So, I'm wanting to sleeve up a 5th commander deck for fun (and so, when I loan out decks in a four-player game, my Karn deck can sit on the bench because it destroys all my other decks with ease). My brother suggested I put my foil alt art Graveborn Crosis to good use, but I wanted to do something a bit more fun/interesting than Grixis Goodstuff, and a bit less griefer than some sort of mass bounce/discard/ thing. So, I went with...a flashback deck, featuring Catalyst Stone, Secrets of the Dead, and Burning Vengeance! Here's the list.
My fear, looking at this deck, is that it simply isn't strong enough to stand up against casual but reasonably well-tuned Kresh, Zedruu, and Mimeoplasm lists. Thoughts? Suggestions?
Yawgmoth's Will gives every one of your cards (including permanents) flashback.
Chandra Nalaar is really unimpressive in EDH. Maybe if you only used her for her -X, but then I'd just rather have a kill spell, or even better in these colors, a steal spell.
I would recommend more board wipes, as I only see two, with no tutor them up. On that note, yes, get that Increasing Ambition ASAP, I LOVE this card. People seriously underestimate it.
1) 7 power means he kills an entire turn faster.
2) As you have to pay for Crosis's ability, Crosis effectively has a 3-mana upkeep cost, so that isn't really a disadvantage.
3) Though Bolas costs 2 mana more, he can more easily use his on-hit the same turn he's cast (in conjunction with a haste outlet like Lightning Greaves, Hall of the Bandit Lord, Fervor, Anger, etc).
4) His on-hit takes out the entire hand instead of just one color. Wit's End >>> Persecute.
5) Flavor. Bolas is one of the biggest badasses in the entire Multiverse. Crosis is a bit actor in Invasion.
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1) 7 power means he kills an entire turn faster.
2) As you have to pay for Crosis's ability, Crosis effectively has a 3-mana upkeep cost, so that isn't really a disadvantage.
3) Though Bolas costs 2 mana more, he can more easily use his on-hit the same turn he's cast (in conjunction with a haste outlet like Lightning Greaves, Hall of the Bandit Lord, Fervor, Anger, etc).
4) His on-hit takes out the entire hand instead of just one color. Wit's End >>> Persecute.
5) Flavor. Bolas is one of the biggest badasses in the entire Multiverse. Crosis is a bit actor in Invasion.
Hey now, don't be badmouthing my Crosis
Because of his higher cost, Bolas doesn't really kill a turn faster by general damage - Lightning Greaves has the same effect for Crosis. His ability is better from a statistical standpoint, but it also makes him a very large (and expensive) target since no one will want to be hit by him.
The upkeep cost is a disadvantage (unless you want him to die, which can be useful in some cases, when he is stolen or Pacifism'd for example) because it is mandatory. 3 mana is a LOT, just think of all those times when you were just 1 mana from casting a critical spell. Theoretically, yeah, you will want to take advantage his ability every turn, but it is not always in your best interest to do so. Crosis doesn't have that problem. Options and versatility reign king in EDH.
My point is, one is not clear cut better than the other. Crosis comes out earlier and surgically remove colors, while Bolas come out later and wrecks hands. They are balanced, in my opinion.
Because of his higher cost, Bolas doesn't really kill a turn faster by general damage - Lightning Greaves has the same effect for Crosis.
Personally, I only ever played Bolas when I had haste, so that I could bash and use his ability immediately. To do the same with Crosis, it actually costs a total of one more mana.
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Thanks for the help folks! I'll consider Bolas over Crosis, but for now I have Crosis only so he'll have to work for a few games :).
Quick changes:
-1 Chandra Nalaar
-1 Prophetic Bolt
+1 Fact or Fiction
+1...sweeper. Probably Earthquake as I don't own Life's Finale, Black Sun's Zenith, or Damnation and my only Plague Wind is in Kresh, but I'll go through my rare box and see if I dig up something better. I am running Urborg, so maybe Mutilate would be okay? And I might have a spare Oblivion Stone laying around too...hm.
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Commander - Currently Playing: RCRDaretti: Superfriends Forever RCR WGBDoran: Ent-mootWBG GGGMultani: Group Bear HugGGG GB(B/G)The Gitrog Monster: Dredgefall DurdleGB(B/G) RGWGahiji, the Honored Group Hug MonsterRGW UB(U/B)Yuriko, Ninja Trinket AggroUB(U/B) WUBRGAtogatog: Assembling a OHKOWUBRG
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1 Crosis, the Purger
Creatures: 9
1 Nightscape Familar
1 Drift of Phantasms
1 Shadowmage Infiltrator
1 Nightscape Battlemage
1 Dimir House-guard
1 Izzet Chronarch
1 Sphinx of Jwar Isle
1 Wrexiel, the Risen Deep
1 Chancellor of the Spires
Mana Rocks: 6
1 Rakdos Signet
1 Dimir Signet
1 Izzet Signet
1 Coldsteel Heart
1 Darksteel Ingot
1 Gilded Lotus
Kill Spells: 5
1 Blasphemous Act
1 Starstorm
1 Terminate
1 Prophetic Bolt
1 Crosis' Charm
Miscellaneous Card Advantage: 10
1 Telepathy
1 Brainstorm
1 Shred Memory
1 Phyrexian Arena
1 Diabolic Tutor
1 Wash Out
1 Clutch of the Undercity
1 Seer's Vision
1 Syphon Mind
1 Exsanguinate
1 Praetor's Grasp
1 Control Magic
1 Bribery
1 Memory Plunder
1 Volition Reins
Counterspells: 4
1 Counterspell
1 Perplex
1 Hinder
1 Rewind
Secret Vengeance of the Dead: 19
1 Secrets of the Dead
1 Burning Vengeance
1 Mystic Retrieval
1 Mystical Teachings
1 Recoup
1 Silent Departure
1 Devil's Play
1 Forbidden Alchemy
1 Lightning Surge
1 Chainer's Edict
1 Sever the Bloodline
1 Army of the Damned
1 Deep Analysis
1 Rolling Temblor
1 Desperate Ravings
1 Raven's Crime
1 Syphon Life
1 Catalyst Stone
1 Runic Repetition
1 Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker
1 Chandra Nalaar
Land: 39
1 Graven Cairns
1 Rakdos Carnarium
1 Akoum Refuge
1 Sulfrous Springs
1 Bloodstained Mire
1 Izzet Boilerworks
1 Drowned Catacomb
1 Polluted Delta
1 Jwar Isle Refuge
1 Underground River
1 Crosis' Caverns
1 Terramorphic Expanse
1 Evolving Wilds
1 Rix Maadi, Dungeon Palace
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Dust Bowl
6 Swamp
13 Island
4 Mountain
I know there's a few obvious inclusions missing, so preemptively: I desperately want Call the Skybreaker, Increasing Ambition, Increasing Vengeance, Snapcaster Mage, and Sol Ring and simply don't own them currently :). The lack of Myojin of Night's Reach is intentional; I'm thoroughly unimpressed.
My fear, looking at this deck, is that it simply isn't strong enough to stand up against casual but reasonably well-tuned Kresh, Zedruu, and Mimeoplasm lists. Thoughts? Suggestions?
RCRDaretti: Superfriends Forever RCR
WGBDoran: Ent-mootWBG
GGGMultani: Group Bear HugGGG
GB(B/G)The Gitrog Monster: Dredgefall DurdleGB(B/G)
RGWGahiji, the Honored Group Hug MonsterRGW
UB(U/B)Yuriko, Ninja Trinket AggroUB(U/B)
WUBRGAtogatog: Assembling a OHKOWUBRG
Yawgmoth's Will gives every one of your cards (including permanents) flashback.
Chandra Nalaar is really unimpressive in EDH. Maybe if you only used her for her -X, but then I'd just rather have a kill spell, or even better in these colors, a steal spell.
I would recommend more board wipes, as I only see two, with no tutor them up. On that note, yes, get that Increasing Ambition ASAP, I LOVE this card. People seriously underestimate it.
Cabal Coffers.
Tuck effects (Spin into Myth and Chaos Warp) to deal with the really annoying generals that just won't go away.
Hope this helps, might have more suggestions later, but I gotta run for now.
1) 7 power means he kills an entire turn faster.
2) As you have to pay for Crosis's ability, Crosis effectively has a 3-mana upkeep cost, so that isn't really a disadvantage.
3) Though Bolas costs 2 mana more, he can more easily use his on-hit the same turn he's cast (in conjunction with a haste outlet like Lightning Greaves, Hall of the Bandit Lord, Fervor, Anger, etc).
4) His on-hit takes out the entire hand instead of just one color. Wit's End >>> Persecute.
5) Flavor. Bolas is one of the biggest badasses in the entire Multiverse. Crosis is a bit actor in Invasion.
Currently Playing:
Legacy: Something U/W Controlish
EDH Cube
Hypercube! A New EDH Deck Every Week(ish)!
-Needs more Past in Flames.
-Fact or Fiction fills the grave.
Hey now, don't be badmouthing my Crosis
Because of his higher cost, Bolas doesn't really kill a turn faster by general damage - Lightning Greaves has the same effect for Crosis. His ability is better from a statistical standpoint, but it also makes him a very large (and expensive) target since no one will want to be hit by him.
The upkeep cost is a disadvantage (unless you want him to die, which can be useful in some cases, when he is stolen or Pacifism'd for example) because it is mandatory. 3 mana is a LOT, just think of all those times when you were just 1 mana from casting a critical spell. Theoretically, yeah, you will want to take advantage his ability every turn, but it is not always in your best interest to do so. Crosis doesn't have that problem. Options and versatility reign king in EDH.
My point is, one is not clear cut better than the other. Crosis comes out earlier and surgically remove colors, while Bolas come out later and wrecks hands. They are balanced, in my opinion.
Still, Crosis for the win
Personally, I only ever played Bolas when I had haste, so that I could bash and use his ability immediately. To do the same with Crosis, it actually costs a total of one more mana.
Currently Playing:
Legacy: Something U/W Controlish
EDH Cube
Hypercube! A New EDH Deck Every Week(ish)!
Quick changes:
-1 Chandra Nalaar
-1 Prophetic Bolt
+1 Fact or Fiction
+1...sweeper. Probably Earthquake as I don't own Life's Finale, Black Sun's Zenith, or Damnation and my only Plague Wind is in Kresh, but I'll go through my rare box and see if I dig up something better. I am running Urborg, so maybe Mutilate would be okay? And I might have a spare Oblivion Stone laying around too...hm.
RCRDaretti: Superfriends Forever RCR
WGBDoran: Ent-mootWBG
GGGMultani: Group Bear HugGGG
GB(B/G)The Gitrog Monster: Dredgefall DurdleGB(B/G)
RGWGahiji, the Honored Group Hug MonsterRGW
UB(U/B)Yuriko, Ninja Trinket AggroUB(U/B)
WUBRGAtogatog: Assembling a OHKOWUBRG