I recently built my first cube and am looking for any and all feedback. On CubeTutor On Salvation
This cube is sometimes played with my kids (played a bunch of Star Realms with them and decided they were ready for drafting) and sometimes with friends. We also mix it up between playing duels and multiplayer.
A few notes on card selection:
- All five colors use and abuse ETB effects.
- Each individual color has 2-3 specific archetypes, but not all of the guilds are well-defined yet.
White - Blink, Lifegain, Removal
Blue - Blink, Spellslinger, Draw
Black - Removal, Recursion, Lifedrain
Red - Spellslinger, Burn
Green - Creatures, Pump, Ramp
I think my biggest problem right now is in the multi-color section, particularly the hybrid cards. Initially, they were all hybrid, but after a few drafts, I added two gold cards per guild, and I'm considering adding a third. I also originally had full cycles (like all the guildmages), but I've been trimming some of those. Some guilds have tons of cards I want to run, and some I struggle to find ones that interest me. And even with this, it's hard to categorize some cards, as they may be hybrid with a gold ability (Mistmeadow Witch). Can I get some help with the multi-color?
I can be more thorough later, , but just to get the ball rolling:
Pretend cycles arent a thing. Except for functionally identical lands, completing cycles doesn't offer anything (and an argument can be made for unbalanced mana sources as well)
It's also disingenuous to label mistmeadow witch as hybrid since it can't be played in one color.
I'll totally figure out how to use cubetutor when I get a chance - it's just bad timing because our baby decided to come six weeks prematurely. Once that's under control, I'll bump this again.
OK - bumping this after I put it on CubeTutor: http://www.cubetutor.com/viewcube/87394.
I was just playing around on their interface, and I can see why you guys like it. After drafting a deck, is there a way to goldfish it?
As I stated in the OP, I'm looking for help with the multi-color section. Both what to add, and what to cut (because I'd like to stay at or under 400 cards).
I have putrefy and mortify both in my cube and their fine, but i hate them. They don't define the guilds at all and are boring. Your 3 multicolor cards should be exciting to play, archetype/guild defining and extremely valuable.
I have putrefy and mortify both in my cube and their fine, but i hate them. They don't define the guilds at all and are boring. Your 3 multicolor cards should be exciting to play, archetype/guild defining and extremely valuable.
Interesting. So, cards that make you want to play the guild rather than just good utility if you happen to already be in it?
There is something to be said about guild cads being "interesting" (I have my cube set up that way too) but from a pure power perspective putrefy and lightning helix and co are just better cards than the interesting options.
An exception to this would be if the interesting card was also a builaroud of some sort.
You are way too heavy on guild cards and bad lands/artifacts, and way too light on boring role-filling 1- and 2-drops. By forcing heavy hybrids, you're shoehorning yourself into running bad cards. Some guilds just don't have good hybrids available.
I would cut guilds down to 2 cards apiece as a start, and literally triple the number of role-filling aggressive creatures in each color.
Basically, you're running a lot of cards that nobody will ever want to draft, and that's fine - bad card cubes are a thing. But you're also running the most broken cards in peasant. So what that means is that drafting and deckbuilding, I'm not going to make any decisions, I'm just going to pick the only non-embarrassing card each pack and hope a deck comes together.
Neglecting the early parts of the curve is a classic rookie mistake, but more or less I would agree with the above. I wouldn't say everything he suggested is a staple, but the point is valid.
Building a cube is like this amazing creative process.. you really do have this huge brainstorm at the start and you want to put in all these things and then you realise you don't have space or the card wasn't as good as you thought it was and you pick away at your original vision until you find something that still resembles it but it is much leaner and streamlined.
I am particularly orderly in my thinking so breaking out of cycles is super hard for me and I couldn't do it fully. But it can also help me set up strong archetypes and makes me keep strong grip on my vision without losing goodstuff completely.
Okay first you have a base idea about what your cube is "Blink Cube". That is the starting point, Step 1. Now we continue the brainstorm. How does each colour blink? what are the key blink cards in those colours.
Green has creatures that can repeatedly return other creaures to your hand and some amount of grave return including soulshift.
Step 2 complete collecting types of cards you want to have in the cube. A lot of these are bad. Next up you want to stitch these cards together to make the archetypes.
Example ideas.
Blue-white = flicker (easy).
White- black = well you can have Spirits, Sacrifice Tokens deck or part of the reanimator deck.s
White- Red = Aggro Tokens
White- Green = Strong ETBs hand return and recast.
Blue - Black = Reanimator
Blue - Red = Perhaps this is your evasive ninjitsu aggro dash deck.
Blue - Green = Strong ETBs with hand return e.g Species Gorger Or you can use +1/+1 counters and the evolve mechanic.
Black - Red = Dash and Unearth.
Black - Green = Reanimator and recursion
Red - Green = Hand return, Dash and Undying
Step 3 Then you need to find the cards that support these things, this is where some of the good stuff will creep in. Make sure to only use the best cards as your support cards here. However, cards that support multiple archetypes are critical, e.g Impact Tremors works with a lot of things here even if it is lower in power level. So for white creatures that make tokens ETB can be very strong. For blue cards that draw or filter etb but at also evasive can help. For black cards that require or use Sacrifice are useful as are ones that make tokens for sacrifice or both Rakshasa gravecaller. For red you can use evasion (meance) or raid triggers. If you are using dash or unearth recent cards like Bloodrage brawler and burning-fist minotaur can really help with hand overfill issues. The green cards can make multiple creatures or early ramp creatures that become good targets to return for your undercosted beaters. Cards that get -1/-1 counters wall of roots, devoted druid that you can reset. And obviously eternal witness and the like.
Step 4. Goodstuff.. removal, card draw, counters, Burn etc. You will need these. I know it is last in my list but I think when first building it should be last on the list but as you play, use and update the list these cards will start to feature more and more and you will add more and more. But they are less fun when you first start.
My cube as an example (because we all like showing off our cubes) keep in mind I am modern only because it can be hard for me to get older cards.
You are way too heavy on guild cards and bad lands/artifacts, and way too light on boring role-filling 1- and 2-drops. By forcing heavy hybrids, you're shoehorning yourself into running bad cards. Some guilds just don't have good hybrids available.
I would cut guilds down to 2 cards apiece as a start, and literally triple the number of role-filling aggressive creatures in each color.
Basically, you're running a lot of cards that nobody will ever want to draft, and that's fine - bad card cubes are a thing. But you're also running the most broken cards in peasant. So what that means is that drafting and deckbuilding, I'm not going to make any decisions, I'm just going to pick the only non-embarrassing card each pack and hope a deck comes together.
Neglecting the early parts of the curve is a classic rookie mistake, but more or less I would agree with the above. I wouldn't say everything he suggested is a staple, but the point is valid.
The playtest feature on cubetutor has proven invaluable this week because it allows me to quickly run through a bunch of drafts and evaluate which cards I never like seeing in a pack. I've already got a cut list of 34 cards based on that.
Regarding the hybrid cards - absolutely, some color combos are crap, while others are amazing. How do you guys balance this? Do you run the good stuff only and just not care if it throws off color balance? Or do you have to deprive yourself of some good stuff to maintain balance without making compromises to include bad stuff?
Also, let me ask - does your card evaluation change at all when you realize about half the games we play off this cube are multiplayer? Things like Carnophage and Jackal Pup may be aggressive in a race, but they seem really bad in multiplayer. You take damage, Player B might take damage, and Players C and D sit there laughing as you do their job for them (killing yourself).
I like powerful cards, but pure aggro bores me. I'm a combo-control player who mostly plays Commander - I play more for interaction and fun than to see how quickly we can get the game over. That's probably why there is such a disparity in power level of my best and worst cards. I need to find a balance and better options, which is why I'm asking for help.
Building a cube is like this amazing creative process.. you really do have this huge brainstorm at the start and you want to put in all these things and then you realise you don't have space or the card wasn't as good as you thought it was and you pick away at your original vision until you find something that still resembles it but it is much leaner and streamlined.
I am particularly orderly in my thinking so breaking out of cycles is super hard for me and I couldn't do it fully. But it can also help me set up strong archetypes and makes me keep strong grip on my vision without losing goodstuff completely.
Okay first you have a base idea about what your cube is "Blink Cube". That is the starting point, Step 1. Now we continue the brainstorm. How does each colour blink? what are the key blink cards in those colours.
Green has creatures that can repeatedly return other creaures to your hand and some amount of grave return including soulshift.
Step 2 complete collecting types of cards you want to have in the cube. A lot of these are bad. Next up you want to stitch these cards together to make the archetypes.
Example ideas.
Blue-white = flicker (easy).
White- black = well you can have Spirits, Sacrifice Tokens deck or part of the reanimator deck.s
White- Red = Aggro Tokens
White- Green = Strong ETBs hand return and recast.
Blue - Black = Reanimator
Blue - Red = Perhaps this is your evasive ninjitsu aggro dash deck.
Blue - Green = Strong ETBs with hand return e.g Species Gorger Or you can use +1/+1 counters and the evolve mechanic.
Black - Red = Dash and Unearth.
Black - Green = Reanimator and recursion
Red - Green = Hand return, Dash and Undying
Step 3 Then you need to find the cards that support these things, this is where some of the good stuff will creep in. Make sure to only use the best cards as your support cards here. However, cards that support multiple archetypes are critical, e.g Impact Tremors works with a lot of things here even if it is lower in power level. So for white creatures that make tokens ETB can be very strong. For blue cards that draw or filter etb but at also evasive can help. For black cards that require or use Sacrifice are useful as are ones that make tokens for sacrifice or both Rakshasa gravecaller. For red you can use evasion (meance) or raid triggers. If you are using dash or unearth recent cards like Bloodrage brawler and burning-fist minotaur can really help with hand overfill issues. The green cards can make multiple creatures or early ramp creatures that become good targets to return for your undercosted beaters. Cards that get -1/-1 counters wall of roots, devoted druid that you can reset. And obviously eternal witness and the like.
Step 4. Goodstuff.. removal, card draw, counters, Burn etc. You will need these. I know it is last in my list but I think when first building it should be last on the list but as you play, use and update the list these cards will start to feature more and more and you will add more and more. But they are less fun when you first start.
My cube as an example (because we all like showing off our cubes) keep in mind I am modern only because it can be hard for me to get older cards.
Thanks for going through all that. I think I really need to focus on each of my desired archetypes, follow that process, and look for overlaps wherever possible. I'll definitely be checking out other people's cubes and playtesting them for ideas, too.
Also, let me ask - does your card evaluation change at all when you realize about half the games we play off this cube are multiplayer? Things like Carnophage and Jackal Pup may be aggressive in a race, but they seem really bad in multiplayer. You take damage, Player B might take damage, and Players C and D sit there laughing as you do their job for them (killing yourself).
You should really decide what you're going to do and stick with it, as you're designing a cube that's played in two wildly different styles which won't work out the way you want in the long run for the reasons you spell out above. Yes, Jackal Pup and Carnophage aren't great multiplayer cards, but they are good for single player, or at least exist there to support specific single player decks.
Like, there's nothing wrong with deciding you're going to do a multiplayer only cube, and the same with one meant for dueling, but your decks and game play will lack when you choose to do one and the cards that support the other underperform.
Frankly, I would just make a 1v1 cube, and save the multiplayer stuff for constructed. Multiplayer is a slog as-is, and to add a draft to that is really unappealing. Going through an entire draft and then running into the classic multiplayer pitfalls (doing nothing because you're missing lands, doing nothing because you have nothing to do, sitting and watching a player take forever with their turn, having to play politics) is about as unappealing as a night of magic can be, IMO.
It's generally better to design for 1v1 play and use it for multiplayer experiences than it is to design for multiplayer and draft it for 1v1. For as much as Carnophage and Jackal Pup don't work in multiplayer, the same can be said for a number of multiplayer cards being used in 1v1, except with the added bonus of no fast deck to police the slow decks. And even if you don't like aggro, it's kinda necessary unless you want all your 1v1 games to be predictable i.e. every time you're going into the late game.
Also, let me ask - does your card evaluation change at all when you realize about half the games we play off this cube are multiplayer? Things like Carnophage and Jackal Pup may be aggressive in a race, but they seem really bad in multiplayer. You take damage, Player B might take damage, and Players C and D sit there laughing as you do their job for them (killing yourself).
Frankly, I would just make a 1v1 cube, and save the multiplayer stuff for constructed. Multiplayer is a slog as-is, and to add a draft to that is really unappealing. Going through an entire draft and then running into the classic multiplayer pitfalls (doing nothing because you're missing lands, doing nothing because you have nothing to do, sitting and watching a player take forever with their turn, having to play politics) is about as unappealing as a night of magic can be, IMO.
We enjoy multiplayer and the accompanying politics. It's definitely going to be played that way, so I need to keep it in mind when selecting cards. That doesn't mean I can't lower the curve or add more aggressive things, though. I'm more than happy to take specific card suggestions and to make changes - I've already cut some cards and am just waiting to figure out and acquire replacements before cutting a bunch more.
If you are planning to always draft multiplayer, then go for it. If you are planning to sometimes draft for duel-play, then I'd consider having an expansion/replacement/whatever, so you could take out all the cards that are meaningless in one-on-one and perhaps replace them with more appropriate cards. If you play with sleeves, you could put a mark on the front side of all the multiplayer-specific cards for example, to make it easier to identify them and swap them out.
I hadn't looked into the conspiracy draft cards before, but now that you mention it, those might be fun. Cogwork Librarian, Agent of Acquisitions, and Leovold's Operative play around with drafting in a way that I like. Regicide and Garbage Fire look like good cards, but I'm curious if they're worth the extra complexity/memory issues (never played with them before). Anyone have personal experience for better or worse?
I've done a single multiplayer CN2 draft, and things worked out fine. Just bring pen and paper.
EDIT: Garbage fire is perhaps "more worth it" than Regicide. Regicide is always doing the same thing, and in cube you cant get multiples, so it is much more replaceable by a general Terror-effect. Garbage Fire is much more unique in that its value increases as the draft progresses.
On CubeTutor
On Salvation
This cube is sometimes played with my kids (played a bunch of Star Realms with them and decided they were ready for drafting) and sometimes with friends. We also mix it up between playing duels and multiplayer.
A few notes on card selection:
- All five colors use and abuse ETB effects.
- Each individual color has 2-3 specific archetypes, but not all of the guilds are well-defined yet.
White - Blink, Lifegain, Removal
Blue - Blink, Spellslinger, Draw
Black - Removal, Recursion, Lifedrain
Red - Spellslinger, Burn
Green - Creatures, Pump, Ramp
I think my biggest problem right now is in the multi-color section, particularly the hybrid cards. Initially, they were all hybrid, but after a few drafts, I added two gold cards per guild, and I'm considering adding a third. I also originally had full cycles (like all the guildmages), but I've been trimming some of those. Some guilds have tons of cards I want to run, and some I struggle to find ones that interest me. And even with this, it's hard to categorize some cards, as they may be hybrid with a gold ability (Mistmeadow Witch). Can I get some help with the multi-color?
Azorius - Blink
1 Deputy of Acquittals
1 Reflector Mage
HYBRID:
1 Azorius Guildmage
1 Judge's Familiar
1 Mistmeadow Witch
1 Somnomancer
1 Turn to Mist
1 Migratory Route
1 Lyev Skyknight
Boros
1 Boros Charm
1 Lightning Helix
1 Boros Guildmage
1 Duergar Hedge-Mage
1 Spitemare
1 Honored Crop-Captain
1 Renegade Wheelsmith
Dimir
1 Baleful Strix
1 Countersquall
1 Dimir Guildmage
1 Inkfathom Infiltrator
1 Lurking Informant
Golgari
1 Golgari Germination
1 Necrogenesis
1 Golgari Guildmage
1 Hag Hedge-Mage
1 Quillspike
1 Putrefy
1 Baloth Null
Gruul
1 Bloodbraid Elf
1 Zhur-Taa Druid
HYBRID:
1 Firespout
1 Giantbaiting
1 Manamorphose
1 Tattermunge Witch
1 Wild Cantor
1 Burning-Tree Emissary
1 Gor-Clan Rampager
1 Gruul War Chant
Izzet - Spellslinger
1 Bloodwater Entity
1 Izzet Charm
HYBRID:
1 Blistercoil Weird
1 Izzet Guildmage
1 Noggle Hedge-Mage
1 Turn//Burn
CONSIDERING:
1 Electrolyze
1 Gelectrode
1 Nivix Cyclops
1 Stormchaser Mage
Orzhov
1 Cartel Aristocrat
1 Restoration Gearsmith
HYBRID:
1 Batwing Brume
1 Beckon Apparition
1 Gwyllion Hedge-Mage
1 Orzhov Guildmage
1 Unmake
1 Mortify
1 Drana's Emissary
Rakdos
1 Rakdos Charm
1 Terminate
1 Murderous Redcap
1 Rakdos Cackler
1 Rakdos Guildmage
1 Torrent of Souls
1 Claim//Fame
1 Blightning
Selesnya
1 Juniper Order Range
1 Selesnya Charm
HYBRID:
1 Dryad Militant
1 Elvish Hexhunter
1 Seedcradle Witch
1 Selesnya Guildmage
1 Sundering Growth
1 Appeal//Authority
CONSIDERING:
1 Kitchen Finks $$$
Simic
1 Coiling Oracle
1 Horizon Chimera
1 Selkie Hedge-Mage
1 Shielding Plax
1 Snakeform
1 Trygon Predator
2023 Average Peasant Cube|and Discussion
Because I have more decks than fit in a signature
Useful Resources:
MTGSalvation tags
EDHREC
ManabaseCrafter
Pretend cycles arent a thing. Except for functionally identical lands, completing cycles doesn't offer anything (and an argument can be made for unbalanced mana sources as well)
It's also disingenuous to label mistmeadow witch as hybrid since it can't be played in one color.
My CubeCobra (draft 20 card packs, 2 packs.)
430, Peasant, Very Unpowered
Why you should take your hybrids out of your gold section
Manamath Article
First things first...
You really need to set up your cube on cubetutor.com
This will present your cube in a clean cut and organized fashion.. which in turn makes it much easier for us to visualize it.
Do that, then post the link in the thread!
My Peasant Cube thread !!! (380 cards)
Draft my Peasant Cube on Cube Cobra !!!
Cubetutor is great, and we've all become spoiled and only want to read things in that format lol.
We will be glad to help you though
My CubeCobra (draft 20 card packs, 2 packs.)
430, Peasant, Very Unpowered
Why you should take your hybrids out of your gold section
Manamath Article
2023 Average Peasant Cube|and Discussion
Because I have more decks than fit in a signature
Useful Resources:
MTGSalvation tags
EDHREC
ManabaseCrafter
I was just playing around on their interface, and I can see why you guys like it. After drafting a deck, is there a way to goldfish it?
As I stated in the OP, I'm looking for help with the multi-color section. Both what to add, and what to cut (because I'd like to stay at or under 400 cards).
At this point, I'm fairly certain I want to add a third gold card per guild, as the existing gold cards have been great.
Here are my main considerations:
Azorius: Migratory Route, Lyev Skyknight
Boros: Honored Crop-Captain, Renegade Wheelsmith
Dimir: ?
Golgari: Putrefy, Baloth Null
Gruul: Ghor-Clan Rampager
Izzet: Electrolyze, Gelectrode, Nivix Cyclops, Stormchaser Mage
Orzhov: Mortify, Drana's Emissary
Rakdos: Blightning, Spontaneous Combustion, Blazing Specter
Selesnya: ?
Simic: Trygon Predator
2023 Average Peasant Cube|and Discussion
Because I have more decks than fit in a signature
Useful Resources:
MTGSalvation tags
EDHREC
ManabaseCrafter
2023 Average Peasant Cube|and Discussion
Because I have more decks than fit in a signature
Useful Resources:
MTGSalvation tags
EDHREC
ManabaseCrafter
An exception to this would be if the interesting card was also a builaroud of some sort.
My CubeCobra (draft 20 card packs, 2 packs.)
430, Peasant, Very Unpowered
Why you should take your hybrids out of your gold section
Manamath Article
I would cut guilds down to 2 cards apiece as a start, and literally triple the number of role-filling aggressive creatures in each color.
Then I would go through and make sure your cards are worth playing. Nobody wants to play a Mistmeadow Skulk, Lunar Force, Deathgreeter, Vampire Cutthroat, Sage of Epityr, Blood Seeker, Disciple of Griselbrand, Unhallowed Pact, etc. when Man-o'War, Cloudgoat Ranger, Shriekmaw, Ridgescale Tusker, Flametongue Kavu, Sprout Swarm, Curse of Predation, Curse of Shallow Graves, Gradted Wargear, Skullclamp, Pelakka Wurm, Greatoak Ancient, etc. are in the list.
Basically, you're running a lot of cards that nobody will ever want to draft, and that's fine - bad card cubes are a thing. But you're also running the most broken cards in peasant. So what that means is that drafting and deckbuilding, I'm not going to make any decisions, I'm just going to pick the only non-embarrassing card each pack and hope a deck comes together.
I strongly encouge gutting the guild and artifact sections ans ramping up on simple effective role-filling monocolored cards like Carnophage, Diregraf Ghoul, Elite Vanguard, Youthful Knight, Stormfront Pegasus, Borderland Marauder, Dauthi Horror, Dauthi Marauder, Elvish Mystic, Jackal Pup and aggressive staples like Stonewright, Fenzied Goblin, Lightning Berserker, Ahn-Crop Crasher. Run that for a while, assess whether different cards actually do anything (looking at the Kamigawa self-bounce creatures), and make cuts appropriately. After that, start looking at a third and *maybe* fourth guild card that would support the decks you see in each color combo.
My CubeCobra (draft 20 card packs, 2 packs.)
430, Peasant, Very Unpowered
Why you should take your hybrids out of your gold section
Manamath Article
I am particularly orderly in my thinking so breaking out of cycles is super hard for me and I couldn't do it fully. But it can also help me set up strong archetypes and makes me keep strong grip on my vision without losing goodstuff completely.
Okay first you have a base idea about what your cube is "Blink Cube". That is the starting point, Step 1. Now we continue the brainstorm. How does each colour blink? what are the key blink cards in those colours.
1 Kor skyfisher
1 Whitemane lion
1 momentary blink
1 Stonecloaker
1 Flickerwhisp
1 Flicker
1 Aerobactic maneuver
White flickers directly.
1 Quickling
1 Familiar's ruse
1 Ghostly flicker
1 Ninja of the deep hours
Blue can flicker directly or use ability liks ninjitsu which requires evasion.
1 Dread return
1 Reanimate
1 Animate dead
1 Exhume
1 Unburial rites
1 Gravedigger
Black "flickers" by killing things and reanimating them over and over. Or returning to hand.
1 Vithian stinger
1 Hellspark elemental
1 Pyreheart wolf
1 Viashino Sandstalker
1 Yuki-Onna
1 Devour in Flames
1 Glitterfang
1 Grinning Ignus
1 Oni of Wild Places
Oh boy that was a struggle. Red doesn't flicker well. But.. It can unearth, undie, and dash. These mechanics can be very similliar in behaviour.
1 Invasive Species
1 Masked Admirers
1 Roaring Primadox
1 Stampeding Wildebeests
1 Temur Sabertooth
Green has creatures that can repeatedly return other creaures to your hand and some amount of grave return including soulshift.
Step 2 complete collecting types of cards you want to have in the cube. A lot of these are bad. Next up you want to stitch these cards together to make the archetypes.
Example ideas.
Blue-white = flicker (easy).
White- black = well you can have Spirits, Sacrifice Tokens deck or part of the reanimator deck.s
White- Red = Aggro Tokens
White- Green = Strong ETBs hand return and recast.
Blue - Black = Reanimator
Blue - Red = Perhaps this is your evasive ninjitsu aggro dash deck.
Blue - Green = Strong ETBs with hand return e.g Species Gorger Or you can use +1/+1 counters and the evolve mechanic.
Black - Red = Dash and Unearth.
Black - Green = Reanimator and recursion
Red - Green = Hand return, Dash and Undying
Step 3 Then you need to find the cards that support these things, this is where some of the good stuff will creep in. Make sure to only use the best cards as your support cards here. However, cards that support multiple archetypes are critical, e.g Impact Tremors works with a lot of things here even if it is lower in power level. So for white creatures that make tokens ETB can be very strong. For blue cards that draw or filter etb but at also evasive can help. For black cards that require or use Sacrifice are useful as are ones that make tokens for sacrifice or both Rakshasa gravecaller. For red you can use evasion (meance) or raid triggers. If you are using dash or unearth recent cards like Bloodrage brawler and burning-fist minotaur can really help with hand overfill issues. The green cards can make multiple creatures or early ramp creatures that become good targets to return for your undercosted beaters. Cards that get -1/-1 counters wall of roots, devoted druid that you can reset. And obviously eternal witness and the like.
Step 4. Goodstuff.. removal, card draw, counters, Burn etc. You will need these. I know it is last in my list but I think when first building it should be last on the list but as you play, use and update the list these cards will start to feature more and more and you will add more and more. But they are less fun when you first start.
My cube as an example (because we all like showing off our cubes) keep in mind I am modern only because it can be hard for me to get older cards.
Pioneer:UR Pheonix
Modern:U Mono U Tron
EDH
GB Glissa, the traitor: Army of Cans
UW Dragonlord Ojutai: Dragonlord NOjutai
UWGDerevi, Empyrial Tactician "you cannot fight the storm"
R Zirilan of the claw. The solution to every problem is dragons
UB Etrata, the Silencer Cloning assassination
Peasant cube: Cards I own
Regarding the hybrid cards - absolutely, some color combos are crap, while others are amazing. How do you guys balance this? Do you run the good stuff only and just not care if it throws off color balance? Or do you have to deprive yourself of some good stuff to maintain balance without making compromises to include bad stuff?
Also, let me ask - does your card evaluation change at all when you realize about half the games we play off this cube are multiplayer? Things like Carnophage and Jackal Pup may be aggressive in a race, but they seem really bad in multiplayer. You take damage, Player B might take damage, and Players C and D sit there laughing as you do their job for them (killing yourself).
I like powerful cards, but pure aggro bores me. I'm a combo-control player who mostly plays Commander - I play more for interaction and fun than to see how quickly we can get the game over. That's probably why there is such a disparity in power level of my best and worst cards. I need to find a balance and better options, which is why I'm asking for help.Sounds like building every Commander deck ever.Thanks for going through all that. I think I really need to focus on each of my desired archetypes, follow that process, and look for overlaps wherever possible. I'll definitely be checking out other people's cubes and playtesting them for ideas, too.
2023 Average Peasant Cube|and Discussion
Because I have more decks than fit in a signature
Useful Resources:
MTGSalvation tags
EDHREC
ManabaseCrafter
You should really decide what you're going to do and stick with it, as you're designing a cube that's played in two wildly different styles which won't work out the way you want in the long run for the reasons you spell out above. Yes, Jackal Pup and Carnophage aren't great multiplayer cards, but they are good for single player, or at least exist there to support specific single player decks.
Like, there's nothing wrong with deciding you're going to do a multiplayer only cube, and the same with one meant for dueling, but your decks and game play will lack when you choose to do one and the cards that support the other underperform.
Frankly, I would just make a 1v1 cube, and save the multiplayer stuff for constructed. Multiplayer is a slog as-is, and to add a draft to that is really unappealing. Going through an entire draft and then running into the classic multiplayer pitfalls (doing nothing because you're missing lands, doing nothing because you have nothing to do, sitting and watching a player take forever with their turn, having to play politics) is about as unappealing as a night of magic can be, IMO.
It's generally better to design for 1v1 play and use it for multiplayer experiences than it is to design for multiplayer and draft it for 1v1. For as much as Carnophage and Jackal Pup don't work in multiplayer, the same can be said for a number of multiplayer cards being used in 1v1, except with the added bonus of no fast deck to police the slow decks. And even if you don't like aggro, it's kinda necessary unless you want all your 1v1 games to be predictable i.e. every time you're going into the late game.
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2023 Average Peasant Cube|and Discussion
Because I have more decks than fit in a signature
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If it fits your draft format I'd also look into some of the cards from Conspiracy 1 and 2, such as Regicide, Cogwork Librarian, Garbage Fire etc.
Cubetutor Peasant'ish-Funbox
Project: Khans of Tarkir Cube (cubetutor)
2023 Average Peasant Cube|and Discussion
Because I have more decks than fit in a signature
Useful Resources:
MTGSalvation tags
EDHREC
ManabaseCrafter
EDIT: Garbage fire is perhaps "more worth it" than Regicide. Regicide is always doing the same thing, and in cube you cant get multiples, so it is much more replaceable by a general Terror-effect. Garbage Fire is much more unique in that its value increases as the draft progresses.
Cubetutor Peasant'ish-Funbox
Project: Khans of Tarkir Cube (cubetutor)