1) Talk to me more about your vote on CropCircles at EoD1 immediately after he claimed Friendly Neighbor? Obviously with how things look now you're more likely to be correct on CC, but talk me through your thought process on the "oh he claimed fn, hm" -> "gonna be busy for the next couple hours, vote CC" because I don't really understand how you could come to that conclusion?
2) What are your thoughts on what happened at EoD1 between JoeTerry getting run up and ZDS being the lynch?
3) Who do you think is mafia? Who do you think is town? I have trouble understanding where you at right now wrt the game because your posts are so... scattershot. Like it's really hard for me to step into your shoes and see where you're coming from, is what I'm getting at.
Okay now that I'm back on a computer I can go through a cliff notes version on why I think Terry is scum.
1) His catchup in the midgame feels strongly reminiscent of my scum self - he does a lot of note taking and observing, but he doesn't really ask questions or interrogate players in his catchup. This type of catchup is fairly easy for scum to pull off because they can just ignore most of the real-time that goes on in the thread and then provide commentary, which is easier to fake than real-time interactions. I would expect town Terry to ask some critical questions in his catchup, but instead he boils it down to players he agrees with (me, is town) and disagrees with (Vaimes, is scum).
2) This isn't really a point, per se, but he does a lot of "townsplaining" - IE he constantly refers to himself as town. Now if he did this only a couple times then I wouldn't bring it up, but it's kind of a constant trend throughout his posts:
Quote from JT »
Even if he targets the most town of townies (me duh)
Quote from JT »
@ZDS: I'm important. Trust me, I'm like the most important town person ever! Can you look me in the eyes and say that there is no reason for my interest in CC's lack of Vaimes discussion? Can you tell me that if it were you instead of me that it wouldn't be the slightest bit odd that he just ignored mentioning Vaimes at all? No matter how unimportant you think I am? You should know that I'm pretty full of myself from Voldemort, I'm just leaning into it more this game (and making Trump jokes at the same time).
Quote from JT »
I am so town, my doctor says I'm the most town person he has ever seen. Maybe the towniest person in the whole world.
Quote from JT »
PS I posted my notes in my recap. Yep, there were opinions in there too. I'm the most transparent villager ever. No secret notes here, you guys get to see all my notes.
(the above posts are where he explicitly refers to himself as town, the two posts below is where he defends himself weirdly)
Quote from JT »
Come on, Silver, you know deep down inside what I'm saying is true. You probably feel self-conscious about it and that's why you're voting me right now. You wish you've been posting a bit better but haven't got bitten by this game yet.
Quote from JT »
Hope that helps, I doubt it will because you already seem like you're tunneled. It's almost a sure thing that anyone who posts anything substantial like I did to catch up, will be attacked because it's content, content that people can like or dislike. You can like or dislike what I said, but I'm putting myself out there and giving my thoughts, I'm not hiding.
3) I feel like everyone skimmed over this, but when I asked him why he thought Silver's post 20 was forced, he responded with this:
Quote from JT »
1) Ok, first off it's post 20, are you really diving that deep? That being said, I didn't feel drawing a distinction between Highroller's claim and Rod's justified a vote on ZDS, which he straight up says was to end RVS, which could be interpreted as forcing.
Instead of saying "this is why I think Silver's post was forced, here are my reasons" he says "this could be interpreted as forcing". This tells me that he doesn't actually believe that Silver's push was forced - he's trying to convince himself that it is.
tldr - I think that town Terry would play this game with more nuance and be a bit more interrogative. In this game he just joined the large CropCircles bandwagon and had pressure on Vaimes that sort of went nowhere.
Still think most of this holds, especially points 1 and 3. I guess I can toss out point 2 since it's more of a stylistic thing, though you continuing to do this (in 756) has made my eyebrow uhh, firmly worn out.
I guess that Silver/Amy kind of answered my question in 777, but I still want to hear more from Silver outside of just "PoE".
More specifically on how he was townreading Amy based off of Rodemy's posts, said that Amy's initial catchup post was "solid", and then continued to townread Amy based not on her own posts, but sticking to the "townread based on Rodemy" bc that reads very strangely to me - if my memory is getting Silver's reads progression right.
I'm ~kind of worried Proph is scum. I think he's someone that would propose a WMU shot while hoping that town!JT and I keep sniping at each other.
I think WMU is a weird shot, specifically as a replacement, because they were still kinda trying to get their bearings. And they scumread ZDS/Proph/Cayvie.
I agree that WMU is a weird shot but I'm not scum. Pretty sure scum me would have checked out of this game a long time ago (plus also post much less).
Quote from Vaimes »
But yeah that kill makes me think that, among other things, my JT push is bunk.
Vaimes, expand on this a bit? Maybe I'm kind of far in the tunnel wrt JT but I still have issues with how he played Yesterday, specifically the lack of asking inquisitive questions + the "can be interpreted as forcing" wording issue.
Is it simple as that you don't believe a team with a wolf!JT kills WMU?
Quote from Silver »
My solve as of start of Night was [Cayvie / Grape / Proph / Amy]
Not sure what the odds are of Amy bussing on d2 though lol
Silver, talk to me about how you said "I'm going to continue to town read Amy based off of Rodemy's posts", you putting Amy as a townread in your town/scum list, and then now sticking her in with Grape/Cayvie/me in your start of night solve? Just... walk me through your thought process on seeing the ZDS flip and then your reads changing from, say, 535?
Okay so the mods got back to me, and said that CropCircles would get a message if he was roleblocked, which makes me think that think that CropCircles is scum who tried to wriggle his way out of the lunch D1 by claiming Friendly Neighbor and is now trying to set up something with Silver?
The only other situation that is coming to mind right now where both Silver and CC could be both town is that the possibility that Silver was ascetizied or was targeted by a scum "Rolestopper" (target a player, all actions that would affect that player fail). I'll check with the mods to see what would happen if this were the case.
However, those are very uncommon roles, and that's so unlikely to happen I'm happy with going with Occam's Razor and assume CropCircles is just lying.
Plus - his primary focus for most of Day 1 was the dkings slot and ZDS, and both have flipped town. Thiiiiiiink this is fairly clear-cut?
My question now is that "does scum really go through all this effort to fake claim a role" but I guess that JT literally did say that fakeclaiming is one of the best parts of being scum, so.
You're saying that you're asking questions, but most of the questions you're asking are some variant of "what is the case on me/why am I being voted" or bookkeeping.
I only found the grand total of one question I could consider nuanced and even that one is a bit of a stretch.
I'll be around more tomorrow, been busy preparing for a job interview
"Let CC flip then I'll evaluate things" is like 80% of my viewpoint rn though
1) Talk to me more about your vote on CropCircles at EoD1 immediately after he claimed Friendly Neighbor? Obviously with how things look now you're more likely to be correct on CC, but talk me through your thought process on the "oh he claimed fn, hm" -> "gonna be busy for the next couple hours, vote CC" because I don't really understand how you could come to that conclusion?
2) What are your thoughts on what happened at EoD1 between JoeTerry getting run up and ZDS being the lynch?
3) Who do you think is mafia? Who do you think is town? I have trouble understanding where you at right now wrt the game because your posts are so... scattershot. Like it's really hard for me to step into your shoes and see where you're coming from, is what I'm getting at.
1) CropCircles is mafia and lying about his role
2) Silvercrys is mafia and is claiming not to have received the result to mislunch the Friendly Neighbor CropCircles
Pretty fine with resolving CC first given that his reaction to this reads as fairly manufactured?
Still think most of this holds, especially points 1 and 3. I guess I can toss out point 2 since it's more of a stylistic thing, though you continuing to do this (in 756) has made my eyebrow uhh, firmly worn out.
More specifically on how he was townreading Amy based off of Rodemy's posts, said that Amy's initial catchup post was "solid", and then continued to townread Amy based not on her own posts, but sticking to the "townread based on Rodemy" bc that reads very strangely to me - if my memory is getting Silver's reads progression right.
I agree that WMU is a weird shot but I'm not scum. Pretty sure scum me would have checked out of this game a long time ago (plus also post much less).
Vaimes, expand on this a bit? Maybe I'm kind of far in the tunnel wrt JT but I still have issues with how he played Yesterday, specifically the lack of asking inquisitive questions + the "can be interpreted as forcing" wording issue.
Is it simple as that you don't believe a team with a wolf!JT kills WMU?
Silver, talk to me about how you said "I'm going to continue to town read Amy based off of Rodemy's posts", you putting Amy as a townread in your town/scum list, and then now sticking her in with Grape/Cayvie/me in your start of night solve? Just... walk me through your thought process on seeing the ZDS flip and then your reads changing from, say, 535?
To answer your questions:
- I would wait to see what CC flips before we start ruminating on what it means for Silver's alignment
- Obviously it depends on the rest of the setup, but I wouldn't consider it too powerful in a vacuum for a 12p game.
The only other situation that is coming to mind right now where both Silver and CC could be both town is that the possibility that Silver was ascetizied or was targeted by a scum "Rolestopper" (target a player, all actions that would affect that player fail). I'll check with the mods to see what would happen if this were the case.
However, those are very uncommon roles, and that's so unlikely to happen I'm happy with going with Occam's Razor and assume CropCircles is just lying.
Plus - his primary focus for most of Day 1 was the dkings slot and ZDS, and both have flipped town. Thiiiiiiink this is fairly clear-cut?
Vote CropCircles
currently pending a response from the mod wrt cropcircles and silver, but I think in 95% of worlds cc is just scum
Unvote
Vote ZeDorkSlipeur
Hope that by some miracle this is a hit but I'm not optimistic
Annoyed to have scum staring at you yet you can't lunch them
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ZeDorkSlipeur (5): Highroller, xX_WakeMeUp1337_Xx, Cropcircles42, Ampharos, Silvercrys3467
CropCircles42 (3): ZeDorkSlipeur, TheRealStinkyJoeTerry, cayvie
TheRealStinkyJoeTerry (3): Vaimes, Prophylaxis, Grapefruit21
Abstain (1): Axelrod
I only found the grand total of one question I could consider nuanced and even that one is a bit of a stretch.