Waterfront Bouncer is always solid around here. I think you're right that it doesn't get picked early but I think that's because the deck that wants this card knows that it can wheel and they can take something like a mulldrifter or merfolk looter first. I love any card that turns late game lands into an advantage and this card is no exception. Bouncing a dude on your opponents EOT late game is OP. His early game is also useful in removing annoying blockers, bouncing your own mulldrifter or even pitching a durdle creature to enable a Stitched Drake. Speaking of Stitched Drake...I know that card is a boss and Makeshift Mauler isn't anywhere near as good but that card always does really well around here but I dont think I've seen anyone else play that card at all. What's wrong with a 4/5 for 4?
I don't think I've ever been disappointed by drawing a Sunlance . There aren't very many creatures that 3 damage doesn't kill in the cube. Sure, it doesn't handle regenerators like pacifism but pacifism doesn't handle utility creatures like sunlance does. And sure it can be countered by pump...but how often does that really happen? I don't run a whole lot of pump and i don't think most people do anymore (the same case can be made against red burn and no one holds that against lightning bolt). Also, pacifisms get even more blown out by enchantment removal, which i run more of than i do pump. Being 1 mana also doesn't hurt. Cheap removal is cheap.
Having smaller packs would actually call for you to reduce your cube size...not advocate making it bigger. The idea of having a cube of a certain size is to see a majority of cards in each draft. You design your cube with the idea that the cards of colors you've chosen should be able to make cohesive decks. Due to the fact that pack randomization is pretty poor in cubes, adding more cards adds to the chance that key cards of colors or archetypes are missing. I play 4 people 360 which is WAYYY too big but my friends and I play 1 draft with half of the cube and then another with the remaining half. I should realistically be running a much smaller cube and I can tell when we draft that it's very hard to put together certain decks because key components are going to be missing. The idea of running a cube size was never based around the number of playable but rather the need to have key cards present in each draft. There are TONS of cards to be played in regular cubes but people still cut them to 360 for this very reason. If you really want to put in more cards for having the sake of having more cool cards in the cube, that is totally respectable but it's pretty strange to say that increasing the number makes more sense in terms of draftability of the cube
Testy testy
Again, I don't care whether or not a 4 drop 3/3 haste is better than a 3 drop 3/3 without haste after testing. I was pointing out that you missed a counterargument in your reasoning.
You said
"the only difference between X and Y is Z"
and I said
"There is an additional difference W".
Then I added in a humorous remark which you mistook for a contention.
Calm down.
Just stop posting in this forum. You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about and your posts have brought absolutely nothing positive to the conversation. Go troll somewhere else.
As much as I want to like a 4/2 trample with potential haste. I really hate 4/2's ><. The only one I run in my cube is Slash Panther and that's because it's in my colorless section since even red is going to run it as a 4 drop and take the 2 life hit most of the time. It's that whole thing about Slaughterhorn vs Nessian Courser again. At least in my cube, the difference between 2 and 3 toughness is pretty substantial in terms of staying on the board. I will say the trample keeps me thinking about running that card tho. How does Rukh Egg play out in your cube? I've always been intrigued by that card in pauper. 4/4 fliers are pretty awesome. How often does it get thwarted by white enchantments and bounce?
You shouldn't go after my little anecdote when trying to dismantle my argument. My actual contention was that by playing a higher costed creature that has haste instead of a lower costed creature that doesn't, you miss out on the opportunity to play your cards earlier in case you do happen to have a play next turn. Something like equipping someone or shooting a blocker can easily come up here. In the latter case, if that is necessary in order to get through, the haste advantage is lost entirely.
Furthermore, that wouldn't be the only argument remaining even if you did decide to ignore it. The big one is that if you get stuck at 3 mana, one of these cards is mulliganing you. I suppose its worth noting that if you get stuck at 3 that a 4 drop with haste is alot better than a 4 drop without haste for when you finally draw your 4th land.
I'm really quit surprised this argument is still going on. Haste is good. Not sure why people are even trying to make a side case about it not being worth extra mana. Wizards has made it abundantly clear that haste is worth 1 mana on multiple cards such as ThornlingSkithiryx, the blight dragon and flinthoof boar to name a few. Sure these cards can also be played without haste which makes them better but this is pauper cube...our cards are not of this caliber. So a 3/3 haste for 4 is perfectly acceptable. More so, this whole notion of anecdotal well you COULD draw a 4 drop is kind of silly, especially in red. I guess you don't have much experience with pauper cubes because red's 4 drops outside of Gorehorn Minotaurs are not impressive which is why Raging Minotaur is more than acceptable. I only run 3 red 4 drops. The same goes for the whole skyknight legionnaire case. It's a good card. It's not exciting by any means but R/W isn't an exciting color for pauper cube. It beats and burns. If you want something other than a creature to draw in your R/W players that's up to you but let's not shun people for playing a perfectly acceptable card.
Also, it's the 2/2 and LIFELINK that makes Mark of the Vampire such a beating even if it connects only once or twice. The 4 point life swing just from the enchantment alone (not including the power of whatever creature it is on) is a huge swing in the game if it connects more than once.
I had Moment's Peace in my cube but none of the decks really seemed to want fog, even if you got 2 fogs on one card. I don't run a lot of pump in my cube but this one cantrips and gives trample which is extremely relevant. Definitely Wildsize between the two of them.
I think what the not blocking cards do is open up red aggro better than the burn. I'm not going to say that these cards are better than burn but they are certainly worse for control and splashes in other decks. The problem with red aggro in my cube is that all of the powerful red cards (the burn) are taken by other decks to either splash or play it as removal in their control deck. Stuff like nightbird's clutches doesn't get taken by these decks. Not saying it's a good plan for overall cube performance but it would certainly open up more options of drafting red aggro by letting you take creatures early and wheeling cards like these. Trying to wheel a lightning bolt or staggershock is nearly impossible.
Those are 2 extremely different cards. I'm always tempted to just cut the land d when i look for slots to test as well though. However, I never do because they're always so good.
I guess it really just boils down to how your cube plays out within the context of your playgroup. I know how true this is even in my own un-powered cube. There are cards that almost the entire community says is not only a staple but top 3 of that cards color and our playgroup seldom even puts it in their decks. Every one and every group has different cube experiences and different cards tend to fit those better than others. That being said, Aven Riftwatcher is always solid in our playgroup but maybe aggro isn't as powerful in other people's cubing experiences which could definitely detract from this cards value.
I think your definition of card disadvantage is a bit strange. Card disadvantage is when you net yourself negative cards. Such examples would be 2 for 1'ing yourself to get rid of your opponents creature or saving your own. Discarding 2 cards to your Wild Mongrel to kill a blocking 3/3 is card disadvantage. Playing your card and taking something from your opponent (life or a creature) or gaining something for yourself (life or a creature) is simply a card. At the very least, Aven Riftwatcher nets you 4 life if it literally does nothing. Life Burst is not card disadvantage. Sure, it's not a good card but it is not card disadvantage. We all know that a 2/3 flier is a very imposing body on the board. If you play it on turn 3, it would be very rare that your opponent could swing into it without at the very least trading which nets you a 1v1 for creatures and leaving you up 4 life from your opponent. If your opponent doesn't attack into it, you've just left yourself with a 2/3 flier, a fog, and 2 life. This card is simply a beating against any aggro deck and still a decent creature against others.
I can definitely see there being a cap on the number of tappers you want to run. I run 4 and they seem to do very well in our cube. Their versatility is awesome and both control and aggro seem to want them. Whether its tapping down a 4/4, a flier with equipment, or a blocker to bash in with the team they always do something useful. Even if it's not the most backbreaking of abilities (sometimes it is), it's always at the very worst, useful. I guess it's also of note that I don't run any hexproof guys except for old blastoderm.
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Just stop posting in this forum. You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about and your posts have brought absolutely nothing positive to the conversation. Go troll somewhere else.
Infraction issued for Flaming.
—Lanxal
I'm really quit surprised this argument is still going on. Haste is good. Not sure why people are even trying to make a side case about it not being worth extra mana. Wizards has made it abundantly clear that haste is worth 1 mana on multiple cards such as Thornling Skithiryx, the blight dragon and flinthoof boar to name a few. Sure these cards can also be played without haste which makes them better but this is pauper cube...our cards are not of this caliber. So a 3/3 haste for 4 is perfectly acceptable. More so, this whole notion of anecdotal well you COULD draw a 4 drop is kind of silly, especially in red. I guess you don't have much experience with pauper cubes because red's 4 drops outside of Gorehorn Minotaurs are not impressive which is why Raging Minotaur is more than acceptable. I only run 3 red 4 drops. The same goes for the whole skyknight legionnaire case. It's a good card. It's not exciting by any means but R/W isn't an exciting color for pauper cube. It beats and burns. If you want something other than a creature to draw in your R/W players that's up to you but let's not shun people for playing a perfectly acceptable card.
Also, it's the 2/2 and LIFELINK that makes Mark of the Vampire such a beating even if it connects only once or twice. The 4 point life swing just from the enchantment alone (not including the power of whatever creature it is on) is a huge swing in the game if it connects more than once.