Not unless there is suddenly a new way to actually have dragons on the field. Most dragons or dragon producers in standard are not playable so he will not be playable.
RBDW
Dunno once you play Sarkhan you can sac a hellspark elemental for 3 damage and get a 5/5 dragon. Rinse and repeat?
Thing is by 5 lands your opponent should almost be dead
Finding it hard to find a spot for him
Not really. His first ability is pretty terrible. His last ability is only relevant if you hae dragons already, since you won't be able to use it after using his second ability more than once. So that leaves the ability to morph stuff into dragons. A lot of people have already mentioned how good it is on Thrinax, and it is pretty good on Thrinax. Also any other weenie that your preferred version version of Jund happens to be running. But that's about it. And given that Jund is already very short of spare slots, I don't see anyone wanting it, especially when Bit Blast exists for the same cost. As to non-Jund decks, well...which ones? Grixis can't use it much, except in desperation to kill an opponent's fatty.
No, I think this Sarkhan is just cute, not relevant.
Not unless there is suddenly a new way to actually have dragons on the field. Most dragons or dragon producers in standard are not playable so he will not be playable.
Thats the way I felt as well when I saw it. I mean seriously all the dragons currently available just do not seem super playable for the costs. I mean Dragon Master Outcast maybe if you can keep him on the field, possibly a broodmate, but it will be tough to play a constructed deck around them.
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Not that the colors necessarily line up, but Sarkhan's ultimate is actually pretty good with changeling creatures like Chameleon Collosus and Taurean Mauler.
He might see play in constructed as an interruptable 10 damage burn spell for 5 and "sac a creature", which is actually a litle better than it sounds. But I agree in general that he's not worth the investment.
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RBDW
Dunno once you play Sarkhan you can sac a hellspark elemental for 3 damage and get a 5/5 dragon. Rinse and repeat?
Thing is by 5 lands your opponent should almost be dead
Finding it hard to find a spot for him
I don't know why people are saying the 1st ability is terrible, it's his best ability, the fact that a RB card card draws you 3 or so cards(on average without manipulation) is strong, although until the insane card advantage which is Junds cascade engine rotates it probably won't be realised.
I can't see him seeing crazy amounts of play but there are a few decent options for him in standard.
Option 1- cheap fast red/black aggro deck, use lots of cheap costed creatures, burn etc. and then cast Sarkhan who will give you a decent amount of card draw and/or turn your weenies into giant dragons. You can also run Dragonmaster Outcast in this type of deck for a shot at actually getting value from his 3rd ability.
Option 2- Grixis deck using Halimar Depths and Jace, the Mindsculptor in order to make his draw hit lands(and thus be painless) as well as using Into the Roil and/or Grixis Charm to return it to hand when it's counters get too low. This is probably the best shot at getting good value out of him.
Option 3- run it as a 1-2 of in a normal deck like Jund or RB vampires using it just to draw the 3 or so cards and possibly turning your creatures into dragons(particularly nice with Sprouting Thrinax) or your opponents(baneslayer, Iona and Eldrazi get worse as 5/5 red dragons). This is possible but the competition is too steep.
Extra- For the fun of it it's nice to play this together with Mirror Entity who can turn all your creatures into big changelings(dragons) and then you can get max usage out of the -4 ability.
Yeah its 7 lands to do the hellspark sac into dragon thing.
What I meant with by 5 lands normally a RDW pilot should have his opponent down to almost no health.
So clearly I am pointing out that doing the hellspark + sac thing is slow play considering the elements of a RDW
WotC may want us to move away from the staple Jund format... so they want us to play ...
Jund Ramp! (so susceptible to removal though)
T1: Forest + BoP or any 1drop Elf
T2: Rootbound + Explore + Rampant or Explore
T3: (Land untap) + Oracle + (Land untap) + Dragonmaster Outcast
T4: If 6 lands = Dragon + Sarkhan (-2 for dragon on elf) + play lands
T5: swing for 10 + (-4 Sarkhan) + another 10
========> Opponent in response /facepalm
or Smile + Kill dragons = GG
I don't know why people are saying the 1st ability is terrible, it's his best ability, the fact that a RB card card draws you 3 or so cards(on average without manipulation) is strong
No it's not. Not for five mana over three turns. That's not very strong at all. Is Honden of Seeing Winds constructed viable? And Sign in Blood exists...
Don't forget about the original Sarkhan Vol. Get it to ultimate and then cast Sarkhan the Mad, instant win, as early as turn 5. This is also possible with two original Sarkans, but now we can have 7 more chances to pull of the combo.
Two Sarkhan's on the board annihilate each other... read the rules about planeswalkers.
Right, but when you -6 on the original Sarkhan he kinda fizzles, allowing u to cast the 2nd one and ult in the same turn
Holy crap with ramp this is possible, nice find
T1: Forest + BoP or Elf
T2: Multicoloured Land + Harrow or Explore or Rampant + another mana donk
T3: Sarkhan 1.0 + haste on mana donk + mana ramp (not necessary) + Land
T4: Sarkhan 1.0 + haste on w/e blah blah + Land
T5: Sarkhan 1.0 -6 (leaves play) + Sarkhan 2.0 -4 O.o
Right, but when you -6 on the original Sarkhan he kinda fizzles, allowing u to cast the 2nd one and ult in the same turn
Holy crap with ramp this is possible, nice find
T1: Forest + BoP or Elf
T2: Multicoloured Land + Harrow or Explore or Rampant + another mana donk
T3: Sarkhan 1.0 + haste on mana donk + mana ramp (not necessary) + Land
T4: Sarkhan 1.0 + haste on w/e blah blah + Land
T5: Sarkhan 1.0 -6 (leaves play) + Sarkhan 2.0 -4 O.o
Yeah, I actually mentioned it quite awhile ago back in the thread that announced him being spoiled in the rumor mill. Thing is, it's still rather difficult. Not bad for a strange sort of Jund build that doesn't run a ton of creatures though. Perhaps some new sort of Jund control?
No it's not. Not for five mana over three turns. That's not very strong at all. Is Honden of Seeing Winds constructed viable? And Sign in Blood exists...
Don't compare blue cards with black/red cards blues card drawing has historically been much more potent than Black and red's card draw is next to non existent. Also to be fair the Honden actually saw a limited amount of play as a 1-2 of in some MUC decks while it was in standard(despite there being Thirst for Knowledge or Compulsive Research and Jushi Apprentice in the format). And yes Sign in Blood exists, but 1 shots are almost never as good as repeatable effects. Sign and Night's Whisper are both in extended but Dark Confident(even though it almost always gets killed straight away) and Phyrexian Arena have always been the ones to see play(although the arena isn't so good in the current hyper fast extended and has lost favour). Not to mention the fact that Sarkhan does things other than drawing if you need/want it too(including the very nice combination with Bloodghast).
Repeatable card draw effects are good, for example Aeon Chronicler would usually cost you at least 7U to suspend and would draw you 1 card a turn and the card a turn was as much the reason for playing it as the fact it would give you a creature(in fact if you had the mana you'd be happy to suspend it for more because the card a turn is more important than it ever coming into play).
I'm not saying he's great i'm just saying that he's not complete jank and that the first ability is by far his best ability since repeatable card draw is good and black/red doesn't get a lot of card draw.
I think he has potential, but I think he won't really shine until post rotation. If you ever want the ultimate to go off there's no way he will hit play turn 5. I think he's true turn will be 6-7 after a turn 5-6 Hellkite Charger. My guess with the 0 ability is that wizards wanted players to team it with either Jace (like that needs to go up in price anymore) or Halimar Depths. The abilities aren't bad, but I really think wizards screwed the pooch not giving it a + ability of some kind. Just like how they did with Level Up.
Don't forget about the original Sarkhan Vol. Get it to ultimate and then cast Sarkhan the Mad, instant win, as early as turn 5. This is also possible with two original Sarkans, but now we can have 7 more chances to pull of the combo.
First: No, he isnt viable. He does nothing by himself, Broodmate Dragon is way better.
He's a bit fun with Thrinax.
Otherwise, 3BR sac a cretaure for a Dragon, then 5 damage, then draw a card isn't the worst card in the world, which is what I thought of him initially.
I like the Sarkhan + Bloodghast plan.
Also, if you run him, you run 4 of him so that as soon as you use him up you can lay another one down. Suppose some kind of BR slowdeck shows up (Just go with me); your first Sarkhan makes your dudes into dragons until he dies, then your next one drops and -4s the field.
P.S. - People have been complaining about not getting to use their PW's ultimates for a while now, but when WOTC gives us one that you can use right off the bat people complain again. >_< I'm excited to use him (More excited for Gideon though).
I think Sarkhan can be very good in a B deck with a R splash using Bloodghast to get continuous damage in and Abyssal Persecutor to bring the pain and have Sarkhan sac it when ready.
For the Jund Problem just have a big burn sb and you should be good.
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Sarkhan Vol was just spoiled, and being the most awkward planeswalker ever, I just wanted to see if anyone thinks he could be constructed viable?
We all know he can be a limited bomb from sacrificing a eldrazi token or forcing your opponent to sacrifice their eldrazi.
However, constructed?
I think it's safe to say he will only be good in standard due to the higher cost, do you think it has a place in Jund? Or any other type of deck?
Dunno once you play Sarkhan you can sac a hellspark elemental for 3 damage and get a 5/5 dragon. Rinse and repeat?
Thing is by 5 lands your opponent should almost be dead
Finding it hard to find a spot for him
Thanks to Damnation Studios's Neongoyf and SGT_Chubbz
Currently Playing:
URRuneflare M11URUWUW Permission ControlUWURRuneflareUR 12-5-2 (02/05/10)UWRSuper FriendsUWRUWUW Conscriptrol 9-2-2UWNo, I think this Sarkhan is just cute, not relevant.
Thats the way I felt as well when I saw it. I mean seriously all the dragons currently available just do not seem super playable for the costs. I mean Dragon Master Outcast maybe if you can keep him on the field, possibly a broodmate, but it will be tough to play a constructed deck around them.
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He might see play in constructed as an interruptable 10 damage burn spell for 5 and "sac a creature", which is actually a litle better than it sounds. But I agree in general that he's not worth the investment.
If your answer is "No," then your morality does not come from God's commandments.
If your answer is "Yes," then please, please reconsider.
its actually 7 if you did it on the same turn
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Umm... Karrthus, Tyrant of Jund?
"Make your creature a 5/5 flying Dragon, now permanently gain control of it and attack you with haste."
Yeah, seems kind of unlikely, but potentially hilarious. I think the new Sarkhan is crappy though.
I can't see him seeing crazy amounts of play but there are a few decent options for him in standard.
Option 1- cheap fast red/black aggro deck, use lots of cheap costed creatures, burn etc. and then cast Sarkhan who will give you a decent amount of card draw and/or turn your weenies into giant dragons. You can also run Dragonmaster Outcast in this type of deck for a shot at actually getting value from his 3rd ability.
Option 2- Grixis deck using Halimar Depths and Jace, the Mindsculptor in order to make his draw hit lands(and thus be painless) as well as using Into the Roil and/or Grixis Charm to return it to hand when it's counters get too low. This is probably the best shot at getting good value out of him.
Option 3- run it as a 1-2 of in a normal deck like Jund or RB vampires using it just to draw the 3 or so cards and possibly turning your creatures into dragons(particularly nice with Sprouting Thrinax) or your opponents(baneslayer, Iona and Eldrazi get worse as 5/5 red dragons). This is possible but the competition is too steep.
Extra- For the fun of it it's nice to play this together with Mirror Entity who can turn all your creatures into big changelings(dragons) and then you can get max usage out of the -4 ability.
Machius proudly supports R_E's right to Rumour!
Yeah its 7 lands to do the hellspark sac into dragon thing.
What I meant with by 5 lands normally a RDW pilot should have his opponent down to almost no health.
So clearly I am pointing out that doing the hellspark + sac thing is slow play considering the elements of a RDW
WotC may want us to move away from the staple Jund format... so they want us to play ...
Jund Ramp! (so susceptible to removal though)
T1: Forest + BoP or any 1drop Elf
T2: Rootbound + Explore + Rampant or Explore
T3: (Land untap) + Oracle + (Land untap) + Dragonmaster Outcast
T4: If 6 lands = Dragon + Sarkhan (-2 for dragon on elf) + play lands
T5: swing for 10 + (-4 Sarkhan) + another 10
========> Opponent in response /facepalm
or Smile + Kill dragons = GG
Thanks to Damnation Studios's Neongoyf and SGT_Chubbz
Currently Playing:
URRuneflare M11URUWUW Permission ControlUWURRuneflareUR 12-5-2 (02/05/10)UWRSuper FriendsUWRUWUW Conscriptrol 9-2-2UWNo it's not. Not for five mana over three turns. That's not very strong at all. Is Honden of Seeing Winds constructed viable? And Sign in Blood exists...
Right, but when you -6 on the original Sarkhan he kinda fizzles, allowing u to cast the 2nd one and ult in the same turn
Holy crap with ramp this is possible, nice find
T1: Forest + BoP or Elf
T2: Multicoloured Land + Harrow or Explore or Rampant + another mana donk
T3: Sarkhan 1.0 + haste on mana donk + mana ramp (not necessary) + Land
T4: Sarkhan 1.0 + haste on w/e blah blah + Land
T5: Sarkhan 1.0 -6 (leaves play) + Sarkhan 2.0 -4 O.o
Thanks to Damnation Studios's Neongoyf and SGT_Chubbz
Currently Playing:
URRuneflare M11URUWUW Permission ControlUWURRuneflareUR 12-5-2 (02/05/10)UWRSuper FriendsUWRUWUW Conscriptrol 9-2-2UWYeah, I actually mentioned it quite awhile ago back in the thread that announced him being spoiled in the rumor mill. Thing is, it's still rather difficult. Not bad for a strange sort of Jund build that doesn't run a ton of creatures though. Perhaps some new sort of Jund control?
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Don't compare blue cards with black/red cards blues card drawing has historically been much more potent than Black and red's card draw is next to non existent. Also to be fair the Honden actually saw a limited amount of play as a 1-2 of in some MUC decks while it was in standard(despite there being Thirst for Knowledge or Compulsive Research and Jushi Apprentice in the format). And yes Sign in Blood exists, but 1 shots are almost never as good as repeatable effects. Sign and Night's Whisper are both in extended but Dark Confident(even though it almost always gets killed straight away) and Phyrexian Arena have always been the ones to see play(although the arena isn't so good in the current hyper fast extended and has lost favour). Not to mention the fact that Sarkhan does things other than drawing if you need/want it too(including the very nice combination with Bloodghast).
Repeatable card draw effects are good, for example Aeon Chronicler would usually cost you at least 7U to suspend and would draw you 1 card a turn and the card a turn was as much the reason for playing it as the fact it would give you a creature(in fact if you had the mana you'd be happy to suspend it for more because the card a turn is more important than it ever coming into play).
I'm not saying he's great i'm just saying that he's not complete jank and that the first ability is by far his best ability since repeatable card draw is good and black/red doesn't get a lot of card draw.
Machius proudly supports R_E's right to Rumour!
lol fail
Spam infraction.
He's a bit fun with Thrinax.
Otherwise, 3BR sac a cretaure for a Dragon, then 5 damage, then draw a card isn't the worst card in the world, which is what I thought of him initially.
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22: 27.5%
23: 26.3%
24: 25.5%
25: 25.1%
26: 25.3%
He's a source of decent draw, you can feed him a thrinax and works well with broadmate.
Buuut he's still pretty janky.
EDH:
Niv-Mizzet
Legacy:
The Rack
Modern
Venser, the Sojourner Control
Also, if you run him, you run 4 of him so that as soon as you use him up you can lay another one down. Suppose some kind of BR slowdeck shows up (Just go with me); your first Sarkhan makes your dudes into dragons until he dies, then your next one drops and -4s the field.
P.S. - People have been complaining about not getting to use their PW's ultimates for a while now, but when WOTC gives us one that you can use right off the bat people complain again. >_< I'm excited to use him (More excited for Gideon though).
For the Jund Problem just have a big burn sb and you should be good.