so bottle-nosed dolphins aren't committing murder (or fit into your definition of evil for that matter) when they kill porpoises for apparently no reason?
so bottle-nosed dolphins aren't committing murder (or fit into your definition of evil for that matter) when they kill porpoises for apparently no reason?
If they are a programmed enemy in the wild it very well could be just their nature. A group of 'different' mammal swimmers they fight for food and territory with.
so bottle-nosed dolphins aren't committing murder (or fit into your definition of evil for that matter) when they kill porpoises for apparently no reason?
Id say no. Unless the entity committing the act has sufficient knowledge of evil and what it is doing is wrong, then no evil is being committed.
By that same token, I don't condemn tornados as evil, or volcanos or earthquakes.
I'm a proud member of the Online Campaign for Real English. If you believe in capital letters, correct spelling, and good sentence structure, then copy this into your signature.
If that's your "casual," what on earth is required for "formal," a butler in livery shuffling the decks whilst a pianist plays Brahms in front of a tapestry?
so bottle-nosed dolphins aren't committing murder (or fit into your definition of evil for that matter) when they kill porpoises for apparently no reason?
Id say no. Unless the entity committing the act has sufficient knowledge of evil and what it is doing is wrong, then no evil is being committed.
This would imply that there is a definitive act of evil though, wouldn't it? So if someone judges that its action is not evil, then it's not evil?
Tornadoes and volcanoes and earthquakes cannot be considered evil because they don't have a mind or any control over their actions, if going by the normal definition of evil and its requirements.
Sorting people into the "evil" category is done when you've decided you can't forgive them. There are people out there who do horrible, awful things, that aren't evil because you forgived them; lots of celebrities are particularly poor human beings. People who can't forgive themselves usually view themselves as evil.
It'd be nice if you could post something longer to reinforce your opinion rather than just put it out there. Why do you think animals lack in cruelty or selfishness? Why do you think evil can only ever possibly exist within humans?
The Human Psyche is the root of all evil. The seven sins lust, gluttony, greed, sloth, wrath, envy, and pride are emtions that are subsets of the psyche. Everything else that has been mentioned so far is derived from one of these sins. For example, money isn't really evil but people's greed for it and envy of others that have it is the real evil.
If all human are replaced by robots then there will be no evil, but there won't be good either.
The human mind is the root of all evil. The human mind is the only thing on this Earth that can even comprehend what evil is. Can an animal comprehend evil? No.
i. Chasing your preferences at great prejudice of others. Ex: Stealing / Killing for money. The evil doer wants money and there's nothing wrong with that. But he causes great pain to others in his pursuit and that' the evil act. Starting a business solely for money is not a evil act, as his not inflicting no pain in anyone. The problem is not greed, but the lack of self control.
ii. Preferring the prejudice of others. Ex: that's when someone kill for the sake of the kill. In this case 'lack of self control or regard to others is not the issue. Someone might wish to murder, rape and torture people and never do the acts, but just longing is already a act of evil in my opinion.
The case 'i' is fully explained but since we don't know from where personal preferences spawns the case 'ii' have a deeper, hidden, unknown root.
It is quite possible to imagine two person having different opinions and accepting it as such without conflict. If this is true, then there must be something else at the root of evil to make two persons who have different opinions to misbehave.
The human mind is the root of all evil. The human mind is the only thing on this Earth that can even comprehend what evil is. Can an animal comprehend evil? No.
Free Will is not. Money is not.
Is comprehension necessary for something to be evil? The people working in German concentration camps thought they were doing the world a service by ridding the world of Jews. Men working in Korean concentration camps mentioned the things they did to prisoners (and made prisoners do to one another) were normal because well, they were prisoners, not humans.
Or do you mean that the only reason evil as a concept exist is because we thought it up?
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
We have laboured long to build a heaven, only to find it populated with horrors.
The human mind is the root of all evil. The human mind is the only thing on this Earth that can even comprehend what evil is. Can an animal comprehend evil? No.
Free Will is not. Money is not.
Is comprehension necessary for something to be evil? The people working in German concentration camps thought they were doing the world a service by ridding the world of Jews. Men working in Korean concentration camps mentioned the things they did to prisoners (and made prisoners do to one another) were normal because well, they were prisoners, not humans.
Or do you mean that the only reason evil as a concept exist is because we thought it up?
Yes, comprehension is necessary for something to be evil. While the Gestapo didn't see the evil in their actions during World War II, others did. The Jews saw the evil in their ways. The Allies did too. If no one comprehends or recognizes an action as evil, is it evil? I guess it depends what moral or ethical theory you subscribe too (Divine Command theorists would suggest that God's recognition is enough).
But there is an argument for evil has a human concept. Why is murder wrong? Why is it evil? Early humans killed each other in clans for thousands of years before, and there was nothing prohibiting it before the Code of Hammurabi in 1772 B.C.E. Is evil even a thing if we as a human race don't recognize it?
The human mind is the root of all evil. The human mind is the only thing on this Earth that can even comprehend what evil is. Can an animal comprehend evil? No.
Free Will is not. Money is not.
Is comprehension necessary for something to be evil? The people working in German concentration camps thought they were doing the world a service by ridding the world of Jews. Men working in Korean concentration camps mentioned the things they did to prisoners (and made prisoners do to one another) were normal because well, they were prisoners, not humans.
Or do you mean that the only reason evil as a concept exist is because we thought it up?
Yes, comprehension is necessary for something to be evil. While the Gestapo didn't see the evil in their actions during World War II, others did. The Jews saw the evil in their ways. The Allies did too. If no one comprehends or recognizes an action as evil, is it evil? I guess it depends what moral or ethical theory you subscribe too (Divine Command theorists would suggest that God's recognition is enough).
But there is an argument for evil has a human concept. Why is murder wrong? Why is it evil? Early humans killed each other in clans for thousands of years before, and there was nothing prohibiting it before the Code of Hammurabi in 1772 B.C.E. Is evil even a thing if we as a human race don't recognize it?
I can't say I know for sure, honestly.
So then the question should be "What are properties that makes people/things do actions we would describe as evil"? Because I do agree that you that if there were no sapient creatures, actions could not be described as evil.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
We have laboured long to build a heaven, only to find it populated with horrors.
Something being necessary doesn't mean it is the root itself. A children are needed so child mortality occur, but it doesn't mean children are the root (it is deseases and other problems). Just because humanity is needed so evil can exist doesn't mean it is the root of it.
It is quite possible to imagine two person having different opinions and accepting it as such without conflict. If this is true, then there must be something else at the root of evil to make two persons who have different opinions to misbehave.
Hm.
Two people have different opinions on a matter.
Both people decide to not act on their different opinions
Nothing gets done because of said difference in opinion.
Two people have different opinions on a matter.
Both people decide to act on their different opinions.
Things happen.
The human mind is the root of all evil. The human mind is the only thing on this Earth that can even comprehend what evil is. Can an animal comprehend evil? No.
Free Will is not. Money is not.
Is comprehension necessary for something to be evil? The people working in German concentration camps thought they were doing the world a service by ridding the world of Jews. Men working in Korean concentration camps mentioned the things they did to prisoners (and made prisoners do to one another) were normal because well, they were prisoners, not humans.
Or do you mean that the only reason evil as a concept exist is because we thought it up?
Yes, comprehension is necessary for something to be evil. While the Gestapo didn't see the evil in their actions during World War II, others did. The Jews saw the evil in their ways. The Allies did too. If no one comprehends or recognizes an action as evil, is it evil? I guess it depends what moral or ethical theory you subscribe too (Divine Command theorists would suggest that God's recognition is enough).
But there is an argument for evil has a human concept. Why is murder wrong? Why is it evil? Early humans killed each other in clans for thousands of years before, and there was nothing prohibiting it before the Code of Hammurabi in 1772 B.C.E. Is evil even a thing if we as a human race don't recognize it?
I can't say I know for sure, honestly.
So then the question should be "What are properties that makes people/things do actions we would describe as evil"? Because I do agree that you that if there were no sapient creatures, actions could not be described as evil.
Yes, then maybe that would be the question.
Can the Gestapo's actions be viewed as truly evil? They were merely soldiers in the Third Reich, simple peons. There's a reason not every single foot soldier was put on trial like the higher in command at the Nuremberg Trials.
At what extent does humanity stop and say:
"Okay, that's evil without outside influence."
I can argue that serial killers with poor upbringings and psychological trauma should be exempt from conviction just like the Gestapo, can't I?
The human mind is the root of all evil. The human mind is the only thing on this Earth that can even comprehend what evil is. Can an animal comprehend evil? No.
Free Will is not. Money is not.
Is comprehension necessary for something to be evil? The people working in German concentration camps thought they were doing the world a service by ridding the world of Jews. Men working in Korean concentration camps mentioned the things they did to prisoners (and made prisoners do to one another) were normal because well, they were prisoners, not humans.
Or do you mean that the only reason evil as a concept exist is because we thought it up?
Yes, comprehension is necessary for something to be evil. While the Gestapo didn't see the evil in their actions during World War II, others did. The Jews saw the evil in their ways. The Allies did too. If no one comprehends or recognizes an action as evil, is it evil? I guess it depends what moral or ethical theory you subscribe too (Divine Command theorists would suggest that God's recognition is enough).
But there is an argument for evil has a human concept. Why is murder wrong? Why is it evil? Early humans killed each other in clans for thousands of years before, and there was nothing prohibiting it before the Code of Hammurabi in 1772 B.C.E. Is evil even a thing if we as a human race don't recognize it?
I can't say I know for sure, honestly.
So then the question should be "What are properties that makes people/things do actions we would describe as evil"? Because I do agree that you that if there were no sapient creatures, actions could not be described as evil.
Yes, then maybe that would be the question.
Can the Gestapo's actions be viewed as truly evil? They were merely soldiers in the Third Reich, simple peons. There's a reason not every single foot soldier was put on trial like the higher in command at the Nuremberg Trials.
At what extent does humanity stop and say:
"Okay, that's evil without outside influence."
I can argue that serial killers with poor upbringings and psychological trauma should be exempt from conviction just like the Gestapo, can't I?
Difficult. I'd say that the actions are without any word evil. If the people in question are depends, I'd say at least, somewhat on their knowledge of their actions.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
We have laboured long to build a heaven, only to find it populated with horrors.
Two people have different opinions on a matter.
Both people decide to not act on their different opinions
Nothing gets done because of said difference in opinion.
Two people have different opinions on a matter.
Both people decide to act on their different opinions.
Things happen.
I suppose action is the root of all evil then?
Well, no. Either the action has a motivation or it doesn't. If it doesn't, then it cannot be evil because it isn't done by any kind of willingness (though this can be disputed, but I think evilness requires intention). So the evil action has to be caused or has to have a motivation that makes it evil. Therefore, action itself couldn't be the root of evil. It should have something to do with what motivates the action.
I know I'm not proposing anything as what motivates evil, but I'm not even sure evil really exists. I do believe there are morally wrong and right acts, so my doubts are not created by relativism or nihilism. If evil is a very immoral action, then at what degree does it become so and what's the usefulness of using such a word?
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
If they are a programmed enemy in the wild it very well could be just their nature. A group of 'different' mammal swimmers they fight for food and territory with.
Id say no. Unless the entity committing the act has sufficient knowledge of evil and what it is doing is wrong, then no evil is being committed.
By that same token, I don't condemn tornados as evil, or volcanos or earthquakes.
signature by rivenor at http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=329663
I'm a proud member of the Online Campaign for Real English. If you believe in capital letters, correct spelling, and good sentence structure, then copy this into your signature.
I hate the reserved list.
Mythic rares are fine.
This would imply that there is a definitive act of evil though, wouldn't it? So if someone judges that its action is not evil, then it's not evil?
Tornadoes and volcanoes and earthquakes cannot be considered evil because they don't have a mind or any control over their actions, if going by the normal definition of evil and its requirements.
BGStandard Green AggroGB
UWRGModern Saheeli CobraGRWU
UBRGLegacy StormGRBU
Wizards Certified Rules Advisor
It'd be nice if you could post something longer to reinforce your opinion rather than just put it out there. Why do you think animals lack in cruelty or selfishness? Why do you think evil can only ever possibly exist within humans?
Or its ontological status..
If all human are replaced by robots then there will be no evil, but there won't be good either.
Free Will is not. Money is not.
My Mafia Stats - My Helpdesk
G Omnath, Locus of Mana U Arcum Dagsson BUG The Mimeoplasm GW Gaddock Teeg X Karn, Silver Golem
Please disprove me if you want to.
BUWGRChilds PlayGRWUB
BUWGR Highlander GRWUB
UBSquee's Shapeshifting PetBU
BW Multiplayer Control WB
RG Changeling GR
UR Mana FlareRU
UMerfolkU
B MBMC B
i. Chasing your preferences at great prejudice of others. Ex: Stealing / Killing for money. The evil doer wants money and there's nothing wrong with that. But he causes great pain to others in his pursuit and that' the evil act. Starting a business solely for money is not a evil act, as his not inflicting no pain in anyone. The problem is not greed, but the lack of self control.
ii. Preferring the prejudice of others. Ex: that's when someone kill for the sake of the kill. In this case 'lack of self control or regard to others is not the issue. Someone might wish to murder, rape and torture people and never do the acts, but just longing is already a act of evil in my opinion.
The case 'i' is fully explained but since we don't know from where personal preferences spawns the case 'ii' have a deeper, hidden, unknown root.
BGU Control
R Aggro
Standard - For Fun
BG Auras
It is quite possible to imagine two person having different opinions and accepting it as such without conflict. If this is true, then there must be something else at the root of evil to make two persons who have different opinions to misbehave.
Is comprehension necessary for something to be evil? The people working in German concentration camps thought they were doing the world a service by ridding the world of Jews. Men working in Korean concentration camps mentioned the things they did to prisoners (and made prisoners do to one another) were normal because well, they were prisoners, not humans.
Or do you mean that the only reason evil as a concept exist is because we thought it up?
Yes, comprehension is necessary for something to be evil. While the Gestapo didn't see the evil in their actions during World War II, others did. The Jews saw the evil in their ways. The Allies did too. If no one comprehends or recognizes an action as evil, is it evil? I guess it depends what moral or ethical theory you subscribe too (Divine Command theorists would suggest that God's recognition is enough).
But there is an argument for evil has a human concept. Why is murder wrong? Why is it evil? Early humans killed each other in clans for thousands of years before, and there was nothing prohibiting it before the Code of Hammurabi in 1772 B.C.E. Is evil even a thing if we as a human race don't recognize it?
I can't say I know for sure, honestly.
My Mafia Stats - My Helpdesk
G Omnath, Locus of Mana U Arcum Dagsson BUG The Mimeoplasm GW Gaddock Teeg X Karn, Silver Golem
So then the question should be "What are properties that makes people/things do actions we would describe as evil"? Because I do agree that you that if there were no sapient creatures, actions could not be described as evil.
BGU Control
R Aggro
Standard - For Fun
BG Auras
Hm.
Two people have different opinions on a matter.
Both people decide to not act on their different opinions
Nothing gets done because of said difference in opinion.
Two people have different opinions on a matter.
Both people decide to act on their different opinions.
Things happen.
I suppose action is the root of all evil then?
Yes, then maybe that would be the question.
Can the Gestapo's actions be viewed as truly evil? They were merely soldiers in the Third Reich, simple peons. There's a reason not every single foot soldier was put on trial like the higher in command at the Nuremberg Trials.
At what extent does humanity stop and say:
"Okay, that's evil without outside influence."
I can argue that serial killers with poor upbringings and psychological trauma should be exempt from conviction just like the Gestapo, can't I?
My Mafia Stats - My Helpdesk
G Omnath, Locus of Mana U Arcum Dagsson BUG The Mimeoplasm GW Gaddock Teeg X Karn, Silver Golem
Difficult. I'd say that the actions are without any word evil. If the people in question are depends, I'd say at least, somewhat on their knowledge of their actions.
Well, no. Either the action has a motivation or it doesn't. If it doesn't, then it cannot be evil because it isn't done by any kind of willingness (though this can be disputed, but I think evilness requires intention). So the evil action has to be caused or has to have a motivation that makes it evil. Therefore, action itself couldn't be the root of evil. It should have something to do with what motivates the action.
I know I'm not proposing anything as what motivates evil, but I'm not even sure evil really exists. I do believe there are morally wrong and right acts, so my doubts are not created by relativism or nihilism. If evil is a very immoral action, then at what degree does it become so and what's the usefulness of using such a word?