Oops Oasis
Sacrifice Oops Oasis and pay 2 life.
Search your library for a Plains, Island, Swamp, Mountain, or Forest and put it onto the battlefield.
Shuffle your library.
It can't be strictly better than Fetches.
Obviously the issue with Fetches is there just aren't enough of them out there. I'm in the "The manabase should be the cheapest part of a deck" camp. I would jam this card at rare in whatever set is going to the printer ASAP. Then, preemptively ban it in Standard. Maybe give it one big standard tournament to ensure it is Modern legal. I would ban it so fast, I would tell everyone it will be banned in Standard during Preview week before you even clicked on the card to see what it is. I would also say that as soon as the Fetches are reprinted, whenever that will be, it would then be Banned in Modern, Legacy and Vintage at the next update. Then I would proceed to put it in every Pre-con and Core set until then. It would be a Judge Promo, an FNM promo and everything in between. I'd give a stack to Maro and Aaron Forsythe to hand out at GPs. Anything to get it out there.
This would certainly be tantamount to admitting a bit of a mistake. That's OK. I'd be honest with the players, "You know we plan years in advance. Who knew the player base would increase so fast? Thanks to you guys for making Magic so successful! We know what cards you need to build your decks and so here they are."
1) It probably doesn't need to be banned in standard
2) It's worse than fetches so decks still need fetches
3) You can only run 4 of these so you probably need fetches anyways
4) With there just being one of these, the demand would be super high. Even with all those printings it would probably still command a decently high price
5) It'd be really annoying to have like 15 printings of this card and then ban it in every format
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1. Without Wasteland to keep them in check they make mana too consistent
2. They introduce far too much unnecessary shuffling
3. Because the combination of Fetches and Shocks is so powerful the fetches effectively prevent other dual lands from seeing play, which reduces diversity by limiting the ways that players can construct their decks.
4. It would remove a huge barrier to entry without ruining standard with 2 years of fetches and shuffling.
Wizards should have banned them when the format was created.
No if u want to fix the fetchland problem you need to give people a reason to stay mono colour. As long as the mana fixing is so good there is almost no reason to not play more than 2 colour.
Either increase the power of staying mono colour (devotion could have done this if it was a more powerful mechanic) or give more cards that punish going more than one colour. Fetchlands are not the problem, they are just a symptom of the greater problem.
Why can't they print a GOOD land at Uncommon anymore? They used to do it before (ie Wasteland). Would it kill Wizards to have a really decent Uncommon land?
Not sure if I understand the point of this thread. Is it a price discussion? A reprint discussion? A new card discussion? Because we already have threads for all three of those things.
1. Without Wasteland to keep them in check they make mana too consistent
2. They introduce far too much unnecessary shuffling
3. Because the combination of Fetches and Shocks is so powerful the fetches effectively prevent other dual lands from seeing play, which reduces diversity by limiting the ways that players can construct their decks.
4. It would remove a huge barrier to entry without ruining standard with 2 years of fetches and shuffling.
Wizards should have banned them when the format was created.
If Fetches get banned, then UWR, Pod, Twin (RUG anyway), and Scapeshift die with it, and any hope that Esper and Grixis had of reaching the big leagues get's crushed. Every 3 color mana base completely folds to Blood Moon.
If WOTC bans fetches they may as well sign the death certificate of modern, as all the players who have invested in these decks, in what is supposed to be a stable and non-rotating format, will just quit.
Reprinting the Onslaught fetches is the most likely course of action, but reprinting Zendikar would be great too. A reprint will drop the prices (not as much as people hope though) and, assuming the reprint is in a standard set, make the lands readily available to all players.
Actual solution would be to simply bann the fetchlands, problem goes away, problem solved.
Printing any "similiar" cards doesnt solve anything, they are extremly over expensive as they are, simply because they are good and playable in "every" format they are legal, and thats never a good thing to be for "lands" and especially not if simply every deck needs them (except corner cases like affinity).
Wizards just printed common lands that are fairly good for most people, just not at a competitive level. The guild gates from Return to Ravnica. Ah fetchlands well they need to be reprinted. That's it. No need for any other stupid ideas to be thrown around. Simple answer reprint fetches. This has been talked to death. I think many people are tired of reading it.
Or yeah I also like that more decks could be mono color it's been forever since there were good mono color decks besides red. "major sigh" I'm tired of this topic. It's very obvious that all wizards wants to print these days are multicolor cards. Our newest Fall set is all wedge multicolored... After a very crummy enchantment set. I've said it before. Where is muraganda? Mono colored matters, basic lands matter, creatures with no abilities matter. You all know it will be fun! There could be sacrifice abilities on some creatures to summon larger creatures. Flip flop power levels. 10/1's 1/10's, or just 10/10's in every color for 6 mana. NO abilities. Then you could have enchantments, artifacts, and equipment to alter them. Or staying on theme for basic land matters. Fortifications on lands! It would even make sense to have riggers and contraptions! You have technology, simple goblin tech, invading a non tech world. Of dinosaurs!!!!!!!!!!! I'm so sick on these constantly multi color sets..........
Feel the need to rant?
Situation is simple. Play what you want or can afford. You don't need to drop several hundred getting a set of each fetch if you can't afford it. Just play something cheaper and build toward the deck you really want. Could take time,but oh well.
Actual solution would be to simply bann the fetchlands, problem goes away, problem solved.
Printing any "similiar" cards doesnt solve anything, they are extremly over expensive as they are, simply because they are good and playable in "every" format they are legal, and thats never a good thing to be for "lands" and especially not if simply every deck needs them (except corner cases like affinity).
Doesn't this create a pretty large 'new' problem in the format though?
I am all for cheaper fetches. I think they need to be around $25-$30 and that would be fine, but banning them would neuter so many decks in the format.
1. Without Wasteland to keep them in check they make mana too consistent
2. They introduce far too much unnecessary shuffling
3. Because the combination of Fetches and Shocks is so powerful the fetches effectively prevent other dual lands from seeing play, which reduces diversity by limiting the ways that players can construct their decks.
4. It would remove a huge barrier to entry without ruining standard with 2 years of fetches and shuffling.
Wizards should have banned them when the format was created.
If Fetches get banned, then UWR, Pod, Twin (RUG anyway), and Scapeshift die with it, and any hope that Esper and Grixis had of reaching the big leagues get's crushed. Every 3 color mana base completely folds to Blood Moon.
If WOTC bans fetches they may as well sign the death certificate of modern, as all the players who have invested in these decks, in what is supposed to be a stable and non-rotating format, will just quit.
Reprinting the Onslaught fetches is the most likely course of action, but reprinting Zendikar would be great too. A reprint will drop the prices (not as much as people hope though) and, assuming the reprint is in a standard set, make the lands readily available to all players.
Plenty of 3 color decks will be able to exist without losing to blood moon, but it is true that the format would be different. There is no reason to get that hyperbolic.
The fetches shouldn't be reprinted for standard. The shuffling is terrible and they should be kept far away.
1. Without Wasteland to keep them in check they make mana too consistent
2. They introduce far too much unnecessary shuffling
3. Because the combination of Fetches and Shocks is so powerful the fetches effectively prevent other dual lands from seeing play, which reduces diversity by limiting the ways that players can construct their decks.
4. It would remove a huge barrier to entry without ruining standard with 2 years of fetches and shuffling.
Wizards should have banned them when the format was created.
If Fetches get banned, then UWR, Pod, Twin (RUG anyway), and Scapeshift die with it, and any hope that Esper and Grixis had of reaching the big leagues get's crushed. Every 3 color mana base completely folds to Blood Moon.
If WOTC bans fetches they may as well sign the death certificate of modern, as all the players who have invested in these decks, in what is supposed to be a stable and non-rotating format, will just quit.
Reprinting the Onslaught fetches is the most likely course of action, but reprinting Zendikar would be great too. A reprint will drop the prices (not as much as people hope though) and, assuming the reprint is in a standard set, make the lands readily available to all players.
Plenty of 3 color decks will be able to exist without losing to blood moon, but it is true that the format would be different. There is no reason to get that hyperbolic.
The fetches shouldn't be reprinted for standard. The shuffling is terrible and they should be kept far away.
I really don't think I am being hyperbolic at all. If 3 color decks existed after the banning of fetch lands, which I'm sure they still would as people currently enjoy playing them, pretty much a guaranteed way to take down a GP is to just play Skred Red or Blue Moon. Without an early fetch for a basic, the game very often ends. Yes shuffling happens, but I hardly think it is a game-breaking annoyance.
1. Without Wasteland to keep them in check they make mana too consistent
2. They introduce far too much unnecessary shuffling
3. Because the combination of Fetches and Shocks is so powerful the fetches effectively prevent other dual lands from seeing play, which reduces diversity by limiting the ways that players can construct their decks.
4. It would remove a huge barrier to entry without ruining standard with 2 years of fetches and shuffling.
Wizards should have banned them when the format was created.
If Fetches get banned, then UWR, Pod, Twin (RUG anyway), and Scapeshift die with it, and any hope that Esper and Grixis had of reaching the big leagues get's crushed. Every 3 color mana base completely folds to Blood Moon.
If WOTC bans fetches they may as well sign the death certificate of modern, as all the players who have invested in these decks, in what is supposed to be a stable and non-rotating format, will just quit.
Reprinting the Onslaught fetches is the most likely course of action, but reprinting Zendikar would be great too. A reprint will drop the prices (not as much as people hope though) and, assuming the reprint is in a standard set, make the lands readily available to all players.
Plenty of 3 color decks will be able to exist without losing to blood moon, but it is true that the format would be different. There is no reason to get that hyperbolic.
The fetches shouldn't be reprinted for standard. The shuffling is terrible and they should be kept far away.
So basically you'd just want a nonfunctional format? Between banning fetches, Bolt, and Goyf Modern would have 500 person GPs.
1. Without Wasteland to keep them in check they make mana too consistent
2. They introduce far too much unnecessary shuffling
3. Because the combination of Fetches and Shocks is so powerful the fetches effectively prevent other dual lands from seeing play, which reduces diversity by limiting the ways that players can construct their decks.
4. It would remove a huge barrier to entry without ruining standard with 2 years of fetches and shuffling.
Wizards should have banned them when the format was created.
If Fetches get banned, then UWR, Pod, Twin (RUG anyway), and Scapeshift die with it, and any hope that Esper and Grixis had of reaching the big leagues get's crushed. Every 3 color mana base completely folds to Blood Moon.
If WOTC bans fetches they may as well sign the death certificate of modern, as all the players who have invested in these decks, in what is supposed to be a stable and non-rotating format, will just quit.
Reprinting the Onslaught fetches is the most likely course of action, but reprinting Zendikar would be great too. A reprint will drop the prices (not as much as people hope though) and, assuming the reprint is in a standard set, make the lands readily available to all players.
Plenty of 3 color decks will be able to exist without losing to blood moon, but it is true that the format would be different. There is no reason to get that hyperbolic.
The fetches shouldn't be reprinted for standard. The shuffling is terrible and they should be kept far away.
So basically you'd just want a nonfunctional format? Between banning fetches, Bolt, and Goyf Modern would have 500 person GPs.
Goyf would be fine witch fetches, and I never said I wanted to ban bolt.
1. Without Wasteland to keep them in check they make mana too consistent
2. They introduce far too much unnecessary shuffling
3. Because the combination of Fetches and Shocks is so powerful the fetches effectively prevent other dual lands from seeing play, which reduces diversity by limiting the ways that players can construct their decks.
4. It would remove a huge barrier to entry without ruining standard with 2 years of fetches and shuffling.
Wizards should have banned them when the format was created.
If Fetches get banned, then UWR, Pod, Twin (RUG anyway), and Scapeshift die with it, and any hope that Esper and Grixis had of reaching the big leagues get's crushed. Every 3 color mana base completely folds to Blood Moon.
If WOTC bans fetches they may as well sign the death certificate of modern, as all the players who have invested in these decks, in what is supposed to be a stable and non-rotating format, will just quit.
Reprinting the Onslaught fetches is the most likely course of action, but reprinting Zendikar would be great too. A reprint will drop the prices (not as much as people hope though) and, assuming the reprint is in a standard set, make the lands readily available to all players.
Plenty of 3 color decks will be able to exist without losing to blood moon, but it is true that the format would be different. There is no reason to get that hyperbolic.
The fetches shouldn't be reprinted for standard. The shuffling is terrible and they should be kept far away.
I really don't think I am being hyperbolic at all. If 3 color decks existed after the banning of fetch lands, which I'm sure they still would as people currently enjoy playing them, pretty much a guaranteed way to take down a GP is to just play Skred Red or Blue Moon. Without an early fetch for a basic, the game very often ends. Yes shuffling happens, but I hardly think it is a game-breaking annoyance.
Okay. So they lose to blood moon and the meta shifts back and forth. What's the problem? That said, I think you are overestimating how good Blood Moon would be in this scenario.
1. Without Wasteland to keep them in check they make mana too consistent
2. They introduce far too much unnecessary shuffling
3. Because the combination of Fetches and Shocks is so powerful the fetches effectively prevent other dual lands from seeing play, which reduces diversity by limiting the ways that players can construct their decks.
4. It would remove a huge barrier to entry without ruining standard with 2 years of fetches and shuffling.
Wizards should have banned them when the format was created.
If Fetches get banned, then UWR, Pod, Twin (RUG anyway), and Scapeshift die with it, and any hope that Esper and Grixis had of reaching the big leagues get's crushed. Every 3 color mana base completely folds to Blood Moon.
If WOTC bans fetches they may as well sign the death certificate of modern, as all the players who have invested in these decks, in what is supposed to be a stable and non-rotating format, will just quit.
Reprinting the Onslaught fetches is the most likely course of action, but reprinting Zendikar would be great too. A reprint will drop the prices (not as much as people hope though) and, assuming the reprint is in a standard set, make the lands readily available to all players.
Plenty of 3 color decks will be able to exist without losing to blood moon, but it is true that the format would be different. There is no reason to get that hyperbolic.
The fetches shouldn't be reprinted for standard. The shuffling is terrible and they should be kept far away.
I really don't think I am being hyperbolic at all. If 3 color decks existed after the banning of fetch lands, which I'm sure they still would as people currently enjoy playing them, pretty much a guaranteed way to take down a GP is to just play Skred Red or Blue Moon. Without an early fetch for a basic, the game very often ends. Yes shuffling happens, but I hardly think it is a game-breaking annoyance.
Okay. So they lose to blood moon and the meta shifts back and forth. What's the problem? That said, I think you are overestimating how good Blood Moon would be in this scenario.
Well agree to disagree, I guess. I have played Blood Moon several times against the UWR lists that are 'budget' at my LGS (ie. no fetches) and every one of them have scooped on the spot. People say "Well then run more basics" but running 8 Islands, 8 Mountains, 8 Plains, and a couple Tec Edges is hardly going to result in an even slightly consistent deck, so that is not a realistic suggestion.
So if they aren't running only basics, they will be running Colonnades, Seachrome, Fountatins, Foundry's, etc. Those are all now mountains.
Oh also banning fetches ends Zoo, which they are trying to promote again by unbanning Nacatl.
Sacrifice Oops Oasis and pay 2 life.
Search your library for a Plains, Island, Swamp, Mountain, or Forest and put it onto the battlefield.
Shuffle your library.
It can't be strictly better than Fetches.
Obviously the issue with Fetches is there just aren't enough of them out there. I'm in the "The manabase should be the cheapest part of a deck" camp. I would jam this card at rare in whatever set is going to the printer ASAP. Then, preemptively ban it in Standard. Maybe give it one big standard tournament to ensure it is Modern legal. I would ban it so fast, I would tell everyone it will be banned in Standard during Preview week before you even clicked on the card to see what it is. I would also say that as soon as the Fetches are reprinted, whenever that will be, it would then be Banned in Modern, Legacy and Vintage at the next update. Then I would proceed to put it in every Pre-con and Core set until then. It would be a Judge Promo, an FNM promo and everything in between. I'd give a stack to Maro and Aaron Forsythe to hand out at GPs. Anything to get it out there.
This would certainly be tantamount to admitting a bit of a mistake. That's OK. I'd be honest with the players, "You know we plan years in advance. Who knew the player base would increase so fast? Thanks to you guys for making Magic so successful! We know what cards you need to build your decks and so here they are."
1) It probably doesn't need to be banned in standard
2) It's worse than fetches so decks still need fetches
3) You can only run 4 of these so you probably need fetches anyways
4) With there just being one of these, the demand would be super high. Even with all those printings it would probably still command a decently high price
5) It'd be really annoying to have like 15 printings of this card and then ban it in every format
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1. Without Wasteland to keep them in check they make mana too consistent
2. They introduce far too much unnecessary shuffling
3. Because the combination of Fetches and Shocks is so powerful the fetches effectively prevent other dual lands from seeing play, which reduces diversity by limiting the ways that players can construct their decks.
4. It would remove a huge barrier to entry without ruining standard with 2 years of fetches and shuffling.
Wizards should have banned them when the format was created.
Either increase the power of staying mono colour (devotion could have done this if it was a more powerful mechanic) or give more cards that punish going more than one colour. Fetchlands are not the problem, they are just a symptom of the greater problem.
If Fetches get banned, then UWR, Pod, Twin (RUG anyway), and Scapeshift die with it, and any hope that Esper and Grixis had of reaching the big leagues get's crushed. Every 3 color mana base completely folds to Blood Moon.
If WOTC bans fetches they may as well sign the death certificate of modern, as all the players who have invested in these decks, in what is supposed to be a stable and non-rotating format, will just quit.
Reprinting the Onslaught fetches is the most likely course of action, but reprinting Zendikar would be great too. A reprint will drop the prices (not as much as people hope though) and, assuming the reprint is in a standard set, make the lands readily available to all players.
Printing any "similiar" cards doesnt solve anything, they are extremly over expensive as they are, simply because they are good and playable in "every" format they are legal, and thats never a good thing to be for "lands" and especially not if simply every deck needs them (except corner cases like affinity).
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Feel the need to rant?
Situation is simple. Play what you want or can afford. You don't need to drop several hundred getting a set of each fetch if you can't afford it. Just play something cheaper and build toward the deck you really want. Could take time,but oh well.
Doesn't this create a pretty large 'new' problem in the format though?
I am all for cheaper fetches. I think they need to be around $25-$30 and that would be fine, but banning them would neuter so many decks in the format.
The fetches shouldn't be reprinted for standard. The shuffling is terrible and they should be kept far away.
I really don't think I am being hyperbolic at all. If 3 color decks existed after the banning of fetch lands, which I'm sure they still would as people currently enjoy playing them, pretty much a guaranteed way to take down a GP is to just play Skred Red or Blue Moon. Without an early fetch for a basic, the game very often ends. Yes shuffling happens, but I hardly think it is a game-breaking annoyance.
So basically you'd just want a nonfunctional format? Between banning fetches, Bolt, and Goyf Modern would have 500 person GPs.
1. Get a job
2. Save money from this job towards purchasing needed fetch-lands
3. Buy needed fetch-lands
Is this so difficult?
Okay. So they lose to blood moon and the meta shifts back and forth. What's the problem? That said, I think you are overestimating how good Blood Moon would be in this scenario.
Well agree to disagree, I guess. I have played Blood Moon several times against the UWR lists that are 'budget' at my LGS (ie. no fetches) and every one of them have scooped on the spot. People say "Well then run more basics" but running 8 Islands, 8 Mountains, 8 Plains, and a couple Tec Edges is hardly going to result in an even slightly consistent deck, so that is not a realistic suggestion.
So if they aren't running only basics, they will be running Colonnades, Seachrome, Fountatins, Foundry's, etc. Those are all now mountains.
Oh also banning fetches ends Zoo, which they are trying to promote again by unbanning Nacatl.
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