiler (Covenant is being tested, may not stay).
Personally I have Chaos Defiler / Daretti / Kolaghan's Command as my top 3 Rakdos cards of choice, and it isn't particularly close. While not 1 to 1 comparisons, there are a good amount of mono red / black cards that does a lot of what Fire Covenant wants to do as a one-sided sweeper.
- Delayed Blast Fireball (the best of the bunch by far if you're willing to play foretell cards)
When comparing vastly different cards, you should be asking yourself what do you want / need more to achieve your design goals. The Goose Mother and Hydroid Krasis are very similar to each other, but Sail into the West is a completely different card. If you want more draw 7 / Fastbond support, then Sail into the West will help you more than the other two. If you want a more generic threat, I'd pick The Goose Mother over Hydroid Krasis.
- Deathrite Shaman vs Assassin's Trophy vs Alpha Deathclaw vs Mosswood Dreadknight vs Witherbloom Command
Same as above, Alpha Deathclaw is vastly different from every other card you listed: you can't compare a super fatty to cheap utility roleplayers. If you need an extra super fatty for Natural Order / Reanimator / etc, then Alpha Deathclaw is the only card that can fill that role. Deathrite Shaman can be very dependent on the size of the cube (more density of fetches, the better). If I had to pick 2 without any context I'd probably go for Alpha Deathclaw and Assassin's Trophy. Alpha Deathclaw is just as effective of a 6 drop as Inferno Titan and Assassin's Trophy has the broadest use of any other cards listed .
Could argue on a card being up / down a slot, but they're roughly where they should be. As effective as Goblin Rabblemaster still is, I do believe that it's at best the fifth best Rabblemaster right now. Laelia / Bombardiers / Gut / Squee all have a certain x-factor to them that the other other Rabblemasters lack, IMO.
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StaffThe two definitives for me is White Plume Adventurer #1 with Thalia, Heretic Cathar being at the bottom. After that you can really go either way with everything in between.
Here's how I'd rank everything else in the middle. Not definitive, any different day I'd probably rank them slightly different.
- Adeline, Resplendent Cathar
- Skyclave Apparition
- Elite Spellbinder
- Blade Splicer
- Flickerwisp
- Loran of the Third Path
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StaffI'd argue that the increased pressure of a top heavy 360 cube makes the triomes ETBing tapped much more of a liability. 10 ETB tapped lands is A LOT for a 360, IMO, even with increased fetch density. I've personally found the mana fixing of triomes to be excessive at 540, nevermind a 360 cube where all 10 are guaranteed to be in a draft pool with 8 players.
It's definitely true that the cost of pain lands has increased since inflation of damage has devalued life points. But again, the increase of pressure also increases the cost of ETBing tapped also.
Assuming all other things being equal, the presence of Wrenn and Six and / or Primeval Titan would probably be the biggest tie breaker(s) more than any domain card / land types matter card / other Crucible effects / etc.
I've always said that your choice of land cycles won't make too much of a difference in the grand scheme of things since a lot of them are very interchangeable with other cycles. That being said, here's some personal anecdotes I've observed over time:
- WOTC finishing the Horizon Canopy cycle has been on the top of my overall MTG wishlist (not just cube) since when Future Sight came out in 2007 (nearly 17 years ago at the time of writing this). I really can't say that I was waiting anxiously for WOTC to complete the triome cycle.
- The only Horizon Canopy to have been standard legal is Horizon Canopy itself, everything else so far has only been printed in a direct to Modern set. Meanwhile, WOTC has been okay with all 10 triomes having been legal in Standard (shocklands too as long as fetches aren't legal). I feel like WOTC would've completed the Horizon Canopy cycle by now if they were more comfortable with them in Standard. I assume the real reason the cycle hasn't been finished yet is because they have to compete with fetchland reprints, and there isn't a single non-reserved list land cycle that can compete with those since fetchlands will sell the most packs by far.
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StaffCanopy lands are great on their own, the presence of Crucible effects don't move the needle at all on their viability. And unlike triomes, they ETB untapped and you're not restricted to choosing between playing it as a land or cashing it in for a card.
If I were forced into a situation where I can only run 1 uniform land cycle outside of fetch / dual / shock, I would snap pick a completed Horizon Canopy cycle.
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StaffI prefer canopy lands + mix of various other things over triomes unless you're going in on domain. I like the Horizon Canopy cycle of lands more than any other cycle besides actual fetch / dual / shock.
Also, I prefer Restless Anchorage over Celestial Colonnade in a cube that has a heavy presence of monarch / initiative.
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StaffThey all do really different things, so it's a matter of what you want to prioritize.
- Trinket Mage if you want to string together some specific combos like Time Vault or just ramp extra hard to find your Sol Ring / Black Lotus / etc.
- Chrome Host Seedshark if you want a defensive spells matters creature.
- Aether Channeler if you want a catch all blue midrange creature. It's good for blink / recursion and is one of the better blue creatures at fighting both initiative and reanimator.
- Tishana's Tidebender if you really want to shut down planeswalkers and such I guess. I personally don't see the appeal of Tishana's Tidebender in cube and think it's overrated based on its impact on constructed. Tishana's Tidebinder is the card I like the least of this bunch, and by a wide margin.
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StaffGet Lost > Fateful Absence since it hits more things and your opponent can't crack the maps on your turn and require a creature.
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StaffCan't go wrong with either of them. Personally I like Soul Partition more since it has a cleaner mana cost and can be used on your own stuff if in response to removal or you just really want another ETB trigger. It's important to note that the 2 mana tax doesn't apply if you use it on your own stuff.
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StaffThere are plenty of blue shells that are pretty creature heavy where Seedshark isn't idea: UR Kiki-Twin / UW blink / UB Recurring Nightmare / UG Survival / many UX tempo shells / a good amount of artifacts matters decks are getting creature heavy / etc.
YMMV, but Oath of Druids comes together in my cube all the time since I heavily support cheaty face (and Oath of Druids is probably the deck I force the most). Shark Typhoon is often a card that will make the deck since it's a cantrip that can buy time or steal initiative / monarch in a pinch.
This I generally agree with, the only spells matters card I think that is better than Seedshark is Third Path Iconoclast. Mentor has a high ceiling, but its average case scenario in a singleton environment is so bad that I ended up cutting it from my cube. Shark is pretty much everything I wanted mentor to be in terms of defensive prowess and generating value through a sweeper.
Just to be clear with everyone, I think Chrome Host Seedshark is a great card. But gun to head, I'd cube Shark Typhoon first. I value Shark Typhoon's versatility, guaranteed value, role of being a scaleable big mana payoff that's strong at any point in the game, and ability to be reactionary more than Seedshark being an engine for spells matters. I'd give the nod to Seedshark over Mulldrifter even though Mulldrifter is also more versatile and shares a lot of Shark Typhoon's qualities, but IMO Shark Typhoon is on another level compared to both of them.
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StaffI disagree with Chrome Host Seedshark being a higher pick than Shark Typhoon in most decks for several reasons:
- Shark Typhoon can go into any deck that Chrome Host Seedshark can go into / any blue deck in general. Chrome Host Seedshark doesn't necessarily fit into every blue deck, and is incompatible with Oath of Druids.
- Shark Typhoon's cycling can be used at any time, giving blue decks more options in terms of leaving counters up against key threats, having a combat trick that can lead to a 3 for 1, or surprising your opponent at EOT to steal monarch / initaitive.
- If I can afford a blue splash in my deck, Shark Typhoon is a card I'll shoehorn in. I probably wouldn't splash for Chrome Host Seeshark, because if blue is a tertiary color that I"m splashing for, that probably means it's not a very spell centric deck.
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StaffSeedshark is good, but the other two are more consistent and will always be a 2 for 1 for 2U. Shark Typhoon being a combat trick and strong mana sink / solo finisher that's also uncounterable easily puts it over the top of the other two for me. Shark Typhoon is still one of the better goodstuff blue win conditions, although Occult Epiphany has been eating a lot of its lunch. I consider Occult Epiphany to the best goodstuff blue spell not named Ancestral Recall / Time Walk.
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StaffShark Typhoon > the other two. Mulldrifter vs Chrome Host Seedshark depends on what you want to support more.
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StaffDaretti >= Kolaghan's Command >>> Valki
You can argue that Daretti and Kolaghan's Command are pretty much equal as generic good stuff cards, but Daretti has the edge in also being an extremely valuable roleplayer for artifacts matters.
Personally I have Chaos Defiler / Daretti / Kolaghan's Command as my top 3 Rakdos cards of choice, and it isn't particularly close. While not 1 to 1 comparisons, there are a good amount of mono red / black cards that does a lot of what Fire Covenant wants to do as a one-sided sweeper.
- Delayed Blast Fireball (the best of the bunch by far if you're willing to play foretell cards)
- Fear, Fire, Foes!
- Seismic Wave
- Night Clubber
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StaffWhen comparing vastly different cards, you should be asking yourself what do you want / need more to achieve your design goals. The Goose Mother and Hydroid Krasis are very similar to each other, but Sail into the West is a completely different card. If you want more draw 7 / Fastbond support, then Sail into the West will help you more than the other two. If you want a more generic threat, I'd pick The Goose Mother over Hydroid Krasis.
Same as above, Alpha Deathclaw is vastly different from every other card you listed: you can't compare a super fatty to cheap utility roleplayers. If you need an extra super fatty for Natural Order / Reanimator / etc, then Alpha Deathclaw is the only card that can fill that role. Deathrite Shaman can be very dependent on the size of the cube (more density of fetches, the better). If I had to pick 2 without any context I'd probably go for Alpha Deathclaw and Assassin's Trophy. Alpha Deathclaw is just as effective of a 6 drop as Inferno Titan and Assassin's Trophy has the broadest use of any other cards listed .
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Staff- Selfless Spirit
- Cathar Commando (assuming a powered cube)
- Intrepid Adversary
- Imposing Sovereign
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StaffCould argue on a card being up / down a slot, but they're roughly where they should be. As effective as Goblin Rabblemaster still is, I do believe that it's at best the fifth best Rabblemaster right now. Laelia / Bombardiers / Gut / Squee all have a certain x-factor to them that the other other Rabblemasters lack, IMO.
- Bonecrusher Giant
- Laelia, the Blade Reforged
- Broadside Bombardiers
- Gut, True Soul Zealot
- Squee, Dubious Monarch
- Goblin Rabblemaster
- Death-Greeter's Champion
- Legion Warboss
- Plundering Barbarian
Tidehollow Sculler > Gerrard's Verdict
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