At this point im not even sure what Salt actually wants from us. He asks for opinions on cards, then just tells us how wrong we are and how cool those are. And we are no talking about borderline cards that can work in the right environment here.
To repeat myself there are the following options:
a) strongly suggest playing Battlebox !
b) strongly suggest playing Battlebox !
c) build a cube from the ground up, playtest it extensively (6-8 players, 3 drafts minimum), adjust archetypes and powerlevel, then come back with results or specific questions rearding options for weak spots.
d) be the weird guy that spams the forum nobody will take serious pretty soon
as i said, the cube is all over the place. 50% of the cards are very good or at least good to playable. (Othesmo's cube) The rest is filled with trashcards nobody will ever play unless forced to. (your additions) It makes a horrible drafting experience and you are probably the only one who likes them for their artwork or weirdness. The cube is also lacking duals really bad. Tbh, Id never draft it. It feels a little like drafting beta or the early sets, where its better to just run 25 lands instead of unplayables.
I think cube might be the wrong format for you. You better off running a battlebox , where all players play from the same deck. This way you can force them into all those weird cards.
I don't know what sort of opinions I want for those artifacts.
I guess whether or not they're too powerful? Whether or not they make the game less fun? Whether or not you'd draft or actually use them? Do you find their effects cool? Do they have any sort of neat combos?
Amulet of Kroog for example I could see being unfun because of the slow, grindy nature of my cube. You're kind of guaranteed a ton of mana and it's feasible that you could just blank 1-2 attackers of your choosing every round. It would also give green a big incentive to ramp into it.
Squee's Toy for example is just another copy of Oasis, one of my favorite cards in the cube.
Idk, if you saw Glasses of Urza in a pack would you draft it and actually use it?
- They are not powerful
- Youre definition of fun and unfun is completely different from most of ours
- Id probably easily ignore 50% of your cube while drafting
- no neat stuff available afaik. A lot of them are online only commony anyway, so I never considered them. Rarity disparity is even worse than I thought.
- you might want to check the rulings of mono artifacts again or look up the latest wording
- Glasses of Urza lulz. If it would be at least the sunglasses for the cool kids
Sorry to derail the art conversation- I don't have a dog in this race- but the Wight of Precinct Six example reminded me: What's wrong with Wight of Precinct Six? It seems like it generally doesn't make the cut for modestly powered Cubes, and I've left it out on that basis, but it seems like it should almost always be a 2/2 in our format and will be bigger the vast majority of the time. Has anyone played with it who can comment on its unpopularity?
I think its biggest drawback is, thats its only a 1/1 in the early turns and doesnt help stabilize on board. Otherwise it seems decent in removal.dec
there is a huge difference in digital and non-digital artwork and i definitely prefer the old look of cards. i have found a cube that altered everything to the good old times. http://www.cubetutor.com/visualspoiler/58137
I definitely want answers for those, some are just too strong. But I never liked running sideboard cards, so I have a bunch of creatures that can deal with them.
Booster Tutor is an uncommon though
You said you wont draft with 8 ppl, so just add it. Otherwise its a good excuse to run 375 cards.
Splice can barely be used as you noticed, but since you already run a bunch of very fringe synergies you could still just add them. If you want to bend some rules there is also always the option to add multiples of certain cards to spice things up.
Regarding Hybrids. I think it works if you add real Hybrid cards to that subsection which means to me the card can be played in either color with full functionality. Most of those cards are either "gold" cards or can be put/cheated into the monocolor section.
In the end its just a definition thing anyway. Put them in Hybrids, Gold or Rainbow or whereever
As I said to Izor, nobody will ever notice a slight imbalance in the guildsections. Id say anything from 3-6 is fine to have and wont imbalance anything. I think even WotC does it that way.
i tried to cut all duals from my T2 once and would only run some rainbow lands, signets and a bunch of fixing in green. i got the feedback that it feels bad to waste deckslots on fixing and that duals do it much smoother. Now im the complete opposite and would like to run 3 full sets of duals but decided to run 2.5 and give green some lockets, since the ability to turn them into drawspells is nice for ramp strategies.
As said, in my T1 I only run the bouncelands and some fetches and stuff and the signets got promoted into it. Basically only control wants the duals there anyway.
Rule of thumb, Id advice to run 2 sets of duals of your choice and at least 10 other ways of manafixing, be it manastones, fetches, more duals
not sure why you want to push hybrids that much. Usually the ultimative density of strong cards in each color doesnt need any crosscolor cards. Except very few theyre pretty much always worse than their monocolored variation and might get just ignored. I think you have to decrease powerlevel by a lot to make them viable.
Im interested how the meta turns out in the end though and id be totally up for an xmage draft if you want to fire one.
Regarding Deathtouch. I like them because they interact with hexproof, always trade in combat and can be abused with Viridian Longbow or Fire Whip
I like Ethereal Ambush, especially since you're running a little long on Morphs and the card gets notably better (and more interesting) if you have Morph support. I don't like Coiling Oracle really at all- I think its popularity is a testament to balanced gold sections, and we all know how I feel about those.
We discussed the card before and kinda agreed its often worse than Elvish Visionary. The card was strong in constructed, so maybe thats why many stuck to it. I tried it for ramp lately in my T2, but more or less because the better guild cards are in my T1.
Speaking of weird color counting, I want to see if Hybrids can fill any of the holes in my Cube. The specific card that I am thinking about is Safehold Elite as a two drop that is one half of a Green card and one half of a White card. I feel like White would definitely run it, Green might, and BG or BW might for sacrifice synergy? (Although I don't like it with Soulstinger. More generally, are there hybrids that feel good enough to you if they weren't competing for gold slots, but basically artifact slots? Here are some of the ones on my radar:
Cultbrand Cinder- Worse than Pith Driller, but by how much? Pith Driller is really good...
Driller is colorless and costs 4. Rakdos has a lot of playables..
Barkshell Blessing- a decent trick in two colors that like tricks. I keep on trying to sneak in a +2/+2 for W: Maybe this is the answer? its fine, but there are better pumpspells Gather Courage
Dimir Guildmage- Honestly, the only thing holding this back is whether it's closer to Hybrid or Gold. more of a gold card, but you can pretty much put it everywhere
Shielding Plax- I'm not loving some of my aura inclusions, but is this card OK? pretty decent, a little slow though
Piston-Fist Cyclops- I have this nagging suspicion that this just ends up playing as a Gold card, in which case it's not good enough. i can see it in monored decks
Pitiless Gorgon- You all seem to like Deathtouch more than I do, so this is mostly to see where you all would rank this sort of body. 2/2s for 3 are not very interesting, especially if you want to trade with them, there are better deathtoucher for 1 or 2.
Whisper Agent- Another set of stats that I feel lower on than you all, but how much better is this than a bad removal spell? I like it very much for draw-go
Senate Griffin- This doesn't actually fill any holes, my curve is probably a touch too high, and it seems fragile. BUT IF NONE OF THOSE THINGS WERE TRUE, a 3/2 for 4 with evasion and some deck manipulation- good enough? meh
Sign in Blood is kinda outclassed by Night's Whisper, but both can be played, Skittering Skirge is a pure RB removal or control card and Dauthi Slayer is problematic on curve like the flyers and you probably want Dauthi Horror instead. all 3 are cutable for Scroundrel.
Keep in mind that I consider my T1 pretty much purely dedicated to the highest powerlevel while some of the others went more towards archetype/gameplay. There is not only one way to approach it though. You defintely want to playtest some of the cards you were cutting now or reconsider them later down the road
EDIT:
So, i decided to move some cards around. Carnophage and Vamp went to T2. Although Id consider them as staples theyre misplaced in my control black and I cant recall when I last saw them played. Black is a splash color for aggrodecks, so higher CC aggrocards are fine, but its unlikely you hit B on T1. But I moved Snuffout back in, so it can help aggrodecks that splash for B. Therefore I added the Scoundrel to my T2 as well and I wonder how those change effect the cube. Getting access to 3 one drops is a big push for my black aggro there.
Unless you are turbo aggro the games tend to become attrition games, meaning in the end the player with more ressources will win. Frantic Search doesnt help aggro and does exactly nothing, so you are down a card now.
Fissure can kinda work, but usually is just worse than any of the spells that can bounce 2 things. But how can one be so opposed to the Drake combo but wants to support storm. Storm pretty much is the epitome of non-interactive anti-magic.
To Grapeshot become better than Volcanic Hammer, you already had to cast another 2 spells this turn. You you jump through some hoops for 4 damage and had to play suboptimal.
Treasure Cruise is pretty strong, but doesnt do as much as it does in constructed, basically because you only run one anyway and the decks are far more random.
I dont understand how ppl like the Drake without the combo. The Sentinels are mediocre at best and Drake comes down at minimum a turn later, but getting to 5 lands usually takes even longer. 2/3 is not a good statline on T4 or T5, even when the creature comes "for free" "Every" random 2 drop trades into it
It feels so bad to cast it just for the body, Id never run it for itself.
Cloud of Faeries also does nothing. The card is worth a spirit token.
ETW is fine as soon as you get another spell down the turn and becomes quite impressive with 2 spells which is relatively easy. Its more of a midrange/control finisher than an aggrocard.
Invigorate looks nice on paper. Counter a toughness based removal for free. In reality I see it more often just cast for 3, which is okayish, but there would be better cards. Ill replace it at one point for sure. Green anyway is my most volatile color, not quite sure what to do with it. Turboaggro shifted way deeper into red, Ramp usually lacks value, Fatties are too fragile and pushing for all hexproof doesnt make it much better. It doesnt have good spells besides Sprout Swarm, no real removal.. The color is just too fair.
To repeat myself there are the following options:
a) strongly suggest playing Battlebox !
b) strongly suggest playing Battlebox !
c) build a cube from the ground up, playtest it extensively (6-8 players, 3 drafts minimum), adjust archetypes and powerlevel, then come back with results or specific questions rearding options for weak spots.
d) be the weird guy that spams the forum nobody will take serious pretty soon
T2 powpercube Value https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/37t
the deck will probably crush all those lategame durdle fantasies too bad i passed the early empyrial armor
and a pack https://imgur.com/a/iMWJG0j
as i said, the cube is all over the place. 50% of the cards are very good or at least good to playable. (Othesmo's cube) The rest is filled with trashcards nobody will ever play unless forced to. (your additions) It makes a horrible drafting experience and you are probably the only one who likes them for their artwork or weirdness. The cube is also lacking duals really bad. Tbh, Id never draft it. It feels a little like drafting beta or the early sets, where its better to just run 25 lands instead of unplayables.
I think cube might be the wrong format for you. You better off running a battlebox , where all players play from the same deck. This way you can force them into all those weird cards.
T2 powpercube Value https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/37t
- They are not powerful
- Youre definition of fun and unfun is completely different from most of ours
- Id probably easily ignore 50% of your cube while drafting
- no neat stuff available afaik. A lot of them are online only commony anyway, so I never considered them. Rarity disparity is even worse than I thought.
- you might want to check the rulings of mono artifacts again or look up the latest wording
- Glasses of Urza lulz. If it would be at least the sunglasses for the cool kids
T2 powpercube Value https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/37t
I think its biggest drawback is, thats its only a 1/1 in the early turns and doesnt help stabilize on board. Otherwise it seems decent in removal.dec
T2 powpercube Value https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/37t
T2 powpercube Value https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/37t
In my T1 I also run Soltari Visionary which is worst case a 2/2 unblockable. My T2 got 2 Ronom Unicorns which I like very much.
T2 powpercube Value https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/37t
T2 powpercube Value https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/37t
You said you wont draft with 8 ppl, so just add it. Otherwise its a good excuse to run 375 cards.
Splice can barely be used as you noticed, but since you already run a bunch of very fringe synergies you could still just add them. If you want to bend some rules there is also always the option to add multiples of certain cards to spice things up.
T2 powpercube Value https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/37t
In the end its just a definition thing anyway. Put them in Hybrids, Gold or Rainbow or whereever
As I said to Izor, nobody will ever notice a slight imbalance in the guildsections. Id say anything from 3-6 is fine to have and wont imbalance anything. I think even WotC does it that way.
T2 powpercube Value https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/37t
As said, in my T1 I only run the bouncelands and some fetches and stuff and the signets got promoted into it. Basically only control wants the duals there anyway.
Rule of thumb, Id advice to run 2 sets of duals of your choice and at least 10 other ways of manafixing, be it manastones, fetches, more duals
T2 powpercube Value https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/37t
Im interested how the meta turns out in the end though and id be totally up for an xmage draft if you want to fire one.
Regarding Deathtouch. I like them because they interact with hexproof, always trade in combat and can be abused with Viridian Longbow or Fire Whip
T2 powpercube Value https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/37t
T2 powpercube Value https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/37t
Keep in mind that I consider my T1 pretty much purely dedicated to the highest powerlevel while some of the others went more towards archetype/gameplay. There is not only one way to approach it though. You defintely want to playtest some of the cards you were cutting now or reconsider them later down the road
EDIT:
So, i decided to move some cards around. Carnophage and Vamp went to T2. Although Id consider them as staples theyre misplaced in my control black and I cant recall when I last saw them played. Black is a splash color for aggrodecks, so higher CC aggrocards are fine, but its unlikely you hit B on T1. But I moved Snuffout back in, so it can help aggrodecks that splash for B. Therefore I added the Scoundrel to my T2 as well and I wonder how those change effect the cube. Getting access to 3 one drops is a big push for my black aggro there.
T2 powpercube Value https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/37t
Fissure can kinda work, but usually is just worse than any of the spells that can bounce 2 things. But how can one be so opposed to the Drake combo but wants to support storm. Storm pretty much is the epitome of non-interactive anti-magic.
To Grapeshot become better than Volcanic Hammer, you already had to cast another 2 spells this turn. You you jump through some hoops for 4 damage and had to play suboptimal.
Treasure Cruise is pretty strong, but doesnt do as much as it does in constructed, basically because you only run one anyway and the decks are far more random.
T2 powpercube Value https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/37t
It feels so bad to cast it just for the body, Id never run it for itself.
Cloud of Faeries also does nothing. The card is worth a spirit token.
ETW is fine as soon as you get another spell down the turn and becomes quite impressive with 2 spells which is relatively easy. Its more of a midrange/control finisher than an aggrocard.
Invigorate looks nice on paper. Counter a toughness based removal for free. In reality I see it more often just cast for 3, which is okayish, but there would be better cards. Ill replace it at one point for sure. Green anyway is my most volatile color, not quite sure what to do with it. Turboaggro shifted way deeper into red, Ramp usually lacks value, Fatties are too fragile and pushing for all hexproof doesnt make it much better. It doesnt have good spells besides Sprout Swarm, no real removal.. The color is just too fair.
T2 powpercube Value https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/37t